The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hour 2 - Greg Cosell

Episode Date: December 26, 2024

Greg Cosell of NFL Films breaks down the keys to Sam Darnold's resurgence in Minnesota The Jets need to keep Aaron Rodgers to contend next seasonSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

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Here's something that should not be as complicated as it is, getting a racist statue removed. And here's something that should be a whole lot easier than it is, getting a new one put up in its place. I'm Akela Hughes, and Rebel Spirit Season 2 is about both of those things. As I was watching these statues come down, I was thinking about what it meant that I grew up in a majority black city in which there were more homages to enslavers than there were to enslave people. Listen to Rebel Spirit Season 2 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Every family has its secrets.

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Here we go. It's hour two and a Thursday day after Christmas. I hope you had a joyous holiday season. My kids are all over the country. Maybe yours are as well. But I stopped by and saw a couple of friends last night. And it was so great to see everybody. I came bearing gifts, little wine, little vino. Hope you had a great holiday season. I hope you're safe. I hope you're avoiding airports as much as you can. Three really good NBA games yesterday. NFL kind of stinkers. But Saturday in the NFL, J-Mack, we have three really, really good Saturday. NFL games. So they move games around late in the season because of the holiday schedule. And then next week, between Saturday, Sunday, and next week early, the college football games,

this is the heart of great football in America. It is unbelievable. Chris, New Year's Eve, we get one of the playoff games and then three on New Year's Day. So it's a banger of a week coming up. It really is. It is a banger of a week. I want to just get, and I told you I'm going to sell, I got a four-point plan for the Jets. I'm going to unveil this at the bottom of the hour. 25 after. I really feel strongly about this. I watched Enigma the documentary, Gotham Chopra,

and Aaron Rogers. And I say, I mean, listen, I'm a big enough nerd. I sat there and took notes. And I thought to myself, you know, this Rubik's Cube is not impossible to solve and it's actually very easy if they do four steps and I'll get to those. But first, let's bring in Greg Kosell. NFL films 45

years, always on Thursday. So, you know, you'll watch Kansas City and this is what they do. They end up in January, December and January, they solve an offensive line issue. Now they've got Xavier Worthy and here's Hollywood Brown. They do a very good job. What's important to me in the media

is big stories. What's important to them of the details and solving little riddles throughout the course of the season? And let's talk about Mahomes and his efficiency over the last couple of months. What's the film say? Yeah, and I think, Colin, quite

frankly, there's been a little misconception about the Chiefs. This is a Mahomes driven offense. He has the most dropbacks of any quarterback in the NFL going back nine weeks, but in his last six games, he has not thrown an interception. And again, most dropbacks in the league, so it's a pass-first offense. There was a lot of talk early in the season about the running game. That's kind of disappeared. It's all driven by Mahomes. They lead the NFL in third-down conversions. He's phenomenal on third down. They control the ball, their second and time of possession, and that becomes really important because when you control the pace and tempo of the

game, your defense plays fewer snaps, and that is absolutely critical. I remember a coach telling me years ago that in an ideal world, you don't want your defense playing any more than 60 to 64 snaps a game, and we know how good Steve Spagnolo is anyway. So now you have a complete team, but make no mistake. This is driven by Patrick Mahomes. He's playing really well. What we're not seeing and I think where people think, oh, Mahomes isn't what he used to be, is we just don't see a lot of 60-yard touchdown passes. But he's controlling the game with

incredible efficiency. So you and I, both like Sam Darnold, rough start. We always saw the playmaking. We always saw the playmaking. We always saw the big arm. But he could be reckless. Is there something the film says, though, and this is why I love bringing you on?

Is there something the film says about Darnold that he doesn't necessarily get a ton of credit for? I think there's two things. And you know, Colin, because I send you my evaluations of college quarterbacks, you know I'm a traits guy. Yes. So there's two traits that I think have really stood out with Darnold that we didn't see much of early in his career. It might be his natural development, it might be the coaching.

We don't know that, but there's two traits. One is pocket movement. He's much more efficient and much more effective when he moves within the pocket. I'm not talking about running out of the pocket. I'm talking about moving within the pocket, as we see on this touchdown last week that won the game to Jefferson. The other thing is sort of a corollary point to that. That's his ability to stay in the pocket and make late in the down throws when the pocket is squeezed and there's bodies around him. That was something he did not do well early in his career.

He made a lot of bad reads and bad throws when he tried to do that. He's gotten so much better at that. So there are two areas of pocket play that are absolutely. critical to being a higher level pocket quarterback that he's improved significantly at. Yeah, he's willing to take a hit, play a little linebacker in high school. He's a tough kid, and he'll sit in there to the very end and get smoked, and I think you nailed it. So I think what's fascinating with Philadelphia, everybody acknowledges. It's a Barclay offense, and Jalen throws less.

But if you look at Green Bay, I'm actually seeing the same thing, where it's a Josh Jacobs-Lafloor offense and Jordan Love, who they like. who has excellent weapons is throwing less. And I find it fascinating because when the floor was in Tennessee, he had Derek Henry and his reputation. I remember making calls. People said, I don't know about creating a culture, but he likes to pound the ball.

And it feels like we're finally seeing his offense. Well, it's the era of the running back. We're going to have probably five or six backs with over 300 carries. We had none last year, and Josh Jacobs will be one of those backs barring an injury. And they start with the run game, and they're very multiple with their run game. That's the thing. You're seeing a lot more multiplicity with teams that run the ball, and the Packers are a great example. All the use of different backfield actions. They play with two running backs, what we call the pony package. A lot of teams are doing this. The Packers are one

of the teams doing it quite a bit, and they're so multiple with their run game concepts, the way they use Jaden Reed in the backfield with different motions. So it all starts with the game, but it's not old school run game, Colin, where you just line up and give it to the back and say, let's bang it up in there. They're very, very multiple, a lot of different formation looks, a lot of different personnel, a lot of different motions. You know, it's funny about Derek Henry. First couple years wasn't a superstar in the league, then he develops into one, and then he goes to Baltimore, and it's easy to say, well, you know, it's the Ravens, of course he can run it, but they've replaced three starters on the old line. It seems to me,

that it's not just that Derek Henry's talented. It seems to me that the way they use him, he's getting yards before contact a lot this year. That's what it looks like to me. He's always been good plus post-contact. But what are they doing specifically to Derek Henry, who's given him kind of a rebirth in the league? Well, there's no question that the Lamar factor plays into that

because you have to account for Lamar on the run game. So there's no question that the way. way defenses have to align, has to have an accounting for Lamar Jackson, and that impacts runs support. So it's not just, as he was in Tennessee, where they would just line up and give him the ball. But I think Henry as a whole, you know, it's funny. I remember talking to a coach who was at Alabama at the time, and he's now in the NFL, and I wasn't sure after two years if this was, if Derek Henry could be what he's become. And I'll be the first to admit I was wrong because obviously Derek Henry's on his way to being a Hall of Fame back. But the thing about

Henry, because in a sense he's not a power runner in that he runs over people, Colin, but he's a power runner in this sense. When it's blocked for three, you look up and he just got seven. And you go, how do he get seven? It didn't look like he got seven, but he just got seven. And then you add that to the fact that he can take it to the house for his size on any given play. And that combination is really hard to beat. But there's no question that the Lamar's. Jackson factor figures into how defenses have to align and therefore that really dictates run support issues for defenses. So I want to talk about a kid because I picked Atlanta to win their division and they've beaten the bucks twice. And you know, we were going back and forth on

this show, why won't they play him as Kirk Cousins was regressing? And my take was they wrote a big check to Kirk Cousins and Arthur Blank probably wanted to get every start out of Kirk Cousins before they sent him to the bench because once you played Pinnock, you're not going to go back to Cousins. What in the debut, the debut, what about it did you like? Well, you've always talked about this with quarterbacks, Colin, about coaching. And I thought this was a great example. The kids making his first start. You and I both love his talent.

We know we can throw the ball. We know we can sit on his back foot and drive it with the velocity. We know what his traits are. But what they did exceptionally well, you're almost seeing it on this play right here that we're looking at, is there an outside zone foundation run team with Bijjon Robinson. another back, by the way, he might get 300 carries. So what they did is they countered off that beautifully with the play action and the play action boot pass game.

So they use their outside zone run foundation to really help Pennix get comfortable in the game and define the reeds and the throws. And the thing that he does really well, and there's not a lot of quarterbacks who do this, he throws outside the numbers really well, and there's a lot of juice on those throws. And obviously you can throw between the numbers. I mean, those are easier, throws, relatively speaking. But to drive the ball outside the numbers, he can do that, and he can just sit on his back foot and do that. He does not necessarily need to stride into those throws.

Yeah, no, he's got an arm. So this past week on Monday, Matt Hasselbeck said something interesting. He said, you know, Caleb's not an anticipatory thrower. And he goes, I think you have to be in this league. And some guys can develop into it. But you have been higher on Caleb, even during his losing streak. There's a lot to like. Let's address that anticipatory thing, because I thought Hasselbeck was willing to say it.

And I think it's true. I now watch him when he plays, and some guys, you've got to be open or I won't let it rip. What do you make of that criticism? Right. I think it's fair. And don't forget, he's got a big arm. He throws a really tight spiral. The ball comes out.

So at times he can compensate for that. But what the film shows is when he sees it and the primary is clean, man, does he look good? He made two throws at the end of the first half last week, a dig ball to Moore for about 25 yards, and then he threw the touchdown to Keenan Allen, and those throws were defined, they were clean, they were the primary reads on those throws. When he sees it that way, he looks really good. But I think one reason he doesn't throw a lot of interceptions, Colin, hasn't thrown one in a long time, is if he doesn't see it he's not going to throw it

because he just doesn't feel it that way now I don't know how Matt Hasselbeck feels I think that coaches would say you can improve that to some degree yeah but you're not going to take a guy who's not a an innate anticipation thrower and make him Joe Burrow that's not gonna happen so you know you sort of have to work around that but he's got really high level throwing traits and obviously we know he's got some movement ability the other thing he needs to work on is he needs to work on moving within the pocket. And that's a totally different trait than running out of the pocket, which he can be pretty good at. He's got to feel

when he moves out of the pocket, pretty good spatial awareness, because the sacks have to come down. There's too many sacks. Okay, a team that's getting red hot is the Rams. It's interesting. Stafford's older, and they have struggled in the first half. And I was telling a friend a couple of nights ago, I'm like, is it a Stafford's not warmed up thing? Does he need to get to the fifth inning, but they usually, he's not getting sacked, they're not turning it over, finally now with Tyler Higby back, everybody's ready to go in offense, but yet it's the defense with a lot of first, second, third round draft picks that have all hit, all hit.

So to talk about, because I don't know if this defense, it's really, really young, but when I watch it, I mean, this week they play Arizona, and both Arizona's offensive tackles are out, so it could be a feast. What do you make of the Rams defense? I really like what they've done. They've won eight of their last 10, okay? In those last 10 games, no team in the NFL has played more with six defensive backs, what we call dime, than the Rams.

That has really been their foundation. They play a ton at a dime. They play with Jalen McCullough, who's a rookie safety. They play with Kitchens, the rookie from the University of Miami. They even play what we call Big Nickel with three safeties a lot. I mean, this is a safety-driven defense with a front four that's young and improving. And I have to tell you, when you watch Jared Verst play and we're seeing him here, his speed to power for a young player may be as good as any in the league.

So this is a continually evolving defense that plays a ton of dime. That's sort of their foundation. They're getting better and better. And offensively, they're really another team that's really built on the run. You and I both love Stafford, but Kyron Williams, another back with over 300 carries. That's where they start their offense with the zone run game. Yeah, it's funny. We always think these McVe-Lew-Lew-R-Shanahan guys, offensive wizards, or pass guys, they all love to run.

The truth is all of them. I mean, Kyron Williams, a small guy is carrying it 24 times a game. Yeah, and you know what? Motion is so critical. We think of motion in the past game. You know, you were talking about the past game, and you're right. We think of motion being a big deal in the past game. It's really a bigger deal in the run game.

You can almost go back to Joe Gibbs with the Washington Redskins and the use of motion to really mess up teams' run support problems and how they handle the run. So motion is a critical factor in the run game. So, Greg, I don't know if I've ever told you this before. I have something I have a belief in quarterbacks, is I'll pay a quarterback 50 large if he's not an if guy. But if Brock Purdy is your classic if guy, if the weather's good, it's not raining, if he gets protection, if he has an above average O line, if he has an offensive coach, if Christian McCaffrey is healthy, it's very much a qualifying scenario.

If he gets that, and to me, I'm not paying guys 40, 50 million if they're the if quarterback. I like Purdy. But when I watch the Niners, I see offensive line issues. and then I see a very average player. What is the film say on Purdy? Well, I guess I'd almost ask you a question. How many quarterbacks are not if guys? How many quarterbacks can be really great and carry a team

without a lot of things working for them? There's probably very few, Colin, if you really think about it. Yeah. Okay? So 90% of the quarterbacks in the league would be if guys, based on your definition. So you have to separate the money. You have to separate the money from the conversation because, look, everybody knows what Brock Purdy is. Brock Purdy is not a big guy.

He doesn't have a great arm. So what has to happen for Brock Purdy to be a really good player? He has to have a good old line, which, by the way, has not been good this year. No. The depth of the pocket, which is controlled by the interior of the O line, has not been very good. So he's been squeezed a lot. And because he doesn't have a big arm, he needs space to throw the ball. They've almost had no run game this year.

Maybe early in the year they did when Mason was pretty good early, but they've almost had no run game, and they've got no speed right now at receiver. I think Pierceall is going to be a good player, but he's a rookie who basically had no practice because of the unfortunate tragic situation. So really, this is an offense that's lacking in so many areas. But you could say that about a lot of quarterbacks.

I mean, we can talk about the Mahomes, the Allens, the Burroughs, the Jackson's. Maybe there's one or two more I'm missing. But almost all quarterbacks in the league are if quarterbacks. It depends what they have around them. And right now, Purdy does not have much around him. So his game is going to look like it lacks consistency at times on a week-to-week basis. You know, interesting, the Cowboys, obviously, Dak Prescott's the starter. But we brought stats out last week with Cooper Rush.

And if it was a blind test, it's the same guy. Is there anything, I mean, where is Cooper Rush clearly not Dak, and where is he very similar to Dak? Well, I think their coaching staffs doing a great job because what you see a lot with them is you see a ton of different personnel packages, a ton of different formation looks, a lot of shifts in motions. They're giving a defense a lot to have to deal with. That was really evident in the game against Tampa on Sunday night last week. where you just saw that Tampa, they really struggled a bit to figure all this out. And therefore, he was phenomenal against their blitz, because Todd Bowles will blitz. Rush was phenomenal on third down.

He was phenomenal against their pressures, and the Bucks pressured a lot. Now, he's a guy that you need to get pressure on, and the pressure must be effective, which it was not by the Bucks, because he tends to fall away from throws. But one thing about him, he's been very decisive the more he plays. And I'm sure that's being drilled into him, that has. hey, just get rid of the football. Do not hold it. They're not going to tell him this,

but the bottom line is he's not good enough to sit in the pocket and drive the football. So the ball needs to come out, and he's been doing well. And prior to last week, where they didn't run well, but in the previous four weeks prior to the Bucks game, Dowdell was the second leading rusher in the league behind Saquan Barclay. Yeah, interesting.

All right, we're going to end it here over the next two minutes on Jaden Daniels. I thought it was impressive that he struggled early, was trying to give that puppy away, and then in the end, he was great in the fourth quarter. And I like his ability. Andrew Luck had this. An ability, a short memory, it's about the win. Don't get caught up into your emotions.

You're going to make mistakes. It's the NFL. Guys can sometimes make great plays. I love. It's an Andrew Luck quality. Herbert's got this too as well. Just get the ball. That drive's done.

Move to the next drive. have you noticed that? Yeah, and I like Daniels. I liked him coming out a lot because I thought he was far better in the pocket than a lot of people gave him credit for. And he's made some outstanding pocket throws this year. I mean, he made one against the Eagles. He touched down to McClorin for 32 yards where he had a free hitter right in his face. And he threw the ball to the pylon.

It was a spot throw. He threw the ball to the pylon at the edge of the end zone. And McLaren was at the 25-yard line. It was an unbelievable throw. But, you know, obviously he led the game-winning drive, and I love the final touchdown drive to Crowder, which is our play of the week, Colin, so we can take a look at it because this is an example of great execution, but also great coaching, because they knew exactly what they were going to get from the Eagles on this red zone play. It was a, and teams tend to know that in the red zone. So you're going to see that there's an empty set here. Daniels is in an empty set.

There's nobody on either side of him. So that's an empty set. Now, what he's looking at, and this is what they anticipated, he's looking at a two-shell coverage structure. There's two safeties. But the other really important player here is going to be Zach born the linebacker. Because very often when teams play this two-shell in the red zone, they have the linebacker who kind of works the middle of the field as a middle-hole player. Now, these are the three receivers here, because don't forget it's empty, that are key to this whole play. Okay?

So what they want to do, we're going to see the route concept, which is all designed. designed to high-low Zach Bond. That's the whole premise of this route concept. So you're going to have Crowder who runs a route behind him and Ertz in front of him. And then you have Robinson, this is critical. You must control the backside safety. That's absolutely essential on this play. So Robinson, the back, of course, it's an empty set. He's going to do that with his route. So now what you're going to get, as we see this go in motion, is Crowder, he's going to run the bender, as we saw. He's going to bend inside away from the play side safety.

And the play side safety can't chase him because at this point he doesn't know what Ertz is going to do, but Ertz is going to run the bender inside. And as I said, Bonn is the player here that they're really high-loing. And you're going to see, and Daniel sees this because he knows what the concept is, you're going to see Bonn's body position. taught this, look at body position. Right now, Bond cannot flip his hips to be in position to react to the bender by Crowder. So this is a spot throw. Daniels is going to throw this to a spot now, basically the N in commanders, and he's going to hit him right there, and this was

just beautifully designed, beautifully executed. They knew exactly what they were going to get in the red zone. This, hey, Colin, this is the stuff I love, you know that. This is football. This is X's and O's and its execution about as beautifully as you can do it. Greg CoSells, Merry Christmas to you, the staff, 45 years NFL films. It's always a pleasure to have you. We get smarter every time, and thank you, Greg. Thanks, Colin. Great holiday, and I'll see you next week.

Yep, absolutely. I always love that segment. Just feel like I just get just, it's the meat in the sandwich on this show on Thursday. You just three really good Saturday games. Tonight, Seahawks and Bears. Gotta be honest, I'm on a two-game draft king's streak. I like Seattle tonight in that game. I think Seattle is the side, J-Mack.

I largely agree. I saw there's some Bears injuries. Looks like their left tackles done. Yep. Seattle's still technically alive in the division? Yeah, no. And by the way, with the NFC North going to get three playoff teams here, it's not a lot of wild card positions available.

I just, you watch the Bears the last few weeks since they canned Iberfluse, and they keep falling into big holes earlier. in games. This guy who took over for him as the head coach, what Brown is it? Yeah, but he didn't even start the years of coordinating. Yeah, he's not fair. He's a lot of his depth here. Yeah. They seem ill-prepared for some of these games. Yeah. Be sure to catch

live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the I-Hard Radio app. Hey, Steve Kavino. And I'm Rich Davis. And together we're Kavino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio. You can catch us weekdays from 5 to 7 p.m. Eastern

2 to 4 Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and of course the I Heart Radio app. Why should you listen to Covino and Rich? We talk about everything, life, sports, relationships, what's going on in the world? We have a lot of fun talking about the stories behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture. Stories that, well, other shows don't seem to have the time to discuss. And the fact that we've been friends for the last 20 years and still work together, I mean, that says something, right? So check us out.

We like to get you involved too. Take your phone calls, chop it up as they say. I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio. Maybe the most interactive show on planet Earth. Be sure to check out Covino & Rich live on Fox Sports Radio on the IHeart Radio app from 5 to 7 p.m. Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific. And if you miss any of the live show, just search Covino and Rich, wherever you get your podcast and, of course, on social media.

That's Coveino and Rich. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, huge news? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to...

We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down?

Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing. a bit for the podcast for people could call in and say, Hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it.

Another podcast from some SNL, late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman helped make you funny. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise.

Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people. people who live them. Listen to SportsSlices on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you

get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slico Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levin, this went to a billion dollar fraud.

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Help! Somebody! Please! But there's so much more to me than me. I'm an actor. I'm a comedian. And recently, I've become quite the helper myself. And on my new podcast, Hope from a Hypocrite, I'll be changing lives, helping people in need with my sage advice. and thoughtful solutions. Sike! I'm a comedian! I'm not qualified to give good advice. Join me and my comedian friends as we riff, rant, recommend some of the most legally dubious advice

known to man. If I'm calling you, even if you're on your phone, let it ring twice. One ring is too scary. Cream a chicken suit. Hey, cream. Cream a chicken suit. This is Help from a Hypocrite,

the worst advice from the dumbest people you know. Listen to help from Hibon. Hypocrat as part of the Mike Cultura Podcast Network available on the IHartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All right. So the way it work when Aaron Rogers first went to the Jets, I love this, it's my four-pronged plan for the Jets. Jet fans may struggle with this, but me, not Fireman Ed, has the vision for the Jets going forward. So it started Woody Johnson and Aaron Rogers, A. Raj, they were best friends. Flew out to his pad in Malibu, their best friends.

And then Salah gets whacked and Hackett gets demoted and they stopped talking. Well, Aaron Rogers, at a recent press conference, it appears to be a tad frosty between him and the impulsive jets owner Woody Johnson. Hey, Woody wants you back? You should ask Woody. Have you and Woody had conversations all around about the future? No. If you do want to come back and they want you back, what would that mean to you? It would mean that they see me as an important part of helping the culture, the changeover,

whatever they do at head coach, that would be special to hear that. But if they don't, again, no offense at all will be taken. So what I take there is the relationship is now separate and frosty. All right. First of all, Aaron's been very good in his last eight games. Passer rating a 99, 14 touchdowns one pick. Can't blame him. And that coincides with Devante Adams arriving via the Raiders.

Now that's made Garrett Wilson mad. Get to that in a second. but I think early in the season, 40-year-old off the injury. He didn't move very well. I didn't think he had a ton of confidence in his body yet. I think Aaron right now is playing very good football. You take these older guys, Russell Wilson, Aaron's better.

Right now better. Kirk Cousins, Aaron's better. You start looking at these old guys. Aaron's the best of them again. And it just took him a while to get comfortable with his body. I mean, I think that's pretty clear. He feels really good right now. He's moving better.

So if I was Woody Johnson, and I don't know if he would do these, but these are the four things. First of all, as a coach, you need a proven guy in a culture center. I'd go Mike Vrable. That's the easy one. Go get Mike Vrable. Mike Vrable's going to build a team defense, O-line run game around. Vrable's the perfect coach to me here. Number two is hire an aggressive, proven general manager.

Thomas Dimitroft, formerly of Atlanta, the guy that pulled off. that major Julio Jones trade. I like him. He'll take big swings. I would go get Thomas Dimitrov. That's just my opinion. Number three, keep Aaron Rogers. Listen, Aaron's not at this point, Mahomes, Lamar, Josh.

Maybe not Stafford. He's good. Aaron's going to be good. He's going to have an entire offseason to bring back this Aaron Rogers. And if you're watching the games, he's just more comfortable moving. He's moving better. That means he's planting better. It's working.

It looks good. This is a good Aaron Rogers. Definitely a top 12, 13 guy in the league now. And then number four is trade Garrett Wilson. Now, hold on here. Now, I know what you're saying. Colin, I don't like this. First of all, what is the one position that college football furnishes the NFL with 15 good players a year?

Receiver. The Jets need about two things. It's a good roster. It's not a great roster, but it's good. If you could, in my opinion, there's one great tied end in the first round from Michigan. Go get him. Then you can get a receiver to replace Garrett Wilson. I don't think they have a third round pick, second, fourth, fit.

You can go find receivers. Pooka Naku is in the fifth. You can do that. And Dimitroff was a good GM. So I think if you can get a first for Garrett Wilson, and here's why I think you can. It's a weak draft. There's a lot of good rush ends, some good offensive tackles, maybe one great wide receiver. It's not a particularly strong draft.

So Garrett Wilson is absolutely without question. better than 95% of the talent in this first round. He may not be Travis Hunter. He's right behind him. So in a weak draft, I absolutely believe teams would go get Garrett Wilson. Still on a rookie contract. Go get Garrett Wilson. He is unhappy.

How can you be unhappy? I'm looking this morning at his targets. And I'm like, he's got 141 targets. That's more than Amaran St. Brown, Devonthe Adams, and Justin Jefferson. Jefferson. So I see light in this tunnel. Now, Aaron sees light too, but the way he sees light and darkness probably different than me. But I see light in this tunnel. Get Vrable, Dimitrov, keep Aaron, trade Garrett Wilson, go get two players in the first round. You got to get better. You probably have to get another receiver. You got your left tackle. He's banged up now, but you got your left tackle. You got your edge rushers. You got your corners. I would go get a tight end, which I don't love first round, tight end. but you need one. And there's one great one in the first round. And then I would get a receiver later. You'd probably want to get into a pass rusher if you can or interior lineman. But I see light here. But when you hear Aaron and his comments on Woody Johnson, it's telling you that kumbaya,

they're doing their own thing now. Aaron's like, I won't be offended, do what you got to do. That usually means the sides of stop communicating. Okay, Jay Mack, you're a very negative. I would say you have turned very sour on Aaron Rogers. But, Don, I convince you, Vrable, Dimitrov, keep Aaron, get another high pick for Garrett Wilson. It's not awful. I like the Vrable thing. I'm still looking at the GM. A quick thing on Garrett Wilson.

So I wondered, why is he so high on the target chair? I don't know if we could get that back on the screen. The targets this season. The top five guys, there's one thing in common with all those top five guys and targets. Malik neighbors, are they in the playoffs? Are the Cowboys? Are the Bengals? are the Raiders. These are all terrible teams that are chasing points laid in games.

And Garrett Wilson also, by the way, had a 23 target game against the Vikings, the one in London, where they didn't have Devante Adams. So that's a little bit skewed. But I do like your idea. Let's see what Garrett Wilson fetches on the market. Because I'm looking at the draft. I put out the mock draft. There is one great receiver in this draft. The kid in Arizona is very good. His name is T-Mack. I had dinner last night with one of his college teammates at Arizona. He is an unbelievable kid from a great high school program. has delivered, so he is a top 8-9 player.

I had him go to the Cowboys. Yes. McMillan, he's very good. He's a great, no-bust potential receiver. So then Travis Hunter, do you see him playing wide receiver or defensive back? He's going to want wide receiver. That's where the big money is. I think he-

He'll say, better than both those guys right now. Sorry. Better than both those guys, for sure. So again, in a weak draft, Garrett Wilson fetches a one. Can you get a one-in-a-three? I think you can get a one-and-a-four. I am going to text her in the break.

I think you can get like a one and a four or five. Again, it's a weak draft at the top. I could make an argument right now that Garrett Wilson is guaranteed to be better than every single player in this draft. Okay. So if you could get a one and it's a top ten pick, you already have a top ten pick. Now the Jets are sitting pretty with two picks in the top ten. If you move off Garrett Wilson, right? That's not bad.

Their need, tight end is a need. There's one at about 17 to 25. Okay. Well, Tyler Warren from Penn State, we love him. We do. Yeah, you're right. No, no. I like it. He is well. My bad, there's two good tight ends first round.

The Aaron Rogers thing comes down to this. One of your big tenants, you don't like noise in teams. Wacky out of the, off-the-field stuff, you don't like that. Rogers gives you that crap every week with these paid TV appearances. I don't personally want that, Colin. Why are you changing course and saying, you know what, it's noise, we'll take it on? I think I've come to terms with this, is I, and I've made mistakes on this, I was all in on Kylie. the bottom line in this league, start looking at your standings. Why am I able to predict seven of the eight division winners? Who's the best quarterback?

Aaron for one more year. I think Drake May is surging. Yeah. And he's not Josh Allen. But my takeaway is Vrable brings stability. Dimitroff bring stability. Get the unhappy receiver out. Bring stability.

You just say, Aaron, you're up front with him. This, we're going to do a two-year deal, team option year two. but we're going to surround you with good players. And we got Mike Frable. And I don't think Aaron will, first of all, he came to New York with pressure, then he got injured. Now there's injury pressure. This will be a pressure free year.

The pressure now is on the organization. So Aaron goes to New York and there's like, I've got to prove it. And then he gets hurt and he comes back and it's like, okay, prove it. You're an old guy off an injury. I think Aaron would go into year three. No injury, playing well at the end of the year. They have a bad season. there's no pressure on him.

Nobody's going to pick him to go to the playoffs. It is a perfect. Listen, I watched the documentary on Aaron. And again, it's a bit self-indulgent for me. A bit for me. But you know what, Aaron doesn't like me, and we've had our issues. But here's the thing. If you go to the last eight games, he can still sling it.

You know, you say he's expensive. I'm looking around the league. You're not that expensive. He's not bankrupting you. So my take is, if this was a strong quarterback class, I wouldn't maybe feel this way. It's dreadful. Yeah.

It may not be a third. Okay, so your guy, Sean Payton, when he went to Denver, do you remember one of the first things he did? Russell Wilson had, like, his own office. Yeah. He had all these privileges. And Sean Payton said, yeah, we're cutting that out. Nope, no. Do you think Vrable can go to Aaron Rogers and say, hey, man, I don't want you going on weekly.

I don't want you doing weekly. I don't care how much you're paying. It is non-football stuff, and it's taking away, it's changing the narrative away from this team. And it's self-indulgent. I would like you to stop that. Yeah, well, first, that hasn't happened. Second, I'm not sure what Aaron would say. Oh, okay.

Well, Russell Wilson said, hey, coach, yep, I want to win. Yeah, I don't want to get into Aaron's personal side businesses. I don't know what he'd do. I don't know if Vrable would do that. Vrable certainly strong enough to do that. But I'm just telling you is that we do this every year. Three years ago, I picked the Vikings to be the surprise team. Last year, Rams.

This year, Denver. And one of the things I always look at is, do you change? check the boxes. Vrable would check a box. Left tackle, Penn State. Weapon, edge rusher, corner. They check every box. I look at traits and boxes. That's how I pick Washington to make the playoffs.

Weapon. I like the coach coordinator. Quarterback. They got a pass rush. They went and got Latimore because they were weak at corners. So it's all boxes. Aaron may be the weakest box at 41. But he checks a box.

Yeah. All right. Listen, I can't solve the world's problems. I'll start with the Jets. Start with it. All right. Take a break back with J-Mack. In L.A., The Herd.

Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd, weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it.

We just contributed to it. We were the first people to do podcasts. podcast. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's

extra special. So how did we, how do we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call

about what we should call it. Oh, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers.

This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast where people could call in

and say, Jonas and then I wrote down on my little notepad Hey Jonas and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it.

Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and. and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode we're cutting through the noise.

Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live there. them. Listen to SportsSlic on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your

podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levin this went to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me?

Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The story I've told myself about love or relationships can then shape my behavior, and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility of connection. This Mental Health Awareness Month, tune into the podcast deeply well with Debbie Brown and explore the journey of healing, self-discovery, and returning to yourself. We explore higher consciousness, emotional well-being, and the practices that help you find clarity, peace, and self-mastery in a world that can feel overwhelming. The world is becoming lonelier.

We're not becoming more social and connected. We're becoming more individualized, but we actually meet people in connection. If you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole, this podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to deeply well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. All right, let's start with Lamar Jackson breaking Michael Vicks record for most rushing yards by a quarterback yesterday in the beatdown over the Texans. Lamar's got 6,110 career rushing yards.

one more yard than Vic. Vic had that record for 13 years, but the most impressive part is how quickly it took Lamar to break it. Vic, 143 games in 13 seasons. Lamar done 102 games in only seven seasons. Cam Newton is third on the list. Russell Wilson, a bit of a surprise at four. Lamar, listen, the game wasn't much of a fun one yesterday. Lamar had a nice touchdown run.

He made it look easy. He's pretty spectacular player. Yeah, I mean, they're all different. Lamar and Michael were electric. Cam was probably better from the pocket initially, but more inconsistent. Russell was kind of managing the game early, elusive. They all kind of had a different style. But I think I would say this is that I felt like with Michael Vic Cam,

Russell Wilson, to a degree, I kind of saw what they were early, and what they were is what they were. They were all good and they improved. I think Lamar Jackson's growth from the pocket, where I consider him now a really elite pocket passer. It's not pretty the way. He's kind of Phillip Rivers. He's kind of different.

It looks like it's just off a little bit. But whereas I always felt Cam came into the league and he could throw up in the pocket, big statue-esque guy, Russell was a good pocket thrower early. You know, I mean, the raindrop balls. Michael Vick got better. But I think Lamar's growth. Remember, he came and he was thin.

He put on weight. He developed into an elite pocket passer. I think he has grown into, like, Lamar's not that far away, in my opinion, despite the postseason stuff, he's not that far away from a Hall of Famer. I mean, a third MVP, I think you're a Hall of Famer. Well, is Cam Newton a Hall of Fame? He never had back-to-back winning seasons. Thank you. Lamar wins 76% of his games every year.

Yeah. I know he's not great in the postseason, but that's so, I mean, think how great Aaron Rogers was, and think how good the organization was. got one. I'm really curious how this AFC bracket shakes out. So last year the chiefs went through Buffalo and Baltimore on the road. This year they might be able

to do it at home. I know. You think they could be both those teams again in the playoffs? Yes. I think Kansas said he's better than last year. Stop it. No way. Come on. Well, let's dovetail it to story number two, which is about your chiefs. Because, Colin, they have some

strange company. You just said they're better than last year. This was a mind-blowing stat that emerged on Christmas Day. Kansas City is one of four teams in the NFL to score 30 or less points in every game. Four teams. We've got the four teams for you. The Chiefs are one. The other three are the 3 and 12 Patriots, the 3 and 12 Raiders, and the 2 and 13 Giants.

That is some interesting company because the Chiefs, by not scoring, look like, one of the worst teams in the league statistically. Yet they're 14, or I'm sorry, 15 and 1 now. Well, that's because unlike the Patriots, Raiders, and Giants, the Chiefs are the best situational team yesterday. One for one on fourth down. You know, yesterday is a prime example is when it came to the big one or two stands. Yeah, the Russell Wilson interception in the end zone.

I mean, they are so great situation. And we got into this discussion. We fall in love with a sizzle. very few Super Bowl champs. Even the great Lynn Swan catches. Cedars were known for their defense. We just get caught up in the sizz. That's not what wins Super Bowls.

It's trenches, it's toughness. As you watch the Niners regress, why? The O-line's not as good, and the D-Line's not as good. It wasn't about Debo. It was always about their dominant defensive line, anchored by Bosa. Yesterday, no Chris Jones. You see the pass rush?

Yeah, they had like 17 sacks of Russell Wilson. I don't. I just, again, you're watching that yesterday, and tell me you didn't have the thought. Oh, this is so boring. Chief, there's no sizzling. Where's the juice? Where's the pop? Lamar had, like, three better or more interesting plays than the Chiefs had any offensively.

I didn't, I don't see it. Like, I see greatness. You see boring. Boring, yeah. They might, listen. Chiefs, the fan base doesn't like me, obviously, because of stuff I've said on the show. If they win another Super Bowl, may have to call in sick. the day.

They're winning it. It's just, can Philadelphia beat him? So you're certain they're getting by Buffalo and Baltimore. Kansas City, I'm not saying who I'm rooting for. I love Andy Reed and Mahomes. I think Buffalo's a better story, but I'm taking Kansas City and Philadelphia

and all, based on health, I'll make my prediction that week. What do you think the bills was going through to mind watching the Chiefs win that? Locking up home field advantage. Are they just like, oh my gosh, yeah? I think they're, I think they watch that. And they start making plans early February for Cancun.

Jeez, that's hard. Final story, there is a breaking news element here, Colin. So yesterday, Jimmy Butler news popped. Actually, it's been breaking for a couple months. It seems like his agents using a reporter to put this out there. Reports claim Butler wanted to be traded before the deadline on February 6th. He was open to the Suns, the Warriors, the Mazz, the Rock is basically trying to call his shot. and Eric Spolster has been telling reporters, we want Jimmy here.

Within the last 30 minutes, Miami Heat put out a statement through Pat Riley. We are not trading Jimmy Butler. Riley, they're saying we don't comment on rumors. The speculations become a distraction from the team and the coaches. We are not trading Jimmy Butler. Everybody can stand down. Jimmy Butler and his agent are probably not thrilled because I think he wants to go to a contender, right? I mean, he's got one big fat contract coming left.

Nick Saban once said, I am not leaving the Miami Dolphins for Alabama. Miami is one of those cities where people change their mind. Morally flexible. Something about that aqua water and the pretty people. Things change in Miami. They don't change in Iowa. It's cold today. It's cold tomorrow.

Miami? All it takes a couple, my ties and a look at that aqua water. Things change. Coastal elite cowherd strikes again. Things don't change. Iowa. Well, I mean, what is that? Iowa catching strays on boxing day? Come on, bro. That's harsh. J. Mack with the news. All right. There we go. Good stuff. We've got Diana Rusini's around the corner. Hour three on a Thursday. Hey, next. Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what?

We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions. because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know, tired and sick. Tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite.

Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel. help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Here's something that should not be as complicated as it is, getting a racist statue removed. And here's something that should be a whole lot easier than it is. Getting a new one put up in its place. I'm Akela Hughes, and Rebel Spirit Season 2 is about both of the, those things. As I was watching these statues come down, I was thinking about what it meant that I grew up in a majority black city in which there were more homages to enslavers than there were to enslave people. Listen to Rebel Spirit season two on the Iheart radio app, Apple

podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Every family has its secrets. But what happens when you discover that your dad has been living a double life? That is not the look of an innocent man. Is everyone lying to me about who they are? I felt such desperation. I felt it was what I had to do. Listen to Deep Cover the Family Man on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This season on Dear Chelsea, with me, Chelsea Handler,

we have some fantastic guests like Amelia Clark. When like young people come up to me and they want to be an actor or whatever, and my first thing is always, can you think of anything else that you can do? Rather be. Because... Pointed in. Do that. David O'Yelloo.

I love this podcast, whether it's therapy or relationships or religion or sex or addiction or... You just go straight for the guts. Dennis Leary, Gaten Moderato from Stranger Things. Tena Monjou. Camilla Morone, Carrie Kenny Silver. And more. Listen to these episodes of Dear Chelsea on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an I-Heart podcast.

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