The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hour 2 - Looking at the top NFL QBs

Episode Date: January 23, 2024

Nick Wright of First Things First stops by to examine Josh Allen's championship viability, why Baltimore quarterback Lamar Jackson and head coach John Harbaugh are an unique pairing in the NFL.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. We're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Here we go. It's our two. It's Tuesday live in Los Angeles. It's the herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening. Thanks for making us part of your day. I just think Jason McIntyre just about had an aneurysm

when I gave him data, which clearly illustrated that the San Francisco 49ers, when you take Debo Samuel out of the office, offense are three points less of a team, which would indicate Debo's value is three points. Now, you say to yourself, well, if you take Stefan Diggs out, or if you take Tyreek Hill out, no, no, no, those are with superstar quarterbacks. Lamar Jackson's on a third string running back. Lamar Jackson doesn't have a star tied in. When you have a star quarterback, I mean, Joe Burrow, we saw when Jamar Chase left and T. Higgins

came in. That's the difference between a star quarterback, Mahomes, Lamar, Josh, Burrow, CJ Stroud's got some of that feeling that C.J. Stroud in the first month in Houston with three offensive linemen out was putting up unbelievable rookie numbers. Or Justin Herbert's first year in the league, when they had the 32nd ranked offensive line,

he broke all the rookie passing records. But for average quarterbacks, and we would view Purdy and Garoppolo as sort of in terms of talent, not stars, they lose a Jamar Chase, a Stefan Diggs, a Tyreek Hill. Adibo Samuel.

They are massively affected. And if you look at the Niners, what has been the piece they're missing? A star quarterback. They're not missing an edge rusher or a great tide end or a left tackle or a coach. The missing piece for the Niners has been, oh, Garoppolo got hurt a lot, Tray Lance draft pick didn't work, and Purdy has trouble gripping the ball when it drizzles. So it's not crazy to think that if you take an increasingly, incredibly unique player historically Debo, and you take him away from a marginally talented

quarterback, they're a field goal less. It would not be a field goal less with Lamar or Patrick or Alon or Burrell. Does that make more sense? It kind of does. If I could just ask one other follow-up is you said all these star quarterbacks. And yes, those guys are very talented. But how do we get to star quarterback? Like, is it the eye test? Is it just simply talent? Or is it something they've done Numbers-wise that puts them in that category. What makes you, if you watch, you know, The Voice or America's got talent. Well, that's different because you can't quantify any of that stuff. Yes, you can.

If I'm not a music person, I mean, I go to YouTube all the time and I listen to my YouTube and my eagles, whatever. Yeah. I can watch one of those shows. Me, a complete novice, can watch one of those shows and in a minute go hack, star, lounge singer. Right. You can see it. But that's individual, though. Well, I'm talking about quarterback.

When I watch Lamar, his first game, I'm like, oh, the fastest player on the field happens to be the quarterback for Baltimore. And then by the next year, now there's growth to it. He's obviously better now as a pocket guy. Definitely. When I watch Mahomes do sidearm stuff, I never forget when Peter Schrager had a piece of video. So this is years and years ago. So it was Mahomes had just been drafted, had a losing record at Texas Tech in the Big 12, a crudy, mostly a lobsided conference with Oklahoma, Texas, and nobody.

Like arena league football defense. TCU was pretty good. Okay, so there was a piece of video from the chief's camp that Schrager got a hold of. One piece of video. One piece. And Andy Reid had sent it to a couple of people or Brett Veach and said, look at this play. And it was Mahomes running across his.

body flipping it 38 yards between new defenders. It's moments. You can hear it. You can see it with a great singer, with a great actor. My wife and I say this all the time. When they had all those strikes in Hollywood, those studios made sure they resolved the directors first. That's real talent.

They resolved the writer second. They resolved actors there. Why? because I have sit with my wife and I all sit and watch a show. We don't care who the actors are. If the writing is great, there's a, there's a,

there's a streaming service called Acorn. It's Europe's. It's like London's Netflix, Acorn. Don't know any of the actors. We will watch series after football season. Don't know the actors. You could give me an all-star cast.

Tom Hanks in Terminal. I can't get four minutes through it. meaning the writers are more valuable than the actors. Nobody would deny Christian Bales amazing. Or Denzel, whoever they are, Amy Adams. It doesn't matter. Merrill Street. Nobody's arguing Ed Norton.

Don Chito. Great actors. Michael Keaton are great actors. But the Hollywood Studios told you they want to take care of the directors and the writers before the actors. Because writing leads the industry. And you can sense it. And I'm not a writer. Have no skill at that.

But I can watch seven minutes of a show and go, My favorite show of all-time Mind Hunter. God, that writing's unbelievable. And I'm a novice. So it doesn't take somebody like me who has watched football for 40 years to watch a great quarterback and go, the hell is that? I mean, the first year, Josh Allen struggled.

He was jumping over linebackers. Brock Purdy can't jump over this coffee. So how many guys are in that upper echelon group where it's the talent and, you know, whatever else he was in? One of the things, I mean, I really do. I do feel like Patrick, Lamar, and Josh just look different. Okay. They're just different.

Now, I love Burrow, but Burrow doesn't blow me away in terms of size, speed, arm strength. And now he's getting hurt. His secret sauce is like Brady. It's cognitive edge. It's pre-snap. It's accuracy. So athletic ability seems like, even for quarterbacks, that's a big thing for you. Yeah, I mean, what separates golf, who's not a great athlete, but a great thrower,

but we worry about him when he's pressured. I don't worry about Josh Allen under pressure. I don't worry about Mahalms under pressure. I don't worry about Herbert under pressure. I don't worry about Lamar Jackson under pressure. So athletic, I mean, you have to be a pocket passer, but I guess my whole point is with the Brock Purdy argument, your eyes aren't lying to you.

Your eyes will tell you the truth with writing and singing and acting and quarterback. Watch it. And now fans have agendas. They root for their players. You and I mostly don't. You love your jets, blah, blah, blah. But I think you say what defines Brock Purdy. Where's the wow?

Size, no, arm, no. Speed, no. That's why I defend Kyler Murray. When you watch Kyler Murray, it's like... A lot of wow with Kyla Murray. Holy God. The stats are terrible. I don't care.

He throws the prettiest ball, arguably, in the league, and he is the most elusive guy. He's in that Steve Young-Lamar class. It's like he makes Fred Warner look bad. He's just a losing quarterback. Like, he's not going to make winning quarterback. plays on the game winning drive. He's not going to come from behind. It would help if he had ownership

and the right feet. That's where, okay. Nick Wright going to join me live here. First things first. Let's go to Nick Wright. So you, by the way, I don't know, you scotch the whole, you scotch the whole herd hierarchy rather than put the chiefs out of the bills for a single week.

You just said, screw it. I mean, it's a staple of the show. Every damn Tuesday, you finally have no choice but to put kids. City had a Buffalo and you said, you know what? Burn the segment. Not even going to do it and suffer that indignity. Unbelievable.

Hi, Colin. Well, we only have four teams left, so it's not much of a hierarchy. But it's funny and it's a good point. It's ironic. It's not coincidental, but it's still a great point. No, I want to, you know, I'm going to go to the Josh Allen thing. And I said this, they may be great next year. It doesn't mean they're going to win it.

Those those Buffalo teams for years that didn't win, those are great teams. great coach, great. But I said, here's the thing about Josh Allen. They're going to be viable for this reason. Think about how great Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson is. And I forget where I put the number, but Josh Allen has scored like 73 more touchdowns than Lamar Jackson the last four years.

Is that wouldn't you at least acknowledge, they may not win a Super Bowl. But Buffalo, as long as Josh Allen's in his 20s and early 30s, they're not going anywhere. Is that fair? Well, not going anywhere. I guess that depends on your tone of voice. They're not going anywhere or this Bill's team, they're not going anywhere.

I guess it could be a bit of both. Here's the thing, Colin, and this is as someone who has, you know, obviously, because I'm a Chiefs guy, been rooting for my hometown team in the playoffs three of the last four years against the bills and Josh Allen. The version of Josh Allen that showed up to the game Sunday was the least scary. And I think the bills, because they are scared of Josh's turnovers, made him less of a scary player to play. Since Joe Brady took over, Josh Allen was under 250 yards passing in every game but one. The one game he had big passing numbers post-Joe Brady was the Dolphins game, the end of the regular season, when he had three turnovers.

And I think the best thing the bills have going for them is their quarterback. And they appeared to me to be afraid of their quarterback making the big mistake. So they asked him, check it down. Run the ball. Take the easy completion. But when you ask someone to do something that is against their nature and that is against Josh Allen's nature, it is very hard to do that for three and a half hours. So what we saw on Sunday was Josh Allen play exactly the way they wanted him to play for three quarters.

And then when despite that they were trailing, what did we see on the final drive? The best and the worst. First play of the final drive, he throws a 65-yard pass on a run. rope in cold weather, outdoors, and I mean, it would have been a tough catch because any 65-yard pass is tough to catch, but it was a perfect pass. So that's the best. But then what else did we see that drive? He fumbles the game away, fumbles their season away if it's scooped up the way it should have been. Yeah. And then at the end of the drive, second and nine, has Stefan Diggs, move the chains, keep bleeding the clock, he has to go for the kill shot. Third and nine, he goes for

the kill shot. So I think if you're Buffalo, you can't coach the Allen out of Allen. You just have to somehow find a way to mitigate the mistakes. Because to play a game against the Bills where they don't have a single 20-yard play, where Josh completes 16 passes behind the line of scrimmage, and two passes more than five yards down field, that's not a scary Bill's team. It just isn't. You know, the Ravens are interesting, though, because I was saying this earlier about the Harbaugh's. Jim Harbaugh is really not your classic offensive

coach. You can't pigeonhole them. Both the Niners and Michigan were led by their defense. Michigan never threw the ball down the field. And John Harbaugh's really, his history, he started an offense to special teams. His Flacco team was a top 10 offense. It was a Flacco hot streak, and this team's got a great defense.

But it's his ability to embrace Lamar and keep adding elements to it that has made it great. Aren't you, whereas Sean McDermott is the classic defensive purist, and Andy Reid has an edge. Harbaugh's hard to pigeonhole. They do offense. They do clever. Baltimore is, to me, less predictable, harder to pigeonhole, Harbaugh's harder to label. To me, if I was a chief fan, I would be worried about Baltimore.

They just do a lot well. and they're kind of unpredictable due to Lamar. Yeah, I mean, listen, Baltimore, going into the year, this was odd because I doubted Baltimore. Going into the year, you know, the AFC is so deep, I didn't know about the borough injury. I thought the Ravens were going to miss the playoffs. So I was dead wrong on Baltimore. But the same show that I said, I thought they were going to miss the playoffs, I also said, of all the teams in the AFC, they're the one I would least like to play in the postseason.

Because Lamar's best is so dynamic and so unique that if he is playing his A-plus level, they do seem almost unbeatable. And then you add to it what I didn't know they were going to have is scoring-wise the best defense in football. They are a great team. They had three losses. You know, throughout the final week of the year, they had three losses all season, and they led it the two-minute warning. in all three of those losses.

I, the reason, now, you know, I watch all your media, Colin, I know for the, you know, you don't believe in the Chiefs still. You think the Ravens can, you know, walk all over them, blow them out. I get that. I'm surprised you don't in, you know, almost a Tom Brady context, bring up this stat. I don't hear anyone that mention it.

Patrick Mahomes is 0.2 in the playoffs against Brady. he's 13 and 1 in every other playoff game. And the one loss was in overtime. So I just, I don't think anyone in any building deserves to be three and a half point favorites over a healthy playoff Mahomes. Last year we saw him in the postseason on one leg, be able to score 38 in the Super Bowl. But I have a healthy respect for Baltimore. and they are, you know, they have earned every step of this. Unlike Buffalo, which I felt like a lot of it was the media wishcasting what they could be.

The Ravens have walked the walk all year in all three phases of the game, and they are more than a worthy competitor. And now I'll add this, Colin, given how Dallas once again flamed out in the playoffs, it feels to me, and we don't always get this, that we truly did get the fourth, four best teams in the league start to finish as our final four. San Francisco, Detroit, Baltimore, Kansas City. That's the right final four. So I was saying this during my preamble to you,

is that you and I have been on the same kind of feeling with Brock Purdy. You know, I mean, players obviously Drew Brees fell to the second round. But I mean, if you look at DAC falling to the fourth round or Kirk Cousins, very similar players, there's a reason they fell to the fourth round. and one wasn't an accurate thrower, one wasn't a big strong power thrower and an athlete, is that Brock Purdy is the last guy taken in the draft. Not everybody's a dummy in the league.

And it is interesting. I had said earlier today, Mahomes loses Tyreek Hill wins a Super Bowl. Lamar's on a third string running back without his Hall to Fame tied end, aFC championship. Josh Allen, pre-Stegne, was just fine. Brock Purdy deals with a drizzling rain and no debo,

and they were outplayed by Green Bay. Do you feel justified? I don't think they're going to beat Detroit without Debo. I don't. I don't. Do you feel a little justified on Brock Purdy? I'm mystified by smart people who are struggling to contextualize the Brock Purdy debate. Your thoughts?

Yeah, I'm not, I mean, I'm not mystified by it. I just think folks are, maybe folks are more sensitive to criticism than you or I. And it is the easy thing to do is say, look at his record, look at his numbers. What more do you want from him? I think the more nuanced point is this. What is your opinion of Brock Purdy and how much of that is informed just by the numbers and how much of it is informed by the fact that these games are on television? And that we are able to watch it.

And that we watch football for five months every Sunday, we watch all these games. I give Brock credit the end of the game he came through. I didn't think he would. I didn't think he could and he did it. But for three of the three hours and 15 minutes that game was on, he was the worst player on the field. We had a debate about a player. Is he the league's MVP?

When deep down, everyone knew, not only was he not his team's MVP, I think right now deep down, inside and outside the locker room. If you were asked, what is the Niners' biggest weakness, not the MVP of the league, the weakness of the team, they would say the quarterback. And then folks love, and you reference this, Colin,

folks love saying, well, you feel a certain way about him because of his draft status, as if that's not rational. Of course, the draft status. is a part of it because the draft is not random names selected out of a hat. I understand it is not all science, but there is a level of if the people whose job is evaluating players on a full-time basis across 32 teams, every single one of them at the most important position, had multiple opportunities to grab a guy, I think that's valuable data. I think his size is valuable data. I think his athleticism is valuable data. And if the

rebuttal to that is, well, then explain Tom Brady. That is like making an argument about not needing superstars in the NBA because of the 04 pistons. Because there is a once, a quarter-century anomaly does not mean the rest of the data is irrelevant. And I just don't think people deep down believe Brock Purdy's excellent. I think it's easy to say he is because the numbers say he is and they don't want to get yelled at. I think deep down everyone knows

if the Niners don't win, it will be because the quarterback is not good enough. Yeah, I think you're right. By the way, I'll bring the herd hierarchy back next week, especially if Baltimore wins. I mean, it's unbelievable. I've been waiting.

I've been waiting all week to see not only, that Kansas City was on there in Buffalo wasn't, but I was pretty confident you were going to have Kansas City last of the four. And the Chiefs have been thriving off bulletin board material all year, a lot of which has come from

this television show. Go ahead. If I did a herd hierarchy this morning, with a four left, that's interesting. I would do Baltimore 1, Kansas City 2, very close. And I would do, man, if Debo is healthy,

San Francisco 3, Detroit 4, and I love Detroit, but I don't think Brock Purdy, even with Debo, can beat Mahomes or, I think the AFC champ is the champ. That's what I feel today. How about that? So I think the closest to Baltimore is going to feel great. If Baltimore gets through Kansas City, I think they're going to feel like that. I think Baltimore looks at this weekend as the Super Bowl. Yeah.

And I'm not trying to disrespect the Lions and what they've accomplished, but Baltimore beat the Lions by a thousand points earlier this year. and Baltimore a few weeks ago beat the Niners by 2,000 points. So I think Baltimore, and you don't have to worry really about the emotional letdown if they get there because you have the extra week to prepare. So I think the winner of Chiefs Ravens, I believe, is winning the Super Bowl. And, you know, I'll save my pick till Friday. You don't know who I'm going to pick in Chiefs Ravens, Colin. I could surprise some people.

Who knows? I got to analyze the All-22, look at all the data and see what I come up with. Yeah, sort of like me taking the lions over the Rams. I think I have a hedge on that. I know where you're going. Good seeing you, buddy. Nick Reich, first thing. You know, we were talking about drafting.

You mentioned it earlier as I got into this discussion. With somebody two nights ago, and we were, no, it was last night. We were talking about the drafting of quarterbacks and how virtually impossible it is. And with quarterbacks, you think about two things. Traits, arms, size, mobility. and then production. One of the reasons I didn't love Daniel Jones out of Duke.

He had some traits. He was big and he moved, but his production was okay in a week conference. One of the reasons I didn't love Zach Wilson, he had some traits. Nice arm could move, but outside of his COVID year, what was his production? And so when it comes

to drafting, that's where Brock Purdy had production, but no traits. And you're trying to find a balance. That's why Sam Darnold, With a weak coaching staff and one NFL receiver, Michael Pittman was his guy, right? At the time, Michael was his upperclassman receiver. He had nice production with a bad coach. And he had good traits.

Big, moved, tough. I missed on that. But so when you draft, Brock doesn't have any of the traits. Small hands, small size, no big arm, marginally mobile. But his production was good. You don't want to draft somebody just on traits that hasn't been productive in college, nor somebody who's productive in college, but is tiny. I'll take tiny when it's Kyler Murray because his traits, his elusiveness,

his ball placement are out of this world. So that's all drafting a sentence. I was talking about this with somebody who does this. And he said it's just a mesh with quarterbacks of traits and production. When you get into trouble, and he gave me a couple of guys, I don't want to bang on him. He said they were all traits, no production. You also get in trouble when, you know, a guy is all production. And it's like, yeah, but he's got small hands.

And he's like, I mean, Johnny Mansell was a great example of production. He was tiny. He wasn't nearly as athletic. He was a mess off the field. Yeah, I mean, but he was like, what trait? Well, he's kind of elusive. He couldn't outrun defensive ends. He's a tiny guy.

One of the traits you mentioned last before the Nick thing was under pressure. Like, you don't worry about Mahomes and some of these guys. So fortunately, we have some data that we can look. at about quarterbacks under pressure, pro football focus. What did you know it? Brock Purdy led the NFL in yards per attempt and yards under pressure. Third in touchdowns. Under pressure, Brock Purdy was one of the best quarterbacks in the NFL this season.

But I know, I know, I know. It's because the talent around him, obviously. Well, also, I don't know the exact numbers, but under pressure, Mahalms, Josh, and Lamar often leave. And they don't pass. They run. And that's an additive. that's hard to quantify is that sometimes Mahomes, last year's Super Bowl, the play of the game.

Mahomes on a bad leg flies for 45 yards. You saw it again this weekend against Buffalo. One big run. One of the plays of the game. Mahomes gives you about one a game when he did that thing when he jockeyed the ball back and forth. Josh Allen, the week before, biggest move against Pittsburgh was the run. Lamar this weekend had two of them. So you say, well, under pressure, a lot of times under pressure, the three best quarterbacks,

exit stage right and go run for a touchdown. So they don't have to sit. Whereas Purdy is going to sit in the pocket and throw. Here we go. So according to PFF, this is my staff. According to PFF, thank you, Alex. Highest credit quarterbacks under pressure PFF. One Lamar, two Mahomes.

I mean, you can't blitz Lamar, but then the Texans blitz him in the first half, and he was a little shaken by it. They adjusted. But Lamar's been unbelievable. Well, in Mahomes, I mean, the book on Mahomes is, and Brady, don't blitz either. You can't blitz Brady. Quick processing.

They just cognitively figured out, get it out. It's just so. So again, it's, I'm not, I don't want to be marginalized as anti-Brock. I just, the traits don't blow me away. But I do think contextually the weapons, he does clearly process things at a very quick level, and that matters. The problem is this Detroit matchup, like, Niners win by two touchdowns. Well, the lion's defense stinks, as Jason said.

If the Niners don't have Debo and they win 3420, well, that's impressive. That's a big win. I think Detroit's a real team. Just know that if you're not drafted in the first round, you are going to face this your entire career. That's a fact. Russell Wilson, Tom Brady, anybody,

Dak Prescott, all these guys get knocked. We didn't talk about Drew Brees' draft status. The first couple of rounds. It was like the first pick of the second round, wasn't he? Yeah, I mean, I think the first couple of rounds. I mean, we don't talk about dead. Derek Carr, Drew Brees has drafted. It's like the narrative is, like Kurt Warner.

By the way, Kurt Warner. By the way, Kurt Warner. He was stocking grocery sales in Iowa. But that's like, system quarterback. Hey, he can't. That's an, well, no, that's an endearing quality. They made a movie about Kurt. I don't think anybody holds it against Kurt.

I think people look at it and think, God, did everybody miss on Kurt? I never hold it against Kurt. I'm like, like Tony Romo, undrafted. I never hold it against Tony. I'm like the hell. How did you guys not draft Tony Romo? So do you feel that way about Purdy? No, because I don't think he's even in the same ballpark.

athleticly size arm as Kurt Warner. Kurt Warner was a great player. Great thrower. I don't think he was more athletic than Brock. Kurt Warner is a big, strong, brilliant quarterback. Good hoops player, too, apparently. No, I mean, no. When you watch Kurt Warner, you don't blame Kurt.

You blame the GMs. That's a, like Antonio Gates for the Chargers. I remember the first time I saw him, I'm like, undrafted. It's like the best player on the field the second year in the league. I blame the GMs on that. I never held it against Antonio Gates. So there are, I'm like, what Dak Prescott, I've been saying. I remember when he came out of college.

I'm like, he throws it like Tebow. But he was better than Tebow as a thrower. But it's like, how do you? That's not, what? Better than I thought. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app.

Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds.

I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions,

my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow

at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of tontons and wampas on the ice planet hot,

or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to Stuff to Blow Your Mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A lot of things going on today. You got that Belichick story in there, J-Mack? I think we'll get to it eventually. Jay-Mack with the news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news.

This is the Herdline News. It seems like the Tennessee Titans are getting really close to their next head coach. according to Adam Schaefter, Bengals offensive coordinator, Brian Callahan, is nearing a deal to become the next Titans head coach. It's a bit of a surprise after firing Brable. I don't know. I guess Callahan did a nice job with Jake Browning this year. Here's why I like it. You know, I lean offensive coaches.

Yes. We have what I think is a clear truth in the league that only an offensive head coach can take a marginal quarterback or a. a backup and make you viable. Zach Taylor, Jake Browning, Shane Steichen, Gardner, Minshue, Kevin Stefansky, old Joe Flacko. A defensive coach can get McDermott, you know, a great quarterback.

And so what Tennessee has to figure this out, can Will Levis play? And they're going to get much more clarity on that within one season with an offensive coach. Is that you can have a defense, I mean, Pete Carroll's trying to talk us into Gino Smith, Ron Rivera's trying to talk us into Sam Howell, Mike Tomlin's trying

to talk me into Kenny Pickett. Every offensive guy in the league is like, nope, nope, nope. The offensive coaches can take a Will Levis, and he will know by the end of camp, maybe the end of mid-September, this ain't it. And I think defensive coaches do not embrace that. They think they can win with running and defense and limiting mistakes. And so this is the move to make. You will discover if Will's the guy. And if he's not, and you'll know by training camp for early September, job one is to get a quarterback. And I think that is the advantage.

Again, Tomlin with Big Ben, Belichick with Brady. It's different. But offensive coaches, and this new league, once again, we're left with three offensive coaches and a special teams guy hardball. Yeah. I want to try to make this so the entire audience can care about this. Because, you know, listen, it's the Titans, it's a Bengals OC. Okay.

You've been in junctures in your life where it's like, ooh, should I take this job offer? And it's like okay with maybe some upside. And then like there's big upside here. And like, how long do you wait for like the perfect job, which doesn't exist? Because let's be clear, man. You want to coach Joe Burrow and Jamar Chase and an awesome offense next year in Cincinnati and probably be in the mix for the Super Bowl.

Or do you want to go to Tennessee and see if it works with Will Levis? Derek Henry's out the door. He said he's done. Offensive line in Tennessee stinks. Not a lot of talent. You should have some cap space. It's a wonky division. I don't know.

Every division's got great. Is it wonky? C.J. Stroud and Trevor Lawrence? Again, in the NFL, outside of the NFC South, there's a superstar quarterback or two in every division. You can't run from it. You can't run from it. And so my takeaway is Callahan's going to say, if I own the team, I would like this higher. I would say, listen, here's what I want, Mr. Callahan.

Brian, give me clarity on Will Levis. Can he play? Give me an answer by October 15th. And if not, we got a trading deadline or another draft. So I think you have to take this job. I think if you're confident, your first job, when you've been making this and then you get to that, take the job, trust yourself.

What's a better job? Tennessee or Carolina? Tennessee. Absolutely, Tennessee. Absolutely. You've got some pieces there. You don't have a crazy town owner. Absolutely.

That ownership situation is a mess. No, thank you. I don't think of Tennessee as poorly run. Quarterback's more important than the owner. I'll never forget an exchange I had with Kevin Durant on Instagram. And I was like, oh, you've got to go to New York, but the owner's crazy. He's like, you think I care about the owner? That was what it basically straight up told me in the DMs.

Well, I mean, LeBron went to the Lakers. The Lakers, Steve Ballmer could buy the Lakers ownership group 38 times over. back to the owner in Cleveland. It doesn't matter. You don't care. So why would you care about Crazy Town Teper when you got Bryce Young versus Will Levin? No, because I think James Dolan has hurt the Knicks. I mean, there's owners that are a little impulsive,

Jim Ursay, and he's had some personal struggles. Then there's Crazy Town. There's the guy in Phoenix. Donald Sterling, Marge Schotton, Base, like when you get corrosive, now I'm not saying David Tepper is Donald Sterling, but I'm saying is there are levels of the impulsive

nature of what's going on in Carolina. We've had NBA owners. You had to get out the door. Like the commissioner had to say, out of here. We've had baseball owners. Listen, they created a rule in the NBA because of Ted Steppian own the Cavaliers. I don't remember exactly how it works. Stepion was so

bad that when they got new ownership in Cleveland, and my memory is fuzzy, that they granted the Cavaliers multiple first round picks that didn't have to give the next owner a shot to compete. So there's levels of And what I'm saying right now with David Tapper, and I don't know him, but he is running through people.

He's getting rid of. Frank Reich is respected. When you're running through people by October, early November, that's different than the Jets owner's a little impulsive or Erse's a little impulsive. Like, I don't love some of the NBA owners, but you had to get certain, you've had to get certain owners out of the league. Good luck to Callahan in Tennessee. All right, moving on. Pete Carroll was ousted in Seattle. Richard Sherman said that on undisputed, you remember, Pete Carroll will be a great fit with the Chargers.

Now Snoop Dog is telling Fox Sports that he spoke with Carol after the move, and Pete indicated to Snoop. Yes, to Snoop Dogg, the former great rapper, iconic rapper, that Pete wanted the Chargers job. I don't know, Colin. I think he does, because Pete's got a place in the Bay down here. South Bay. South Bay, yeah. Yeah, I think he probably, yeah, I think he does.

I don't think that's the move, but I think Pete. you know, I talked to somebody who has a little influence within the charger sphere. And I, you know, like we've been talking about this with Belichick. The thing that worries me about Belichick is, does he really want the Atlanta job,

or does he want to beat Don Shula's record? Are you hiring a guy that wants a milestone or wants to be there for 10 years? That's why, like, Harbaugh and Vrabble to me, are much better candidates in Atlanta or the Chargers than Belichick would be. I don't think Pete's a milestone guy.

That's not it. What Pete is is a very youthful 71-year-old guy or 72-year-old guy. He doesn't want to be buried here. He's like, I can still do stuff. So the question becomes, college is a young man's game. That's not the fifth. I mean, the year-round recruiting is nonsense. The NFL, my bigger issue with Pete, he's not a milestone guy.

He's not a money guy. He's a smart guy. He's a good coach. why was his side of the ball in Seattle with multiple good draft picks so damn bad for five years so my question Pete you got to get your side of the ball right I mean I may bang on Tomlin but that Pittsburgh defense it's pretty tasty

right like it's pretty my knock on Pete isn't his age isn't his lack of I mean he is we're going to have presidents in their 80s I don't worry about Pete Pete is a chewing gum 100 miles an hour but my question with Pete and I think this is what Seattle said.

You know, we don't worry about milestones. Belichick, to me, feels very milestone aware. I do worry about the look if Pete 72 and Belichick, 72, both end up with no jobs here after the cycle's done. That's in play, Colin. What do you mean? If neither of them get a job. Oh, nobody wants the old guy.

Oh, I think it's totally in play. Because I think you have, Harbaugh, is one of the best candidates the NFL's had potentially in a decade, Vrable is one of the best candidates in recent years. So you have two superstar candidates, and then you also have a really high-end coordinator candidate in Ben Johnson. So your candidate, you have three, very rarely do you have two amazing candidates and a couple other, like D'Amico Ryan's was considered a pretty darn good candidate, but people outside of the bait didn't know who he was, mostly. All right, final story to the NBA, where your guy, Joel and B, the reigning MVP, scored 70 last night.

Franchise record for the Sixers. Kevin Durant was asked about the performance and had this to say about the state of the NBA. I don't know if you saw Joe L.M.B. He scored 70. 70. Yeah. He had 70.

Yeah. He had 70. The skill level in this league is insane. And actually, the coaching the schemes on offenses is insane. You're seeing so many different sets being run for bigs to get threes. I mean, coaches are being well. way more creative to put their best players in great positions to get those numbers. And you got shooters all around the floor.

You got penetrators. I mean, this is the peak of basketball, in my opinion. He's absolutely right. No question he's right. I mean, it's not even close. And I know people will argue, oh, it's the rules. It's no hand-checking. You think no hand-checking is stopping Carl Towns from inning 10-3s last night?

Like, come on. Wembe's putting the ball in the Dackey 7-4. Yeah. J-Mack with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. Heard line news. We've got a break.

It's the herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the IHeard Radio app. Hey, it's Ben. Host of The Fifth Hour with Ben Mallor. It would mean a lot to have you join us on our weekly auditory journey. You're asking what in God's name is the fifth hour? I'll tell you, it's a spinoff of the Ben Mallor show, a cult hit overnights on FSR.

Why should you listen? Picture, if you will, a world when we chat with. captains of industry in media, sports and more every week, explore some amazing facts about human nature and more. Listen to The Fifth Hour with Ben Mather on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw,

unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment. And the next, we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast.

It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes.

Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of taun tons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The 2024 NASCAR season drops the green flag next month with the clash of the Coliseum. And on February 18th, it's the most iconic day in all of motorsports as the great American race returns. The Daytona 500 only on Fox. By the way, we were talking during the break about you said to me, who do you want to win the Super Bowl?

And I know Andy Reid, and I love him, and I occasionally communicate with some people inside the Chiefs organization. I know Travis Kelsey. I don't know Mo Holmes's been around him. It's impossible for me not to want the Chiefs to win. And it's also, I know John Lynch. I covered John Lynch in Tampa. So it's impossible for me not to see John Lynch succeed. So the problem for me is when you work in this business long enough, I mean, I covered John as a buck.

And he was a Pac-12 guy. His dad was in the radio business down in San. I mean, I've known John forever, it feels like. So, yes, I mean, if Andy and I, but I've seen Andy and Kyle and John and those guys in a Super Bowl. Meanwhile, the Detroit story, my family, my wife's family is all Michigan. that's, I'm getting pictures all weekend from people in lion's shirts. And the other thing is, I just love so much about the Ravens. I love the Harbaugh family.

I love how they're disruptors. So this, I feel the same way. When Brady met the Seahawks and Russell Wilson, so my sister didn't like sports. And then Russell Wilson came to Seattle, and she's now a Seahawk fan. All Sunday, she's sending me, ooh, boy, this is driving me crazy, go into a second cocktail. My sister goes crazy. My sister and I have a connecting point. We never did our entire life.

of Russell Wilson and the Seahawks. She doesn't like sports, but she loves the Seahawks. Russell, she loved Pete Carroll. After Pete Carroll left, she's like, this is so sad. How can they get rid of Pete Carroll? And so it's like, I feel like I have my sister's a fan. So when they met Brady in New England and I lived in Connecticut for 10 years, that was rough because all my buddies in New England were Patriot fans.

And all my friends from my hometown were Seahawks fans. And I just said, just give me a great game. Just give me a great game. And it ended up being a final play of the game. So this year, I have four connections, and I love all of them. So this is unique to me. I really don't care. Now, I did find myself in the Washington Michigan National Championship.

I'm a Husky fan, but I loved Hardball, and I loved Harbaugh sticking it to everybody. So I was conflicted there. It was like, well, if the Huskies win, I'm happy. But I'm so tired of people badmouth and Jim Harbaugh, I wanted to stick it to everybody. And so I felt pretty good. But I can't remember a year in which all four teams left, I'd be overwhelmingly happy if they won. I really don't. I don't care. Yeah, my brother and his

buddies go to Ravens game, so they're locked on the Ravens, and I like the Ravens. I'm obviously rooting for the Niners, financial interest in futures, 49ers, tickets. I think it would be a great game in the rematch, you know, 49ers versus Ravens in the Super Bowl. And by the way, the Ravens, I don't like to call organizations

for tickets. It's not my thing because I want to be objective. One time, my daughter was in Baltimore with a friend, a girlfriend, and I called the Ravens and I hate doing this. and I'm like, I'll pay for them. I don't care. Can you get our good seats?

The Ravens sent me gifts, free tickets, great seats. My daughter was like, I've never been treated better in my life than by them. And my daughter now loves the Baltimore Ravens. And so it's like their part of me is like, I just love the class, the owner, the coach, the players. We're lucky, man. Four teams, I like all of them. Good dudes, good coaches, good front offices, all through them. We should all be happy.

Root for everybody. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year.

Within probably 10 days, I put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the Look Back at it podcast. 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 was big to me. I'm Sam J.

And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it with our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild year. I mean, it was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to Look Back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts.

or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed human.