The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hour 2 - NBA Finals might be over soon

Episode Date: June 13, 2024

Rachel Nichols joins the The Herd to talk about the NBA Finals, the Celtics dominance, Luka Doncic, and Caitlin Clark being left off the USA Women's Team Colin talks about the Lakers having a plethora of information leaks as news comes out that they are set to interview JJ RedickSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Your husband is not who you think he is. Your body is not what you thought it was. Your identity is formed by a secret history. I'm Danny Shapiro. And these are just a few of the stunning stories I'll be exploring on the 14th, season of Family Secrets. He kind of shoved me out of the way and said, move, and he went out the front door and he jumped in a car and drove off, and that was the last time I saw him. Listen to Season 14 of Family Secrets on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you

get your podcasts. Thanks for listening to The Heard Podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in noon to 3-Eastern, 9 a.m. to noon Pacific. Find your local station for the heard at fox sports radio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeart radio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. All right, it's our two and a Thursday live in Los Angeles. It's the herd. Dan Hurley just stopped by live from his office at Yukon.

We love that. Rachel Nichols around the corner, Joel Clatt, too. The soccer guys are in the building at Fox today. A lot of British accents, a lot of sophistication. A lot of Europeans in the building today. My late mother was British. A connection I can feel at a vibe as I walked by. I love what soccer guys are in the building.

A little alpha. A little chip on their shoulder. A little European vibe in the building today. All the executives, big deal in the building. Exciting. Jordan Schultz is joining us. So Celtics are running over Dallas. They kind of melted down.

It's funny watching the Celtics melt down. And this is just the way it is. To be in the NBA, you have to be so good. You have to be so great to be in the NBA, meaning at some point, high school, AAU, college, you were a dominant score. And so whenever an NBA team gets out of rhythm offensively, it's usually because their best players go iso ball.

And the Celtics last night got into about a seven-minute area where they just, even the Celtics who were very collaborative and very smart, very veteran, got into this iso ball thing, and they melted. And so it can happen to the best of teams. But Jalen Brown is going to win, I would imagine, MVP of this series. He won MVP of the Eastern Conference Finals. So Jason Tatum has shot under 50% in six of his last seven playoff games.

Jalen Brown has shot over 50% in seven straight playoff games. And we don't consider him to be the fluid, aesthetically pleasing offensive player. That's Tatum. So Tatum is viewed as a superior talent. Jalen Brown reminds me of D. Wade. And I'll tell you why. Neither went to a massive basketball power, Cal and Marquette, both lean into power and physicality over grace. Both are always the best athlete in the floor.

They're strong physical players. Jalen Brown's dad was a heavyweight boxer. You don't have to be talked into that. That kind of sounds right. And we are so used to in professional basketball, having the best players make it look so easy. a Michael and a Kobe and a magic. It's just Steph Curry. It's easy.

It's graceful. And with Jalen Brown and D. Wade, you see the grit. You see the effort. It's not always pretty. But neither D. Wade or Jalen Brown has ever let their deficiencies define them. It's great messaging. Is that D. Wade was never, even in the three-ball era, he couldn't shoot threes. His career is 29%.

Didn't define him. He didn't take him. Jalen Brown, when he first got into the league, wasn't a very good ball handler. And he still doesn't have like a go-to offensive shot. But when Shaq and LeBron played with D. Wade, they were often the better talent. But D. Wade was always the soul of the heat. His toughness, his camaraderie, his collaboration, his resilience, his physicality. D. Wade, even with LeBron and Shaq there, always the soul.

And I would argue, Jalen Brown isn't the best Celtic. He's the soul of the Celtics. When you think of even the bird Celtics, scrappy, on the floor, tough, get in fights, tackle you if they had to. That's what Boston basketball is. When the Lakers are great, they got a little sex appeal. It's showtime. When the Celtics are great, they'll punch you right in the forehead.

And that's kind of like Pistons basketball. That's when the Steelers were great historically, it wasn't because they were pretty. When Belichick's Patriots were great, the only time they were pretty, Randy Moss, they didn't win Super Bowls. And I think Boston is defined by resourceful, tough, resilient, smart, collaborative. And to me, I watch Jalen Brown, and I feel like I'm watching D-Wa. They play above their weight. I mean, the biggest dunk in the game last night wasn't by the Bigs. It was by Jalen Brown.

That would often be D-Way. But once a game, D-Wade, 6-4 and a half would go to the rim and jam over somebody 6, 7, and a half, the place erupts, and it defines the effort for the heat. So I love watching to play as coach talked about him after. How can I explain, Jalen? The guy just has a growth mindset. He just wants to get better. He urns to get better. He's not afraid to face his weaknesses on the court.

And so when you have that type of mindset, you're just going to be able to take on. every situation that the game brings you. So he puts himself in every single situation that he sees in a game. He uses six, seven, eight coaches a day. In every situation on both ends of the floor, he puts himself in that. And that's how you have to grow, is to become vulnerable on the things that you know, make you uncomfortable, and he does that. I said when I saw him at Cal play, I thought he looked like a football player.

He was really rough around the edges, but a wildly talented athlete, every year you can see the time he puts in. It's not always graceful. It's not as aesthetically pleasing as Tatum, but it is the soul of the Celtics. And Rachel Nichols, who's been covering the NBA since 1993. We got all sorts of stuff going on in the NBA. I'll pivot off the Celtics after this question, though.

But there is always that question, and we thought about it last year with Denver. Is this just a one-off, or could we have a dynasty? And in the NBA, we tend to look at eras and decades. If I say 70s NBA, there was no great team. If I say 80s, Magic Bird, 90s, M.J., 2000s, it's Shaq Kobe. Are these Celtics with Porzingis's injury history, are they going to be an era team or just like KG Pierce Allen, a great team for the moment? I think an era team, the definition may change, right?

I just think, and we've talked about this before, the talent level in the NBA is so much higher than it has. ever been because you have now the world's most talented athletes coming to the NBA, where even 10 years ago, you weren't having this much of an influx of international players and they hadn't reached their height of their abilities. The last five MVPs have gone to international players. So because there are more talented guys across the league, it means more teams are better, right? More teams have a chance of having a really A1 talent on their team. Because of that, I don't see someone winning six titles like Michael again. I don't even know. know if someone can do what the Warriors did,

even semi-recently, right? But I mean, semi-recently, they won their first title nine years ago. Time passes. And I just feel like because of the depth of the NBA, the Celtics, maybe being an era-specific defining team is winning two, or, you know, we don't know yet.

I mean, there's never been an NFL team that's won three straight. And we've had the Steelers in the 70s you couldn't score on. You had Belichick and Brady the best coach quarterback, so nobody's won three straight. And I will say this. I said it earlier, a part of the Celtic greatness is really taking advantage of something that you may not be able to take advantage of. They got Porzingus, Derek White, and Drew Holliday

off tanking teams. San Antonio, Portland, and Washington were, I mean, literally like tanking, and they went, take, take, take. The league doesn't want what they are, which is like eight deep. Horford's made multiple all-stars. So to your point, I think it'll look different. because Derek White, somebody's going to grab them and pay him a lot of money. But I do think dynasty in this era could be defined with back-to-backs. Yes, absolutely. And look, they're clearly so talented. It's why I pick them going into the series.

They have six of the eight best players on the floor. And they have learned from their mistakes. I thought the quote you just played from Joe Mozilla was perfect. He encapsulated it perfectly. He was talking about Jalen Brown specifically. But Jalen has been sort of emblematic of how this team has grown overall. because they faced what they did wrong. They acknowledged it.

They worked on it. And they got better. And that's all we ask of these athletes, right? I mean, I know we're going to talk about Luca and the mistakes he made last night. The real test to me isn't what Luca did in game three of the 2024 finals. It's does he learn from it and get better? And that is how I will judge him. Yeah.

Tragic Johnson after about 84 finals from Magic. LeBron James, when he literally had so few layers to, his game. He had eight points in an NBA finals game in 2011. Did he want the basketball? And so what I find is though, the smart players, MJ and LeBron, looked themselves in the mirror and go

okay, MJ said, I got a trust teammates. LeBron said, I got to add some layers. A low post game, better at threes. So for Luca, what's interesting though, his offensive game doesn't need anything. A lot of it is shoulders up where he unravels. He's been told

since he was 14, he's a prodigy. you know, the D. Wade's and Jalen Browns, who had to work and you can see the work, is different than at 13, people are like, he's the best rising star in the history of European basketball. Yes. I worry about Luca, because I don't worry about physical divisions. He's, although he's not a good defensive player, but can he look himself in the mirror and say, I've got to trust teammates? I've got to engage every time down the floor in the finals. I don't have to be Jalen Brown, the defender. That's what I worry. about. Yeah, that's the big question, right? And we all have seen this with pro athletes. You've been told you're great since you were 11, 12 years old. You've been the best player on your team for most of your entire life. And you've been getting away with it. That's really the key is that Luca has been getting away with talking to the refs, you know, not necessarily getting back on defense, you know, not necessarily trusting his teammates in the big moments. He's been getting away with

it because his team still generally win, you know, with some, you know. And he hasn't. faced a great team. And he's still, even when his team loses, they didn't make the playoffs last year. It's not his fault. The organization decided to tank. They didn't have the talent around him. No one was blaming him. So this is the first time, I think, he is facing a situation that is this high profile

where he's not getting away with some of the deficiencies in his basketball behavior. And I imagine it's a wake-up call. And if it's not, then he has a really big problem. because there's a couple easy areas for him to just elevate his already incredibly elite game. Obviously, they're talking to officials. Yeah, get over it. Because that's just, I mean, it's basic one-on-one. You're not going to reverse calls.

100%. And all it does is it makes it when he does have a call that doesn't quite go the right way against him, they don't even listen to him. It doesn't matter because he's the boy who cried wolf, right? And then that in turn, hand-in-hand, get back on defense, play the kind of defense that we saw him play. he can play very good defense. We saw it just the last couple months. So get back and do that.

And then frankly, he's got to get in the kind of shape where he can be in the best shape of his life at the end of a very long season. We saw Nicola Yokic do that, and that was a game changer for him. Nicola Yokic, as we all remember, used to be the pudgy guy, kind of laboring up and down the court.

And kind of a poor defender. And a poor, not kind of, a poor defender. And I remember sitting down with Nicola in the bubble. which was the first time he showed up in 2020 is sort of looking like a different person and he was telling me all the changes he made to his diet. We've had Joel Embed make a bunch of changes in the way he is and his physical durability and all of that.

Obviously the knees, the ankles that's different but I'm talking about being in shape. Luca has to decide can he be in that kind of shape this deep into the season because Kyrie did it. Kyrie looks like he might be in the best playing shape of his life and he's had issues in his finals but it hasn't been because he's been tired.

Luca is clearly tired. And when we're all tired, we are more short-tempered. I can no question. We don't play our best. We don't do our best. We don't commit to everything. We don't commit to everything. I mean, that to me is the biggest thing I see of what's wrong here, and that is the biggest

thing I think he needs to change, and everything else will follow suit. Is it fair to me to say this about the Lakers that I could rename them the Los Angeles leakers? Everything gets out. Everything. Yes. If I didn't know about Dan Hurley and Reddick, it wouldn't look like such a circus. Yes.

I have never, it's like a bad White House. Like whether you liked Obama or not, nothing leaked. Everybody on the same page. Yep. Okay. Then the guy after him, everything leaked. Yeah. Like, it just looks like it's a circus.

Everything leaks. And so is it fair to say at times it looks chaotic from the outside? Oh, it absolutely does. And to me, it goes back to the firing of Darvinham. I'm not caping for Darvinham. People can make their evaluations on whether he was a good or bad coach or a good enough coach for this team. But you cannot make a decision to fire him one year out from reaching a Western Conference finals without a plan of someone better that you are going to find.

Because maybe he wasn't the gold standard for the Lakers, but he was a standard of where they were this past year. or two. And they had to know when they fired him, the only reason to do that wasn't to get another guy who was here or here, it's to get someone better. And to have at least an idea in your head, who that would be. Have those relationships so that you already

know, is this guy really interested in us or not. We saw it in Phoenix. I don't think that Frank Vogel should have been fired. I think he was a scapegoat again for the second time in his career. But at least the sons knew exactly who they wanted after Frank. They went after him and that contract with Mike Boonehouser was done

within, I think, 48 hours, and they got their guy. I just feel like the Lakers did one thing without a plan for the other thing, and that is what we are seeing right now. I have kind of a WNBA take, and it's kind of, I do not believe they're picking on Caitlin Clark. I think if you watch the WNBA, I said this earlier, it is not as dynamic a league twitchiness-wise, nor is it as vertical as the NBA, so it tends to be a horizontal league that is very physical. Yeah.

So if you've watched it for leave years, it's physical. Absolutely. And the NBA, you can't stay in front of anybody. People are just too fast. Yes. Or they jump over you. That's not the WNBA. So it is a physical league.

It's always been chippy. So I don't think anybody's picking on Caitlin. Now, I do think there's some jealousy stuff. I mean, by the way, that's life. Welcome to the world. Yeah. But I would say this. To defend the WNBA, I don't like the Olympic decision, but that wasn't their call.

But I'd say this. It does remind me is that over the course of owning a business, you can run a very fine business. And then all of a sudden in your business, something happens. There's a culture change. There's an employee that arrived. There's a catalyst. And your business explodes. And you're just not quite ready for it.

You're not ready for the criticism. You're not ready for the attention. And I feel like the WNBA a year ago could have said, Caitlin's coming in. let's give her an easier schedule. Let's talk about this Olympic stuff if it's big. And it just got so big, so fast, so discussed, so debated, that women's basketball is a little bit like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. They're not quite ready to be the lead story on debate shows.

It's not a criticism. I think this happens with tech companies, Main Street, Wall Street. To get this tsunami of coverage and heat, you've been ignored for 27. years. Is that a fair place to land? I personally feel it's more about the type of criticism that the league is getting than the criticism itself. These players, the executives, they have tough. They have been fighting their way through not only just to be elite basketball players, but in a world that wasn't willing to hand them everything, the way a lot of their male counterparts have. So I don't

think they're crying on the floor because people have been mean about them. I think it's the tenor and the tone. I think that there are some people, not every one, but but there are some people in the media who have loud voices. The way they've approached talking about the NBA has been quite frankly very sexist. And I think that after fighting all those fights and battles, I think there is a bit of pushing back and also just a bit of frustration. Really, again, we have to listen to this again. We have to listen to people treating us so differently from male athletes again.

Why can't we just be basketball players? I think that is some of the frustration that you're sensing from them. I do want to ask you about the Olympic decision, though, because I think it made total sense. I'll make my case to you and you can tell you can pick it apart is that I think the US women's team is one of the hardest teams to make in all of sports It is harder to make Team USA on the women's side than it is on the men side Because if you look at the 10 best male players in the world half of them don't even qualify for team USA They're playing for their own countries right so that allows more spots for guys who are in the 10 through 20 spot or 20 through 30 spot to make it on to the team because a big chunk of the people they'd be competing with

are playing for other countries. The vast majority of female basketball players who are at that elite, elite, best in the world level, are Americans. So you're not getting those four or five open spots when you pick out the top ten. You're not getting that. And also, it's a program that really puts an emphasis on, have you been there together, have you been in these training camps?

And they have to do that, because unlike the NBA, where it comes in the middle of a four-month break between seasons. This is in the middle of the WMBA season. So Team USA, the women's team, will get seven practices before they go play in Olympic competition. Seven, that's all they get to play together. So part of the thought when putting together the team,

and we've watched sports for so long, it is essential to have chemistry, to know what the other person's going to do out on the core. We're seeing it right now with the Celtics. That experience makes them a better team. And that is why all of those factors contributed to Caitlin Clark not getting on the team. I absolutely believe she will be on the next team if things continue as they are,

and many, many more to come. Yeah, I think there's more gray than people would acknowledge. I think that's the great basketball argument. I would say this. The women's basketball, and for the record, Bryce Harper went through the same thing in baseball. Remember the jealousy in peddness? So let's not make this a women are petty.

100%. Bryce Harper got into fights in the dugout with people. Baseball, men, tradition can be petty. It could be church, baseball, whatever. 100%. So it's sex as to say women are petty. No, there's people are petty. 100%.

People are petty. Yeah. Okay. So I would argue this, that holistically, the decision to put Caitlin Clark on is not a basketball decision. She's good enough to be the last player because she statistically is Diana Trossier right now, right? is that in a business that has been had second class travel, second class attention, has struggled financially, really needed the NBA to make it. All decisions until it is a profit center need to also consider beyond basketball the business of it. And the WNBA and the Olympic women's basketball team are kind of working together to enhance.

Yeah, in an overall sense. the overall sense. And I think when you complain for years about how you're treated, the catalyst arrives Connor McGregor Tiger and instantly get you on charter flights and the attention, and by the way, a better TV contract very soon. You owe them a solid. You kind of owe them a spot.

Now, that is subjective. That is political. Historically at the end of benches, certainly for men, Olympic teams. It gets very political. Women not so much because, like you said, where it lands. So your argument is a basketball argument, and it's the right basketball argument. It doesn't make it the wrong business argument, but I do think there's a business element.

I said yesterday, if I got you private flight for two years with your family, you'd owe me an invitation to some party. You know me something. I feel like Caitlin's like, I got you guys chartered flights and all the attention. Can you squeeze me into the back end of the team? But if your team USA, which is not the WMBA, right, and has had a lot of success over the years. So they're not at the level, right? They're not at the level where, oh, my God, people are just discovering us.

They don't look at themselves as needing anything. They don't look at themselves as needing the degree to what the WN needs, right? And they haven't gotten those benefits. Those benefits have gone to the WMBA, a different set of coffers, a different business model, a different number of people getting dollars in their pocket. They're worried about what they can do. And if they don't get a gold medal over in Paris, the repercussions are going to be huge.

People will lose their jobs. So I think the idea is make it the best basketball team it can be. And by the way, you talk about political decisions at the end of the bench. What happens if she does come in as the number 12 player and gets playing time accordingly, which means not very much at all? What do you think every question is going to be at the beginning of every press conference? They're responsible on Team USA for the Olympic experience of every athlete on that. team. They're responsible for what the country is talking about in terms of what that sets them up for the

money they try to raise and get people to donate to our Olympic effort. They don't want to create. If you're just going to now step away from basketball and make a business decision on politics, for them, separate from the W, it's not a great business decision, in my opinion, because it sets you up for people not to like you, where right now there's controversy, people are talking about it. But once those Olympics start, these women are such talented. talented players, their great personality. So many of them are just jump off the page likeable. Asia Wilson is just... And the quality of basketball

so much better than 20 years ago. 100%. And so I think people will get behind this women's team. I don't think people will be talking about Caitlin Clark every day at that point. And, you know, assuming that they go ahead and complete the mission and win a gold medal, it will be joy there as opposed to, well, what about

this? You know, it's funny. I've thought about this before is one of the people I was always jealous, I'm not really a jealous person, but one of the people that does what I always thought I wanted to do is Bill Maher, who does like 31-hour shows a year. So he gets to go on and take two topics and think all week about that. And I've always thought, oh, God, that's so perfect. I'm on a treadmill.

And this is not an excuse. So is Stephen A. So is Skip. So are all the fine people at ESPN and Fox who do daily treadmill shows. The downside to that is you're asked to have an immediate three-hour an opinion the minute something happens. Yes. And a prime example with this is,

My initial take, and I'm not sure if I said it on the air or thought was, God, the women are being petty. And then over the course of four or five days, I thought about it, and I thought, oh, no, wait, Bryce Harper, it was embarrassing. Like, baseball players were embarrassing toward Bryce Harper. Think about what the pistons did to Michael Jordan. I mean, just petty. And it's like, guys, women don't own petty. Yes. Like, one of the pettiest industries is stand-up comedy, dominated by men.

100% like the entertainment business acting stand-up con a lot of petty businesses are male-dominated but but if i did a once-a-week show i you could flush that out and i'm not i'm not blaming anybody at any network i feel like i am to some degree like every other guy at every network that does could be dan patrick it could be rich is in it could be stephen a we're on this three-hour treadmill and i think the katelyn's story is more nuanced than a three-hour debate show, who's better, Jalen Brown or Tatum. That you can, you can chew that up and we can chop it up together all day, and nobody gets hurt, and it doesn't feel like it's an avalanche raining down in a young lady or a league.

So I think my takeaway on the Caitlin Clark story is it needs more nuance, and I don't know if I was ready for it the first day it was on the air. But I actually kind of like what you were describing here. It's kind of what Joe Missoula was just talking about with Jalen Brown. It's fine if you come out out of the box perfect, okay. I mean, it wows us. But that doesn't actually, that's not the way humans work. He talked about a growth mindset there.

He talked about addressing weaknesses, things like that. I think that people who are willing in public on TV in front of millions and millions of people, Colin Cowherd, to actually evolve and not stick to the first opinion that comes out of their mouth. That makes you so much better at your job. And it's part of the reason everybody wants to listen to you as opposed to someone who is, frankly, a blow heart and just comes out and says the first thing that comes to mind or just something where they haven't had a chance to react because there's only so many hours in the day and they're on in the morning and then it sort of sticks to it and digs in because they have to that's that's why people

come to the show because you are allowing for nuance i have to do a segment every week called right and wrong there you go to acknowledge i am regularly wrong but i i do think certain things need nuance and we're not built for it right it'd be like an account And you have to do taxes every day instead of April. Yeah. Like, like, I'm jealous of the people in our business that can write a book, a Jeff Benedict or an Eno Connor, or you get to come on and, and you're on the treadmill too, more and more. You're talented.

But it is, some, some topics deserve nuance. And we're not very nuanced. I am not always very nuanced. I had to move off that Sam Darnold's going to be a star. As painful as it was, Rachel. Great seeing as always. I had to go there. Excellent.

One more herd? The herd streams 20. four hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search heard to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what.

He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows, without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall.

And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court, licking his fingers, why he got the ball like,

After you go through a training camp with that, I said, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everyone, it's Ryder Strong and Will Ferdell from PodMeets World. And now the Pod Meets Twirled podcast. We're two men who were completely clueless to reality TV, who now have covered Dancing with the Stars, traitors, and we're gearing up for the season finale of Survivor. So yeah, now we're experts. I know we annoyed a lot of our listeners by our severe lack of survivor knowledge.

That is the point of the show. I'm just going to remind you. I have watched some survivor. I obviously haven't watched enough. Did people not like it? Yeah. Just because we? Yeah.

We'll be recapping the big conclusion in the 50th season from the final attempts at gameplay to the desperate pleas of finalists to a bunch of, ha, ooh. Ha, ha, ooh. Again, we are experts. So make sure to tune in to Pod Meets Twirled for all our Survivor 50 takes. Listen to PodMeets Twirl on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Now everybody over here? Oh, it's one of my other favorite places.

The Twilight Gazebo. Sunset Gardens. Twilight Gazebo. What's next? Dead Man's Grove? Mom, could you please try to be a little bit positive about this? From Kenya Barris, the visionary creator of Blackish, comes Big Age, an audible original about finding your way in life's next chapter. This audio comedy series follows a retired couple's

reluctant relocation to Sunset Gardens, a Floridian senior community that is anything but relaxing. starring comedy legends Jennifer Lewis, Cedric the Entertainer, and Nisi Nashvettes. Through its blend of outrageous comedy, key party anyone, and touching revelations, Big Age explores what it means to grow older without growing old at heart. Go to audible.com slash big age series to start listening today. If you're watching the latest season of the Real Housewives of Atlanta, you already know there's a lot to break down. Georgia accusing Kelly of sleeping with a merry man.

They holding Kay Michelle back from fighting Drew. Pinky has financial issues. I like the bougie style of Housewives show. I think it looks like it's going to be interesting. On the podcast, Reality with the King, I, Carlos King, recap the biggest moments from your favorite reality shows, including the Real Housewives franchise, the drama, the alliances, and the team everybody's talking about.

As an executive producer in reality television, I'm not just watching it. I understand the game. As somebody who creates shows, I'll even say this. At the end of the day, when people are at home, they want entertainment. To hear this and more, Listen to Reality with the King on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Hey, it's Edwin Castro, also known as Castro 1021. And I'm Kunky, his best friend and business manager. And we've got a new show called The 1021 Podcast. I'm taking you behind the scenes on how I became one of Twitch's most popular streamers. We also love sports. And with the World Cup right around the corner, we'll be breaking down the biggest storylines ahead of the big tournament here in the USA. Listen to the 1021 podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Yeah, driving to work today in Los Angeles. There was almost no traffic. It was so nice. I don't know why. It was just, hope you, you know, I'm taking tomorrow off. J. Mack will be in and Jordan Schultz is with us today. Patriots, by the way, retired.

I thought it was so weird. The Patriots retired Brady's uniform last night. Yeah. on a night the Celtics were playing in the NBA finals. Couldn't you look at the calendar? I know. I thought that was so odd. Good for Tom, but I would have chosen the day before or tonight.

Almost everybody in that area is a Celtic fan. Jordan with the news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. All right, Colin, Travis Kelsey has 11 seasons and three Super Bowl rings under his belt in what will be a shooting

Hall of Fame career. Speaking to the yesterday, Kelsey addressed how much time he has left in the NFL. I can't put a time frame on it, man. I love coming to work every single day. Obviously, I know there's opportunities outside of football for me, and I think you've got to keep in perspective that, you know, I'm still a little kid when I come into this building, man. I know I'm 34 years old, about to be 35, but I have a love to do this right here. in the middle of the heat in June. I love coming to work every single day and doing this. So I'm going to do it until the wheels fall off.

And hopefully that doesn't happen anytime soon. I really like him. I think he's got great perspective. He's awesome, man. And what the Chiefs have done is awesome, too, because the culture they have built predicated around winning. And Patrick Mahomes and Travis Kelsey and Andy Reed is so special. You mentioned earlier just a few minutes ago

that no team has gone back. to back to back. The Chiefs now have an opportunity to do it with Coach Reed, and I think the unsung hero as well is C Spagnolo, who beat the Patriots twice, was a huge factor in the Giants winning two Super Bowls with Eli, and now has done an unbelievable job in Kansas City with a defense that really wasn't afterthought when you talk about Mahomes, but now has become a central component of the organization. So Brett Veatch from the GM all the way to the quarterback to this Hall of Fame, Travis Kelsey, Hall of Famer. I'm so impressed with what Kansas City has done. And the league built and predicated on parody. It's almost unprecedented.

Well, the Patriots and the Chiefs are two dynasties for 20 years, and the one thing they have in common. Stable ownership at their best, excellent front offices, legendary coach, star quarterback. As the Patriots aged and Belichick blew out a lot of the personnel people or took over the draft, it weakened. They did not have enough good players at the end. And so one of the problems with male dominated sports is egos and alpha.

Kansas City more than New England doesn't seem to have a problem. Andy Reid does not want to control the draft. Belichick wanted more say. Mahalms like Brady will do a team friendly deal. Try to renegotiate his contract constantly.

So, I always thought the reason the Seahawks didn't become a dynasty because they had the players is Pete wanted more control and personnel than John Snyder would give up. Pete had an issue with Russell Wilson is that the dynamic, the power dynamic was never perfect. New England's was perfect until about the last five to six years when Bill took too much control of personnel. Kansas City is perfectly built. I was literally at a resort not long ago and sat next to the president of the chief. And he talked about that, about how the ownership lets the football guys do football.

The football guys let Andy do the coaching. That's so much more important. I mean, the reason the Niners with Harbaugh could have been a dynasty. Trent Balke and Harbaugh, there were fissures in the relationship. So what the Chiefs do better than anything is everybody stays in their lane and is elite in their specific job. Absolutely. We talk about on the field chem. It's organizational chemistry.

The chiefs have struck that perfect balance, and that's why they're in a position to win three in a row. We've seen a lot of wide receivers, Colin, land huge contracts this off season, and we've seen some stars holding out for deals of their own. Amari Cooper is the latest holdout in Cleveland, but Deshawn Watson is backing his decision. He's the best in the game, and I believe that. You know, he's showing each and every year. He shows it the last two years with different quarterback, so I think you've got to put him up there, if not the best.

Amari is our brothers, our teammate. We support him. And, you know, the decisions that he got to make for himself is on, you know, Amari. But, you know, everyone in this locker room, respect him and know exactly what he's about. And whenever he gets back, he's going to be ready to go. Yeah, you don't get any drama and ego at a position that has a lot of both. And so he never quite gets the respect he deserves. He doesn't call attention to himself, but he's really productive.

great route runner, rock solid person. I think he's one of those athletes that when it's all said and done, you'll look at his stats. I always said this about Alex English of the Denver Knows. Wow, good, yeah. You're like,

Alex English led the 80s in the NBA and scoring. No flash, no drama, didn't call attention to themselves. Amari's going to retire someday, and you're going to look at those numbers and go, those are Hall of Famous. Kind of like Mike Evans. it's similar.

But at least Evans played with Brady for a couple years, so we were microscoped on his catches. Amari's a great player. He's a great player. He's 29 years old. He's coming off his best season as a pro, almost 1,300 yards. He is productive.

And I actually spoke with someone in that organization after Amari didn't show up. And basically, the comment I got was Amari Cooper is what we want the Cleveland Browns to be about. He's professional, he's consistent, and he's dominant when he's on the field. I think he will ultimately get paid. The number really has to be, I think, over 25.

It makes sense to me. And when you talk about him getting 20 next year, he is significantly underpaid going into 2024. Yep. All right, Colin, this is a really good one for me. The Ravens made a big move this offseason, landing Derek Henry, a perennial all-pro and free agency, and giving Lamar Jackson a true number one back.

Now in Baltimore, Henry talked about being paired up with the reigning league MVP. Definitely a different aspect Because he's a dual threat quarterback And he's dangerous with his legs As he is with his arm And it's going to be

Fun and a breath of fresh air Not being the center of attention Knowing that I was going to be On him as well But I'm just excited to get to work And put the work in out here And let it all come together when it's our time You know I think Derek Henry

Is probably at worst, a top three running back right now. And the reason he didn't have the same gaudy stats the last couple of years was Tennessee's offense and really offensive line took a big step back. And I think right now going into his first season in Baltimore, this is going to position the Ravens to a spot they've never been in before, which is to have a dominant back with Lamar Jackson. I think J.K. Dobbins could have been that person had he been healthy.

But now you get inside the 20s and inside the red area. And if you're a defensive coordinator, and I spoke to one, today about this, you have to change your entire philosophy because you have to worry about the read option with Lamar and Derek Henry. He's an absolute workhorse. One more common on him. I spoke with Melvin Sanders, his longtime trainer from Dallas, and he said he's never really worked with anybody quite like Derek Henry. He might be 30 going on 25. His type, he's a unicorn, his physicality, the type of effort he puts in. It's not the normal guy who gets 250, 300 touches a year. He's really younger than what his age suggests.

up Jordan with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lie News. Thoughts on JJ Reddick and the Lakers. He could be in the driver's seat. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. On Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app.

Hey, we're Kavino and Rich. Fox Sports Radio every day, 5 to 7 p.m. Eastern. But here's the thing. We never have enough time to get to everything we want to get to. And that's why we have a brand new podcast called Overer. You see, we're having so much fun in our two-hour show. We never get to everything. Honestly, because this guy is over-promising things we never have time for.

Yeah, you blubberlips. Blamey. Well, you know what? It's called over-promise. You should be good at it because you've been over-promising women for years. Well, it's a Kavino and Rich after show, and we want you to be a part of it. We're going to be talking sports, of course. But we're also going to talk life and relationships.

And if Rich and I are arguing about something or we didn't have enough time, it will continue on our after show called Over-Promised. Well, if you don't get enough, Kavino and Rich, make sure you check out OverPromise. And also, uncensored, by the way. So maybe we'll go at it even a little harder. It's going to be the best after-show podcast of all time. There you go. Over-Promising.

And remember, you could see it on YouTube, but definitely join us. Listen to Overpromised with Kavino and Rich on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and. and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what.

He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows. Without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup,

he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stopped by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash will get that thing. That man, hell get the flying.

He running up the court, licking his fingers, why he got the ball. Like, after you go through a training camp with that, IZAD, you figure it out real quick. Oh, yeah. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everyone. It's Ryder Strong and Will Ferrell from PodMeet's World. And now the Pod Meets Twirled podcast. We're two men who were completely clueless to reality TV, who now have covered Dancing with the Stars, traitors, and we're gearing up for the season finale of Survivor. So yeah, now we're experts.

I know we annoyed a lot of our listeners by our severe lack of survivor knowledge. That is the point of the show. I'm just going to remind you. I have watched some Survivor. I obviously haven't watched enough. Did people not like it? Like what was just because we? Yeah.

We'll be recapping the big conclusion of the 50th season, from the final attempts at gameplay, to the desperate pleas of finalists to a bunch of ha-hoo. A-ha-hoo, ha-hoo, ha-hoo. Again, we are experts. So make sure to tune into Pod Meets Twirled for all our Survivor 50 takes. Listen to PodMeets Twirled on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Now, everybody over here? Oh, it's one of my other favorite places, the Twilight Gazebo.

Sunset Gardens. Night gazebo. What's next? Dead Man's Grove? Mom, could you please try to be a little bit positive about this? From Kenya Barris, the visionary creator of Blackish, comes Big Age, an audible original about finding your way in life's next chapter. This audio comedy series follows a retired couple's reluctant relocation to Sunset Gardens, a Floridian senior community that is anything but relaxing. Starring comedy legends Jennifer Lewis, Cedric the Entertainer, and Nisi Nashvettes.

Through its blend of outrageous comedy, Key Party Anyone, and touching revelations, Big Age explores what it means to grow older without growing old at heart. Go to audible.com slash big age series to start listening today. If you're watching the latest season of the Real Housewives of Atlanta,

you already know there's a lot to break down. Georgia accusing Kelly of sleeping with the merry men. They holding Kay Michelle back from fighting Drew. Pinky has financial issues. I like the bougie style of Housewives show. I think it looks like it's going to be interesting. On the podcast, Reality with the King, I, Carlos King, recap the biggest moments from your favorite reality shows,

including the Real Housewives franchise, the drama, the alliances, and the team everybody's talking about. As an executive producer in reality television, I'm not just watching it. I understand the game. As somebody who creates shows, I'll even say this. At the end of the day, when people are at home, they want entertainment. To hear this and more, listen to Reality with the King on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Hey, it's Edwin Castro, also known as Castro 1021. And I'm Conky, his best friend and business manager. And we've got a new show called The 1021 Podcast. I'm taking you behind the scenes on how I became one of Twitch's most popular streamers. We also love sports. And with the World Cup right around the corner, we'll be breaking down the biggest storylines ahead of the big tournament here in the USA. Listen to the 1021 podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. The Summer of Stars has arrived with one of the biggest international soccer tournaments in the world. The Euros finally kicking off tomorrow. when hosts Germany take on Scotland Live on Fox. Don't miss it. Coverage starts at 3 p.m. Eastern. All right, the story this morning, this afternoon, the Lakers are going to interview J.J. Reddick for the coaching job.

There's the other story. James Borago is considered a leading candidate after Dan Hurley passed. So the calves want him also. Whoever they hire, it feels like they botched it. Right? Like, we can be honest with that. I said to Rachel Nichols, They should be called the Los Angeles leakers.

Everything gets out, every rumor. Why? The Celtics are winning a title, and a big part of that is their front office, their executive suite. The Lakers don't have a coach. The drafts in two weeks. Free agency starts June 30th. They don't have a coach. And if they hire JJ Reddick, he'll be the least experienced head coach in the league with unrealistic

expectations and one of the smartest, most demanding players in LeBron James. And they don't know who their coach is. And remember that four other teams have already hired a coach and staffs, and it could be five if Cleveland gets it done in the next 36 hours. Okay, this isn't complicated. This is the way it works in the NFL. You want to hire a coach quickly. You want to get your coach in, but you want to get the best offensive coordinator you can.

In college, if you get a college football job, you want to go get two or three of the best recruiters in the country. You want to get these staff. You've got to figure out very quickly. Coach is gone, new coach in. You've got to have a list. What was the Lakers list? A podcaster, a college icon.

I mean, at some point, LeBron James is masking what appears to be the truth with this organization for 10 years. It's a bit of a mess. It feels sort of like they wing it. Stuff. I always worry about businesses, white houses, organizations. where you get constant leaks. Why is everything getting out? That means people inside the organization are protecting their butt, seeking leverage,

don't agree with the boss. Whatever reason the Dan Hurley thing gets out, you've got to protect yourself. I mean, if I was the Lakers GM, Rob Polenka, and I was interested in Dan Hurley, and I've always thought about this, I'll say, we're very interested. if the word gets out, we're interested, I will cancel the flight. John Lynch has done this before with San Francisco when they're making big moves. If it gets out, we're canceling it. If you're a well-run organization, you have that leverage that you're never desperate.

Just tell people. If it gets out, we cancel it. We take away the job offer. It's the Lakers. We have options. But it just feels like it's just mayhem. I mean, it could be Mike Brown. It could be Luke Walton.

It could be Frank Vogel. It could be Darwin Ham. It feels like they're making it up as they go. All right. I thought this was interesting last night. Quickly, Tom Brady had his, he entered the Ring of Honor in New England, Foxborough, at the stadium last night. I do think this is an organization really struggling to pivot. They hire one of Belichick's favorite guys to be the coach.

They can't get offense right. You know, they're holding something else, you know, to honor the past. It varies, very Chicago Bears. The league is pivoting offense. They have no offense. They finally, to their credit in this draft, went heavy into offense. But here was Tom last night. Strangely in the night, the Celtics were playing in the finals on television about Bill Belichick.

To coach Belichick, thank you for your, thank you for your tireless commitment to develop and push me to be my very best. It wasn't me. It wasn't you. It was us. Our hard work, our love of the game, and the way we worked for one another, that's what it was all about. Let me make this crystal clear. There is no coach in the world I would rather play for than Bill Belichick. I'll tell you, one of the great things about Jerry West and why he was able to repeat his success building dynasties

over and over. He did not romanticize the past. He didn't need pats on the back. He built. He won. It regressed. He built. He won. It regressed. No rearview mirror. You got to be careful. Celebrating the past. This was great for Tom, but I look at that roster, and they are so offensively deficient, Drake May has almost no chance to succeed in a division with Aaron Rogers, Josh Allen, and one of the two or three most creative offensive coaches with Tua in the sport. Rough road ahead.

Hour three next. Another podcast from some SNL, late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes.

Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. American Soccer is about to explode. The World Cup is coming. Ramos sending on the Army. I'm Tab Ramos. I'm Tom Bowker. On our podcast, Inside American Soccer, you'll get the real storylines, the biggest decisions, and the truth about the U.S. national team.

It wouldn't be a huge surprise if our team ends up in the quarterfell. Finals are potentially a great run into the semifinals. Listen, Inside American Soccer with Tom Bogart and Tab Ramos on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcast. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season.

And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was crying. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis coming to him, he's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love.

This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Deanna Maria Riva, and on my new podcast, How Hard Can It Be? I call on my Gen X squad from Ohio to Hollywood as we navigate Midlife's most fantastic BS.

Unfiltered conversations from night sweats to futas to scheduling sex. Wait, what sex? Is it just me? or does every woman my age want to look at Pinterest instead of having sex sometimes? They say we can't polish a turd, but we're sure going to try. So let's get blunt with laughs, tears, or tears of laughter. Listen to How Hard Can It Be with Diana Maria Riva on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Your husband is not who you think he is. Your body is not what you thought it was. Your identity is formed by a secret history. I'm Danny Shapiro. And these are just a few of the stunning stories. I'll be exploring on the 14th season of Family Secrets. He kind of shoved me out of the way and said, move. And he went out the front door and he jumped in a car and drove off.

And that was the last time I saw him. Listen to Season 14 of Family Secrets on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.