The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hour 2 - Top 5 players

Episode Date: June 2, 2025

Has Shai Gilgeous-Alexander passed Luka Doncic? Jason talks to NBA analyst Ric Bucher about the top 5 players in the NBA right now that don’t have a championship on their resume  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Tired and sick.

Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you. you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman

help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends

on the ice. Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where SportsSlice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more, follow Timbo Slicelife 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Winning on Clay is an art. The rallies are relentless. And at the French Open, only the toughest survive. I'd know. I competed there for decades. Join me, Renee Stubbs, on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast for no nonsense breakdowns of the biggest matches, the toughest players, and the moments that define Roland Garris.

Jench who win. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes. Clay? Listen, Leonard Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcasts on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Thanks for listening to The Heard podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in noon to 3 Eastern, 9 a.m. to noon Pacific. Find your local station for the herd at

Fox SportsRadio.com or stream us live. every day on the IHeart Radio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Here we are, our number two here on the herd. Colin Cowherd, still vacationing. Yes, he is enjoying another sojourn around the globe. So you have to settle for me, Jason McIntyre, joined by Alex Curry. Alex, I don't know how we both color.

I love it. On Mondays, we wear pink. I think I was good in pink. I didn't know until we sat down. I was like, A, great minds. Back in my prime in my 20s, just kidding, I'm still in my prime. I would rock like a pink shirt to go out on weekends. I love pink.

I love pink on men, especially you're a girl dad. So it's like, it's even cooler. Pink shirts are money, guys. Coming up in a few minutes, Rick Buecker, never miss it when Rick joins me because we always spar over stuff. And I'm sure he's going to love the list that I just came up with. We'll talk about it right now. So obviously, SGA and the Thunder going to the finals against how.

Alliburton and the Pacers. And we saw that over the weekend, LeBron did a podcast with Luca Donchich, along with Steve Nash, and they were talking about Luca's style. And I said, why don't we do a list, the top five players in the NBA without a ring? And here's what LeBron and Luca talked about that got me to that point. Here we go. Obviously, we've seen throughout his career, like there's plays and passes that certain guys in the league history. have ever been able to make.

I mean, it's always his pace. It's always been his pace. And he's never ever been on the floor where he's allowed someone to dictate where they're going to put him on the floor. It's always been the opposite, you know, and for us, when we all working off of that, we just got to stay ready. You know what this is leading up to, right, people? I'm a Luca guy.

And this is not just Johnny come lately. This is not since he got to the Lakers, but I'm a huge Luca fan. So I thought I'd rank going from five to one, the five best players in the NBA without a ring. Now, this caused some drama in the morning meeting. And out of the corner of my eye, I can see Rick Buecker just like, oh, my gosh. So let's start with number five, fifth best player right now in the NBA without a ring. And that's got to be my guy, Jalen Brunson.

He is a phenomenal talent. He has emerged from the best point guards in the league. He's a sub-six-3 point card, which some people think you can't win with. And Brunson, all he does is deliver Bucson. Now, why they didn't get by the Pacers, I don't think it's fully on Brunson. Obviously, his defense was not up to snuff. But the fifth spot came down to me for Brunson or Halliburton, and I'm sorry, I think Brunson's slightly better than Halliburton.

So I go Brunson at number five. The fourth best player in the NBA without a ring. Here we go. A little bit of a curveball. Jimmy Butler. Now, somebody tried to tell me in the morning meeting. Oh, my God. Jay Mack.

Joel Embed, it's so much better than Jimmy Butler. And I almost, like, vomited. it in my mouth. Come on, guys. Jimmy Butler, as an alpha, led the Miami Heat to the championship twice, okay? That's a superstar. Now, I know he's getting up there in age and he's not what he was three years ago, but he is still a phenomenal talent. I love the Jimmy Butler story. Back to my radio days. Like Jimmy Butler coming out of, like, living on, he was couch surfing, okay? Had to like fax in his resume to get into college at Marquette. Like, this guy was in a rough spot, and he has just become a star in the NBA.

I love everything about Jimmy Butler. I don't know if they'll get a title, but I have his fourth best player in the league without a ring. Number three, let's go to the MVP, Shea Gilgis Alexander. I haven't feeling Rick's going to have him at once. I think SGA is a really good player. He's obviously great season.

He's on a really good team. SGA does everything well. I'm not going to say he's a jack of all trade, master of none, because he's the master of the mid-range right now. He just gets buckets at the mid-range. Probably going to get his title this year, right? Fifth biggest favorite in like the last 50 years or whatever. SGA, third best player in the league without a ring.

Number two, Anthony Edwards. Yes, I believe Anthony Edwards is better than Shea Gildes, Alexander. Sorry, he's younger. He's got a better offensive bag. He's led the league in threes this season. He just doesn't have as good of a team as OKC. I think Anthony Edwards is phenomenal. All this future face of the league stuff, it's legit, guys.

He's that good. Now, is he a little goofy off the court and sometimes not locked in and he loves a good IG batty? Who does it? But once Anthony Edwards grows up just a little bit, Alex, stop laughing. Once he grows up just a little bit, Anthony Edwards is going to be the top player in the NBA. Now, for the number one player in the NBA without a ring, it's got to be Luca. Who's better than Luca? I have him right there in the Yokic Janice class,

and my thing that I come back to all the time. Luca makes everyone around him better. He did it in Dallas. They got to the finals last year because he made everyone around him better. That Dallas team, it's not a great team. Look at them this year. What would they do this year?

Now, I know Kyrie got hurt, but they had AD, and largely the same guys that Luca had that he put on his back and got to the finals. For me, Luca Donchis, the best player in the NBA without a ring. And without further ado, let's welcome in Rick Buecker, Fox Sports NBA analyst.

Now, I have great vision, and I could see Rick pacing, turning around, throwing his hands in the air. Oh, my gosh, J. Mack, you're crazy. So much work. I've been. So much work, so little time. We made eye contact a couple times.

Oh, rattling on. Oh, five best players. I had chills over there. The NBA without a ring. Now, Rick, you're not a lot of, You're doing your list as well. Yes. And don't pretend like you didn't see my list. No, I haven't seen it.

They did tell me. He could be telling the truth. It's the same list. I'm going to start sending out a Fogazi list to the producer early so you don't try to crib it. I'll guess your guy number one is SGA, right? Yes. And by and how do you possibly put Anthony Edwards ahead of Shea Gildes-Alexander after what we just witnessed? How is that possible?

Well, it's not like they were playing one-on-one, Rick. They were both the leaders of their respective teams, and one guy got gentlemanly swept. It was essentially a picket-in-law. Against Anthony Edwards. They said, Julie's Reynolds. Take all the three. Yeah, because you know what? Because he has no mid-range game.

If you put Chey Gildes-Alexander there, the defense isn't able to do the same thing. So he can operate in more places. If you want to go head-to-head, yes, mid-range to SGA, three-point shooting to Anthony Edwards, driving to the rim, Anthony Edwards, dunk on anybody. And defense, I would go aunt over SGA. Then why didn't he in that series? five guys in the late, including... Okay, so if you don't have the mid-range, then you don't get the dunk as often,

and he has to finish at the rim. Look, SGA, as far as an offensive bag, it's not as dynamic as ants, but it is more complete without question. I can say SGA is a three-level score. Ant falling in love with the three has changed that dramatically. Half of his shots this year were from three, and yet he shot the same number as he did the previous season. Where did the shots come from?

His mid-range, he abandoned it, and that cost him in the playoffs. I blame analytics. Don't blame Anthony yet. So where do you have Luke on the list? Luke, I believe I had second. He's up there, but you're mixing the bag because I also had, I had Aunt Fifth, and I had Jimmy Butler ahead of him. Now, if we're just talking about pure talent, I don't know that we can go there,

but I'm looking at a Jimmy Butler, to your point, who led teams to the finals twice. Like, there's this combination of guys who are just purely talented who don't have a ring and guys who have demonstrated that they're next in line or they deserve a ring because they've come so close and maybe they just didn't have the requisite team around them. But I'm not going to say that about Ant. This is my great issue is that when a player like Ant doesn't get to the finals or doesn't win a ring, We immediately go, oh, well, he doesn't have enough help. We need to get more pieces around him.

It's Julius Randall's fault. It's Chris Finch's fault. It's Mike Conley's fault. I'm like, no, if you're that kind of player and I'm looking at the holes in Anthony Edwards' game, first and foremost, I want him to fill those holes. And then I'll figure out the pieces that I need around him. Because this Minnesota at Simberwell's team was more talented than a team. that got gentlemanly swept.

That's fair. I would push back and say Ants 23. And I think SGA is 26. I know, we keep saying that. So three years ago, SGA was in the play-in, and meanwhile, Ant is taking his team to the conference finals two years in a row. His team has gone to the final,

to the conference finals two years in a row. You would admit that. Julius, I can make a case that Julius Randall had more to do with them getting there this year than Ante. Well, Julia Randall did was unbelievably good until he wasn't. Yes. Understood.

Yeah. Here's the other part is I keep, first, last year it was he's 22. Now it's he's 23. And when asked, like, did this, did this hurt? Did you struggle? No, I don't struggle. I'm good. I'm going to work hard this summer, but I'm good. Like, you like that? I did not love that. Okay. Some of the, I, me, me either, because you, the clock is ticking. Like, and if you look at guys, like Tracy McGrady, Penny Hardaway there's any number of guys that were great early on Penny Hardaway went to the finals his second year

he was all NBA first team two years in a row Tracy McGrady same thing was like third or fourth year was was all NBA and getting some MVP accolades

before I don't know that I take that back that was with Penny with Shaq leaving Orlando Yeah, yeah. But those guys, like, when we looked at them early in their first three, four years, we're like, oh, these guys are playing for championships. These guys are going to be all-time greats. And they hit their zenith in those first four or five years. That's more the rule than the exception in terms of guys winning a ring. Like, I think it's a foregone conclusion in a lot of people's minds, including ants, that Ant is going to win MVP at some point, and he's going to

win a ring at some point. Probably. Right? The Minnesota Timberwolves had the most expensive roster in the league this year, right? And if we look at some of the guards and some of the players early on that won, it's because they had guys on their team that were really good who were underpaid. Like, the Minnesota Timberwolves are not there. Yeah, they're not. Right? So is it going to happen in the next year or two? No. Well, then now we're getting to 27, 28 and having to remake the temper wolves around him. I'm just, I think there's this foregone conclusion about Ant that I wouldn't necessarily buy into. As I hear you explain that, I was just thinking to the guy LeBron James who in what year three or something with Cleveland goes to the finals.

Yep. Can't get back there. Yep. Says, guys, I'm out. Evan Duran and OKC. Yep. Yep. They get to the finals, young guys. Had to go someplace else. Right. So is Minnesota going to do it in Minnesota? Anthony Edwards going to do it in Minnesota? Yeah. Probably not.

And here's the flip side of that. When you look at the guys that are there right now, SGA and Tyrese Halliburton. What do they have in common? This isn't their first team. This isn't their first team. And there were doubts about both of them at various points. Like how good can they be? Can they be the leader of a championship team? We haven't had anybody expressed that doubt about Aunt Edwards. And I believe that you're taking away the motivation of a player, the urgency of a player to say, you know what, I want to prove you wrong.

Nobody's saying Aunt has to prove them wrong. Everybody's still giving him flowers in spite of the fact that if you look at the last two Western Conference finals, yes, did they get there? Sure. But he was outplayed by another star, Luca Dant's last year and SGA this year, and yet there still seems to be no urgency or a feeling like, hey, Aunt, you need to pick it up if you're going to get there. I don't know what more he could do. But anyways, let's move on to the Knicks. I just, the post-mortem, we had Frank I so long. I'm pledging, hey, let's take a deep breath.

Last year, the Pacers were swept by the Celtics, conference finals. They make zero changes to their top eight, and they're in the NBA finals. I know I've been like, hey, maybe we dumped Tibido. I know there's this Janus Chase. I'm actually preaching some patience, Rick, and I think the Knicks can run it back. Are you okay? I know. Irrational New Yorker over here. No. You are, you are being incredibly rational.

I've never, I've never heard. Wow. Jay Mack be this rational. You're usually, we've got to move. We got to do this. We got to fire the coach. Like always, right? Blow it up, get rid of them.

They suck. I had a boozy weekend. It played some basketball. You know, like, you get your mind cleared. I came in this morning. I said, guys, we're going to stand up. Yeah. And I think they can get to the NBA finals.

They weren't far off this year. No, they weren't. The issue is, like, ideally, if you're going to play for a championship, they need a true two-way big. Like right now they have, like Mitchell Robinson's on the floor. Defensively, they're a different team. But now they're a different team offensively as well. Offensively, Kat gave you a lot. Let's not undersell what he did for the better part of...

of the playoffs. But if you're going to be built around a point guard, and I'd look at the 2004 Detroit Pistons winning a championship and the 2022 Golden State Warriors, you have to have like the perfect pieces and a lot of talent around that guard. If you look at the numbers alone, what Jalen Brunson did this year in the regular season and in the players, playoffs, mirrors what Steph Curry did in 2022, both regular season and playoffs. But what Steph had was he had Andrew Wiggins playing almost, yeah, almost better than Draymond Green as a defensive player and a true was a two-way impact player. You had Draymond Green still playing well.

You had Clay Thompson have his moments. You had Jordan Poole. Like you had all the pieces that allowed to, that covered the blemishes of Steph. and allowed him to maximize what he is. That's what the Knicks need. And I don't know that they have it right now, but to your point, like unless there was a clear cut,

I can get this thing that makes a difference, I'm standing pat. Let's be real. Can they get Janus? I don't see, it just doesn't seem feasible given the pick. They don't have that many picks. Yeah, I've been asking about that

because, I mean, the teams, there's Houston. Yeah. There's Brooklyn. Brooklyn can give up a lot, but he's not going there. Yeah. Toronto's going to make a run at him, but I don't know that that's going to happen. But those two teams in particular have the assets that Milwaukee would want.

How the spurs have assets? The spurs, I would add the spurs in the equation, too. Those three teams. It's tough. Okay, so let's downshift to Kevin Durant. Yeah. Turn 37 in September, Rick. Yeah.

I'm a huge KD fan, but is he that much of an upgrade for Kat? And doesn't he shrink your window from, like, maybe the next three years to, like, you better win this year? because KD's hurt all the time. Yeah, I'd say he's an upgrade. I mean, the tricky part is, are you just getting him as a one-year rental? Or is he going to sign an extension?

Do you want to sign him to extension? What does that extension look like? There's a lot of tricky parts to that, to your point, because of KD's age and where he is. The one-year deal for a team that's looking for cap space that might be stuck. I mean, that's where Minnesota's kind of attractive. But the problem is that you'd have to give up multiple pieces.

It's not Julius Randall for Kevin Durant. It's Julius Randall and Jade McDaniels, or Julius Randall and Rob Dillingham and Mike Connolly. So that's where it becomes difficult. I had somebody this morning suggest Atlanta as a place. For KT. Just because they have the assets. And my first reaction was,

KD's kind of finish his career. in Atlanta. That's like Patrick Ewing wearing a Sonics jersey or... Yeah, it's... A Laja one for the Raptors or something silly. You don't want to see that. Not very attractive.

But no, KD's going to be difficult. All right, let's go to the... Actually, Easter Conference Finals voting. Did you have an issue with the Siakum 5, Halliburton 4? And I will just preface this. The media votes on this stuff. Yes, right?

Yes. We know the media. They do some dumb things, obviously. All NBA voting. But anyways, did you have a major issue with it? I really don't. First of all, it was 5-4. Yeah.

So there's like one swing vote, right? And I can make a case for either guy. Yeah. Pascal Seacom, if you look at the, if you take in to account the defensive end of the floor, I mean, the Knicks were hunting Tyrese Halliburton at times. Pascal Seaccom winning his battle, being the best big on the floor, was the difference maker. And then when you look in terms of key baskets, he didn't have, he didn't have,

He didn't have the highlight moments that Halliburton had. But the way I described it was Pascal Seacom was the engine, and Tyrese Halliburton was the driver. He got everybody involved. You know, obviously the assists were through the roof. But Pascal Seacom was getting to the free throw line. He was getting the Knicks in foul trouble. And, you know, in those situations where they absolutely needed a bucket, they could hand him the ball and he would go get it. It's weird. It felt like Jalen Brown over Jason Tatum last year.

Yeah. Not unlike that. I was also thinking like the kind of the Igwadala, Steph Curry. Oh, finals MVP. Finals MVP set up. That annoyed me. I was such a Curry defender. I would go online and battle these morons. Like you said, the media doesn't always get it right, but I don't think that they got it perversely wrong in this case. Now, let me ask you about the finals. I've been workshopping this take. I was going to save it for midweek when things are slow. I don't know, Rick. This whole finals battle, right?

It's a good matchup of teams. NBA diehards will love it. Casuals probably will not. I'm of the belief that Indiana is going to give them a much closer series than the experts think. Everybody's saying, oh, this OKC is just a juggernaut. Everything that OKC does really well, so does Indiana. They've got the bench. They play with pace and tempo. Halliburton led the league and assist turnover.

I mean, at one point in the next series, he had like four turnovers in five games. Like... It's one way to look at it. A lot of people are looking at all the things that Indiana does, OKC does, and they just do it better, right? Except for one thing. And I'd say there's two factors where I'm with you, I'm not going to say it's going to be a great series. I think that the pastures have a chance to make it an interesting series in terms of pushing it to six, maybe even seven. maybe even seven.

NBA would love that. I don't see them winning it, but I see them making it a contest. And for two reasons. Number one, they have shot the ball from three-point range, lights out, and they've done it collectively. Like, I think last I checked, they were shooting like 40% in the playoffs as a team.

That's insane. That's much, much better than OKC does. And as we know, the three-point shot can have a huge influence on flipping... As the Cavs. In the odds, exactly. The other part is Rick Carlisle and Pascal Seacom. I have two guys who know what it takes to win a championship,

who have been to the finals. And I look at the, I look at the Thunder, and you have Alex Caruso, I believe, who won in the bubble. Am I right on that? And other than that, brand new. Rick Carlisle has been to the finals six times. He took a Dallas Mavericks team that was probably as underrated and looked past in the finals versus the Miami Heat as this Pacer's team is against the Oklahoma City Thunder. So I believe that the Carlisle is going to have a few things up his sleeve.

I love that. And by the way, Nemhard, you see he's making $2 million this year? Yeah. Starting point guard, who's good? I still remember this. Nobody will remember this. But his final college game, I think it was Wichette. He shot like two of 11.

He was a train wreck and they lost his big favorites. And I'm like, this guy's not a pro. He was terrible against Arkansas. Nemhart has been phenomenal. He's a good basketball player. And at $2 million in the finals, that's how you're here. And that's how you get to finals. Going back to the whole Minnesota point is that you have, you know,

when the Warriors were making their runs, they were paying Steph $11 million. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He signed the four-year $44 million deal. You need, especially in today's NBA, you need a couple of guys who haven't been paid yet. Jordan Poole and Andrew Wiggins in 2022. Like, guys that are playing for the bag and the Minnesota Timberwolves don't have that.

So let me just, the whole small market, super team stuff. The super team era is over, sadly. But I need to remind people, Rick, like LeBron, the LeBron, we know now, before he got to the heat and started that, he was like second banana to Kobe and Shaq and the Celtics. He wasn't the polarized,

oh my gosh, I can't stand the LeBron. He wasn't that until he went to the heat. Yeah. And so I just wonder, some of these young stars, they're not polarizing. And if you don't have that love or hate,

it's just like, oh, we've got the Pacers and thunder in the finals. Yeah. And I know the NBA doesn't want that because the owners want everybody to have a chance. Right. But I feel like if you don't have that, it's not going to be great for the league.

I don't know. That's kind of like a big picture thing. I don't know how you've solved that. But there isn't really anybody at the NBA right now that you feel strongly about one way or the other. Right. No, it has to happen organically. And to your point, I don't know who that is that's out there right now that we feel that way. Well, Janus could be the lynchpin.

People are not going to like it if he goes to a good team. Like KD went to the Warriors. Instantly, everybody hated him. But, Rick, you had to watch. You were rearranging your anniversary dinners around Kevin Durant versus LeBron, you know, that kind of thing. Sure. And if KD goes to a contender, that would stir the pot as well. Yes. Look, the league is taking a very different approach to the way it traditionally approached things,

which is it's taking a global view. And I think in part it's plain to the fact that its best players are international players. and that the domestic market is basically saturated. Like, well, how much more are you going to get out of the domestic market? But they look globally and they're thinking, okay, we have international stars. It's why they're talking about starting in a European division, as much as, you know, getting expansion teams in Las Vegas and Seattle. You hear as much about a European division as you hear about those.

In fact, those moves, which I still think are going to happen, are sort of have been forgotten. So I believe that they're looking at, you know what, we want to attract an audience that's going to buy jerseys and is going to stream games and is going to be fans. And we don't need, like,

we don't have to cut through the mainstream, have stars that are going to cut through the mainstream in the U.S. Because, you know, the people in Serbia are going to go crazy for the Denver Nuggets, Right? And maybe you capture a bigger part of the Canadian market with Sheaildas Alexander. I think that they're looking at globally we have attractions that other leagues don't. And that's our sweet.

So we'll wrap up with this Cooper flag. Carmelho Anthony had some quotes. And it's interesting. You just mentioned domestic international. Yeah. And I don't want to say Carmelo was bashing him, but he was basically saying like, he's not great at anything. He's a good player. He does everything well. Yeah. There's a world. Jeff Teague last week was like, SGA saved the NBA with the mid-range.

I was like, eh, I honestly think Cooper Flagg domestically, I know people aren't going to want to hear this. He can be a savior of sorts. And I'm sorry to bring up race, but he's a white guy who can maybe dominate in a league where there hasn't been a dominant white guy in a long time. Yeah, you know, it's funny. I look at like a Chet Holmgren and a Cooper Flag. And I, and it's then they sort of shift my view of where we are as far as our

American-born players and our ability to compete internationally. I think if Anthony Edwards continues to evolve and you have a Cooper flag and you have a Chet Holmgren, we have a chance to still be all right. France isn't going to take over. It's not over. Just quite yet. But I hear Carmelo because I think one of the dangers is when we have somebody who's taken number one, we immediately expect them to be a superstar.

Yes. And I don't know. I think Cooper Flag could be a really good player for a really long, good, good, a really long time. But I don't know that he's necessarily going to be a superstar. Okay, well, wait, to find superstar. Was LeBron a superstar right out of the gate averaging like 23 as a rookie? Ah, he had, he had the earmarks of a super star.

Okay, what about Zion? First year, I know he's heard and blah, blah, blah, but no. Zion's a classic example of somebody that we anointed way too early. And making the Anthony Edwards comparison. Like, Zion was supposed to be the next whatever, like from the gate. And even LeBron, like, until he lost, and everybody started to say, well, maybe he's not a champion. Was that the Dallas series?

It forced him to, no, no, no, no, no. That forced him to go to Miami. Oh, oh, in Cleveland. To get out of Cleveland, right? Super Team Celtics. Right, right. Like, he finally had to, hey, you got to put up or shut up. Like, we kept making excuses for Zion.

Oh, he's heard. If he could just stay healthy, whatever, da-da-da-da. I'm done. Yeah. By the way, is he moving this summer? Is he going anywhere? I don't know what the market is for Zion. I don't know that he's going anywhere, but he's got bigger issues.

Oh, that's right. Yeah, yeah, he does. All right. Final one. We haven't mentioned John Moran in a couple years. Yeah. A couple of years. Something's going on in Memphis.

I keep hearing this, Jaron Jackson stuff. And then there's, hey, maybe. we just move on from Jaws, start over, reboot. Any thoughts on Jomera? Because he, for like seven minutes, was going to be the future of the NBA. Yeah. Well, I don't think he gets back there now.

I think there's just too much water under the bridge. I, could he be moved? Man, that's as difficult as Minnesota moving in Anthony Edwards. You don't get stars like that in markets like that unless you draft. I mean, I just think of Luca got moved and nobody thought that was. Yeah, that's the exception rather than the rule. Yeah. All right, Rick Buecker. I mean, look at that. It's like 20 great minutes

with a guy who... We actually, there was a couple of things we had some Pataco on, and you were like, you were rational and sober at one point. This was a good session. It's Monday. I have to be sober today. Jay Mack, this was... I enjoyed this. Thank you so much. I made him come back.

Ooh, I love it. All right. Rick Buecker, great stuff. Coming up next. Alex Curry will tell us why Matt LaFleur had to defend his stark QB Jordan Love over the weekend. That's next. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers. And guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, name? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast?

Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a... We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Oh, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down?

Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential. title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform?

We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending. Opinions are flying.

And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real.

From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slicelife 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis. And I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs.

And on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris. Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on clay. Jen Chinchin win. I mean, she went down. three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lena Rubakina is arguably the best player in the world right now.

And I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Great stuff from Rick Buker and now more great stuff, Alex Curry with the news. No, no, no, no.

Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. All right, we're going to start in the NFL. Jordan Love and the Packers finished third in the NFC North last year and had an up and down year in his second year starting going into year three. His head coach Matlopheor says he doesn't believe that Love took a step back last year. Three games is a significant amount of time and you're going to be a little. bit you're not going to produce as much from a numbers perspective if but from what i've seen i you know and then also i think there was let's be honest i mean when we talked about this we did have a lot of

drops last year the packers had the third most drops in the NFL last year but according to matliflor yeah not on jordan love now they did draft a wide receiver in the first round for the first time in 23 years. So they addressed, you know, what they think might be the issue. But again, like, NFC North is a tough division. Lions, obviously, losing a lot of

their coordinators. That's going to be difficult. Vikings, now going with rookie quarterback, J.J. McCarthy, is going to be a little different. So Packers and Jordan Love have a chance to be competitive once again in the NFC North. But do you think

he played well last year, Jordan Love? Not particularly. So here's it. He missed two games. He had some injuries. So he wasn't as mobile. The key number here is the interception. So Alex, he threw 150 fewer passes and had the same number of interceptions.

Not great. And his touchdowns were significantly down. Again, he missed time due to injuries. He wasn't as healthy. Start in the open. Remember he turned his ankle? Yeah. I think it was on the last play of the game.

So he was injured to start the season. Good chunk of the season. Also, I like the fact that your head coach is defending and supporting your quarterback. Like, that's a good sign for Jordan Levin, Matt LaFlor. Listen, he didn't drop significantly, but I think people expect young quarterbacks to make a linear progression. Good one year? Hey, we were great in the playoffs. Let's go.

Let's make the next step. Yeah. You're also following Aaron Rogers, who won a bunch of MVP's. You know, the Packers have, for some reason, have always figured out their quarterback. like one after the next. So there's a lot of pressure on Jordan Love, but I think he's going to be just fine. I don't know if I agree with you there.

All right. Well, let's move to another team in the division. New Lions quarterback, DJ Reed came over from the Jets last season after spending three seasons in New York. And Reed says he noticed a difference immediately. Is the energy difference immediately notable here? Yeah, for sure. Like, I needed to go through what I went through in New York.

And I'm grateful. that I went through it. Now, that's the difference between a team with championship aspirations, the Lions, versus a rebuilding team when he was on the Jets, and a functioning franchise like the Lions against a dysfunctional situation when he was there with the Jets. Because he was there the last three seasons. Like they had, he was great, but now he's on a team that is a complete team.

He has the talent around him. It's a completely different. different scenario for. And he, and I don't have exact numbers on this because I don't know if you can find these, but I know Sawdartner was their number one with New York. Yeah. So he was facing a lot of number two receivers. Yeah.

He goes to Detroit. He's the number one cornerback. Yeah. Now you're facing the elite superstars every week. And opposite him is Terrianna Arnold, the young kid out of Alabama who really struggled, graded out of 109th out of 116 corners. So it's like, hey, why would we even target DJ? We're going to be throwing at Arnold.

I think this is going to be a little tough one for Reid, the transition. Yeah. And they're not as great of a past rush in Detroit as we had in New York. Could be an alarming. But the Lions have a lot going on as I think we're going to do another story. We're saving that for a bit. But yeah, yeah, yeah. They have the Lions have a lot of going.

A lot of changes. Not a lot of great, not a lot of great stuff either. Not a lot of good. They're losing a lot of guys. We'll get to that in a bit. It's not our third story this hour. But let's move to New York and talk about your Knicks again because it was all good in New York. Just a round ago, now after the Paysers bounced them in the conference finals,

a report came out after saying teammates were growing frustrated with Carl Anthony Towns and his effort on the defensive side of the ball this season. But, I mean, I don't think that's a surprise. We all saw it. We heard the broadcast talking about it. Kat mentioned he needed to be better in his post-game interviews. But at this point, you know, how do you work with what you have? Like, he is who he is.

He's 29 years old. He's their highest paid player on the team and will be for a bit. So do you just kind of adjust around him? Do you play through him more and make him more of an offensive weapon? So maybe that kind of balances out the defensive defects that he has. You trade him for someone with better defense. Like, there's a lot of questions. You just, you kind of have to work with him.

And as you mentioned, you're not going to break up the whole system. It's just how do you kind of adjust it? They don't need a full facelift. They need just kind of touch-ups. This is a really tough. There's no easy answer. There is a lot of questions, as you said. Yeah.

No easy answer. I use the word at the phrase space cadet. I don't know if that's accurate, but he just, his rotations are curious. It's like, dude, if this happens, you've got to do this. And he never does that. And I just, some of these fouls, I think you said, the post game, was it Barkley? Yeah, called him out. You can't be doing this.

Dude, what's with these dumb fouls? You can't be doing this. He's like, I know, I know. And he just, he looked at like. I know, I shouldn't. I know. I didn't stop. I don't know. I mean, Tibbs is a defensive guy. If he can't get the guy locked in,

it's just who he is at this point. It's tough. Listen, I like Towns. Got some relatives in New Jersey. Towns's father just moved around the corner from them. So they're texting me. Hey, Carl Anthony Towns's dad lives near us. I was like, great. Can you tell a cat to lock it on you? Yeah.

But when he's good, he's great, you know? It's just, are you going to get that? He consistently brought up. He's the one piece that Nick's fans And this article that you bring up Yeah I was reading it during the commercial It's like

Yeah All I mean it's like Every finger is pointing at him Like bro Like that would be to move You're the week link here I don't know I like he's also the most expensive

guy on the roster Bro Alex Curry with the news Well that's the news And thanks for stopping by The Hurd Lye News All right coming up next The good news is

Michael Parsons was at OTA's last week. The bad news is he's not there this week. Oh, what is Dallas doing? We'll talk about that next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. Hey, it's Steve Kavino. And I'm Rich Davis. And together we're Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio. You can catch us weekdays from 5 to 7 p.m. Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific, on Fox Sports Radio, and of course, the Iheart Radio app.

Why should you listen to Kavino and Rich? We talk about everything, life, sports, relationships, what's going on in the world? We have a lot of fun talking about the stories behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture. Stories that, well, other shows don't seem to have the time to discuss. And the fact that we've been friends for the last 20 years and still work together, I mean, that says something, right? So check us out. We like to get you involved, too. Take your phone calls, chop it up as they say.

I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio. Maybe the most interactive show on planet Earth. Be sure to check out Covino & Rich live on Fox Sports Radio and the IHeart Radio app from 5 to 7 p.m. Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific. And if you miss any of the live show, just search Covino and Rich wherever you get your podcast and, of course, on social media. That's Kavino and Rich. Hey, it's us to Jonas Brothers, and guess what?

We have some big news. What's the news, me? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts.

Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts, right? starting a trend. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it

one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey Jonas. and then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast.

But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and Head, writer Street or Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple

podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise.

breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaders to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more, follow Timbo Slicelife 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis. And I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs. And on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris. Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on clay. Jen should win. I mean, she went down in three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted.

She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lena Rubakina is arguably the best player in the world right now. And I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports.

Horse racing's greatest test returns as sovereignty and journalism face off in the 157th, Belmont State's two of the season's biggest names, one race to settle it off. Coverage begins Saturday at 4 p.m. Eastern, live on Fox. All right, I love when we do, like, peaks behind the curtain of what's going on. You know, there's a quarterback who's unsigned, who's old and ornery, and played for my Jets last year. I don't like talking about him anymore. But the staff hit me with, hey, this is interesting. I like, no, we're not doing that guy on Monday.

We're not. I'm not talking about it. And another, like, kind of no-fly zone has been the Cowboys. But this next story, I found interesting enough, and it's Micah Parsons. Okay. He's not at OTAs this week. It's not the end of the world, right? He was there last week showing up immediately sees the new coach, Schottnheimer, blah, blah, blah.

He still doesn't have a contract. Okay? and when I was a kid, I would, you know, I was one of these procrastinators when it came to schoolwork. Oh, that project's due next week. I'll do it later. And my parents would say, so the project, are you going to do it? And I'd be like, no, no, I got to do this, that, the other.

I got to work on my shot, you know, playing golf. I would just, I would procrastinate. And I'd never want to do it. And my parents would always say, the exact saying was, don't save for tomorrow which you can get out of the way today. And I would just be like, you old people don't know what you're talking about. I'm going to do me. And usually it blew up in my face.

I didn't get great grade shocker. Don't tell my kids that. But I was a procrastinator. And for some reason that still is unexplained, Jerry Jones continues to procrastinate when it comes to paying his players. He waited to pay DAC and it blew up in his face. And now DAC is the highest paid quarterback in the league. Dak, who pro football focused last week said was, I think 17th or something.

He's not 17. He's probably closer to 10 or 12. But basically Jerry Jones screwed it up. So then Jerry also procrastinated with CD Lamb. And how'd that work out? He's not a top three receiver in the league. I'm sorry. He's paid like one.

And now we have Michael Parsons. And Michael Parsons is a podcast guy. So he's stirring up stuff. He's on social media. Did you see what he did over the weekend? So, you know, there's some random video of Michael Parsons running back highlights from his senior year in high school. Maybe he can help the Cowboys running back room, which is kind of putrid, probably bottom five running back room. And, of course, Michael Parsons repops it.

And he's like, yeah, he averaged 10 yards of carry. I mean, he looks like Derek Henry does in the NFL. Michael Parsons look like that in high school. He got like 27 touchdowns. So Michael Parsons is essentially using every avenue he can. his podcast, social media, to cryptically send messages to Jerry Jones in Dallas. Jerry's going to sign him, but he's going to wait and wait. And for the longest time, I thought, oh, this is strategy by Jerry because he wants to keep Dallas's name out there in the ether.

People are always talking about the Cowboys, even though they're not America's team anymore. People are always talking about Dallas. But once again, it's blowing up in his face. We saw Miles Garrett reset the market recently. Well, if Jerry had just signed Micah last season, before or last off season, he wouldn't be dealing with this nonsense. Micah's not going to play for anything less than Miles Garrett.

So now you're paying more. So you paid more for DAC, more for lay them, and now you've got to pay more for Parsons. And some of these numbers that the salary cap guys are crunching is basically saying, those three guys are chewing up like all of the money for Dallas. And I don't know, guys.

I'm at the point where I don't know what else you can say to Jerry Jones. He doesn't get it. He doesn't care. Nobody can get in his ear and stop him from doing, you know, dumb things to the Dallas salary cap. They had a good run under McCarthy. That's over. It really feels like Dallas is going nowhere. And I've said for the longest time, like Michael Parsons, he's had 12 or more sacks in each of his first four years.

That's great. That's historic territory. It's like what Reggie White was doing. And now you're going to pay him more money than Miles Garrett. You're essentially going to have one defensive player, a quarterback and a receiver, and nothing else. So Jerry Jones, I don't know what to tell you, my guy, but we have now reached our quota of Dallas Cowboy Stories for the week. And it's Monday. Nice job, Jerry Jones.

Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast.

Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it out. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite.

Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman helped make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and headwriter Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people

are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened.

That's where Sports Slice comes in. Timbo, in every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff

nobody gets to hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slice Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Winning on Clay is an art. The rallies are relentless. And at the French Open, only the

survive. I'd know. I competed there for decades. Join me, Renee Stubbs, on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast for no-nonsense breakdowns of the biggest matches, the toughest players, and the moments that define Roland Garris. She's an outsider to win the French name. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lerner-Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports.

This is an IHeart podcast, guaranteed human.