The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hour 3 - BREAKING NEWS : Knicks fire Tom Thibodeau

Episode Date: June 3, 2025

JMac reacts to the BREAKING NBA NEWS: The Knicks have fired head coach Tom Thibodeau following their run to the Eastern Conference FinalsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Back here on the herd. Listen, Kevin Durant, I have a checkered relationship with him. He's 36 turning 37. He's kind of near the end of his prime. I mean, he can still get you a bucket. I don't know what else he could do. But there's a lot of chatter right now.

An article just dropped about the potential for. him going to Houston, the New York Knicks. So we're bringing in Christian Winfield of the New York Daily News, covers the Knicks, Beat Writer. Christian, listen, man, this Kevin Durant stuff. I know it's exciting, but I got to be honest, I don't know how realistic it is for him to end up with the Knicks. What are you hearing on your end here?

Well, you got to remember, I got a chance to cover Kevin Durant for four years while he was a member, while he was the leader of that Brooklyn Nets team. And one thing he's going to do as soon as he walks. walks to the doors, raise the level of everyone that's around him. That's just the championship pedigree. That's the Hall of Famer pedigree that he brings. That being said, you hit the nail on the head. He's going to be 37 years old in September.

We know in terms of just injury history, it's been checkered. And on top of that, the asking prices, guys, making more than $50 million. And then you're probably going to have to sign him to an extension after that. Just what does that look like at this stage of his career? It's hard for me to see the Knicks, especially considering they don't really have any draft assets. after he gave up five for Mikhail Bridges to make this deal happen, let alone what they'd have to give up to get them. I don't see it happening.

It feels like a pipe dream. But let's turn back the clock. So you covered that Durant Nets team, which was basically the Titanic, right? I mean, with Kyrie Irving, James Hardin, you know, the sage in the locker room and James Harden being. One of the things Durant didn't do was be a leader. I'm just curious.

He's often talked, hey, I just want to hoop. I don't want to be a leader. Is there a world where he becomes one? at this stage of his career because he hasn't won anything since the Warriors? You know, I think it's dependent on what your definition is of a leader, right? If you ask the guys that are in that locker room, Kevin Durand is the type of guy who leads by his actions. He's someone who's coming in early, getting his work,

and he's setting a standard of excellence and showing guys what it takes to perform at a certain level. Now, if you're talking about leader on the floor, being the guy who can make every decision with the ball for a team, kind of like LeBron, kind of like what we're seeing with Luca, Shea, along those lines, then maybe that's not your guy in terms of the number one person that you can have to win a title. But in terms of just locker room present in turn of raising the IQ and just the overall ability of everyone in the locker room, Kevin Durand is most certainly a leader.

It just depends on what a team needs. And, you know, in Brooklyn, I mean, there were more things that could have gone wrong other than Kevin Durant. Kevin Durant was probably the most consistent in terms of what you were getting from every single day. I don't think he was the problem there. Yeah. I am curious. Do you think he fits with Brunson? I know it's easy to say Durant fits anywhere.

He's a bucket guy. He just shoot, shoot the ball. I don't know. You could argue he hasn't worked with Devin Booker, who doesn't have as high of a usage rate as Brunson. But do you think this would be like an easy partnership? I don't know because with the Knicks already right now,

you have two issues on defense. And at this point in Kevin Durant's career, especially dealing with the injuries and then at age 37, to have another pressure point on the defensive end would be a pretty tough sell. Offensively, I think KD is a bucket, no matter, 37, 47, 57, he's going to be money from that mid-range. He's going to be money in crunch time moments, no matter how old he is.

It's really just on the defensive end right now where there are concerns. And then it's durability, of course, especially if you're talking about playing Kevin Durant under Tom Tibido. I mean, how many minutes can he play before he starts to wear it down? So I think fit in terms of that will be a question. But offensively, you put him next to anybody. He's going to find a way to be effective. So we know the vibes at the garden were incredible during that pace. series, you know, Timothy Shalamee rolling up with the Jenner sister.

And it was just amazing. But for whatever reason, just because they lost the series, all Knicks fans are like, all right, how do we fix this? How do we blow it up? This was their best season this century, I believe. I don't know. I'm under the impression they should probably just tinker with the bench. And I'm okay with keeping Tibbs.

But where are you on the whole run it back versus let's go get this guy, blah, blah, blah. Well, when you look at the two teams that are representing both conferences in the NBA finals, you've got two teams that are not afraid of playing 10 players that have played 10 players in a rotation regularly throughout the season. I think that's going to be the new standard. If you're going to be a team that's going to compete for a title, you've got to have a deep bench. And when you look at the Knicks, things get shaky outside of the next, outside of the top seven to eight players.

You don't have that reliable eighth or ninth guy off the bench that you know can fill in and play quality minutes. And by the time the Knicks found them, which was Landry Shammon, and Dillon Wright in the conference finals, it was too late. They hadn't been tinkering with a lot of these lineups. So to your point, I think bench depth is something they have to target. I think backup point guard is something they absolutely have to target when you consider the difference between T.J. McConnell for the Indiana Pacers and whoever was stepping up behind Jalen Brunson,

you get a quality backup point guard in there. You're able to maybe preserve Brunson in some of these minutes down the stretch where he's otherwise tired, right? So there's those two parts of it. And then the big part is, how can this team kind of maximize the pieces that they already have. You stack that starting five up against a lot of these other teams in the conference, and you've got a team that should be winning a lot of these games. The issue is, you know, you've got the ball being stuck in Brunson's hands at times. You've got the ball not getting

the towns for stretches at a time. And then you've got players like O.G. Anobia and Mikhail Bridges who've shown they can carry scoring loads that just aren't getting utilized to their, to their biggest potential, right? So how do you maximize these guys? How do you, you know, get better bench scoring? The next had the worst bench in all of basketball for, in terms of production scoring. And then how do you just make all the pieces fit? That's something that we didn't see from this team, making the pieces fit, putting together complete 48-minute games.

But I think the Knicks have what it takes in terms of their core. Just have to bolster that bench a little bit. So it's interesting. You made it sound like you have some question. Is Tibido the guy to navigate that whole, we got to play bench guys. You know, like Tyler Colick. I mean, I know casual fans are like, who the hell is that? That kid was a stud at Marquette.

you know, I'm a fan of his work. I don't understand why he was pinned to the bench. I like McBride. I thought he showed well. Like, shouldn't those guys have played more in the regular season so they were ready in the playoffs? That is one big criticism here of Tom Tibido is not having guys that you draft,

not having players like Paccombe Doughtier. You know, you sign pressure at Chua to a $6 million deal in the offseason as one of your main offseason additions or being able to just use him in terms of cab space, being able to retain him. And you don't play him that much, if at all, during the regular season and playoffs come around and he's pinned to the bench.

So that is a question here. Will Tibbs utilize the bench. Will Tibbs, you know, develop younger players towards the beginning of the season so that they're serviceable at the end, you know. And also Will Tibbs put together an offensive plan that isn't just ISO ball, have Jalen dribble the ball and make a play, right?

There were too many stretches where Kat isn't getting touches. There were too many stretches where Mikhail or OG are just not getting used to the best of their abilities. That being said, you know, this is back-to-back 50-win season. this is conference finals conference. This is two second round exits and then a conference finals appearance. You know, the data shows that since Tibido was taken over, the Knicks have gone up.

So you kind of can't just throw that out the window. But we've seen teams make coaching changes that were unpopular because they couldn't get over the hump. What do the Knicks do this offseason? We'll have to stay tuned. Yeah, you go back to the Warriors with Mark Jackson. You know, it felt like they hit a ceiling. They put in Steve Kerr. He makes the switch and they make the jump to light speed.

But I don't know. The way you just frame the Knicks, it's like. like they've had three good seasons. I don't know, is this a version of Damian Lillard and C.J. McCollum in Portland? Hey, we're going to win 45, 50, 52-ish games every year but we ain't winning the title.

I wouldn't go that far just yet. Remember, this is the first season of this new look group, right? And then you consider towns gets traded here in the middle of training camp. Brunson misses a month of time. Guys are in and out of the lineup, you know, mid-season trade, moving Jericho Sims out. You know, there's a lot of moving pieces here.

I think a full training camp, I think a full year under this team's bat and i really just think the sting of losing in the conference finals when you were that close to the NBA finals can help improve this team but at the same time there's just some glaring shortcomings with this roster in terms of how do you get jalen and car on the same page defensively that's a big thing when you look at the stats from these conference finals alone it's hard to find lineups with towns and brunton on the floor that were a net positive against this pacer team towns with a bunch of good defenders around him good lineup brunton with good defenders around them, good lineup. Towns in Brunson, negative lineups is not a good solution right now.

And some of that might have to include trading a guy. You know, it might be Josh Hart. It could be, you know, Mitchell Robinson. It could be Miles McBride. The Knicks are going to be open for business when you consider the salary cap situation they're in. They're not going to have many mechanisms to add players in free agency. So you're looking at potentially a lot of wheeling and dealing in a way to try to improve this roster. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific.

Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHard Radio app. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, news, news? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it.

We just contributed to a... We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it.

And, well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your

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Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves.

Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the. moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered.

SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsSlice on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slices Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis, and I know firsthand.

because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris, every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on Clay. Jenchen won. I mean, she went down in three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay.

Listen, Lina Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. All right, Christian, we could wrap up with a two-parter on the NBA Finals.

Listen, I'm a big hoops guy playing men's leagues and stuff. I'm not super geeked about this finals. A, are you going to watch it or are you going vacation now because you're done covering the Knicks? And then B, do the Pacers have any shot here to beat O'KC? I'm definitely going to watch it. Listen, I think that in terms of play styles, you've got two teams that are going to defend, that are going to play a lot of players,

and they're going to play with a lot of pace. And I do think the Pacers have a shot because we saw Pascal Seaccombe step up and play championship-level basketball against the Knicks. The Knicks had no answer for him, just in terms of leakouts, just in terms of one-on-one defense. They just couldn't stop him.

Now, OKC is a completely different animal. They're a buzz saw on both ends of the floor. I still think the Thunder win this series. But I think you've got two polarizing fun players in Shea Gilgis Alexander and Tyrese Halliburton. You've got two two deep rotations. You've got two really high caliber coaches and Rick Carlis and Mark Dagnold as well. So I think it'll be a fun series. Obviously, these are small markets, OKC and Indiana.

If I had to go to OKC, I don't know what I would have done for five days of my time. But at the end of the day, you're getting two high-quality teams, Two teams they're going to play fun, up-tempo basketball. I think it would be fun to watch. But I've got OKC in five or six. I think the Pacers can get one. It's just going to be tough when OKC is going to just keep coming at you. And they've got the size advantage.

Hartinstein is going to be a big difference in the series because the Pacers had no answer for Mitchell Robinson. You mentioned OKC. I've never been there, but I guess you went on the next road trip there. What is there to do in Oklahoma City? I saw there the 47th largest TV market or something like that? Oh, no, you're asking the wrong person. I've never been.

I didn't go for the real game. I was dreading if the Knicks actually made the finals. I was like, where am I? Am I going to stay at the haunted hotel? Like, what are we going to do? Yeah, I was actually looking into it. I was thinking, but then the issue becomes if I go stay at the haunted hotel, then we might not have a Knicks beat right anymore.

So I don't know. Next time, next season, maybe I'll go try to find some food. I'll have a food recommendation for you. That's the highlight of OKC, a haunted hotel. Okay, all right. Sounds like an awesome city cultural crossroads. Christian, great stuff. Thanks a lot.

And enjoy the off season, buddy. Thanks for having me. Any time. All right. Haunted hotels in OKC. Alex. That's a thing, because I was on the road with the Angels and the Kings for 10 years, and there's a lot of cities that have very well-known haunted hotels, that team stay in.

Wait, hold on. Do you believe in ghosts? Yeah, oh, I've seen them. I'm one of those. Oh, boy. Come at me. Let's go to Alex Curry with the news. Turn on the news.

This is the herd line news. Wait, wait. Now you're going to get them. Just confirming you admitted on national TV you believe in ghosts. Yeah, spirits, like energies. So are they moving stuff like? No. Or are you just appearing?

No, it's. Yeah, that's what I thought. Come on. Ghosts. Yeah. Like, you've never been in a situation where you've had, dude, that's why there's these haunted places. There's places where, like, you can feel an energy,

and you can feel that there's an outside energy, and things happen, and things move, or lights change, or I've seen. like a little figure like yeah my parents house growing up was haunted so excuse me one more time yeah my parents house that i grew up in was haunted so that's why like it's yeah so like you saw some things you talk about like an air i've been in like a spring break in akapulco and there's energy in the club and it's different different i don't know what you're talking about it's different yes yeah good all right so the staff tells me there's something called the scurvin hotel in oklahoma city voted most haunted hotel in the country.

Oh, no, it's crazy. There's also one when you play the Tampa Bay Rays, but you don't stay in Tampa Bay. You stay in, I forget where you say, but it's this pink hotel, and it's very well known. All the players, it was my first time on the road trip.

They tried to put me on the haunted floor and in the haunted room, and I was like in tears. Yeah, I was in tears at the front desk. Like, you can't do this to me. Like, please don't do this to me. Like, I won't sleep. I won't sleep.

I won't sleep. I won't sleep. I won't sleep. I won't work. I know we got to get to do. But I just have to ask, what are the ghosts? What are they doing? Moving stuff in the room and scaring you?

No, it's more of like you just feel it and you see it. It's an energy. All right. So now the staff is lifting up the haunted hotels and like testing me. It's a thing. It's a thing, Jay Mack. Get into it. Okay.

Let's get started in the NBA. The price for Kevin Durant is going down. Sons have pitched Durant to the rocket several times, according to a report from the athletic. And that report says, that over the course of several calls, the sons have gradually lowered their asking price. Now, you have to remember, like,

prices are pretty skewed right now with the last two big trades. You had Malik Bridges last season go for four first-round picks and a first-round pick swap. But then you had Luca this season go for basically AD and Max Christie. So you're kind of...

I thought they were going to be in a holding pattern to see what Janus, where he went, and what his asking price, was going to be, but it kind of sounds like the suns are trying to off locate you before that. So they're not set kind of in whatever Yonah sets the market price at. Yeah. So, for instance, you know, all these tariffs that are coming for the country, I think they're goofy and a terrible idea.

But nevertheless, I talk to some people who are like, yeah, man, I got the new iPhone. I went and got a new car. Yeah. I got to get the scrap out of the way before this stuff hits and the prices are jacked up. It's insane. It almost feels like the sun's. are saying, holy cow, we better get off KD quick. Let's just not pennies on the dollar, but let's move fast.

Yeah, because it's kind of been all over the place, the last two big trades we've seen. But because they're both most likely going to be moved this off season, they're going to have similar asking prices. And if Yannis goes first and he gets a... Well, he's younger. I think he's going to fetch more, but like, huh, that's interesting. Yeah.

You know, probably on the new market for a new iPhone, I'm waking up and my batteries being at like 60% and I charge it. Maybe it's a ghost, Alex, that's draining my battery overnight. I'm just waiting for you to now get haunted. It's going to be a beautiful thing. You're going to wake up, you're going to cry. I'm going to get a phone call. You were right, Curry.

I haven't cried in a while, but maybe it's coming. All right, let's go to New York. And your Knicks are stuck between a rock and a hard place right now. New York traded four first round picks and a pick swap for Bill Bridges. And now he's up for a massive four years. year $156 million extension. Now, Bridges struggled in the playoffs, shooting 33% from three in the playoffs. So the question is, do you pay him or not?

You gave up a lot to get him. It wasn't bad. He was a plus defender. It needs to be a better offensive player. But as you said, you've kind of stuck to this this week. And since the Knicks lost, is he one of the pieces you move? Or do you pay him? Because you said you don't think you need to do any big changes.

I like them a lot. I like Bridges a lot. The problem is, I'm doing some math quickly in my head. That's like $26 million a year for your fourth best player, OG, Towns, and Brunson. I don't think that's a sustainable model. Could you offload a sign and trade with Bridges to a team where he's going to be their third best player, and you get, say, two guys in return, so you've got a deeper bench, which is what they need? $156 million over four years.

Yeah, so that's like... It's more. Oh, did I not do the math good? I swear I was good at math back in the day. That's okay. So what is the number? Do the math. Look at 1.56 to bottom of four.

Well, you said, what, 25 is going to be 100. Oh, yeah. That was bad math by me. That's okay. Holy hell. Yeah, 39 a year. Yeah, that's a lot. That's embarrassing.

Can we delete that? Oh, no, we're live. Damn. That's my bad. Anyways, that's way too much money for your full option. Also, if someone's shooting 33% from 3% from 3 in the biggest game. No, no, I like, again, I like Bridges,

but I don't think you can pay your fourth. I mean, Boston Rees is the third best guy making like $15 million a year. That's a great deal. Yeah. Your fourth best guy at $30-something million a year? Will he be on the next year? Ooh.

I was thinking hard in the bench. Yeah. You can't give up five first round picks and bail. So I would guess, yes, yes. Or you could, like, you know, just admit your losses. Like, okay, maybe. You're at the poker table, you're down bad. Here's my car, here's my watch.

I'm putting it. What are you going to do? My phone will not stop buzzing because I can't do math. I can already, I sense the text. Maybe it's a ghost texting me. Oh, Jemak. All right. Let's stay in New York.

Your Jets have had a revolving door at offensive coordinator in the last 20 years. And you're breaking in a new one. With Tanner, Eggstrand, new quarterback, Justin Fields, though, is very high on the new coach. Just talking to him, You can just tell he's really smart. He knows what he's doing.

So, you know, I think he's very detailed with, you know, installing the plays and stuff like that, especially in the limited time that we have now. So like I said, he's putting a lot on, you know, the guys played our plate, but I think in the long run, it'll help us. 10 different offensive coordinators in the last 20 years. The last time they made a play, the playoffs were in 2010. So what are your expectations for the judges?

offense this year. The new offense of Cornyner. They're 10-1 in 20 years. They haven't had one. Look at that list. Look at that list on the screen. I know. It's crazy. Have any of those guys going on to anything? And no, that's not LaFleur the Placters coach.

That's his brother. That's his brother. I mean, Brian Chautenheimer's currently the Cowboys coach. But after that, Tony's Perano, Marty Morningwig, Chan Galey. I mean, this is John Morton, Jeremy Bates. Anyways. Jets have a new quarterback, O.C. Coach. Yes.

How's that for continuity? What you think it's going to be good? I mean, look what the commanders did. They had all that last year. They did. They had Jaden Daniels. We have Justin Fields on his one, two, 13th. Yeah.

Yeah, I'm not, I'm not feeling great, Alex. Damn it. Yeah. Jets, thanks for wedging in negative Jets news at the end of the show to really make me feel. Just for you. What's he wearing? Does Fields have a GoPro on the front of his camera there? Maybe.

Oh, that looks cool. Yeah. Yeah, anyways. All right, Alex with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lye News. All right, coming up next, we just got a hold of some awesome video of Travis Hunter today defensively at Jags practice,

and we'll have a former NFL defensive back in studio to help us break it all down. That's next. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, it's Steve Kavino. And I'm Rich David. And together we're Kavino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio. You can catch us weekdays from 5 to 7 p.m. Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and, of course, the IHeart Radio app.

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Hey, it's us to Jonas Brothers. And guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, huge news? We created a... own podcast called Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it.

We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band.

Before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast.

But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, Not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in.

I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsClyce brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsClyce on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slicelife 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis. And I know firsthand because I competed there, myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris, every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on Clay. Jenchian win. I mean, she went down in three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay.

Listen, Lina Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface, because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs Tennis Podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Back here on the herd, we have a great guest in a moment, but holy cow, huge NBA news. A couple days after the Knicks had their best season this century, they just fired their head coach, Tom Thibito. He has been relieved of his duties, according to a report.

Team President Leon Rose is sitting on this grenade, clearly, for owner James Dolan, who got intoxicated. This is my guess, obviously, intoxicated by their best season in decades. Celebrity Roe filled up, great TV ratings. Nicks are a huge story around the league. They're back, baby. Let's fire the coach. I mean, that's just the height of insanity. Listen, I know I was, this was like a month ago when things were sputtering before the Celtics.

I was like, hey, listen, maybe we got to go get Michael Malone. Tibbs isn't working. And then Tibbs found his groove, how Tom got his groove back, you know, takes down Detroit, takes down the defending champion Celtics. And then I know they lost to the Pacers and they were favored, but still, really? Firing Tibido? So I'm going to be honest, guys, this puts a lot of stuff in jeopardy. because Tibido was just offended by Jalen Brunson in the exit interview. He's like, is that a real question, firing Tibado?

So that's Brunson's guy. What is this future hole for Carl Anthony Towns? Mikhail Bridges, we just talked with Alex. Is he going to get an extension? Oh my gosh. Let's play the Brunson sound real quick when asked about Tibado's future with the Knicks. I feel like nobody takes more criticism than Tom, and this team obviously has turned around during his tenure.

Do you kind of feel that going forward he's the same guy to lift you guys the rest of the way, the next level? Is that a real question right now? I mean, you just ask me if I believe that if he's the right guy. Yes. Thanks, guys. Come on. I mean, we have multiple guests on the show since then. One, like 30 minutes ago, Christian, from the New York Daily News.

It's like, you know what? They just had an amazing season. They keep accelerating around here. conference finals, and you fire the coach? I don't know, guys. Again, it just happened literally three minutes ago, so I'm a little shook and embarrassed that yesterday I said, hey, let's do nothing.

Kind of a whiff there by J-Mack, but holy hell, the New York Knicks fire their coach, and I guess Michael Bologne's going to be on deck. Maybe they go out of pocket. You know, I'm just going to put this out there. LeBron got, did a podcast with J.J. Reddick, and next thing you know, JJ Reddick is the head coach of the Lakers. So you know who LeBron's doing a podcast with now, right? Steve Nash.

And I know Nash sometimes lives in my area, but his family really likes it in New York because he was the Brooklyn Nets coach. And Steve Nash was run out by Kyrie Irving, who was an absolute jerk to him. Steve Nash, next coach of the Knicks? I don't know. We'll see. Oh, my gosh. that would take you out of the running for Kevin Durant. I don't know.

I mean, this is exciting. Hey, Cowherds on vacation. We'll do a lot of Knicks for the rest of the week. Tom Tibido out as the Knicks coach. All right, let's bring in our guest. He played in the NFL. His dad played in the NFL. His brother played in the NFL.

Brock Verene, studio and football analyst for Big Ted Network. Brock, you're an NBA fan, obviously. Any thoughts on Tibado getting fired? I'm shocked. And quite honestly, I'm shocked that Kat has gotten any of the blame. I expect him to get more of the blame. But at the same time, when your two best players can't be on the court at the same time, what do you expect to happen? Right? Something needed to change. I think the head coach would be the change. Absolutely not. But when you're two best guys making all that money, doing everything, the faces of your franchise, when you're at your best and one of them is on the bench, it's an issue. Now, why I'll always defend Kat is because, you're is if you get a different version of the guy that you signed, that's one thing. But this is the same cat we've seen his entire career. It's not his fault that he's played the same his entire career. So if you thought you were going to get more out of whom, that's one thing.

But for every complaint that has come against cat in the past couple of weeks, they were the same complaints in Minnesota. Kat's Kat. I don't like any of the blame going to. Yeah, this is, it's going to be a big story the rest of the week. But hey, you're here to talk NFL. Let me ask you, Brock. So you're a draft pick of the Bears.

I'm assuming you feel a connection to them. This Caleb Williams stuff, you know, up and down first year, they get Ben Johnson. Then the report comes out that, hey, Caleb Williams didn't want to go to Chicago. What do you make of all this? Well, first things first, everything that Caleb was afraid of and nervous of happened. He was right. Yeah. So whether you agree with him saying that information or his dad's saying that information, fair.

But he was right about everything. Now, Ben Johnson coming in. what does that change? He can learn to play on time. The biggest issue with Caleb Williams, even with the Heisman year and the year after was he was his, he was at his best off script. That's not good. And college is fine because an athletic quarterback in college can outrun a defensive end, can outrun a defensive tackle, can outrun most linebackers. You're not out running Andrew Van Ginkle. You're not outrunning Aiden Hutchinson. So what can Ben Johnson do? He can get him to play on time. The talent is there. There's no question of the talent.

between the ears. It's making sure that internal clock remains calm. It doesn't panic. It's saying, Caleb, I understand up to this point you've been at your best outside of the pocket. We need to rein that in and let me scheme things up for you. I will tell you where the ball needs to go. And then naturally, that athleticism can come out. But that's the biggest issue with Caleb right now. So we had Albert Breer on earlier and I asked him, hey, rank the quarterbacks in that tough division. NFC North, you got a guy, J.J. McCarthy has yet to play an NFL game. We haven't seen him throw a football pass and for real since January of

2004. But go ahead, rank the quarterbacks in that division. I don't know that there's a lock number one, but let's hear what you got. JJ, of course, has to be four. I'll put Caleb at three. Number one, I'm putting Jordan Love, which means Jared Gough is that too.

I'm a big Jordan Love guy. I'm a massive Jordan Love guy. I don't see last year as a step back. I just see it as he didn't take the leap, right? okay, you have one year of real starting experience. What happens next? The second year for any quarterback is always where that big jump comes. So it was delayed for Jordan Love because he sat for a little bit.

No, he didn't make that massive leap. I'm a massive Jordan Love guy. I would take his crop of wide receivers over anyone else's, even Minnesota, even with the changes that Chicago was made. I understand what's going on in Detroit. But the fact that Green Bay does not have a true number one, I feel is their benefit. And that's why Jordan Love is so great. He can trust anyone on third and five, where's the quarterback going to throw the football?

As a DB, that's the first thing you're thinking, who is favored here? No one's favorite. And that's going to benefit Jordan Love. Everyone is always open because no one is favored. Massive Jordan Love season incoming. Jordan Love over Jared Goff. That qualifies as the hot take. Well done.

Not by a wide margin, but a firm margin. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. Obviously, you were a defensive back, and this play just happened today at practice. Jacksonville Jaguars and their top pick, Travis Hunter, making a pretty phenomenal play. Let's get it on the screen. Travis Hunter, and we think he caught this. Oh, he caught that.

For sure. We don't know. Hey, listen, we don't know what a catch is in the NFL still. But amazing tip. And this is why we're talking about him as a two-way player. Athleticism, I mean, he is a phenomenal talent. Do you think he should be playing two ways? I mean, when you were drafted, you know there's a steep learning curve for a defensive back.

And he's only in half the meetings. The other time he's in the offensive meetings where they really want him to shine. And frankly, you get paid higher or larger contract. Sure. Second contract if you're a receiver. They're doing it perfectly. Offense is a steeper learning curve than defense. Why?

Because defense, there's only so many concepts, right? Travis knows what cover two is. Travis knows what cover three is. Travis knows what man is. As a wide receiver, you have to know what the other wide receivers are thinking. You have to make sure you guys are seeing the coverage the same way that your quarterback is. There are so many adjustments and calls that immediately affect what you're doing. So yes, they start him on offense.

And don't let it get past you that he was the best receiver in this draft. If he did not play cornerback, he would be the number one receiver taken. So you look at the quarterback position, he's more natural at it. He is a natural corner. He is a natural ballhawk. His skill set offensively leaks to the defensive side. His skill set defensively leaks to the offensive side. But because of that steeper learning curve offensively, they're handling it perfect.

As they start the season, he'll probably start on offense. They can get a little creative on offense, put him in the backfield, put him at the slot, put him at the wide out. And in order to do all of those things, he needs to start there immediately, whereas defensively coming on third down and then maybe week six, week seven, we'll see if we can put more on your shoulders. So my big question with the two-way for Travis Hunter is like, hey man go tackle derrick henry then you come off the field and now go run routes on a drive like

that is going to be nearly impossible isn't it but he's done in his whole life right if this was a situation where say dion wanted to get creative and his last season at colorado hey chavis why don't you play both ways that's one thing he's always done this so there's really no comparison i know we we compare it to champ a little bit we call him otani here and there but he's been doing this his entire life at a high level, at the highest of levels on both sides of the football. There really is no comparison for Travis. He's going to be fine. He's going to excel. Do you think this, if you were advising him, would you say, hey, man, you should play both ways? Or why don't you just get down the wide receiver first?

Then maybe in year two, you can add that on your plate. Or do you think, hey, go for it? If they didn't need help in the defensive backfield, that'd be one thing. But the team he's on needs help on both sides of the football. So you bring up the money sample. Yes, wide receivers at the time. up and get paid a lot more than dbs. Well, I'm thinking if he can even contribute minimally on defense, which I don't think will be the case. I think he'll be a starter on both by the

end of the year. But imagine what that contract negotiations is going to look like. Hey, what's the number one cornerback getting paid? What's the number one wide receiver going to get paid? Let's combine those numbers and see what it does in my bank account. That would be amazing. All right, we got about 30 seconds left. I got to ask you, your brother, Shane, played for Belichick.

You know, again, we only got 30 seconds, but what do you make of this whole Belichick, North Carolina? Now, I didn't ask about her. I didn't ask about the 20 years. Yeah, I would love to see Bill Belichick coach college 10 years ago when it was a marathon, when you could bring in a one-star, two-star developed him. That's where Belichick shined, right?

Finding a late-round Tom Brady making him one of the best, helping him make one of the best, finding a Julian Edelman, a seventh-round quarterback, letting him play offense, defense, and then develop him. College football's a sprint now. I don't know how it'll go, but he's at the perfect place, North Carolina says, just have a way. winning record, beat the rivals, and we're happy, and he can do that. Great stuff. Brock Berean, we are back tomorrow.

Probably going to talk a little Knicks. I don't know, maybe. Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts.

We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know, tired and sick. tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes.

Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headlines. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes,

themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to SportsSlice on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slicelife-Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Winning on Clay is an art. The rallies are relentless. And at the French Open, only the toughest survive. I'd know. I competed there for decades. Join me, Renee Stubbs, on the Renee Stubbs' tennis podcast for no-nonsense breakdowns of the biggest matches, the toughest players, and the moments said to find Roland Garris. Gentian win. She's an outsider to win the French fame.

And she likes Clay. Listen, Lena Rubakina is arguably the best player in the world right now. And I actually can win on any surface. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app. Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.