The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hour 3 - Roasting Tom Brady

Episode Date: May 9, 2024

3-time Super Bowl champion Julian Edelman joins the show to talk about his experience preparing for and performing at the Tom Brady RoastSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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iHeart Radio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Julian Edelman now is joining us live. So I didn't know this before, but I just discovered this in the preamble before we went on the air. So you did the roast. Yeah. And that's a big crowd. It wasn't tiny.

Tell the audience how big it was. It was 15,000 at the forum. Okay. So down the road, the forum, that's where the, you know, that was Showtime Lakers. So you did something to prepare, which takes a lot of courage, and this is so Julian Edelman, this in such a patriot way. Tell the audience what you did to prepare. Well, I found out I was doing the show probably two and a half weeks before the show,

and, you know, all the athletes were pretty nervous, just because you're going to get on stage, you're going to talk with in front of a whole lot of people, and you're also talking with, professionals or going against professionals. These guys do this for a living, the comics. So I was getting super nervous. Jeff Ross was, we were doing our like our brainstorm meetings where his team was there. My team was together. We get on a Zoom link and we go over jokes. We go, we went over what we wanted to hit. They had some things for us. And, you know, it was getting overwhelming. So Jeff could kind of feel that for me. And he goes, hey, I'm going to do the comedy store next Thursday.

Why don't you come on and I'll have you on the back part of my set. And I said, awesome, let's do it. The fact that you said awesome to do it. I treated it like a game. I needed walk-through reps. I needed a pre-season game. And then I wanted to go hit the game. You know what I mean?

So the walk-through reps was with my team where I would perform in front of them and I would do our jokes in front of them. Like, we were in full roast mode for two weeks. everyone, we all hated each other by the end of it because everyone's making a joke about each other just to kind of get the jokes going. And it was very nerve-wracking going to the comedy store on a Thursday because I did about 12 minutes there. Whoa. And that's a lot of material. It was because you wanted to go fat so you could see reactions. And it was good to get that rep because you know, some part of your jokes, when you're setting a joke up, people start laughing or start or start talking about it or you get paused up.

So it was good to feel that. So then you could deliver the end of the joke. So, you know, I go there and it was nerve-wracking because it's very intimate at the comedy store. I mean, there's like five, 400 people, 300 people. We were in one of the bigger rooms and everyone's right up on you. Thankfully, we had a group of like 25-year-old frat bros that knew everything about sports. so my material was flying. I was good. I was good. But it was a good rep to have. And after that, going into the roast,

you know, I felt a lot more confident for the show. Just because I could feel the beats of when I was going up there. Like one of the jokes, you're performing something. And I said, you barrels chested SOB for Bill. And people started laughing, but that was the first part of my joke. So then I knew going into the roast that people were probably going to laugh at that. I got to take a beat, then I get back to my joke, and then deliver. So it was a fun experience. Nerve-wracking. Let me tell you something. When you did 12 minutes, did you have a paper next to you?

I had cards. Okay, yeah, you did. I had all my cards on jokes. And by the end, I mean, I knew my jokes, but I was shaking at the comedy store. Of course you were. You know, I'm not a comic by any means. I think comics probably from time to time get nervous on it. on sets. Yeah. And when I got to the roast, the day before, you know, it was kind of like

getting to a game early. You get to see where the shot, you know, the play clock is. You get to see the field. You know, you saw where everyone was sitting so you could dictate your jotes to the certain people. I saw Mr. Kraft. I saw Alex Guerrero, so I could see where they were going to be in the crowd, so I could go to them. And it was, I treated it like a football game. So when you were in, you know, the cocktail roared. or the green room, they call it in our industry. Before you go out, we have it here. We call it the avocado room.

It's California, of course. In the green room, when you guys are all there before you go out, intense? Now, you have a lot of legends. Yeah. In one room. And all the athletes were with the athletes. You know, and so you could see guys were nervous, but they didn't want to show their nervousness.

So guys would, you know, go to the bathroom, kind of run their lines. by themselves. No one wanted to do it because you didn't want to have your material in front of the other people. But it was definitely, guys were definitely nervous. But it was honestly very fun to catch up with a lot of guys. I mean, our green room, we had Randy, Gronk, Bill, me, Bledsoe. And we were just, like, it was so fun to hear the old war stories. Bill opened up. He was telling him we were talking about rookie skits and stuff because we were in skit mode with the whole roast. And it was a, fun. It was a fun experience.

How much of it did Tom know was coming? Or did he go there and just sit and listen? I mean, he had material too, but I mean, I kept reiterating to the writers and so I'm like, is everything on limits here? Like, are we good? Like, we could talk this, we could talk that. They go, he said everything's good.

Oh, boy. And I was still a little nervous going in with my set with certain things just because family stuff, maybe you're saying. Family stuff. But then Once the first five minutes of the roast happened and Kevin Hart dropped his opening lines, I was like, oh, we're good. We're good. He cleared the air. He cleared the air, which that's a good teammate.

He did that to probably make us feel comfortable with what we were going to say. And you could really see the professionals, the Kevin hearts, the Jeff Rosses, the Nikki Glazers, all of them. All the comics, you could see why they were professionals because of, with Kevin, like, you, you, you, you, I was watching teleprompter the whole time. I wanted to see how people were going to deliver off teleprompters because there are teleprompters everywhere and you could see him. And with Kevin, he could pull something from what someone just said and it would be a completely different term or whatever than what the teleprompter said,

but he would be able to get back into the prompter to keep the show going. That's when you see professionals at work, along with Jeff, along with Nikki. I mean, all these comics, that's sort of. why they're pros. They know how to entertain. They knew how to pull things, bring things, and listen, and then deliver. I thought Albert Breer said this, that the roast was a Patriots therapy session to get stuff out that you probably kind of wanted to get out, but in a funny way, so it wasn't as hurtful. Yeah. Fully. I mean, I looked right at Bill when I said my joke to him. And he loved it. That's the thing he laughed hardest at.

You know what? I didn't get a lot of TV time on that dynasty, so he probably laughed at my joke. He still liked you. No, but your joke was bad, and I was talking to somebody who said, Bill used to say that all the time. All the time.

Basically, I can find a guy at Foxborough High that can do this. Yeah. Well, Foxborough High is the only job opportunity you had, coach. And I love saying it, no, but it was all out of love. And he was, I thought he was a great sport. I thought Bill, you know what? I thought Bill won the night. He did a really good job.

Because Bill came in, fair or not, Bill came in viewed by the league as a little combative. Hey, I'm going to do things my way. And I watched that. And I thought, if I was an owner or a GM, I'm like, okay, that's the bill I've heard about. The happy bill, the fun bill, he's a serious man. Yeah.

But I thought afterward, I'm like, okay, and he's been good on McAfee. And I'm like, okay, this is the bill that I think is totally hireable. He got, you know, listen, I understand coaches. But Bill's rep for about two years at the end there was a clunky. Yeah, time was ending over there. And, you know, anytime you're in any area or with anyone or any opportunity, any job for a long time, things get stale.

Yeah. I thought it was a great night for him. I thought it meant probably a lot for Brady to see him there. Yeah. You know, the tension with the shot with him and Mr. Kraft was palpable. Great TV. But it's not that one, here's the thing, Julian. In my opinion, that one's never going to be close.

But I do think Tom and Bill, and this was a real icebreaker, I think they really do know how much they meant for each other. They love each other. And I've always said that. It just sometimes it takes time after a long time being together. to realize that. And, you know, I could specifically remember when TB went to Tampa Bay and he would say things like, you know, everything that's normal that we're used to doing is not normal.

So all the stuff he used to complain about, he wanted. Isn't that interesting? You know what I mean? And, you know, they definitely love each other. I feel, I mean, they could be, I could be completely wrong, but, you know, we needed both of us. Yeah, I think what Bill provided for Tom was he never had to win mostly by shootouts, which even if you're Mahomes is hard. And I think what Tom provided was a fairly eagulless quarterback.

There's not a lot of superstar athletes in America that don't bring some crap to the table. And Tom really didn't. And so in the end, what they provided to each other was very rare. Tom for 15 years, 18 years, never had to. a bad old line or a crappy defense. That just doesn't happen in pro football. You lose a free agent. You lose a pass rusher.

And I think they both gave, I think both now look back at it and think, and it's funny that you say the Tampa thing, it's just like a relationship. You leave it. The grass is greener and you're like, yeah, that ain't great. I kind of miss that. Yeah. You know, it's. You didn't have that because you were a patriot.

I never had that. But you've talked to guys. I've talked to guys. And when guys leave, you know, they, they realized why it was a tough environment and why we won when they left. You know, and it's hard to say that with Brady leaving and going to win in the Super Bowl.

But, you know, I always explain it like this. Tom always had a chip, and we all knew Tom played better when he was pissed off. You said that, yeah. And what did Bill like to do? Piss off Tom. And what did Tom do? Get pissed off and play great football.

Yeah. Like, I don't know if it's super Jedi mind tricks that Bill played, because sometimes it was a lot. But I think that's what he thought he had to do to motivate Tom to get the best out of him. You know, the other thing is you're obviously still close with guys, and now you're the father and your life's changed, and there's different things of importance. But I don't know why I always think about this.

whenever a football team is good, I always think winning on the road is cooler. Because to get on a plane and fly home for four hours, after a win on the road against a good team, I'm like, that is guy time that is even better. Locker room, you go in, media's there, you shower. That's the part of your life that where I look as a sportscaster, not the money.

It's like to be on those planes, With Brady and Gronk and Road wins, are those special to you? My favorite win of my career that wasn't a Super Bowl was the 18 AFC Championship when we went to Kansas City. Like, we had the stigma that we couldn't win on the road. We've been hearing it for years. We lost to Denver twice in the AFC Championship in Denver. To go there, play in a hostile environment against a young, sexy new generation team.

We were kind of that old team that was, you know, the old generation holding on and to go out there and compete and everyone perform and be a part of the contribution to going out there when there's nothing like going home on that plane with the guys. Like you said, when you're at home, you got 20 minutes

and guys are out of there. You got to go to your family. You got the media there. When you have a three-hour flight, you're in there, guys are bumping music, guys are having fun. There could be some cocktails on there that aren't supposed to be on there. But it's literally, that's the most, that's the number one thing you miss when you leave the game,

is that camaraderie of that away trip flight back home. So I was right. You were right. That's what I think about. Mark Sanchez, when they beat the Chargers, it was a foggy day in San Diego. Remember that Sanchez went west, foggy and a good charger team

and I'm like man you got five and a half hours flying back he's like you have no idea that is just great living you cannot duplicate that you can't you can't Julian Edelman by the way he has a podcast games with names it's really good they have a new episode every Tuesday

one of my favorite people is on this week Drew Bledsoe I love Drew and I always think Drew's had an interesting life he was replaced by the greatest player ever and it minimizes how great Drew was. Who had, by the way, I thought maybe the funniest joke in the whole thing, Tom, there's two things I have. I was a number one pick and I'm celebrating my 28th wedding anniversary.

I thought that was a great line. But Drew kind of gets beat up not on purpose but because of Tom's greatness. And I love that you guys all rally around him. I think he's a special guy. Well, Drew is a pivotal part of one of those pillars that help build this whole thing early on in the Patriot Dynasty. he's always been a great sport about it and that's got to be a very tough situation because he's a baller if I mean

we threw the ball on Sunday night when we did that podcast that guy can still sling it like you could see why he was in he looks the part of a number one number one draft pick he picks up in Tom used to say it all the time he could pick up any ball fresh out the box and he could just sling it big hands.

Just, I mean, he's a great sport. He was a humble guy about that whole situation. If you've watched and heard the stories of how he handled a young 25-year-old or 23-year-old kid coming in and taking his job after getting a huge contract. Like, he was still a team guy. And that's the Patriot way. You know, not doing what's best for you, but doing what's best for the team. that was on the wall when we walked in every day. Mental toughness, doing what's best for the team when it may not be the best for you.

And Drew's, he's in there. Yeah. Great seeing you, man. Great to see you, too. It is Drew Bledsoe out now, games with names, really a smartly constructed and delivered podcast. I love having you on. Whenever I see your name on the list, I'm in a good mood, buddy. Thank you.

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Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

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J-Mack with the news. No, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Some breaking news, Colin, even the last 15 minutes. The league has announced a suspension for Patrick Beverly. He got a whopping four games. That's it.

That's it? Is Adam Silver aware that Patrick Beverly threw a basketball at... Twice. Unbelievable. He was also reprimanded for his inappropriate interaction with a reporter when he said he would not answer a question because the lady didn't follow his podcast. I don't know.

This changes things. I thought Beverly's going to get at least minimum 10, 20 games. I mean, throwing a basketball at a fan twice. I cannot believe that. I mean, Jamal Murray threw stuff on the floor and got a $100,000 fine, and he makes $33 million a year. This is, I mean, Silver's always been very pro player. Yeah.

That leads me to believe, well, didn't they say those fans said Cancun on free? That's not the worst thing in the world. I've probably said worst thing this morning. I mean, that'd be one thing if they incited them, and there was some racial comment. Like, Cancun on 3 is like a bad cliche. Charles Berkeley says that every night on television, doesn't he? In reference to these guys? Yeah, he does, yeah.

That's light, I think. Anyways. All right, next up is the Cavs. They dropped game one to the Celtics by 25. Easy cover. I don't know the line. I don't know if you've seen it tonight, Colin. Celtics are minus 13 and a half.

Anyways, Donovan Mitchell had 33 in game one. He says there is a chance for a bounce back to brush off their poor performance and potentially steal one in Boston. I think the biggest thing is just mentally understanding what's coming with it. It's, you know, understanding that we've played these guys before and it took them. I mean, it's completely different, to be honest. You know, you're protecting the pain, protecting the pain for seven games, hammering home. And now you've got to get out to guys.

And it's not just like it's two guys. It's really one through 15. You know what I mean? So understanding that. But you got to go through a game like this. You got to get that to understand it. And, you know, like I said, we had a snug fest in game one. I'm not using that as an excuse. They came out here and did what they were supposed to do.

Now we've got a fine way to steal game two. Massive underdogs tonight. Listen, this is a spot Miami stole one. Remember in game two, they hit like 25 threes or whatever, and they were able to steal the victory. Well, when there's a line that's this lob-sided, generally I trust Vegas. You know how sometimes you'll see in the NFL?

Like, I won't see it often, but it may happen every third or fourth week. I'll see a line and I don't get it. And through the years, I've doubted it and got burned. Now, I do think, and it doesn't happen very often at all, but I do think every week Vegas has a line that is there for the taking. You and I talk about this. Sometimes you get a couple of them. You don't generally get them after Monday.

The line moves and you're done. So if you're a real gambler, you know, Sunday night or Monday morning, there's usually a line that clearly is in favor of the better. But then about five times a year there's a line, maybe not even five, that you just don't even understand the line. And this is a line that feels way lopsided to me.

So my take is they're saying Tatum's going to have a bigger game, Tatum's going to be more forceful, and they're going to blow them out. Yeah. Well, I don't know if you've seen Pacers' Knicks game three. Have you seen the line for that? Hit Indy? What is it?

Let me guess. Eight. Indy favor by eight. Now, we don't know about what's the OGN and OB. Well, I could see the Knicks, honestly, resting. No, I could. I could see the Knicks resting one of those guys. And just saying, listen, we're ending game sevens at our place.

We have the momentum. I could see Indy winning that game. Yeah. I don't see Cleveland stealing this one. I will just say Donovan Mitchell is, like, I know we all love Anthony Edwards. I get it. Donovan Mitchell's won multiple playoff series by himself. Remember he took down Paul George and Russell Westbrook?

Yeah. Like this guy is a budding star. I think the bidding war, if he says no to Cleveland, is fascinating. I don't know that he fits in Philly with Maxie. Would he work with Maxie? No, no, because he'll take shots away. Maxie's really a shooting guard despite his size. They need a, they don't need another ball-centric guy.

So what do they need, Kevin Durant? No, they need just a, like a Mike Conley, a grown-up, who can score 12 but doesn't need shots. M-B and Maxie are going to take your shots. Then you need defenders. You've got to get a point guard that can defend and distribute and then defenders and length on the wings, but you got your two stars.

I have, for headlines tomorrow, we're doing Sixers Free Agency, and I have one that'll probably blow your mind. Nobody has it on their radar yet. I'm very excited for that. Yes, yes. Final story is the Phoenix Suns, Colin. So they had high expectations this year.

Remember, they ended the regular season hot. A lot of people, including the, Bozo speaking currently picked them to take down the Timberwolves did not happen. Listen, the future is supposed to be bleak all of a sudden, but Brian Winhorst of ESPN says the sons will not break up their big three. Instead, they will tweak the roster around them. Okay, we like to follow breadcrumbs. What do you, what do you make of this report from Ryan? Brian Winhorth, very credible.

I've had him on my podcast. Give the audience the report one more time. Basically, they're going to tweak everything around the report. big three. But not breaking up the Beal Durant-Durant-Rour-Treato. Not breaking it up. Well, Grayson Allen was effective until he got hurt. He did get hurt in that series.

First of all, do you believe it? Well, the way Minnesota is trashing Denver, maybe Minnesota it's just their year. Fair. Or if you were looking to move Kevin Durant, the move is, we're not trading anybody. We are not doing anything. We are standing pat. And then quietly, you go

behind the scenes. You don't want, like, a feeding frenzy out there. Then, Durant's price goes down. I still think that they're going to have to do something. Well, they have a lot of duplication, and they don't have a point guard like Philadelphia, and we are seeing, like the Clippers before Hardin, no matter how good your wings and bigs are, if you don't have the quarterback to get you into your offense, that's why the Knicks can win without great talent,

because they have a great quarterback, and why the Sixers with better talent can't because they have no quarterback. So you've got to have somebody that can run the offense, then you put your scoring on the wings and at the bigs. Your point guard doesn't have to be a great score. Steph Curry and Isaiah Thomas were offensive-minded point guards that won titles. But generally, you know, the hard and where I'm going to take the most shots and have the ball historically doesn't win titles.

I'll also add they need toughness, Colin, and rim protection. Like, Nirk gets, you know, like they need toughness inside. They couldn't stop anybody. Anthony Edwards driving at the hoop head. So what are you suggesting when you say that? So you're saying they need an aggress, like a Julius Randall? Yeah, that would be a solid fit for the. He's tough.

Not really a rim protector, but I don't know. That's the problem. These guys, there's not a lot of guys like that who are just going to be on the market. You know, like... I even think the Knicks, they're going to make a move, but it's got to be the right move. I mean, if you wanted to retain, let's say you're willing to move off deep in Genzo, although he is a good three-ball share. His value...

His contract is like $11 million a year. But, I mean, if you didn't want to move Brunson, which they won't, or OG, so you don't want to move those two, you'll move Randall. Do you need to get another great score? I could argue you don't. What you need is another scorer. So, like, you don't want to break the band up. You don't want to give up way four for one, but you have to make the, you have to make the salaries match. So Randall's the guy that's the, he's going to be gone.

Because he has a big enough salary so I can go get a Paul George. Coming off an injury, I don't know what his value. Well, I mean, you all this... With Mitchell Robinson. How many stars in this league aren't hurt? Ambide is. Janice is. Dame was.

Paul George is nuts hurt. But he's had injuries. Kauai is. LeBron is. A.D. had a great year. But a lot of the older stars are missing games. Okay, let me give you a name. That sounds like the Pelicans are kind of done with him.

He's a three, but Brandon Ingram. It sounds like he's going to be rightly available. For the next? I don't know. Does he fit? Sixers? Nicks. Lakers.

I'll be honest with you. He can give me 22 and a half. half a night. I don't, I think he's an easy hang. He's not a disruptive personality. That's not a, that's not bad. That's it. By the way, he is a poor man's KD. A little bit. Homeless man's KD. I mean, I'm not being, listen, he, he just, he's like an empty calorie score. He could go out and get you 28 and you lose and you're like, oh, Ingram had a nice game. He's not like a, I don't know if he fits their kind of tough culture. I don't know. He's an interesting name that's funny. When you talk about that, a lot of

people didn't think AD was a tough guy. He was gifted, but he was always hurt, wouldn't play through pain. And then in the last year and a half, it shifted. AD plays hurt all the time, plays all the time, and shows all sorts of toughness. So when guys come into this league, unlike the NFL, when they come in their 23 years old, all of these guys come in at 19, and they develop toughness. When you're 19, you're not fully refined and developed. But the time you're 25 or 6, you have a better sense of what you are. So some guys you can label as kind of a, like, A.D.'s reputation, and I'm telling you this from executives in the league when he was in New Orleans,

a lot of top execs were like he's soft. Well, I don't think AD's soft at all anymore. Hell no, not when you're playing next to LeBron. But you only went to college for one year at Kentucky, so it took him time to develop his true basketball personnel. And by the way, he was like a guard growing up, and then he had like that seven-inch growth spur. So he wasn't, when he was young, he wasn't guarding bigs?

No, he was a ball-handling guard. That's why he likes his two-three. He's on the perimeter. Yeah, so anyways, a lot of fun stuff. NBA offseason is going to be pop-out on this show, that's for sure. J-MAC with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by.

The Herd Lye News. Save big on your water and energy bills with a new Navian tankless water heater. Go tankless, spa-like comfort. Go to tankless made simple.com. It's Navian. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, I'm Doug Gottlieb. The podcast is called All Ball.

We usually talk all basketball all the time, but it's more about the stories about what made these people love their sport and all the interesting interactions along the way. We talk to coaches. We talk to players. We tell you stories. You download it. You listen to it. I think you like it. Listen to All Ball with Doug Gottlieb on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth.

Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits,

the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast,

it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more behind the scenes, Follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J.

And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 was big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so you all know. I mean, at this point, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack.

So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Keer Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we, are in possession of the thing, and we're still chasing it, and we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses.

Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth, or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure and purpose on my new podcast,

learn the hard way. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the hard way and listen now. Tonight on FS1, Bobby Witt, Jr. Leads the Royals as they take on the Angels. Catch all the action tonight at 9.30 Eastern on FS1. We're going to play Brunson or Brunce out. You give me a player with Jalen Brunson,

and I'll tell you, would I rather have Brunson or that star player for next season? Oh, boy. We ready to go? This is going to be challenging. Brunson or Bruns out? Jalen Brunson or Anthony Edwards? That's one of the easier ones.

Anthony Edwards is becoming really an elite defender and an elite offensive player. Brunson's more about polished fundamentals and just a more dynamic athlete, 22 years old, best 10 years are ahead of him. That's an easy one. Okay. Jalen Brunson or Donovan. Mitchell. I would take Brunson because I think he's a better leader and he's a better facilitator of others around him. And I get a more consistent game. Donovan can be a bit hot and cold

shooting the ball. So I'll take Brunson. Okay. I'm on record. I don't like this one. Jalen Brunson or Jason Tatum? I would take Tatum. Better two-way player, bigger. You know, the NBA is getting bigger, not smaller. And Tatum's a big, long athlete. He can score at the rim. Perimeter, transition, post, I would take Tater. Okay. Jalen Brunson or Shea Gilgius Alexander. So this is the hardest one for me. I take Brunson.

Brunson's playoff numbers are going up. SGAs are going down. And again, the facilitate, now SGA can score and assist. The numbers have come down. He is a high ball usage rate guy. I worry about that. Luca. This one's a go either way.

I think SGA is a more dominant score over time, but Brunson's changing my opinion on his scoring ability. He's dropping 40. So I think it's by an inch Brunson. Yeah, I like it. Jalen Brunton or Anthony Davis. Well, Anthony Davis, I thought, was the best defensive player in the league this year. He didn't get in the final three, which was ridiculous. Anthony's can be a little hot and cold offensively.

But Anthony Davis right now is a top 7-8 player in the league. He had a remarkable year. Great year. And again, the league's getting bigger, not smaller. You got to have bigs. All right. Let's go Jalen Brunson or Devin Booker. So this is an easy one for me.

This is Brunson. Booker before Chris Paul, Phoenix was terrible. Booker's a score. Is he a great leader? The number a one-and-done get-sweet, get-swept team this year. I think Brunson's the soul of the Knicks. I think Booker's a really good player for the Phoenix. He's not the soul of it.

That's a take. What's a take? You don't like that take? You know what? Booker's a little more like you, though. He considers defense a hobby, not a profession. So Booker on the Knicks in the East,

he wouldn't get swept in the first round, I'll tell you that. East is a lot easier. But that's an interesting... All right. Jalen Brunson or Kevin Durant. Next year? Brunson?

Yeah. Yeah, I mean, Kevin's lack of commitment. Kevin's also... older, had more injuries. Again, I've never felt Kevin is the soul of a team. I just think he's brilliant. I think Brunson's brilliant and the soul of a team. He's the foundational piece of a franchise.

It feels, the team feels like an embodiment of Jalen Brunson. Yeah. Now this one, Jalen Brunson or Juel M.B. Brunson's healthier. I mean, M.B. played how many games this year? 40? He was hurting the playoffs. He was going to be the MVP.

They say. Brunson with far less talent is going to win a second round series. And beat seven years, number one, a second round. I mean, I know everybody thinks I'm nuts, but you're telling me who I could pick to lead my team. Next season. Yeah, I would take Brunson. I don't, I don't disagree. Jalen Brunson or Kauai letter.

Brunson. I mean, Kauai's never available. He's nonverbal. Literally, I have to guess as a coach when I show up at 3 o'clock. I have no idea if he's playing. I don't know what time. Coaches probably show up at 1.30. But if I show up at 1.30, at 3 o'clock, I'm like, is he playing or not?

Do we have Kauai today? I mean, last night, Brunson checks out of the game. He's hobbled. And he comes back in and dominates the second half. I mean, the guy is like insane. He's playing hurt. I mean, he's just doing it. There's nothing I don't like about him.

Everybody loves it. Jalen Brunson or Luca Dodg it. I think Luca is one of the great scores in the history of the league. And he's big. 6-7-2. What is he? 2.30. He's a big strong athlete who's going to be around forever. So I don't...

I mean, again, at some point, like a Tatum or a Luca, I get a bigger, stronger athlete who can score at the rim, it's just different. Luca's like the size of JJ Y. He's 6-7. I don't think he's 2.30. I think he's probably closer to 240. But, like, yeah.

Finally. Oh, boy. Jalen Brunson or LeBron James? Well, head LeBron now. lashed out. That me yesterday for my backwards hat ramp. Now, I think LeBron at 39 is still the better athlete. But I will say this.

Laker teams, because of LeBron's style, they have to, he takes over the ecosystem. Well, what's that doing in the West, vis-a-vis what Brunson taking over the ecosystem of the Knicks is doing in the East? I just I think I actually thinking this is rare I think we're undervaluing what Brunson is doing no Mitchell Robinson no Randall so you lose your size OG's hurt

you're hurt and you put on that second half clinic last night I think what we're watching here is it's very rare in the NBA that a star gets traded and we don't realize he's a star until he goes to the new place usually like oh we're losing a star Nobody in Dallas, they were like, okay, we got the star. We're good here. We upgrade to Kyrie.

No, no, actually, you lost a superstar. And you just didn't know he was a superstar. It's very rare. It didn't happen much. The only pushback on Brunson, and I love him, and I'm a Knicks fan, blah, blah, blah. If we did this exact same topic one year ago, would it have been a clean sweep on the other side opposite Brunson? No, I would have taken SGA and probably LeBron over Brunson.

LeBron went to the conference finals last year. Yeah, I would have taken. But I do, you say, well, things have changed. Well, LeBron is now a year older, and SGA's numbers have come down in the playoffs, which leads me to believe he needs to have the ball in his hands a little less. And by the way, Sam Presti's going to build this team. He's got a lot of draft capital. But I do think when numbers go down for a great player,

it's not because they aren't playing hard. It's because usage rate wears guys out. You wouldn't have taken Brunson over Booker and Durant. that they were, they looked good last postseason. They ran into the nuggets. Booker's an interesting player. So Booker's one of those guys like Clay Thompson and his prime. Clay fit on every team in the league.

There are great players in the NBA that don't fit on every team. MB doesn't fit on every team. But Booker catch and shoot it. He doesn't need to be your point guard. He doesn't need to just catch it and give us 27. Jamal Murray works on almost NBA team. So when you can get a guy that's not huge ball usage, rate and is a good score.

That's why Kevin Durant fits everywhere. He can get the ball with three seconds left in the shot clock and get a good look. So the one time Devin Booker played alongside a point card, Chris Paul, they went to the finals. If Clay Thompson doesn't have a career, isn't spending his career next to Steph Curry, do we think of Clay Thompson like that? Like if Booker was next to Curry, I think we would think of Booker as like probably an all-time great, right?

Just like Clay Thompson is on the way the whole thing. Booker's a great two playing with a one. And yeah, I think what you're saying is basically Clay and Booker are the same. They would be much less relevant. They would have both Clay needed Steph to be that globally relevant. And I think Booker would be more globally relevant if he had Steph. And I think that speaks to Steph's greatness. The ability to not only be a superstar, but make, like Jerry West made Gail Goodrich a household name.

Jerry West had the ball in his hands a lot. Gail Goodrich, who was a shooting guard, ended up being, you know, he was a, I don't know if he was a shooting guard, he was a guard. Is that 70s or 60s? Hey, I have one 70s reference in every show. But Gail was number 25. You wouldn't know Gail Goodrich if he didn't have Jerry West.

I mean, he was a good player. Yeah. And he went to UCLA, good player. But it's like to get a guard that has the ball, has the scoring, and leaves you oxygen to have your own game. That's very rare. Chris Paul did that to Booker. Steff did that to Clay.

West did that to Goodrich. So he allowed, a lot of times, James Hardin doesn't leave a lot of oxygen and touches for his back court mate. And let's remember, Clay pre-back-to-back missing seasons with the knee injury, like that clay was totally different. He was the best two-way guard in the league probably, right? Or one of them. He was like a defensive guy back in the day. Devin Booker's never, like you said, he's never been like a defensive lockdown guy. No, no. But he, I think he's a more...

It's better off the bounce than Clay was. Yes, that's exactly right. JNC consulting. We're always here. We're always here for all your managerial and executive needs. JNC consulting. All right, Chandler Parsons stopped by today. Julian Edelman stopped by. I thought his story, if you didn't hear it live, we'll put it on the podcast.

If you did not hear the Julian Edelman story on him doing, stand-up at the comedy store for 12 minutes to get ready for the roast. That takes courage, man. That. That takes courage. Twelve minutes, live, 300 people. See you tomorrow. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite.

Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Scare Idle help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all. embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth.

Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, what's good, y'all? You're listening to Learn the Hardweight with your favorite therapist and host, Kear Games. This space is about black men's experiences, having honest conversations that's really not safe to have anywhere, but you're having them with a license,

professional who knows what he's doing. How many men carry a suit or armor. It signals to the world that you not to be played with. And just because you have the capability that does not mean that you need to, listen to learn the hard way on the AHA radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science. and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of taun tons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two.

Listen to Stuff to Bole Your Mind on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.