The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Jason Witten, Kyler Murray, LeBron James, and Bryce Harper

Episode Date: March 1, 2019

Filling in for Colin, Doug Gottlieb explains why TE Jason Witten is making a mistake going back to the Dallas Cowboys, why teams should be concerned about drafting QB Kyler Murray, why he feels Los Angeles Lakers F LeBron James is not a top 10 player right now, and why OF Bryce Harper new contract with the Philadelphia Phillies was a loss for the player. Guests include Chris Broussard, Mark Schlereth, and Tom Penn. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Clivert Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her.

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You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Markeep coming to, he's like, you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Thanks for listening to The Heard podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1. Find your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeart Radio app by searching Herd. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. What up? Welcome in. This is the Herd wherever you may be, and however

you may be making it as part of your Friday. Thanks so much. Alongside the very talented Joy Taylor, I'm Doug Gottlieb filling in for Colin Cowherd. It is March, which of course is the greatest college basketball and arguably sports month of the year. And man,

the end of February go out with a boom. We actually have baseball to talk about with a record-breaking contract for Bryce Harper. We got football to talk about with Kyla Murray being a little bit taller than people thought that he was. And Jason Witten leaving the broadcast booth, we'll get back to that. We got basketball to talk about with outstanding college hoops, huge upset on Fox Sports 1 last night. And of course, the NBA tonight, LeBron, the older model against Janice, the newer model. model. We're starting to get into, hey, Lakers are must-win territory. They've competed well against the top of the league. Now you're getting the team with the best record in the league at home

tonight. We've got a lot of things to get to. Morning to you, Joy. How are you? Good morning. Good morning. What was your reaction when you heard that Jason Witten was leaving the Monday night football booth after just one year? I was very surprised and curious. Surprise because that's a huge job to leave and an even bigger job to take leaving the NFL. So you would think that that's something you're very, very committed to. And it's curious because I don't know what to expect from him after a year off from football, which I think everyone is just assuming he's going to pick up where he left off and mentally. And as far as his, you know, teaching abilities and locker room guy and all that, I'm sure will be seamless. But the football field stuff is what I'm not sure

Yeah, you don't get faster. Everybody else does a year away after having 63 catches but not looking great doing it. It's going to be fascinating. Listen, I agree with you. I was surprised. And look, none of us are blind, deaf or dumb. Oftentimes, people who have sat in an analyst chair are a little bit more reasonable in terms of their analysis of it. It's a hard gig.

It's a hard gig to do, especially when you're judged by the entire world. You're the only game. you're a standalone game. Whereas if you're on a Sunday at a 1 o'clock or a 4 o'clock game, you know, even if there's some other big guys on it, there's parts of the country that don't hear you. Everyone hears. And it's Monday night football,

which has been synonymous with the very top in the field. Whether or not they don't get the Super Bowl, they only get one playoff game. But the fact is, being a standalone game, everyone parses every word you have. And when you're compared against your former quarterback, Tony Romo, it's really hard because everybody loves Romo. And look, there's flaws in the hiring for ESPN.

They had a completely green crew. Like as much as everyone loves Booker McFarland, he never called NFL games. As much as everybody loves Joe Testator, he never called an NFL game. So there's no NFL chops, no equity with the audience. It was hard, and he rightfully got some criticism. But it makes no sense to leave one of those four chairs, right? It's why I sat here in this very chair before, before Cowherd ever got a chance to comment on it,

when Tony Romo left playing in the NFL to be the lead broadcaster, lead color man analyst for CBS. They said he's not going back. Because once you have that chair, you're at the top of the mountain. You didn't have to climb. You didn't have to fight.

You didn't have to wait for a guy to retire. You leapfrogged a bunch of steps. You didn't have to do ESPN news overnight, right? You didn't have to call NFL Europe. You didn't have to slog it out. You got one of those big chairs. Never give it. up. So on many levels, it makes no sense. They were going to try and figure out a way to make it work.

He would have been better as time went on. They likely would have moved Burger McFarland into the booth. And that would have been a good three-man booth. And we would have started out, okay, you know what, I understand the Witten thing. He would have gotten better. Our expectations would have lessened. They would have grown together as a crew. He had a four-year con. It makes no sense to leave one of the four big chairs. covering the biggest professional sport in the industry to go back to playing tight end for the Dallas Cowboys, unless, hey, why did Josh McDaniels change his mind

from the Indianapolis Colts where he might or might not have had Andrew Luck, remember at the time we didn't know about Andrew Luck's shoulders? Why would he go back to the New England Patriots? Do we really believe it's because Bill Belichick was going to open up his vault of knowledge? Or was it a wink deal? Or he's the guy.

It feels like we're all missing that if you just look in a vacuum, do you leave Monday Night Football to go back to the Dallas Cowboys with a one-year deal, $3.5 million, where you're making more money with an easier job. That's a 30-year... Look, being a broadcaster on Monday Night Football or in any of these... It's like a lifetime appointment.

It's like being a federal judge. Those guys, he might not have had Monday night football after four years, but it's not like they were going to fire him. And if they mutually decided to part ways, there were other networks that would have hired him to do maybe lesser games. Why would you walk away from what feels like a layup? You know, 18 weeks, 17 Monday, not even 17 Mondays. Right, but 17 games plus one playoff game.

why would you walk away? And then you start to think about it. Jason Garrett last week was not renewed. There was no extension on his contract. Heck, if you go back and you listen to Jerry Jones and his son, they have said, we're in win now mode. We're kind of in prove it mode.

And then you start to think, wait a second. Kellen Moore is the new offensive coordinator. He's been with the Dallas Cowboys with Jason Witten. John Kittna is the quarterback coach. He's been the backup quarterback with Jason Whitten. Rob Marinelli's doing a good job with that defense. All they'd have to do is change out head coach and tight end. And remember, Jerry only hires Jerry's guys.

He's hired outsiders in the past. Bill Parcells did a good job, but they didn't get along with it. Jimmy Johnson, of course, works here, did the best job. but Jerry wants Jerry's guys. Cowboys. I want a cowboy to be the cowboy head coach. That's what he's got now. And this is part of what Jerry has done previously. If you go back to the 2013 season, they were 8 and 8, they missed the playoffs for the third straight year under Jason Garrett. Go back and look. Their offensive coordinator was Bill Callahan. Their defensive coordinator was Monty Kiffin. Even their special teams coach, all three coordinators,

had previously worked for John Gruden. When John Gruden was a head coach in Oakland, Bill Callahan, or in Tampa, Monty Kiffin. And what he put in place was, hey, look, Jason Garrett thing doesn't work out. I'll just slide John Gruden in. He's already got his guys in place. Why would, why would you leave one of the top four positions? The chair is analyst for money. Ninety-night footballist Danny Don Meredith all the way to John Madden to John Gruden.

Why would you leave that to go back to the Cowboys? Take a listen to Dallas Morning News columnist Matt Mosley on my radio show, which follows this one, 12 to 3 Pacific, 3 to 6 Eastern on most of your Fox Sports Radio affiliates. Why would you leave? Take a listen to Matt Mosley. Into the Cowboys locker room where he's more comfortable, and then we can see if Jason Whitten becomes the future head coach of the Dallas Cowboys. Now look, I actually think you're more valuable to a team if, like John Gruden, you're going and watching everybody else, Pratt, talking to every other coach,

you understand the entirety of the league. But being a plant for ownership, for the general manager, to be in the future head coach, already having kind of the deity status that he has in Dallas, the only thing that would make sense to leave a Supreme Court, justice-like lifetime appointment of being a color analyst with no chops at all, Monday night football in the second year of a four-year guaranteed deal, is if he got a promise that he's the next coach of the Dallas Cowboys.

It's the only thing that makes sense. Like, look, does it make sense that he didn't like criticism? Sure, that here's a guy that, you know, back when they were players, Tony Romo got all the heat and he got all the praise. And now Tony Romo gets all the praise and he gets, yeah, some of that. and I'm sure some of it isn't fun when you want to be out there playing and you don't have it fully out of your system.

Like, I get all that. But the Cowboys said they built up Blake Jarwin. They're probably going to draft a tight end. Like, look, he raised a pregnant woman two years ago and came in third. He was not running particularly well. So the idea that it's simply because he missed football and wants to get back on a football field

and wants to be in that locker. I'm like, okay, okay, you don't want to. want to be a shell of your former self. You're more likely to get hurt as well as being effective as, you know, we're all joys rightfully like anybody else questioning what he has left in the tank. To me, the only possible, reasonable explanation for, dude, you don't give up that job. Don't ever. Make them fire you. If you die in that chair, great. That's a life well lived. The only thing that makes sense is if Jerry, who has done this before, he tried to put it in place for John Gruden, as if Jerry said, you're my guy.

You're my guy. Coming up next, Kyler Murray measured at just that much over 5'10, but why it doesn't actually answer any of the issues with drafting Kyler Murray. We'll get to that up coming next with Joy Taylor. I'm Doug Gottlie. This is The Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific

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learn the hard way. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the hard way and listen now. What's up, fam? This Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano and our podcast, point game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed.

And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Rue.

Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court, licking his fingers, why he got the ball. Like, you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah. You figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff.

Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue 42. Hey, rec, my mama want you to wave at her.

What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Park. Listen to the Clippers show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Doug Gottlieb, Joy Taylor, in for Colin Cowherd. This is The Herd. Yesterday, always interesting to see guys' true measurements.

I don't know if he did the tiptoes thing. I don't know if he had thick, thick socks. But I was told from several sources, like, hey, Kylie Murray's like, just a hair under 5'10. He's like 5'9 and 3.4. orders or 5-9 and 7-8s, whatever. Yesterday, he measures in at 5-10 and 1-8th, whichever.

So much better, right? Like this much time. Like, okay, now he can play quarterback in the National Football League. Now we're good. It's not the Olympics, right? There's the famous Jerry Seinfeld deal about the Olympics, right? The difference between a gold medalist and fourth place is like,

greatest guy in the world? Never heard of him. You know, it's, it's like that. It's literally that much. But I kind of think we're sort of missing a little bit of the point on Kyler Murray. Think about this for a second. Look, Kyler Murray was, and I believe I sat in this chair or on that chair, Joy, and I said, Kyle Murray's going to win the Heisman.

Kyle Murray is Doug Flutty with Mike Vicks athleticism. And what's happened is because his measurements are, similar, not the same, hand size much smaller. He's slightly smaller and actually weighed a little bit more, 207 as opposed to 204 to Russell Wilson. We're like, well, look, if Russell Wilson can win a Super Bowl and play in another one, Kyla Murray should be your number one overall pick. That's the correlation we're making. There's a couple different parts to it which are

interesting. I think we would agree that Russell Wilson and Drew Brees and even Baker Mayfield are outliers. Now, can we say the league has changed over the last 10, 15? Yeah, like a blind man could see. The league is changing. It's evolving. On the other hand, you have some of these older quarterbacks that have stood the test of time. I mean, look at Philip Rivers.

He started, what was, like, 207 consecutive games, and he can't move at all. He was a bad athlete before he tore his ACL. before he was in his mid-30s. Now he's a terrible athlete, but he's a really good quarterback because you don't have to have the type of athleticism that Kyler has

in order to have long-sustained success. You still throw from the pocket. That's where your success is. And so the idea that an undersized quarterback, which is what he is, whether he's 5'9 and 3 quarters or 5'10, and whether a guy who weighs roughly 200 pounds, probably below,

like I think the reason he didn't run yesterday, which I would like to see him run, which is he probably put on weight for the combine, but he knows that that weight is going to hurt his 40 time. And he, Baker Mayfield told me at the Super Bowl, he's a 4-2 guy. So maybe he's a 4-3 guy, but if you're running with 15 extra pounds, you're probably a 4-4-5 guy, regardless of which, whatever his size is, he would have to be an outlier in order to be successful in the NFL. And this reminds me of the, you don't need college guy.

Do you need college? I don't know if you absolutely positively need to graduate from college. And I understand that there's a lot of reasons some people never make it to college. Parents can't afford it. They grow up in an environment where it's not valued or they have a troubled childhood. They're moving around houses or they simply don't have, not everyone's educational base is like our own. Sometimes schools don't provide.

the right level of, you know, core curriculum in order to help kids do well in the standardized test. Or maybe it's just not, again, not valued. And so people like to point out, and Cowherd never, never graduated Eastern Washington. And he's as successful as anyone has ever been in this business. Steve Jobs, Mark Zuckerberg. Now, in case of the point, they had to actually get into Harvard in order to withdraw from Harvard. Larry Ellison, who owns an island, right?

Like how many islands are there in Hawaii? He actually owns one. That's the biggest baller move of all time. You can tell me about Zuckerberg and Bill Gates trying to save the world. Larry Ellison actually owns one of the Hawaiian islands. That's a mic drop, isn't it? Didn't finish college.

Now, he did go to the University of Chicago, which is one of the 10 best schools in America, but he didn't finish. But if you want to say, like, hey, I don't need college, Larry Ellison didn't need college. We did get into University of Chicago, so there was some ability to be competitive.

One, can you be competitive in high school? And two, do you value on some level your core education or to get into those schools? But I don't need college guy is a little bit like, I know that through the 50 years of the NFL, there's been like five guys smaller than six feet tall who have been successful as quarterbacks in the NFL. But that, by definition, is an outlier.

But here's the other problem, here's the other problem with the Russell Wilson comparison. Forget about the fact that Russell Wilson had to lose weight before the combine and Kyler had to gain weight. Or the fact that Russell Wilson has longer arms and is a little bit more of a pocket thrower. Like here's what we forget about Russell Wilson. Kyler Murray has a chance to be the number one overall pick in the NFL draft. And how we evaluate the number one pick is different than any other pick, especially a third round pick. So if I were to tell you that Kyla Murray comes into the National Football League and this year with the Arizona Cardinals,

with the air raid scheme with Cliff Kingsbury as their head coach, he has nine games of less than 200 yards passing. He has zero games of 300 yards passing. Would Kyler Marie live up to the expectations and hype of being the number one overall pick? No. What if in his second season he had just two, three hundred yard passing games

and six games below 200 yards? Would you say that he was a good quarterback to be taken number one overall? Of course not. Of course not. That's what Russell Wilson did. See, Russell Wilson, yes, he's become a very good, maybe great, but very good quarterback in the national football league. but he walked into a deal where they had the Legion of Boom,

not yet in their prime. They had a great running game, a good offensive line, and he didn't have to do anything other than hud, hud, hike, hand off the ball, and occasionally scramble and complete a pass on third down. The diminutive outlier quarterback that's become a star in Seattle that Cowherd has moving on went to the Giants in a year or two or something because his wife doesn't like Seattle, that's what happened? that our view of him is skewed because we're looking at him now

and not understanding the context of where he was taken and how he was protected. Look, if Kyler-Marie goes to Arizona Cardinals, they have no offensive line. None. That's one of the reasons Josh Rosen was bad last year. None. And the expectations in that system is going to be to throw it all the time because that's what air raid quarterbacks do. That's what Cliff Kingsbury is going to do.

So you compound the fact that he has to be an outlier. A no college can still succeed. Walt Disney didn't go to college. It has happened. Five foot 10 quarterbacks have made it. But then you put, he's the number one pick potentially, playing in a system where they're going to make him throw. They're not going to allow him to develop and evolve as a pro quarterback.

Feels like a recipe for disaster to me. Let's get to Joy Taylor with the news. No, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. So Anthony Davis was involved in one of the NBA's most dramatic trade sagas. And in an excerpt from his new show, The Shop, which airs tonight at 10.30 p.m. on HBO, LeBron compared Antonio Brown's situation with the Steelers to Anthony Davis's in New Orleans. AD's been in the league. This show was your seventh year.

Seven years in the league, nobody's ever said anything. No media. Not a fan, not a friend, not nobody has ever said anything negative about AD. But you can tell when the narrative change, when you don't do what they want you to do. So Antonio Brown was talking about basically he was a sixth round pick from Western Michigan. He just worked really hard. And then all of a sudden once he started talking and wanted to do his own thing, the whole narrative changed about him starting to be a problem. And basically LeBron is saying that that's what they're doing with Anthony Davis.

Now he does have a point. You never heard anything bad about Anthony Davis at all until this whole trade thing happened. And to me, Anthony Davis was doing the Pelicans of favor by telling them, I'm not going to stay here. Here's your opportunity to actually make some moves and get something back for me. But overall, I get the point of what it is they're trying to say. I would offer up this counterpoint to it. I don't have any problem with you asking for or even demanding a trade. It's when it becomes very public.

And remember, the difference here is, You're a year and a half out. You're mid-season. This is something that should have been handled in this upcoming off season and everybody would have gotten. That was the expectations. In this upcoming off season, they're going to offer you the biggest contract extension in the history of the league.

And if you turn it down, we know you're not all in, and then we'll trade you. The problem isn't that he asked. It's the problem, the way in which, the public way in which they handled it. And then all the different, I don't want to play for the, his dad, I don't want to play for the Celtics. and like he only want to play for the Lakers. And then he goes on NBA TV and says,

I'll play for anybody, 2019, except for that team. I think that it got, there's a lot of reasons why this trade situation with Anthony Davis got messy, and it wasn't all on Anthony Davis and Rich Paul and the Lakers. Like the Pelicans did plenty of work

to make this whole situation the disaster that it now is. Now their goal was to mess up the Lakers, which I think they successfully did. Yes. I think they messed up to Celtics a little bit too. A little bit. The GM also got fired. Yes.

And now they're in a different situation because while they still do have Anthony Davis and they are going to have to make a trade for him, their reputation has taken a hit from this as well. It was in a very aggressive move and I agree with you. It was in the middle of the season and it happened because LeBron clearly felt like he needed a superstar and he needed him now. And we still all feel like if they don't land Anthony Davis, it's going to be a problem for LeBron. But I just don't, I agree with him that it's not on Anthony Davis. Like I think that a lot of this started to spin negatively for him when in the reality he's doing what a lot of guys have done which is just saying I'm not going to be here at the end of this.

I'm not going to be here moving forward. And then everything on the outside got really aggressive and that's where it kind of got messy. Well, look, is it all? Because he's not the one that said he didn't want to play for the Celtics. I understand, but it's his dad. Look, at some point you're a grown man. You're 25 years old.

You have a couple of commas next to your name because you're a multi, multi, multi-millionaire. You're a superstar in this league. like, hey dude, you got to take control of your life. It is his dad. He can come out and say, my dad does not speak for me. He didn't do that. He didn't do that.

And he's likely not going to do that because that's the reputation he has. I mean, that's the relationship he has with his family. He left the arena with Rich Paul after the shoulder injury. Like, these are things that he's involved in. And by the way, Rich Paul works for him. This is something to never forget in basketball, in football and baseball, and in our line of work. Like, they work for you. your agent is your employee.

Right, but I think the point that they're trying to make is everything is fine and you're the superstar and everything's great. And so you want to do your own thing or you want to leave and then they try and attack your character as opposed to just looking at the situation. No one has attacked his character. Zero people have attacked his character. No, I'm going to say zero people. Like there was definitely, I mean, we're talking about it now. No one who matters has attacked his character. Have we attacked how he's handled this professionally?

Yes. But that's attacking his character. Like how you handle things professionally. is attacking who you are. If you're under contract for the next year and a half. Okay, that's the problem. If it was this off season and the extension, it's the timing of it in the middle of the season,

it became public. That's when, and we all know why it happened. I'm not disagreeing with you in terms of New Orleans making this a far bigger firestorm. Right. But let's be honest. You know, the fact that they demanded a trade in the middle of a season when it's not his contract year,

and he had not yet been, they're not even able to offer them the extension. Yeah, but I don't, I think the point they're trying to make is like don't attack someone's character because they're trying to take control of their career or do their own thing. Like, things can be handled in a professional way. So speaking with the Lakers, the doctors will reevaluate the sprained ankle of Lanzo ball in one week, according to Shams. Lonzo has missed the Lakers last 14 games with L.A. going five and nine during that stretch. And LeBron discussed why his absence has had such an adverse impact on the team. he said we obviously miss another ball handler, another playmaker,

a guy that's very, very good defensively with his ability to get a steal and pressure the offensive point guard, then push the pace for us, get into our early offense, so we miss that a lot. You know, with all the talk about the Lakers and the issues that they've been having over this season, we really haven't given enough credit to how disastrous the injuries have been for them. I have. I have. I mean, I know you have as well. I think overall, like the conversation is all about, like, LeBron and what he's doing off the court and then obviously everything that happened with Anthony Davis.

It's also only looking at LeBron's injury. Remember, two of the losses. Kuzma got hurt as well. Like, even on LeBron, you have Kuzma, Rondo, Lanzo. Who can win with three starters out? And LeBron's injury, we've completely forgotten how they were playing before LeBron's injury. These are huge injuries that have impacted their season. And they're getting kind of the lowest rung of the ladder of the Lakers' problems

when they really should be much higher. I mean, we're really dismissing that. And finally, it's been 27 days since the Patriots dominated the Rams of Super Bowl 53 and held one of the league's most explosive offensive attacks was 260 yards on offense. And appearing yesterday on Pro Football Talk Live, Sean McVeigh, still regrets not having a better contingency plan.

What I would do differently is make sure that you're putting your players in a position the way that you practice and prepare to have an ownership for some of the things that we activate it. So I think with the way that you prepare, having a better contingency plan, knowing that, yeah, they put a lot of man coverage on tape, but let's make sure you got a better all-purpose menu, some different things that we can activate. We never really made them pay, so they were able to just kind of play that consistent front structure, coverage structure on the normal down in distances, and then they were

really able to dictate it as opposed to, you know, what we want to try to do. I still just want an answer on Todd Gurley. I feel like this just disappeared. What happened with Todd Gurley? All of the reports are that he was completely healthy. Why wasn't he anymore? He's not having surgery. He said on that interview, he's not having surgery. He had 11 touches. It's so bizarre.

He was just not the same guy. This is why he don't put a bunch of, he's had so many touches. He's just worn down. That's it. He needed a better load management. That's what he needed. The conversation after the Super Bowl with Malcolm Butler, compared to the conversation that we've had about Todd Gurley,

it's just not even comparable. I really don't know. It's almost just getting dismissed. Like, oh, he had to be an injured and they're just not going to talk about it. But he's not injured. They're not having surgery. So what happened? I guess they just didn't think he was the same dude, and maybe that's, maybe that's what he's talking about.

That's Joy Taylor with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The herd lie news. Here's what's interesting about the LeBron thing. Tonight they take on the Milwaukee Bucks at Staples Center. And there's going to be a little bit of the older model and newer model, right? On offense and on defense.

And granted, Janice is not, and he may never be the shooter that LeBron is. as LeBron has become a very good shot maker after sometimes struggling with his jump shot early in his career. But it's fascinating. You know, there was a quote from LeBron a couple of days ago after they beat the Pelicans two nights ago about how teams, you know, are going to go at him on defense and he's still like, bring it on.

Like Julius Randall had 35 against you, dude. So I would offer this up. We can debate whether or not LeBron is the greatest player of all time, the second greatest player of all time. It's great for TV shows. It's great for radio shows. I host one, and I'm guest hosting in here for Colin Cowherd. But sometimes we get lost in the, is he an all-time great historically?

And is he one of the best players now? And I would offer up that LeBron James, so far, based upon his play at both ends of the floor, is not playing like a top 10 player in the NBA. He's just not. Like has he had a better and more impactful year at both ends of the floor than Janice and Tenacupo? No. You can give me the raw stats about how, well, you know, he's averaging slightly fewer points and, you know, and less assist and less rebounds or whatever. But if you watch the other end of the floor, you're trying to hide LeBron James, trying to hide him.

Doesn't move the same. We're looking at raw stats. He had a better year than Paul George. more impact at both ends of the floor. Has he had more impact than James Hardin, then Kevin Durant, then Kauai Leonard, then Joel Embed, then Nicola Yokic, then Anthony Davis,

then Steph Curry. What if right now in the NBA, though historically, no question at top 10, likely at top five, and on some people's list, the best player of all time? Right now in the NBA, why is LeBron James considered a top 10 player in the NBA?

Because in the past, he's carried teams, the past he has. This is not the past. This is today. This is 2019, 34 years old coming off of a groin injury. You show me where he's a top 10 player in the NBA. You want to give me his stats?

That's fine. I'll give you Russell Westbrook stats. He had another triple double last night. They didn't win. But if you just want to give me stats, I'll give you he's averaging a triple double for the third straight year. And with that, we bring in,

Chris Broussard, who of course has his own radio show, along with crazy uncle Rob Parker, where they argue for three hours every night, 7 to 10 Eastern Time, 4 to 7 Pacific. And of course, you saw him on undisputed. You see him on all of our TV shows. Wow. Right now. You just dropped a bomb, the godly. Not really.

Like, not really. Again, like, this is, I don't think it's being as disrespectful to LeBron as, like, like Nick Wright right now is probably tweeting furiously. but like the reality of it is like look dude he's 34 his contemporaries are are dwayne wade who is you know petering out in miami with a miracle last second shot a couple nights ago and of course last night carmelo anthony right like those guys aren't even in the league if lebron fell off from tonight forward he still has had a tremendous career he's still a top 10 top five maybe best player of all time he's played more games more games way more games than Michael Jordan did, Magic Johnson, Larry Bird, all those guys.

I would say, look at, see, LeBron hasn't had as good of a season as a lot of those guys on that list. He's not going to be first team all-NBA, which is a trip. But before he got hurt, he was on pace to be first-team all-N-B-A. He had carried that team to the fourth seed from a 35-win team before to the fourth seed. and I think my feeling is I still have LeBron as the best player in the world. Here's why. I think he's earned the benefit of the doubt to not, he's played nine games since the injury.

And you're right, he hasn't looked great. He's looked atrocious at times on defense. But I think he, I need to see more of a sample size. If he does not get them into the playoffs and they continue losing to these bad teams, in part because of his play, then I'll, give you he's not the best player in the world. But I just think he's earned the benefit of the doubt to say, I'm not going to take that mythical title from him after nine games.

Because before the injury, the 18 he missed, and the nine games, it was arguable. I mean, you were saying Duran, I think, at that point. And certainly people could make arguments for other guys. But I think most people still, through Christmas Day, believe LeBron was the best player in the world. And he was carrying that team to a nice season. I think, like, look, they were 17 and 10 at one point in time, but if we remember back, like, okay, we're cutting out the first 10 games where it really wasn't really, you know, a lot to get adjusted.

I mean, part of the whole Lakers thing is they were learning how to play with LeBron and just as they started to learn how to play with him and with his style, then he goes out, now they got to learn how to play without him, then they come back. And oh, yeah, by the way, while they're out, Joy pointed out, they've had a litany of injuries, not just LeBron. And then when they come back, now their schedule is more difficult. My issue is we're just, we're just.

Judging him, evaluating him against the best players, some of these losses have been against the worst teams. It's not like they're losing to, it's not like when you're losing. When they lost to the Sixers, the Sixers are really good, you know? You lose to the Warriors, the Warriors are really good. You lose to the Grizzlies, the Pelicans. The only reason they beat the Pelicans because Anthony Davis only played 20 minutes, otherwise they lose that game. And so I'm just evaluating based upon what the body of work this year against everybody else's body of work at the top, and I would tell you that their body works better.

I could argue, again, these last nine games, without question, I mean, he hasn't been the same. But I don't know, did he get out of shape when he was hurt? Did he not know how to respond to the longest absence of his career? You know, is he still working his way back? Like, I think he's earned the right to, for the benefit of the doubt, to a larger sample size. And I typically say, you don't become the mythical best player in the world in the regular season. Let's see what you do in the postseason. Tracy McGrady, if you just look at the regular season, he's a Hall of Famer, and I think deservedly so, I know you argue that.

But regular season, I think you would be like, oh, without question, he was a Hall of Famer. But then you look at the postseason, and even though he actually performed well individually, he never could lift a team to win. So Janus has never won a playoff series yet. Durant has certainly done it, you know, and that's why if I take, if it's not LeBron, I would say it's Durant right now based on the postseason he's, you know, performances he's had rather than Janus. But if Janus comes out and is great in the postseason, then I would say it's Janus. All right. We also have James Harden who had 58 points last night.

He's balling, but he has had some postseason stumbles. You're right. Right. I want to discuss the important, sudden importance of. of Lanzo ball with this Lakers team. And can the Celtics figure some things out? We'll get to that. I'll come next to Chris Broussard.

And Joy Taylor, I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is The Hurt. Be sure to catch live editions of The HARD. Weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Doug Galdiv in for Colin. This is The HARD on Fox Sports Radio. Fox Sports 1 of the IHeart Radio app. Joy Taylor, always here.

Chris Broussard, joining us on a Friday. Hope you're ready for a great weekend. Lakers with a massive test as we're starting to get into a must-win territory. They welcome in the Milwaukee Bucks, best record in the NBA, and still know Lonzo Ball.

Joy and I were discussing, like he's gone from a guy who everybody heap with criticism, kind of rightfully so, only 53 games in his first year, missed all the off-season because of his knee surgery, has shown signs of improvement,

but not playing at the elite level, I think some would deem necessary of the number two overall, picking the hype that surrounded him. But now people are starting to understand, like, man, they really miss him. They legit miss him, especially at the defensive end. Yeah, they do.

I think mainly at the defensive end, although he does some things offensively well. But look, they switch a lot, and he's long, he's versatility, he's got great instincts. You can just look at the numbers. When he's on the court defensively, they're so much better. And offensively, look, I don't want to overstate his absence because he was there during most of that period where LeBron James was injured. and they went five and eight. We know he shoots 41% from the file line,

32% from the three point line. He's not as aggressive as he needs to be. So I do agree they miss him. They'll be better off when he gets back. However, I think some people, not you necessarily, but some people are acting like he's the savior. Oh, they need lines when they get lines away. They should be able to, to your point earlier,

they should be able to beat New Orleans without Anthony Davis, Memphis, Indiana, without. Oladdebo, without Lanzo ball. It actually kind of helps make my point in that LeBron's become a defensive liability. And he's not the only one. Right. Right.

Rondo is living mostly on reputation defensively. He's past his prime. He had a torn ACL a couple years ago. Forget about the multiple hand injuries he had. And even some of his defense prowess is a little bit overrated. So it's harder to hide LeBron when you're trying to hide the fact that either you're playing without a point guard or you're playing with a point guard who's really a backup.

in Rondo. Speaking of defensive liabilities, I heard you say something on undisputed, which I feel like I told not you so. I told the world so. When they signed to Marcus Cousins, 95% of the NBA analysts and 100% of NBA fans said,

that's a wrap, it's over. And I said, well, hold on now. One, he's coming off in Achilles' tenant, and he's a massive man. We don't know how he's going to look. Secondly, like when Golden State's been, Golden State, they've played without a center on the court because it allows them to switch and really just kind of hide Steph. You know, you've got four and a half defensive players.

Now you've got a legit big guy. How's it working out in Golden State so far? No, that's a great point. And look, when you look at the eye test, you say, boogie's running the floor, boogie's passing the ball, he's obviously scoring, and his attitude is good. Like, on the court, it looks good, again, from the eye test. Look at his numbers. In 24, four minutes a game. He's given you 15 points, a team high eight rebounds, three and a half assists. So all that looks good. But when you really delve deeper, Doug, there is a problem. And look, I still expect him to win the title. I still would be stunned if they didn't. However, the numbers show that when Boogie, since he's come back, when he's off the court,

their offense is at a historic high. 118 is their rating, which is two or three points greater, than the Showtime Lakers and the Warriors of 2017, who are the best offenses ever. Defensively, their rating is 105, which is top five in the league. When boogies on the court, offensively, 108 is the rating, which is mediocre in today's NBA, and 108 is the defensive rating, which is mediocre in today's NBA.

So their net rating with him off the floor is over 12. With him on the floor is 0.2. Like you said, it was just hiding. Steph defensively. And you can do that successfully as a team. Now it's hiding Boogie and Steph and it gives your opponents two guys to target. I used to

look for Steph, try to get him in pick and roll. Now I can do Steph or Boogie so it makes them more vulnerable. I kind of hate to put it on Boogie like that because his attitude has been good and he's putting up numbers last night he had 2111, but they lost.

To the magic. Right. And Drayman's also, look, his defense has declined big time. And his offense, he can't make a shot. Both sides. 25% from three, worst of his career since rookie year, and like seven points a game, worse since he's been a start. Last thing, and I got like 35, 40 seconds for you. The Celtics, how fixable are the Celtics? Look, they may lose to Milwaukee and Toronto just because they're better teams. I still think they should beat Philly, but I didn't like Kyrie's comments about I just wish the playoffs were here.

because they can't just flip a switch. He may have seen LeBron do it and think we can flip a switch, but as good as Kyrie is, he's not LeBron James. And he should be thankful that they have these 20 games to try to work this thing out. You know, I think it's fixable. I think they've got good guys. From what I'm told, it's not like guys just dislike each other off the court. There's some good relationships off the court,

but the on-the-court chemistry is not there. So I think it's fixable. they got 20 more games. I wonder if when he's saying playoffs, he means we know Gordon Hayward's not going to get 28 minutes a game that we're trying to have him work through and then finally we get to the playoffs like, okay, Gordon, we'll wait until next year.

Because that's a huge thing. To your, that's a great point because everybody's focusing on the addition of Kyrie and saying that's the problem. What about Hayward getting this 26, 7 minutes a night? And all his shots, which take away from 2 of them shots and others. He's Chris Broussard. Check him out on the odd couple.

7 o'clock Eastern, 4 o'clock Pacific. Boy, Taylor and I break down Bryce Harper's bad decision yesterday. Next. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. What up? Welcome in.

This is the herd wherever you may be. And however you may be making this part of your day. Thank you so much. In for Colin Cowherd. I'm Doug Gottlieb. And whether you're listening on the IHeart Radio app, watching on Fox Sports 1 or any of our. Fox Sports Radio affiliates, could not be more pleased to have you join us.

We got a great second hour of the show as three-time Super Bowl champion. Mark Schlereth will join us in moments, Joy Taylor alongside. It's a Friday. Weather's still kind of gloomy in the city of Angels? Big plants this weekend? No, not big plants, but I'm also not complaining about the weather. I'm not complaining about it. I'm just kind of painting an accurate picture.

It is. It's been chilly here for longer than is acceptable by everyone that lives in Los Angeles. It's really, again, you know, I grew up in Southern California. I've lived other places. I understand that a bad day in L.A. is a good day, most places. But we have had a remarkably long and wet winter. This could be complete fake news, but I'm pretty sure it's the coldest winter in L.A. in like 60 years. Yeah.

And the wetest as well, which everybody's like, well, that's a good thing. And then L.A. people are like, well, that means eventually it'll be followed by a drought. and then everything grows up because it had so much water and then the big, big fires, and then we'll start all over again. That's generally kind of the way it works. And I don't think anyone's wiping away tears in Los Angeles over not getting Bryce Harper,

but there was an assumption that a kid from Vegas, they needed an outfielder, they did go out and get A.J. Pollock, that Bryce Harper would, they have the money, they have the TV deal, they are the Dodgers, they've been to the World Series, They got rid of Yassie El Pugge. They moved some stuff around. It would have made sense.

And they became kind of late bidders. And then all of a sudden, there was the competitiveness with, wait, the San Francisco Giants are involved, were involved as well. Yesterday, 22 hours or so ago, news broke that Bryce Harper had agreed to terms with the Philadelphia Phillies, 13 years, $330 million. And there's two other parts of this contract. which are really, really interesting. No opt-out clause, and of course a full-noad trade clause. Which the full-noad trade clause, come on. If somebody wants to be traded and wants out, they can get out.

It can be worked out. But this apparently is what Bryce Harper wanted. All reports, and Tom Verducci, of course, works first on MLB on Fox, covering the World Series and the regular season, writes for Sports Illustrated. He just had an article which kind of painted the true details of the picture, which is Bryce Harper wanted one team. He did not like this being a free agent thing.

He didn't love being coveted. He just wanted the biggest deal ever, the longest term deal. He wanted security. He wanted nowhere he's going to be, and he wanted more money than anybody's ever gotten. And if those were his goals, he accomplished them. But that doesn't mean it's a smart decision. If you ask a financial planner,

I win the lottery tomorrow. Do I take all the money now or I take it over 25 years? 99.9% maybe 100%. I just don't want to say it's a, or maybe 90, scientific fact is like 97%. So I'll go with 97% of them would say you take the money now. And we diversify it in your portfolio and it'll be worth three, four, five times as much money as if you were going to get paid out over 25 years. The common misconception from lottery winners or for people who think of lottery winners are half of them are going to go broke, which is true. but they don't go broke because of taking the money up front or not taking the money up front.

You got to have a plan. 13 years in Philadelphia sounds like a good idea, but 13 years in one place, especially a city like Philadelphia, don't know if that ends particularly well. I mean, think about Ryan Howard's deal ended there. Like, it all seems to kind of end poorly at some point. Now, look, I do think the genius to no opt out, no trade clause, and really only 25 million dollars a year means that Bryce Harper can in fact recruit Mike Trout in two years if he becomes a free agent as a member now of the Angels and goes back to Philly.

Although it should be pointed out, Trout grew up a Yankee fan, and the Yankees by then probably will need a center fielder, and they have even deeper pockets than the Phillies. And the Angels, of course, are going to do everything in their power to keep Trout so he doesn't even ever get on to the open market. But this is not a smart deal. It's just not. To not include an opt-out clause, which is your power, not the team's power. It's dumb.

And we believe this to be accurate, right, that the Dodgers offered three years at 135, three years at 135, or four years at 168. This is the lottery winner choosing the 13-year payout instead of the year. year payout. Granted, less money, but he would have been on the market again. In four years at 31, three years at 30 years old. And you can say, hey, the market has settled and guys when they get to 30, okay, even if he got a deal that was below that of the 13 year contract, which is 25 million per year. If it's three years at 35, which you do the math, right, that's 45 million. That's 45 million. dollars per year.

First, it's you can't spend $135 million. I mean, you can try. You guys remember the movie Brewster's Millions? I may be dating myself. Richard Pryor, where he had a month to spend a million dollars. Actually, an interesting movie. Right? Where he had to figure out ways to spend, in order to get, I forget it was like $10 million.

He had to spend a million dollars in a month. He had a month to do so. Like, you know how hard it is to spend $130? $35 million over three years when you have like a legit financial planner. And Bryce Harper for all of the persona with the hair, the beard, the home runs, and some of the ways he carries himself. Like, look, dudes, I believe he doesn't drink because he's like a legit Mormon. He's married, doesn't party.

Like he just wants to play baseball. The idea that he would fry through all of that money is crazy. And he would get another contract. but even if you don't want the top front loaded deal, wouldn't you rather play with the Dodgers? Like the Dodgers have been in the last two world series. Where the Dodgers are is where the Phillies hoped to be. And if brands mean anything,

look, I like Philadelphia far more than the classic national radio host sits here and says, well, Philadelphia is. Like, Philadelphia is a great place. great sports fans. You live out of the main line. Like, that's a good life. You have all the different sports you can throw out there. You can raise a family.

It's not ridiculously expensive. You're not far. You can buy a place on the Jersey Shore if you want to go to the beach. Live at the beach and still play for the Philadelphia Phillies. Like, that's not actually crazy to do. In the middle of the summer, your family can go live at the beach. Amazing. We're going to live in Delaware at the beach.

Totally underrated. I get that. but it ain't the Yankees and ain't the Dodgers. You had a chance to be a Dodger and had a chance to completely reshape the market and make $45 million a year. What am I missing? What am I missing?

I understand Bryce Harper thinks he knows what he wants. But this is where the proper financial planner or Scott Boris needs to set aside the ego of, hey, we don't need to have the longest, biggest contract of all time. Let's have the best contract of all time. Three years at 135 or four years at 168 for the Dodgers is a better contract than 13 years 330 with no opt-out. This is classic Boris. Classic Boris.

I got you more than you ever could hope for. Yeah, it's not really in the city you want to play in. Sure, it's in the same division as your rival. And no, they actually haven't been in the playoffs in more than a half decade. But I got you more money and I got you what you wanted. See, deal done. but it's not the best possible contract. It's not the best possible team.

It's not even the best possible location. Don't sell me on taxes in Los Angeles. And like, look, if you wanted long term... By the way, he turned down a 10-year deal with the nationals for $300 million going back to last year. So now he has to move to a rival city that doesn't have the pitching they had in Washington. And maybe you sit there and go like, you know, I'd kind of burn through my time in Washington. that part of my life was done like okay but that's not what has been said here he wanted long-term stability he wanted to reset the market 10 years 300 plus million dollars he didn't even have to

move and they got max scherzer oh I'm isn't this feels like a guy who set out with a checklist of things that he wanted and once the checklist was accomplished he end up taking it he settled on a six that's it settled on the six that's it settled on the six Eh, good enough. Women settle, men settle, Bryce Harper settles. My wife settled on me. That's what happened.

I was a six, solid six, though. Solid six with potential to grow to a seven. Potential. I never met that potential, but a solid six. Three-time Super Bowl champion, Mark Schlerth joins his show upcoming next. If he was an NFL GM, would it be Kyler Murray or Dwayne Haskin?

One seems to check every box. The other one's Kyle Murray. I'll ask him next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. On Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the IHeart Radio app. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying,

and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real.

From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice. radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations

with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't really really. We don't really that we are in possession of the thing, and we're still chasing it, and we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross,

because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth, or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines,

as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What's up, fam, it's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what.

He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reed. I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nasree.

He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night bases on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He run up the court, licking his fingers,

why he got the ball like, after you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff,

like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom. I want you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42.

Hey, Brett. My mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's she at? Hey, Ms. Parker. Listen to the Cliverts show on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Sunday, the Cup series heats up as NASCAR superstars race for the Las Vegas

Checkered Flag. Monster Energy NASCAR Cup series Sunday at 3.30 Eastern on Fox and the Fox Sports app. Doug Gottlievin for Colin. This is the herd and this is not soy milk. What?

There's supposed to be soy in my latte and that's not soy milk. I know the difference in too. Sorry, what? I just, you drink it and you're like, no, like there's no way you could tell the difference. Between soy milk and regular milk? Yeah, I mean, I get almond milk in here

but if they tricked me, there's no way I could just, like, taste it and know the difference. It's phone. Well, you're not a milk connoisseur then. You can't taste the difference in soy, almond and red milk. So you would be able to tell if it was cow milk. So you're saying there's regular milk in there? Yes.

Yes. Scott Lee would like his soy milk. Come on, Joyce. I mean, I don't know. I'm not cowherda has the minions when he walks around. I do not. I do not. I just, I think that one.

I think that one got lost. So you go soy milk over almond milk? No, I like almond milk. Here's the secret to the soy milk thing. Starbucks soy milk has vanilla soy milk. So it's like sweetened as well. I actually like the almond milk. It just depends on what kind of drink it's with.

Like if I get a cold brew and it's already sweetened, then I'll put some almond milk in it. You put a lot of thought into this. I do. I mean, you ask the question. Stink is a regular milk guy, right? No. I've gone almond milk later. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Just the unsweetened almond milk. Stink, when you played, sorry, I don't know if you've ever gotten to this on this network. I need you've gotten to the other one. When you played, how much did you weigh?

I usually weighed about between 285 and 290, pretty much my whole career. And then as soon as you got done, you lost the weight? Yeah. How much you lose? I went down to 220. How did you drop that weight? Quit eating. Pretty much.

See, there's this thing. When you consume less calories than you burn, I think it's science. I'm not 100% sure. I think that that is science. You actually lose weight. It's the craziest damn thing. If you don't eat, you don't. I understand, but like did you like, did you give up?

It's Carb Friday here, by the way. They only had me in on Carb Friday. We had this group. We have bagels. And we had now have pretzel bagels. They used to be salt bagels, now they're pretzel bagels, as well as one of those other bagels that you guys fight over. There's actually like plastic.

Well, there's only two Asiago bagels. And that's like they start, they get out, they sharpen the plastic. And then they have the, what's the other, what's the sweet ones? Cinnamon raisin bagels. French toast bagels. Mm. French. We're getting your food all wrong this morning, huh, Doug?

French toast bagels. Yeah. Did you give up carbs? What did you do? No, I literally quit eating. I literally just, I quit. I quit lifting. I quit training.

I quit doing everything. And I just, you know, quit essentially eating. and I end up losing a lot of pounds. Here's the flip side of that. I'm heavier right now than I have ever been since the day I retired. I wasn't trying to bring that up. I did step on the scale the other day, and then I got to the point where I was like,

oh, my goodness, I need to get back on the don't eat any more diet because I'm way too heavy. Mark's Lera, three-time Super Bowl champion joining us. 5'10 and an 8th, 207 pounds, 9.5 inch span of his hands. It's Kyle Murray big enough to play quarterback in the NFL. Listen, the game has changed because you're playing 60, 65% of the game is out of shotgun. He had less balls batted down at line of scrimmage than any quarterback in college football last year, I believe, only five times was a ball batted down at line of scrimmage.

So if you've got, I think one of the things you have to understand when you're watching film, guys that have great pocket awareness. that don't stare at the rush but feel it, can slide, can find windows, and deliver the ball accurately on time. Whether you're 6-5 or whether you're 5-10, it doesn't really matter. I find it fascinating, though, that, you know, people and scouts and just general people that cover the league are like, oh, he's 207, now he's a legitimate, you know, first overall pick. Like, that is so faulty.

That is so stupid. Like, one, are you going to be able to retain that weight during the season? and probably not. We used to play this game when I was playing for the Broncos, me and Tommy Nailen. So both Tommy Nail and I would weigh somewhere between 84 and 88,

usually, somewhere in there. So we'd get all dressed for practice, helmet and everything on. We'd step on the scale and get our weight. And Friday, well, actually, it was hat days. We only did it on hat days. So we didn't have a helmet on.

So hat days were if you won on Sunday, like we got not to have, we didn't have to wear helmets on Friday. So we'd be in shorts and, you know, jerseys and hat day, right? So we'd weigh ourselves on the scale before we went out to practice, and then we would consume water at an ungodly rate. You'd be sloshing around out there to see who could gain the most weight during an hour

and a half practice. By the end of practice, men, you've got to urinate, you're sloshing around, you're totally uncomfortable, then we would rush right in to see how much weight we would gain. And I literally could gain 8 to 10 pounds during an hour and a half practice by just drinking water. I mean, we would sit there between the defense and be doing whatever they're doing, and we're just, you know, you guys have the little scoreball. things. We'd just be pounding water.

It was, I mean, it was the most ridiculous thing. You have to do something to keep yourself entertained. But 207 pounds, like, who cares? You think about this, Doug. The last time I ever ran a 40 was 1989. I went on to start for 12 years in the league. The last time I ever did

a vertical jump was when a team was testing me and all these. The last time I ever did the 225 bench test was 1989. Then I went on to start for 12 years, and it didn't matter. anymore. If it's such a great indicator of your football skills, why do we not do it every year?

By the way, your dad still benches 225 reps it out. I don't know people have seen pictures of his dad. His dad is built like a Greek god. And there's pictures to prove it. Okay, so if that's not what playing quarterback's about, some of it's on film. Yeah. And some of it's also, there's a leadership component to it. Absolutely. Okay. You played with Doug Williams when your first Super Bowl, right? Well, no, Doug Williams I played with. It was before I got there. So I played with Doug Williams for a year, but it was, I didn't win a Super Bowl with Doug Williams. Mark Rippin, and then two with John L.A. Okay, so Rippin, Doug Williams. That's three Super Bowls for those counting at home. Hold on. Three. Okay, so. Who's counting? I am. Doug Williams, Mark Rippin, John

Elway. Yeah. Tell me if I'm wrong. When they walk into a room, all three takeover a room in terms of personality, persona? Yeah, in different ways, though. Explain. Like, different ways. Like, like, Rippin was happy action fun, love, you know, just goofing around guy. But when it came time, you know, to play on Sunday, man, he was dialed in. He's ready to roll. You know, Elway was more subdued business-like. So that was kind of his. But when he walked in the huddle, it didn't matter what the situation was.

When he walked into the huddle, then you knew you had an opportunity. You could be down 14. And you're like, okay, we got them right where we want them. Let's roll. Like, that's the kind of, that's the kind of presence he has. had. Doug was, Doug was very much the same way. I remember the first game I ever started.

It was a game against the Philadelphia Eagles in the vet. They had the number one defense they had, I mean, it was Jerome Brown and Mike Pitts and you know, Reggie White and Clyde Simmons and I mean, they were loaded, right? And I'm sitting on the, I'm sitting in the bus and I'm scared to death. I mean, I'll just flat out honest. I'm scared. I don't know if I belong. I honestly don't.

And I knew it was. going to be a lack of effort that was going to get me booted out of the league, but I didn't know. And I was sitting on the bus and Doug Williams walks on the bus and he walks right by me and all a sudden he stops and you can feel his presence behind you. He stops. He backs up, taps me on the shoulder and he said, hey, listen, the only difference between you and them is they've had an opportunity to make a name for themselves. And he goes, and today you're going to make a name for yourself. and he goes, I have nothing but the utmost faith in your ability. I went out, got a game ball, and wreaked havoc, you know,

got in a fight, the only fight I've ever been in. It was awesome. I mean, it was, because Mike Pitts, I was dispensing justice on Mike Pitts, and Mike Pitts is so frustrated because he thought he was going to be player of the game and have, you know, four sacks and go straight to the Pro Bowl, right? And I'm wearing his ass out. And Mike Pitts takes a shot at me, and I swear to you, my wife's over there, she can tell you,

I took double hands, I tried to break his freaking jaw. I mean, I just wham! And then Ernest Biner came flying and tackled him and it was melee and everybody's pulling us apart, you know, and flags are flying and stuff. And it was just my way of saying, I may be a 10th rounder out of Idaho, but you're not going to punk me.

Like, I didn't come here to get punked. And I bring that up because one of the, I think the biggest discussion point is people want to say, well, Baker Makefield was in the same system and Kyler surpassed him statistically. And like there's a difference in Baker Mayfield and Kyle Murray. Like Baker Mayfield

you know, people may not like his persona, but there's a persona and his teammates seem to love it. But in Oklahoma, teammates love it. In Cleveland teammates seem to love it, right? There's a get behind me, you've covered him, you know it. And then I saw Kyle Murray, take a listen. This is Kyler on with Dan Patrick

at the Super Bowl. Are you going to the combine? I don't know. Dad, is he going to the combine? Dad had no comment there. Pro day? I mean, that's after the combine. Yeah, are you going to do a pro day?

Yeah. Now, look, it's an, it's an uncomfortable Q&A because, remember, he's under contract with the A's, in fairness to him. And he's just a kid. And look, he won every high school football game he ever started in the state of Texas. He's a legend in the state of Texas. And here's a guy who started as a freshman at A&M, lost his gig, and then goes up to Oklahoma and comes out of nowhere, wins the Heisman trophy and leads them to another big 12 time. So he is accomplished.

He is no dummy. He's a bright kid as well. Right. But there is a difference in the personality, in the presence that quarterbacks have. And I don't know if he has it. And I almost feel like we're questioning the wrong things about it. Yeah, I think there's, I think the combine's a joke, okay, first off. It's a test of athletic ability.

It has nothing to do with your football ability. I always say this football is easy for football players. It's really hard for athletes. And all as you're figuring out here is who's the athletes. So it goes back to the film. It goes back to the intangible stuff, how much you're willing to prepare, how much you're willing to work, what you're able to understand, and how quickly you can make decisions. So all those things are more important. I think it's medical is the most important

thing you're going to do here. Two is personality. Let me talk to you. All the 40s and all that garbage is exactly what it is. If we lined up and ran 40s and the team that ran the fastest 40s got to win the, you know, look at the fastest 40s in football, like the fastest 40s ever recorded at the combine. You know, John Ross, how's he done? He's got 22 catches over the last two years. They want to trade him in Cincinnati. Right. I mean, so and there's a bunch of other ones that fall into that. So you got to take that stuff with the grain of salt. But I'm 100% with you. I don't know

what he is, but there's not one cookie cutter guy that can lead a team. Baker Mayfield. Baker Mayfield, you walk into Cleveland, man. There is no doubt who's in charge. You watch a Friday practice. I mean, you know, John Dorsey's like, that dude's all balls. Like, that's who he is. Like, he is in charge and everybody gravitates

towards him and loves him because of that. So you've got to have whatever it is and it comes in all kinds of different forms and fashions. But I think the bottom line is you have to be authentic. And then the other thing that you have to be able to do is play. Yeah, if you can't play. Right. If you can't play, you can't because you can't fool players.

Right. Like I remember the story you had and tell me if I'm wrong. You're in Washington. Yeah. Oh, yeah. And you guys trapped Heath Shuler in the first round. Right. And in the seventh round, what was the guy's name?

Gus Ferrat. Gus Ferrat did the headbutt later on in the cement wall, whatever. And didn't you want? lock up to somebody. Very first day. Very first day of mini camp said, boy, I tell you what, the seventh rounder is going to be ten times a quarterback of the first rounder. You can just see it. And sure enough, you know, Gus Ferrett went on to play for 15 years and he shuler flamed out.

And there's a lot of processing, how quickly you can process information and all those different things that are important. I think authenticity, the way you lead authentically is really important. But the bottom line, you got to play. And John Elway once told me this, your guys' job first and second down. I leave that to you guys. Go out, have fun, play. You know, be great. My job

is to convert on third down. That's what they pay me for. They don't pay me to play on first down. They don't pay me to play on second down. They pay me to play on third down. And that's what a quarterback has to be able to do. Play on third down. Can you do it? You're going to find out. Last thing.

You have your own radio show in Denver. Obviously, John, I always a friend of yours. Sometimes. Sometimes closer than other times. depending on what I say. I understand. So my thoughts on the Flacco thing were I actually think it made sense. I think it's a short-term solution.

A guy who is solid is fine. They can still go out and try and find the next guy. But because he's not going to make a ton of money, they can fix some of the other holes within this roster. What's your reaction to the Flacko move? My reaction is he's better than Case Keenum, but very much like Case Keenum, if you don't fix all those holes you talked about,

you're still going to be on the outside looking in to the playoffs. So you've got to fix a lot of things. Here's the issue right now is you're going to have Case Keenham and Joe Flacko. You're going to have a bunch of dead money from Case Keenum. So you're paying essentially Aaron Rogers pay to Joe Flacco to run your football team. And you look at them right now. They've got free agents. I think they have four or five free agents right now that Bradley Roeby doesn't look like he's going to be back.

Matt Paradis, I don't think he'll be back. Max Garcia, Jeff Hirman, there may be one other guy. If all four of those guys are gone, they won't have one draft pick on their team from the 13, 14, or 15 draft. You want to talk about the mismanagement of the draft. And they've got two players from the 16 and 17 draft that actually kind of contribute as starters. Justin Simmons and Garrett Bowles. And Garrett Bowles is a question mark. So, I mean, they have not done a great job.

Last year's draft, notwithstanding because it was really good. So to me, you still have a ton of work to do to be even mentioned as a team that's going to compete for a playoffs. And you have the Chargers that might have the best talent in the league and the chiefs who might have the best young quarterback in the league. He's Mark Schlery, three-time Super Bowl champion, giving so many thoughts on the national football league course. You see him covering the NFL on Fox. Think great stuff, as always. Thank you, buddy. Let's get to Joy Taylor with the news.

Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. So for Clay Thompson, rumors involving the Warriors chemistry is overblown. After losing for the third time in their last four games, Clay was not having any of that talk. Based off the past years, are you happy to where this team is at? You're going forward to playoffs right around the corner of the outside? Yes, that's easy. Yeah.

Could be much worse. Cavalry drama. I didn't hear any of that. I think the talk of team chemistry with the Warriors is a bit ridiculous, too. There's certain teams in this league that we can have a serious conversation about the chemistry, like the Lakers or the Celtics or you can even get into it with the Sixers. I don't put the Warriors on that list. Now, at the beginning of the season, I know we were all freaking out about the Draman and Kevin Duran thing.

I think that's pretty much settled, at least at this point. Now, maybe there's some residual feelings about it. We'll find out in the off season. But as of right now, that doesn't seem to be the case. The Warriors are not the team that I'm worried about going into the end of the season. I tend to agree. Like, I do want to see what happens with Boogie in the playoffs. He's sitting in key moments, like how he handles that.

So far, though, he's handled it very, very well. But I think the biggest difference is that we cover the NBA with far more focused than we ever have before. Remember, the new TV deal, now you have multiple national TV nights on TNT and on ESPN. You have this show, Nick and Chris's show, Undisputed, as well as other networks, focusing so much on the NBA. Like, no one talked about NBA regular season before. So all these blowups and coaches and players not getting along and lack of team chemistry and bizarre losses. This has happened for the last 50 years in the NBA. The difference is now we're talking about it on a daily basis.

It seems like there's more issues. There's 24-hour news coverage of everything. So it's overly saturated for sure. But I don't think that team issues are really a conversation here. Katie's been out for a few games because he needs some rest, according to Steve Curry, he's tired, which is fine. What's more interesting about what's happening with the Warriors is if they do continue to, not struggle, but just, you know, go through the end of the season, you know, getting tired, resting guys, whatever they're going to do. It could end up moving them down in the seating, which could move the nuggets up. And if the Lakers sneak in in the eighth seed, then we have a very interesting first round for the Lakers as opposed to if they match up with the Warriors, which everyone's going to feel like will be over very quickly.

Look, I don't think the Nuggets are as good as their record. I don't think anybody in the NBA thinks that they are. As much as I think Yokic is an amazing player, and Malone is doing a tremendous job as head coach. They're fun to watch. I will point this out, that that's a better matchup for the Lakers, one in which you feel like they could win. Have you seen the Nuggets home court?

Do you know how they have that 5210 written right below the Frito line? Because that's the altitude at a mile high? Like, you don't want to fool around and play a long series in altitude. that'll screw you up. You'll just have some games. I mean, I don't anticipate that it would be a short series with the Lakers. No, no, I mean, but even if I'm the Warriors, like, I want no part of Denver. I want Denver, and I know that you wouldn't face them to the conference finals.

I just, I do think that an under, the altitude is not being taken into consideration when we talk about playing at home against. No, like home court advantage. I don't think matters anywhere in the NBA. I don't think it matters anymore because especially teams, they figured out the old spurs, like, all we got to do is win one game. And now we got home court advantage. Fine. Right. And teams can win.

We saw the Cleveland Cavaliers beat the Golden State Warriors twice in the last three games to win an NBA championship. But I do think it matters in Denver. So it's time to see who's going places. Sponsored by Toyota. Let's Go Places. And Leveon Bell is going places. The Athletic has reported that there's growing speculation that the Ravens are one of the favorites to sign Leveon in free agency. Do you like that fit with Lamar Jackson in Baltimore?

They have $20 million in Cap Space. No. I know they want to run the ball a ton and they want Lamar to run it less, but the beauty to Levyon Bell is he's great out of the backfield. I mean, he has a pass catcher. Like, he's a dual threat. And that's not how I believe he'd be used with Lamar Jackson. Like the true weakness to Lamar Jackson is,

his underneath and intermediate throws are really inaccurate. And I'm sure they can work on some of that in the offseason. Like, he throws a good ball down the field. it's some of the inaccuracies underneath in short intermediate throws and that's not really the style of that offense I think if you look at a number of carries he could get a bunch

but that beats him up like yeah I don't love it yeah he's more of a patient yeah the whole runner well Gus Edwards who's an undrafted free agent 2018 is a top of team's steps chart for running backs 718 yards as a rookie that's what the Ravens are working with right now yeah and Lamar carrying it 15 times the game

But obviously, they're going to. Like if I'm the Ravens, I like it. But if I'm Levyon Bell, I'm like... You might not fit his style? Yeah. Yeah, style. Well, he wants to get paid. So whatever...

Fair enough. However, they stylishly signed back check is what he's concerned about this point. It does say something, though, if the Jets, if the Raiders, if the Colts, three teams with the most cap space, and what would think be the style that would fit him are not the highest bidder or not as interested, he might not be, he's not going to make up the $14 million he gave away last year. Which is unfortunate. But, I mean, look, we were just talking about Todd Gurley disappearing in the Super Bowl. I think that has had an effect on the free agent marketing for running backs.

Totally agree. We don't still feel like they're important. They certainly are. I think they've shown over the past few years that it is important to have a strong running game. But I think that's affected it. And finally, according to the L.A. Times, LeBron will be the subject of an upcoming play entitled King James, Center Theater group provided a brief play description. King LeBron James reign in Cleveland brings promise, prosperity, and renewal to a city in desperate need of all three. As the city celebrates a championship,

two estranged friends spar in a verbal game of one-on-one, revealing past secrets, present truth, and a possible future after the king has left the building. LeBron has yet to acknowledge this yet. So I don't know if he's approved this or not. I mean, I'm sure he has King James copyrighted, so I don't know how this works. But Would you go see this play? No. Are you into the theater? I am in the theater, but I'm so backed up on musicals that my wife says I need to.

Why haven't we seen Dear Evan? Why when we lived in New York, do we not see Dear Evan Hansen? Like, I don't know. I didn't even know Deer Evan Hanson was a thing, but apparently it was a thing. What was the last one you've seen? Oh, God. I love you. You're perfect now change.

Oh, okay. Which is basically the story of marriage. And it's fantastic. It was a little slightly off-ronger show. Did you see Hamilton? I have not seen Hamilton. Oh, you've got to see Hamilton. Hamilton's amazing.

Earl took me to see Hamilton. It was awesome. I don't know if this is going to hit Hamilton level, but it's interesting. It's about Cleveland and LeBron's. LeBron's reign in Cleveland. That's Joy Taylor with the news. Well, that's the news.

And thanks for stopping by. The Heard Lie News. Speaking of LeBron, if I told you LeBron was no longer a top 10 current player in the NBA, you would say I'm crazy. And you might. next in the herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. Doug Galdivin for calling, this is the herd. Fox Sports Radio. Fox Sports 1, the IHeart Radio app, Joy Taylor alongside. She has her podcast. I'll get to that in a second. The

Nashville Predators take on the Winnipeg Jets at 8 p.m. Eastern or Discovery card key matchup, get your free credit scorecard today. Even if you're not a Discovery member, excuse me, It includes your FICO score. Checking into your scorecard won't hurt your credit. Learn more at Discover.com slash credit scorecard limitations apply. Your podcast is, I might be crazy, right? Maybe I'm crazy. God, I screw it up all the time.

I'm so sorry. Maybe I'm crazy. The topic of this week's is what? I mean, LeBron. I know. Matt Barnes joined us, so we talked a lot about LeBron and MVP. We also discussed pineapple on pizza, which I'm very against. You're against pineapple pizza.

I grew up against my sister used to like pineapple and Canadian bacon. By the way, spoiler alert, Canadian bacon is ham, right? Why are you so against Canadian bacon? I mean, pineapple and pizza. Oh, because I love pineapple. And I just don't believe that it belongs on cheese and marinera sauce. I generally, I understand what you're saying there. This is, we had this discussion before the show, Ryan Music and I did, which is I like,

I usually have an egg white omelet when I'm here, right? spinach and mushrooms and tomatoes and some white cheese. And I love the pretzel bagels that we get. I get scooped out, but combining the two is not great. It's a little like women's basketball, frankly, right? Love women. You hate women's basketball. Don't like women's basketball, right?

I love basketball. I love, I enjoy women. I enjoy their company, right? But women's basketball, it's what you're saying. But I have come around a little bit to pineapple on pizza. There's a certain refreshing element to it where you bite in, you get all this stuff, and then you get the refreshing. the refreshing kind of juiciness of the pineapple.

I'm certainly against the women's basketball take, but the pineapple on pizza thing is just wrong. It's just wrong. Okay, so do you believe LeBron will be the MVP this year? No, no, no, no, no. We were just discussing how close the MVP race really is. And it feels like in the past couple years, the MVP has been a topic that we've discussed on our shows a lot.

Yeah. And we haven't really talked about it much this year, and I think it's because there is no real clear winner. I mean, Hardin was obviously in the conversation for most of the year, but you have to discuss Yannis. He had a favorite right now. He had the run of 30 straight points. Which is incredible. Right. But Yonis has to be in that conversation. I think Paul George has a very good argument. I mean, Matt Barnes through Kevin Durant in there, which isn't wrong. I think that the warriors sort of cannibalized themselves with the MVP race. Because you have staff as well, right? Right. But, okay. Hold on a

I mean, I thought that this was a year that LeBron would get a regularization of the MVP. But you wouldn't ever come close to including him and the MVP. No, no, no, absolutely not. Not now. Which beautifully lends to my point, which is why do we have to say that LeBron is a top 10 player? You just named five players that are having better years, right? We didn't include several, but in Russell Westbrook, who's not even on my top 10 list. very easy. Kyrie Irving, who I seem to be the only guy pointing out. In fact, that Kyrie Irving over the last month and a half has played amazing basketball for the most part.

He's had some amazing games. These are the top 10 players this year in the NBA. Now look, could you argue for LeBron ahead of an Anthony Davis because Anthony Davis hasn't played games? Like, okay, I'm willing to have that argument. Could you argue that he's had a better career than all of these players? Like, I'm not arguing that. I'm not going to sit there argue that. But just because he was better two years ago, three years ago, and at times last year, does not mean that he's a better player this year at 34 years old

with a new team and coming off of an injury. Even before the injury, he did have some games, which he looked like, man, Braun still got it. But he had some other games. You're like, I'm not sure if he still has it. And whether it was them figuring him out or him figuring them out or the fact that he's 34 years old and figuring his body out, he's not the dynamic player at the defensive end,

and while he's a better shot maker now on offense, maybe than he's ever been, he doesn't make free throws, and he doesn't get by people nearly as easily. Like, I don't have Ben Simmons on this list. I think these are your top ten players in the NBA. I'm not convinced that I would, would I allow you to argue with me that LeBron

could take the place of Yokic or maybe Embed, or maybe Kauai because Kauai sat at a bunch of games. Okay, but Kauai's been a better play. when he's played. He just has. That would be my argument. Feel free to take down that argument. I mean, I'm just, I feel like this year has been a very strange year for LeBron, and it's been his first year with a major injury. So my taking him out of the top 10 players in the NBA because of that and because of everything that's going on, no, I'm not. I still think he is the best player in the NBA. I would put Kevin Durant right there, if not slightly better at this moment. But,

But, I mean, you have to look at the body of work when you're talking about it, and not just statistically and how their team is doing right now. Like, Paul George is not an overall better player than LeBron James. He is right now. He's having a better season. Right, because he's a better player right now. He's in his prime athletically, whereas LeBron James is not athletically. That's really my point.

I'm not arguing with you that LeBron James is a better player historically. I'm arguing within the context of the last four months. it's not close. It's not close. Not close. Even before he was injured, he was not moving the same defensively as he had. He's not getting by people the way he did previously. Here's Chris Broussard, agreeing more with you than he is with me earlier when I talked

about LeBron James not being among the best players on earth. I still have LeBron as the best player in the world. Here's why. I think he's earned the benefit of the doubt. He's played nine games since the injury. And you're right. He hasn't looked great. He's looked atrocious at times on defense.

But I think he, I need to see more of a sample size. If he does not get them into the playoffs and they continue losing to these bad teams, in part because of his play, then I'll give you he's not the best player in the world. It's like, we're waiting to so far after the fact, be like, yeah, you know what he's. And what he's doing is very, very human. Yes, he's been hurt, but you're also more likely to get hurt, and it's likely to last longer the older you are. You're likely to slow down some.

Like, this is all very normal stuff. I mean, look at Dwayne Wade and his contemporaries. Those guys aren't, Dwayne Wade's like the last other guy in that draft class that's even in the NBA, not named LeBron James. And there's a reason. So what he's doing for his age is extraordinary. The fact that he's in this discussion as a top 10 player is extraordinary. But the fact is, it's just part of the decision.

discussion. He's not absolutely, he's not a top five player because he's not an MVP candidate. And he's probably not a top 10 player if you look at, if you take out the last 15 years, that would be the argument. You think I'm, so, so what is it? What's the, what's the podcast called? Maybe I'm crazy. Yeah. This is a maybe I'm crazy. You sound a bit crazy. Maybe I'm crazy, but maybe he's not a top 10 player. Jason Witten left the broadcasting booth to go back to the Dallas Cowboys. That only happens for one reason. Tell you what that is next in the hurt. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. What up? Welcome in. This is The Herd wherever you may be and however you may be making us part of your day.

Thank you so much. I'm Doug Gottlie, filling in for Colin Cowherd, alongside the super talented Joy Taylor, who has no plans for the weekend. No plans. I like that. God, I just I yearn for that. No plans for the weekend. What does that feel like? Just you and Earl and just chilling? Yeah, we'll probably go to yoga. Yeah. Might go see a movie or get dinner or just show. So I coach, I know Earl has an A.U program and he does stuff in Kansas City as well

with doing stuff in Southern California. We have a program as well as I help coach my son in baseball. Like literally just with my son, he's got rain notwithstanding two basketball games Saturday. one Sunday and two baseball games Sunday. Then the girl's like, that must be amazing. That must be amazing. Amazing.

No plans. When your kids were at summer camp, you complained every day. I didn't complain. That I missed them? Yes. Oh, no, no, I missed them. I didn't want them to go to summer.

You're right. It's a good point. I fight them going to summer camp and miss them. I'm just saying it must be, it's got to be awesome to wake up on a Saturday. And trust me, I'm also Jewish. I'm allowed to complain all the time. It's part of the DNA.

But you're right. I'm not saying I want a day off all the time, but just the ability to just go like, you know, I got nothing to do. I'm here working this morning. I didn't say you don't work. I didn't say you didn't earn your weekend. You do.

And then tomorrow it's supposed to rain. Be amazing day to just go do yoga, come in, flip on some ball, watch it on Fox Sports. One, amazing day. There's always one reason behind why some things happen. right one reason behind some things happen like there has to be that one reason a couple is together and then all the sudden you see online you read online that a couple that you thought was happy is no longer together you're like somebody cheated right right there's a really really really

nice house on the market that's under the value and it hasn't been sold forever you're like Oh, somebody had to be killed in there, right? Like something bad had to have. It's got to be some sort of, it's not feng shui or feng shui? I'm going to go with feng shui. Fung shui. Fung shui. It's not like bad feng shui, which is you're not supposed to face to the west, right?

You're not supposed to, sun's not supposed to set on the front door of the house. I don't know. It's not just bad juju. There has to actually been something bad happen within that house. Maybe there's foundation issue. There's something bad there. Like you walk in, does it smell like a dead body in here? Like, I'm going to pass.

There's always one reason. And yesterday, the breaking news first was Kyler Murray is apparently 5'10 and 8th, only to be trumped. It was like we were doing news topper. Guys do this all the time, Joy. Women don't do this, where I don't think, where they play like Topper. You know, like, I once caught a fish this big. And the next guy's, I caught a fish this big. And the next guy, I got a kid's fish this big.

This is how we've gotten to 22-inch rims, right? 18-inch rims used to be the rims, then 20-inch rims, now it's 22. Pretty soon they'll give me like 70-inch rims on cars. It's a guy thing. It's got to play Topper. Even though we're all convinced, even though people will say size doesn't matter, guys, like, I don't believe that for a second. It was News Topper yesterday, right? It's like Dwayne hits a shot, then LeBron hits a shot, then Kyler Murray's 510 in an eighth.

Then, and then we had Jason Whitten, who unretires and goes back to the Dallas Cowboys. But it doesn't make any sense. Like, I get he wasn't good. There was no one who was like, Jason Whitten killing it at the new gig. But you're going to get better. You don't get progressively worse. If you're willing to take some feedback

and they were together longer, they weren't going to break up the Monday night football booth. You ask anybody at ESPN, they were caught by surprise. Like, Jason Whitten is a ring of honor, possible Hall of Fame player. I do love the fact that he was, like, now, oh, he's a Hall of Famer. Like, I don't know, I don't know if that's totally the case, Jason Witten. I think it is, but I don't know it is. Like, he was, he was never as good as Tony

Gonzalez. He wasn't, Shannon, frankly. He wasn't, I mean, you go through the litany of great tight ends. He was really, really good for a really long time, and it probably gets him into the Hall of Fame. I think it would have helped Teddy State as a broadcaster. But he's a circle of Ring of Honor guy in Dallas. He is a cowboy. He caught 63 balls two years ago. And then surprisingly, after signing a contract extension, walked away to join the Monday night football booth. And look, that is a lifetime appointment. I don't know it's only a four-year contract,

but you don't go from being in the Monday night football booth to not doing any sort of TV. And it's not your knees are fine, your back's fine, your hips is fine. There's no CET from being in a booth. Like, it's a pretty good gig. So to walk away from it to go back to the Cowboys doesn't to me signified he just missed football?

Of course he missed football. Of course you miss playing. in front of 80, 90,000 people and playing with the star in the side of your helmet, playing for the most valuable sports franchise in the United States. Like, yeah, I understand you missed it,

but did you miss it to the point of actually wanting to give up and in one of the top four gigs in television to go play 16 weekends, two preseason games, and maybe a postseason game or two in the Nashville bowling.

That only happens if there's something else to it. And I think we found the something else to it. He's the coach in waiting. When I heard it, when I read it, Schepter tweeted about it, I was like, eh. I heard Matt Mosley, who writes for the

Dallas Morning News. He said this on my radio show. Into the Cowboys locker room where he's more comfortable, and then we can see if Jason Witten becomes the future head coach of the Dallas Cowboys. I said, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. hold on. I actually think he's better off in the booth where he can meet with other teams,

watch the entire league. But he did that for a year. And now he's kind of player, coach, mentor. Remember, they got John Kitten as the quarterback coach. He used to play with Witten. They have Kellyn Moore's a new offensive coordinator. He's been the backup quarterback with Witten. And the only bright, shining star on that coaching roster is Chris Rischard, came over from Seattle and did a great job. And everyone knows he's a head coaching candidate, just not in Dallas, right? he's not a cowboy. Like he checks all the boxes of what Jerry wants. Played for the Cowboys, Star for the Cowboys,

no off the field nonsense, kind of into the Cowboy Way, went out for a year, came back, super, super loyal to the Cowboys. Like, kind of makes a lot of sense. And the Cowboys have done this before. Go back to 2013, all three coordinators. Bill Callahan, Monty Kiffin, even their special teams coordinator,

had all worked for, John Gruden. And John Gruden was the guy in waiting. And if Jason Garrett fell short, he would have been the guy. Now John Gruden's not out there. There is no other, you know, Lincoln Riley. Hell, if Lincoln Riley wanted to coach the NFL, he could have done this year. Could have done this year. Plus, Lincoln Riley's not a cowboy guy. Not a cowboy guy. And his style of offense, that doesn't fit with Dak Prescott. Whitten has a relationship with Dak,

has a relationship with guys in the locker room as players, respecting the front office, respected down the coaching staff, because those are former teammates who all know how he operates. Like, this all makes a whole lot of sense when you consider there's got to be that one reason. Right? There's always one reason why a very happy couple abruptly calls it to an end. There's always one reason that a guy wants to,

you guys ever go to lease trader or swap a lease, right? It's where you can actually, you can pick up somebody else's lease on a car. that only happens because a guy loses his job or moves has to change jobs, right? Like, that's why you get out of a lease on a car. Like, these things only happen for one reason. And the only possible explanation why you would give away a lifetime appointment, one of the four best chairs. Look, it's not the Fox one because we have the Super Bowl this year.

It's not the CBS one. That one's not open. That's why I told people Romo's never leaving. No, he's not leaving. Now, he might leave and go to another network if they don't want to pay him, but you're not leaving that big. You're not leaving in college coaching. They tell you, don't leave the best job in your league unless it's for the best job in another league.

You don't leave being an analyst on Monday Night Football to be a tight end with the Dallas Cowboys and an aging tight end. Who no one knows if you have anything left. Joy, you asked the question to start a day, and I don't know the answer to it. I don't know anybody does. Like, what's he actually going to look like in a football uniform? Right. Well, I mean, like everything you just said is why I was surprised about it. Because if you're going to choose to retire and leave the NFL and you get to go right into the Monday

night football booth, that's the gig you're doing now. Like, that's what you do now. You do Monday night football. Now, obviously, that job is much more difficult than people realize. And that's not, I don't host Monday night football. This job is not as hard as it is to host Monday night football. So I get it being overwhelming. But you've not played football for it.

year that that matters you're you're a position that gets hit from time of time that matters to me how you looked at the end of your career is kind of irrelevant you just took a year off literally we're sitting in the booth so i mean people who take a year off levy we don't know what levy on bell's going to look like a year off and he's in his athletic prime right but he's in his athletic prime right like again i'm saying like we don't know what he's going to look like people are concerned about what he's look like. And it's not that you're expecting some high level of production from from Witten, but that's more of my concern. But I don't, I agree with you. I thought that Kellen Moore was really the one who was in the pipeline for the head coaching job. If they move

out Jason Garrett, then now it's kind of looking like this is, you know what it feels like to me in a less dramatic and, you know, messed up way that the Josh McDaniel situation played out. But it kind of feels like that. Yes. It's like you took this huge position. Now, Whitney obviously did it. Downs would only come back if he had a promise, right? There's just one reason. Because it just doesn't make sense. Why would you pass up an opportunity to work with Andrew Luck at an organization that has

championships and to stay in another position unless you had some sort of guarantee? Now, obviously, Josh McDaniels handled it very poorly and we all know that. But that's kind of what it feels like to me. Like, what is, what were you told? Because for one more year? Yeah. Listen, look, this is, this happens in the NBA draft where a guy works out, all of a sudden, a guy shuts down his workout.

You only shut down your workouts after one or two workouts. If somebody said, we're going to draft you, shut it down. We promise we will take you, right? If you get a promise. And the promise, there is, you know, there's no, like nothing legally binding to that. But when you're a cowboy, and I get that it felt like maybe Kellyn Moore, the problem of Kellmore is he never played, right? Right, but he has been coaching, though.

Yes, but he never, but the having. playing I think automatically creates credibility within the locker room and I think Jerry and remember all the managers

with Jerry he played for Jerry and then I think within the locker room he played with those guys and in all fairness he was probably too fair

and too soft Calmore played with the Cowboys he was on the Cowboys I mean right but he was there like he is a Cowboy I understand one guy is a Cowboy Hall of Fame Right.

The other guy's on the team. I understand the difference, but I'm saying logically, he played for the Cowboys, and he's been he's literally been coaching, and he's going to be the offensive coordinator this year. So he is literally more qualified for this position than Jason Whitten would be if that was the decision that you were going to make.

And I'm not saying any of this is malicious. Right. Right. If this is what the Cowboys are planning, I just, to me, it would make more sense to do something, to put someone in that position who actually has the experience. Well, this is given, it's different. kinds of experience, right? Because what you do as a head coach is not what you do as a play caller. I mean, just not. I mean, really, in comparison to, I mean.

But what you do as a player is not what you do as a quarterback's coach or a play caller. No, but you do. He's been coached by enough guys. He's played long enough and now covered it. I actually think he rounded himself off pretty well. Would I prefer him to go and coach for a year or whatever? Like, I guess. But either you can or you can't. And Jerry, I believe, has determined he can do it. if you surround them with enough guys, you'll surround them with the right guys, which is what they're doing with the Kellamore and the John Kittner. Like John Kittner has never coached before, but now a sudden you get him as a quarterback coach. Why? Because he played long enough.

When you're back of quarterback, you're essentially a quarterback coach. I feel like we now know the reason, the more we stop and take a look. It doesn't make any sense to leave one of the great jobs in all of television, unless there's a promise being made. And it feels like that's what happened. More on Jason Witton returning to the Cowboys. plus why Bryce Harper might have made the wrong decision, even if it is a very, very financially beneficial one.

That upcoming next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo.

Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the head. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered.

Sports slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsClyce on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kier Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark.

Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch life becomes about wins and losses Steve Burns Dustin Ross because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth or are you a good person because you're afraid because that's two different intentions bro absolutely and that that's two different levels of trust I want you to just really be a good person Join me, Keir Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now.

What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano and our podcast Point Game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never. seen before. And he knows. Without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the

lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash will get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court, licking his fingers why he got the ball. Like, after you go through a training camp with that, I said,

you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show,

I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me, he goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue of 42. Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her.

What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clippers show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Got laid in for Colin. This is the herd. Fox Sports Radio. Fox Sports One, the IHeart Radio app, Joy Taylor, who on a new podcast, which is, I might be crazy.

One of these days, you'll get it. Maybe I'm crazy. Maybe I'm crazy. In my head, I keep fixing it to myself. I have a podcast. It's called All Ball, where we've had a lot of great guests. And this week, Nick Baugh, who works at Fox Sports One covering college basketball. We've done sit downs with a bunch of different coaches.

but you offered up how important you think it is for the NBA playoffs to have LeBron James in it, correct? It's very important, yes. Let's welcome in Tom Penn, of course, a longtime friend of ours in the show. He's the president, co-owner of LASC, that's the Los Angeles Football Club. He's also an analyst for Turner Sports used to work in the National Football League, so a well-versed guy.

I'll talk a little soccer in a second. But, like this is covering the NBA for Turner Sports, I should point out, because Turner also has soccer as well. Yep. But we're at a weird kind of place here with the Lakers where the NBA, there was the Donagee's story kind of refocused on going back like a week and a half ago with ESPN.com. They were trying to do it on the up and up. They want the Lakers to get there.

But, I mean, Tom, they're losing to bad teams. Not the good. Tonight they have a really good team. What's your thoughts on the Lakers? Well, we're in a normal place for the Lakers. We're in a really weird place for LeBron because you talk about Joey how he should be in the playoffs. he should be in the finals because he's been there eight straight years. We know we just get so accustomed to his greatness overcoming all odds.

And this one's really unusual because that team is so dysfunctional right now. They got so rattled by the adversity that they faced, whether it was injuries and or the trade talk, and he can't get through it. And he doesn't look particularly passionate or interested about getting through it. and I don't really blame him. I know you've been on him today. When you go eight straight years,

it is just, I don't know how he's still playing, let alone. That's really, so people just join the show. Tom Penn joining us, of course, Fox, NBA, I mean, excuse me, Turner NBA analyst. I think people are taking, when I say I don't think he's a top 10 player in the league currently. Like, look, I'm factoring in,

the fact that he's played in eight straight finals. He's not the same player because of, of injury this year, but also the wear and terror of it and the lack of engagement. I'm not on him as much about the engagement. I'm just viewing him as what he does at both ends. And he used to dominate at both ends. And now statistically, he's still very good on offense. But when you watch it, the movement's not the same.

And sometimes it's uncomfortable on where, you know, he doesn't know where he wants to be or that his body doesn't cooperate. His skill is probably at a higher level than it's ever been in terms of shot making. but then defensively, like he used to be kind of a Swiss Army knife where he could play anywhere. Well, he still can, but not night in night out. And there's just plays in which he just doesn't, he just takes plays off. Everybody takes plays off. But not like this.

But not like this. And I'm wondering if it's just an effort and engagement thing or this where his body is at 34 years old with all of that wear and tear. I think it's, well, look, Colin always talks about no player in history has been under this much of a microscope when it comes to analyze. and possession by possession. And you're doing it now defensively, possession by possession. Right. And he's earned that. That's why he's LeBron.

But when he takes time off like that, it's infectious. It's not like the rest of the team can cover for him. And if you had a good team dynamic where you had a guy exerting that much, Steph Curry's perfect example. Right. Steph does not guard, takes a ton of time off, gets after it when he needs to, gambles, make steals, all that sort of stuff. But the rest of that team covers for him.

And here there's no cover. It's a great point, which let's go to the warriors. They can cover for them. But it's harder now with DeMarcus cousins, right? That's not because whether there's Andro Godala or Sean Livingston, those guys' versatility, length and activity defensively. Yeah, they guard five positions. Right.

Or four and a half with staff. Yeah. Now of a sudden it's three and a half with Demandah. Marcus Cousins and even the offensive dynamic is different. The numbers aren't as good offensively or defensively. Are they better with DeMarcuscous? I think they are. They're better off having that option for sure because they can always go with

the lineup of death or whatever they call it, you know, where the five guys get out there and just wreak havoc. But to have the versatility of an offensive player like that who can also stretch the floor and shoot it and just get the other team into foul trouble, just give a completely different look, whether they finish with that look, you know, that'll be up to Steve to figure out what's going to be their best finishing lineup under pressure. All right, there's a lot of talk

on the East Coast about the Boston Celtics and their record last year they run in the NBA playoffs without Kyrie Irving. Remember they survived the Milwaukee Bucks in the first series. They got all the way to Game 7 of the Eastern Conference Finals before losing to LeBron James after beating the Philadelphia 76ers. And the record this

year, the record this year is better without Kyrie as opposed to with Kyrie playing. What are your thoughts on the Celtics chemistry issues? Hmm. Okay, this is one where I think if they're going to win it all, they need Kyrie, because they need his impossible shot making under pressure. You know, we saw how he lifted him over the Warriors with LeBron. Now, I don't think that their chemistry gets them to that point.

They're not good enough to get out of the east. They're not good enough to get to where Kyrie can make that difference. And they're not good enough in large part because of Kyrie, the regular Kyrie. In my opinion, he's so ball dominant, dribble, dribble, dribble, and the rest of these guys all get discouraged by them because they're all on the climb. And that's the other thing about Kyrie. As much of a veteran as he is, he's still on the climb. He's still achieving his greatness.

He's still looking for his own glory. And there's a competition going on there with the younger players that's just different if you were with a guy who feels like he's arrived. I'll point out something that I've seen, I've noticed, and I've talked to some of the Celtics guys, and like, does anybody realize that when Kyrie's missed, we've not played him for the most part against the non-playoff teams? The 76ers who they beat without them in the playoffs is kind of the one exception.

But take a look at this list. These are the teams that they've, it was like, wow, look at how much better they are without Kyrie. It's like, yeah, well, the Pelicans are trying to lose. The Mavericks are bad. The Cavs are bad. They beat them twice. the nets are surprisingly good, but the nets are not expected.

They're not really seeing it. The Celtics are trying to position themselves and figure themselves out against the top three other teams in the East. The rest doesn't matter. Does that change, do you think that'll change people's view of how good they actually are without Kyrie Irving, if you contextualize it with, yeah, he's not playing and they're winning more games, but they're doing it against inferior competition for the most part. Well, none of this will matter soon because we're into real games and real performance. and are they going to advance and we're going to know real quickly.

I still think they're the most talented team in the East if they get their act together. What about the Raptors? I feel like the Raptors, maybe because they're in Toronto, but they were so close and yet they kept running in LeBron. Now LeBron's not there. And they had Kauai, who he's better than DeMar Dorosin, right? For sure. For better at both ends.

It feels like we're not, and they went out and got Marcus Hall. Yeah, that's a big ad. Yeah. Yeah. They got better at two starting positions, you know, demonstrously better and two dynamic, two defensive player of the year guys. They're legit. They're, look. Why do you think Boston's better?

I think Boston's just more talented. I think they have more dynamic wing shot makers that are going to make the difference. I worry about Kyle Lowry and where he just disappears at certain moments. And he'll, he just won't even be there at game five in a series that's tied two, two. Then he'll come back and have another great game. So I like guards that are pressure-packed that are going to perform when they really need to. All right. This Sunday, you also look, the co-owner of L-AFC.

Yeah, let's talk L-AFC. Okay, so if you've ever been, if you've been to Los Angeles recently and you're driving on the 110, okay, and you drive on the one-10, on the left-hand side, you're used to seeing the Coliseum, right? And on the right-hand side, drive up a little further, and you see Staples Center. But now, instead of the Coliseum, there's this really cool, smaller stadium that's sitting right there. you're like, it looks like something out of architectural digest. It is really, really cool. You had your first season there last year,

and it was an amazing success. What has this been like to build a soccer team right in the heart of downtown L.A. in this really cool new building? Yeah, it's cool. Building the whole club from nothing, and that's Bank of California Stadium that's right next to the Coliseum. It's just been this amazing ride, and to create the culture and the community around it.

We say it's a club, not a franchise, not a team. That's the nomenclature you use in global football. Right. And part of a club is this, this expression of support. Our supporters, that's the 3252. They do that the whole game. What's the 32-552 signify. 3252 is the number of seats that are in the north end of the stadium.

That's their section. It also, if you add it up, it adds up to 12. They figured that out. We didn't. And they had six different groups unite under one umbrella name, and they named themselves the 3252. This is what happens. That's right after a goal where they'll light off the smoke.

But look, they do these TIFOs every game. They have this amazing TIFO, which is a spectacular display at the beginning of the game. It's football culture, and it's right here in the heart of the city. And it's just been like the coolest thing to help develop it. Smoke okay, fire, not okay, right? It's called Safe, safe smoke. Safe, safe, safe, safe, smoke. Like, no flares.

Just, just, just smoke. Okay, but I feel like that stadium, like it can't go under Seoul. Like, forever, L.A. did not have any good venues, right? Then Staples was, and now the forum's been redone, and that's for indoor concerts only. They got the new football stadium. The Coliseum is being redone, and then you guys kind of fit in this little niche. How big is it?

It's 22,000 seats, soccer-specific. We're rolling through some of our partners on this. Mia Hamm, Nomar Garcia, Para, Will Ferrell. They come to every game. Yeah. It's kind of become a cool thing in L.A. And it's a ton of fun. We sold out every game, and it's just the coolest scene live.

You've got to come. And I brought you a gift. You did? Yeah, I did. Because when you come, you got to, this is our secondary jersey. We just announced our new second kit that's a nod to the concrete of Los Angeles. But we got you. We got you covered.

I like that. I like that. You got to fill in a host gets his own jersey. That's pretty awesome. That's right. Because I saw a cowherd had the black one. Yeah. So I got the new...

So we just announced that one. You get that one. All right. Do you have the traffic one for the... Do you have a traffic jersey? Or do you have the special... What's the pass, the fast pass on the 110? It's the only carpool lane that costs you money in L.A. as well.

It's like a toll road within the freeway. It's really... Fast pass. Yeah. It is a fast pass. It's awesome. I can't wait to see you guys against Sporting KC. Get a win over Sporting KC this weekend.

Thanks so much for the basketball analysis as well. Hey, one other thing. If you care about this story, there's a huge documentary out right now that was just released called We Are L-A-F-C. It's on ESPN Plus. All right. Well, Brettos has gone around doing a bunch of interviews. He never comes down to Orange County. Want to do a bunch of interviews to me.

He is big time, man. He is, he is big time. I want to do taco spots in Orange County. I got some good sports. Tom Penn joining us. Of course, you can see him on Turner as well. Here's Joy Taylor with the news. No, no, no, no.

Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Billing guy got the shirt, dude. There's no Joy Taylor jersey I don't want to brush your bubble But I got one like two weeks ago I knew it I knew it The fancy black one

Yes But that's very nice though Thank you I will I'll take another one I'm always down for another jersey I'm back All right so Kevin Durant was interviewed by Carruth Burke of NBC Bay Area

And he made some comments They're starting to get some traction So to provide some context On what he said Durant was asked With your skills And what you've accomplished Do you feel the need

To build something Somewhere else? Do you need that for yourself? And Durant answered, I don't need anything in this basketball world to fulfill anything in me. The NBA is never going to fulfill me. It's going to make me feel good about all the work that I put in,

but I think those days of me wanting to prove something to anybody or walk around with a huge chip on my shoulders, not my thing. I'm more relaxed and letting these days flow. I'm the best version of me. Now, really, people are focusing on the beginning part. I don't need anything in this basketball world to fulfill anything in me because obviously the conversation about, Durant or surrounding Durant for the longest time has been,

is he ever going to surpass LeBron? Which I think is a real conversation, even though most people just dismiss it. Because I think if he wins a third championship this year, which most of us are assuming that they will, and then he leaves and says goes to somewhere like New York and wins a championship there, in the LeBron era, it has to be part of the conversation.

And a lot of people get very excited about that, but LeBron may very well not. not even make the finals with the Lakers, let alone win a championship here, which was something that kind of has to happen to close out his career. Otherwise, why wouldn't have you just stayed in Cleveland with no pressure? So I get what Kevin Durant is saying. He has had an incredible career. I don't know if I fully buy that there's nothing left for him to prove.

But maybe he feels like he's accomplished what he needs to. And now he's just playing for him. Well, I do. There's a bunch. There's a lot to unpack. here. It feels a little bit like the LeBron and I'm not chasing anything. Comment from a couple weeks ago.

I also think that KD is also coming around to the he believes, and I think he's right, that in the last two NBA finals, he was the better player being guarded by LeBron James. Like, you know, whether he had, two years ago he had a very good team and he was better. Last year, he didn't have his good a team and he was better,

whatever. He guarded me, I guarded him, and I was the better player in the second half, in the fourth quarter and I hit the big shots in game three to win both of those series. Like, that's kind of And he doesn't believe that the world reacts as they should to it. And now he's like, what am I going to do? Keep pounding my head, you know, against the wall. Why don't you see how great I am?

Even this year. Like this year, he's averaging 28, 7 and 7 having a phenomenal year. Staff's had a bad slump and then some unbelievable performances. Clay's been up and down. And yet he's pictured consistency. And he doesn't necessarily get the respect. So maybe he said like, look, forget it. I can't go and please anybody, so I'm just going to go do my thing and let it flow.

The problem with it is, it's like every week there's a different Kevin Durant narrative that he's thinking something different, you know? Right. And if this is the Kevin Durant, like, fine. The problem is he's a hyper competitive dude that wants the ball and has a killer instinct and he's having trouble with how the world feels about him. So I can't take it that seriously because he's going to change it in two weeks. I just think Kevin Durant can ever win no matter what he says.

Is that what he's saying, though? Well, I mean, he's kind of in a roundabout way being asked about free agency. That's really kind of what's being asked here. Like, do you feel like you need to go build something somewhere else? It's like a roundabout way of asking him if he's going to leave. And he can't answer that. If he stayed in Oklahoma City and never won a championship, that would have been a knock on him. He went to the Warriors.

They already won a championship and had a great team. So that's a knock on him. If he leaves to New York, they're going to talk about how he can't commit to anything. So that's going to be a knock on. He can't win no matter what. So he might as well just play for him. just continue being great, which he is. And if you're arguing about LeBron not being in the top 10 players in the league right now,

which I disagree with, then you'd have to put Kevin Durant, number one. Would you put him in the top five players this year in the league? LeBron? Yes. Yes. I'm going to give him that, yes. You're going to take out James Harden? I mean.

You're going to take out Janus? you're going to I mean you're going to take out Kevin Duran No I think it's between LeBron and Kevin Duran As in the top five Yeah I'm not just going to dismiss what happens last year Like people have up and down the years

This has been an insane year for LeBron And this is his first major injury Like we wouldn't Would you say if Duran had an injury That he wasn't in the top 10 players in the NBA If he was like struggling to come back And they were having some issues with the team No

Um My thing is I don't think LeBron looked like peak LeBron for at least half of the first part of the season. No. Some of that was assimilating to a new team, but some of that is I just think he's 34 with a, we're like, we're not reasonable about the fact that he's aged. Yeah, and I think maybe all of our expectations were out of control with the situation. So speaking of LeBron, Anthony Davis was involved in that huge trade saga with the Lakers and his new show,

the shop, which airs tonight at 10.30 p.m. on HBO in his new show, LeBron compared Antonio Brown's situation with the Steelers to Anthony Davises in New Orleans. Been in the league. This show was your seventh year? Seven years in the league. Nobody's ever said anything. No media, not a fan, not a, not a, not a, not a, not nobody has ever said anything negative about AD. But you can tell when a narrative change, when you don't do what they want you to do. I do get your point about the middle of the season, and I do think that this whole thing went very badly for a lot of different reasons,

and it was very aggressive, and the Pelicans clearly, well, allegedly, but everyone was kind of assuming all those trade leaks came from the Pelicans because it helped the Lakers in no way that every time something was offered, it immediately went public. But I do think that fans can turn on players, but I don't like when the organizations do, because there's this idea of loyalty, that exist in professional sports, and it's just an idea.

It's not reality. Organizations don't have any reason, really, to be loyal to players. They don't have an obligation to be loyal to players. They don't, but listen, the Orleans Pelicans, and look, it's not a perfectly run organization, and I'm not giving them a pass. They've screwed a lot of things up. But the North's Pelicans were willing to offer them $250 million guaranteed this upcoming offseason to be the highest paid player in the history of the national

basketball association. As opposed to doing what? That's their sign of loyalty. The loyalty is like, look, we'll give you whatever you want to stay here. And he said no. Right, but they're not limiting it just to Anthony Davis. Like, they're talking about Antonio Brown's situation. And basically they're saying that

what they're discussing on the shop is that whenever you try to take your career into your own hands, people sort of turn on you and it starts to become this campaign against your character as opposed of you just trying to take control of your career. Do you think do you think that Antonio Brown has handled himself appropriately?

I don't think he's been perfect, but I also don't think it's entirely Antonio Brown's fault what happened with the Steelers. I think it's on Ben Rathesberger. I think it's on Tomlin. I think it's clearly on the GM. I think there's plenty of blame to pass around there. I understand.

But to not show up to work in the final week of the season. No, no, no, no. This is a very important point that LeBron needs to understand. He says he wants to own an NBA team. Michael Jordan owns an NBA team. They're not the highest spending NBA team. They are not a free agent destination. Because when you own a team, you understand that you know what's unacceptable? When you're under contract for a year and a half, okay? And they probably would have had to trade him this upcoming office. A year and a half. And your agent starts leaking stuff out and demanding a trade in the middle of the season.

Like, look, dude, you're putting us in an impossible situation. And when you have employees that decide They're not going to show up to work when you're in Pittsburgh or when they're going to tell you with a year and a half left in your contract that they want out, please don't tell me about ownership being disloyal. All we can do is sign you up to a contract and try and fulfill your every need. And when you're done with that contract, do you want to leave, you can do so. It's just more about the attack of character. Like if this was any other business, any other business, we would not talk about it the way that we would. But it's not any other business.

All right. All right. All right. All right. All right, we'll move on. So the doctors will reevaluate this brain ankle of Lonzo ball in one week, according to Shams. He's missed the Lakers' last 14 games, and they've gone five and nine during that stretch. And LeBron discussed why his absence has had an impact on the team.

He said we obviously miss another ball handler, another playmaker, a guy that's very, very good defensively with his ability to get a steal and pressure the offensive point guard and then push the pace for us, get into our early offense. So we missed that a lot. Lonzo is missed defensively, and as far as the pace goes, for the Lakers. And this is the biggest part of this whole Lakers season to me that I think is being overlooked because it's not as fun to discuss because there's really nothing you can do about it. But the injuries that they've had this year have been devastating.

Lonzo, Rondo, obviously LeBron, Kuzma's been out here and there. So, I mean, I don't know what you could do when you lose three starters. And really, it's kind of amazing they've been able to maintain where they are in the standings with having three of their starts consistently out. I would agree with you. I think there's some flaws in the roster. but I also think it undersells the importance of Lanzobal, but also how Lanzobal hides the fact that LeBron has aged some defensively

and can't dominate a game of the defense and on the floor, much the way he's alleged to have going back four or five years ago. That's Joy Taylor with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lye News. Jason Witton's going back to the Cowboys. Wait to hear our list of guys we'd rather have played tight end for the Cowboys.

That's next in The Herd. One more herd. The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Doug Gottlieb in for calling. This is The Herd, part of the best for last. So Jason Witton's coming back to playing football. And we're not that fired up about it.

Not that Jason Winton wasn't awesome, but again, bother time, undefeated year away. Plus, you feel like Blake Jarwin, to walk on Oklahoma State, kind of made his way. Like, hey, Blake Jarwood, move his side. So we thought, all right, if there were better options out there, who would it be? So, Joy, we have five players. We'd rather see play tight end for the Dallas Cowboys. Ready for it?

All right, number five. LeBron James. First team, Allstate wide receiver is a sophomore. As a junior, he had 1160 yards receiving 1,600 yards, been recruited by Irmaier. is 6 foot 8, 250 pounds. And while he doesn't run the same on a basketball floor as he used to at 34 years old, on a football field, you don't have to run that well. Antonio Gates, you know, ran like he was dragging a dead body last year,

still caught 28 balls for the charger. And to anybody says, LeBron wouldn't want to get hit. No one wants to get hit. No. Well, I'm kind of with you because Witten has had a year off, so. The one downside would be worried about the groin injury. That's about it. Otherwise, I'm going to take LeBron James ahead of Jason Whit.

All right, number four. Tim Tebow. All right, Tim Tebow. Like, look, he's still in very, very good shape. He's obviously super competitive. He's a winning quarterback at Florida, but he ran the football. I don't know if he would, he never wanted to switch positions, but his baseball thing might not work out.

Put him a tight end for the Dallas Cowboys. Jerry'd love him. Fans would love him. He's a winner. He'd give great speeches as well. Really good speeches that would really energize guys. Again, doesn't want to change positions. All right.

Shannon Sharp. Three times Super Bowl champion, Hall of Famer. When he retired, he was the all-time leader in receptions, receiving yards and receiving T-Ds for a tight end. He's 50 years old in age only. I'm not sure if you're seeing it. Do we have the picture of him with his shirt off? This is like, dude, he's the after picture.

any workout video. He has been on the Miles and Yack, though, for quite some time. I mean, I would go with Witten and over Shannon. I want that. He's only had a year off. But that's interesting. Shannon Sharp. All right.

Number two. Tony Gonzalez. Tony Gonzalez. Just elected the Hall of Fame, all-time leader in tight-end receiving yards. Those are receptions. Second most NFL history behind Jerry Rice. Also still in crazy good shape. Now, he's not on the hen and the year.

Gack. He's on Madello, right? He's a medello guy, isn't he? Yes, he is a Madello guy. Tony's still very... Tony got tired of... He got bored of playing. He wasn't not good. He got bored of play. And number one, the one guy we would much rather see play tight end than Jason Witton would be

this guy. Zion Williamson. There are concerns that if you heard his knee, he might shut it down for his season. But Zion is 6-6-2-80 unbelievable shape watch him throw this football it doesn't even land it actually went to the moon

crazy athlete 38-inch vertically it went to the middle like it's crazy the form's not great but the result is to ask yourself honestly would you rather see Zion Williamson play tight end for the Cowboys or

Jason Witten Jason Winn because I want to see Zion Williamson in the NBA and I don't think that would last very long I actually don't think that Jason Witten is going to be bad. No. I mean, he had 560 receiving yards and five touchdowns the last year that he played. Yeah.

But I'm just concerned about, you know, he hasn't played in a year. Well, I just think, look, any of these guys, they can come back for one game or five games, but then you start to kind of wear down as you get older, it's harder to recuperate. But, yeah, you know, against zones and he has all the guile. I just think, man, you really gave up that chair on Monday night football. You just gave it up after one year. That's a big chair to give up. I hope there was a promise to becoming the head coach.

Joy's got nothing, no plans this weekend. None, zero. I got a bunch of coaching and cheering to do. Colin is back on Monday. I'm sure he will completely crush the idea that LeBron's not currently playing like a top 10 player in the NBA. That may change tonight. We'll see him against Janus at Staples Center. As the Lakers had to play their way into the NBA playoffs.

We'll see the court will tell the tale. I'm Doug Gottlieb. Have a great weekend. This is The Hurt. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in.

I'm Timbo. In every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headlines. And we're going straight to the source the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to SportsSlicse on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

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