The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Jon Gruden, Rodgers-Brady, Browns, & the Blazing 5

Episode Date: November 2, 2018

Colin discusses the continued failure of Oakland Raiders HC Jon Gruden, the Aaron Rodgers-Tom Brady match up this weekend, why the Cleveland Browns should've listened to former HC Hue Jackson, and the Blazing 5. Guests include Greg Jennings, Peter King, T. J. Houshmandzadeh, and Rob Parker. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. In every episode, we're cutting through the noise,

breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headlines. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite.

Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an acapella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What?

Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, Wreck, my mama want you to weigh better. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, fam?

It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season, and I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was harmed. You just understood. That's how personal it got.

Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis come until he's like, you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening to The Heard podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1.

Find your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the Iheart Radio app by searching herd. Now let's get this party started. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Ah, this is the herd on a Friday, wherever you may be and however you may be listening live in Los Angeles,

Iheart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS1, blazing five, one hour from now, sports gambling is legal in America. The Supreme Court said, please get your coins, your cryptocurrency, one hour from now, blazing five picks. It's a week with a lot of movement on the lines.

I generally don't go after the biggest games, but the biggest games are the one I like this week. Joy Taylor is joining me on a Friday. Good morning. Good morning to you. This is usually on Friday. We tried to talk about the game last night. Of course, it was a blowout, but that doesn't mean it's not interesting. So let's start with something we predicted before the season started that John Gruden and the Raiders would not work.

John Gruden is great at selling himself. He is. And that is a skill. That is a skill. That's why he's a TV star. If you watch Monday Night Football this year, they could use him. And he's missed. Most great football coaches in NFL history are not great at selling themselves. Chuck Knoll of the Steelers was not. Tom Landry of the Cowboys was not. Bill Walsh, Belichick, Parcells, Paul Brown.

They were not television stars. Bill Walsh was actually, the late Bill Walsh, was kind of bad on television. Through the sheer force of personality, John Gruden has sold himself as the quarterback whisperer. He's had 12. One popped Rich Gannon. If you go one for 12, I'm probably going to give the player more of the credit, Rich Gannon.

than the coach, John Gruden. I did think it was interesting and ironic last night that Kyle Shanahan, a guy who does not sell himself, who is the actual quarterback whisperer, took a guy none of us, myself included, had ever heard of, and won a game in a route over a former pro bowler, Derek Carr. But Kyle Shanahan does not sell himself. He doesn't talk.

He's kind of rigid. He's a football guy through and through. Last night, John Gruden is not only not the quarterback whisperer. He was the second best quarterback coach in the Bay Area. Nick Mullins, no idea. Chris Mullins, I know. Nick Mullins, no idea. Looked brilliant.

By the way, Dick Vital and John Gruden have something in common. They're both better on TV than they were coaching their sport. Vital like Gruden is an amazing, amazing marketer. He is the biggest name in college basketball, or at least was for 20 years. That's not a criticism. Dick was great at selling himself. Chuck Daly wasn't. Greg Popovich isn't. Brad Stevens doesn't. Bill Self, not so much. It is a skill to sell yourself. By the way, the guy in the White House right, right now, got there on sheer power of personality, not policy. It's a skill.

And Gruden, Vital, Trump, they're great at it. There's an energy. There's this sort of just knocks you the wind out of you. But Kyle Shanahan last night was facing the quarterback whisper. Kyle Shanahan made RG3 the rookie of the year. He left him. He was a bust. he made Matt Shab a pro bowler.

He made Matt Ryan the MVP for about an hour. People were saying, you know, Matt Ryan's better than Aaron Rogers. They're neck and neck. No, no, they're not neck and neck. And by the way, Brian Hoyer with Kyle Shanahan had a winning record. Let me finish the sentence. In Cleveland, we had a quarterback whisperer on display last night, but he does not sell himself. and Derek Carr is now officially a better quarterback with defensive-minded Jack Del Rio

than with that quarterback whisper guy. But again, I get why Gruden was a TV star. Money Net Football, they miss him. I get why I was glued to that quarterback camp thing he did at the SPN. I get why he got this job. I get why owners and GMs for years offered him gigs. I saw that interview with Howie Long. It jumps through the television set.

Watch. I got a cell phone just like you and everybody else. And I get a lot of phone calls from people that are dying to come and play here. I'm just telling you, they're dying to play for the Raiders. He's Tony Robbins with a whistle. I'm sitting there. I'm like, eh, I wish I could laugh. I want to play for the Raiders.

He sounded a little bit presidential there, didn't he? Trump. It is the very best. Gruden. We have the best organization. Amazing. Trust me. Terrible.

The very best. Great. Everyone's dying to come here. It is. That's what he does. What he won a Super Bowl? Sometimes things line up. Mike Ditko want a Super Bowl.

Barry Switzer won a Super Bowl. And John Gruden with Tony Dungey's defensive personnel on a Super Bowl. But I never bought into this move because I thought Gruden was a great television star. and an average coach who'd never really proven he can build anything. Chris Carter was on first things first this morning. I'm not saying he can't coach, but the idea that he's ever proven he can go in and rebuild a mess, I've never seen it.

I don't believe John Gru knows how to build a champion. When he won a championship, he did that with Tony Dungey and what Tony Dungey had built. So I don't believe John knows how to build champion. He's going about it the wrong way. And I know, I know this is common right now to, to not necessarily speak the truth or just make stuff up and just lie. But that's what John Gruden was doing. When he sat down with Howie Long and he told him that lie that people are calling him, people are ringing off his phone, that's a blatant lie. Maybe I won't go that far,

but I'll say it again. The qualities that make you a great TV star are generally the opposite. of the qualities that make you a great football coach. And let's shift gears to this. This weekend, we are going to watch the two best quarterbacks in the NFL, along with Drew Brees. Aaron Rogers and Tom Brady will play this weekend. It will be magnificent. It will be in Foxborough.

It will be Sunday night. I will be glued to my television set. Earlier in the week, Tom Brady talked about how great Aaron Rogers is. Very classy of Aaron Rogers yesterday to talk about how great Tom Brady was. He said, quote, he's able to make subtle movements, his entire career to create space. It's an innate sense. Tom's always been great with his eyes, able to manipulate defenders, move them out of the way. Lanes.

He and Brett are the two best I've seen on film. That was nice of Aaron to do. He's a smart guy. He gets the game. A lot of you think I don't like Aaron Rogers. Aaron Rogers doesn't think I like him. I do. I put Aaron Rogers in a very interesting class with LeBron, James, and Andrew Luck. What if? What if LeBron first seven years had an owner and a GM that could have gotten him other good players?

What if Andrew Luck's first six years in Indianapolis weren't marked by utter chaos? What if Aaron Rogers was given great defenses or had Belichick? being a legend is about a marriage. Michael Jordan didn't win squat without Pippin and Phil Jackson. And Kobe never won anything without Phil, Gassal, or Shaq. Brady's got Belichick, Sean Peyton's got Breeze. Tiger Woods had the right golf coach in his prime. Bill Russell had R-back.

Jeter and Mariano not only had Tori, but they had the Yankee brand. it's much easier to get saves when you lead going into the ninth. You wouldn't have in that era with the Pirates or Royals. I am never disappointed in Aaron Rogers. I'm disappointed for Aaron Rogers. What if he had Belichick? What if, like Big Ben, he had Lavian Bell behind him? What if, like Jared Gough, he was in a free agent-friendly marketing,

What if, like Drew Brees, he had an offensive genius? This weekend, Tom Brady and Aaron Rogers will play. Probably for the last time. You've been cheated. I've been cheated. And most of all, Aaron Rogers has been cheated. In 45 minutes from now, Blazing 5, coming up next, the comment so honest, they'll make you mad.

They'll make you upset when I simply read them. In Los Angeles, it's a Friday, and it's the herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. Great NFL weekend. Ram Saints. Greg Jennings around the corner, Patriots Packers, man, Sunday, depending on what coast you live on or where you live at about 1 o'clock my time, 4 o'clock Eastern. You got Rams Saints and you're going to have Patriots Packers. It's just going to be an incredible night of NFL football.

A couple of big college football games tomorrow. We'll talk about that next hour. Ben Shapiro is a political pundit. He's a conservative. He has a great line. He said, I don't care if my facts get in the way of your feet. I think it's a funny line and it's accurate. I'm going to say something and I'm sorry if it hurts your feelings, but it's a fact.

Hugh Jackson came out yesterday and did some talking and he talked about he was fired and he said in Cleveland, quote, we passed on three franchise quarterbacks in my first two years, Wentz, Watson, and Mahomes. There's no way that should have happened. You do not pass in a potential franchise quarterback. You just don't know what he's going to be in the future. here's the facts. I was told last year

and the year before that Hugh Jackson did want Wentz and he did want Patrick Mahomes. Excuse me. He wanted Wentz and Deshawn Watson. I can't through a source verified that he wanted Patrick Mahomes. That I don't know.

But two people I trust before the draft told me Hugh Jackson wants whence. Cleveland passed. Hugh Jackson wanted Deshawn Watson and Cleveland passed. I'm sorry if you don't like Hugh. I'm sorry if you're a Brown fan and you think this was the right move.

That's a fact. Hugh Jackson wanted Wence and would not have gone Owen 16 with Wence and he wanted Deshaun Watson. I can't. I cannot through my sources verify them a Holmes thing. He could be telling the truth. I just can't prove it. But the other ones, and I set it on the air with Wins a couple of years,

years ago. Hugh Jackson wanted him. He also said this, and again, sorry if this hurts your feelings, you'll have to put down the pom-poms if you live in Ohio. Did you hear what he said about Baker Mayfield? He said, I think Baker Mayfield's going to be a sensational player if they surround him with the right people, but they've got to give him help and run a scheme suited to a skill set. Now, on its surface, it doesn't seem like much, but there are some key words here that nobody is mentioning. I think He's going to be sensational if they surround him with the right people, give him help to run a scheme suited to a skill set. Nobody says that about Tom Hanks or DiCaprio. You know, I think if we give Tom this role, if we get him the right people and, you know, we get him help so it's suited to it.

You know, Tom Hanks is a movie star. He makes it work. Nobody ever said that about Carson Wentz, John Elway, Andrew Luck. They're ballers. They look and play like number one picks. If you walked in to a general manager as a regional scout and you tried to make an argument for a number one pick, you would be laughed out of a room if you said, listen, I think this kid, if we surround him with the right people.

and we do a scheme suited to his skill set could be really good. You know what you're describing? A fourth round pick, a third round pick. Hugh Jackson yesterday told the truth is that he wanted Wence and Deshaun Watson, and they wouldn't listen to him. And from those words, he is telling you exactly the truth, what I was told from various scouts on Baker. It's a lot of, I think, if, right, people, help, skill suited to certain things.

That is not a number one pick. I'll give Ben Shapiro credit again. Sorry of my facts. Hurt your feelings. But Hugh's right. But in the culture we live in America in 2018, it's much easier to go to the interweb, Twitter, Instagram, and bash the unemployed, and hammer the recently fired.

and crush those who are unpopular. Today, Hugh Jackson is an easy guy to take the anvil out on. Fired, bitter, and accurate. You know, his comments. Joy Taylor with the news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news.

Yeah, they went with Miles Garrett and Corey Coleman. Those were just different choices. I mean, Miles Garrett is a very good player, but it's just like your rake analogy, your wife sends you to the store to get milk and eggs and you come back with a rake. I say it's great value. It's a beautiful rake. It's the best rake available. But we need milk and eggs. And they need it a quarterback.

And it bags the leaves simultaneously. But it's just not what we need right now. All right. So the NFL's offensive explosion to the first half of the season has brought us almost video game numbers. However, some believe this high-flying brand of football is reversible, and one of those people is Todd Bowles, who told the New York Daily News, it'll change back. It'll recycle itself.

Probably not in my coaching career, but it will recycle itself. It only takes one team to have success doing that. It's a copycat league, so everyone will follow suit. Eventually, in the next 10 years, I expect that to go back. You know, he's right. But now, what's going to happen, Joy, it won't go back summarily in the league for everybody, But what will happen is you will get a great running back who is just one of these Adrian Peterson kind of guys.

By the way, this could be Gurley. And he's going to have, he's going to be on a right team, and they're going to win. And people are going to go, you know, the running game. Now, I'm not saying the league's going to dictate based on rules. Right. But his point is, and he's Todd Bowles, that's why I say, the best coach in the league with a losing record. His point is, this league has always swung way too far in one direction. and way too far in the air. And now we've gotten to the point where, like, running, who needs to?

You watch the L.A. Rams this weekend? You know what the L.A. Rams are? They're a power running football team. I've never bought into the idea that running backs are interchangeable, really. Although the Steelers kind of, we'll get to that in a second. But, I mean, in general, though, if you have a skill, if you have a running game, it only expands your offense. That makes your offense great.

Yes. You're dynamic. You're able to run the ball and you're able to throw it. If you're a one-dimensional offense, then you're beatable. So to me, the idea that the running game is dead doesn't really make any sense anyway. But I think more to what people are going to push back on this is, I don't think it's going to swing back as far as people getting sick of offense.

No, nor will quarterbacks lose value. But we will, by the way, the Redskins with Adrian Peterson lead their division, the Rams with Todd Gurley lead their division, the Saints with two running backs lead their division, is that this league. tends to swing too far either way. And by the way, if the Giants got the quarterback situation right, then we pay more

attention to Saquan Barkley, but right now we're ignoring him because the quarterback's wrong. You still have to get the quarterback right's job number one. But let me tell you something. Don't kid yourself. If Big Ben didn't have Connor or Lavin Bell, he would be under siege. Yeah, that's more to my point. I

don't think that the level of scoring is something that's going to swing back. People are going to, people have already embraced and shown that this is the way to go. But having a running game, important. And to his point, I think people are going to now possibly overvalue receivers and then that's when it's going to become a copy. And get burned. Yes, because somebody's going to

miss on the next great, the next Adrian Peterson, the next Levion Bell, David Johnson, whatever, have you. And then that's going to swing back. That position, I think, is what is going to swing. So it's time for the real deal, brought to you by Carl's Jr. and Hardee's. And this week's matchup between Aaron Rogers and Tom Brady is the real deal. Everyone's

very excited. We've been talking about it all week. Although I think the game has a little bit of lopsiedness based off of the Packers lost last week, but it's still an exciting matchup. You know who else is excited? Favre. This is an epic matchup. But, you know, from a fan standpoint, this is what you look forward to seeing.

Bird and Magic Johnson. A great pitcher against a great hitter. This is one of those games that, you know, the ratings will be sky high, and rightfully so. Both quarterbacks are as good as any that's ever played the game. in totally different in style. I don't know who I give the nod to or the advantage to. Both teams

I'm sure and both fan bases love their chances. I'm going to give the nod to the Patriots in this spot, but this is the second and it could be the last meeting of Rogers and Brady. It feels like it. Well, unless they play in a Super Bowl, they won't play again until 2022 in Green Bay

when Brady would be 45 and Rogers would be 39 or 40 depending on when the game is played in that year. I wonder who will be in the White House by then. You know what? It's anyone's guess at this point. It could be any of us. That's pretty crazy, though.

Like, it's a little bit of a, you know, Pachial Maeweather. Like, thankfully we got this while they're in their prime. Yeah, I was driving to work this morning just thinking about stuff and I'm like, you know, this is probably it. This is probably the last time we see the Ali Frazier of their generation. This is it. We've got to see Manning and Brady a lot. To me, like, that's why

the way the game ended with the Rams last week is kind of more of a it just sings a little bit extra. Like you'd love to see Aaron Rogers in that two-minute drill, even if they had lost. Like, you'd love to have seen that and then ride into this week. And now I just feel like the momentum is with the Patriots.

But everyone's going to be watching? It's very interesting. And finally, Baltimore's defensive coordinator, Wink Martindale, is not impressed with Levyon Bell's tactic to become a high roller. He took some digs at Bell yesterday when he was asked about the team's preparation to face a Steelers' offense without Leveon.

I think it's like since 2015, you know, if you look at their stats, there's a lot of stats in different categories that the Steelers are actually better without it. You know, they're better in those categories since 2015 without Levion. So that might be why he's riding a jet ski down in Miami right now. I don't know. That's funny. I mean, you can chew his job. But if you look at the numbers that he's talking about, he's kind of right. Now, I still don't believe that they're necessarily better without Levion.

I think James Conner's done an amazing job, obviously, and he's earned himself some money. If Levion is not there next year, he'll likely be the starter. But I just think Levion is, it's kind of like what happened with Kauai Leonard. Like, everyone kind of forgot because he wasn't around. And obviously he's not injured, but he's just not there. It's like out of sight, out of mind. Levyon Bell is one or two top running backs in the league. But there is something to be said here, Joy, and I think it's a real thing.

And what I'm about to say works in all businesses. When you do work with, I would call higher maintenance stars, there are times you do feel a pressure to feed them constantly. Feed Odell Beckham. Sure. Yeah. Or does Ryan. You feel like, and Labian's one of those.

I want the ball in the huddle at the line. And do you as a team overfeed the noisy player to the depth? to the detriment of the team. And I've seen this in basketball. I've seen it in football. So you can make the argument that they're more balanced without Levian and they don't feel a need or a burden

to give Levian the touches. I've always felt that Eli, I mean, he'll go into games. I saw this with Romo and Des. It felt like the first quarter, I got to get Des involved. I got to get debt, because if I don't... Well, when you have a high profile receiver like that,

they like to get a few... A rhythm. They like to get going. Yeah. It's the same with... turning backs too. It's hard to put them in cold to get them going. But I don't know. I just, I get the numbers, but I just, and it's no disrespect to James Conner, like I said. It's just, it's letting him out. Like, there's a reason why he's holding out for all this money.

Joy Taylor with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd Lie News. What a show today. In 30 minutes from now, the Blazing Five, which has been on fire. Peter King next hour. But let's bring on a man who I always, enjoy a good battle. And he's a pro bowler and a Super Bowl champ and a former Packer and Aaron Sunday night. Greg Jennings, you are a straight shooter. So I said there have been, there's been some what if guys in the last several years in sports.

What if LeBron's first seven years in Cleveland, they got him one all-star? What if Andrew Luck wasn't under siege for his first seven years? Now he's got support. What if Aaron Rogers had Sean Payton or Belichick? He's one of those guys deep down. You're as honest as anybody I bring on. You cannot tell me that Aaron Rogers hasn't thought, what if, a couple of times. We all think what if, but absolutely he's thought what if.

No doubt in my mind that Aaron Rogers just thought, man, if I had Belichick, I would have won. I don't know. I think it's limitless, really. it's one of those things where you look at and I've heard this well Aaron Rogers' personality wouldn't mesh with Belichick I 100% disagree with that

because I don't think he and Mike McCarthy's personalities just meshed Oh no I think they're opposite because you got to understand when Aaron Rogers came into the league when Tom Brady came into the league they both came in with chips on their shoulder

like why they both felt like they should have been drafted higher they both felt more about themselves than what obviously the evaluators and the GMs thought. The thing about Aaron Rogers and Mike McCarthy that people miss sometimes

who was the number one overall pick the year Aaron Rogers came out? Alex Smith. Alex Smith. Who was his offensive coordinator? Mike McCarthy. Mike McCarthy. So Mike McCarthy.

Mike McCarthy had something to do, obviously. With selecting Alex over Aaron. And so Aaron, I remember being in meetings, and it would just be so random. And Aaron will take a shot at Mike, like, oh, yeah, like how you picked Alex Smith. Yeah, yeah, okay. Like, I mean, that's just, so when you look at that relationship and it's always been a little frosty. Exactly.

So, and I think Belichick, with Aaron understanding the respect that he would demand, he would, he would give him that and he would he would kind of pull back because of winning you think Tom Brady doesn't have an ego he does you think he doesn't have a he does but winning will suppress some of those things it's like you know what let me let me fall back because we're going to win I know I know if there's one thing I can trust this guy to do

is win no I think you bring up a great point is that here's something I know about Aaron and I don't know Aaron, I've met him. He cares what people think. So he does. You'll never get a chance to really sit down to me there. No. He doesn't like you.

He doesn't like me. That's okay. That's okay. A lot of people don't like me. It's okay. He's not going to come on the couch. No, he's not coming on the show. He's not going to be. He doesn't like me.

I'm totally, I'm really okay with it. Like I said this morning, he's great. I think he can be a little thin skinned, a little Kevin Durant. When you get to be a superstar, you're not married, no, kids, you go home, buy yourself in Green Bay, you turn on TV on your phone, and sometimes you can get conspiratorial. And I've noticed, I've noticed this in my business. I've noticed it in sports.

Once you have kids, you're married, your stuff, you're busy, you're off the phone, you're not, you're time. You're just busy as hell. So, and I think Aaron sometimes cooks up some stuff and worries too much about what people think. But he does care what people think. And I think that's not a terrible quality in human beings. And I think that has given him more than time to pause and think, God,

What if? They've given him one great defense. It's the year he won the Super Bowl. They've given him no running game for four years. Here's another thing that I think a lot of people miss. When you look at Mike McCarthy and Bill Belichick, Bill Belichick has been given the option, or not the option, but the authority to where he can make personnel decisions. Yes.

Mike McCarthy, he's not making personnel decisions. So you have a different dynamic with both of those guys, and they've seen it differently because they've had to handle things differently. They've had to where Belichick can put the pieces he want in place. Yes. McCarthy has never had that as an option. You know the other thing, and I'm guessing here, I don't have this sourced. But I just, you know Aaron and I don't.

So is that now Aaron signed this huge deal. And Aaron again, he, and this is not a bad quality. It's just, it's the reality of being 35, a super, superstar in America, not married, no kids. You know, you're watching more TV. You're on the phone, probably a little more. Is that now that he signed a big television, a big contract? It's basically a television contract.

Well, it is really in the NFL. So he signs this big contract, and we're all talking about the contract. And he goes out Sunday and loses, and you're like, well, you know, Tom takes pay codes. I mean, Aaron's the highest pay. Aaron doesn't need to win to prove me anything. but I do think Aaron senses the if I start not winning my division with this contract people are going to say we can't afford anybody

because of Aaron's contract. It's not spoken about but I think Aaron's too smart he thinks about everything. Aaron thinks about everything. I think he's got that up there thinking if I start finishing second and third in my division my contract's going to become a topic. Well I think every player thinks like that

anytime a guy gets paid, especially when they're the top at their position or the top in the league in this case, you don't want your play to drop and you don't want your overall team's performance to drop because you're going to take the blame regardless. It's going to be, look at O'Dell Beckham. Like it's going, he's having a good, a good year. Yeah. But the Giants are poor and it's like, well, he's making all this money.

Why aren't they better? Well, it's only so much he can do. it's in Aaron Rogers position at the quarterback position, it's a lot more that you could do. We've seen it with Flacco over in Baltimore where he decided, no, give back that brink's truck up to me. And by the way, they didn't have a tied end and a good receiver for four years after that. And then they struggled.

Because they couldn't afford permanent players. They couldn't afford anybody. So I just think it's some. All right, two topics here. I predicted before the season, I said, great television stars Dick Vital, Gruden, don't generally have the personalities to be great coaches. And, you know, Gruden caught Tony Dungy's team,

Barry Switzer caught Jimmy Johnson's, Dicka, Buddy Ryan. There are times when things line up, you win a Super Bowl, you write a book, you're a star. But to me, Gruden's a TV star, and that magnetic energy, I think, falls flat very quickly with players. I never bought into this Oakland thing. I just, I mean, that's my takeaway. He's built for TV, actually.

You watch Monday Night Football this year. They miss Gruden. That's not a shot in anybody. They miss him. I think he's more built for television, where I thought he was an amazing analyst. I don't think he's built for the new NFL. Why do you think he's struggling? Well, when you look at TV, you have to be entertaining.

You have to do something. You have to act. You have to portray this persona perception. You have to be big. You have to be loud. You have to be obnoxious at times. You have to be unlikeable. Like all these things.

In the locker room, I don't want any of that. I want what's real. And what's real is not what we saw, even in the snippet bit sit down that we saw with Howie Long, one of our own. Like, there they did us. Like, what? If all these guys want to be here, if you're getting all these guys, the trade deadline when that was going on was still in a fact, like you can still, let's go get them. Let's bring them in here. And I just don't see it.

Last night. that that just looked like i mean every time they showed him on the sideline it was it just looked like he was he was in it by himself like dude your your buyer's even when derrick car would stand next to him there was really no like engagement it was kind of like by the way it's a very smart comment by you it was kind of like yeah okay this is what i said about matt patricia week one matt patricia may have been on a sideline matt patricia was by himself yes bellichick's Belichick is talking to people. Always.

Always people. Last night, John Gruden was on an island. He, it was like. So if I can see that, if I see that, and you see that, what's the room like? I just, there is no way. There is no way that you can tell me the players in that locker room trust John Gruden right now. If there is no trust, I'm not going to give you everything that I got. I can't because I don't know if that's.

even going to be enough. Are you giving me everything that you got? Are you giving me what's real? But you want me to give poor all of me to you but you're giving me this fake phony something substance. I don't want that. Just be who you are.

Finally, Hugh Jackson I defended him this morning. I was told by somebody I trust. He did want Carson Wentz and he did want Deshawn Watson. And he did want Deshawn Watson. and he said that, nobody wants to hear it.

I have, I said this last year, he wanted Carson Wentz, and he wouldn't go old and 16 without him, and he wouldn't have Baker Mayfield. So we're all crushing Hugh today, and I'm not saying he's Belichick or Sean Peyton. You just think he's bitter? He's definitely bitter. Have you ever been bitter?

Of course I've been bitter. When things happen to you, and you get a microphone and a camera in your face, you're going to say things that you, emotionally, feelings, everything is going to come out. When I left Green Bay... Was I bitter? Absolutely, I was bitter.

I wanted to stay. Hugh Jackson wanted to still be coaching his team right now, but he's not. And so when I left, of course, now what I said, was it true? Absolutely, 100%. Truth. Should I have said it? What did you say? I said that Aaron Rogers wasn't the leader that everybody thinks that he is.

He's sensitive. All these things. all these things that are true, but it wasn't the fact that it was true. It was, why are you saying it now? Because I would have never said it when I was in the locker room if a reporter asked me a question about Aaron Rogers. Absolutely not.

I would have deflected it. No, he's great, man. He's a great teammate. But you were better. I was bitter. And for more reasons, because I felt like other things had transpired, that I'm not going to get into.

Today isn't the day. one of these days we're going to sit right here and I'm just going to share. There's no day like today, Greg. There is a day like today. We just haven't experienced it, Joy. No time like the present. I never knew you to be bitter. You're so likable and fun.

I knew you when you were a packer. I used to tell people all the time at the other place. I'm like, hey, you know, I years ago, Dilfer came on my show and I told my former executives, I said, that guy's going to be a good broadcaster. And I interviewed you at a Super Bowl in some small room one time. and I'm like, dude, whenever that guy gets out of football, go hire him. Basically, your career is in my hands. Do we have time?

Yeah, let's take a break. I want to hear your bitterness. Yeah, no, we have time. He's like, yeah, let's say, look, Joy. I'll just take a break. Bitter Greg Jennings. I'm not bitter anymore. No, but you were bitter.

I was bitter. I want to hear your bitter side next. It's the herd. By the way, the Green Bay Packers, a bad road team, have been even in Aaron Rogers' Prime. We'll go to New England where Tom Brady's the best home quarterback in league history. I'll take New England to win. It's one of my blazing five picks. How much do I like him to win by?

You'll find out. Greg Jennings joining us. We started talking about, Greg's being brutally honest this morning. He brought up a really interesting fact that Aaron Rogers. McCarthy was on the San Francisco staff that pick Alex Smith over Aaron. And I didn't know this. Aaron took shots at him when you were in rooms. They were good nature, but they were still shots.

Absolutely. And you mentioned that you were better. and I said, I've known you for several years. I've never seen bitter Greg Jennings. Go back to your last year in Green Bay. Tell me the story. So my last year in Green Bay, again, I'm on contract year. I wanted to be in Green Bay.

You're a pro bowler. I didn't want to leave. But our first game of the season, we're playing San Francisco, the 49ers, in Lambo. And it's a timeout, Carlos Rogers, corner. comes up to me, he's playing with the 49, and he's like, man, what's going on, man? Why aren't they getting you the bar?

Why they got you running these little simple routes? I'm like, I don't know, man. You know how I go. When you contract year, you don't know what's going on. Aaron is right here. He's kind of listening to the conversation. He says, you guys should get them after this year. You guys should try to get them.

I look like, what? This is the first game with the season. and my court of my guy is already pretty much pass me along and you want to know why I said what I said and you want to know why and everyone wants to be like Greg he was bitter he would look he was

basically he was done with me time out have you ever said this before I've said this I've never said it like like this first of all if if somebody you have every right. And again, I don't want this to be a bash

Aaron, but listen, if, first of all, an opposing player, because when I'm watching you, I remind me how damn good you were. You were a you were tall, you were really a great, but you were a pro bowler. And all of a sudden you get the contract year, that a rival goes up and says, dude, you're running

all these scurly little routes, you got four, four, five speed, you're tall, you're a red zone target, and then Aaron says that. This is, of course. I was, I mean, it, that altered not like I couldn't get over that I mean this is a I had brought you into my phone you know my family my kids they like and you just like and then I started understanding like this is truly a business and guys are are selfish and rightfully so rightfully so I mean his

deal was coming up the year after Clay's was coming up in a couple years I mean Clay was the face of the defense he's going to get his I'm not the face of the offense. Aaron is. And so that last year, that hovered, that was in your mind every play. Yeah. And so for me, like, I remember talking to some of the coaches, and I'm like, dude, I'm not going to be here, man. Like, I'm not going to be.

Because I didn't want to be somewhere where I was always questioning that. Of course. Like, that was as much as we had done. See, I don't see you with, I don't think that's bitter. Like that, it messed, no, Colin, it messed me up. Like, I'm not, it, that disturbed me. So when I did leave and on that on top of all of what I didn't already know and how I did feel like, you, when you're in a relationship, you overlook a lot of things

because you're in that relationship and you want that relationship to work. You want to give everything to it. And so you're willing to overlook every flaw and every relationship has them. but when you're now out of that relationship, you either walk away and you're like, no, they're fine, they're great. You're on great terms or you walk away and it's messy. And that's what happened. And that's what started it for me.

When my quarterback, the first game of the season. Your man, your guy. Tells another guy, you guys should get him. Wait a minute. We should keep me. like what like listen i get it like it it bothers me to this day because i mean it changed my whole mental like uh hey i i think that is i tell people this all the time two things about pro athletes media people don't get this media people are so sensitive the idea that my company

would trade me for a weekend sportscaster and it wouldn't hurt my feelings What if tomorrow? Eric Shanks goes, listen, we like you. But we just traded you for two overnight guys and a secretary to be named later. I'd be like, I'm going to go jump off a bridge. Athletes get treated like car parts. And so, and your careers are short to begin with. You get no choice on where you live. No.

You are traded like an end table at a furniture store. So the idea that you're sensitive, well, hell. Of course you're sensitive. And whenever they do have some leverage and try and maneuver their own careers. Like, we're the bad guys. Selfish, not team guys. Yeah, man. And so that's kind of what took place.

So when I would hear things like, I remember Max Kellerman, oh, Greg Jennings has an ax to grind. You dang skippy I do. You know what? It has nothing to do with it. It has nothing to do with the fact that he said that he didn't just. say it to me in the privacy of our locker room or some he said it to me to another guy

on another roster for basically saying here you can have them like uh you you would you have a problem with that this is a very petty Friday and I'm here for it this has been great I love your honesty you need to be you need to be supported

and loved but thank God you have a good family after saying all of that I would honestly my my end goal like is to be a pack or in the ring of honor. No, that's not it. Okay, I got to go.

I got eight seconds. I would love to be able to sit down and have a real conversation with Aaron. So would I, but it's not going to happen. That's kind of how I feel, too. It's the herd. This is the herd, wherever you may be. And however, you may be listening live in Los Angeles, Iheart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS1 right here.

Joy Taylor is joining me. every Friday. Peter King in 15 minutes. Supreme Court said gambling is legal. Of course, I was doing it for years anyway, but now I don't get in much trouble for it. We do our Blazing 5. This was an interesting week. There was a lot of line movement throughout the course of the week. And one of the things I talk about all the time is I bet numbers, not teams. And this week was all about numbers and line movement. In fact, generally the best numbers I get on Monday morning, the best numbers were late in the week, not to complicate it, but if you bet football, you have to wait for the best line, and it was never more true than this week. So the Blazzen Five is brought to you by Chili's 3 for $10 deal. Get the new Caso Burger plus a starter and a Coke only 10 bucks score with Chili's three for $10 deal.

Here is Blazing Five. That's a hot one. Let's Blaze it up. Fire it up. It's Collins, Blazing Foss. Packers and Patriots. Again, this started at Green Bay getting a little more than a touchdown. It's now New England minus five, and I love that number.

Let me simplify this. New England's a great home team, especially at night on TV. Green Bay is not a great road team. They're 0- and 3 this year. In fact, last seven years, Aaron Rogers, sub-500 on the road. Just say that out loud. Since week four, the Patriots, are first in wins, first in points, first and third down percentage.

What does that mean? They'll keep the ball of Aaron Rogers' hands. By the way, Green Bay is allowing a lot of points. Their best defensive player for Green Bay is a rookie cornerback. I'm going to take the Patriots minus five. 3326, New England wins. Chargers at Seahawks. This will be entertaining.

They both kind of run the same offense. I get the Chargers plus one. at Seattle, I'm going to take the LA Chargers who lead the NFL, not the Rams. The Chargers lead the NFL in what they call big plays. That's runs over 10 yards or passes over 20. It's not the flashy Rams. The Chargers lead the NFL on that. They call them big plays.

The last month, nobody's beaten the Chargers, 28 a game, plus five turnover differential. The Seahawks are 0 and 2 against teams with winning records, the Bears and the Rams this year. And again, I think this is one of these really competitive, really fun games. But I get a hyper-aggressive offense, and Phillip Rivers having his best year. I think they win this thing late on the road. Weather will not be a factor. It can sometimes in November in Seattle. I'll take the chargers to go up to Seattle and win 2823.

Lions and Vikings. Minnesota minus 5 at home. Like it? I love it. One of my rules. Find a good football team. Vikings that gets humiliated on national TV, take them the next week, and they just got smoked by the Saints at home.

This is a good football team. It's not Kansas City so far in New England. It's a good football team. Kirk Cousins is having a B-plus year. In fact, he's having his best year. The Vikings defense is still top 10, 12 top in the NFL. And Detroit's weird. Detroit just traded away golden tape.

How's that going to play in the locker room? When I look at the Vikings, third down percentage, rushing yards, reds. zone touchdowns allowed. Their defense is top five and everything. And again, how does the Golden Tate trade? How does that play in the locker room? It kind of feels like you're mailing in the season. That's what it feels like to me. I'm going to take the Vikings to win comfortably 32 to 21. Rams at Saints. Everybody likes the Saints. Everybody likes the Saints. I'm going Rams Minus One. The Saints just came off a wildly emotional revenge, television win against Minnesota.

Very hard to duplicate that in another week. The Rams were outplayed at home by the Packers. For most of that game, if you watched it, they may have won. They were outplayed for about 75% of it. Listen, the Rams' offense this year, let's just say they're great at everything. The thing to keep your eye on, they lead the NFL in rushing at 150 yards a game. Here's what travels. Running games travel.

I think the Rams could be susceptible to go to a windy Philadelphia in the playoffs. You know, go to a cold northeast city. Have to go to freezing Green Bay. In a dome, on a game they didn't play well but won, I think they're hyper-focused. I'll take the Rams to win the game 3027. Titans at Cowboys. My favorite, my favorite Blazing Five Pick of the Week, Titans plus five and a half. I love this.

Listen, you can't run on Tennessee. Nobody's run for over 85 yards this year on Tennessee. You can't run on Tennessee. What does it mean? It's going to be Dax game. Now, Mari Cooper is going to work, I think, but is he going to work in the first game? He's been there 10 days. Tennessee plays real defense.

They have an excellent, excellent defense, especially in the red zone. They force you to settle for field goals instead of getting touchdowns. They have the number one-ranked red zone defense. And again, this is a low-scoring game. It's a number. I love the number. Now, I think Dallas is going to win this game. This is going to be ugly.

All Titan games are ugly. They make you kick field goals. They don't give you touchdowns. So I think the Cowboys win 26, 23. But I think this is an ugly take the five to five and a half points, whatever number you can get with the Tennessee Titans. Blazing 5 brought to you by Chili's three for $10 deal. Get a starter and entree of Coke, 10 bucks.

Koso Burger, mushroom, Jack, fajitas, starter, Coke, 10 bucks from Chili's. So there's your. Blazing 5, New England, both L.A. teams, the Vikings, and in a rare, rare moment, I take a Tennessee football team. Volunteers or Titans, that doesn't happen much. If I'd have told you, do you remember, Joy, I think it's interesting because I think Drew Breeze and Peyton host McVeigh and Gough this weekend. And Vegas has them as two of the top four Super Bowl favorites. I think Gough and Breeze. have a ton in common.

A ton in common. And I think their careers are going to mirror each other. First of all, what do they have in common? Both had a hiccup early in their career. Both don't blow you away physically. Drew's kind of short, golf's kind of thin. Not kind of thin, he is. Both played at non-traditional football powers.

Both are incredibly giving teammates well-liked. Both now have a genius offensive head coach. Both didn't start day one. and both have perfect weather. 172 degrees outdoors, one, and it helps both. The other plays in a dome. But here's the thing they have in common. Do you remember Joy when Michael Vick broke into this league,

and literally he's all that we could talk about for five years? He was running around. Also at that time, Dante Culpepper was 6'6 and throwing the ball 100 miles an hour down the field of Randy Moss. So you had this Michael Vick dynamic player and he was mesmerizing. Michael was absolutely mesmering. You had Dante Culpepper, who had the biggest arm in football.

Six foot sick. He looks like a defensive end. He was thrown at to Randy Moss. You had Donovan McNabb, this great athlete from a basketball school, Syracuse. You had Carson Palmer, the USC prodigy. He looked like quarterbacks. Look, if I'd have told you then, you know who's going to have a better career than all of them? Drew Brees.

You just said, well, time out. Then Carson Palmer, Michael Vic, Dante Culpepper, and Donovan McNam. Yeah, this kid, the short guy from Purdue,

he's going to be better than all of them. Well, he holds more records right now than any quarterback not named Tom Brady in the history of the NFL. I think a similar thing is happening with Jared Goff.

So Jared Koff comes into this league at the same time as Carson Went. who's bigger, stronger, and flashier. Deshawn Watson, high-profile Clemson. Athletic runs, throws. Patrick Mahomes, flashy, cannon 90 yards. And I think Goff is going to end up having a better career than all of them.

Just like Drew Breeze, he has the perfect components to succeed. He's got the genius coach. He's got the ideal. weather. He's got the great playmakers locked in, Todd Gurley. And he also, like Breeze, does not see himself as a runner. Therefore, he will develop at the incredibly high level the skill of throwing from the pocket. He doesn't have his legs as an out, as an excuse, as a weapon. And Goff and Breeze have both had their doubters. But when Breeze broke into this league, people would have mocked me for saying he's going to be better than Vic and Culpepper and

Carson Palmer and Donovan McNabb. And people think I'm crazy because Wentz, Deshaun, and Patrick Mahomes are bigger, stronger, and flashier. But Goff has the perfect setup. The richest owner, perfect weather, genius head coach, hyper-friendly free agent market, under the radar our personality, and will not use his legs as a weapon, meaning he'll sit in the pocket in a bubble screen league and get rid of the ball quickly and probably add years physically to his career. Gough, McVeigh, to me, are the next Breeze, Sean Payton. Coming up next, it sounds like it would work, Belichick Rogers. Let me just throw a couple things out there.

plus Peter King on a Friday. What a gift for us. The great Peter King, some thoughts heading into the weekend, joins us live. That's coming up next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. All right, the blazing fry brought to you by Chili's $3.3 for $10 deal. I'm sorry. Make your pick starter, entree Coke.

10 bucks, that's it. Chili's three for $10 deal. There's been blazing five picks. You know, it is interesting. As Aaron Rogers and Green Bay faced Tom Brady and Belichick this weekend, there's a lot of talk. Geez, what if Aaron Rogers? had had Belichick, and I've thought about that too. But, you know, it is often interesting that you think his former coach Craig Rigsby

was quoted saying, it's limitless, Belichick and Josh McDaniels, done crazy stuff with Aaron. He has all the intangibles. He has better armed talent. But, you know, there's a lot of times you think stuff's going to work. I'll give you an example. In the history of the NBA, the best center in the league joins the Lakers, it always works. Kareem, Wilt, Shack. It worked every time.

Dwight Howard came to the Lakers. He was a 20.15 rebound guy. He was the NBA's best rebounder shot blocker, engaging personality to the number one brand. Kobe was at the end of his prime, but still very good. And they had an offensive leaning coach and Steve Nash was coming. And the Lakers had a chance. It was a disaster. The personalities didn't work.

And Dwight Howard was a perennial All-Star when he came to the Lakers and his career ended. It was a disaster. Peyton Manning and Tony Dungey. You know, people didn't know how it would work. Peyton's intense and rigid and bossy and tough to deal with. And Tony Dungey's almost like a pastor. He's laid back. And would he be overwhelmed by Peyton Manning's personality?

And it was actually a perfect marriage. Chip Kelly and Michael Vic on paper was going to work. It didn't. Chip Kelly and Nick Foles on paper should never work. And it was actually bizarrely successful. Joe Torrey, they called him shoeless, they called him Clueless Joe when he got the job. playing on shoeless Joe, clueless Joe, losing record, already been fired in New York by the Mets. Calm.

How would he work with Steinbrenner, who was crazy? It was a perfect marriage. So this idea that Belichick and Rogers would be perfect, Tom, and I've said this before, is like Tim Duncan. He's the ultimate coachable superstars. LeBron's not always coachable. Mello's not coachable. Westbrook's hard to coach. Durant's not the easiest.

Right, Kosell, could Belichick have tamed the wild stallion? Cocell's talked about Aaron before. I've said this to you in the past, but it's been a while. He plays more like a jazz musician than a classical pianist. You know, he's an improvisational guy. Now he's very capable of playing from the pocket. There are times he does not, and I would bet that that can be frustrating to the coaching staff at times, but he's so gifted that he can do special things.

So I've always found him tough to evaluate. So this idea is that they'd have a perfect marriage. Listen, man, it's just like, Joey, we've talked about this. It's like people. You would think if you have two people who are both frugal, you're like, oh, that will be perfect. But the truth is, you need to lighten one of them up. two creatives Hollywood's full of creatives

marrying each other the divorce rate's like 75% does a creative better off marrying somebody that's a little more pragmatic and a pragmatic person have a little livelier life what if two loners marry each other

you'd want somebody who's great socially with somebody who's not quite as social at engineering social situations look at marriages you know I mean So it is weird, they say opposite to track. It is weird what works. I think Belichick Rogers would be fascinating, but there's no way eight Super Bowls.

I don't know. I think Brady's talents better than anybody admits. He's one of the best cold weather throwers in the league. You know, think about this with Aaron Rogers. Aaron Rogers has a losing record his last seven years in the road. How the hell does that make sense? I mean, he's Aaron Rogers. like he has a losing record on the road.

Aaron Rogers is two quarterbacks, the home guy, the road guy. Tom Brady is the same everywhere. Maybe is that because Tom is more capable and willing to be in a system on the road. He doesn't improvise. I mean, I'm just, but this idea that it would be better than this. No, I think to be honest with you, Joe Montana Walsh mentor student was a perfect relationship. I don't think Popovich would have necessarily gotten along with Kobe, as well as Phil Jackson, was able to engineer a relationship with Kobe.

This idea that great player, great coach, Phil Sims once said something about Bill Parcells. I think Bill Parcells and Aaron Rogers, oil and water. Oil and Parcells would have struggled with Aaron Rogers. Both super smart guys. But Phil Sims once said this. He said, you know, I was a perfect quarterback for Parcells. is I was every bit as smart as him, but I didn't need to tell him I was. Aaron tends to be smartest guy in the room and he lets you know it.

So, you know, this idea, I think Aaron could very well be with the very perfect coach for him that pushes Aaron, pushes Aaron, but reigns him in, rains him in, and is kind of a candid, you know, McCarthy's got no BS with him. No BS with him. You know, we all thought Gruden and Derek Carr was going to be great. It doesn't work. Jack Del Rio and Carr, it's never been better. Jack Del Rio and Derek Carr worked.

Gruden in Carr's a disaster. Is that because Gruden knows less offense than Jack Del Rio? No, the personalities don't work. Same in marriages, same in dating. Michael Vic and Chip Kelly on paper was a 100-year marriage. Nick Foles and Chip Kelly was actually great. I have no idea how, but it worked. Joy Taylor with the news.

No, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Don't undervalue interpersonal relationships in sports. We kind of just gloss over that, like, oh, this is a great player and a great coach. And it works. It doesn't always. This person's pretty and this person's pretty.

Tadda. This person's smart. This person's smart. What could go wrong? Yeah. There's other elements to it. Yeah. Speaking of interpersonal relationships, Magic Johnson previously said the Lakers need to allow time for Luke

Walton to develop a young roster surrounding LeBron. However, less than 10 games into the year, Magic reportedly met with Walton to discuss the team's slow start according to ESPN's Adrian Wojernowski and Dave McManumanneman. They have reported that in a meeting on Tuesday, following a winless two-game trip, Magic Johnson admonished coached Luke Walton for the team's sluggish start to the season. There are intense and immediate pressures on Walton to deliver the franchise a winner in short order. What? I don't know. Magic.

Who's reporting this? Woge and Dave McVaneman. I know those guys. Yeah, we do. We do know those guys. I don't know what to make of this. Okay, so. They've been in every game. Houston's getting their ears boxed. Lakers are in every game. I don't want, I don't, look, I had no expectation.

of the Lakers having a fast start to this season. That's not what LeBron does when he goes to a new place. Lakers are not. They start slow. Yes. They have a young team. Yes. They've got to, you know, you've got to let it simmer a little bit.

Joy, they've played playoff teams. Don't rush the sauce. Every time they've played a team, they should have beaten Phoenix, clobbered them, should have beaten Dallas, won. Every game they should have won this year, they've won. I just don't know what the need for. for panic is. Like, I understand that this is Los Angeles

and there's a certain standard, but you can't let history dictate reality. Like right now, today, you have a young team with some veterans sprinkled in. And no elite three-point shooters, including LeBron. You have no other elite shooter. You have to let this chemistry work itself out and let these guys figure out what's going to work for them.

There's so much, this is the beginning of the season. Why do you need to win now? I'm not saying let this go off the rails, but you've got to allow some times for some bumps and bruises. A lot of these guys need to learn how to win. A lot of them have to learn how to play with LeBron. It takes a while. But not just play with LeBron.

Say LeBron retires after his time here in L.A. They still have to have a team after that. And some of these guys were supposed to be. He's not going to retire. Okay, but maybe he's not with the Lakers necessarily. Well, he's going to be with the Lakers for four years. Right, but I'm saying you need to build this young team up. There's no need for panic.

There's no need to overreact and start pushing to win right now. It's the beginning of the season. It's dumb. It's dumb. I'm done with that story. It's dumb. Jesus, it's like seven games into the season. There's just no need for it.

All right. So Aaron Rogers, Tom Brady, done, dun, dun, everyone's talking about it. We've been talking about it all week. And it's a very exciting matchup. And you know who else is very excited? Packers great, Brett Farr. It was an epic matchup. But, you know, from a fan standpoint, this is what you look forward to seeing.

Bird and Magic Johnson. A great pitcher against a great hitter. This is one of those games that, you know, the ratings will be sky high and rightfully so. Both quarterbacks or as good as any that's ever played the game in totally different in styles. I don't know who I give the nod to or the advantage to. Both teams, I'm sure, and both fan bases love their chances. You know, we are obviously billing this as Rogers versus Brady, and then you start, you know, comparing, like, it's the goat conversation

and, you know, the Michael Jordan commercial, and Brett Farms talking about it two different styles. We're really talking about them, like, their boxers. It's kind of disregarding the fact that they have a whole other team around them that's got to perform. Like, is this going to come down to the two of them? and all the spotlight's going to be on them. But there's some other factors here.

There's something that's not being discussed. I haven't heard it. Maybe Joy, it's been discussed, is Ha-ha Clinton Dix, the Packers just traded him away. He's a great safety. The way to slow down Gronk. And Kansas City did this last year is put a great safety.

Linebackers are too slow for Gronk. Corners are too small. Ha-ha Clinton Dix is one of the three safeties in the league that can cover Gronk, and they just traded him away, and Green Bay is going to move, I think, a corner in that position. Like, I understand the trading deadline, but Ha-ha Clinton Dix, a really strong safety is about the only way to defend Gronk and take him out. The Chiefs with Eric Berry did this last year, took him out of the game. So it just feels like New England, home, Sunday, better defense.

And again, I'll say it, Green Bay, last seven years is sub-500 on the top. the road with Aaron Rogers in his prime, which is a remarkable thing. I mean, it's going to be all eyes on them either way. But yeah, like I said, there's going to be some other factors. All right. So Nick Sabin, someone called in to Sabin's radio show last night and decided to ask him, ask the notorious grump. That's what I call him.

The notorious grump, yeah. What his plans are for the coin toss Saturday night against LSU. And here was his answer. Well, to be honest with you, I hope we elect to kick ass is what I hope we do. You snuck a little joke in there. This is a huge game. It's probably the best game of the season. Oh, well, it's the big, yeah, it's the, I think Alabama's going to win comfortably, but it's.

Comfortably? I think, yeah, I think Alabama's really good. And I think LSU, it's classic LSU, NFL bodies everywhere, can't throw the ball consistently. run-oriented and good luck running the ball against Nick Saban. I mean, this conference right now is... Are you willing to put some Baker-Baker Moneymaker on that? I don't bet college games, but I feel like Alabama. It's going to go on the road.

It'll be a really, really fun first half, all sorts of NFL athletes all over the field. But in the end, I get a significantly better vertical passing game and a better coach. Well, a lot of good football this weekend. Yeah, there is actually a lot of good football. Joy with the News. Well, that's the news.

And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lie News. NBCSports.com, one of my favorites. Lucky for us, we got him on a Friday. Let's go via the Coward Global Satellite Network to Peter King. You know, I said to start the show today is, and this is no criticism, Dick Vitale was great at selling himself. That's what makes a TV star. He was a better TV star than he was a basketball coach, and Dick's a wonderful human being.

Gruden, I've always felt, was a terrific TV analyst because he sells himself. there is no proof that he's the quarterback whisper. In fact, I could argue, Peter, that the guy coached against last night, Kyle Shanahan, Matt Ryan MVP, RG3 rookie of the year, Matt Schaubb, pro bowler under him. I mean, I look at this Gruden thing, and I'm like, some of his qualities are better served for TV than they are coaching, his abrupt personality. I'm not shocked by this mess. How shocked, I guess, are you by what we've been watching?

Not really very shocked. I mean, this is a guy who has last three years in 10. Tampa won four, nine and nine games and didn't win a playoff game, and now he's one and seven, and did not develop a quarterback in Tampa. And so far the results with Derek Carr have not been good. No. I mean, it's too early to say that it's over and dumb, stupid, all that stuff. But last night was a horrendous performance by a guy who,

who's supposed to have his players ready to play in every game. And it was a particularly horrendous performance against a practice squad caliber quarterback who had never played in the NFL before and who beat you by 31 points. That was a disgraceful performance by the Raiders. You know, I'll say this with John Gruden. And the NFL made a bunch of moves out west in the same region.

Chargers moved up to L.A., Rams from St. Louis. Raiders moving. The Rams has been an absolute home run. The Chargers have a good team, but nobody in L.A. seems to care. The Raiders are an abject mess. You know, I do wonder sometimes this Raider moved to Vegas. I mean, how do you think when the league watches what's happening last night with the Raiders? Do they care?

I mean, they made all these moves out west. One's been a home run, but this Raiders thing is embarrassing. I mean, I think if you're the NFL right now, you've got to be looking at, A, the price structure that the chargers put in place, which is far, far, far less in terms of money than the NFL ever thought that they would put in place. I mean, you could get two great seats in the upper deck of the most beautiful football stadium ever built. you can get two season tickets for a total of $2,000. And again, good for fans. That's a great thing for fans.

But, you know, it's not very good for people who think that this should be a home run of a business move. Yeah. And you're right. Now, if you are a Raider fan in Vegas or you're excited about the Raiders coming to Vegas, and look, short term you can't be concerned with, well, what's our record in 2000? 20. But I'm just, I'm making this point. Is it beyond the realm of possibility that John Gruden next March or April trades Derek Carr to Jacksonville for a one? And then has four picks in the top 20 of the draft, is going to take his quarterback of the future. And so, hey, that's great.

Everybody's excited. Raiders own the draft. What gives you any feeling that they're going to be able to draft and develop these guys. They're two best players. They drafted, developed, and one of them now they've traded, Kaleo Mack, and what they're going to do with Derek Carr, I don't know. But I wouldn't have limitless faith

in what I'm going to see from the Raiders. You know, I've, the discussions this week are what if, you know, Rogers had Belichick. And I said this earlier, Peter, what makes a marriage work? It's, you know, Hollywood, all these creative people marry each other and their divorce rates higher than any place in America.

You'd think it'd be perfect, right? The director marries their producer. They're both creatives. What makes relationships work is it's really, it's not scientific. You just don't know. And, you know, Greg Kossel's come on my show and said basically that Aaron Rogers add libs out of successful plays. He's a jazz musician. And then you have the coach Belichick with the world's greatest system.

Do we know that, I mean, I'm not saying it wouldn't work to some level, but couldn't I make the argument that Brady's more coachable personality is perfect for Belichick and that Rogers wouldn't be ideal? He wouldn't, a little more, you know, Aaron's the smartest guy in the room and he's not afraid to tell you that maybe they wouldn't be perfect together. Well, two things about that. Number one, one of the reasons that Belichick soured on Drew Bledso in the first place is that he changed too many plays at the line of scrimmage. really? And change too much of what they were going, what they wanted to do and what he had worked on the whole week in practice and game planning. But I think there's a bigger question here. I've heard this question asked this week. And nobody has made this point. Aaron Rogers came out of Cal in the 2005 draft. Okay. And not only didn't he play right away,

he wasn't ready to play right away. When Aaron Rogers was drafted, Bill Belichick and Tom Brady had already won three Super Bowls. So let's say that Aaron Rogers comes out and he lands in New England at a time when they've already had this tremendous success. Well, I mean, then what? I mean, is he going to play right away? You can't just say, okay, let's give Belichick Aaron Rogers in 2001. He was either in high school or Butte Junior College or something. I mean, he wasn't, So everybody who makes this argument tries to say, what would happen if Belichick had Rogers? By the time Rogers came into the NFL,

he would have been three Super Bowls behind because that's how many of the Patriots would have won. And for the record, as you pointed out, Aaron Rogers today is not the Aaron that came out of college. He was not ready to play at the highest levels in the National Football League. I do think, let's stay on Aaron for a second, though. I mean, the relationship with Mike McCarthy and Aaron, some have termed it frosty. I don't think that's inaccurate.

Aaron's now got a massive contract. Ty Montgomery ticked him off and got sent out. Ha, Clinton Dick's a terrific safety. He's no longer there. Aaron's not going anywhere, but he took a shot at the organization on Milwaukee Radio this offseason for getting rid of Van Pelt, the quarterback coach. I do think, and I'm not trying to be hyperbolic here, I don't think McCarthy's long for Green Bay. I think they're going to finish out of the playoff race. Here's my question. If that happens, is there another Sean McBay out there? Who's out there for Aaron? Because I don't

think McCarthy and he are going to last much longer. I think that's a fair question to ask. I think if they end up, you know, whatever, nine, six and one or eight, seven and one and don't make the playoffs, I think it is a question about whether McCarthy returns. Yeah. A new general manager, Brian Gutikuntz might choose to sweep the coaching staff clean. We'll see. But is there somebody out there? I mean, you know, look, there are smart, progressive, innovative coaches out there. I would love to see, if they have an opening, I'd love to see the Packers go after a couple of really bright young offensive coaches like Lincoln Riley.

Would he go? I mean, Lincoln Riley sounded like the other day he was going to poo-poo going to the NFL. But for the chance to coach either Aaron Rogers or Baker Mayfield again in his case, that would be interesting. John DeFilippo of the Minnesota Vikings now the offensive coordinator, the former quarterback coach of Carson Wentz, he would be interesting. I think it would be if they decide to make a change, my feeling is they'd go very hard after an innovative. of offensive mind. By the way, the happiest story of the year for me is Andrew Luck. His center is on the mid-season pro-ball team. His left guard, Quentin Nelson, got offensive player of the month. That's the happiest story in the NFL. I got to tell you, Peter, I watch these Colts.

They're not far off. They need a little better defense. It feels like Chris Ballard, the GM, hit a home run in the draft, and that thing with Frank Reich is working. Even though their record isn't blowing anybody away. I think it's working in Indy. Your thoughts? Well, Chris Ballard is the executive of the year, as far as I'm concerned, at least now midway through the season, because

he drafted so many guys who've contributed immediately in huge, huge roles. Darius Leonard could well be the defensive rookie of the year. Quentin Nelson will get some consideration for offensive rookie of the year.

I mean, the unfortunately, thing in these awards deals is that the sexy guys, the guys who touch the ball often will win these awards, but I've voted often over the years for guys who don't touch the ball if they're better at their position than the guys who touch the ball. And look, it's hard to argue against Sequin Barclay. He's a very, very good running back who has hit the ground running. But, I mean, they have drafted well. And I also think that in the way they, they, they, they have drafted well. And I also think that in the way they drafted in, you know, in the last couple of years, they have said, listen, we're all in on

Andrew Luck and we are going to build a suit of armor around him. Yes. I think next year, there's a very good chance. The Rams take one or two offensive linemen on the first two days of the draft and even go farther all in to make that line better for luck. Yeah. No, I've heard the same thing. I totally, I believe the key in this league is when you have a year. young cheap quarterback, get aggressive and free agency, and when you have an older quarterback who's been injured, you cannot draft enough offensive linemen, protect him, elevate

his career, extend his career. Peter King, NBCSports.com. Great talking to you, Peter, on a Friday. Thank you, Colin. Coming up next, two major college football games, I'll give you the winner. Our spoiler alert is coming up next.

Tonight, the Colorado Buffalo's head of Tucson to take on Arizona at 1030 Eastern on FS1. Then tomorrow, Big 12 contenders, West Virginia and Texas clash at 330 Eastern on Fox or watch it anywhere on the Fox Sports app. You got the dreaded stuff he knows this cold and flu season. Vix Sinex nasal spray lasts up to 12 hours. I've used that stuff. Vix Sinex nasal spray.

It's great. Intense, but great. All right, if you don't want to know what's going to happen this weekend in the two big college games, turn away. You know, I'm not going to, I can give you the end of the movie right here. I'm going to tell you exactly what's going to. going to happen. It's our spoiler alert. Warning. Colin is about to reveal the outcomes of the biggest college football

games this week. If you don't want to know exactly what's going to happen, turn away now. Okay, Alabama goes on the road to take on LSU. This has become a very lobsided rivalry. Alabama has won the last

seven meetings and they've mostly looked the same. LSU has scored less than 20 points in each of the last games against Alabama because it's a fairly one-dimensional offense run by LSU. This is a coaching mismatch. Now, I do think Alabama leads the SEC and SACs, so LSU would like to throw it a little but won't have much success. The offensive matchup here is a dual threat. Alabama can run, throw short, throw deep,

the quarterback can move. and LSU pretty much wants to pound it. I will say this, though, keep your eye on this. If it's close late third quarter, Alabama has not been in a close game all year long. And for teams sometimes in college sports, and you don't see this in pro sports, when a team in college sports just dominates and they finally face a little adversity on the road, 80,000 really loud. And LSU's got as many NFL guys as Bama does.

That's where they could get a little tight. I don't see that happening. I think Alabama, it's close at half, pulls away third quarter, makes adjustments. Spoiler alert. Alabama wins 3420. Other great game, Michigan and Penn State. Oh, last year they played in Penn State rubbed Michigan's nose in it. It will not happen this year.

Michigan leads college football in total defense, allowing 14 a game. That's the fewest in the Big Ten. They don't turn it over. It's a pretty conservative game. planned by Jim Harbaugh. It is old school football. They lead the league in time of possession. Michigan wants to run it, run it. They want to squeeze the clock. They don't want to give you opportunities. They don't turn it over and they play great defense. In fact, their third down defense may be the best part of their defense at Michigan. I think Penn State's going to get swamped.

It's a revenge game for the Wolverines. And I think they're going to win it. Michigan going away. Ups, spoiler alert. 3420 in this game as well. Michigan looks better, is better, pulls away. By the way, so Harbaugh and Sabin are the big conversation here. You know, everybody lives in the moment. I mean, Kevin Durant wins the MVP of the finals.

He's better than LeBron. Kevin's better than LeBron. He just saw it television. He's better than LeBron. No, he's not. Stop talking. LeBron's better than KD. It's not close.

But everybody lives in the moment, right? And like right now in the moment, Saban is number one. Harbaugh is terrible. Harbaugh is the better coach. Harbaugh's gone four for four. San Diego, home run. San Diego, Stanford, home run.

NFL, Super Bowl. Michigan. Boom. By the way, you do get Nick Saban, Michigan State. Nick Saban did not hit a home run at Michigan State. He won 58% of his games. Mike Dantoneo, grumpy guy, has won 68% of him.

his games. Mark D'Antonio. D'Antonio is a better coach at Michigan State by far than Nick Saban was. And then, well, what about, what about LSU? What about it? Nick Saban won 75% of his games in a title. Les Miles won 77% of his games in a title. Well, what about the NFL? Harbaugh got to a Super Bowl.

Sabin bombed. Harbaugh's the more impressive coach. When you can do it over and over and over and over, Harbaugh is four for four. and was a massive home run. You know how many great coaches have coached in the NFL and don't even get to a Super Bowl? God, I can name Don Corrielle. I mean, I can name five off the top of my head great coaches who couldn't get to a Super Bowl. I mean, Barry Switzer won one.

You know, so Harbaugh is at a school, Michigan, which is a top academic school in a region of the country that doesn't have nearly the players in high school. Harbaugh's better than Nick Saban as a coach. I just said it. Say it again. He's got a more impressive resume. Go look at Michigan State and LSU and examine him. Dan Antonio and Les Miles won more games.

They did. Sorry, just facts. Last hour coming up. Rob Parker, T.J. Hushman's out. I can't wait. It's a Friday, baby. It's the herd. Oh, hour number. Three, live in Los Angeles, wherever you may be, and however you may be listening.

IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio FS1, Joy Taylor. I still can't get over. That absurd story that Joy reported 40 minutes ago is the dumbest thing. Magic Johnson says, Luke one, you must win more now with a bunch of guys who can't shoot. Yes, according to Wurgeon, Dave McMendman. come on i don't i don't understand it there's no there's truly no need to win right now like of all of all the times in sports where it's okay to just be in the regular season and do any amount of losing or kind of figure out what you are right which that was now it should be noted

ingram is not playing well and it's baffling now that magic should go and deal with but luke walton's the problem i just don't get it i don't i don't i didn't take that as luke walton is the problem. I took that story as there's pressure to win right now, which makes no sense. There is no, there's pressure on the rockets to win right now. Oh, God, yes. They got a new owner. There's pressure on the Raptors to win right now. There's pressure on the Celtics

to win right now. Yes. There's no pressure on the Lakers. Like zero. If they didn't make the playoffs this year, it would be okay. It depends how they didn't make it. If they had the most... I mean, look, if they're seasons a disaster, sure. But if they're close to making the playoffs, they don't make the cut. That's

That's not the end of the world. Every game they played this year against Phoenix won. They beat Denver at home, who has a better roster. They're winning all the games they're supposed to be winning, and they're losing at Portland. They're losing, didn't they beat Minnesota? That's a nice win for them. Did they beat Minnesota?

I mean, I don't understand this stuff. Pressure on Luke Walt. Okay, anyway, give me a headache. I don't even understand that. 15 minutes, T.J. Hushman's auto-stops by, one of the most forthright honest guys. Greg Jennings said something an hour and a half ago, told a story about Aaron Rogers. I've never heard in my life.

I'm going to play that again. Rob Parker, Monday's headlines today. That will be funny with Rob Parker. Let's start with this. The Raiders were humiliated and crushed by the 49ers on Thursday night football. So let's start with their legendary head coach. John Gruden is great at selling himself. he is and that is a skill

that is a skill that's why he's a TV star if you watch Monday night football this year they could use him and he's missed most great football coaches in NFL history are not great at selling themselves

Chuck Knoll of the Steelers was not Tom Landry of the Cowboys was not Bill Walsh Belichick Parcells Paul Brown They were not television stars. Bill Walsh was actually the late Bill Walsh was kind of bad on television. Through the sheer force of personality, John Gruden has sold himself as the quarterback whisperer.

He's had 12. One popped Rich Gannon. If you go one for 12, I'm probably going to give the player more of the credit Rich Gannon than the coach, John Gruden. I did think it was interesting and ironic last night that Kyle Shanahan, a guy who does not sell himself, who is the actual quarterback whisperer, took a guy none of us, myself included, had ever heard of, and won a game in a route over a former pro bowler, Derek Carr.

But Kyle Shanahan does not sell himself. He doesn't talk. He's kind of rigid. He's a football guy through and through. Last night, John Gruden is not only not the quarterback whisperer, he was the second best quarterback coach in the Bay Area. Nick Mullins, no idea. Chris Mullins, I know.

Nick Mullins, no idea. Looked brilliant. By the way, Dick Vital and John Gruden have something in common. They're both better on TV than they were coaching their sport. Vital like Gruden is an amazing, amazing marketer. He is the biggest name in college basketball, or at least was for 20 years. That's not a criticism. Dick was great at selling himself.

Chuck Daly wasn't. Greg Popovich isn't. Brad Stevens doesn't. Bill Self, not so much. It is a skill to sell yourself. Kyle Shanahan made RG3 the rookie. of the year. He left him. He was a bust. He made Matt Schaubb a pro bowler. He made Matt Ryan the MVP for about an hour. People were saying, you know, Matt Ryan's better than Aaron Rogers.

They're neck and neck. No, no, they're not neck and neck. And by the way, Brian Hoyer with Kyle Shanahan had a winning record. Let me finish the sentence. In Cleveland, We had a quarterback whisper on display last night, but he does not sell himself. And Derek Carr is now officially a better quarterback with defensive-minded Jack Del Rio than with that quarterback whisper guy. But again, I get why Gruden was a TV star. Money Net Football, they miss him. I get why I was glued to that quarterback camp thing he did at the SPN. I get why he got this job.

I get why owners and GMs for years offered him gigs. I saw that interview with Howie Long. It jumps through the television set. Watch. I got a cell phone just like you and everybody else. And I get a lot of phone calls from people that are dying to come and play here. I'm just telling you, they're dying to play for the radius. He's Tony Robbins with a whistle.

But I never bought into this move because I thought Gruden was a great television star and an average coach who'd never really proven he can build anything. The qualities that make you a great TV star are generally the opposite of the qualities that make you a great football coach. And let's shift gears to this. This weekend, we are going to watch the two best quarterbacks in the NFL along with Drew Breeze, Aaron Rogers and Tom Brady will play this weekend. It will be magnificent. It will be in Foxborough.

It will be Sunday night. I will be glued to my television set. Earlier in the week, Tom Brady talked about how great Aaron Rogers is. Very classy of Aaron Rogers yesterday to talk about how great Tom Brady was. He said, quote, he's able to make subtle movements his entire career to create space. It's an innate sense. Tom's always been great with his eyes, able to manipulate Defenders, move them out of the way. Lanes. He and Brett are the two best I've seen on film.

That was nice of Aaron to do. He's a smart guy. He gets the game. A lot of you think I don't like Aaron Rogers. Aaron Rogers doesn't think I like him, but I do. I put Aaron Rogers in a very interesting class with LeBron James and Andrew Luck. What if? What if LeBron, first seven years, had an owner and a GM that could have gotten him other good players. What if Andrew Luck's first six years in Indianapolis weren't marked by utter chaos? What if Aaron Rogers was given great defenses or had Belichick? Being a legend is about a marriage. Michael Jordan didn't win squat without Pippin and Phil Jackson,

and Kobe never won anything without Fulner. Phil, Gassal, or Shaq. Brady's got Belichick. Sean Payton's got Breeze. Tiger Woods had the right golf coach in his prime. Bill Russell had R-back. What if he had Belichick? What if, like Big Ben, he had Lavian Bell behind him?

What if, like Jared Goff, he was in a free agent-friendly market? What if, like Drew Breeze, he had an offensive jeanness? This weekend, Tom Brady and Aaron Rogers will play. Probably for the last time. You've been cheated. I've been cheated. And most of all, Aaron Rogers has been cheated. Coming up next, T.J. Hushman Zada, he just got off the phone with recently fired and outspoken Hugh Jackson.

That is coming up next. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week, within the iHeart radio app search heard to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like oh we got a lot of show left still disturbed by that luke walton story that is weird weird uh so i love when i get former players who can we've gregg jennings was so good earlier today he told stories i've never heard and when we get players that just get off the phone with people who they know in the league who have gone through a crisis. Hugh Jackson got fired a couple days ago and T.J. Hushman Zata knows him. He is now joining us, the former Pro Bowl wide receiver over a decade in the NFL,

drafted by the Bengals. So you, first of all, let's explain your relationship with Hugh Jackson. How do you know him? Well, me and Hugh actually get along really well. He was my position coach in Sincere for a few years and then from that point forward, we just always stayed in contact. He was a very good position and coordinator coach. Yes. Yeah, excellent. Yeah.

He was given a dysfunctional raider job briefly. I think he went eight. I was winning. And by the way, it was eight and eight. We should have made the playoffs that year. Should have made the playoffs that year. It was not a disaster. Yeah, it wasn't.

And I defended Hugh Jackson this morning. I have two sources that I trust deeply, told me two years ago he wanted Wentz and told me a year ago, before Baker, he wanted. Deshawn Watson and they wouldn't listen to him. So when you talk to him on the phone this morning, let's just go. Take your time on this.

You called him, he called you. What happened? So number one, I knew he wanted Wentz two years ago. I knew he wanted Watson last year because we talk all the time. I talked to him this year before the draft about Rosen and Mayfield and Baker. And so it's the reason he was brought back this year was because the owner knew and everybody in that organization knew he wanted Carson Wentz.

The analytics guy didn't want him. Everybody knew he wanted Deshawn Watson. The analytics guy, they didn't want it. So yeah, because you go one in 31 and they bring you back. Why? Because they felt guilty. Because they knew he had two supposed franchise

quarterback said he wanted to draft. The analytics guy did not want him. So the owner and everybody else said, we got to give him another chance because he looks like he was dead on in those two picks. Did he want Baker Mayfield? We didn't really get into the did you want Baker Mayfield. What I asked him was, do you think Baker is going to succeed? And he says if you put the right pieces around Baker Mayfield, he will have success.

He's deadly accurate. He was the exact word. He was like, TJ, he is deadly accurate. He will put the ball. But you need guys that when Baker Mayfield throws, you a six, seven-yard slant route, we can take it 60. Yeah. And he said, we don't have that.

And the problem is Todd Haley wanted to implement the Pittsburgh offense. You don't have Big Ben, obviously. You don't have an Antonio Brown and you don't have a Levi-on-Bell. And so you cannot implement an offense when you have those caliber players in Cleveland because Cleveland doesn't have those type of players. Wasn't he done in by the fact the minute they went and got Todd Haley, he was toast? I don't know if he was done in because Todd Haley has had a lot of success. in the NFL. In order for Todd Haley

to agree to come on, he wants full control of the offense, which you gave him. The problem is they said they were going to sit Baker Mayfield as whole Rick year. The reason that was was because Todd Haley wasn't going to tailor his offense to Baker Mayfield. Baker Mayfield was going to fit into

Todd Haley's offense. That's where they went wrong at initially. When you draft Baker Mayfield, you implement some of the schemes and things he did at Oklahoma. Todd Haley did not want to do that. He wanted Baker Mayfield to fit into his offense so they were going to sit him so that he could learn the offense so that he was able to make checks. He could change protections. He could change players at the line of scrimmage.

You can't do that as a rookie coming in and learning somebody's office. Now, if they implement some of Oklahoma's offense, Baker would have been able to do that. And Todd Haley, he's stubborn. He wanted it his way. Was Hugh bitter, angry? Because I think Hugh is one of those rare NFL guys that would work at the college level. I think Hugh gets in the living room. You can have a good looking guy. Hugh can sell water to a well.

Well, we've seen him her in Edwards, Pete Carroll, guys that going to college, Nick Saban, if you can sell, the biggest day in college football is February 3rd. It's signing day. Hugh can sell. Hugh would be. Was he better this morning? He didn't sound better. He sounded more disappointed. Like, if I'm going to go out, let me go out my way.

And he felt like he tried to help offensively, but it was he kind of had his hands tied. And Dorsey and Hasel, they knew. Todd Haley needed to go, but it was a, we're just going to get rid of both of you guys. Hugh deserves a good another chance. I don't know if he will. By the way, again, let's state it again. You, let's go back to the Wence and Deshawn Watson, your friends with Hugh. What did Hugh tell you in both of those drafts?

Before the draft, me and Hugh talked, when he was in Baltimore, we talk about players. When he was in Atlanta, we talk about players. When he was in Cleveland, we talked about players. prior to each and every draft. And he straight up said, I love Carson Wentz. He comes from a city. He played in a city that's similar to Cleveland.

He'll succeed here. We'll basically run some zone reads, some RPO's to kind of get him a... Carson Wentz is Carson Wentz because Peterson said, we're going to implement some college stuff. And he liked Deshawn Watson too. Dude, he loved Deshaun.

He loved him. Before the draft, he told me, we're going to draft this kid. And so when he didn't draft him, I sent him a text, like, what's y'all doing? He didn't respond. And so that told me all I needed to know.

His hands were tied. His hands were tied. I feel better about supporting Hugh Jackson all these years. If SC don't turn it around, they might want to go look Hugh Jackson's way because SC has a hard time developing players. They get these top recruits and they don't seem to develop. You can make worse choices at USC than Hugh Jackson. Okay.

I've made my case. I never thought the Gruden thing would work. It's not what's your takeaway. Gruden is, he's funny, man. He's like a comic. Like, people are dying to play for the Raiders. Nobody wants to play for the Raiders. He's a lot.

The guys that play for the Raiders don't even want to play for the Raiders. But other guys and other teams do, they'll play for the Raiders if you pay them a lot more money than everybody else is going to pay them. Of course, they'll die to play for the Raiders in. I mean, what he's done, like, you've gotten rid of two players that were two of your top five or six players on your team. Kaleo Max is a top five player in the league. And you hope to draft players as good as or better than those guys. And they were young. It's not like you're getting rid of them at the tail end of their career.

John Gruden, man, if he turns this around, that's like story of the century because it's a mess right now. Here was Gruden last night selling the story to Howie Long. I got a cell phone just like you and everybody else. And I get a lot of phone calls from people that are dying to come and play here. I'm just telling you, they're dying to play for the radius. I get it. I think he's very persuasive. He ain't telling the truth. He's lying. That's a lot. Who? Who wants to come play for the Raiders?

I don't think a lot of people do. Nobody. Nobody wants. Everybody will go again. They got a lot of cap space. If you're going to pay them more than anybody else, they'll be there. By the way, last night, I'm telling you, when Garoppolo comes back and you give the Niners or running back. Man, did Mullins look good, though? That's Kyle Shanahan. Kyle Shanahan made RG3 beat out Andrew Luck for rookie of the year. Kyle Shanahan and McVey are the best young coaches in the NFL.

Not even close. Not even close. Yeah. Not even close. RG3 beat out Andrew Luck, rookie of the year. Shanahan leaves. Think about that. And Hugh had RG2 as his quarterback.

Cody Kessler, Kevin Hogan, RG3. Just saying. There you go. I know people talk about what if Aaron played for Bella. And I've, it's just like your marriage is that sometimes opposites work. Sometimes they attract. Sometimes they work initially and don't work. Relationships are hard.

It's Michael Vick should have worked with Chip Kelly. It didn't. Nick Foles, who can't run as fast as that chair work with Chip Kelly on paper. It didn't make any sense. This idea that Rogers, who's kind of an ad lib, do my own thing guy and best, Belichick, the ultimate system guy, would just be perfect. I'm like, kind of one of the reasons Brady Belichick works is because Tom's coachable. If Tom had Aaron's arm, would he be as coachable?

I mean, if you were given the gifts of Aaron Rogers, sometimes, T.J. Kind of want to let it loose, Bill. Drew Bledso had a huge arm. Hey, Bill, I'm going to add live. I want to let it loose. Is that some of the limitations, couldn't I argue, T.J? I mean, look at you in Ocho. Ocho probably got a better vertical than you.

No. Well, let's just pretend he does. He was quicker than me. Okay. Chad was, yeah. Okay, so Chad to world-class speed. Chad wasn't as coachable as you. Chad didn't run the routes you ran.

When God gives you gifts, you want to show them off. That's why people sing in the shower. You know what it is all about the Aaron Rogers debate? It's, I honestly feel had Aaron Rogers got drafted to England, he would have fit in because he has no choice. That would have been his first NFL experience. And he would have seen that Belichick runs a tight ship, he would have fit right on in. He goes to Green Bay. Brett Farf kind of is loose.

He kind of ad-libs does things on his own. Aaron saw that. He mimicked that. And so that's all he knew because that's what he came into. Quarterback is able to kind of take some chances. Quarterback is able to kind of ad-lib and new things. Small town. You're the star of the town.

Right. And if it's where you get drafted to kind of plays a roll. Like when he was in college, Aaron Rogers held the ball up here. He changed a lot in a year. he wasn't playing and he learned a lot but he learned from Brett Farve a lot of it could be good or bad had he gone to New England he would have fit right in because

talent wise his talent is undeniable it's unquestionable good stuff today you really brought it today you had good energy today you got you broke a story with Hugh Jackson story breaker can we have brazy let's get him a breaking news sound effect when TJ listen I don't expect athletes to break news

are not journalists but when they do come out and you do the homework to break news Let's give them this sound effect. Breaking news. Let's here for T.J. Hushman's on a Friday. Excellent work today. By the way, Ram Saints, who do you like? I actually like the Rams.

So do I. I'll throw a theory at you. So the Saints come out of this wild revenge game where they had big chip on their shoulder against the Vikings. And they played their arse off, and they circled that thing in the calendar. You can't match that. The Rams actually,

got their butt handed to them for about three quarters of the pack. And they won. So they go on the road and they're like, fellas, if we play like that against New Orleans, we're going to get blown out of this place. The Rams won, but I think they'll be hyper-focused. The Saints won, and I think they'll pull back. You've been in locker rooms. The Rams will implement some no huddles, some fast-temple type of stuff to try to keep the crowd out of it.

Because they're not going to just scream for two, three minutes straight. They'll go in and out of the no-huddle, play fast, play. slow to kind of keep the crowd out of it. And so, because it's loud in a Superdome, but McVeigh, man, he's a genius, man. The guy, Jared Gough was a bust under Jeff Fisher. He couldn't play under Jeff Fisher

and he's the deal now. You know, I just, last night, the punter for the Rams was at a soccer game I was out. I was talking to him, Johnny, Oregon State kid. Hecker. Great kid. Quarterback in high school, threw a tape to Oregon State, put punting highlights on the back of the tape, and Mike Riley gave him

the gig. But he was talking. And we were talking about this. The Rams are doing something that's fascinating. And nobody's talking about this in the league. First team ever. Didn't play their stars a snap in the preseason. Why?

During practice, Wednesdays, just walk-throughs. Walk-through. I talk to the coach every day. Walk-throughs. One of their coaches every day. So what are the Rams doing? Players recruit players.

Players are saying, Dude, we don't practice hard here at all. At all. Keep them fresh. I'm telling you, you talk about where players want to play. You go to Akeeb-Talib. Dude, Wednesdays? Walk-through.

Walk-through. Yes. Pre-season, you are not allowed to. Baltimore does that as well. They were doing that. When I played in Baltimore, Wednesday was a walk-through, and here we are in Cincinnati getting IVs in practice. No lie.

No lie. True story. True story. Good seeing you, bud. Take care. Thank you. Joy, with the news. Turn on the news.

This is the herd line news. I feel like you could just do an entire show of shenanigans in Cincinnati. It is. Well, it is. You know, what's ironic is the time that TJ was in Cincinnati and the nonsense, I think it was the tail end, Marge shot on the Reds. She had just then, like she was out and then Cincinnati, Cincinnati Reds, Rob Dibble told me one time to save money,

they would fly in on a game day so they didn't want an extra night at the Marriott and baseball had to step in and go timeout. What if you have an electrical problem with a plane? You can't fly in the morning of. Cincinnati's had quirky owners. I just imagine like the water from Water Boy that's in like that metal container.

You told us a story about that. Yeah, we had no water in the locker room until Marvin got there. Marvin changed a lot there. Well, Marvin's grown up. He changed a lot. Now Marvin knows what he's doing. And by the way, Marvin Lewis and Doc Rivers, I always say this. What were the clippers and the Bengals before those coaches?

I don't want to hear they're not winning titles. They have created symmetry, stability, they're adult. Sometimes Mike Tomlin should win Super Bowls. Marvin Lewis wins a division. I'm good with that. And they still going to win. I remember I said that, I want to see before the season started. They're still going to win the division too.

Oh, God, no. They are. They're going to win in the – remember I told you that. You were so good until that. You'd broken stories. No, no, no, no. What's their record right now? Four and four?

No. What? Five and three. Could easily be four and four. It's this far from four and four. You're right. Might as well be four and four. Hey, a win's a win, right?

All right. Well, somebody who wants some more wins is Magic Johnson. He previously said that Lakers need to allow time for Luke Waltom to develop a young roster around LeBron. However, less than 10 games into the year, Magic reportedly met. With Luke Walton to discuss the team's slow start. Don't get it. According to Wojj and Dave McManum, they have reported that in a meeting on Tuesday

following a winless two-game trip, Magic Johnson admonished coached Luke Walton for the team's sluggish start the season. There are intense and immediate pressures on Walton to deliver the franchise a winner in short order. I love Magic. You know who Magic could get on? You know who they could get on?

They could get on Brandon Ingram, who has been. in mystifyingly average. He's been a huge disappointment this year. And suspended. It's 10 games. And he was, Rondo was suspended too. I don't get it.

All right. And just as a note, okay, L.A. has the number seven offense in the league so far. With no shooters. With 112. 12.0. Per 100 possessions. That includes three games without Rondo and the four without Brandon Ingram. They've lost three of the five games by two possessions.

Against playoff teams. Against playoff teams. And across the first seven games of the regular season, they've utilized 93 different lineups. They're behind only the Hawks who had 122 different lines. Magic Johnson. You know what? The Dodgers lost the World Series. And two days later, Magic was in a bad mood. Chill. Honestly, that's like Magic was mad because the Dodgers lost. He took it out on Luke Walton.

I mean, there's just no need to panic. There's really not. If Wozje is reporting, it's generally right. Yeah. No, I'm not saying that this. didn't happen. I'm just saying that historically, LeBron, when he moves to a new team, they start out

slow, you got to get the chemistry right, and this particular year, there's no pressure. There's only they're always going to be interesting because it's LeBron. You don't have to win right now. This is the time where you have, you have a very, very rarely do you have a grace period in sports where you can, where you're

granted time to figure things out. This is what it is. So just everyone chill. All right, so the NFL's offensive explosion to the first half of the season has brought some huge numbers. However, some don't think that this high-flying brand of football is going to last. Todd Bowles told the New York Daily News, it'll change back. It'll recycle itself. Probably not in my coaching career, but it will recycle itself. It only takes one team to have success doing that. It's a copycat league, so everyone will follow suit. Eventually,

in the next 10 years, I expect that to go back. He is talking about smash mouth football, running game, run-centered teams. I don't, I agree in that I don't, I do think that people are going to start overvaluing wide receivers. We're always not overvaluing, but obviously the quarterback is the most valuable position, the position you have to get right. I do think that people are going to start drafting receivers higher. It's going to become a point of emphasis to get that receiver because of the way the offenses are going. And then that's going to lend to somebody landing an incredibly talented dynamic running back,

Levy on Bell-esque, Ezekiel Elliott-esque, and getting a steal on them. mostly in the draft. Unless there are 32 dome teams, there will always be value after Thanksgiving, turning, handing to a running back who can get five yards. Well, I don't even think, that's totally true. But also, if you want to have a dynamic offense, you don't want to be a one-dimensional offense. So if you have a strong running game, that only lends to more. I think what Todd Bowles was talking about is, you know, this idea of this hardcore running game and getting away from the finesse. offenses. I don't know that that's going to change because the ratings, like, people obviously

love more offense. So, but we'll see. Finally, Baltimore Ravens have lost three of their past four games and Joe Flacco is coming off his worst game of the season. So naturally, the first question asked of Flacco this week was why did he shave his beard? Here's his answer. Thinking about probably cutting it every night for two weeks and it's not like we've been winning with it. So, you know, we all got a little bit of superstitions in us, I guess. Are you a Super Sissor's person? No, I used to until

probably only 10, 5 years ago, I used to, if, when I used to be more of a fan and less of a sportscaster like 10 years ago, if I was like, if I, let's say I'm watching the game and I left to go get a Diet Coke and my team scored,

then I'd stay out of the room and I'd turn the TV episode. Like, I felt like, and it's so stupid. It's so dumb. there were times. And it was always an in-room, out-of-room thing. Right. If you literally, like, for instance, you know, I had to run to the store during late second quarter.

And when I was gone, the team had two good drives. I was like, oh, crap. So maybe there's, and it's so embarrassing to admit this. No, it's not. No, I think a lot of people are superstitious like that. It was an in-room. Especially athletes, because athletes really like a routine, you know, like anything to be changed. So it almost be, for me, it's more like OCD than it is.

superstition necessarily. Once I do something a certain way and it brings like good energy, I don't like changing anything up. Yes. But I'm very much like that too. I like to eat the same thing every morning and park in the same spot. But the beard thing, I don't know. Beards are a big deal in sports too. Yes, they are. Very big deal in hockey. Yes. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herdline News. Rob Parker, Monday's headlines today. Best for Last, one of my favorite and funny segments of the week. That's coming up next.

Sunday, it's a Fox NFL doubleheader, starting with Matt Ryan and the Falcons, taking on Adrian Peterson and the Redskins. Then it's America's Game of the Week is Todd Gurley and the Undefeated Rams battle Drew Brees and the Saints. It's all on Fox in the Fox Sports app. Check local listings. All right, great weekend of college and NFL football. He's my friend. He's the FS1 Instigator.

it's best for last let's bring out rob parker yes rob parker what's happening joy our best so i have never um done this with you uh mcintyres at some uh newfangled winning or something like that is that right on a friday yeah and i see he said somebody said hey parker will do this and i said oh he's funny all right like rob parker's a u sc communications prof and so what we do we call it a little open here mondays headlines today. So you're a newspaper, man. So let's start with this. Rams

at the Saints. Are you ready? I am ready. Let's go. Saints go March and win. There we go on the Parker Post. We saw last week. I know that the Rams are right now, but Green Bay showed me a little something there.

A little crack in the armor. I think that the Drew Breeds and the Saints, they get it done and they beat the Rams, give them their first. loss of the season. Now they did come off a very emotional win or revenge win over Minnesota. Aren't you a little concern that New Orleans can't emotionally duplicate that effort? When you come off those big emotional games, everybody pulls back. No, I get that, but I also think that they probably looked and said, hey, Green Bay was, could

probably would have broken through. We have a chance. Is that something that you carry later on, right, in the NFC? Yes, by beating the Rams and being the first team to be. to beat them when on paper, Colin, they look as good as anybody. And it should be noted this could end up being a game which dictates home field advantage. That's why it's a huge game. You've got to be ready for this one. Okay, the next one, Monday's headlines today. Packers at the Patriots.

Very easy to go takes down Brady. Down goes Brady. The beginning of the end, we're starting to see the decline. Did you see last week against the Buffalo Bills? Tom Brady had how many touchdowns, Colin? None. Zero. Tom Brady, zero against the Buffalo Bills. Also, I think Aaron Rogers will be able to rip up on the Patriots defense.

That's a bad defense. 25th in the league, 27th against the pass. Look at the numbers. Blake Bortles, 376 yards, four touchdowns. They've been shredded by a number of guys this year. Trubisky had a big game against them. Andrew Luck had another big game against them. are not that good. I think this is an opening for Aaron Rogers to expose that defense.

Yeah, New England has a, I do like McCordy on the back end, but this year, their best personnel's on offense. Stefan Gilmore is a good corner, but they don't have a consistent pass rush, and when Aaron has time, he usually chops it up. Monday's headlines today, Penn State at Michigan. Harbaugh doesn't disappoint. And what I'm talking about is whenever he has to play a ranked opponent, top 15, top 15 kind of team. He's 3 and 8 at Michigan. And I know they're having this year resurgence. Everybody's all excited.

But here comes the big games that really matter. The Penn State and Ohio State, let's see if Harbaugh has really turned a corner or not. I'm not convinced so far. I think that there's a chance that they can lose to Penn State. You're a Michigan guy. They must love you at UM. So you think Penn State against this defense, by the way, if you watch this Harbaugh team it's so hard about so old school they run the ball they own time of

possession they don't turn it over and that you can't run on them no I get all of that but but the numbers say that it just hasn't happened for him now maybe this is the year that he finally turns it around and beat some of these other schools but so far it hasn't been the case this is his best team so far here it is it won't matter at all Colin unless he finishes the job and and beats pen state in Ohio State. That's fair. Rob Parker. Monday's headlines today. Lakers, two games this weekend. LeBron fires Walton.

There we go. I mean, you know what? This is the only thing I'm saying, Colin. Come on. Look at the schedule the next four games. They can lose three of them, and if they lose to Sacramento, if Sacramento's been playing well, they can lose four games. They're at the Blazers. They host Toronto will beat them.

Right. The Blazers have won. 16 straight against the Lakers. They own the Lakers. They have the Blazers, Raptors, Timberwolves, and Kings. And Timberwolves have already beaten them. I know the game is here. Did you see the story by Woj this morning that Magic

already sat Luke down? Don't you think that's odd? No, I don't think it's odd from this standpoint. You go bring LeBron James here so that you can win those games. Like losing the playoff team, people go, well, it's a playoff. No, no, no. The Lakers without LeBron lost

to those teams, you add LeBron to the you should be able to win some of those games, which they haven't done. Here's the other thing, Colin. You can't afford if you're the Lakers to be 3 and 10 to start in the Western Conference. You get buried. So magic is right that early on, don't poo-poo. That this is early in the season that doesn't matter. In this conference with how deep the conference is, you fall behind.

Remember, last year from 3 to 8 on the playoff. Out West. Out West, two games separated the third best team from the eighth. So that's how bunched up they are. And if you get behind big time, you might not climb out of it. I think magic is right. You got to think macro, not micro. There's no pressure on them to win a championship this year.

You got to get the chemistry right and get these players developed to the place where they know how to win properly. I hear that point about winning. But to win a couple games early. But to win a championship, I agree with that. No one would expect them to win a championship. but you have to be in the top four in the Western Conference. Otherwise, you might be playing the Warriors in the first round as an eighth or seventh seed

and get humiliated. And get annihilated in the first round. I don't think that's what they want. They thought that with LeBron added, that they could at least get to the top four. It doesn't look like that right now, does it? No, and that's fair. I will say, I think the Brandon Ingram enigmatic start is baffling to me. Everybody thought he was going to take his game to a new level.

He did miss four games. I know, but he just doesn't look right on the floor. He's not aggressive. Kyle Kuzma looks like he's taking a step up, and Ingram looks like he's taking a step back. Okay, Monday's headlines today, great. We're done with that. Hey, oh, do we have another one?

I don't think we have another one. No, that was it. We don't. I want to ask you this, though. What did you make a gruden last night? Pathetic? Can I use that word? Dude, really, like, when you're telling people about all the girls who like you,

I mean, I'm just like, for him to have to go on and say, I'm getting Texas from all over the league. Players want to be a Raider. Really? It should be about how you got embarrassed by undrafted quarterback who marched your team up and down the field. I mean, nobody signed up for this. People can say, oh, nobody expect the Raiders to win anything. You're right. I didn't expect them to go championship.

I thought they'd be competitive. Here's another example of talking a good game doesn't mean that you're a great coach. and we saw this. I remember in Detroit. Nobody talked a better game than Matt Millen about football. But when it came to being a GM, he wasn't able to do the job. That's fair. And that's the same thing with John Gruden.

Go back. Anybody who's into 10-year, $100 million contract, go look at his last few years in Tampa Bay. They were not good. He took Tony Dungey's team. He went to the Super Bowl and won. Give him credit. Give him a parade. But he is not the coach that everybody thinks he is.

No, he took Dungey's excellent defensive personnel. I was there. I covered that team. So I covered that Super Bowl, and you remember, they scored, the defense scored as much as the offense in that game. It was unbelievable. That was one of the great defenses in the history of the NFL. Tampa was.

They ran everything back. It was unbelievable. Tampa and the Baltimore Ravens defense with Ray Lewis and the Tampa defenses were. I covered, I was in Tampa when they were building that defense, and they were getting your Ronde Barbers and your Derek Brooks and your Warren Saps and your John Lynch. And back then Lynch was just a missile blowing people up and there was no weakness. By the way, Michael Vicks on our show Monday where Colin was right, where Colin was wrong.

I'll show you a video. So Tom Brady's going to break Rob a record this weekend. And he put something very funny on his Instagram, Tom Brady did. He needs three yards rushing to get a thousand yards rushing in his career so we can play this. We'll talk over the video. So he went to his Instagram and he put up this highly dramatic Instagram. post that he's going to break this rushing record. Pot it up here. Let the audience hear

a little of Tom Brady's Instagram post as he goes to break a record this weekend. Three more yards rushing and a thousand for his career. I guess we don't have it potted up. It's actually very funny. Very self-deprecating. You've never been, I would

say, a minute left. You've never been a huge Brady guy? No, no, no. Tom Brady's a great quarterback. I just don't think he's the greatest of all time. I think it's so overblown when you talk about it. Just go look at his highlight video of his career. Adam Venet Terry's on it for 30 minutes.

I mean, let's just be honest. Oh, come on. Seriously. When did Tom Brady? Tom Brady, when did he throw a touchdown to win the game at the end? Well, first of all, it's about winning Super Bowls not making the hero ball play in the last 12th? I'm just saying when you take a look at it, he's been the luckiest of all time. It's documented.

Go look at the Super Bowls that they've. One, every time the other team blows up but does something crazy. Carolina, Casey kicks the ball out of bounds. Gives Tom Brady the ball on the floor. Enough of this nonsense. Seattle. What are you doing? Run the football.

Nonsense. Interception. Atlanta up 28 to 3. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo.

In every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment,

and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy,

not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests. from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band

with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the 4th.

And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me, he goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Quarterback on office blue 42.

Hey, rec, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clippers show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, Famous? Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast, Point Game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest

playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was hungry. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Mark keep coming to you. He's like, you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed human.