The Herd with Colin Cowherd - LeBron Goes Down, Packers looking for a coach, Durant chasing money, and Gottlieb’s Herd Hierarchy

Episode Date: December 26, 2018

Doug Gottlieb--in for Colin--likens Los Angeles Lakers forward LeBron James to a well-made car. He’s been playing for so long at such a high level without sustaining serious injury but he is getting older. Also, there's a familiar face in Green Bay and we're pretty sure Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers wants him to be the head coach. Plus, Doug takes a shot his own version of the Herd Hierarchy. Finally, Doug makes his case for the 2018 NFL MVP. Guests include: Comedian Michael Rapaport, NFL analyst T. J. Houshmandzadeh and NBA commentator Jim Jackson. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Thanks for listening to The Heard Podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1. Find your local station for The Hurt at Fox SportsRadio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching herd. Now let's get this party started. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. What up? Welcome in. This is The Herd, wherever you may be. And however you may be listening or watching the show, thanks so much for making this part of your day. I'm Doug Gottlieb, filling in for Colin Cowherd, who at this very moment is probably going down a mountain somewhere in the state of

of Utah, Jamie Maggio, who we spent many a weekend in some of the garden spots of the NCAA tournament together, places like Spokane, Salt Lake City, a couple others, I believe, as well. You can see her on the sidelines of Clipper games, of course, Gaucho Nation celebrating that Jamie is back with us here in the herd. Do you have a Merry Christmas? Yeah, it was good. It was a nice day. I think people are weird about saying Merry Christmas.

Like the day after Christmas, you can't wish people a Merry Christmas. I don't really say. Is it over? Happy holidays? You can still say Merry Christmas. It's cool. It's the spirit of what you're saying. You're saying like, hey, hope you're having a good time.

Right. Like, I'm Jewish. My wife is Christian. Like, I've never understood the offense over like, happy holidays, marry everything. Like, look, you can just be Merry Christmas. I understand. It's coming from a spirit of like, hey, hope you're having a good time this time. Do you celebrate both, by the way?

We do. I don't celebrate both. Like my kids. The kids benefit. Yeah, they do quite well. They do quite well. We had a great holiday. glad you did too. Thanks so much for joining us. We have an outstanding show for you. Chris Broussardle,

join us. We'll talk about yesterday's NBA action where the Celtics dominate the Sixers in overtime. My thoughts on Kyrie Irving on how his superstardom has gotten buried partially because of who he played with previously, maybe more than who he's playing with now. We also want to talk about LeBrono. Get to that in a moment. And the sudden struggles of Russell Westbrook to simply make a free throw, what's going on in Oklahoma City. Michael Rappaport will join us. I'm sure we'll argue about something pertaining to sports, maybe non-sports, and T.J. Hushman Zada will join us, and we'll talk about upcoming Week 17 football, games like Vikings Bears, where Kirk Cousins has to proven prime time that he can lead his team to the playoffs.

You win and you're in if you're the Vikings. It really is that simple. But let's start with something we saw from LeBron yesterday, which we've never seen before. look, people who are pro LeBron, like the guy who usually occupies this chair, like to use smart arguments that show you the greatness of LeBron James, right? The statistical dominance, the 15 years of excellence. Part of that is helped by the fact that he didn't go to college, so he's been playing consecutively. He didn't retire for a year and a half the way that Michael Jordan did. Like, we create arguments of, hey, we've never seen this sort of, like, look, when Jordan had a

full season with the team, six consecutive years, he won an NBA title. There was the year and a half off. He did come back. They did lose the Orlando Magic. That all did happen. But we can create this, hey, level of dominance we've never seen before, which is true because of the longevity of it, but also because he was really the second or third incarnation of guys that came straight at a high school and have played consecutively in the NBA and played in the same conference, dominated that same conference. But what I've always said, I'm in the middle. Like, I think LeBron's incredible. I'm still not willing to say he's the greatest player I've ever seen. You can use the stats to help you. I would point out that every stat for NBA players is up because of more three point shots,

more possessions, an emptier lane. We've created a more offensive game. Just like in the NFL, heck, we're going to have a 5,000 yard passer and 10, 11, or 12 other 4,000 yard passers. Why? Because people who run sports leagues have figured out that we as Americans want to see more scoring. So stats are up. So if you want to use stats to help your argument, that's great. But those of us who understand, if there is a control group, everyone's stats are going up. But what we've seen from LeBron, I've said this sitting on this couch, I've said it back when Colin first was launching shows here, even back to his old shows,

is the amazing part about LeBron is he's never been hurt. He's never been hurt. he's taking games off, but he's never really been hurt. Like Kobe five knee surgeries. Kobe had to go and get the cells spun in Europe. Kobe had the Achilles tendon. Kobe got banged up. Michael Jordan in his second year had the foot injury.

So even though he came back and dropped 63 on the Celtics in the playoffs, taking a below 500 team into Boston Guard, one of the most heroic performances we've ever seen, the fact is he did miss most of a season because of injury. The brunt's never been hurt. And yesterday, he, by his own words, felt a pop, said it's not that big a deal and pulled his groin. And in the litany of possible bad injuries, this one is at the very bottom in terms of scare factor on the scale, right? It's not a knee.

It's not a back. It's not a hip. It's not an Achilles. Though it is soft tissue, it doesn't seem to be one of those. It's not like he tore the groin off the bone, right? This is not something that's going to be a debilitating injury. But if you've ever owned a really well-made car, and I've owned several, my wife had a luxury brand SUV, and I'm telling you, we've owned a lot of automobiles.

I mean, a lot. I go through them a lot. I chew them out. I drive a lot, and I don't do the greatest job of taking care of them. But it was one of those deals where we bought it. We knew it was well-made. we got the extended warranty on everything and the extended warranty on the drive train. And the extended warranty went to 80,000 miles.

You know, they say like bumper to bumper with a couple exceptions. Those exceptions were covered up to 80,000 miles. And wouldn't you know it? Once we got to 82,000 miles, remarkably, something happened with a hose. Well, the hose gets fixed. And then it was the transmission. And then something with the drive train. And it began the, wait a second.

We went from having the best made car where all the door seals were perfect, the entertainment, there was no rattles. Like, isn't anything, there's nothing worse than you buy a car and all of a sudden you hear a rattle. It's like a rattle in a car is like a cricket in a house. You can't find it. You can't fix it. You can't kill it. And once it's there, it just feels like it's there.

There's no rattles. It was, the fit and finish of this car was perfect. But it got to 82, 82,000 miles and now there's something wrong. 85,000 miles the transmission, 92,000 miles, and the drive train had problems. And look, the car company was nice enough to fix it, and it was still fine. But this is the car that lugs around my three kids and my wife. And the last thing you want to do is she's driving to go ski or driving to go to soccer or basketball game and stuck on the side of the road. Like, on to the next.

Well, you can't do that, obviously, with human beings. We're not going to throw LeBron James onto the next. We're not going to trade him in. But when you sign a guy in his mid-30s that has played more minutes, more games than anybody in the sport since his rookie year, this is the biggest fear that anyone who signs a more than one-year contract with any superstar in his mid-30s could ever have. Forget the fact that he's already taking more plays off. Forget the fact that he doesn't move nearly the way he used to move. LeBron James has become a different version of himself.

He still essentially plays point card, but he's shooting a lot more jump shots. He has that kind of weird dribble right step back to his left shot. He's developed a little bit more of a post game. He still is explosive going, you know, going downhill. But he's not the lith that he was earlier in his career. But now all of a sudden, you pop a groin. All right, you're out a week. You're out two weeks.

The fear is not the groin. The fear is the groin leads to the hamstring, leads to the calf, leads to the back, leads to the knee. This is the, this is what happens when you get older. It just is. You wake up and you're like, what hurts? It all hurts. And I don't know why. I didn't do anything.

All he did was eat Christmas dinner last night and throw the football with my nephew. And now my shoulders killing me like I got a rotator cup. I got to call Dr. James Andrews. We've never seen this before. This dude never gets hurt. It's crazy. Now, is it helped by the fact that he's bigger and stronger? Sure.

But it could be hurt by that. Because instead of delivering the punishment, because he's 6'8, 6'8, 6 foot 9, 260 pounds, now a sudden he's delivering the punishment to his own body. It's why he wanted to be lighter this year. Because he knows you put all that stress. I tell people all the time. who are former basketball players like, man, I got to get back in shape.

I want to get back to playing. I was like, look, before you get back to playing, you need to get at or below your playing weight. Because five pounds more on your body when you're five years or 10 years older than when you were playing, and your body does not respond the same. I think the Lakers plan is clearly working. Are they going to shoot as well as they shot last night? No.

Are the warriors screwed up and is their bench? as their bench aged right before our eyes. People haven't paid attention to Sean Livingston's essentially washed, and Andre Godala doesn't move nearly the way he used to. And they're playing with, you know, Kavon Looney, who's a backup center as their starter because they're waiting for DeMarcus cousins. And oh, yeah, by the way, no one's mentioning that Draymond Green, no one's guarding him.

It's four on five on offense, and he's not nearly as effective defensively as used to be. And Clay Thompson went Casper, the friendly ghost and disappeared. Like, these are all, look, the Lakers plan is working. They wanted competitive veteran dudes who weren't scared of going in to Golden State. And using Zubach, using a true big guy against the Warriors late last night was genius. Brilliant.

But as much as this plan of the younger players shooting at a higher percentage because of age and experience in the league and the emergence of Kyle Kuzma is right before our eyes. As much as the plan of let's get some competitive dudes that aren't scared of any situation, you play them five, you play them 45 minutes, they're going to be fine. That's where it only comes together if LeBron's on the floor when it matters. And the biggest fear that anyone who's reasonable has is by the time the Lakers get to where they can compete for a title, he's too banged up to do it. It's what happens to all of them. It's what happens to all of them.

Like Jason Kidd went from an All-Star to he couldn't make a layup in the playoffs. Couldn't make a layup, couldn't make a shot. Now, I'm not saying that's where we are with LeBron. Not close. There's a different scale. LeBron's an all-time great, and this is the first, but you pop a groin and you hold your breath because you wonder whether or not this is just a leaky hose that can be fixed and the drive train and transmission's all good, or this is, hey, once he had 80,000 miles on any car, they're going to start to break down.

A lot of tread off those tires. A lot of tread off those tires. All right, coming up next, something else we've never seen before. A superstar player saying, you know what? I want this guy to be my coach. And you'll never guess who said it. I'll tell you next. I'm Doug Gottlieb.

This is The Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app. Doug Gottlieb, Jamie Maggio. In for Colin here in the herd. And, of course, lovely Joy Taylor, also having some days off. You know, it's funny, Jamie, you live in a beach city. I live in a beach city.

And I was driving to work with a buddy today. And you travel and covering the Clippers. I travel and covering college basketball and occasionally covering the NFL here for Fox. And, you know, it's one of those things where you go, like I was in D.C. for a Georgetown game. It was raining. you know, and you're like, man, I kind of miss weather. And then I woke up this morning and I'm driving in and it's 65 degrees.

I'm like, I don't actually miss the weather that. I want, I like snow, but then I want it to be all gone. I want the Denver thing, right? Denver has that. Well, that is massive snowstorm that's like 75 the next day. Like that I think I can handle more than when it's snowing and cold for four or five months. This morning was weather for me. I was cold this morning driving in, freezing.

I'm glad you actually pointed out. Later on. It is. It was, it was, no, no, no, no. This is, this is true. And here's why the Rams, thankfully for the Rams, I don't believe if they win this weekend, they'll have to go on the road to a place like Chicago, why they were so uncomfortable.

Look, if you live out here, even if you're, and I've lived 12 of the last 16 years, I've lived on the East Coast. Okay. So I should be hardened by it. I should be. And weather doesn't usually affect me. I went to the Charger game with Colin, my son, one of his buddies, Jacob Oldman here, who we work with. We all went to the Chargers Ravens game.

And Clay Travis gave me grief on Twitter because I bought a beanie. Now, I was wearing a polo shirt, but I bought a beanie. My son needed a sweatshirt, got him a, he won a Beanie hat, whatever. We both got Chargers beanies. You can call it a stocking cap, whatever they call it, depending on where you live. He said there's a toboggan in the south. I thought a toboggan is actually a sled. But anyway.

And I was like, look, the coldest day on record is 50 degrees in Southern California. You got to understand. Like, we're used to 70 every day. You get 50 or 48 and a little breeze coming through. It just, it thins the blood. It makes, it freaks you out, which is where you were this morning with the seed here. And I'm from New York. I grew up on the East Coast and I'm embarrassed to say that I was cold.

Don't be embarrassed. Don't be embarrassed. It's okay. Like, look, if it's in New York, if it's usually 40 and it's 20, you're like, man, that's cold. All right. Well, when it's usually 70. And it's 48 or 47 when you're driving in. Like, that's, that's, that's, that's,

see, listen, seat heaters are fine. What's the point, point of having, having a little cash. You're not going to spend it on the seed heater. You know, something we don't ever hear from athletes is ownership of management. And here's what I mean. Or ownership of management decisions. I just tire of players saying, that's out of my hands. You know, I don't, I don't make, we've heard it from.

LeBron with the coaching changes. He has nothing to do with it, nothing at all to do with it. Now, this wasn't a, this wasn't Jimmy Chitwood from Hoosier's moment, right? If you remember, Jimmy Chitwood wasn't playing. Gene Hackman was the coach. He was under duress. They have a town hall meeting. They take a vote whether or not they want to keep the coach, not keep the coach.

And then Jimmy Chitwood walks in and says, I think it's time for me to start playing ball. And everybody goes crazy and he goes, there's just one thing. Um, coach, coach stays, I play. Coach goes, I go. And all of a sudden they're like, ah, we want a new vote, right? Like that's the ultimate Jimmy Chitwood moment. This was not Jimmy Chitwood. This is not he stays, I play, he goes, I go.

But take a listen to what Aaron Rogers said at a press conference yesterday in regards to, uh, excuse me, Sunday, in regards to his acting head coach and whether or not he wants to play this Sunday. We have matters for pride. It matters for Joe. We love Joe. We want to play for Joe and give him the best opportunity possible. So he didn't say, I want to play for Joe, I only play for Joe, hire Joe.

He didn't say that. On the other hand, at least saying we all love Joe, we want to give him the best opportunity possible. Like if you're Aaron Rogers, and we've all tried to read the tea leaves on Aaron Rogers, And he's not exactly a poker player in terms of having a poker face as to whether or not he enjoyed playing for Mike McCarthy at the end, right? There was a lot of eye rolling. There was a lot of, it was like, look, I have a 12-year-old daughter and a 9, a 12-year-old daughter, a 9-year-old son, and none of them are good at hiding their emotions. Like, they overroll their eyes. Like, roll their eyes and head.

And honestly, that's been Aaron Rogers recently in regards to he and Mike McCarthy's relationship. but at least saying like, hey, I like this dude. I want to give this guy an opportunity. Like at some point, we'll be able to read the tea leaves. This wasn't, again, this was not a Jimmy Chitwood hire this guy moment or keep him and I stay happy moment. But if Aaron Rogers wants to truly control his own destiny, he can. Now, you can do it behind the scenes, but you can also do it in the public. put a tremendous amount of pressure on Goudicund,

who's their new general manager. This is the guy I want. This is the guy who will fix things. This is the guy who will hold me accountable. So I think it's going to be fascinating to see how much Aaron Rogers plays this weekend as he said he's wanted to play. He said some of it. He mentioned Brett Farr, now he mentions his acting head coach Joe Philbin,

who has been a head coach before. It stands to reason that Green Bay is going to hire a Green Bay, guy. You're like, well, no. Hey, look, President, General Manager, they hired a General Manager who has only been in Green Bay. Green Bay does not feel like we're going to hire outside the family. And so Joe Filbin does seem to check that box and he has been a head coach before, albeit not a successful one in Miami. But I'd be fascinated to hear Aaron Rogers' comments post-game Sunday. If you want Joe Philbin, he can be your coach. All you have to say is, I want Joe Filbin. say it into an open microphone, it likely happens.

And if you don't or you kind of do the, well, you know, we just wanted to give him a good opportunity to show what he could do. We get it. We can read the tea leaves. But the whole LeBron thing, which so many guys do, look, I don't control the coaching stuff. That's above my pay grade. That's not true.

You're the quarterback. You just signed the biggest contract to anybody had ever gotten. You're the face of that franchise. If you want Joe Philbin, say you want Joe Philbin, and it's likely to be done. Here's Jamie Maggio with news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news.

This is the herd line news. So Doug Tom Brady finally showing some signs of aging this season. But he's expressed his desire to play beyond this season. In a weekly interview with Westwood One's Jim Gray, Brady was asked about playing for the Patriots in 2019 and beyond. And he said that is his goal. Do we have a tweet? We have sound for you. listen to this.

I absolutely believe I will. I know I've talked about it for a long time. You know, I have goals to play not only next year but beyond that. I'm going to give it everything I have like I always have. I hope I can keep playing. I hope I can keep playing at a championship level. I've been able to be in a career for 19 years that I love and I wake up every day, excited to go to work.

And I don't think there's any greater gift in my life than to have that. In my heart and soul, you know, I love playing the sport of football. he hasn't played well recently. Matter of fact, he's played poorly recently. Now, some of it is Rob Gruncowski didn't have a catch in the game. Like three targets, one ball went right through his hands, became an interception. But he hasn't played well. Some people think Tom Brady's not healthy, that it's his knee, tweaked his knee a couple of games ago. Some people think it's just age or the fact that he doesn't have any sort of playmakers around him. But he's made it pretty obvious that even though his wife doesn't want him to play, he wants to play. Even though his coach probably would have. prefer to have a younger model by now. He wants to play. There's a few guys I want to take their word for it, but he's not only fought off father time. He's fought off people who really care for him,

who want him to stop playing football. I think he's going to keep playing football. That love of the game is so intense. And when you've had the success that he's had, I can only imagine the draw to keep playing, right? But you know what I hate? I just don't want to see him right off. I'm not a Patriots fan.

I'm not a Tom Brady fan. I appreciate the success that he's had and the way that he plays the game. But I hate when guys get to the end of their career and they just can't hang it up, and then they ride off into the sunset limping, all banged up and bruised. They go Emmett Smith and they go sign with the Cardinals.

They go Joe Montana put with the Chiefs. But he doesn't want to go, remember. He's not going to go anywhere else. Right. I think the question becomes, does he want to be Peyton Manning? Paid Manning technically won a Super Bowl his last game, but he was terrible.

He was so bad, in fact, that he was injured and replaced by Brock Osweiler, right? Nine touchdowns, 17 interceptions in his last season as a start. Like, that's not Peyton Manning. But he did win a Super Bowl. So I just, I feel like, I feel like Brady might be in that like, hey, look, I'm just to ride this thing out.

We're going to keep getting in, you know, we're always going to be there. And if it works out, we win a Super Bowl, then I call it quits. I just, look, I respect the fact that you can play longer because they can't touch you at quarterback, right? It's not like he's going to lose, he's going to lose some stuff, but he can still be himself as long as he can throw a football. and they're in a division where, you know, I think the Jets will be better next year, but are the Jets, you're going to pick the Jets to beat the Patriots?

What happens with the dolphins? What happens with the – like, you still – they're going to be the playoffs next year as long as he plays. So why would you stop if you feel like you can give yourself another chance of winning another Super Bowl? 42 years old by the time next season starts. LeBron James has said that he will keep recruiting players to join the Lakers. In an interview with Rachel Nichols, LeBron said, that he's always recruited. I don't think it would be that hard to get guys to L.A.,

but we've got to win. I'm looking forward to when guys come up for free agency. I'll be at their doors. I'll be on their phones, seeing how we can continue to help this franchise be an elite franchise. I actually do think he meant it when he's pretty much burned Cleveland there. You know, he because he looked at the camera and be like, I've always been recruiting.

I tried to recruit guys to Cleveland. He's like, he was saying, look, I'm awesome. I've always been awesome. I've wanted other guys to play with me, and they wouldn't come to Cleveland because Cleveland sucks. That's what he said. He didn't say the Cleveland sucks part. He basically said all the other stuff. He insinuated.

He insinuated it. And again, that doesn't mean that it's not the truth. That's selling people on whether it's playing for that owner or playing that city is not a hard sale. I also, there's a portion of playing with LeBron is not always the easiest thing. But I don't think that needs to be said. What he could have said, and he's very bright. He knows what he's saying with his words. He has control of what he's saying.

He could have said, like, look, I've always recruited guys, and for whatever reason it hasn't worked out, I feel like this is the best possible scenario with where am my career, location, Magic Johnson, Rob Polinka, but that's not what he said, right? He said, I've always recruited guys, couldn't get him to come to Cleveland. Now I'm in L.A. shouldn't be that hard. Do you think it's just Cleveland versus L.A.? Or do you think that there's an element to, because, listen, I've been to Laker games this season. I've been in those post-game media scrums where you're literally,

like throngs of media are jockeying for position in front of LeBron's locker. You can't go try and get a soundbite with Kyle Kuzma, Brandon Ingram, Monso Ball, because you've got to stand in front of LeBron's locker and hold your position because if you move out of there, you're going to not be able to get back in and penetrate the media scrum to get your LeB and everybody wants the LeBron soundbite. So I think a star player has to come to L.A. knowing that it is LeBron at 1A and whoever it is at 1B. No question. No question.

He's in, if he doesn't, think that he is at least a part of the reason that guys do and do not want to go there, he's blind. But, you know, his agent, who's his best friend, does, in fact, represent some of these players. So it's all in how the message is sent. But I didn't love, I understood, Rachel Nichols did that interview over a week ago, so they couldn't ask him about some of the social media missteps and what he said on the, what was that show?

the shop, right? Like she couldn't ask about that. It was pretty much a softball question. But he said, I'm going to recruit, and I've always been recruiting. I felt like he slammed Cleveland and he didn't need to. Like, we got it. We understand what Cleveland is. But I'm not sure if he understands who he is and how he's viewed by some of his contemporaries.

Interesting. Finally, Doug, Kevin Durant on Free Agency. He said, nobody can recruit me anymore. So I guess if LeBron shows up on his doorstep, getting on his phone, it's not going to matter, because apparently he's got. a different mindset these days. So he spoke to Chris Haynes on the posted up podcast. Ain't nobody can recruit me no more.

Why is that? I want to dictate an environment that I want to be in. So it's just like, you know, you can't give me the bells and whistles and be like, I'd rather see what you do on the day-to-day basis. That stuff really doesn't impress me. Arenas and doing extra shit just for me. Like, nah.

I just want to see. if you're a real person, if we're going to hold people accountable every day, or we're going to all come to work and enjoy basketball every day? Yeah, exactly what I'm getting here. I don't know. Duran's clearly searching for meaning to life, for respect from people. And I actually kind of feel for KD.

I do. Do you feel for him? I do. I honestly have sympathy for Kevin Durant. Here's why. I think he's the best player in the NBA. I think he's been the best player in the NBA for a couple years now, especially last year he started to pick it up,

defensively. He, he, people, well, can't win a title. All right, so he won a title. Well, you're not as good as LeBron James. Like, I guard LeBron James. He guarded me. And in the second half of NBA Finals games, I was the better player. I made the dagger shots.

Whether he had a surrounding cast his first year in Cleveland or didn't have a friend, didn't matter. I was the better player. And he's proven that on the actual basketball. He wants the respect. Remember, last time they played together Team USA. Kevin Durant was the go-to guy, not LeBron James. Those are all facts.

but he doesn't feel like he gets to love. He deserves because he's trying to get love from this thing. Okay? He's trying to get. He's, the Sky Report on Kevin Rant is, man, he's good going right.

He's good going left. He's good in the post. He's good outside the three. He can pass better than you think. He can block shots. What's the negative? He can't handle social media. He just,

he's addicted to it, and it's a super negative vortex that he gets sucked down by. And so now he's like, I don't want bells and whistles. I don't want to recruit it. I want to go to what place to work. He also in the same interview said, look, I just want to get paid.

Where do you think he ends up next season? I think he plays in Golden State. See, I, okay, with or without Dremont? Because I think that that beef is not going to just simmer down. I think that stays around and messes up the underlying chemistry. I wouldn't be surprised if they move on from Dremont. I don't think it's because of the beef. I think the beef covers up the fact that Dremont hadn't been very good in a while.

He cannot make a shot. You do not guard. It's four on five on offense. And as good as he is on defense, like, once they have DeMarcus cousins, now of a sudden he has to play the power forward position. He's not playing the center. His versatility defensively isn't as valuable when they're not playing small ball. So I don't know how all that works out.

Look, I have had some of the most vicious arguments with guys who I love who I played with. I played with a guy named Joe Atkins in college, and we used to go at it. And he is one of my best, dearest friends because we hold each other accountable. So I actually get that. I don't think that, I don't think that resonates as much. Because I could still, I could play with Joe Atkins today. I could do whatever I want because he's, we're that close to friends. But I, so I, but I think it's, I just think, end of the day, you keep winning titles.

You win five, six titles in Golden State. It doesn't matter what they say about you got the rings to prove it. But because of the very fact that you said, he's so worried about what people say on social media, so worried about legacy. Don't you think he would take the opportunity to go to a different franchise? and try to bring them to glory or try to be the man on that team? It would make sense, right? Like you go to New York. If you're the guy who can save the New York Knicks, you're going to be a hero.

The problem is he's also Brighton knows history and knows that players from Carmelo to like Penny Hardaway to Amari Stadamire to Jason Kidd, coaches, Pat Riley has tried, Jeff Van Gundy has tried, Bill Jackson has tried, Larry Brown has tried. Like they've all tried to climb Mount Kilimanjaro and they've all done. died somewhere before the summit, right? So I do think there, and New York, if you don't, if you can't handle negative press, brother, you shouldn't go to New York. Like, don't go to New York.

Trust me, I live there. I work there. Don't go there. Because every game does, in fact, matter more. But I, you know, so I, the answer to the L.A. teams. One of the L.A. teams. I don't think he's going to Lakers to play for LeBron.

And I don't see him going to play with the Clippers. With the Clippers, right? He just said, like, arenas, that stuff. Like, I want to see where. Now, look, the Clippers have, as you know, they've tried to change their cults. Sure. Yeah, big time. Create this environment.

You got like Jerry West, that's a pretty strong sale. You got the money who's pretty strong sale. They're over- You got the money to sign them too. Yeah, but it's still the Clippers, man. I just, I have nothing wrong. I grew up here. No one chooses the Clippers of the Lakers.

It's literally never happened in the history of the world. Unless you're looking to go leave your mark somewhere. I don't know. I'm just saying. It'll be interesting to see what he does. I just don't see him staying in Golden State. And that's Jamie Maggio with the news. Well, that's the news.

And thanks for stopping by. The Heard Lye News. Have you guys seen Pat Mahomes' numbers? Like, I know we do this. And I don't know when MVP became such a big thing. I think it's because of the daily shows like this one, like Undisputed, like Speak for Yourself, where we do need something to talk about as the season goes on. But has anybody actually taken a peek at Pat Mahomes' numbers?

I believe now the updated odds, he's a slight favorite over Drew Brees to win the NFL's MVP. And this is not a slam at Drew Breeze, but in no way should the MVP be a career, a career participation award, right? Like a legacy award. It's what have you done this year? And there's a very good chance. The Saints likely end up two or three games ahead in the loss column,

the win column of the Kansas Chiefs. Granted, they're in a different conference. They play against a different – and if you want to sit there and go like, well, the Raiders stink and the Bronco stink, remember, the Saints play. in a division where the second best team is the Atlanta Falcons, right? So they have six wins, although they've only won five of them, and they barely beat the

Falcons in Atlanta. They have six wins a year. And now they're going to get the Carolina Panthers with a backup quarterback, and Drew Brie's not even going to play. So if you want to talk about level of competition, okay, the chiefs play in a division with another 11-win team, advantage Pat Mahomes. But think about this. He's going to throw for 50 touchdown passes.

He's going to throw for 5,000 yards. His passer rating is, and all their passer ratings are up, but he's second in the NFL. His yards per attempt, so this is not dink and dunk. Like even though he does that little forward shovel pass that for some reason we choose to give him credit for a forward pass when he throws it to Tyreek Hill on a little shovel pass jet sweep, it's still 8.7 yards in a temp.

he's throwing the football downfield. Their defense is terrible. Yes, he turned the ball over five times against the Rams in the Monday night football game, which is as good a football game as entertaining a game as we could have ever watched. They scored 51 points. What?

So, like, I love that we hold him somehow responsible for his team, even Sunday night. Like, he didn't play terribly. Russell Wilson probably outplayed him. But Russell Wilson also has a better defense. Russell Wilson also didn't lose his starting running back to a domestic violence deal in the middle of the season. He lost his starting running back. He has no defense.

His team is going to have the number one seed in the AFC. He's likely going to throw for 50 touchdown passes in 5,000 yards. What am I missing? I'm not a Chief's fan. I've told people all year that the only thing I'm enjoying more than watching Pat Mahomes throw the ball in the regular season is the remarkably predictable home loss after a lead in the first half at home in the playoffs. Why? Because they're the chiefs, because they're coached by Andy Reed, because it just feels like that happens every year. And they haven't won a home playoff game

since 1993. All of that said, like we're really searching, working really hard if we want to give the MVP to Drew Breeze, who's got a better defense, a better running game, has a better home field advantage because he's playing in the dome, which plays more to his arm strength or lack thereof at this age. They both have great play callers. They both have good players around them. They both have good home field advantages,

but I do think that Breeze helps him more. His defense is clearly better. And Breeze plays against an inferior division. And Patma Holmes, when they've lost, hasn't played poorly. Matter of fact, they haven't scored less than 25 points in any game this season. The offense isn't losing them games, buddy. It's the fellas on the other side. We're trying way too hard not give this guy the MVP. He's been the best player on the best

team in the AFC. He should win the MVP. An NBA champion and All-Star needs more respect. I'll tell you who. Next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays at noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. along with Jamie Maggio. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is the herd wishing you a very, very happy new years. We get ready for bowl season. We get ready for week 17 in the National Football League, which leads you to playoffs. Got eight games on Fox this upcoming Sunday.

Man, do we have a great sports weekend, and we will prepare you for it all. Plus, of course, we got some coverage of all of yesterday's NBA games, which it started out with the game in New York with the Knicks. and like, look, the Knicks are just not good. Got a chance to see Janice and Tenacompo and the Milwaukee Bucks go in and get a win. But then you saw an overtime game where Kyrie Irving and the Celtics

just boat-raced the Sixers in overtime. He was the best player on the floor, and there were several other all-stars, including Joel Embedde, Jimmy Butler, Ben Simmons, even his own teammate, Jason Tatum, who many thought, I don't know how that's going to

work between the two of them. Now, it hasn't been perfect for the Celtics this season. I'm not going to sit here and tell you that they have had a dream season. They've had injuries. They've had a little bit of dysfunction. Kyrie Irving did not get off to a great shooting start himself this season. But when you watch last night, you're like, holy hell, I forgot how good Kyrie Irving is. On a team loaded with talent, he drops 40. 40. He had another one of these games against the Wizards going back about a week and a half where he and John Wall went at it.

And you're like, that guy is the best guard I've seen on the floor this year. But there's this weird thing. And Jamie, you asked about somebody coming to L.A. and playing with LeBron. I think there's a little bit of that with Kyrie, where LeBron has this incredible, he, like, sucks up all the energy in the room. Like, does he provide the room with more energy? Yes.

But he also, like, all the attention through no fault of. of his own belongs to him. It's the same way he plays, where even if you're going to score, like he wants to be the guy that passes to you, so then you can score. Or, you know, he does this thing where he'll, when he first saw Kyrie,

when Kyrie was playing for the Celtics, where he rubs you on the head as if, like, you're his little brother. You're never going to be his equal. Even after you leave, there's still the kind of residual effect of playing with LeBron. It reminds me of Paul Rudd.

How so? So Paul Rudd, when was the first time you saw Paul Rod in a movie? Was it? Clueless. Clueless? Which is a great movie. Okay. Don't judge me.

No, no, I'm not judging you. You do have a little silverstone to you. A little share thing going on to Alicia Silverstone. You do have a little Alicia Silverstone to you. Like, talk about somebody I've never mentioned before. But when you think of that movie, he's like, he's not mentioned in the, when you think of that movie, that. That's what, her and Stacey Dasper's in that movie too, right?

Yeah, she was. Right, like that's who you think of in that movie. There are, um, uh, 40 year old virgin. Yes, so good. But that, that movie wasn't about him. Steve Crowell, right? Anchorman. Right.

He's in that, like he's Brian Fantana, right? He's in that movie, but, and I understand that part of that is the role in which he plays. But then all of a sudden you saw him in like, I love you man. You're like, wow, that guy can carry a movie. You see him in Ant Man. like he can carry a movie. He's been these kind of bit players with Jason Siegel, as, as overshadowed him in the past. And who else has he been in movies with?

What's the one? Seth Rogan, right? Like, he's part of that crew where he's been, he's been with a couple of different crews where he's one of those guys. Like, I like that guy. He's really good. But you don't know whether or not on his own, he's almost the opposite of Draymond Green. Like, Draymond Green with the Warriors, people think he's a Hall of,

famer. But if you put Draymond Green on his own team, like, that dude can't go and get you points. Like, he's a superstar role player, perfect role with that team. But he can't go and carry a team. Kyrie Irving was some sort of

subsidiary role to LeBron James, whether or not, and people don't even mention, like, he hit the big shot in game seven. Yes, LeBron had arguably the greatest and most important block in NBA finals history when he tracked down Andreo Goda. Let's not undersell that.

And there's only one field goal scored, and I think the last two and a half minutes of that game, that was scored by Kyrie Irving. But we don't mention it. Some of it's LeBron. Some of it is the media and how we cover LeBron, how we focus on one superstar. Then you watch him last night,

you're like, damn, that guy is. I would think if you pulled the average American, you'd say like top five point guards in the NBA, you'd start with Russell Westbrook, in addition to Chris Paul. and of course you got Steph Curry. You know, you got James Harden. And you're like, what about Kyrie?

You're like, well, you know, he was the other guy with LeBron, and he's always hurt. And he's, he wasn't that good before LeBron. Remember, they couldn't win. Like, no one actually wants to report the fact that David Griffin has said, he said it on my radio show. The reason we were bad was not just that we were young and we didn't have LeBron. We were trying to be bad. We were tanking. We were trying to get the number one overall pick.

you know what? It worked. That's why we had Wiggins that we could trade in order to get Kevin Love. But nobody wants to hear that. They're just like, hey, you know, he couldn't win before LeBron. And the Celtics won last year without him. And so he's fine. He's really, really good. But he's not, if you watched him play yesterday on the same floor with Ben Simmons, and Schoenbitt, Jimmy Butler, and Jason Tatum, those guys are all really good players. Kyrie Uring was the best player on the floor. It wasn't really. all that close. And it's just, it's interesting, the LeBron effect,

and this is going to affect people in the offseason where there's enough guys. They're like, dude, I get it. I got a chance at a ring. Seems to be working in L.A., but I'm watching Kyrie Irving still have to, like have to re-prove himself to the world, and even that might not be enough.

Dwayne Wade, Dwayne Wade was an NBA finals MVP. But because he played with the Bronn and won two titles and lost two others, he was seen as, well, Dwayne Wade's more role player. somehow a massive notch below LeBron James. That's kind of the LeBron effect. And I feel like Kyrie Irving's the Paul Rudd of the NBA. I do like Paul Rudd.

Kevin Durant seems to be searching for something. At the end of the season, he just might find it. I'll explain what it is next. I'm Doug Gottlieb. That's Jamie Maggio. This is The Herd. Want more Herd? The Herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week, within the IHeart Radio app.

Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. What up? Welcome in. This is The Herd. It's that Colin says wherever you may be and however you may be listening to the show. Thanks so much for making this part of your day. Alongside the lovely and talented Jamie Maggio, I'm Doug Gottlieb, Joy Taylor, Colin Cowherd, getting some well-deserved respite. Cowherd somehow going down the ski slope.

Colin! Colin! What's your blazing fire for the wing? Callie, what's your herd hierarchy? Watch Godley. We got the herd hierarchy upcoming the show. Michael Rappaport, actor, Hooper, Potster, extraordinaire will join us in merely five minutes.

There's this expression that guys have. I don't know, Jamie, if women have this expression, where you're like, man, that guy's got it all figured out, right? do you guys ever use that to describe women like she's got it all figured out do you ever do that no i don't think so it's it is kind of a guy thing because most of us guys like we can't figure stuff out we just can't so when it does figure it out we don't read social care breaking yes like we don't read social cues particularly well you know like that's honestly the thing with with god that's like i think most males biggest problems is we just we don't read signs we just don't we just kind

of plow through life as if everybody thinks the way that we think Problems with women, it's because they think every woman is into them. Why? Because they're not reading any signs. They're not actually looking for signs. They just assume that any positive sign means, well, I'm in, right? It's the same reason that I think homophobia occurs because they believe that every homosexual guy should be into them. They're not.

They're just not. They are not into every heterosexual male. Matter of fact, they're not into most heterosexual males. It just not. But again, the heterosexual male, I believe, does not. read signs at all because we don't have life figured out. So when a guy does have it figured out, we all go like, hey, he's got it all figured out. So I don't think that KD is the exception. I think he's the norm. Like I think he's 95% of males in America where it doesn't matter what you have

money, you don't have money. Like he still, he's 30 years old. He's a two-time NBA finals MVP, one-time NBA MVP. He's a gold medalist, and he's a two-time NBA champion that has probably $100 million in the bank. He's got a Nike deal, other deals. He does stuff in Silicon Valley. He does stuff in New York City. He's got everything, and he's going to be a free agent so he can get a huge contract and pick his next destination this upcoming off season after likely or possibly, after watching last night, winning another NBA title. He should have it all figured out, but he doesn't because like most guys he's still kind of searching. It's trying to figure it out. Take a listen. This is, he sat down with Chris Haynes on Chris

Haynes podcast and he had this to say about what he's now looking for in upcoming free agency. I just want to make sure I get as much money as I can my next deal so I can stack up my money and figure it out. That's just a plan, play basketball and stack money. They are giving us money to play ball. Yeah. So why can't I work as hard as I can to get the most that I can for myself? Nothing wrong with that. You can get, and by the way, if that's a sign, you know,

the Golden State Warriors can pay him far more money than anybody else based upon how the collective bargaining agreement works. So if you're looking for a sign of whether or not he'll stay, it's I want to make the most money. You can make the most money in Golden State. Do you stay there? He also in the same podcast said he doesn't want fanfare. He wants somewhere where he wants to go to work.

was like, okay, well, if you're not enjoying playing for the Warriors, but you want the most money, those two ideals kind of conflict, right? It's because he's searching for, he's just looking for something. He strikes me as a guy who's not all that happy. And this is not abnormal, right? Like, what do they say about guys with a Porsche? It's midlife crisis time. You start losing a little bit of hair.

You might lose your wife. You're like, you know what? I'm going to go buy a Porsche because, that shows that I've made it. I got a little bit money. And guys think that women are into a guy at a Porsche where most women are like, he bought a Porsche because he's hiding something, right? Most women think at a younger age, it's not because of hair loss or the midlife crisis. It's overcompensating for lacking in other areas. There you go. Okay. So, but, but that's what, that's, KD is telling you that he's, wants to overcompensate for something else that's

missing in his life, whether it's a, whether it's a family or feeling respect or admiration work or whatever it is. Like, look, he's just like, you know what? I've tried the respect thing. I've tried the location thing. I've tried this thing. I've tried that thing. You know what I want now? I just want all the money. And then I'll figure it out. And you know what? You can figure out a lot of things with money, right? You can, you can have a house here, have a jet there. Like, you can have have a few money and that will, they'll be some short term and even some long term happiness. and everybody, maybe he thinks then everybody will leave him alone. But whatever it is, he strikes me as 95% of males in America,

where ridiculously successful, intelligent, financially successful and stable, respected on many levels at his job. And yet, still searching for something because he's obviously not happy. It's sad, but it's also a snapshot of kind of who we are. And look, some of that does make you better at your job. Make you better at your job. Makes me better. Like, I'm going to always want more guy.

Well, what do you work at the holiday season? Because I want more. Because this is a bigger seat. This is a bigger show. This is more attention, potentially more in the future of other things. I'm not a content guy. But there's a gray area between content and really searching for happiness. And it feels like that's where KD is.

I'll tell you a guy who's always searching for happiness. That could be the only reason that he's always so angry and sarcastic and caustic. He's at the end of several different vicious lawsuits, including one I haven't even told him I'm going to sue him for. I don't know what for, but at the end of this segment, I will. Michael Rappaport joins us now in the hurt. Hi, Jamie. Slammed his book on the table. Yeah, what's up, man?

How you been? What's going on? Good holiday? It was great, thank you. Was it? Absolutely. What's the Rappapaport Christmas like? Low.

stuffed my face with various meats. I had a little goose, a little duck. You had goose and duck? Yeah, and any vegetarians out there that are offended by it, be offended. I had a little goose. I had a little duck. Watched a couple of films and watched a lot of basketball. Watched a lot of basketball.

I want to get to basketball. Second, what films did you watch? Last night I watched if Beale Street could talk with the great Regina King, the director of Moonlight, great film. and I watched Vice the night before. And I also rewatched Silver Linings Playbook that the Philadelphia Eagles fandom and the great Bobby De Niro.

I call him Bobby. I know you guys are close. You guys are text buddies. That's actually an incredible film. Really good film. What are you writing a book? No, I'm just interested. You're an interesting guy.

There's more to you just than sports hot takes. That's right. There's multitude of there's levels to you. Have you been to his Instagram account? I admittedly spend way too much time on your Instagram account. I appreciate that. It's so funny. Thank you.

You don't follow me, bro? He's been taken down for cat shaming. Yeah. Will you cat shame? I have a dog. My kids love a cat. My kids love our cat. Is a cat weird looking?

No. Does your cat look like you? No. Because I'll cat shame your cat. If there's a cat out there looks like Doug Gottlieb? No, it does not. Thank God. There's no cat that has this kind of nose.

That just doesn't exist on earth. All right. Let me get to the Lakers. LeBron goes down with an injury and all of a sudden a huge lead becomes a three-point lead but then becomes a 20-point win. Your takeaway is? My takeaway is

I think, well, first of all, the Warriors didn't play great. They've been inconsistent this season. I don't want any player. I go on record saying this. I don't want any player to be injured. But I think for the Lakers' sake and the longevity of the Lakers' season,

this, LeBron James, LeBron James being out potentially two weeks, three weeks at this point, 10 games or so, could be the best thing for the Lakers. So these players can redefine their identity. And this team can find, it's like a mid-season audition. Because who's going to stay, who's going to not stay? Lonzo, Rondo. I think Kuzma's on the verge of becoming an All-Star.

I think he could squeeze in there throughout this run without LeBron. and I think it could be the best thing for the Lakers to sort of get their confidence and have their identity and other leaders to really emerge. Because this whole toxic thing that Katie brought up, I believe it's true historically with Kyrie, Kevin Love, David Blatt, you know, Instagram accounts, you know, lyrics, N words, F words, F words on a talk show during the regular season. Right. Okay? all of that you know that's what he meant by the toxic whether it's that word was too extreme or not

but that's just too much so LeBron there's just a lot to unpack with LeBron there's a lot to it right he has and he brings it on himself he's not a victim no he's not because we'll see in the next two to three weeks LeBron will you disappear like you disappeared your first year back

in Cleveland when you came back and you were less explosive you were thin in the offseason and then you went to Miami because you needed rest and you came back looking like LeBron the year they won the championship? Or will you be on Instagram? Will you be injured and just be injured the way Steph Curry was injured? Like, we don't hear from you. We don't see your workouts.

We don't see you driving cars. We don't see you. Be injured. Let these guys shine. Don't somehow make it about you. That's the toxicity. If I said it correctly. Did I say it correctly?

Yeah, you said toxicity correctly. You didn't butcher that way at all. I had to verify it with Jamie because I don't know if you have a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, really profound grass. How now brown cow. I think I got it. How now brown cow. Michael Rapopor, joins James, Jay Maggio, Doug Gottlie been for calling. This is the herd. You know, here's the thing. LeBron is so big and that game was so impressive for the Lakers, nobody's talking about the Warriors. I understand that they got DeMarcus cousin sitting over there, but can we admit this looks like the, this is what end of runs look like, right?

Where no one wants to call it. No one wants to call it with the Patriots. But they were terrible last week against the bills. They were terrible. They were terrible. Josh Allen could not have been more inaccurate as a quarterback and they hung around and hung around and hung around. Yet they won the division. And yet the Miami Dolphins, they would have sealed it had there not been the miracle in Miami. But have you been impressed by how

the Patriots have played recently? Listen, you're not going to make me some sort of Patriot apologists. I'm a New York Giants fan. I understand. I understand. No, I haven't been impressed. But I don't, I ain't betting against them. Which is the same with the Golden State Warriors. I'm not betting against them. None of them are old.

Okay. They're not, but the bench players are. That's good. Okay. Sean Livingston has an 80-year-old man's knee because of that horrific injury he suffered when he was with the Clippers. But I can't blame the bench players. He's been old for a couple of years.

Clay Thompson had five points last night. Steph had 15. Yes. Kevin Durant had 21 and Draymond Green has not had a great season. So, listen, it's still early in the. the season. Yesterday was sort of the tip-off for the layman fan. Christmas is considered the tip-off. No question. And that was a dud they threw out there. I agree. And that looked like a team that, well, wow, this actually might be the last year of this incarnation of it. You know, it looked like

for the first time this season where it was like, oh, they do need boogie cousins. Yes. Not, oh, it's like this little, like a cherry on top. Like they need boogie cousins. Listen, they've been so good for so long. And I feel like it's not. laziness, it's not sluggishness. They haven't been able to turn it on when you expect it. You know, they're traditionally... Life's not like the clapper.

You can't walk in and go, let's play, right? Remember the clapper? Did you buy the clapper? No, I thought you were going to shut the... Wait, wait, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Whoa, whoa, whoa. You asking me, uh, did I buy the clapper? Yes. Is sort of age shaming me? You're trying to aid shame me on national television?

This is national television. I'm not, it's in part, most parts of the country. Because most people in the clapper, they're older people. people. I didn't say that you purchased Life Alert. I said did you purchase the Clapper? Do you think I can't get out of bed? Life Alert is... It's a two-fold question, Doug. Do you think, number one,

I can't get out of bed to turn off lights? And number two, do you not think that I live in a house where I have custom lights switches that are next to the bed where I could just press it? Because I have a pretty successful career, and I do have those lights switches next to me. So I feel like it was age-shaming. Can I share with you something really quick? Both of you guys.

Okay, so we purchased and we redid a house. And so I I told my wife, because I actually took advice from Colin. Colin's like, I'll give you one piece of advice. Don't whatever she's, let her just do whatever she wants. Let it just, I'm serious. Like, don't, probably the best advice you love. Don't fight anything.

Because everybody says, man, that's a good way to get divorced is to build a house or redo a house. So that's what I've done. I had one request. You know what the request was? That's two. One was the TV, where the TVs go and how many TVs have been the wiring. I was like, I want, I want an on-off switch right next to my, right next to where I sleep.

And she's like, what do you need that for? You can't get up. I was like, trust me. And two nights ago, she's like, can you turn off the lights? I was like, yes, I can. Bam. No, it's a nice little thing. It's a great thing.

It's opulence. That's what it is. It is opulence. I has it. It's a little things. It's a little things like, can you hang? Yeah, I can hang. Okay, good, because I want you to hang.

Michael Rapport's going to co-host the show only not get paid. Magi and I are going to get paid. The Patriots are AFC champions once again. But what if I told you? they're not a top 10 team in the herd hierarchy. Rapport's going to react to my hierarchy. That's next in the herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio,

FS1 and the IHard Radio app. Doug Gottlieb in for Colin. This is the herd. Michael Rapport's going to react to my herd hierarchy. Jamie Maggi, I'll join us with the news in a moment. And big breaking news that affects both college football and the head. the NFL we will get to in a mere six,

seven minutes or so. But Colin does this every week and so I'm sitting in the seat. I'm going to try it out for a little bit of a ride. Let's get to the herd hierarchy. Heard hierarchy. Time is now. Let's go. The top 10 NFL teams

according to Colin. All right, number 10, let's start with the New England Patriots. The only reason they're on this list is because Bill Belichick's the coach and Tom Brady is the quarterback. If you watch them, they haven't looked great. I understand it took a miracle in Miami to keep them from 11 wins. But if you watch them, not just against the Pittsburgh Steelers,

but even against the Buffalo Bills, where are the playmakers? They just don't have them. Tom Brady looks older. I'm not going to say old. I'm not going to say dead. But if this is the princess bride, they are mostly dead, which does mean somewhat alive. There's 7-0 at home this season, which means they're below 500 on the road. And as of right now, they'll only have to go on the road once, and that would be to Kansas City,

who hasn't won a home playoff game since 1993, which feels like the last time the Patriots weren't great. But this is not a great roster. It's old. Gronk is about three games away, four games away from calling it a career. And the vaunted running game is good. but it's not good enough to hide the fact that what they've done best, pick you apart with underneath routes, with option routes, and at times stretch the defense, they simply don't have.

Patriots are number 10. Number nine. Indianapolis Colts, they've won eight out of nine, and the only reason I have them ranked so low is, well, the division they play in is not great, and some of the competition's not been great. What's stunning about Andrew Luck's potential MVP season is It has overshadowed the defense.

Leads the league in scoring defense since week seven. That's right. Chris Ballard has put together a defense and an offensive line and a running game with Marlon Mack to support Andrew Luck, a really, really good team. And the most important down the NFL is third down. They're number one in the league on third down. I might have the Colts as underrated. We'll see if they can go into Tennessee and get a win this weekend.

They would skyrocket up to charts. Number eight. Go with the Chicago Bears. They two have won eight out of the last nine. and their defense is awesome, but I can't hide my lack of trust from Mitch Trubisky in the playoffs. I like the team. I like the defense. The back end of the defense is okay.

The offensive play calling is creative. It's the same play calling, by the way, that had Kansas City get beat in the playoffs early last season with a superior, with a superior quarterback to that of Mitchell Trubisky. If the best thing your young quarterback does is run, that doesn't make him a great quarterback. The Bears are only eight because of quarterback. That's the only reason. Number seven. I'll go with the Baltimore Ravens.

Also don't love them at quarterback. I sat next to Colin. He said Lamar Jackson was great. I saw him throw two great balls and many scud missiles. He missed on a bunch of throws. But they know who they are. Run the football. Play to the defense.

And that defense kicked the hell of the L.A. Chargers. That's the first team that really destroyed the Chargers' offensive line. They are a problem because they're defense. And we know when we get to the playoffs, you throw fewer flags. Defense becomes a. bigger part of the game, and this Ravens defense might be good enough to carry John Harbaugh back to a Super Bowl considering so many of the questions we have about other AFC teams.

Number six. We'll stick with the Chiefs. They have lost three out of five. They lost their running back. They're not the same team, but they got Pat Mahomes. And all their losses this season have been to good teams, right? Remember, we're just talking about the Ravens and how good they are. Last team to beat the Ravens?

That would be the Chiefs. They do have good wins. They did beat the Chargers on the road. They lost in Game of the Year to the Rams by three points. Let's not act like the loss to Seattle this last weekend was a whoopin. That was a great football game. This is a good team with a great young quarterback and a ton of talent. They just don't have a defense to be considered a top five team.

Number five. Dallas Cowboys. Beat the Saints. They won six out of the last seven, and they're winning close games. They know who they are. Run the football. Leagues leading rusher, they're going to win their division and potentially win a game in the playoffs. Do I love Dak?

No, but now that he has a better supporting cast, I like him a whole lot better. And the defense is a 21st century, 2018-2019. Defense with speed, can get after the pass or can cover running backs with their linebackers. I like the Cowboys because Jason Garrett knew who they were all along. He was conservative because he knew his offense wasn't explosive. It's still not incredibly explosive. if it's efficient, the defense is what carries this team. Cowboys have also figured out kicking game, which has helped him.

Number four. Seahawks. I don't know if they'll get to an NSC championship game, but I feel like any game they play in the playoffs is going to come down to Russell Wilson with the ball, scrambling around, spinning around with a chance to throw the ball deep downfield, and more often than not, he seems to pull it off. What a turnaround. League's number one running offense, so he doesn't throw at a ton.

Russell Wilson, since week 10, 16 touchdowns won interception. Since week 10. Okay, winning time in football, once you get to November and December, 16 touchdowns, one interception. He doesn't throw it a lot, but when he does, he throws it to the right colored jersey. Number three. Still going with the Chargers. I did say they got their ass kicked at home by the Ravens. But they did so without Austin Echler, who's their kind of hybrid back, and they're going to get Hunter Henry back.

And in spite of the fact they got badly outplayed by the Ravens on their own home field, Antonio Gates doesn't fumble, they still find a way to win that game. They figured out kicking game. They have a quarterback who's been an AFC championship game. Melvin Gordon's going to get healthier, not injured again. They have, I think, the best weaponry on offense and on defense of any team remaining with Bosa and Melvin Ingram. And of course, you have the likely defensive rookie of the year in Derwin James. Chargers still a very dangerous team who've shown that they can win on the road.

That's good because barring an upset of the chiefs, they'll have to go on the road. They got the weaponry to do so. Number two. Going with the Rams. Don't love how Jared Goffs played. Hasn't played well. But they beat San Francisco. They get a first round by.

Somebody beat up is going to have to come into their place. And I think they're going to figure out that, hey, we get the ball to Todd Gurley. We can win a lot of games. They'll do so in the playoffs. They still have Aaron Donald, who has 19-and-a-half sacks this season. I don't love golf and his lack of confidence, but I think that can be regained this week and in the week off. I like the idea that they've been to the playoffs

and suffered a home defeat last year. I think that helps them this year. Got the Rams at number two. Number one. Saints, best combination of defense and offense, plus they're going to play at home the rest of the season. Do I think they're great that they're light years ahead of everybody else? No, even though the record would tell you.

They got the number one rush defense in the NFL, number one defense in terms of points allowed per game, number one in takeaways as well. Like this is a good defense of team. The story is not Drew Brees. The story is the other side of football. When it was just Drew Brees, they were seven to nine. When you give them a defense, they get the best record in football.

And that's my herd hierarchy. All right, Rapid Port, pick it apart. What don't you like? No, I can't pick it apart. I agree with a lot of what you said. You mentioned Russell the Love Muscle. You mentioned the Ravens, who are actually the real life any given Sunday sharks,

with Lamar being Willie Beeman. I like that. Willie Beeman. That's good. Flacco being Dennis Quaid and so forth. And Al Pacino Harbo. I just, again, I don't like how you, I feel like you set me up that somehow I,

who I have a number, number 56 is tattooed in my heart. I'm a giant fan. I don't get it tattooed on my skin when it's tattooed on my heart. Right. deeper than skin is what you say. You can't count out the Patriots. I'm sorry. You can't count them out yet.

I didn't count them. I put them out there and then you said they don't even belong here. You jumped all over them and then consequently made me somehow become the number one Patriots fan, which I'm not. Yes. Good luck when you go home to New York. That's going to be really good. Like, hey, Rappaport. Yeah.

You're on there defending. Yes. The Patriots. But I mean, I think that these teams, these teams, Listen, next week, this list could be very different because some of these teams are going to squander and some of them are going to fall apart. The Rams.

I don't have the Vikings. I think the Vikings are going to beat the Bears this weekend. I don't have the Browns. And you know what? I think there's several teams on here that wouldn't want to play the Browns. I agree. So I think this list could be very different in a week or two. But I think it's a good list.

I think it's a solid list. I agree with you that golf has been a little shaky. But I think he'll get it together. I think that, you know, they got a little ahead of themselves. They got away from what they've been doing well. I think the same, I'm with you. I don't beat up this list. The Cowboys, I think they're a little low because it's Jekyll and Hyde.

It's Jekyll. But I put them at five. They're a little higher, a little low meaning. No, I think they should be a little higher because of the question mark on what team's going to show up week to week. What defense, when that defense is cooking, it's cooking. But when it's not cooking and DAC and, you know, like, are you going to feed? Ezekiel because he wants to eat. I want to eat. Let's, let's do this. We have Moes down the...

Yeah, no. Maybe it's after Christmas I could get a little, a little bagel cream cheese and locks when I show up. We can do that, but it's L.A. The bagels are just not the same. No, they're fine, Doug. If you go out of your way to cheat your guests, I guess, bagel cream cheese and locks here, a little caviar spread. A little caviar spread. Just saying, not a whole big thing, but just a little something. That's cowherd money. Okay, really quickly. You bet on, you gamble on sports. Yeah. If you were to gamble on two teams, to play in Atlanta in the Super Bowl, who would they be?

Man, I got to say, I have to say the Patriots. And I think it's going to be the Patriots and the Saints. Okay. Look, it's not crazy. And look, I don't want to declare the Patriots dead. I just watch and I'm like, Tom Brady ain't right. Rob Gruncowski ain't right. Rob is done and getting away with what they've gotten away with

when he's been gone in the past is going to be tougher. I know. And it's amazing. Like, look, last year we all forget. that, or something many people forget, that they didn't punt in the Super Bowl. And that's against a good defense. Didn't punt in the Super Bowl. And they did so without Edelman.

And Brandon Cooks got hurt in like the first series of the game. So they had like two hands tied behind their back. And he still found a way to make it work. So I think it is, it's dumb to count them out. I put them on the list for that reason only. Well, you know what? Then take them off and put the Bears there on your top list. Bears are there.

I mean, not the Bears. The Browns. Squeeze the Browns in there with your guy Baker Mayfield. Let him get away with what he did. What is his antics. If Cam Newton, rookie Cam Newton has been doing what did what Baker Mayfield's been doing, it'd be like people that are protesting in the street. Is it a white-black thing?

Or do you think it's a location thing? I think it's both. I think it's both. I will tell you this, that people in the NFL think Baker Mayfield needs to grow up. That he needs to grow up. Yeah, but they love if he's there, he's quotes and all the stuff. But Cam Newton, if he did that his rookie season. But Cam Newton was not, Cam Newton did not take first team reps.

Like, look, I'm not defending Cam. I'm not defending Baker. I can tell you, I think Baker only works in Cleveland. And I think this is specific to this situation. Like, look, there's a bunch to it. I don't think it only works in Cleveland. I think it only works in Cleveland. Here's why.

It's pretty obvious that Hugh wanted them to draft a quarterback the year before. They didn't. Then he wanted probably Sam Donald. They didn't take Sam Donald. And Baker has rabbit ears. He knows this. He also didn't get to take first team reps. It's also Cleveland that everybody leaves Cleveland.

Everybody says, I don't want to be here. Even LeBron James came back, but then he left again. And because of it, Cleveland, anyone who will say, I love it here, they will wrap their arms around so he can get away with it. And he's played pretty well. He's good. I like his game. He's played pretty well. So last week, I mean, there were some Aaron Rogers-ish throws that he made.

He could play. No, he can play. But again, he also goes into he was a walk-on. He is an undersized guy. he did lose his spot to injury when he's cocky, I'm cocky, I like trash truck, and I'm just throwing it out there. You're pointing out that if he was black and he did the exact same thing. A black quarterback also.

Yes. No, no, I said Patriot Saints, if you had to take your power, these are basically your power rankings and I just want to say power rankings in general. In my fantasy football league, I wasn't even in the power rankings, yet I'm a champion. Nothing to do with why we're here right now? You won that again? Oh, I won this. I won the other day. The Howard Stern won? No, you don't have to bring that.

lost that league. I don't know why you see. But wait. How many leagues are you in? I'm in two, my friend. But why are I when I'm celebrating? Why have to knock me down? I just knew you were in that league. That was a very powerful league. And it was a very painful loss. And I want to have my privacy about it. Okay, good. So the other league you won, go ahead and go

humble brag. What is it? You lost your train of thought. I didn't lose it. I wanted to throw the question back at you. Okay, what is it? I said the Patriots and the Saints, which I'm not proud that I said it, if you had to pick two of these teams, who's going to wind up in Atlanta and hotlanta?

I'm going to go Chargers and Seahawks. Wow, you really believe in Russell the love muscle. I don't, I don't, it's, there's a, there's a good, they're going to play the Cowboys likely in the playoffs. And I like Russell, better than I like Dak, right? Yes, that's round one. Look, they run the football, they got a good defense. Like, this is kind of Pete Carroll 101. Like, he declare him dead and he's like, no, not so much.

I don't even love Russell Wilson as a quarterback, but he just, he just. He's a winner, man. He finds a way. He is a winner. He finds, I hate the he's a winner thing, but he is in fact a winner. He is in fact a winner. He's that guy who you're like, I don't really know what it is about him, but he finds a way to win games. And maybe it's the magic water.

I don't know. That's the magic water that Michael Rapport will be drinking. Thanks so much for joining us. Let's get to Jamie Maggio. She's got some big news. No, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news.

All right, Doug, let's start with a conversation we had earlier in the show. Tom versus Time. Yes. Remember Rob Nickovich, linebacker with the Patriots? He played with Tom for eight seasons, 2009 to 2016. He went on to WEEI Radio. He offered his explanation as to what we're seeing from Tom. You know, I don't know if he's hurt or if he's just getting older.

You know, I mean, everyone seems to have this false sense of, you know, Tom's invisible. but he's 41 years old. He's playing a position where you get 300-pound guys landing on you, hitting you, you know, big guys all around you. So, I mean, it gets a little, it gets a little hairy in there. So I just think that Tom's who are seeing Tom, you know, slow down a little bit. I mean, look, when Rob Ninkovich is saying that, would have the other things the rest of us are going to react?

Remember, he did play well. He actually did play well in Miami in that loss, but he didn't play well the last two weeks at all. and it's going to get colder, it's going to get windier, it's going to get more difficult. And he's been the best cold weather quarterback we've ever seen. Forget about the most successful, the most best cold weather quarterback. But when you're older and you're banged up, there's something wrong with your knee, you're not moving that well, the line's not protecting you as well.

You don't have game breaking wide receivers. That's not great when you're in your 40s. But when Patriot homers, Patriot players are like maybe he's hurt, you know what that means. Well, you also have to adjust the way you play the game as you get older, right? Yes. Right. Yes. You play it better.

Yes. No, get rid of the football quickly. Throw it underneath. But he has to have guys that can get open. And when Gronk has gotten old right before our eyes, it doesn't make it any better. It's two guys who are super important both getting old and what we think is the blink of an eye. But remember, Belichick knew this. He tried to trade Gronk in the offseason.

And he pretty clearly wanted to have Garoppolo ready to play Garoppolo by now and bid a dude. to Tom Brady. He got he got overruled by ownership because of because he's Tom Brady. But Bill Belichick, he knew this was coming. Everybody knew was eventually coming. It's just a question of when, not it. By the way, they play Jets week 17. So that's a gimmie, right? It should be a gimmie, should be a gimmie, especially with the Jets likely to make a coaching change, but you never know. All right. It's also time for the Real Deal brought to you by Carl's Jr. and Hardies. And this one just makes me smile. Doug. Stefan Diggs, he had a big Christmas. Actually, he gave his a big Christmas. Look at this video of him surprising his mom with a new car for Christmas. I didn't,

I thought this was just in the car commercials, but this happens in real life. Her expression, look at this. It's so sweet. I love when guys do this. Take care of mom and dad. He put in his tweet, though, he said, here's something for the lady that put up with all my craziness. Merry Christmas. If my mom's watching, and she probably is because she's sweet and supportive, she's not, she put up with my craziest. She's not going to get a car, though. Yeah, my mom's not going to get a car. My mom cooked fondue set up fondue for my entire family. Yesterday? Yes.

Cheese fondue to regular fondue to chocolate fondue at the end. It was a long and arduous process. They should call it fun due because it's fun to eat. Oh, was that funny? Was that funny? You. You. You.

All right. This one, though, this one I want you to weigh in on for sure. This is the big news just broke. Caught off the press. Apparently, Oregon football had one more gift under the tree. and that is their quarterback Justin Herbert is going to return. He's going to play again next season for his senior season. This guy was supposed to go maybe number one, top quarterback in the draft class.

Yeah, look, this is a lot like Marcus from Mariotta. Remember, Marcus came back for another year. We have seen this from other quarterbacks. Guys, it's been an additional year in college seemed to be more refined, seemed to be ready. But, boy, does that change it? And now it makes it, I'll make the argument a little later on this week on why Kyler Murray should continue to pursue football because there's just a limited number of guys that can be drafted in the first round, despite the fact that he's 5'9.

But Herbert would have been the likely number one overall pick, and now all of a sudden that changes people's draft board, changes the top of the draft immensely. What does this mean for the giants who most people think had an affinity for them, whether they would have taken first or wherever they're drafting? Yeah, 59.6 completion percentage this year for Herbert. eight touchdowns, eight interceptions. You know, but people are going to... His brother's going to play there next year,

so he gives them one year to kind of play together, which is kind of cool as well. But is this a missed opportunity? Do you think when guys have a chance to play? No. They should go? No. I mean, the money is a lot different

when you go number one, number two, number three. Go when you're ready. You know, it's... Go when you're absolutely ready so that... And you want to go to a team where you're going to play, but you want to be Sam Donald,

in New York, but running for dear life. I just, you have... You can, always go pro. Can you? Yes. As a quarterback, yes. There's just not that many guys that can throw a football. It's just not. You got a chance to compete

for a roseball, to compete for a championship, to play with your brother. These are once in a lifetime deals. There's 15 years of playing in the NFL. At quarterback. Like running back, you've got to go because there's just a limited number of where and obviously you can get hurt. But at quarterback, I do think it's different.

And if you look at Peyton Manning to most recently to James played an additional year than he could have come out to Marcus Mariotta. There are others. I know that people want to point out who was it, who played at USC, guy, what I'm going to forget, who would have been the number one all picky. You know, Linerd came back and obviously slipped some in the draft. Matt Barkley slipped in the draft.

They still got driving. If you're good enough, you're going to be fine. Herbert's going to be good enough. More reps, more time. I think it'll be fine. And don't forget, December 31st, the Red Box Bowl, Oregon, Michigan State. That's on Fox, 2.30 Eastern. It's my chance to do a promo. I had to sneak it in.

There's nothing wrong with that. And that's Jamie Maggiot with news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd-Lie News. I think it's picking up for Oregon football. That's huge for the Pact 12, right? You get Cliff Kingsbury, who's going to be the offense coordinator of USC, that feels like

USC is going to stabilize themselves. And now Oregon has their quarterback. Pack 12 football hasn't been great nationally recently. Need a West Coast team like an SCE or Oregon to play for a national championship. Coming up next, something might. like Tomlin is doing that no other coach in the NFL is doing. And it's not a good thing. It's a Tomlin thing.

I'll share it with you next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. Coming up on New Year's Eve, the Red Box Bowl kicks off between Oregon and Michigan State at 230 Eastern on Fox. Then flip over to FS1 as number 17 Utah, battles number 22 Northwestern in the San Diego County Credit Union Holiday Bowl at 630 Eastern or catch it all on the Fox Sports app.

Doug Gottlieb, Jamie Maggio, in for Colin here in the herd and of course Joy Taylor as well. You mentioned the Red Box Bowl. That means Justin Herbert will play for Oregon and will come back for his senior year at Oregon, which leads many people

to leave Dwayne Haskins from Ohio State will be the best quarterback in the upcoming NFL draft. This only makes it even more important to point out how the Giants butchered it last year. They just, they did. I see the look on your face as a New Yorker and a Giants fan. Where's Rappaport? Bring him back in here.

I know I'm right. I was right then. I knew I was on the right side of history then and I'm on the right side of history now. Like, look, the argument for the Giants taking a quarterback last year was that Giants are never in the top, never in the, never a top five draft spot. and this is a quarterback heavy jaft. It was. It was perfectly set up for them. Cleveland took a guy who wasn't seen to be the number one prospect.

Sam Donald falls to them. And oh yeah, by the way, the Jets traded up, move mountains for the third spot. So the Jets would have been left with Josh Allen. I mean, think of how the Jets fans would feel right now if Josh Allen was their quarterback, as opposed to Sam Donald is their quarterback. Now the Giants are in position and we're like,

all right, maybe you can draft Dwayne Haskins, but are you sure that Dwayne Haskins is a franchise quarterback? Are you sure, sure? Like, he's been really good at times. Then there were Penn State where when he had a bit of a cloudy pocket, muddy pocket. It wasn't great. You could have had the number one prospect, a quarterback that everybody believes. He needed some refining to he could have sat behind Eli and learned some

and played here late in the year when they're looking for their next. Now they're talking about maybe we'll extend Eli. Maybe he'll play next year. That's because there is no next day. answer. So I think the Herbert news only makes it even more obvious that when you're the Giants and you have a chance to draft franchise quarterback to replace an aging Eli Manning, you go do it. And they didn't. Saquan Barkley is a good running back. There's nothing against Seekwan. It's just quarterback's a more important position and there's a scarcity of them and he had one sitting

right in front of you. All right, here's Mike Tomlin discussing controversial pass interference calls against the Saints. I thought there were a couple of terrible calls. I actually thought the last touchdown reception by the Saints should have been offensive past interference. It's obvious. So there's a growing push for, hey, if we're going to review some calls,

why don't we review all calls? We're not saying every one of them, but you should have the ability to challenge a pass interference call. Here's Mike Tomlin. I just worry about the entertainment component of it and what that might

do for fans and the viewership, what that looks like. But given some of the things that have happened, you know, I'm sure it'll be up for debate, as it always is and has been in recent years, because technology and the amount of coverage that I game at this level gets, not only on Sundays, but seven days a week, a lot for that type of scrutiny and review. For the record, he's not wrong. If you've been to an NFL game, been to a college football game, it's probably, worse. The number of

and length of reviews makes sitting in the stands tedious. It just does. Like at least when you're at home, you can get up and go get a beer, you can go to the restroom, you can flip over channels and come back to it, or you can sit there and at least you get commentary and you get all the replays.

It's harder and harder to get people in a stadium. It's more expensive. You got to pay PSLs to get season tickets. You can only watch one game. Oh no, you can watch another game on your cell phone. Tell me the stadium when there's great cell phone receptions. There's like three or four of the new ones and that's about it. They just become overwhelmed by the number of cell phones. And now I got to sit there and sit

through a review which I may or may not get a clear look at. I don't know what exactly they're reviewing. I get no commentary of it. Like it's really hard. But why does Mike Tomlin care about the common fan? Why does Mike Tomlin care about viewers? Think about if they asked Bill Belichick. He would say, we're onto the jets. You know, we control, we control. We don't, we don't remember. They with the rules of the rules. Again, he's not wrong. The more technology, the more coverage, the more tedious it is to watch a game.

But that's not even the question, Mike. Mike, the question is, would you prefer a world in which you could throw a red flag if there was an egregious error with pass interference that affected a game greatly? The answer is yes or no, not, well, the fans. Like, stop it. Stop it.

But that's who Mike Tomlin is. He's TV Mike. He's great at the dais. Great. And it's not his fault that they had two fumbles that cost in the Saints game. It's not his fault that Ben Rothsberger threw the ball right to a defense event. It's not his fault that Ben Rothsberger was hurt and they lost to the – well, it's probably his fault they lost the Raiders.

You can't lose the Bears. But TV Mike cares about TV Mike. LeBron injury might be minor now or it might not. We discuss next in the herd. Want more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart Radio app. Search Hurd to listen live. or on demand whenever you'd like.

What up? Welcome in. This is the herd wherever you may be, and however you may be listening the show. Thanks so much for making this part of your day. I'm Doug Gottlie, filling in for Colin Cowherd and Jamie Maggio filling in for Joy Taylor. We are so thrilled to be with you, getting you ready for the college football playoff or week 17 of the National Football League, covering all we saw yesterday from the NBA on Christmas Day, and just wrapping up, putting a nice little tight bow on your new year, on your new year. Big shopping day today where you take stuff back, you use those gift cards. Is a gift card a good present? It depends on where and from who. It's not the most thoughtful, right? But it is the most practical. It is and it isn't. It isn't. It

isn't. It's all in the sale. Can I sell you on why it is? Try. Favorite place. Your favorite place, go? Let's say Nordstrom. Okay, Nordys, which who's having a half-yearly sale, by the way. I just got that up there. I know what I'm doing after the show. Okay. So they're having the half-yearly sale. And by the way, you can always take it back to Nordstrom. That's the whole thing, right? Good return policy. Like, oh, I wore these like five, for the last five years. I need another pair of AG jeans. Anyway, so let's take Nordstrom. If I were to get you a Nordie's gift card, you'd be like, eh, it's only $50. Like, man, golly, $50. But one, $50 you didn't have previously. Two, I know you like Nordstrom and three. I know that there's, there's,

no real win in my taste, right? Like, I could buy you a great-looking dress, but if I bought you a dress, it'd be creepy, right? Creepy married guy buying you. But even if it was, like, for my wife, I actually got her something in Nordstrom's. But if you go too small, you're like, well, you know, I think you're a two, you're really a four. You know, I thought you looked great recently. But then it won't, and now I feel fat.

Or you can, at least I know where you shop, and I want you to have the freedom to go and have a day. Like you just go have a go have Northrop. Matter of fact, here's a $10 Starbucks card. Get a Starbucks, walk through Nordies, buy something, don't buy something. Here's $50 to start you on your way. I actually think that's more thoughtful than, hey, I went and got you some house slippers that you might or mind on me. In your situation, yes, because you guys, and now you're saying to your wife, honey, I'm going to stay with the kids, I'm going to be babysit, you go. Let me just explain. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Because you don't

have kids and because you're not a man, you can, guys, you can never say I was babysit. Okay, that's called... Oh, it's your children. It's called parenting. It's parenting. Look, I've made this mistake before. This is a good one for guys out there who watching. As much as...

And here's the thing with women don't understand the spirit that it comes from. Like the spirit that it comes from is like, hey, look, I just want to give you a day. So I said babysitting. Like, no, no, no. It's not babysitting when they're your children. That's true. Technically, it is babysitting, but that's okay. But the point is you're not just giving the gift card.

You're saying, here's an experience. Here's a day. You go have a self-care day. Honestly, like, If I were to give that to my wife, my wife would be like $50 from Target, goodbye. I'll see it like next week. Like she loved, who doesn't love Targette? I love Tarjeet.

I mean, it's the best. Yeah. Right. So the point is that if I were, I think a gift card can be more thoughtful. Now, I do think that there is a certain lack of, oh hell, I have to think and try and know what they like. And let me just get a universal visa gift card. Like that's mailing it in. Right.

That's, you know, it's like women wearing flats that's mailing it in for guys. guys buying a visa gift card for $25. I don't really want to think about this. I know I have to get something. Here you go. Fair enough? You have a problem with flats now? No, but I do think when you go out with a significant other flats are kind of mailing it a little bit.

I know they're comfortable. I got it. Just saying what you're saying is my comfort is more important than how I look. And no guy is going to go, you know, honey, I would prefer that you wear flats. Those are some sexy flats. No guys ever said that. Those flats. I would prefer you wear sneakers to flats.

Okay. Just because at least sneakers, you're like, oh, yeah, it's kind of sn stylish. You're kind of cool. Footwear power rankings. I'm glad we're having this talk. We could have footwear power rankings. I bought my wife some expensive sneakers last year that were, I'm like, they cost how much, but she wanted them. She got them.

And now she wears them to mow the lawn. Anyway, that's Jamie Maggio. I'm Doug Gautley. But enough of Christmas card. And by the way, it's never too late to. wish somebody a Merry Christmas. Again, it's in the spirit of what you're saying, not in what you're actually saying. I do believe T.J. Hishmanzada is going to join us in about 10 minutes. We'll talk a little bit about Baker Mayfield's most recent comments, his most recent kind of act,

plus we get you ready for Week 17 in the National Football League. Let's talk a little bit about yesterday in the NBA. I know it's supposed to be a banner day, but with exception of the Celtics game against Celtics Sixers game and I guess Rockets Thunder. They weren't great games. They weren't great games played last night. Just weren't. I mean, that's one of the things that the NFL has been able to capture this year. Some great Thursday night games, right?

The comeback of the Chargers against the Chiefs. The Rams taking on the Chiefs on Monday night or even Chiefs Seahawks on Sunday night. Like we've had some great football games when they're standalone games. and in the NBA, we didn't have great games with the exception of the Celtics beating the Sixers in overtime yesterday. What we did have was the Lakers going into Golden State and beating the Warriors, which is surprising. Then the margin of victory is surprising.

And then LeBron James got hurt. Now, let me give you the most recent update. LeBron James' MRI came back clean. He's got a strain left groin. He, to steal from Keith. Oberman is listed as day-to-day, but aren't we all, right? So LeBron just tweeted out, dodged a bullet, sheesh, the prayer emoji to the almighty above, hashtag back in no time.

So look, if it's just a strain groin and he's LeBron James and he's fine, that's it, that's all, and he'll be back and the young guys will get a chance to grow. As Lanzo grew without Rondo, as Kuzma grew without Ingram. now the entire team can grow and learn how to play without LeBron James. This could be a good thing. On the other hand, LeBron never gets hurt. Like, never gets hurt. I like to, Jamie, you've worked with me a lot,

and we've done NCAA tournaments games together, where you do six games in three days, essentially, the one day off in between. And to people who ever done the NCAA tournament, no, the day before the first tournament game, that's when you're really working. It's like speed dating. eight teams and you get an hour with each of the eight teams,

but you don't really get an hour because you get 15 minutes with the coach and the SID come over and talk to you, and then you get five minutes with their best player. And you got to put through the other notes. And then you have a production meeting. And then you do four games the next day. And then you catch your breath. And then you have meetings with all the four teams.

And then you have two games and then you're done. It's a lot in a little time. And I pride myself on somebody who I just, I love what I do. I don't get tired. and so whether it's last year, Christmas Day, I did first things first on Christmas. So Christmas Eve, I did my radio show. I said goodbye to my wife, family and kids, and I flew across country. I did the show.

I flew back. I had Christmas dinner with my family. And then I did this show the very next day. Like I just, I have a pretty good amount of area for gas in the tank, and I don't run dry, and I never get sick. I just don't want to ever get sick. Not that our job is that difficult, but I've never been so sick where I've had to call in sick from work and I've done this for 16 years now.

But at some point, I'm going to get sick. And you know what? At that point, I'd be like, you know what? The travel does affect me more now. I haven't gotten sick yet. It hasn't kept me from work. I haven't come down with laryngitis, knock wood. But it will.

And that's when it is a bit of father time. You start to question. LeBron James has never hurt, especially soft tissue. like a groin injury. That's what's remarkable to me is his last championship with the Miami Heat. And his last championship with what was remarkable about that was here's game seven of the NBA finals. And everybody else in the court was too tired to make a shot, except LeBron James. To play not just the amount that he plays, but the way in which he plays where he dominates the basketball. And though he doesn't give the same effort consistently defensively now that

he did then, he still gives you a lot of effort. for a star player at this age. Like, he's played more games than anybody since his rookie year. He's played more minutes than anybody since his rookie year. It stands the reason at some point he'd break down. I just, when I see a guy go down with a groin and he's in his mid-30s, I think of the car analogy. No matter, pick your favorite car in terms of how it's made.

Like, man, I'll tell you, that, my dad had a Honda Civic, 1976 Honda Civic, he got for coaching at Long Beach. State. That was his comp car. It was Tex Winner's car. He gave it to him. And yeah, he spun the odometer twice. That means 200,000 miles, right? Spun the odometer twice. But I remember, like, when he lost their job at Longby State,

there was a time when the clutch went out. When it would backfire and then you'd have to push start it. Right? There was a, what is that? That's the starter. The starter went out as well. Like at some point, all, even the best made car, like, man, that's the best made car. ever. There's just a limit to it. And so maybe this is just a hose that has to be replaced. I don't know enough about cars. That's, I call my whole reason for not owning a classic car. But I do know that

there's a hose in there that connects to the engine, right? Let's say it's just a hose or a gasket and you can get fixed. But sometimes that hose or a gasket is a sign of greater wear and tear issues. And first it's the groin and then he comes back and in trying to act like the groin doesn't. and bother you, you run a little bit differently, and then you pull a calf. And then from a calf, it becomes a back, and a back becomes a hamstring. I just, he says dodged a bullet, yeah.

I fear injury. That's the thing I fear. Is he going to slow down? Sure. But you can play a step slower and be effective. You know, I mean, everyone in the NBA is talking about Luca Donchik, right, and how great Luca Donchik is.

Luca Donchick is a step slow now, and he's like 19 years old. So it's not that LeBron can't play as he slows down. He absolutely can't. He has to refine and change his game and he's become more skilled. But you can't play if you're hurt. And I do fear that a groin becomes a hip, becomes a knee, becomes a back, becomes a, it all is related. What should not be dismissed is, boy, the Warriors didn't look particularly good.

And just like LeBron at some point will hit that limit in terms of age, that bench is just not. they're just not the same defensively. And what no one to this point has been willing to say, which I'll say right now is, boy, Kevin Duran has covered up for a lot of things, honey. Any? It's 11-11 right now on the West Coast.

Do you do the wish thing? Jamie, do you ever wish on 11-11? Make a wish? No. I'm an adult. You can do that. There's nothing wrong with having dreams. No, I don't do that.

Make a wish right now. 11-12. You missed it. See? I wasn't meant to make wishes on 11-11. If I'm the Warriors, Man, I sure hope there's some sort of fountain of youth for Sean Livingston and Andre Godala. I sure hope that DeMarcus Cousins comes back as the player he was before injury.

I know it's just one regular season game, and it's a little bit of an outlier because the Lakers did it without LeBron, and they hit a bunch of shots, and they probably need to add a shot maker. But boy, the Lakers looked like the franchise that has figured out how to take apart this Warriors team. They shut out Clay Thompson at, what, five points? Completely ineffective. Steph's never good on Christmas Day. He wasn't good yesterday. But not guarding Draymond Green, going inside to your third string center and dominating inside.

And having Rajan Rondo come in and just slice you and dice you, felt like they had a great plan and knew exactly who the warriors were and how to take them apart. I will never pretend to know more about the game of basketball than you, Doug. But can a team just have an off night and just look off? Yes. Absolutely. Absolutely. But you can also... If you put the Warriors and the Lakers right now in a seven-game series. Oh, well, is, is DeMarcus cousin's going to play? As is. Right now, as is, let's say.

I'd still take the Warriors. I don't know if the difference is as great. The Warriors probably in five or six. My issue is, like, look, you're going to have to get through the whole playoffs. Livingston looks washed. Iguadala looks close to wash, although he scored some last night. And just the rest of their bench, like, tell me another guy like Yerebko, Looney, Jordan Bell has not emerged like they thought he was. Like, you're going to need six, seven, eight guys. And in addition to which, Draymond Green looks like a shell of his former self, he doesn't look right.

He's a completely ineffective offensive player. And defensively, he's good, but he's not as effective as he used to be. And the league is adjusted to the Warriors. So I actually think Durant's covered up a lot of their warts because he's. He's been so good. He takes up so much attention, and he does help him at both ends of the floor. Again, it's less than the Patriots. I'm not willing to say the Warriors are done, but we do see the finish line.

Whereas if you went back a year and a half ago, two years ago, I would have thought the Warriors could continue on forever, considering their actual age of their best players. She's Jamie Maggio. I'm Doug Gottlie. I'll tell you why Patrick Mahomes should absolutely positively win the NFL's MVP. We'll discuss it with T.J. Hushman Zada. He joins us next in The Hurt. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app.

NFL Week 17 is on Fox with huge games with playoff implications as the Vikings take on the bears, the Eagles, battle the Redskins, or the Rams host of 49ers. It's all on Fox and the Fox Sports app. Check your local listings. Back in the herd, along with Jamie Maggio. I'm Doug Gottlieb. How great is that Sunday going to be? Bears, Vikings in the new dome. That'll be phenomenal. And Kurt Cousins has a chance to quiet the haters, right?

Quiet the haters. Win the game. Win the game, go to the playoffs. I mean, look, if you watch Case Keenan play this past weekend on Monday night against the Raiders, you're like, if you think that that's not an upgrade, then I can't help you. You just, if you can't simply go by wins and losses, you know,

You just go, well, well, wins and loss. Like, listen, are wins and losses in prime time at times indicative of how good a quarterback you are? Okay. But, you know, some of Cousins' failures with the Washington Redskins were because the Redskins sucked. That's all. They weren't good. They were on TV, not because they were good, but because of the Washington Redskins.

And they have a huge national fan base, national draw. You know, he's had games this year where they've lost because his wide receivers have fumbled. Look, some of the losses are on him, are on him. but simply pinning a loss on a player or a win on a player. Take the MVP debate. Well, Drew Breeze's team's record is just better. So, you know, two games better than Pat Mahomes. Did we not watch Drew Breeze go four straight games with interception?

That did happen in this lifetime. Against the Atlanta Falcons, isn't this a win, a defense which has been just decimated by injury. They're going to fire everybody in Atlanta. He had 171 yards. passing. He backed that up in Dallas where they had 10 points. 10 points and they lost the game. 13

to 10 to the Dallas Cowboys. Again, one game is not a season or MVP definer. One game is not. Pat Mahomes had five turnovers against the Rams. He did have six touchdowns. They did score 51 points. But like, look, if we're going to hold Mahomes accountable

for wins and losses, like, that's just his defense stinks. Now, his defense being stinky does help some statistical dominance. Like, I don't know. He's going to throw 50 touchdown pass. He's going to throw for 5,000 yards. He's going to have 115 or 16 or something crazy pass-a-rating.

He's throwing the ball downfield, something that Alex Smith didn't do until last year. And they're winning games. They're going to have the number one seed in the AFC, barring a collapse and loss to the Raiders who are on a short week. So I'm not saying Drew Brees hasn't had a great year. But he's got the best rush defense, the best scoring defense in the National Football League. He plays in a dome and the team set up for a dome. He plays for an incredible play caller. And he's had a really good year.

But the MVP is not really the most valuable. Most valuable is Andrew Luck. It's the best player, best quarterback on the best team who's had the best season. That's Pat Mahomes. With that, let's bring in T.J. Husch, Benzada, former star wide receiver in the National Football League. Now a star here on Fox Sports Radio and Fox Sports One. Who should you have yourself on Merry Christmas? It was pretty good.

yourself. It's really, really good. Really good. It's pretty good. Merry Christmas to you. Happy New Year. The MVP debate, I watch Mahomes. I'm like, what am I missing that we don't give it to him? Are you a, if you had a vote, who would you vote for? I'm with you. It's Patrick Mahomes. It's his first year as a starter. He's going to throw for 5,000 yards. You don't see that. And you can say the rules or whatever. Travis Kelsey, Tyree Keel, Karee Hill, Kareem Hunt. Patrick, what he's doing, you just don't see a quarterback in his first year as a starter, have this type of year now.

If Aaron Donald breaks Michael Strayhan's record, I believe he deserves consideration. In order for a defensive player to deserve consideration, you have to do things that haven't been done. If he does that, he deserves consideration. Outside of that, it's Patrick Mahomes. Now, if you give it to Drew Brees, to me, it's a Lifetime Achievement Award. And that's the only way Brees can win it if the voters feel so. sorry for him that he hasn't won an MVP. You'd give it to Aaron. You'd really give it to Aaron Donald.

Yes. If he breaks Michael Strayhan's record, I don't know if I would give it to him, but he deserves great consideration. I think he'll get consideration. The problem is that, you know, what you're saying is, even if he affected, say he ends up with something crazy, like 22 sacks, right? 23 sacks. The amount of effect he has in a game is compared to a quarterback. You know, it's the old JJ Watt. You picked the best season JJ Watt ever had. His team didn't win more games because of it because you don't affect the game as greatly as when you're quarterback. It's not fair, but that's the

reality of the position. Positional dependence has to go to the MVP. All right, let's, I want to, speaking of quarterbacks, I want to ask you about Baker Mayfield's act. Now, Baker Mayfield did tweet at Colin Cowher. Did you see this? Yeah. Okay, so on Christmas Eve, Maggio, did you see this? What's that? Okay. On Christmas Eve, Baker Mayfield said Merry Christmas to everybody, including that Grinch, Colin Calhurt, right? Like, dude has, he has a bag of chips on his shoulder, not a chip on his shoulder. This comes off of winning a game against Hoosha's Cincinnati Bengals where he stares down his

former head coach, Hugh Jackson, after completing a long pass. Baker Mayfield is walking it like he's talking it, but he's talking a lot for a quarterback. What's your reaction to him? He needs to chill out. It's by him tweeting at Colin, all it does is reinforce the fact that everything Colin has said is correct. Like, dude, Colin thinks you're a good player. Everybody thinks you're a good player.

You just need to chill. It's okay. You were the first pick. I understand you're a walk-on in college and you've always had to fight uphill. You're fighting an uphill battle. But, dude, you are the first pick of the draft. You're no longer considered a walk-on. you were considered the best player coming out of college and you were drafted one.

If I was a defensive player on any team, I would take a fine. I would hit him so late on purpose. Like, shut up. I would take a fine. Like, you would not play and act like that if I was playing. And I was offensive players, so it would never happen. But if I'm on the opposing team, it would annoy me. Yeah, listen, I think it works in Cleveland because Cleveland has, you know,

Cleveland has the same kind of syndrome, right? They've always, people have made fun of the lake when it caught on fire. Heck, the old Browns left town. Everybody leaves Cleveland, right? Cleveland Indians, when they want to get paid, they leave town. LeBron James left town twice. Came back, one championship, then I'm out. I ain't finished my career here, right?

So there's a little bit of, hey, we've always felt like we're the walk-on in the NFL, and now a guy who was a former walk-on comes in, and he's kind of like a WWE wrestler, right? he's talking trash, he's acting crazy, he's waking up dangerous, and we love it. But it does, I don't know if it's befitting of a franchise quarterback if you want to be taken seriously in the real, maybe it doesn't matter, right? Quarterbacks don't act like this. And this is why it's different is, if he was on my team, I probably would like it. I think guys love it. That was always my point. When I sat in that and talked to Colin, Colin's like, you know people in Oklahoma, and he said, is he like Mansell?

I was like, no, because Mansell, not everybody loved Mansell because Manzell was in it for Mansell, right? Whereas Baker, guys love him. Like, they love playing with him. Yeah, if he's on your team. But if an entire league of and coaches and front office people and I mean, like, look, even the thing he did with the Chargers where they were interested in potentially drafting him and then they sent him his playbook and he's like, yeah, I didn't even pay attention to it. Now we can't draft you because it looks bad. Now we look like, yeah, we don't care if you don't think highly of us or, but we'll take you anyway. Like, we're not going to draft. What if you consider it? So I think it's a fascinating thing. Lamar Jackson, long term, will he work? I like Lamar Jackson,

man. It will work. To me, it's similar to Russell Wilson, meaning Lamar Jackson has a great defense. Russell Wilson's first four years in the NFL, he had the number one defense, and then his fifth year, they took a drop and went to three. As long as he's playing with a great defense, he's going to be all right because they'll mask his deficiency, he's throwing a ball. The ball he threw to Mark Andrews, great throw. Great throw. It's only one throw, and you need to make more of those throws over the course of a game, but that was a great throw. As long as you can play great defense and run the ball, he'll be fine. I understand, but he's run the ball more than anybody who's ever played the position. He's run it more

than he's thrown it. And he's, though he's taller than you think, and he's an unbelievable day. He might be the most athletic dude. Like, he and Vic are the most athletic dudes to play the position in the NFL. Like if Cam Newton's going to get beat up by the wear and tear of playing that style of football, what's going to happen to him? Well, see, he's a different runner. He, Cam is trying to run through you at times. Lamar is trying to make you miss. It's history has shown a quarterback can't run the ball like this.

Now, if he's, if you can give them. He also, he also, and he doesn't just miss. He misses badly, right? Like he misses underneath throws, what should be easy throws, and he misses badly at times, which will lead to turn. But, yeah, like, I just don't. I wouldn't want to play Baltimore in the playoffs. If I'm a team, I'm afraid to play the Baltimore Ravens in the playoffs.

Defensively, they're going to shut you down. Yes. They're going to limit your possessions. Yes. They've got a great field goal kickers. They're going to run the ball and they limit your possessions. They limit the amount of time you possess the ball. It's, you have to be perfect when you play Baltimore because of that run game and that

defense. And so as long as he's had, he has a surrounding cast around them, I'm a fan of them. Are we willing to at least consider that Tom Brady's over the hill? Man, you know what? I've been, the game was on. I watched the game out here. The Bill's game? Yes.

And I was upset that it was on, actually. So I was on the NFL pass ticket. If you watch the Patriots, Julian Edelman is the only guy that can beat man coverage. And so that's, defenses know this. These coaches watching football, they watch the Patriots. and say Julian Elderman is the only guy can beat us in a passing game. That's his problem. So does it look like

Tom is slowed down? Yes. But when Tom doesn't have anybody that can get open, how is he going to look? How is he going to look? You take Julian Edelman away who you're throwing a ball to. But he's also looked more inaccurate and

and if possible less that. Like he's looked very uncomfortable the past couple weeks in that pocket. He has not played well. But the guys around him haven't played well either. And now, New England, this is just me. And I said this last week, you can never really go against New England. But I don't think they're going to win a playoff game this year.

I don't, I don't either. The Rappaport said I'm crazy because it's Brady because it's Belichick. Like, tell me the game breakers they have on defense. Pittsburgh is probably the best team that could win a Super Bowl and they won't even make the playoffs. New England won't win a playoff game and they're going to get a first round by. Tom Brady is not playing great, but when you don't have a receiver that can get open consistently and man-to-man, outside of Elderman

and a defensive coordinator is going to take that away, it's going to be tough on any quarterback. All right, last thing, Cousins has a chance to kind of redeem himself from the eyes of most NFL fans. They got the Bears coming in, nasty defense, but playing at home should help. Can the Vikings beat the Bears to get in the playoffs? The Vikings will win the game,

and my reasoning is the Bears really don't have anything to play for. They play at the same time as the Rams. And so once they see the Rams are going to blow the 49ers out, they're going to pull guys out. They'll pull some guys out of the game. And that will enable Minnesota to win the game because more than likely, they're going to play each other in first round of playoffs. And so Kirk Cousins will win the game because of circumstances. I said that was the last one I lied.

Gough. How do you fix Gough? Like he has not. Even go back to the Lions game, he didn't look good. How do they reconfigure that thing? that offensive line, number one, they need to give the ball to Todd Gurley more. But the offensive line, if you think about, they've been getting manhandled up front. Yep.

Man handled up front. And so he's seeing ghosts when they're not there. And when they are there, he just hasn't, he hasn't been as accurate because the pressure has been getting to him. The offensive line hasn't played well in the last four to five games. That's the same thing that happened to the Chargers where, you know, against the Ravens who you talked about. Like he had, he had Threll Suggs at his feet the entire night. You can't step into a throw. You're worried about, you know, your legs or whatever.

and so you end up you're short on passes, you're inaccurate on passes, and golf is a guy who can, you hit him once, he lacks a little bit of confidence as well. And the Rams missed Cooper Cup. Brandon Cooks is a good receiver, but he needs to be great

with the contract that he has, and I don't know what his size, can he be great, he's good. And they miss Cooper Cup. I completely agree with all of your analysis, but it's not why we had you on. But of course, he was a pro bowler. You can see him on speak for yourself.

You always see him here on the herd. He's T.J. Hushman Zata. Hush, thanks so much. Thank you guys. Let's get to Jamie with the news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news.

Doug, remember last season, Lanzo Ball, everything he did, we, the media, criticized it, as we would, is the number two overall pick. So he draws a lot of attention. Well, he's saying that this season, the presence of LeBron James has actually taken some of the pressure off. In an interview with the athletics, Bill Orham, he said, I would say it takes pressure off of the young guys. obviously you have LeBron, the best player in the world, all the attentions on him. I know he's dealt with that his whole career, so he's fine with it. But myself is taking the spotlight off a little bit, just making things a little easier. So on the flip side, we're saying maybe...

Can we also point out his dad has not said anything? His dad has... That was my point, Dad. His dad has shut the front door. Is that... That's what's happened? And that helps, too. Look, he's not wrong.

By the way, LeBron's playing a lot of point guard. That's got to be hard for Lonzo, but it's allowed Lonzo. to just catch and shoot and not think about running a team. I think having Rondo helps to people I know in that organization. Like, look. Rondo's fantastic. Rondo's unbelievable in that he's a good teammate, but he's also super competitive. And look, they're just going to play who's playing well at the end of a game,

knowing Lanzo's the long, as now, still they think the long-term answer. But in the short term, Rondo was better last night. He finished the game and he won the game last night. I don't think he's wrong, but I don't think we can start talking about Lanzo ball and the fact that his name hasn't been in the news without pointing out, his dad hasn't said anything, and that's the big change. That is the big change. Let's talk about your boy Baker Mayfield,

because after that stare down with Hugh Jackson, he spoke to the media today at the facility. This is what Baker had to say about that. I don't get why people have a problem with football being competitive sport. You're supposed to play with emotion. You're supposed to play with passion. But honestly, if you don't like it, whatever. Football is not meant to be a soft game.

Care less. Brough, that's not playing with passion. That's playing with like an attitude. Yeah, look, part of me I kind of get it, a little stare down, especially if he knows that Hugh didn't want him. It's a little much. Can I point out, can I hear it one more time? I want to hear at the end. Did he say I could care less or I couldn't care less?

Do we know? He said, I have it as he could care less. Yeah, see, there's, there's, my issue is not as much with the stare down. It's the grammatical error. Yes. Yeah, here, let me re-reaker. Let's see if you said I could or couldn't care less. I don't get why people have a problem with football being competitive sport.

You're supposed to play with emotion. You're supposed to play with passion. Quite honestly, if you don't like it, whatever. Football's not meant to be a soft game. I could care less. He said I could care less. So if you could care less, that actually means you care and you could care less. The correct expression is I couldn't care less.

There's not an ounce that I could possibly care any less than right now. This is not to Baker Mephy. A lot of people make another mistake, right? They say, man, that's a tough road to hoe. You don't hoe a road. I've never heard that explanation. You hoe a row. You never said it a tough road to hoe?

No. But you went to Oklahoma State. Maybe it's a, I don't know. Yeah, but in general, if you know what a hoe is. It's a garden. I know what a ho is. A garden tool. I got it.

Right. Well, you went to UC Santa Barbara sometimes. Oh, what are you saying about that? Okay. So, it's a grammatical English 101 with Doug Gopley. Well, no, no, this is not English. This is a common made mistake, though, Doug. It is.

Couldn't care less. And tough road towed. You don't hoe a road. If you can hoe a road, you're very strong. You have to hoe a row. Oh, a row. It's a tough row to hoe. It's a farming expression.

Thank you for that. That's a tough road to hoe. Can I get one more new story in here? Okay. On the flip side of this, okay, Baker's talking about a lot of passion. Maybe we need a little bit more out of one Blake Bordels. As you know, he lost the starting job this season to Case Keenham. But then he got in the game on Sunday when Case left with the injury in the third. After the game on Sunday, this was

Blake Bortles talking to the media about his future with the franchise. I just work here, man. I signed up for three years. So until those three years are up or until they let me go, I'll play when they need me. Cody Kessler. Cody Kessler. My bad. What did you think about that, though? His comments. What's he supposed to say? Don't say that, you just got paid in February. I just, I work, I just, I work here. Like, I want to be the starting, I'm clearly, he wants to be the starting quarterback. Look, if I'm Baker, I get what Baker's saying, but Baker could say nothing at all.

And everybody knows, hey, look, we say what we say with our play. We say what we say on the scoreboard. Bortles is not, he's not Joe Flacco, who gives you nothing and, and, and, and exudes no passion from you, right? Like, there's no, like, Joe is just, Joe's fine, but he just, exudes no passion. Like, I don't know. Look, the mistake of 2019 is giving guys contracts that you don't have to give

Kai's contract. Oh, 2018 is giving Odell Beckham Jr. Blake Bortle's other guys for different reasons. We'll get to that later on in the week. But he's like, look, I just work here. I show up to work when they say, I knew what. He knows what's happening. They're going to try and replace them in the off season.

Nothing he says is going to change any of them. I just think that was kind of, it's like bad optics. Have a little more passion. or present the passion on the field, right? If you're playing better, you'd have the starting job. That's fair, but his defense did turn on him. And that's Jamie with the news. Well, that's the news.

And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lye News. Coming up next, what did the young Lakers prove last night with a win over the Warriors in the fourth quarter without LeBron James? Jim Jackson and I will discuss next in The Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd, weekdays at noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific.

Doug Gottliebend for Colin alongside Jamie Maggio, wishing you a Merry Christmas and a happy new year. If you're watching us on FS1, you and a couple other people probably saw him in Las Vegas. Last night or two nights ago, right? It was Saturday, Sunday, actually. I don't even know what date today is, to be completely honest. Once you get holiday, Jim Jackson, of course, college basketball analyst, NBA Savant, here on Fox Sports, Fox Sports. sports. One, he joins us. And I want to get to the NBA because I know

in addition to having your mom in town and family, you got a chance to watch a bunch of the league. I want to start with something we haven't discussed. The Sixers. The Sixers. Why aren't they better? Well, your primary ball handler is tough in late game situations for him to actually

make a play outside of his comfort zone, which is going to the basket. Doesn't shoot free throw as well. Refuses to really use the pick and roll to take a jump shot. So what happens in late game situations, just like the other night, it was a dribble handoff and he gave it to JJ Reddick for the shot. When generally, the guy that handles the ball, that's kind of your go-to guy, is going to make a play, okay? Not to say JJ's shot was a bad shot, he had a great

look. But when it comes down to late situations and you want the ball and one of your best players, you need them to make plays. And if he's not comfortable making or taking that jump shot, then it limits what they can do in late games if you don't give it to. Can't you play Can't you play him at the elbow, right? I mean, can't you give it to him at the elbow to where he has, he can be kind of in his office around the bucket and spread people around him? I think you can. But then what happens to is now you're changing the way you play, okay, which is okay.

But if you want him to make plays, if you want to put him in that situation, then that's what you have to do. I think you see it with great teams all the time, even with Dirk Novinsky, okay, Newinsky. They put him at the elbow, okay? They made sure he isolated, not that he couldn't shoot jump shots, but they put him in the comfort zone. where it was tough for the defense to guard them.

This is going to be fascinating. I said, look, Kyrie had 40. Yeah. I watched that game. Like, I think Embed's got almost limitless potential. I do think Simmons, he needs to take shots. Even if he misses them. That's right.

Needs to take them a lot like Janice. Yonis takes some that he's not making, but eventually he'll make more of him. But I watched that game, and I'm like, he, Kyrie's the best player on the floor and there's four other all-stars on the floor. why do you think that people don't, when they rattle off the top five players or even sometimes the top couple of point cards, it feels like Kyrie doesn't get mentioned in that conversation. Impact. I think it's more impact when he's on the court versus when he's off. Because if you look at Steph, is he more talented and stuff?

Probably in regards to just ultra-talented. But Steph's impact when he's not on the court, you can definitely tell. Even with a talented Golden State team, when he's not there. But they're not. But like, look, when Steph's off the court, you got what's his name well katy no who replaces step curry uh the the little guard from duke

Quinn oh Quinn cook yeah like look Quinn cook was in the G league last year right right where you got Terry roger you got Marcus smart like I don't think it's kiree's fault that he's he's backed up by legitimate borderline starting NBA players as opposed to but meaning what though I'm talking about the impact that Steph has even on the starting lineup when he's not in the game because here's a difference go and say this

go play the way Golden State plays, even if Steph is not in the game, okay? But with Kyrie is a different dynamic when he has the ball in his hands because he's more of a one-on-one player. Terry Rozier is going to set guys up. He can go one-on-one, but it's a different dynamic with Kyrie. Kaii is going to pound the ball a lot more, so that's going to slow down the offense and change the dynamics how everybody else play. And that's not taking anything away from, because you know that when you get Kyrie that this is the kind of player he is. Is he a top-five player? Not in my opinion. Top five. talent? Yeah, no doubt. Is he a great player? No doubt. But I think his impact is a little bit different when we start to compare him to that top five.

What's going on with Russell Westbrook? In terms of what? Can't make a free throw now all said. Can't make a free throw? Obviously, he's not shooting well. I mean, he hasn't been their best player all season. Paul George has been. And I think a lot of people got like it was smoke where it took us off the track with the two seasons in a row of averaging a triple double. At this point in his career, his sure. shooting should be getting better. It's not. Now a sudden the free throw shootings left. Yeah, you know, but you know, free throw shooting is a lot mental too. I know, but once you, when you lose it, it's hard to get it back. It is hard, but I think Russell, I'm going to give Russell this amount of credit, is that he took a step back knowing that Paul George, I think after last year, I think they both learned to trust each other, okay?

And with that trust, Russell can say I can take a back seat a little bit at times to allow someone I trust to take over. and play a certain role. And that comes with a level of maturity that we haven't seen from Russell Westbrook. So let's give them some credit when credit is due in that regard. Okay, we'll get to Lakers in a second.

Warriors are beaten without LeBron James. I think the story is their bench is supporting castes not close to what it used to be. Does that mean that even when they get back healthy, they're still good enough to win this? They're still the odds on favorite. Well, Doug, I mean, here's the thing. We look at a one-game scenario and say,

okay, they got beat. but you still have to beat this Golden State team in seven games. That's the issue and that's the challenge with beating a dynamic team like this. Now, is the bench as productive as it was in the past? Could you rely? No, it's not. But that starting five still can be the best starting five in the league. So when you break it down, I think it's more so what the Lakers did well,

which is you have a young team that began to grow under the toolage of LeBron James. But that Laker team doesn't perform the way it does. if you don't have Rondo on the court. If you have Mando Ball in that situation, I don't think his maturity level is at that point yet, that they can perform and sustain that through that third quarter and fourth quarter and ultimately beat Golden State like they did. So what should our expectations be of the Lakers at the end of the season?

Well, from the beginning, mine was that they could easily be the fourth or 15 from a playoff seating perspective at the beginning of the season. Okay, I know, but at the end of the season, can we, will they be competitive at the top of that West? I think they will. From this perspective, is that if you put a LeBron James team with the maturity in which we're seeing from this Lakers team, okay, even if they don't have a home court situation,

they're going to be able to win some games and scare some teams. Do you really still trust Houston? I don't care if they're on this 7-1, you know, in the last eight games, whatever it is. Down the stress, do you really trust them from a system perspective? Forget the player, from a system perspective, okay? Denver. They're playing great basketball, but a LeBron-led James-led team compared to a Denver team.

Who do you trust? A Portland team. You can go on and on besides having Golden State in that conversation. And maybe OKC, who else do you trust other than a LeBron James-led team? I couldn't agree with you more. I think in many ways yesterday was, hey, these guys do know what they're doing. They put competitive guys with some of those young guys, and they're progressively getting better. and last night was huge to be able to

they lost the lead and then to gain it back and then put away the Warriors. I know it's just one game, but it was symbolic of a lot of growth. But it says, again, the growth part I think is so important because the battle with Golden State, as you know, it's always fighting complacency. Okay?

Yep. It's fighting complacency. I got one more for you. Braun pulls a groin. Yeah. It's just the pull of groin. Anybody's play basketball has it. But I just, the guy's never hurt.

and I just, I freak out when I see a soft tissue deal and a guy in his 30s. Am I right to at least hold my breath a little bit at what could possibly be next? Because when you're older, you deal with more muscle issues in regards to injuries unless you just, you know, I've never got hurt. I turned like 31 or 32.

I pulled my hamstring playing. Everything, right? Until I started doing yoga, like that was a deal every time I started playing. The bond, the amount of miles you put on his body, think about this. I think of the 14, 15th season, name is eight games. That was the most. Okay? Eventually

Father Time is going to catch up. I don't care if he's from Mars or wherever. Wherever LeBron is from, eventually it's going to happen. Now, I think they'll take their time in regards to letting this heal, but that's part of the process. He's Jim Jackson. Happy holidays to you. She's Jamie Magia. You'll see her on the sidelines

of the L.A. Clippers. I'm Doug Gottlieb. I'm back tomorrow. We'll have more fun getting ready for week 17 in the NFL. I'm Doug Not leaving this is the herd. Want more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day,

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