The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Middlekauff – 3 and Out - Carolina's future with Cam; Goff's growing pains; Khalil Mack's impact; Wentz's injuries piling up; Darnold vs. Barkley pick

Episode Date: December 18, 2018

Subscribe here to the 3 and Out with John Middlekauff Podcast https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/3-and-out-with-john-middlekauff/id1352730623?mt=2. In this episode, Middlekauff looks at the Saints MNF win over the Panthers, Carolina's future with Cam Newton, Jared Goff's late season struggles, how Khalil Mack has elevated the entire Bears organization, why Carson Wentz's injury history is a problem, and why the Giants should have drafted Sam Darnold over Saquon Barkley. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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What's going on, everybody? John Middlecop. Another edition of the three and out podcast. We're only a couple weeks to just finish watching the Monday night football game. We got week 16. We got week 17. and then we got the playoffs, baby. You know, it's an exciting time.

So we're kind of hitting. We've already hit the stretch run. We're really just kind of capping off the season. We now know the Panthers are done. The Saints are, you know, a lock one or two seed. Can the Rams hold on? Can the bear sneak in? You know, a lot to be learned really this week.

And we'll dive in more to the playoffs scenarios, probably on Friday, just because so much is up in the game. the air, you know, with the sixth seed in the AFC, the sixth seed in the NFC, the seeding in the NFC, the seating in the AFC. I think we'll have a, when I'm recording this next week, we will have a much clearer picture. And the playoffs are the best, man. I mean, it's just one and done, best by far games to gamble on.

The lines are the truest. You can take advantage, like, oh, I can't wait to bet against Lamar Jackson. especially if he has to go to Foxborough that first weekend. Also, I'm already kind of eyeing if Minnesota can play a little better. They might get a pretty big line going to Chicago, which could be tough. The Bears, they play in Week 17, could they beat him three straight games. But we'll dive into all that and just a lot going on. Carson Wentz's health, some of Jared Goff struggles, some stuff on Sam Donald and Saquan Barkley.

and we'll just kind of roll around the league in what happened yesterday. But I'm going to start with this Monday night football game. You know, I'm like most people probably, you have to watch it on mute. It's hard to take some of the comments. But, you know, in fairness, broadcasting is hard. I wasn't good when I first got a mic in front of me six, seven years ago. So, you know, you learn by doing, as we like to say it, my alma mater, Cal Poly. But to me, my biggest takeaway tonight was the losing team.

the Carolina Panthers, and I think a couple things. I like Ron Rivera. I met him a couple times. He's a Bay Area guy. The one time I talked to him last year, actually, when I went for the Three and Out podcast to the Combine, we saw each other in the hallways. I introduced myself. He couldn't have been any nicer.

I mean, it was like 9 o'clock at night in the hallway. He didn't have to say shit. And he stood there. I mean, we talked for like 10 minutes. Yeah, I told him where I live in the Bay Area and we started BSing. So I just liked him. I've always liked him. I actually think he's one of the more underrated coaches in the league when you check his resume.

But this year's kind of falling apart on him. And listen, I'm not big on owners overreacting to one bad season when a guy has a resume. I mean, two years ago, I was sitting at the Super Bowl watching his team there. Now, Cam Newton was the MVP that year. And the crazy thing about Cam Newton, you know what's nuts, despite being a max quarterback and one of the biggest freaks this league's ever seen just from a physical standpoint at quarterback, he's never even been the best player on his own team. Even his MVP year, Luke Keeckley's always been the best player on the Carolina Panthers.

I really don't even think it's close. But we'll get into Cam here in a second. When you pay $2.2 billion cash for anything, he paid $2.2 billion in cash. In cash. He sold, I remember right before he, made the purchase, there was an article on CNBC. He sold like eight, he liquidated over eight, or like right around 800 million dollars worth of apple stock, just worth of apple stock. I mean, can you imagine being Dave Tepper not that long ago, just peeking into your assets

and seeing, oh, you know, I got, you know, just a cool 800 million in Apple. I mean, God, you can't even, the level of his wealth is just stupid. But when you pay, you pay, anything. And I believe this, you quote, I don't think he overpaid, but he paid a lot. I mean, he paid a premium for a premium. You want to get an NFL team. He actually didn't even offer the most, but he paid cash. He was already, you know,

a part owner, I think of the Pittsburgh Steelers. Like, you get to overreact a little bit. You know, I would even judge him a little differently if, like, he had financed it. I'd be like, you know, you only put down like 600 mil. But he paid cash for the entire thing. So you know what? I would not fire Ron Rivera. I would for sure give him another year.

But I'm going to give Dave Tepper the benefit of the doubt on this one. Like if he wants to overreact, make some harsh decisions at the end of this season, for a team that has notoriously around league circles has been very old school. They've been very behind the times. Obviously, he's been outspoken, like how their analytic department is not up to snuff. And clearly, he's a hedge fund guy, so he's a numbers guy. It probably bothers them. But I get it.

Though I would hope that he sits down. Ron Rivera is a cow guy, a high-level guy, a smart guy, and a proven winner of this league, that the new owner takes a deep breath. Because trying to overreact, I think you could make a poor decision. And I get, what are they now? Six and eight.

They started six and two. I didn't go to Harvard, but that's a six-game losing streak. Not ideal. But I think their biggest problem, as you saw it tonight, I don't have that many takeaways from New Orleans. They won a tight game on the road. I'm a big believer. Just bad teams.

I don't think Carolina is bad, but they were fighting for something. Just any team, when you play on Monday night football, for the most part, you give your best effort, especially late in the season. Every person in America is watching the game. So it's a big deal for players, coaches all around. So I expect the games to be tight. So again, New Orleans, they're going to play at home.

They'll be fine. But the Carolina Panthers and Cam Newton, and I thought Jason Witten's first and only good point of the season was saying, yeah, Cam's completion percentage, and I get he's injured and his shoulder's a little messed up, and he clearly is not throwing it right. He's always had somewhat of a loopy release, but he's like tilting his body, it's crazy.

So I'm going to give him a little bit of a pass in terms of his accuracy, which has never been that accurate, of a pastor. Now, granted, he's having an accurate season relative to his inaccuracies, but tonight was a train wreck. I mean, it was horrendous. I think he had 16 completions, but it felt like a large majority, I got the box score up, were two Christian McCaffrey, who was no farther than, you know, 20 feet at 10 feet away from him. But you can't win with a quarterback that's that inaccurate. And he's built like,

LeBron James. He can run like a deer, run over guys. He's a physical outlier in a league full of physical freaks. But you got to be able to pass it accurately. So whether he goes on the shelf now or whatever happens with a shoulder and he gets it fixed, if he is not able to become a more accurate passer consistently, Carolina is screwed. And he is, you know, his best days are behind him. It's just, it's simple. Listen, I am not the biggest cam guy. But I will always, and I bet one of the biggest bets I've ever made in my life came against him at the Super Bowl, made a large four-figure, you know, return on my enormous bet on the Denver Broncos. And I mainly bet against him.

I said there's no chance. I don't care that he just won the MVP in that team's 15 and won. They're beating the Denver Broncos. It was stealing money, and I attended it. It was one of the great three and a half hours I've ever been at a game when you win that much money. Relative to me, it was a lot of cash. and I bet against his inaccuracy. I bet against his ability to beat that Denver Bronco team.

And he was great that season. Well, he hasn't been quite the same since. Now, when he gets hot and when he's humming, and he did last year in the playoff game against the Saints when they went toe to toe, he can be as good as any. He can beat anyone. But right now, with his injury, he's just consistently inaccurate.

And back to what Witten said, he said, yeah, you can have an eight-game stretch where you're throwing 65% completion percentage, but not every completion is the same, just like not every incompletion are the same. You have to put it into context. Like, it's a bigger deal to complete a pass on third and seven than it is first and ten.

That is a must-down. You either complete it or you punt. It's like I've always said the analytic guys love in baseball that the post-season is, you cannot put any more emphasis on the 5ABs, any different than the five A-Bs he had in June? No, there is more pressure on the ad-bats in the playoffs. I don't know how to quantify it, but that it's not even arguable.

Just like there is more pressure in the third quarter when you're down a touchdown on 3rd and 10, then there is on 2nd and 5 in the first quarter when you're up a touchdown. Like, every throw is not equal. Certain throws mean more than others, especially late in a game, in a tie game, in passing situations where the other team knows you're passing. Can you complete a third and ten in the fourth quarter with five minutes left down four when the other team knows you're going to drop back to pass? Like any decent quarterback can beat you on a play action pass in a tie game in the second quarter.

Can you win on a must-down throwing the ball? And right now, Cam's not even close. Now again, it's this injury, his shoulder looks clearly he's throwing it kind of funky, but he's always been that guy that you didn't know what you were getting. And to me, like when it's all said and done, is he a Hall of Fame or is he not? That's a conversation. He's still a pretty young guy, so he's going to have a lot of career achievements when it's all said and done. But when I watch Cam Newton, I've never once thought, now, like going into the game.

Now, once the game starts and he's hot, like, yeah, it'd be the type guy I'd want. but like feel confident when I'm putting in the in the circle of the breezes. Hell, even Philip Rivers, who you know, you'd say, well, Cam's accomplished more, I have more faith in Philip Rivers in a big game. Obviously the Brady's, the Rogers, the Russell Wilson's. Like, can Cam be a guy that I just sit on his back for an entire season and he carries you? Now, he did it the one season, but again, don't ever get it twisted. he's never been the best player on his own team.

If that is the case and you're a star quarterback, we got issues. Just think about that. Now, that player is Luke Keechley, who's also a Hall of Famer, who is a 100% Hall of Famer. Cam's still kind of right in his story, but he's trending that way, I think. Cam is a flawed, great player. And if this shoulder injury, hopefully can get fixed,

because right now he's a shell of himself. and tonight he was just a train wreck. Okay, let's get into my man, Jared Goff. He's hitting a little rough patch here, and anyone that's listened to the show for a while knows. I usually cape and defend us west coasters, especially people from Northern California. And Jared Goff, someone I loved in college,

had no problem with him going number one overall. Now, granted, John Middokoff, the media member, probably didn't grind the tape enough on Carson's. and wents. I think clearly if they're both healthy, you'd rather have wence. But Gough has shown to be a very, very good quarterback. But he's in the league, probably compare him to like Matt Ryan-ish. Now, is he going to have a Matt Ryan career? Time will tell. But I think, and I am a culprit of this too, you can blame me for this, just the over-hype on quarterbacks. And it happens all the time. And the reality is, no different than life, there's only a handful of people in, you know,

in a company that truly matter, in a football team that truly matter. There are only, usually you walk into a classroom, there's only one Stanford level kid. Most kids are state school kids. When you walk into an NFL, an NFL team, even a good NFL team, only have so many pro bowlers. even good teams might have six, seven pro bowlers. And the reality with quarterbacks, there's only four or five guys that truly can carry a team. You can give him chicken shit, and he can make chicken salad.

And right now in the NFL, that number is a lot smaller than the guys we actually talk about. Like, it's kind of been proven. Derek Carr is not that guy. Dack, you know, I know Collins hard on Dack. And I like that. I think he has some unflappable characteristics, but there are definitely concerns. Like, can he just put you on his back for a month's stretch? No, he can't.

Now, and I think we have to do this with any young quarterback. They shouldn't be able to do that. You know, what Mahomes is doing is an outlier. That is not normal. He's also had some variables go his way, right? He has elite skill guys. He has an elite coach. Like the variables and things around you in life,

especially when you are young, matter. If I went to take a sales job tomorrow, would I rather sell Apple products or, you know, three-ring binders? You know, I bet I could push Apple products, iPads, iPhones, Apple computers, easier than I could in modern day, in 2018, three-ring binders.

So the things that, you know, you don't control that as a quarterback because you don't get to pick the team. Like, you don't get to pick Andy Reed. He picks you. Jared Goff was lucky. He got Sean McVeigh. Jimmy Garoplo, I've always said, was lucky. Belichick drafted him. He got to sit behind Tom Brady, learn from McDaniels, and then they traded him to Kyle Shanahan.

I mean, that's basically like the opposite of, I don't know, like Jim Tom Sula and Ben McAdoo. Like Jimmy Garoppolo should thank God every day that in his short football life so far, he's been granted football heaven when it comes to offense. So is Jared Goff. You know, he threw it at Cal. They didn't win a lot, but he got to dominate because of the offense. And then Jeff Fisher tried to throw a rink in this theory. But then Sean McVeigh came along and changed his career.

But the biggest thing for Jared Goff is for the first time in his life, he had a superstar, and let me say that again, a superstar running back, and he's dependent on him. Like, Jared Goff is not going to say, hey, everyone, get on my back and I'll take us home. Joe Flacco did it in a playoff run. Eli Manning's done it in a couple playoff runs. Tom Brady's been doing it for seasons for years. Philip Rivers does it a lot. You know, I mean, consistently, Russell Wilson has turned into that guy the last couple years.

Carson Wentz was kind of doing that last year for a period of time before he got his ACL turn, uh, tour. And like I said about Derek Carr, Derek Carr showed he could do it several years ago, but his teammates around him were special. And when they have to, it separates guys. And most young guys can't do this and should not be able to do this. You be a guy on a rookie contract just carrying a team with players that are below average. That is not normal.

And right now, since, Todd Gurley has been, I wouldn't say a shell of himself, but the Sunday night game against the Bears when it was ice cold, he wanted no part of. And now none of the Rams did, but he definitely didn't. That wasn't his cup of tea. The next game last night, or Sunday night, depending on what day you're listening to this,

that's when the actual game happened, though. He got banged up and was not himself. And I was reading a stat that the last couple games, the first back-to-back losing streak, it feels like if Sean McVeigh's career. The Eagles are the only team that has beat the Rams twice. Now, obviously, there'd only be, you know, the NFC West options and maybe the Atlanta Falcons teams that have played them back-to-back years.

But Jared Gop, the last couple of years, has thrown the least amount of play-action passes of the season. This has been the lowest percentage of play-action pass attempts of the year for them. And obviously, they've lost both those two games. And you go, well, that's somewhat of a red flag. because when you watched him, when we're, you know, kind of anointing him. And again, I am guilty on this too because I kind of did it. But I'm watching the last couple games.

He's not ready to do that yet. He's not capable of doing that yet. And what you saw the Eagles do, and I'll touch on Tom Brady a little later, in a game that, you know, everyone is trying to get the violence out of it, CTE, head hits. I never will apologize for saying, still like guys getting crushed. I still like watching the Seattle Seahawks on Sunday, you know, when they had to get

a stop, crush some skulls. Like, I like that style of football, and I refuse to apologize for it. Now, I get the implications of it, but I still enjoy watching that style of football. Well, they were starting to hit Jared Gough, and they were hitting him hard, and it threw him off. So he's used to getting protected since he's, you know, since Jeff Fisher left, and he's used to being able to hand the ball off. Well, when you can hit a guy in play action pass, you don't need to be Nick Saban schemeologist to know the linebackers bite so you get huge openings throughout the middle of the field and the safeties.

You know, aren't as comfortable playing in the open field because their first step sometimes is forward instead of backwards. And when you have guys that can haul ass like the Rams do with Brandon Cooks and, you know, Robert Woods, you can exploit them. And a lot of Jared Goff's big plays came with wide open guys. why you hear, you know, NFL people say, well, it's hard to evaluate him in college because he's throwing to wide open guys. You have to make tight window throws, like the throw rivers made, you know, with the game on the line against the Chiefs. Like the throws, this guy's been making them all year in Patrick Mahomes, Brady's been making them forever, Peyton Manning. The highest level quarterbacks can do that because not everything is play action past, guy wide open over the

middle. In tight games against good teams, against good defenses, you have to be able to throw when everyone in the stadium and everyone in their couch knows you're throwing and deliver a dart into tight coverage. Like that is still in a day and age when it's never been easier to play offense, still mandated. And it's still very important to be able to do that while Melvin Ingram, while Joey or Nick Bosa, both Bosa will be in the league soon,

Khalil Mack, you name it. The long list of pass rushers in this league are coming to hit you square in the chest, are coming to hit you with full force. Yet last night, Ndomacan Su hit Nick Foles. I was in Philadelphia when Nick Foles was drafted. He is big.

Nick Foles is a big S-O-B. Like he had college scholarships to play hoops. Nidomikin Suu hit him with two arms and Foles flew like a rag doll. Like to be able to take those hits and just hop back up, Like there's a reason quarterbacks get all the money and get all the girls.

Like their position is the most difficult and they usually look the best. But you know what I'm getting at? Like it's really difficult. And for the first time in a long time, when games mattered, because here's the thing, at Cal, again, I watched his entire career.

His first two years, they weren't a bowl team. The second year, they couldn't beat a good team to save their life and they got into a bowl because I think they were seven and five. They didn't play in important games. I said last year was the first time in golfs,

Like in his life of being a famous guy in college or the pros, he's played in important games. And this year, again, he's playing in these games, and it's hard. It's difficult. Like, he's going through some growing pains. So I think we're finding out that he can't just throw the team on his back and carry them, which he's in his third year. It's going to take time.

But it's the reason I've been saying, like, I'm going to bet against the Rams if a good team goes into L.A. And depending on how this whole playoff situation, you know, plays out, Somehow, like, they got the three and the Bears got the two, I would 1,000% bet against Jared Gough going into Chicago and winning that game. I would bet on a good team, like, Minnesota might beat them in the first round if they were the 3-6.

The Rams, because of golf, now, if they had rivers, you know, or some elite quarterback, I would feel 100% more confident in them. But they are so dependent on Todd Gurley-Humman and guys being relatively pretty open for Jared Gough to kick your ass. because he's not just going to sit back there and pick you apart. That's not who he is. Okay, really quick. Are you one of the people that thinks it's okay to drive stoned?

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It's not okay to drive high. If you've been using marijuana in any form, Joints, you name it. Vapes, do not get behind the wheel. If you feel different, you drive different. Drive high, get a DUI, brought to you by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. Anyone that's ever outkicked their coverage in life with the opposite sex,

or hell, with the same sex is an open-minded podcast, I can only speak from the opposite sex side. And you start dating a girl. I'm a single guy. and when you take a girl out that's just a smoke show, when you walk into the room or you're in a serious relationship or whatever, you know, your self-confidence goes up a little higher.

You become confident, more confident in everything you are doing. It carries over in life. It really does. And it goes the other way too, but not as bad. But definitely when you're dating a girl that's better looking than you probably should be dating, you get really confident. and it really adds to just your daily swag,

even if you already are a pretty confident guy and have some swag. And I thought about the Chicago Bears, coming into this season, they were going to be a seven and eight, you know, competitive type win team. You know, seven and nine, eight and eight, but be a team that as of the middle of December, we would have been talking about competing for the playoffs.

I thought they had that kind of just talent on the roster. But the moment John Gruden decided, to make one of the dumbest, arguably the dumbest, trade in NFL history. Khalil Mack added something to that franchise that no one in their roster could have done. They were gifted, you know, the best-looking girl in the league, and who just happens to be one of the great players we've ever seen.

Just one of the true great non-quarterback difference makers we've ever seen. I'm a Matt Nagy guy. I've known him since 2010 when he was an intern for Coach Reed. And I was, anyone that's listening to this a long time, I believe in Matt Nagy. I love Matt Nagy. Matt Nagy is the man. And I believe that he was going to get them rolling.

And I had full confidence, again, that they were going to be competitive. But Khalil Mack, and even talking with a buddy on that staff, he said, yeah, I kind of agree. I think we would have been, and he was a little more bullish than me. He's like, I think we might have been an eight or nine win team, but Khalil made us an 11 and 12 win team. And it'll depend on how hard the Bears try, maybe week 17, whether they get to 12 wins. But to me, I watch them. They've been a 12 win team. They have been that good.

And the irony is their quarterback hasn't played that well. But it's because every time they step on that field and you look around and they got good players everywhere on defense. I mean, Eddie Jackson has been an elite safety this year. Just a ball hawk. And if you're a Bears fan, you keep your fingers crossed, hope he's okay, because you need him for your playoff run.

And it should be. It was kind of a freaky deal when he rolled his ankle. Akeem Hicks, the most dominant player in the league that the casual fan does not know about. Roquan Smith, best linebacker prospect since Keekeley.

But Khalil Mack is a Lawrence Taylor or Reggie White. I mean, he's a franchise changer. It's like Dayton Cindy Crawford when you've been single for a while. Every room, you're going to walk in, you're going to think you're better than. Even if you're not better than your opponent or the guy you're trying to do a deal with, your confidence goes through the roof.

And the guy that changed that for them is number 52. He changed the entire franchise. They would not have won the division without them. I feel, I can't say 100%, but no chance. They just would not have won the division. He changed the franchise. He changed just the culture and the market. mindset with Matt Nagy. Matt Nagy played a role in that. But when everyone in that building,

right before week one, we just landed Khalil Mack. And like Khalil Mack with my, you know, hot chick analogy, here's the thing about it. It's not like you acquired some crazy player. Like, how did we get this guy? Oh, he's got drug problems. Oh, you know, she hasn't been in a committed relationship long. I don't know if she's going to be faithful. Callil's a high character. great guy that everyone the building loves. And he's the hardest worker. I mean, it'd be like dating Cindy Crawford, who also loves to cook, great mother, and is rich.

I mean, it's like, oh my God. You talk to people with the Bears, they will constantly tell you, this is like still too good to be true. Because Khalil Mack is too good to be true. You do not find elite defensive players that are high character, no maintenance, the hardest worker on your team,

and every guy in the building loves them. I'm talking from the secretary to the coach to the cook. And that's what they acquired. And that's once upon a time what the Green Bay Packers acquired in Reggie White. LT was a little different, obviously, off the field. But it cannot be overstated the impact that this individual had, this individual player that does, not play quarterback in a quarterback league how he changed this franchise and i have kept a close

particular eye on this team i found them to be as enjoyable of a defensive team as we've had in this league since like the the niners and seattle were humming five or six years ago they are throwback old school but with these new wrinkles of fun because matt naggy and again i i tell them this a little too cute sometimes for my liking, but the players eat it up. They really do on offense. And it works for them. You know, it's worked perfectly for them. Really, if they hadn't had a couple screw-ups,

they could easily be like a one-win team right now. You know what I mean? They're like two plays away from basically being undefeated. But a big reason they've even had the chance to be in that conversation is 52 Kahlil Mack, the future. When he goes into the Hall of Fame one day, think about this. Think about what Gruden traded. He'll be wearing a Chicago Bears jersey after three or four straight all pros with the Bears,

changing their franchise, leading them to the playoffs. He left a franchise that doesn't have a home to one of the truly great old school original franchises in football history. In a bigger media market that he left, and I got news for you, we're, depending. know where you look, you know, fourth or fifth in the Bay Area greater media market. It's not L.A. or New York in Chicago, but it'd be third by many metrics. And that's where he's at. In a big boy franchise with stability, just shining, like he would shine with the Raiders, he'd shine with the Patriots, he'd shine anywhere he went.

That's how special of a player, Khalil Mack is. Let's dive into the Philadelphia Eagles. And, you know, the first. famous saying, I think Tom Hanks said it in Apollo 13, maybe different astronaut movie. Houston, we have a problem. Pretty sure that's Apollo 13. Philadelphia, we have a problem. And the problem is your franchise quarterback. I watched, you know, I follow a lot, most NFL teams on Twitter, but I stumbled upon, I was on Twitter when Doug Peterson met the media on Friday. This is the one thing I appreciate about the northeast. Just the fervor and intensity, a fervor's, I think so a word, the intensity in which the

sport is covered. The entire 12-minute press conference, this was two days before the Rams game, was all about medical, doctors, injury updates, all surrounding Carson Wentz. And in fairness to the reporters, that's the only question that mattered. what is the deal with Carson Wentz? Now, in fairness to Doug Peterson and Belichick, that's always smart when he takes this tactic, the coach is not a doctor.

I'm sorry, I don't blame the coach, for not knowing information, for lying with the medical information, like for shooting it down. And several players, some like has been players or never was players, one of the Acho brothers,

a couple other scrubs on Twitter, were taking shots of the Eagle. doctors. Like, I'm sorry, I don't put much stock into that because I don't think that they're circumventing anything with their franchise quarterback. But I do think the problem lies within the simple question of, is this guy going to be available when you need him the most? Because right now, I have two years of data. Last year, they won the Super Bowl without him because he towards ACL. Let's even throw out the ACL injury and just go, okay, ACL injuries are a little random. I said the same thing with Jimmy Garoppolo. I'll give him the benefit of doubt on the ACL injury,

but I watched him attempt to start when Tom Brady disappeared and he lasted a game and a half. Carson Wentz. He didn't become a starter in college until his junior year, and then he got hurt. His senior year. Broke his thumb, I think. Bro some broke an arm or broke a thumb. then tears his ACL year two and then by year three he's got back issues couldn't even make it 16 games obviously couldn't start the season coming back from ACL injury and they can't finish the season with a separate injury it's one thing to have setbacks with the same injury it's another thing to have other injuries like eventually they catch up and i was texting with a buddy in the league i said man i mean is carson wince what do you think injury prone and he's his style

it takes a lot of hits. And watching Cam Newton tonight, he's the same thing. When you're that big and that just destructive of a human being, you think you can take on anyone. And in the NFL, I say it all the time, man. I don't care if the strong safety, you know, like for the Raiders, for example, Carl Joseph, who went in the first round, is like 5, 8 and a half, 200 pounds. But he will hit you so hard if you're not like, he'll break your,

your rips. In the NFL, like, can you imagine what Khalil Mack and Aaron Donald and Adomacan Sue and those type guys will do to you? You have to avoid hits. It's my issue with Lamar Jackson, beside the fact that he's not an accurate passer. He doesn't slide. Like, you have to sustain in the NFL. It's not just about having one big year. It's about when you're to become a great player. It's about sustaining it and doing it for a while, especially a quarterback like carson they will give you the max contract they want to build this thing around you but so far last year they make a playoff run you're nowhere to be found because you got a knee surgery okay this year i'm back alive again and i look around you're nowhere to be found your back's

going so i get all these people tweeting at me and texting me like you always like you think they should pay so and so it's usually like dachan watson jared gough karsson wince Like, the only way I'm paying Carson Wentz this offseason is if I get a massive discount. I can't max him out. I'm not saying that he's not a max player. I think when he is healthy and what he was showing last year, it was clear he was going to become a elite player. But there's been a lot of players in the history of sports that had elite talent and had the mindset, the work ethic, and everything you want like Carson is. that just for whatever reason always get hurt.

Now, Carson can't avoid some of these hits, cannot always take unneeded shots, but there is some element of luck, life, whatever, that you can't quantify of, this guy just might be injury prone. And that makes me sad even thinking about it because I'm a Carson-Went's guy. I love watching him play,

but he can't stay healthy. Like, that's the point we're at now. Injured in college, tore his ACL, has a stretch fracture is back. I mean, it's just, I can live with like, you know, you broke a toe or you pull the hammy. But, I mean, you start adding up some of these major knee injury. You go, broken bone, torn ACL. It's like, Jesus, is this guy going to be able to last? How can you extend this guy, which the Eagles would have no problem if he was healthy, paying him huge cash?

But how can they do it right now? The answer is they can't. And the answer is, for the first time with this guy, like, say what you want about Jared Goff or DAC, and Carson is a better player than both those guys, more talented player than both those guys. But right now, and again, this is just, it is what it is. I'm just going off the pure data. Two guys can play all the games. They don't get injured. One guy can't stay on the field.

These are just facts. And again, I would take Carson over both those two guys. And I just randomly yank those two guys for my example. but like, you know, it's an issue right now. It's a major issue. They're lucky enough to have Nick Foles, who's, you know, if not the best, a top two or three backup in the league.

But they need that. Right now, you need a top backup in the NFL. When I worked for the Eagles, I remember after Michael Vick kind of came on the scene and almost won that MVP, that entire offseason, Coach Reed wanted Alex Smith. He wanted to pay him like $5 or $6 million to be the backup.

When we couldn't get him, the mistake was made on Vince Young, but I think we paid him like $4 million. I thought he was a good backup. Again, bad mistake. But in theory, they just knew they needed a backup because Vic would go down. Like, same thing with Wentz.

Like part of the package right now, based off the information we have, is you would need a backup, a good backup. Like you couldn't just roll into the season with an average. And I say the same thing about the Niners. I'd put the Niners in the same category. The difference is they,

they've already invested a huge contract into Jimmy. And this year was a lost cause because he got hurt. And you are so dependent when you pay or you invest a high draft pick for these guys to say healthy. If you're quarterback that you've invested, you've gone all in. Either with the number one overall pick or like the Eagles basically, he was the second pick, but the way they traded up for him, they treated him like the number one overall pick.

and when you pay him, you are dependent on that guy staying on the field. Like say one thing about Tom Brady, beside 2008, when he tore his ACL, he's there. The only time he missed over that period of time was when Roger Goodell kind of screwed him. Let's call it what it is. You know, Philip Rivers, Eli Manning, Joe Flacco, all these guys, even Flacco and Eli, for example,

that beside their Super Bowl years, you know, Ben hit or miss, at least they've always been available. At least there's something to be said for that. Not missing games. Being able to depend on you. That was the big question mark this offseason on Andrew Locke. Like what's going to be his deal?

Well, it turns out, just protect him. His shoulder's back. He's back. You know, he can play full seasons. Like, how many 16 games seasons is Carson Wentz have? I got the answer for you. One, rookie year. Like, that's an issue.

You know, I need his 16 games. game seasons to come, you know, in his third, four, fifth, sixth, seventh year. That's when we're going to rattle off playoffs. You know, that's important, man. Durability. They say, you know, availability is a skill. And you can't make the club in the tub. Well, a guy like Carson Wentz is going to make the club.

But if you're always in the tub, you definitely can't help the club. You like my little rhyming right there? Yeah, me too. So you just got to keep your fingers crossed because that. as someone that loves watching him play, he's starting to make me nervous. Okay, one last thing before we get to the Middilcoff mailbag, at John Middlough, my DMs. One thing you'll see on social media heavily is how great a rookie season, Sequin Barclay's had. And he's been unreal.

I mean, he's going to end 90 plus catches, you know, he's had over 1,000 yards. He's been awesome. He's been a game breaker. He's an elite player. He's a special, special player. And Sam Darnold, for the most part, has been roasted this year. Like, Sam Darnold? That guy stinks.

Like, what, I'm just not seeing it with Sam Darnold. This, better than Berkeley, are you crazy? And listen, there have been some moments when Sam Darnold did not look good. He had a rough stretch. And Sequin has made some just incredible runs. I mean, he runs like a 3-8-4. You know, he can't fly. So he gets a little daylight, he's out the gates.

But I got news for you. Sequin Barclay has had an unreal season. Besides Sunday, when he got shut down and they got their ass kick by the Tennessee Titans. He's been awesome. They're five and nine. You know, they are five and nine. With, you know, more than likely the rookie of the year and a guy that's dominated start to finish. Sam Darnold, who has been up and down and a lot more down than up,

His head coach is going to be fired here in the next week or two. His GM might be blown out. They might just start at scratch. Has the worst skill positions in the league. His team's four and nine. Can you imagine if Sequin, and this is my argument back to why you never take a running back when you need a quarterback and there's a quarterback on the board? Saquan Barkley, who has dominated the NFL.

I mean, just had some, I mean, the offensive rookie of the year, looks like he's a guy if he can stay healthy. It's going to be a Hall of Famer. His team is five and nine. Sam Darnold has struggled mightily as their best weapon is Robbie Anderson. They don't have running backs. Their offensive lines are terrain wreck. Again, their coach, I worked with Todd Bowles for a year.

He's a good defensive coach. He doesn't know anything about offense. Defensive coaches don't. Couldn't tell Sam Darnold the difference between a three and a seven-step drop. I got news for you. No defensive coaches can't. So his head coach can't help him out.

He's going to be blown out here soon. They're four-nine. And as you saw on Saturday night, like, if I need to hold your hand, if you're a football fan, and you don't think Sam Darnold is talented, now is he good yet? Can he be consistently good at the NFL level?

Can he take a step when he gets a better coach? Hopefully it's an offensive guy. They get better skills around him. Yeah, I mean, I'm betting on him. But he has not done that yet. But if you can't see it, if you watch that game on your couch, you know, with some buddies by yourself, having a pop, and just watching Sam Donald play.

And you're just watching them against the Houston Texans on Saturday. I guess it would have been Saturday, the night game, at least for me, at 1.30 on the West Coast. And you can't see it? I can't help you. Should you quit watching football? I wouldn't go that far, but I'd say maybe just rewatch the game

because his innate instincts as a player are pretty special. And it's not like he's 25 years old. He was a redshirt sophomore when he went pro. He, as my buddies told me, that in the weight room, when you get your height and your weight, at the NFL Combine, you're in a pair of, like, the equivalent, it's like a girdle, you know, or a pair of underwear.

So you're standing there. Everyone said, God, his body's terrible. Well, because it's underdeveloped. He'd never lifted. It's basically like, remember Tom Brady, the famous Combine picture of him wearing the long, cotton shirt and just bad body? That's kind of Sam Donald. The difference is Sam Donald's a pretty good athlete, and he's just an instinctive athlete.

And as you saw against the Texans, he can just make some special plays. I think the parallel, he can be a better version of Tony Romo. He needs a lot of help. His running back stink. His receivers are worse. He has no tight end. They got a long way to go. But all I know is this.

If you told me for the next five years, I get to pick one or the other. And I need a running back and I need a quarterback. And they were both on the board, just the two of them. I would take Sam Donald still to this day, even off the information we have. Because we see how great Seekwant is. has been. They're five and nine. If he had been the equivalent of a quarterback doing what he's doing at running back, you know, just let's say through 30 touchdowns, they'd be at minimum 500. Hell, the Giants might be in the playoffs. Like a running back can only impact the game so much.

You know? Like Sam Darnold carried his team against what might be, what's the Texans, the number two seat. He just threw him on his back and carried him. And they ended up losing, but they were only in the game because of him. So my argument, and I feel strong about this, about the running back thing, I don't care if the guy's Seaquin Barclay. And I think Saquan Barclay is a Hall of Famer. And I talked about it last week on my podcast. He might be the best running back in the NFL right now, depending on who he talked to. I mean, that's how good he's been.

And I still, the version I have right now of Sam Darnel, the underdeveloped body, the guy that still makes some mistakes, the guy that's had a up and down rookie year, I wouldn't even hesitate. I mean, if I was the Giants, if I could redo the pick. I mean, I wouldn't even flinch. Sequin Barclay's having a historic rookie year. I might not win six games if I'm Pat Shermer. I mean, if I had Sam Darnold with Odell Beckham, let's say Nick Chubb, you know, instead of Sequin Barclay, Ingram, Shepard, I mean, they might be eight and eight.

Okay, let's get into the Middlecough mailbag. At John Middlecough, you slide up into those DMs. I answer your questions right here. Middlecoff mailbag. How long do we have to put up with Boog and Witton on Monday Night Football? How bad is the relationship between ESPN and is there any chance they lose the Monday Night Football Spot? You know, not to beat a dead horse on this one,

but I do think this is a good question given that Florio tweeted out a link. I just skimmed through it. So maybe he interviewed, maybe they, actually I think they were interviewed by it. What it was, it was an article in the athletic, where you can also find my articles coming out Monday and Friday in the Bay Area version, just shameless plug, that Witten and Bug will be back. And same with, I would imagine, Tess.

Here's my biggest, you know, beef with the whole thing. And I'll be the first to say, I've never called a football game. It would be hard. It's difficult. You know, I have another podcast that I work with a play-by-play. Guy Haberman, coming play-by-play guy, call a game this year on Fox Sports One, Pac-12 network in his early 30s future star.

It's hard. Like, I do not ever take away how difficult it is. But the broadcast is atrocious. Tessator, having been someone that, you know, I'd call myself somewhat of a broadcast critic. I watch him very intently. He's, an NFL game will take care of itself. You don't all, like, the one thing that's good about, Gus, for example, is he's doing college games, so he makes them feel bigger.

He did it in the tournament, and he obviously does it on college games now with clap. The NFL games, you don't really need to act like that, unless it's like, you know, the Miami Miracle or something, but the game kind of creates a feel on its own. It's the NFL. He's way over the top. Witten, who is clearly a really high-level, smart guy, is not a media personality. to go in Monday night football, and does Monday night football mean as much? Like, I got news for you.

Thursday night now is more important. Fox is running circles around them with Aikman and Buck. The Sunday night game with Michaels and Collinsworth is better. So you need a Madden-Grunden-type personality. It's not as much about breaking down the X's nose and giving me some crazy insight, not that he does that, but it's about being a big personality, and that's what Madden was and obviously what Gruden was. Witten just doesn't have the personality

and then Buggers doesn't know the league that well I mean I could name I know the league better clearly but uh shameless plug but it's just you it's hard to know the league you have to follow it closely you know I could call most NBA games I know I could name the 90% of the starting fives you know they're only 12 players on a roster

even baseball is a little more difficult because it's double that football's hard and even the NFL you know decent amount of star players, but still, like, in a broadcast, you end up talking about, like, the backup linebacker or a safety or the second tight end. Like, you just have to know a lot of players. I remember when I first got in the NFL, I thought it was overwhelming. Just the amount of players, the practice squad guys, the turnover as the season goes.

You know, it's not just a bunch of Odell Beckham's. It's a bunch of guys that you haven't heard of. You know, even if anyone listening to this knows your team, like whoever your team is, I'll just pick a random team. The Tampa Bay Buccaneers. It's just a random team, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. They got a couple just, you know, James Winston, Deshawn Jackson, Mike Evans.

And then every year you got brand new defensive linemen, brand new linebackers, a new corner of highly drafted safety, you know, a brand new running back that might not be playing because the seventh rounder beat him out. And then the guy from practice squad is, you know, once O.J. Howard goes down is now your tight end. Again, I mean, this is hypothetical, it's actually bright.

I mean, but it's just hard to keep up with all these players. I've worked in the league and thought, God, it's just, it's difficult. It's why I was around smart people, and they had been around the league, Howie Roseman, Lewis Riddick, these guys have been around the league forever, and it just takes a while to get a grasp on it. You know, Brett Veach, once you've been in the league for like 10 years, you've seen the full cycle of guys go through. But when you first start talking about the league or working in the league from college,

and he was an SEC guy, it's impossible to know the league. It really is. And it shows. I mean, one guy played in the league last year. The other guy had been covering the SEC, and they struggled to get a grasp on it. It's by far the most difficult league just because of the amount of players.

There's just an endless amount of players because the amount of guys on the roster, the amount of guys that get hurt, the amount of guys that then come up on practice squad that you might have saw late in a couple preseason games, then end up starting a game for random teams by, you know, early November. It's just, I've lived it. I know how overwhelming and difficult.

You can study all day, every day, and you still can't keep up in year one or two. You just can't. And as a player, you're not focused on the league. You're focused on the opponent. So Jason Witten, you know, he plays obviously the NFC East three times a year. You know, those three teams twice. Well, those teams, if you play the Giants twice by October, their roster's changed by the end of the year. And then you're rotating all the other teams in the league.

So it's not like you're locked in. You play the Pittsburgh Steelers, for example, once every four years. Like, it's just, it's hard. You know, it just, I have a memory for this type stuff. And it was difficult for me. It still is. You just, you can't keep pace. Luckily, now in my job, I talk more about the stars and the impact players.

We don't get into like the nitty gritty of like who the starting linebacker, you know, Luke Keeckley is about as deep as we go because that's what the casual fan's going to know. Well, on Monday Night Football Broadcast, you have to dive a little deeper than just the surface. And you have to know some interesting nuggets. Like, what was a scouting report on this? I was texting with a buddy in the league. It was just like, God, this is terrible. And again, I'm not trying to beat a dead horse.

I know this is hard. So I, you know, criticizing over and over. but there is just some natural chemistry on television or radio or any media medium that comes across and you can't fake it and usually know it right away and they don't have it and they also just don't have like why did that guy go in the sixth round instead of the second round

that's the type of stuff fans eat up well because he had a major knock on something it's like they're just not going to know that stuff and I'll give even Groot could give me little things like that Well, this guy, when he was five years ago, you know, coaching with the New York Giants, now he's on the Kansas City Chief Staff. He used to like to bring this, you know, and now he's doing this. Like, you just got to bring me something. You know, I don't need to learn eight new things a game,

but at least you got to bring me a couple things. Like, I didn't know that. And I'm just, I'm not talking about me. Like, it's going to be hard to give me a new nugget. And, again, you're not talking to me. But, like, if my mom's watching, Can you give her something that like if she's a casual fan, she knows Cam Newton went to Auburn, you know, she knows Drew Brees' story.

Can you give her something that like, well, I didn't know that about him? And that's what I don't feel that anyone's getting. Appreciate everyone listening. Have a good week and I'll see you guys again Friday. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in.

Timbo, in every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to SportsSlic. On the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slical Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, Not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clifford Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Clifford Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her.

What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clippers show on the IHeart Radio app,

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That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis come in. He's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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