The Herd with Colin Cowherd - NBA, Raptors, Kevin Durant, MVP, and the Warriors

Episode Date: May 27, 2019

Colin defends the NBA, compares the Toronto Raptors to the 2010-11 Dallas Mavericks, breaks down Golden State Warriors F Kevin Durant's mobility, why Milwaukee Bucks F Giannis Antetokounmpo should be the MVP, and where he would rank the Warriors if they win another title. Guests include Chris Broussard, Mark Medina, Dan Woike, and Doug Gottlieb. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Wherever you may be, however you may be listening. We're on IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS1. One hour from now where Colin was right and where Colin was wrong, we have plenty of both. Joy Taylor is joining me on this Memorial Day. Joy, how are you? I'm great. Happy Memorial Day, everyone. Happy Memorial Day, everybody.

Really like today's show. you know, I've found over the course of my lifetime, people decide what they like, and they'll nitpick stuff they don't like. Obviously, we all support stuff we like, but you'll nitpick stuff you don't like. Republican will always find a way to nitpick a Democrat, and a Democrat will always find a way

to find the imperfections in the conservative party. It's the way it is. Just be honest. Some of you don't like the NBA. Be honest. You just don't like it. That's fine. But stop using the there's no parity in this league argument. The final four teams were a team from Canada, small market Portland, small market Milwaukee.

That's not parity? If you love college football, want to make a bet, Alabama Clemson play for the championship. Again. But you like college football. So you, oh, yeah, I love same teams every year. Now, I just happen to like college football. and I like the NBA. But I was thinking about this morning.

We have this narrative now that Kevin Durant ruined this league. It's so great. Everybody was having a chance to win, and Kevin Durant came around. Now it's Kevin Durant's fall. Nonsense. I went back to 1949. That's 70 years in the NBA. 70.

Lakers 16 championships, Celtic 17. 33 of 70 championships. two teams. That would be like if Bam and Clemson win another 25 years. By the way, in the 80s, Lakers got to the Western Conference final all but two years.

In the 60s, it was the Celtics and everybody else. Michael Jordan's Bulls won six titles in the 90s. It would have been eight if he didn't decide he wanted to go hit a curveball and single A or double A baseball. I'm going to give you two stats

that are fairly remarkable. And they will not include LeBron James. because there's another guy that gets blamed for moving around to new teams and killing the parody. Listen to these two. In the last 21 finals, that's over two decades. Kobe, Tim Duncan, D. Wade and Steph have been in 21 straight finals. And I'm not even counting LeBron. Those four guys have taken part in the last 21 finals.

Oh, no, no. that's not even the best stat. In the last 62 years, 54 of the last 62 NBA finals have had these five men involved. Red Arbock, Phil Jackson, Pat Riley, Greg Popovich, and Steve Kerr. 87%. And you think Kevin Durant and LeBron because they chose cities are hurting the league? It's nonsense. Katie didn't ruin anything.

the NBA is set up for dominance. It's got the fewest starters. By the way, college basketball, even with the one and done, the top two and three seeds dominate. Go look at the last 30 champions. It's mostly the same teams, rare outliers. But in baseball, pitching dominates the sport. And pitching arms get injured a lot.

They get fatigued. Chris Sale, nobody could hit him last year. Chris Sale for the Red Sox. this year can't get anybody out. Can't get anybody out and his ERA is doubled. That's what happens to pitcher's arms. That doesn't happen to Steph's arm. That doesn't happen to Clay Thompson's arm.

That doesn't happen to Kevin Durant's arm. In football, injuries really help parity. Even now we have a current NFL dynasty, but Carson Wentz goes down. Generally, you don't have a Nick Foles to win it for you. So when I look at the NBA, just admit it. The same college football fan who bemoans the lack of parity, we're going to get Alabama and Clemson again this year.

The final four in the NBA was Portland. I haven't seen them in a Western Conference Finals in a long time. Milwaukee? Good Lord, when's the last time you saw them in the Eastern Conference Finals? Toronto's now in the finals. That doesn't happen. And Golden State. Sometimes, just admit it Democrats and Republicans, you're going to nitpick the other party.

You're imperfect, but you kind of glaze and gloss over the stuff about your party to find the stuff to nitpick the other people. If you don't like the NBA, that's fine. Stop with a parody argument. It's never had it. And it used to be worse. Check out the 60s and the 80s and the 90s. All right, we have a final in the NBA. Let's shift gears.

It's Kauai Leonard and the Raptors, and they will take on whoever is starting Steph Curry and the Warriors. I like Golden State. I think everybody likes Golden State in this series. But we have a precedence here. We have a precedent for an upset. The Dallas Mavericks against the Miami Heat. Now let's go back and remember what the Dallas Mavericks were.

They had the components to win a championship. They had one go-to star, Dirk Novitsky. There was never any doubt with the Dallas Mavericks who was taking the shot. For Miami, Bosch, Wade, LeBron, Ray Allen, little indecision. Not with Dallas. Dallas had an excellent head coach. No indecision. Late in possessions.

Smart veteran players all over the rosters. Absolutely no drama. And do you remember? These two teams played twice in the regular season, Dallas and Miami. Dallas won both. So let's look at the Toronto Raptors. Excellent head coach. They come in like Dallas as massive underdogs.

There's absolutely no drama with this team. Like Dallas, they have nothing but smart veteran KG players. There is no indecision who to give the ball to at the end of games or possessions. And oh, by the way, they played the Warriors twice this year in the regular season. Oh, and they won both. We have a precedent. These are the Dallas Mavericks. Now, I'll still take Golden State.

But don't kid yourself. Talent doesn't always win in this league. Dallas, like these Raptors, one star, good coach, lots of veterans, the star with no indecision late possessions, had beaten them in the regular season. And that Dallas team had Jason, Kid, and Tyson Chandler and Sean. Marion and all these veterans and this team's got Mark Gassall. They got him at the trading deadline.

It's Kyle Lauer. It's Sergei Bocke's Danny Green. By the way, Vegas heavily favors the Warriors, but they do expect a six-game series. And I expect a five to a six-game series. Now, here's something else these Raptors have in common with the Dallas Mavericks. And right now, a Raptor fan watching me, it's like, hey, Collins on our side. He likes us. Well, here's the problem.

When Dallas won that championship, nobody talked about it outside of Dallas. Because that was all about LeBron winning his first title or LeBron losing a championship. And if Toronto wins this series, remember, all champions. are not equally interesting. If Toronto wins this championship, it is not going to be about the Raptors. It's going to be about Golden State, either wins the title, another one, or they gagged as a heavy favorite. You have to understand this. Not all champions are interesting.

Andre Agassi, Serena Williams, are a lot more interesting than Pete Sampras. I'm looking at the ratings a couple of weekends ago at the PGA champion. championship. Brooks Kepka. It was the lowest rating in 20-some years. He's just not that interesting. He just happens to be great. So much like the Mavericks, even if the Raptors win, the immediate story will be about the Warriors and the second story will it be about will Toronto's best player leave and go west. But you won't care. You'll be in Canada. You'll have won. then you'll start rebuilding. But there is a precedent for this,

and I do think we'll have a feisty series because the Mavericks and the Raptors have several components necessary to make it interesting. Good coach, underdog, resilient veterans, superstar with no indecision, latent possessions, and they beat that team twice and the only two times they played in the regular season. By the way,

Joy Taylor should be gloating this morning. Her rafters, the baby dinosaurs, most dinosaurs are extinct because of a meteor. That's what they say in the books. LeBron was the Eastern Conference meteor that kept making the baby dinosaurs extinct. He left, and they now dominate the east. Everybody, let's hear it for Joy Taylor,

who called this during, he's wearing rafters colors today. Why the rest of us. It's mostly red for Memorial Day. We were mocking you during the season. And, well, congratulations on that. You know, sometimes you just got to wait it out. You got to wait out the storm and stick with your convictions. And I'm just glad that Kauai Leonard was the player that I thought he was.

Yeah, I just didn't see Kauai Leonard becoming Michael Jordan. You know, sometimes you're right. Sometimes you're wrong. We do that on Mondays. Way it is. Good stuff. So coming up, Kevin Durant, and this is why I love him. He emotes.

He talks to everybody. He got a little upset, or did he get upset? But he showed a little glimpse of something I can relate to. And that was really interesting at the podium. That's coming up next. It's Memorial Day. Thank you so much for stopping in here for the next three hours in Los Angeles. On a Monday, it's the herd.

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Additional fees may apply for Hawaii and Alaska. See casper.com slash terms for additional terms and conditions. Limit one code for customer cannot be combined with any other offer. Warren Buffett's a legendary investor and he always talks about every generation is going to have a better life than the previous generation, better health care, better travel. I was somebody that grew up. I struggled early, but I never enjoyed the struggle. My struggle was real. And then I started getting what I would call professional mobility.

I moved around the country. And the upside to it is that you can join really cool companies, companies with momentum, companies that have already gone through the initial struggle of growth. And it's a great life. I've joined companies that are established, companies that are good. that is the upside to upward mobility. That's the upside to professional mobility. You know, like at Fox, I came here.

I didn't have to deal with the Simpson years when they were just starting mid-early 90s when they just got the NFL and Best Damn Sports Show. And they were young and they were experimenting and they weren't the company they are today. And I joined the company and it's formed and it's profitable and it's got good management. and it's stable and it's like, yeah, it's been great. But the downside to that is you kind of feel like you're a little bit of an outsider. You don't get the inside company joke. It's like they have a private handshake at some of these companies and I'm not involved.

The downside to professional mobility is you don't go to the 4th of July, you know, party in your neighborhood like everybody else has for 68 straight years. you're in another part of the country. And I will admit, part of me is jealous about that. I don't get that moving around the country. Kevin Durant is a classic example of mobility. Now, the upside to his mobility, he joined a really good team. They'd already gone through the Monte Ellis Steff trade. They had the coach and Steve Kerr.

They had the young players. So he didn't have to go through the early struggle. of Golden State. Not like they were terrible, but there were struggles. They moved through a coach. They moved through some players and there's a lot of controversy trading Mondale. And Kevin Mike, he didn't have to deal with that. The struggle wasn't real. He just caught on the surfboard when they were already riding that wave. And this weekend, he was at a press conference and they were talking about the team and he said this. How have you thought about their playing?

Our play? Yeah, yeah. Sorry about that. I think we've been playing great. Do you feel like there is that, you almost split where it's like you and them? Most definitely. I mean, it's been that way since I got here is the Warriors and KD, you know what I'm saying? And I understand that. And I felt like my teammates

and the organization know exactly what I've done. But I also know that a lot of people on the outside, you know, don't like to see us together. And, you know, I get it. Kauai is embraced as the new guy because he's giving Canada something they've never had and he was traded there. Whereas Kevin Durant,

Golden State won before him, after him, and he's seen as more of a mercenary. And neither one of these is necessarily right. Yes, it's great that Derek Jeter and Kobe stayed with the same team. Yeah, it's easy when you're the Lakers in the 90s and beyond and you're the New York Yankees. But if Derek Jeter started in Kansas City or Pittsburgh, they probably wouldn't have been able to afford him, and Derek Jeter would have moved to the Yankees of the Red Sox. I'm not saying upward mobility is better. I'm saying there are two ways to do this in life and in sports and in your professional career.

Stay with the same company forever and go through the struggles and the roller coaster. And it is perhaps more pure. And you will have these bonds and these lifetime relationships that are just a mile deep and worthwhile. And they resonate your entire life. You stay in your hometown. Those high school reunions are real. And then there's the people that bounce around the country. And they don't have to go through a lot of those struggles.

But they're not quite as deeply embedded in the community, in the company, and they don't get invited to the same Memorial Day barbecue or Fourth of July barbecue that family does. I'm not saying either is right. there are great substantial psychological emotional benefits to both. But what Kevin Duran is experiencing is actually, and I know he's a superstar, but it's something many of you watching and listening today, have experienced, and it's real. Here's Joy Taylor, NBA expert with the news.

No, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Oh, boy. You know what, I'll take. it. It's fine. Why not? I deserve it. You're right. You were on them from the January.

Nobody else wanted to ride with the Raptors. So the Bucks were eliminated from the playoffs Saturday night after losing game six to the Raptors, 194. Janus was clearly frustrated after the game and even left the press conference following a question about the team's playoff experience. You guys have talked a lot about how at this point, you know, sometimes it takes experience. I'm wondering if now that you have some of that experience, if you see more validity to that point or what you think about that now that you've gone through it.

A little upset, which is understandable. Chris Middleton look a little shock there as he's walking off. Like, I guess I have to answer that question now. There is a story behind the story, though, here. Like, he had been there already like substantial time. Let's not make it like that was a- No, no, no, no. I don't, he's not being, he's not pulling a Cam Newton in this situation.

Right, right. And honestly, I don't, I don't, I never had a problem with Cam Newton leaving the press conference early. It's just that he left it abruptly and didn't say like, I'm done or thank you or anything like that. So it kind of, it felt more dramatic. I never problem with what Cam Newton did either. You can't, the expectations that we put on human beings and the, and their biggest moment of failure. I mean, this is, this is tragic. It's game six. He's the MVP. He's young. He's invested. This is his life. He's put all of his time and energy and blood and sweat and tears into this.

And then you didn't have a success in that moment to expect a calm and reaction is irrational. But I will say, Yonis did everything that he could. Chris Middleton was a little inconsistent in that series. If you look back at the series that they had against Detroit, and, I mean, it just goes down from there, really, with Chris Middleton to Detroit, to Boston, and then on to Toronto. So I don't know what the buck's going to have to do next year to, I mean, Chris Milton is going to be a free agent, so they may have some pieces moving around here.

And obviously, Janus is going to get a huge contract whenever he comes up. And he said he's not leaving. I believe him. He seems like that guy that wants to stay there and build everything you were just talking about, kind of the opposite of KD, which, you know, things can change. But overall, I don't see this as a tragic loss for the Bucks. I mean, they didn't really, despite being the, having the best record in the NBA, they didn't come into the playoffs with huge expectations.

Everyone kind of doubted them. Good owner, good coach, good GM, good star, good number. I think Middleton's your third. Maybe he becomes a two. I think he's more of a three. Milwaukee's going to be for 10 years. They're going to be around this space a lot. And look, she's right.

There is something to having experience in the playoffs. The Raptors have a very, very experienced championship level team. And Kawhi was incredible. Maybe you wanted to get to a game seven, but, you know, there's no shame in what happened there. So the Raptors are headed to the NBA finals for the first time in their franchise history. And after a big game six win, Raptors president, Masi, Jari, said that he thinks Kauai. is the best player in the league. And when he was asked about the praise,

Kauai remained humbled and focused on the team. I don't really judge my, you know, game like that. I'm more of a team aspect, see what my team is doing. Just want to win. I don't care about being the best player. I want to be the best team. Always said that. It's turning out well now.

I mean, we're in the finals and we're not done yet. Messiah, Jiri. My apologies, yeah. I love what Kauai is done in this series. Not only has he proven once again that he is really the best two-way player in the game. He really carried a franchise who needed this. Like the Raptors had gone through so many struggles. I mean, you look at what, like, Damar de Rosen, I mean, you've got to give him some credit to do.

I mean, he's been moved out and now Kauai comes in and they make it to the finals. Like he was a big part of building the franchise to what it is. They were hyper-aggressive. I mean, they fired the coach of the year. NBA, they fired him. They moved off to Rosen. I mean, let's be honest about it. Hyper aggressive, didn't have to be super successful with a KC and

Demar Dorosen. And so I think this is like the Dallas Mavericks team. I think there's, you know, owner, coach, star operations. Raptors are buttoned up. They've been buttoned up for a lot of years. It's just that Kauai Leonard played like Michael Jordan in the last month. And he has just been absolutely the best player in the league. But we say this all the time.

There's very small windows in sports when it comes to winning a championship. I mean, all the championships that you're talking about, the Lakers dominating, the Celtics dominating and LeBron and like the Spurs, it takes a long time to build to that point. But then you have a breakthrough year. And sometimes you don't have that breakthrough year. So you have to make an aggressive move to try and make that happen. And that's what the Raptors did. And it was successful.

So we're on the finals. Finally, the Steelers have been very vocal about how the atmosphere surrounding the team has improved since, the end of last season. It's going to take some time to see how the season's chemistry will translate onto the field. But Steelers' cornerback, Joe Hayden, thinks he can, that they can handle the pressure and turn it into a great season. I've been playing against the Steelers for seven years. They were never the underdog. So just having that chip on our shoulder, having that, you know, people doubting us. I think that's something that we could take use of our advantage. And just come out here and grind. And it's all literally about what you're doing between the lines.

You hear the outside noises because usually, man, the Pittsburgh, they're always, oh, no one, they're going to be playoffs. And they're just going to be in the playoffs. It just is what it is. They just basically put us in the playoffs. So now just hearing people not talk as highly of us, you know, is kind of put a chip on people's shoulder. You think that's positive? Can you guys use that?

Oh, I think that's a great thing. That is the central theme of virtually all sports, high school, college, and pro. Doubt talented people. It ticks them off, and they play with incredible resilience for the next couple years. It's what the Patriots do every single year. Somehow they managed to convince their entire team, even though they just want a Super Bowl, that everyone thinks they're going to lose.

and that they're a disaster. And here's what also doesn't work. When you've never won anything, you do get some talent and you suddenly think you're great, Cleveland Browns. That almost always doesn't work. New England, like you said, New England convinced themselves last year

wearing T-shirts in the Super Bowl. Nobody believes in us. Every year they do this. Every year they come in. Oh, well, you know, nobody thinks you're going to be there in the end. What? What? Who's that?

They put you guys a favorite every year. But the perennial losers who do all of a sudden get some talent and are guaranteed. The Jags. The Browns. It's like, trust me on this, folks. Success is hard. It's hard. And you need extra things and motivation.

And being doubted is a massive. It's a blessing. It really is. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The herd lie news. Chris Broussard.

Let's bring him in. our NBA voice on FS1. I got to tell you, you know, everybody complains about NBA parity. I got Milwaukee, Toronto, and Portland are three of the last four teams. I think it's been, I was telling Joy this the other day. I think it's been as good a second round playoffs and on as I ever remember. So let me just throw this out. Dallas Mavericks 2011.

Toronto Raptors. A lot of similarities, Chris. Are you predicting the Raptors win this? I'm saying. National radio, you're saying this, national TV. I am saying one star, good coach, massive dogs, length, veterans. And by the way, that heat team had a little drama. This warrior team got a little drama.

Well, look, obviously, like you said, there are some similarities. Nick Nurse has done a terrific job. He's not where Rick Carlis was at that point. Rick Carly had been in Indiana. They had had some great teams. Fair. You know, Detroit. And so there's a difference there.

The veterans in Dallas had a little more championship pedigree. Jason Ken. Jason Terry, Jason Kidd. Jason Terry hadn't won, but Jason Kidd. Sean Marion. Tyson Chandler. A little bit different. But there's some similarities.

To me, where the big difference is is comparing that Miami team to this Warriors team. That Miami team as a group had never won anything. thing together. Their chemistry wasn't great. They liked each other, obviously, but as far as figuring out how we're going to work the LeBron Wade dynamic, they really hadn't figured that out yet. It was more kind of taking turns.

You know, they did that. Their second year figured it out, whereas obviously Golden State has the tremendous chemistry and the experience of winning championships. And let's face this, too. That Miami team, if LeBron hadn't frozen up those last three games or whatever it was, they're going to win that series. They were up to one.

They should have won that series. Kevin Durant's calf froze up. I listen. So I got the Warriors in six. Okay. Do you think Kevin Durant plays? No. You don't think he plays.

I don't think he plays. I don't think he plays. Why? One, I think the injury is more serious than people are letting know. I mean, we've said that every week or so as the Warriors have released new, you know, diagnoses of the injury.

heard some things. I'm not going to say, oh, a great source told me he's out, but I've heard some things talking to people around the league, but I don't think he comes up. I'm not reporting it that he's not coming back. But if you ask me my opinion, based on conversations and things, I don't think he plays again,

but I still think the Warriors win in six. So that means I think KD's played his last game as a warrior. Oh, my Lord. What a weird awful ending. That's awful. Well, he's going to get a no. going to get a third ring and it will be a ring. He's earned that ring. He was a big part of his team. I don't have a problem. It'll be three rings. So, you know. They had a lead in that series

against Houston when he got hurt, right? Well, it was two two. Oh, they didn't. What a terrible ending to this career. No, he's going to go elsewhere and maybe he'll win some rings. Here's the thing, if they went to me, if they win it without KD, he has to leave. There's never been a player in the NBA that won championships as good as KD that was in a situation where the feeling was, or if they win it, the reality is they don't need you. The players of his ilk, Tim Duncan, Larry Bird, Hakeem Elijah Wine, LeBron.

Can you imagine any of their teams winning a championship without them? And this is what people are challenging KD on. And some criticizing him on is, look, you're too good to not be needed. Go somewhere where you're you're. you're needed and you win a championship, you're already great legacy lifts you higher. Like if you want to be in that top five conversation,

I think he wants to even be higher in the conversation. You have to go somewhere where you know they need you. You know, I was saying professional mobility. You've moved around the country, Akron B, New York Times, the other place here. And I've done the same thing. You and I have, that's fine. And Joy has done the exact same thing.

Joy has bounced around the country, local, national. And I was saying, and we're not saying we're Kevin Durant, but we won rings in other places. Professional mobility, the good thing is you don't have to deal with a lot of struggle sometimes. You can join a really good company that's rolling. Right. The downside is you always feel a little bit like an outsider. Like there's a secret handshake for the guys that have been in the company 40 years. And with Kevin Durant the other day, he talked about that.

It's their team. It's my team. And part of me, again, I'm not analogous to Katie, but I'm saying, no, I get it. He's saying like, you know, I get it. People out here don't think I'm part of the team. I mean, Draymond and Kevin Durant fought this year. And Draymond yelled at him. We won without you.

Part of me feels bad a little bit for KD. Like, it's like he's got this narrative in America. Like, we don't need you. And I'm like, the guy's sensitive to begin with. Right. Here's how that narrative ends or changes. if he doesn't play in this series and they lose and he stays and obviously they're going to be great

if he stays and they win more championships down the line. Maybe they win the next two years. That narrative changes. Actually, it changes. Once they lose without him, it changes. They need him. And then if the only reason, if the only reason he's thinking about leaving his validation, like get this mental asterisk off my name

that all these superstars are saying it's there. And, you know, I got to show people that, you know, I can win it with my own team. If that's the only reason he's leaving, if they lose, stay. Help them open up the new arena, win another championship. Maybe you stay and you win five or six titles. Who knows? But that's what's on the line in my view. Oh, I agree.

With these finals. It's fascinating how everything has changed. You know, we're all trying to guess where guys go, right? And whereas we had a sense, LeBron and the Lakers always felt like it was going to happen. Just think about Kevin Durant. We're absolutely sure he's going to go. Right? That's all the reports.

Then he gets hurt. Then they, that's a shocker. Then they win without him. That's a shocker. Now if they, it's almost like if they lost without him and he stayed, that would be the third shocker. Things happen in threes. That would be a shock. His, you know, I find myself, I do think he's the best basketball player in the world.

Kauai is a better defensive player, but I think offense is more important. in the NBA. KD's better offensive. Yeah. Let me go to this. In fact, I'm going to take a break. I got two things to ask you. I got three things to ask you about.

Did Janus gag? Because I'm going to defend Janus today and a couple of things. Chris Broussard, around the corner. Happy Memorial Day. And thank you so much for stopping by. Back in a second, it's the herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd

weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. On Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the I-Hard radio app. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across.

When Jacob met Levant this plant to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Life throws hurdles big and small.

The question is, how do you conquer them? On Hurtle with Emily Abadi, we sit down with the most inspiring women in sports and wellness, professional athletes, coaches, and Olympic champions to talk about the challenges that shaped them and the mindset that keeps them going. From the WNBA standout Kate Martin and rising hockey star Layla Edwards. If a boy can do it, I don't see why a girl can't. Like, I've never understood that. Like, it didn't make sense in my brain.

It's hard to be in spaces that no one looks like you, but don't ever feel like you don't feel like you don't feel like. Don't let that be the reason you don't do it. An Olympic champs Gabby Thomas and Katie Ladecki. The ability to show a gold medal to someone and have their face light up and smile, that means the world to me. And that's what motivates me to win more gold medals. At our level, at this scale, like being able to fail in front of the entire world.

Like, I can do anything. I can do anything. Because resilience isn't just about winning. It's about showing up, even when it's hard. Listen to Hurtle with Emily Abadi on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts for wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of I Heart Women's Sports. Last night, a blown call changed a game.

This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves,

their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo SlicLife 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it.

And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth, or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely.

And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way. Open your free, our heart radio app, Search, learn the hard way, and listen now.

Great to have Chris Broussard back. New York Times. Now our basketball NBA voice at FS1. Happen Memorial Day to you and your family and all the people. You've become a great friend, somebody I rely on a lot, trust, love, having you as part of the fam. Let's start with Yon. You as well to the family. Happy Memorial Day.

Everybody out there. So Yonis, it's beat up on Yonis Day. Yes, I do think. centers in this new spacing game we have can be a little easier to marginalize than a ball handler. Yonis can't dribble out of trouble like Kauai. But he's really both. He's a point center. That's what he is.

So what do you make of the loss because it's going to be very easy because he did shrink in this series. It's easy to clobber Yonis. A necessary evil. I am not looking at this as, oh, wow, Janus isn't what I thought he was. I voted for him for MVP and defensive player of the year. And I think you'll be the MVP. I'm looking at this as a necessary evil.

He had to go through this. If they had gotten to the finals and won it, it would have been virtually unprecedented. He would have had no adversity. The only players to win championships, you know, superstars who led teams to championships without going through adversity first. Bill Russell, magic, because he went to play with Kareem right away.

Bird, he had tiny archibals, Cedric Maxwell, some Robert Parrish, some veterans with him in Boston. Duane Wade, he had Shaq. Like, Kobe and Shaq went through adversity together. LeBron went through individual adversity. Dr. J. went through adversity. Kevin Durant went through adversity. This is par for the course for great players.

Dirk Novitsky. Michael Jordan. Right, the greatest of all time. I forgot him. So this was, look, it reminded me of LeBron in 2007. when they played San Antonio, he was, I think, 22 years old, and the Spurs forced him to shoot jumpers. It exposed his lack of confidence in his jump shot.

And this is what has happened to Janus. He was exposed, no mid-range game. We know he doesn't shoot the three. He's got to get a mid-range. If he could have pulled up from 15 feet, 12 feet even, it would have been an entirely different series. But this is something he had to learn. And mentally, he kind of broke down.

because he's a 74% career foul shooter. He shot 43% I believe or 47% from the foul line in the last four games. In the fourth quarter's in overtime, it was under 40%. That's mental because you're a good free throw shooter. So that's all a part of the growing pains. He'll grow. He's obviously a hard worker. He'll learn from it.

He'll grow and he'll come back better. I said to start my show today, my opening rant here on Memorial Day was stop with the there's no parody in the NBA since 1949, 79, 70 years, 33 of the titles are Celtics or Lakers. Because you have only five starters,

one or two can have massive impact for a decade. Even in college basketball, we're now stars leave after 45 minutes on campus. It's the same six programs every year that end up around in the elite eight. So I thought that... Here's another point for you on that to support you. the 70s had the most parody ever.

You had eight teams win championships. The league was dead. It was the worst decade of pro basketball. People thought, first of all, you had six or seven franchises that were in financial peril. By the way, I should be happy because the Blazers won then and the Sonics won then. So as a kid growing up, all my teams in the Northwest won. I got my Jack Sick and the Freddie Brown Sonics, Gus Williams, and I got my Bill Walton, Jeff. Lion's, Mo Lucas.

That's why I love the NBA in the 70s when I was a kid. Portland, Seattle won, so I love the NBA. But that decade. My games were on tape delay. And in the 80s, which people think is the decade that saved the league, five teams not won it, five teams got to the finals. Got there. Lakers, Celtics, Rockets, Sixers, Pistons.

That's it. That's it. And Houston never even won it that decade. Yeah, I mean, and I also think, much like soccer internationally, soccer internationally and basketball here in the country, it's a business built around stars. And I'm totally comfortable with that. Listen, Rinaldo and Messi give you a number.

I mean, the bottom line is it's a different culture. Golf tends to be quiet, please. NASCAR tends to be southern. Soccer tends to be international. And an NBA tends to be kind of a hip-hop, fun, youthful, star-driven sport. And I'm totally okay. The reality is we all loved the Michael Jordan

and the magic dynasties. Everybody's all caught up that they hate this dynasty because of the way Kevin Durant joined the Warriors. But excuse me, Kareem started in Milwaukee and said, get me out of here. People forget he demanded a train. He did.

There's no doubt about it. And look, we may get, I think, the best of both worlds where if Kevin Durant, Kyrie Irving, go to the Knicks, if Kauai, whether he stays in Toronto, goes to the Clippers, if the Lakers get somebody, whether it's a Jimmy Butler or,

and Anthony Davis. You'll have Philly, Milwaukee, New York, maybe Toronto. You'll have Golden State, Houston, the Clippers maybe, the Lakers, if you want to throw in Denver, like the parody at the top. When you have about seven teams that can legitimately say they can win it, that'll be great. You didn't mention Portland gets Nurchitch back. You didn't mention Indiana that gets Victorola Depot back.

Portland feels like, because they went on a. rash. They're going to, you know, Damian Liller's going to get the huge extension. They extended the GM Neil O'Shea and the coach Terry Stice. They feel like, look, that series was a lot closer than people think. They were up, you know, they had the big leads. We don't have our center. Closest sweep ever.

Right. They feel like they're, now I think, I don't think it was that close. I think Golden State paste itself. Right. And knowing a couple big surges will get rid of these dudes. But that's how they feel. and that's why they're bringing everybody back, and you're right. They got, Nurkich is one of the top centers.

I mean, top six centers, seven centers, whatever. So they'll be all right. God, Chris Broussard joining us, top of the hour, by the way, Colin Wright, Colin wrong. You know, it's, this is the way it works. There's always a ton of rumors about free agency in all sports. Most don't happen. Generally, if you get a rumor in baseball, it happens. Bryce Harper's leaving the Nats.

I heard that for a year. He's out. But man, it wasn't until the Boston Big Three where you heard rumors and they all started, to me it felt like, oh, they're all happening. If I said to you, give me two that you're absolutely sure Chris Brousard, you feel strongest about the two rumors. Man. I mean, you got Clay, Kyrie, Kauai, Kimba, Jim Butler, KD, obviously. none of them are certain. I would say

KD to New York is the one you hear the most around the league. There are people saying his representatives are telling people it's done. There are people saying, I believe from guys who have told me KD has recruited

players or at least said, hey man, why don't you come to New York with me next year? Things like that. Now, is he joking? Is he serious? Is he feeling them out? Whatever. But that that's been said. I would say Katie to New York. And that one, I am such a doubter on. I honestly think...

You're a doubter on it. Downer or a doubter? Both. Let me throw this out. Wouldn't be shocked if Durant and Kyrie go to Brooklyn. No, that's... So I think they may go to New York. I'm not sure the Knicks are a favorite over Brooklyn.

Kyrie grew up a Nets fan. They were obviously in Jersey, but Big Nets fan. And they know both of them. no, we wouldn't get as much media attention. You know, you wouldn't deal with the daily hype as much as you do with the Knicks. Okay. They're obviously very well run. And here's the thing about the Brooklyn, New York thing.

And you know, because you were in the New York general area. In New York, the gap between the Knicks and the Nets is enormous. Enormous. It's Grand Canyon. Around the rest of the country, it's not that big. No. I mean, the Knicks are bigger, of course, but neither team is really on people's radar. By the last, the, I believe the.

owner of the Nets is richer than the owner of the NICs. So if there's a guy that was going to blow through the salary cap. Yeah, yeah, there's that. And so if they go to Brooklyn and make Brooklyn a contender, they would get plenty of national coverage. Yes. Maybe not quite as much as the NICs. But yeah, so they're in there.

I mean, Katie to the Clippers, I know he likes Steve Bomber. Obviously, you know, we know all the benefits of them. Okay, I'll throw out the wild card. Because I think the league's parody is fine. I think it's overstated. The most fascinating guy to me is Jimmy Butler. Okay, first of all, very comfortable moving around, can be a little combustible. He could just be tired of Philadelphia after having lunch with the guys.

Right. And I believe he is the Lakers' best chance because he loves Los Angeles. And I do think his game works very well with LeBron. Of all these guys, I will tell you, this is weird, Jimmy Butler coming west, to me, I could be out of my guard here. I got a feeling the Lakers would max him because I think they're running out of options. Well, yeah, he's a second tier.

But I... If I can't get KD, which I don't think they would be. Okay. Why any of those guys? I think Polinka and LeBron know he's not second tier. I think they're going to make him feel like you're our guy. So I think... That would be smart.

That would be... But look, right now, they're all in on Kyrie. They're all in on Kyrie. You know that. You see LeBron and... putting on the full court press. And this is interesting. Look, I've talked to people close to this situation

that would be shocked. Shocked, absolutely flabbered, like shocked, if Kyrie goes back to play with New York, with LeBron. They just, because a lot of the stuff around, not that he can't play with LeBron, they've reconciled, they're cool, everything's great,

but that doesn't mean they want to, that Kyrie wants to go play with him again. But look, is Kyrie thinking, I'm just throwing this out there. Is he really a two-guard with great handles? I think he got the best ball handling skills in the NBA history. But is he really a two-guard who can handle? If he thinks that in his mind, if I don't think he does,

I think he feels like he's a point guard. But LeBron handles those duties for you, right? Because he handles the ball. And all A Chari has to do is score. LeBron handles the media, all the other scrutiny. All Chari will have to do is score. But I don't think it's going to happen. You think so?

See you next hour. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jet. That's meeting the president of Turkey.

I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levant, this went to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me?

Jacob told Levan, you're ruining. my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Life throws hurdles big and small. The question is, how do you conquer them? On hurdle with Emily Abadi, we sit down with the most inspiring women in sports and wellness, professional athletes, coaches, and Olympic champions to talk about the challenges that shaped

them and the mindset that keeps them going. From the WNBA standout, Kate Martin, and rising hockey star Laila Edwards. If a boy can do it, I don't see why a girl can't. Like, I've never understood that. Like, it didn't make sense in my brain. It's hard to be in spaces that no one looks like you, but don't ever feel like you don't belong. Don't let that be the reason you don't do it.

An Olympic champs Gabby Thomas and Katie Ledecky. The ability to show a gold medal to someone and have their face light up and smile, that means the world to me. And that's what motivates me to win more gold medals. At our level, at this scale, like being able to fail in front of the entire world, Like, I can do anything.

I can do anything. Because resilience isn't just about winning. It's about showing up, even when it's hard. Listen to Hurtle with Emily Abadi on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHart Women's Sports. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened.

That's where Sports Slice comes in. though. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsSlic on the

iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness

month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch life

becomes about wins and losses steve burns dustin ross because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth or are you a good person because you're afraid because that's two different intentions bro absolutely and that that's two different levels of trust i want you to just really be a good person join me keir games is we have real conversations conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now.

Ah, on this Memorial Day, this is The Herd, wherever you may be, and however you may be listening. We're on iHeartRadio, Fox Sports Radio, SM1, FS1, also Sirius XM Channel 83. It is absolutely a pleasure to have you in today. And again, thank you so much for stopping by. I know many of you are on the road. Please be careful. This is one of those weekends where people go out. They have fun.

They get on the road. Be careful. Spend time with family. Joy Taylor, who has a Memorial Day look and feel today. Look at you. It's like you're going to go right from here to an amazing barbecue. We are probably going to barbecue today, yes. What are the things called?

The eggs? No, not the egg. But, yeah, it's like that. I don't know why I can't. I grilled with my son all weekend. It was so much fun. I just love this time of the year. You can grow?

Oh, I love grilling. I'd grill every day if I could. I'd grill. I used to grill in Connecticut until Thanksgiving. And then the grill was covered with snow. I grilled every day. Love it. All right.

We do it every day for those of you who have never watched our show. Every Monday at this time, 11 o'clock Easter. What time is it? 10 o'clock Pacific, a 1 o'clock Eastern, whatever time that would be in Albuquerque. Colin right, Colin wrong. I tell you where I whiffed last week. and where we were right last week, here we go. Where Colin was right?

I've said this all year long. There was a poll in the middle of the NBA season. Of the three guys you'd start your franchise with, it was all centers. And I said, I'm not starting my franchise with centers in 2019. Yannis, once again, superstar Yonnas, superstar Kauai, who got marginalized, the center. They don't control the tempo. They don't have the ball in their hands. I don't ever trust the big guy late at the free throw line.

And they don't shoot threes. and we've moved analytically into a three-ball league. And by the way, Janus only shot 37% in this series when Kauai guarded him. I just think basketball today, I want to build around guys who can put the ball on the deck and guys who can shoot. And even if you can't shoot like Ben Simmons,

you can get the ball to shooters. I don't believe centers are who I would build around. Where Colin was wrong. The baby dinosaurs, I was a doubter all year. I kept saying, okay, who's your second score? Who's your third? How are you going to get to the finals?

You don't have it. But I will say this. The Celtics were dysfunctional. The Sixers are immature. The Bucks are too young. And they are a well-coached, resilient group of adults. And it's not like they didn't have a little stress in this series. All their series, they'd lose a road game.

But maturity matters. They also made a very nice move at the death. headline to get Mark Gassol, maybe gave up a tad of their depth to get him. And in the end, I was wrong. Where Colin was right. Chris Middleton. I kept saying Milwaukee, listen, I like him. He's a great story.

I mean, the kid has really battled. But if he's your second best player, that doesn't feel like a finals team to me. It certainly doesn't feel like a championship team. Well, this series, he got exposed. He scored 11, 12, 9, 36, 14. that's not dependable. He only scored 15 or more once in this series. And I've said this for years in the NBA.

It's not just about your star. If it's just about your star, Michael Jordan would have won every year he played, and Mike Magic Johnson would have won every year. This league's about who's your number two. Clay Thompson, I mean, when Katie's healthy, Steph is your number two. Magic Kareem was your number two.

So the reality is with Chris Middleton. He may develop, into a reliable two, but right now on a championship team, he's probably a three, and that's why Milwaukee is watching the finals. Where Colin was wrong. Kauai Leonard. I mean, I always thought he was really talented, but he's got an odd personality. He doesn't really pass.

He doesn't communicate a ton. He just never felt like a guy. He's kind of an enigma. He's a mystery. He couldn't even get along in San Antonio. Like, I'm like, everybody works in San Antonio. It's like everybody works for the Patriots, right? and I always just saw him as kind of an odd, enigmatic, super talented guy.

Well, he was great in the fourth. I said this. If you gave him Kobe's personality physically, he's the closest thing I've seen to Michael Jordan. Hands, dexterity, both ends, great in the fourth quarter, trustable to free throw line. There is no disputing now. He is a top, I mean, seriously, he's a top three, maybe a top two player in the NBA. where Colin was right? Never liked these 10-year contracts in baseball,

especially when it's these Seattle, Minnesota, Cincinnati, the medium-sized markets. Sprinkle the money around. Give it to four and five different guys. Well, Robinson Canoe didn't work with Seattle. The Reds are awful. Joey Votto with that huge contract. And Minnesota's fascinating.

So this is the first year they haven't been locked in in Minnesota. to Joe Mowers' contract. And what were they the previous seven years? Irrelevant. Have you noticed them this year? Best record in baseball. Ten game lead in the American League Central. I understand the Yankees paying huge money

because the commerce and revenue they have, it doesn't matter for the Dodgers. It didn't matter for, you know, the big revenue teams. But when you're a Seattle, you're a Minnesota, you're a Padres. By the way, the Angels, they're not a huge revenue team. The Angels are out of it with Mike Trout. The Reds are out of it with Votto.

The twins move off Joe Mower, sprinkle the money around, and they solve all those little issues they had. Never, ever, ever, like 10-year contracts. I guess I would swallow it if the Yankees or Red Sox maybe massive revenue, but I think they're bad for teams long term. Where Colin was wrong. I thought the Steelers drama was all over. Hold on.

We got a little bit of it. Joey Porter came out this weekend on the NFL network and said, Ben Rathlisberger has power, and he used it all for himself. I thought the drama was over. It was for three days. He said, listen. Torell Davis on the NFL network said, listen, John Elway used to go to management.

He had power and give veterans time off because he thought they were getting beat up in practice. Ben Rathletzberger has the kind of power in Pittsburgh to get practices off for other guys, and he doesn't. Ben's into Ben. Here's what I'll say about Rothlisberger. He's polarizing. You can find seven guys to line up behind him and seven guys to criticize him. I don't like polarizing quarterbacks.

As much as I like Ben, I'm not a fan of polarizing quarterbacks. I like my bore form. I like my Russell Wilson. I like my Andrew Luck. I like my Jared Gough. I like my Tom Brady. I like boring. Ben needs to get more boring because he's in the news way too much.

Where Colin was right? One of my mottos in sports and kind of in life, but in sports, be aggressive. Sometimes, be aggressive to a fault. If you want to be patient, get in retirement planning or chess. But in sports, be aggressive. Toronto's a great example of this. They were a number one seed, had the NBA coach of the year and an all-star in Demarterosen,

and they blew it all up. They fired their coach. Didn't have to. He won't coach of the year. They got rid of their star for Kauai, who's potentially a one-year rental, and they went at the trading deadline, very good team, and they went and got. Markisal to give up some of their depth. They went super aggressive and it paid off. Dwayne Casey was coach of the year. They gave him the award and then ran him out the door.

They didn't have to do that. I love that. This is a prime example. Toronto was good enough to sell out every game. They get excellent ratings. They are loved in the city and they said, no, no, no, we're going to get aggressive here. We're going to go for it. If you want to be patient, play chess or get into retirement planning. In sports, three words. Go for it. Toronto didn't, was rewarded. Where Colin was wrong.

I apparently like Clay Thompson way more than everybody else. He didn't make the NBA first team. He didn't make the all-NBA second team. He didn't make the all-N-B-A third team. Let me get this straight. A-plus shooter, A-plus personality, A-plus low drama, A-plus defender, and he's a fourth-team guard. I just like him more than everybody else's.

Now, he had a bad December, and he wasn't great in October, but who's watching the NBA in October and early December? I mean, outside of Scouts, not many of us. I still consider Clay Thompson the one player in the NBA. There's one that fits on every team. There's not a single NBA executive. He said a two-guard, Clay Thompson, everybody would take. Everybody would not take Steph because they have a point guard.

Steph wouldn't work in Houston with the guys they have. I don't think Durant would work with everybody. but Clay works with everybody. Quiet, shooter, defender, smart, not going to argue about minutes, and didn't make one of the first three all-MBA teams. Where Colin was right? Jay Glazer this weekend saying the Rams now have genuine concerns about Todd Gurley's knee. The story came out last year.

They were just, you know, they weren't going to use them as much to rest him, and I just never bought into it. I'm like, time out. Todd Gurley, next to Ezekiel Elliott, is the best running back in the league. And all of a sudden, late October last year, he just wasn't getting the carries. And it's what I said on the Super Bowl,

why I tick, even though I thought the Rams had better players than New England, I'm like, I can't go into a Super Bowl. I have no idea what's going on with Todd Gurley. Why is he on an exercise bicycle? Why did they get C.J. Anderson? I've always been, the Rams smartly downplayed this. but my feeling was by late October, something's going on here. For the record, there were many people in the NFL that questioned why the Rams gave him that contract a year early.

Rams may, according to this now, may regret it. Colin Wright, Colin wrong on a Monday. Folks, I'm not even halfway through all my material today. We got all sorts of stuff. Plus, Doug Gottlieb's around the corner on this beautiful Memorial Day. In L.A., it's the herd. The herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like.

Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levin this went to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive?

The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Life throws hurdles big and small. The question is, how do you conquer them? On Hurtle with Emily Abadi, we sit down with the most inspiring women in sports and wellness, professional athletes, coaches, and Olympic champions to talk about the challenges that shaped them and the mindset that keeps them going.

From the WNBA standout, Kate Martin and rising hockey star Layla Edwards. A boy can do it. I don't see why a girl can't. Like, I've never understood that. Like, it didn't make sense in my brain. It's hard to be in spaces that no one looks like you, but don't ever feel like you don't belong. Don't let that be the reason you don't do it. An Olympic champs Gabby Thomas and Katie Ledecki.

The ability to show a gold medal to someone and have their face light up and smile, that means the world to me. And that's what motivates me to win more gold medals. At our level, at this scale, like being able to fail in front of the entire world, like, I can do anything. I can do anything. Because resilience isn't just about winning.

It's about showing up, even when it's hard. Listen to Hurtle with Emily Abadi on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines.

We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsLice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests.

I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses.

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Join me, Keer Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way. Open your free Our Heart Radio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. All right, welcome back. Doug Gottlieb is joining us. What a crazy NBA playoff.

So I was saying this, Doug, you've moved around a lot professionally. You've done this stuff. I said the upside to professional mobility is. A lot of times you don't have to go through the struggle of a new company. You join a good company that's formed. Commerce is good. You kind of ride the wave and you jump on the wave and you got, whereas the downside to professional mobility is sometimes you feel like an outsider. And Kevin Durant was talking this weekend. He's like, I hear it. I hear what everybody's saying. Like they were good without you. And it's funny because I really like Kevin Durant. And you and I

have both moved around. And I think the Warriors have done an amazing job to make him feel like, do this is your place. But it's not, right? Like, it's not. And he does feel like an outsider, and I get it. He does. It is really weird, though, how the narratives kind of change, right? Like, first if you take the Warriors, remember their first championship, if we're just

honest, Kyrie only played in game one and didn't play all the way in overtime when he hurt his knee. And they didn't have Kevin Love. Right? So everybody said, and if you go back through the, the Cavs didn't, I'm saying, and if you go back through their playoff run, every team they played was missing their point guard for for at least, even the Grizzler. the Grizzlies were missing Mike Conley for a couple games.

Drew Holiday didn't play a couple of games. They got some breaks. They got several breaks. And then they almost lost to the Thunder. They did lose to the cabs. And they add Kevin Durant. People were like, well, you know, they were already a championship team. Like, no, they actually weren't.

They had won a championship. This took them to another level. And even in this season, the last month of the season, Kevin Durant was trying to be a great teammate. Moving the basketball. Look at the number of shots, field goal attempts and the average points. Like, the reason he didn't, he wasn't first team. all NBA was. He was trying to truly buy in to how they want to play. And then after two games

against Clippers, people were like, why aren't you scoring that much? He's like, oh, you want me to score? Okay, here's 45 a night. Yeah, right. And now they have three comebacks without him and it's like, wow, they don't really need you. So I understand what it must feel like to be Kevin Durant, or I don't actually understand, but I understand where he's coming from. He wins two finals MVP's, stare down LeBron James, the better player in the second half of four of the five games. makes the dagger three in game three in Cleveland, both games. And it wasn't until this season, right before he hurts his calf, where everybody's like, you know what?

He actually might be the best player. And now, yeah, he feels a little bit like an outsider. This reminds me of in high school sports when the kid transfers in. Yeah. Right. You already had all these guys grew up playing together. Right. And they were good.

They won like a section championship and maybe a state championship. But you add him and like, well, he's not really from the area. Like, yeah, did I moved in. I moved into the, I did what? I was supposed to do. That said, I think they need him to win this series. No, I think, you know, I said it reminds me a little bit of the Maverick series where you had a good coach, one star, a bunch of KG veterans, you'd won the two regular season matchups against the heat. They've won the two regular season. You got length. And by the way,

there's no indecision for those Mavs or these Raptors. Who's taking the shot? We're not arguing about it. I think it's actually a fairly competitive series. Oh, I think it's a very good series. Look, the Raptors were not a bad team. They just could not. The MVP of the finals was not Kauai Leonard. It was LeBron James of the Eastern Conference finals, right? Because they couldn't mentally, emotionally get over LeBron James. Right.

Whether it was last year or a couple years ago when they went, when they went, what, six games. Like, they just could not get over. It was always like, oh, they were the Cleveland Cavaliers or the New York Knicks of the 80s and 90s. They couldn't get past Jordan. They could not get. So LeBron opens it up. And then they get Kauai, and let's not underestimate some of the other moves, you know, getting Marcusol late. That's a huge pickup.

So they're a good team with a great player who they have a couple guys with championship experience. He's been a finals MVP. No, I think this is an awesome series. On the other hand, I think Steph's playing the best basketball of his life. I think Clay has regained his form. I think the time off was huge for Andre Agu D'Ago Dala, who might be the most important player. I think Draymond Green looks like the Draymond Green of a couple years ago in terms of being in shape and actually making shots.

He didn't make shots in the playoffs at all last year. People said it was his shoulder, then it was his knee. So I think they're going to get the best version of the old group of warriors, but I do think you need somebody to stare down Kauai Leonard, and that guy's number 35. You know, mid-season of the NBA, there was a poll that said, who would you build your franchise around? And it was three centers.

And I'm like, man, I never trust centers late at the time. the line. I think you can marginalize them with a new spacing of the NBA. You can marginalize them. And I also, I want guys who control the tempo. I want you have the ball in your hands. I mean, now it's a possession league, not a rebounding league, right? And it's nothing against Yonis. I'd give them the MVP. But, I mean, let's be honest. Kauai gave Yonis fits. Yes. Like they, when you- I mean, Kauai's, like, look, let's let's start with the Kauai conversation. I know you want to get to the bucks. Yeah. But let's, let's, I sat here and I've sat here for a couple years saying like, okay, people said LeBron was the best.

I thought KD was the best. Now, we're saying the third best player in the NBA has been Kauai Leonard. And now you can make the argument he's the second best or the best player in the NBA. He's because of what he does at both ends of the floor. And I understand what you're saying about his passing. He's not a natural passer. Although he had a couple games in the series. He had a couple good ones here.

Because they were collapsing and making him pass. And hey, when Fred Van Blande shoots 87% in his last year games, there's going to be some assists there. but what he's able to do at the other end of the floor. The best players in the league have to be able to play both ends. That's why James Harden cannot be on this list of best players in the league. That's frankly what limits Steph Curry, as great as he is on offense, and they have to be able to guard all five positions. And Kevin Durant can do it, and Kauai Lennard could do it,

and Yannis can do it. The problem with Yonis is he's just not there yet as a shooter. And the interesting thing about Yonis heading forward is the free throw line. You know, does this become like a Nick Anderson? moment. Remember Nick Anderson missed four free throws. Covered them. Game one. Magic, magic against the rockets, and he never recovered. How does Janice recover from at the free throw line? His perimeter jump shot will get better. He went from a guy that couldn't shoot at all to a guy that can make some

shots now. He'll get better over time. The question becomes a free throw line because that's more of a mental thing, as well as the physics of it, his shot is a little broke. You know, I was saying that with parody, I went back this weekend. And really, there's not as much parodies you think in sports. People forget this. When I was a kid growing up, and I wasn't ever a huge hockey fan, but I can remember the Montreal Canadians in the 60s and 70s own the league. Now, Bobby Orr, Phil Esposito for about an hour came in. And it wasn't until the New York Islanders had Mike Bossy and great players. The Canadians owned the NHL. I mean, they just, they just, how long it was this? This was in the 60s and early 70s.

Okay. I remember the Islanders and the Roylers. We talk about parity. And I never paid attention to hockey ever again. The many. The Minneapolis Lakers on the 50s. The Celtics own the 60s. The Montreal Canadians on the 60s. Our life has been dynasties. And like right now we're like Kevin Durant, Milwaukee, Portland, and Toronto were three of the final four teams. That feels like as much parity as the NBA's had in years.

Yes. And the Celtics could have been there. And the Sixers are one shot away from being there, right? I mean, like Portland, maybe not. But you would think the Lakers will be competitive next year. there's a chance that the clippers get some of it. Yeah. But I actually, but it goes back to your point.

I kind of think if the warriors stay together or if they can, if they lose KD, they can add a piece, right? They're not going to just go as is. They got to add somebody to fill that small forward void. And eventually Andre Godal is going to be too old. Eventually, Sean Livingston's body just lets down. Like they got to find another piece. But yes, I think, look, I think the NFL's NBA is really, really healthy. I think it's probably healthier in terms of parity-wise than maybe.

be the National Football League where you have the Patriots. I mean, somebody trying to beat the Patriots every year. Yeah, and I like where we're at. So here we go. We talk about all these free agent moves. And I asked Chris Broussard earlier, which one of you absolutely sure about? And he's like, well, KD to the Knicks. And I'm like, I think he's going to Brooklyn with Kyrie.

I really do. I thought you said he was already calling last week. No, no. My phone buzzes and it says Colin Cowherd says he's a very good. source to the Knicks. I have a current NBA player that has told me he's the Knicks, and I had a former MVP who has told me he's the Knicks. But I think Kevin Durant is easy to persuade and listens to compelling arguments.

If I told you, Doug, two moves that happen. I don't know any. I think Jimmy Butler to the Lakers, I think he's their number one. and as long as they get he's their number one, I think it happens. I think they'll max him. I think Kauai to the Clippers is the... It feels like the most likely.

Feels like the most likely. But, you know, you win a championship and the city throws itself around you, and it'd be really, really hard to back up your stuff and go, hey, deuce is them out. But it does, it just, it does, it feels like he's a mercenary. And by the way, if you're Toronto,

even if they lose him, I would have made that move, you know, six days a week, twice on Sunday anyway. It gets you to, it gets you to, place you've never been before. I think there's all kinds of interesting things there. First, the Brooklyn part of it is fascinating. Fascinating. I don't know how many people know.

Like Brooklyn's actually more expensive to live in than the island of Manhattan. Right. It's an unbelievable area. And if you look at how Kyrie and KD, how they talk, how they think, how, you know, other things matter to them outside of basketball, the basketball matters a lot to them. They fit the mentality of that Brooklyn bubble, but it's still the nets, right? It's still the Nets. It's not the Nix.

On the other hand, if you go to the Knicks, you got to play for a team owned by James Dolan. Whether he's involved or not, can you be at the cool guy table and like, hey, you're collecting checks from James Dolan. That's a hard thing for some of those guys to take. Then you talk about L.A. Like, I love everything about the Clippers and you've had their org chart.

Like, that's amazing. And Lawrence Frank does a good job. Trent Renton does an amazing job like this. You go through organizational structure. They got studs across the board and a tremendous coach who everybody respects is won a champion. And then you get the Lakers that are a mess, but they got $40 million cap space. They got LeBron James.

They got good young players. They got a number four pick in the draft. And they're the Lakers. Like I still struggle to not be convinced that Kyrie doesn't not have a home. And he's like, you know, it was rough dealing with LeBron in the past. But at least I know what I have. And a bird in the hand is better than two in the bush. And I'm going to like Kyrie to Lakers makes a lot more sense.

Whereas mid-year, I would have said, no way. Now I kind of think maybe they're the ones. because Brooklyn has such a good culture. I don't think Kyrie fits in with that culture. He's just not, I mean, maybe DeAngelo Russell fit in there. Maybe they think they can make Kyrie into what DeAngelo Russell became because he's a better

player. But I just don't think he fits in their culture. I don't think they want to shake. I have no idea what's going to happen because there's so many reasons to not go to those three destinations. And then the Lakers are such a mess. Yeah, it's funny about this. I always say I've done the yellow notepad. So I've left like four times cross-country.

And it really is simple. you get a week out, two weeks out, and you get a yellow notepad, pros and cons. I've done that. I mean, that's what you end up in the same place. Well, but I, not for me. Like, generally I think I've made the right decision every time. And I think the audience thinks it's about the shoe deal.

It's about this. It's amazing. You think it's complicated. But when you move cross country to new teams, like LeBron just decided. There's a basketball school for my kid. Maverick Carter lives out there. I can do business. And I still contend it was kind of,

it came down to kind of basic tenants, family, business, ah, hoops. And he made the deal. I didn't think it was that complex. I think transition is hard, man. I mean, like, even LeBron this year, like this transition has been hard. And because anybody who's ever been recruited,

you get recruited and then you show up. And then, I mean, like, look at Kyrie. Like, you know, Kyrie, everything was going great. And then his knee was bothering him and he has a procedure. and then they turned out and he has to have another procedure and now a sudden the team and then the thing just chained flipped on him overnight

and he went from, I'm staying if you'll have me to nobody, he doesn't necessarily want them and they don't necessarily want him. You know, Kevin Wrenton knew what he was getting into. He's accomplished everything he's set out to do. Like, the only reason he came here was to stare down LeBron James and win championships and he did it and he was the finals MVP.

And he's still not happy, right? So the idea, like, I understand the parallel between your life and leaving and coming here. It's a massive change to up. Think about the change you had to. You had two families. Yeah.

Right. Okay. So you had to, these guys have a lot more to think about. And then they look at the past and how many other guys have gone different places and haven't been happy. Or then you're, you know, you're Russell Westbrook and you're not happy. How about this?

LeBron created a real momentum with player mobility. How about this theory? His disastrous Lakers season, would you be shocked, Doug? Kauai stays in Toronto. Durant stays in the Bay Area. Clay resigns with the Warriors. Butler stays with the Sixers. And they all look at LeBron and go,

ain't that easy. They took the Cape off Superman. Let's just stay put and make the most money. I would be shocked. I don't think it's likely. But, you know, again, you've told me before, and I've moved several times cross-country. Don't mess with happy.

You do wish the guys would understand what they have. And, you know, like a Kevin Durant, like, all right, so it's Steph's team. Like, okay. I still get a bunch of kids. of money. I get to win championships. I can, you know, I play in San Francisco next year. Like, we can do whatever we want to do. AOL City. But, but not enough people. I do think that it's not just LeBron. It's the culture of the sport from switching jerseys and switching AAU teams to switching colleges. None of these guys obviously did. But it's kind of the

culture of the sport. The culture of this sport is to go to the hottest team, to play with your buddies, to try something new. And then when you get there, the first person to go is the coach. That's what that was all the A. A.U. Teams. What happens all the college teams. That's happens with the pro teams. Doug Gottlie, good seeing you, Dougher. Great to see you. A joy with the news. No, no, no, no, no.

Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. So, Kauai Leonard has led the Raptors to their first NBA finals in historic fashion. In his 18 playoff game so far, he's averaged 31.2 points on 50.7% shooting. Yikes. And 38.8% from 3-point range. And those averages have led him to a total of 561 points, which is the sixth most out of any player in the playoffs before the finals. We have the list up right now. Number one is LeBron

in 2017-18, Akeem Ilajuwon, Jordan, Durant, and then Kauai. Jordan twice and then Kauai. It's pretty impressive group he's in there. Well, I mean, when you think of those guys, you think of dominant offensive players. And Kauai, for a lot of years, we just thought he was the best defensive player in the league. So the fact that he's, I mean, when you say Durant, M.J., LeBron. Yeah, you just think buckets. You think buckets and it's like, Kauai, until this year, I thought he was, I thought he was kind of a, I thought what made him a top five player was his defense. Well, to me, before this year, I always thought of Kauai is obviously a great defensive player. But also just a very clutch player, a very reliable, solid, sturdy player.

Like a player that you know can make a big shot, but you don't necessarily think is going to go out there and maybe get volume shooting the way that all those guys do that you just mentioned. I don't know the Kauai is leaving Toronto now. I was pretty sure about it throughout the playoffs and now. And even if they had made it to the finals, I don't know. I got to tell you watching the atmosphere there in Toronto, it's a little different to have an entire country behind you. I mean, he's got the whole country. What do you make of that video this weekend with his sister

and somebody in the background yells? We all know he's going anyway. What do you make of that? I don't know. I mean... He doesn't talk to a lot of people, so his sister would know, right? Like he would... His uncle runs his...

His uncle's very involved in what he does, yes. Look, I don't think anybody has made any decisions. I don't think Hawaii's made a decision. I don't think he's made a decision. I think this was all of us just talking and creating these scenarios and looking for breadcrumbs. We talk about all the time. LeBron made his decision two days before. I think they're 100% focused on basketball.

There's no way that you can start. spread your mind that thin to be thinking about where you're going after something and be successful at what you're doing in the present at the level that he is doing it. So I don't think anybody's made any decisions yet, but I mean, that atmosphere in Toronto was crazy. Oh, it's fantastic. And I'm watching the fans and the street. Like, he's going to be beloved there no matter what for the rest of time. If he stays there, I don't know.

I think he might stay. So Tom Brady will be 42 years old when he starts his 20th NFL season this fall. It's kind of remarkable to even say that. He's not the only one in New England battling father time, though. The Patriots are officially the NFL's oldest team with a league high 15 players age 30 or older. Falcons of 14, followed by the Bills, the Panthers, Redskins, Cardinals, Cardinals, Saints, Giants, and Eagles. With the teams with the most players age 30 are over. We were talking about it earlier that the Patriots or that team that convinces themselves that they are the underdogs every single year.

So maybe this year it'll be that everyone's just saying they're too old to make it happen again. On the flip side, you'll like this note. The youngest team in the league is Cleveland. And they have the tied with Jacksonville with only three players over the age of 30. You know, Cleveland is the over under on Cleveland is nine. They are, I think, at least tied as a frontrunner to get Gerald McCoy. The really good guy, the defensive tackle, the Tampa didn't want to pay. if they get him and you look at their defensive line, Lord, it's good.

Cleveland's young. They're young. They have a coach with no experience as a head coach. Look, I will say this. And I kind of can't believe I'm saying this. But I do see a lot of similarities to the L.A. Rams in the style that they're putting the team together. They have a new head coach, Sean McVeigh. was young. Obviously, I know

they're not the exact same because Sean McVeigh's personality is very opposite of what's going on in Cleveland's. But I just think if they can establish a culture, I know there's a lot of noise and there's a lot going on, but if they can establish a culture there in Cleveland, they can do something special. If

they, you know, stay focused. You're looking at me like, I'm a crazy person. No, I think youngest NFL team, least experienced head coach. Look, I think there are expectations for this year, realistic expectations for this year for to be a successful season. Playoffs. That'd be great. To me, that is a success.

And I think that they will be battling to the last week for that. And I'm a hater for saying that. No, you're not. It's realistic. We're not erasing everything that the Cleveland Browns have been. I just think that that is, your goal should always be Super Bowl. I have no problem with your goal being to win a Super Bowl. It should always be to win a Super Bowl. But I think success for them this year we're making the playoffs. They're battling a lot. So the Lakers have been mentioned in trade rumors many times over the last few months, especially when it comes to Anthony Davis. And one player that's been assumed to be involved in any Lakers trade at this point is Lanzo Ball, his injury history. And, you know, there's been some concerns about his trade value.

However, one NBA source tells NBC sports that people just don't grasp how good he is. Now, the interesting thing about Lanzo, to me, especially going into this offseason, is his relationship with LeBron. He was on the shop with him And it seems it appears that LeBron has Taken a liking to Lonzo Which I think is a good thing and they seem to be playing well When they were playing well together His issue is injuries

His issue is only injuries To me Lonzo is invaluable when he's on the court He's he's everything we expected him to be People put way too much expectation on the amount of scoring That he was going to do And when you look at his numbers And you compare them to the people that he was compared to coming into the league after his two years.

They're comparable to Jason Kidd and Gary Payton. He's not been in the league that long. We all need to stop being so dramatic, especially at his position. Well, he's also, he's incredibly long. He's a 6.5 point. He's very long. Good rebounder. Incredible passer.

Yeah, no, I mean, there's, and by the way, last year before he got hurt, he's always been a spotty three-point shooter. Lonzo did one thing last year before he got hurt that was no, and I watch all the Liker games. he started finishing aggressively at the rim because the knock on him was, dude, don't be just perimeter. You're a 6.5 point. Go to the rim and jam it. He had about an eight-game stretch before he got hurt.

You're like, oh, no, no, no. He has added dimension to his game. Also, his body completely changed from year one to year two, which is expected because he got a year older. He looks like a different player. But I will say, though, if that trade does end up happening, which are very, very slim chances of it happening to the Pelicans, he would be fun along Zion.

And Drew Holiday. You'd have two natural scores. Yeah, that would be interesting. I don't think it's going to happen, but it would be interesting. Joy with the News. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd-Lie News.

Always considered the Warriors in a group of six teams, as maybe the second best ever behind Jordan's Bulls. I now think if they win this year, Jordan's Bulls and the Warriors are absolutely the two greatest teams ever, and they've separated. I'll explain why. Plus, a man who covers these clippers regularly. The Kauai Rumors next in LA.

Memorial Day, it's the herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the I-Hard Radio app. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back.

Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met, Levant this plant to a billion-dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life.

Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Life throws hurdles big and small. The question is, how do you conquer them? On Hurtle with Emily Abadi, we sit down with the most inspiring women in sports and wellness. professional athletes, coaches, and Olympic champions to talk about the challenges that shaped them and the mindset that keeps them going. From the WNBA standout Kate Martin

and rising hockey star Layla Edwards. If a boy can do it, I don't see why a girl can't. Like, I've never understood that. Like, it didn't make sense in my brain. It's hard to be in spaces that no one looks like you, but don't ever feel like you don't feel like you don't feel on. Don't let that be the reason you don't do it. An Olympic champs Gabby Thomas and Katie Ladeke.

The ability to show a gold medal to someone and have their face light up and smile, that means the world to me. And that's what motivates me to win more gold medals. At our level, at this scale, like being able to fail in front of the entire world. Like, I can do anything. I can do anything.

Because resilience isn't just about winning. It's about showing up, even when it's hard. Listen to Hurtle with Emily Abadi on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart women's sports. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened.

That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral, moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them.

Listen to SportsClyce on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests.

I'm talking. Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it, and we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch.

Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross. you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth? Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person.

Join me, Keir Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free Our Heart Radio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Dan Wojke is a national NBA writer for the L.A. Times, known him for some time. And now the national rider, you

are in the hub of it, baby, because the clippers may lead for Kauai Leonard and the Lakers, I think, it's a little bit of a Hail Mary, but I think they land Jimmy Butler, and that's all guesswork. But let's start with Kauai Leonard because you're covering the story as much and as well as

anybody. Let's just talk Raptors and Clippers, the team's vying for him. Yeah, I think what's so interesting, Colin, about this free agency is that the two kind of clear suitors have done such a good job in their recruitment this year, right? So let's look at the Clippers start and what they needed to do to kind of get Kawhi Leonard.

Okay. Right? They needed to establish a really good infrastructure. They'd establish stability. They had to stay in Southern California. Obviously, it's a big part of this too. And then they had a really good year. They showcased great young players, feisty in the playoffs.

They did a good job, I think, showing Kauai that they wanted him. You know, as recently as game two of the Eastern Conference finals, you saw Clippers executives kind of hanging out, hanging around. and they've done a really good job, I think, on that. And they've made it a place where a credible free agent could go sign and nobody would say anything, right? Nobody would make a fuss about it if he ended up with the Clippers. It would be like, oh, that makes a ton of sense. Toronto, I think, and they're sort of one-year addition, they had to show him culture,

and they've showed him that that is a good basketball culture. And I think most importantly, they'd have to keep him healthy. And that was what he said in his opening press conference. It was like, I want to be healthy. I want to get to the playoffs and be like kind of optimized and look at what we've seen. We've seen a historic playoff run. By the way, the Raptors bit the bullet a little bit on this. They wore it, yeah.

They didn't love him missing 22 games. No, and I think part of it helped in the fact that, you know, they played pretty well without him at times. Pascal Seaccombe and those guys, I think did a really good job in the regular season without Kauai. But in the playoffs, we've seen a different animal in this guy. We've seen him turbocharged, playing 52 minutes, guarding. Yanis one night, you know, career high and rebounds in the playoffs, the next, career high and assists. This guy has done it all. He's made a real stake at best player in the world. And I think, Colin, if you notice what Maasai Ujiri said on the podium after they won it, it was what Saturday,

I can't even get my days straight. It's the playoffs. Yeah. That Kauai Lenders, we believe he's the best player in the world. And I think for, Messiah wasn't, that wasn't an accident that he said that out loud. I think in that public stage to declare Kauai Lander, you're the best player of the world, you play here, I think was a message, not just for those fans in Toronto, but it was a message for Kauai Lerner. Dan Oakey joining us L.A. Times National NBA writer. This is an interesting

thing. Psychology is a factor. Totally. Kauai was overlooked by Pact 12 schools. He was overlooked in the draft. Then he goes to San Antonio, and they are like, hey, and he's a system guy. Yeah, fit into our system. There is a chip.

And by way, I totally get it and he has earned every bit of my respect. But Kauai doesn't have an ego, but man, does he want to be loved? And I think he wants to be, I mean, I think he wants to be respected. And I think every player at that sort of level wants like a shot at that crown, right? Like best in the world. I think that does matter. And being regarded at the very best at your craft. And he's been able to showcase this in this playoff run.

And I think, you know, whereas the Clippers probably felt really, really good about Kauai Leonard going in the playoffs. And I still think they feel pretty good about it. But they would have to feel less good. He's had moments there in Toronto, you know, a shot that hits the rim four times that's in the air for about a week it feels like. Yeah. That's a moment, right? Standing on the podium with Kyle Lowry, like, that's a moment. I asked Kauai Leonard a question post game sort of like, it's been five years since you've been to the finals, you know, considering everything you've gone through.

What's it like to be here now? And he mentioned how Kyle Lowry, you know, was such a good teammate to him this season and kind of help him get adjusted. And that was a messy situation, right? They made big kind of changes. They fired the NBA coach of the year. In the span of two months, they fired the NBA coach of the year. They hire a coach who spent most of his career coaching in the British Basketball League. And then they trade the most popular, most loyal player they've ever had in DeMar de Rosen, you know, for a guy who could maybe be a one-year rental who most the league thought was gone.

This could have been a mess. Yeah, and they've hit on all of these, obviously, totally worth it. The risk, sort of the scared money doesn't make money, sort of kind of, you know, that has been what the, if anything, Masayu Jiri, not getting enough credit this year for taking really big swings and, you know, coming up big. Great stuff. You also cover the Lakers. Now, when you say NBA National Beat Rider, L.A. Times, that always meant you just cover

the Lakers and occasionally went to a clipper game. We got a lot of people over there, so it's good. I'm able to kind of move around. I'm going to throw it out here. I believe Jimmy Butler is a lot of teams number two free agent. I think a lot of teams think like if we get him great, but we want Clay, Durant, Kauai. I think he's the Lakers number one.

I think they have to position themselves as, listen, you're our guy. He's famously likes L.A. If I said to you, all these free agents, who goes to the Lakers? Who's your guess? I mean, I think Jimmy Butler seems like the safest bet. And it's for a lot of the reasons you just said,

is that I think he's a plan B for a lot of teams. You know, when you look at Jimmy Butler, you see things like he's got Tibbs minutes on that body, right? Which is like his clock is ticking. Like this is a guy who's played a lot of like high intensity bass. Hard practice guy. Should be a better shooter. You wish you would want a better three point shooter, I think. You know, the career I think is around like 33, 34%.

You'd like that number to be a little higher, I think, for a star player. But what you saw in the playoffs and one of the things that, you know, where I think this is the, There are a lot of reasons to not like Jimmy Butler. Obviously, the teammate stuff. And, you know, the fact this is a guy who's left a lot of places and teams have been kind of like, see you later. Yeah. You know, like that's a concern. But what you saw in the playoffs and what I think there aren't that many guys, who can body up a superstar, chest into a superstar and go toe to toe with someone and play like they're better.

There aren't that many guys who, like, who can be credible in those situations. Jimmy Butler's one of them. To me, I think he's a pretty good LeBron fit. I could see them poking around at some. other guys. I think like Nicola Vucevic is a guy who's a really good player, not a, not a super big star. I think he'd be a good LeBron fit. He's someone I think is on the Lakers and the Clippers radar. We'll see what that money looks like if you don't want to quite max out a guy. Giving Jimmy Butler a four-year max is a scary proposition. That contract is going

to look pretty bad at the end of it, but their clock's ticking over there. And they kind of got to go. And that's where I agree with you. They're in this, the Lakers, I think, are in this weird situation where they've got two different masters that they're trying to serve. You have LeBron James, you know, an all-time great NBA player, maybe the best ever, tremendous winner. This is a guy who lives in the NBA finals. His whole year is built towards getting to the NBA finals, right? And then you've got a team, by and large, the rest of your core are guys that are

22, 23 years old who are learning every day, who are trying to go through mistakes and play through those things. I think this was a really big challenge for Luke Walton. It's going to be a huge challenge for Frank Vogel, is how. How do you coach a team that's trying to do two different things? Trying to develop a young core. You're trying to win now with the all-time great player who's at the end of his prime. To me, I still think the best path forwards for the Lakers is a trade,

whether it's Anthony Davis, whether it's Bradley Beale, whether it's whoever else hits the market. There's going to be two or three names that aren't on the market now that will be, that we don't know yet, just the way things shake out. They need to turn some of those young guys. They need to get a more simplified plan. I think, and move in a clear direction, instead of trying to do everything. Yeah, this is the Lakers current flow power org chart.

We wrote this down next. Instead of a success pyramid, it's a spider web that can't find its way. John Wooden would not be happy with this. No, John Wooden would be like, oh, a timeout. This is not going to work. All right, Dan Woakey, L.A. Times sports reporter. He's the national NBA writer for the L.A. Times. A newspaper in America, by the way, that's hiring people.

That's hiring dozens of people. Dan Great C&U. Hour three next. We're absolutely packed on a wonderful Memorial Day Monday. In L.A., it's The Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd, weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferrari's and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across.

When Jacob met Levant this plant to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Life throws hurdles big and small. The question is, how do you conquer them?

On Hurtle with Emily Abadi, we sit down with the most inspiring women in sports and wellness, professional athletes, coaches, and Olympic champions to talk about the challenges that shaped them and the mindset that keeps them going. from the WMBA standout, Kate Martin and rising hockey star Layla Edwards. If a boy can do it, I don't see why a girl can't. Like, I've never understood that. Like, it didn't make sense in my brain.

It's hard to be in spaces that no one looks like you, but don't ever feel like you don't feel like. Don't let that be the reason you don't do it. An Olympic champs, Gabby Thomas and Katie Ladeke. The ability to show a gold medal to someone and have their face light up and smile, that means the world to me. And that's what motivates me to win more gold medals.

at our level at this scale, like being able to fail in front of the entire world. Like, I can do anything. I can do anything. Because resilience isn't just about winning. It's about showing up, even when it's hard. Listen to Hurtle with Emily Abadi on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Last night, a blown call changed a game.

This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending. Opinions are flying. and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies,

and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls,

we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants to. answer. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kier Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests.

I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth.

Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keer Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free Our Heart Radio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now.

Tonight, the PBA playoffs keep rolling on FS1 with just two spots left in the semis. Find out who will punch their ticket and move one step closer to 100 grand. And the PBA playoff quarterfinals conclude tonight at 9 Eastern on FS1 and the Fox Sports app. Got to put my arms around Janice today. Like he lost and he leaves the press conference. Let me just say this.

I'm not into the most valuable player award in the NBA. I think it's nonsense. I think it's stat-driven. It's called most valuable player in the NBA. If you go and look at the results since 2003, 15, 16 years ago, overwhelmingly and Janus will be the latest to win the MVP and they don't win a title.

I think it's ridiculous. LeBron James, if you go to the first day LeBron James out of high school, join the Cavs, and he count those seven years, and then you count the next four he was in Cleveland when he came back, and then he just left him for the Lakers. If you count all the Cleveland Cavalier games, they won 29% of the games when he didn't play, 65% when he did. that's the most valuable player in the NBA. That literally you were the worst team in the league without him

and won several playoff series and got to the finals with him. So the idea that James Hardin would ever be an MVP, I mean, let's be honest about James Harden. You get nothing on the defensive end. He mostly fatigues in big games late because he's ball-centric. And the other thing is, even if you sat him down for eight minutes since Chris Paul arrived, you have another all-star point guard in the roster. How valuable is he?

He's valuable, but when you have another all-star his position that does what he does, much of it very well. But I will say this about Janus. Janus is the first MVP winner that I absolutely think since, like, LeBron won the last one, who's deserving? Milwaukee was the number one defensive team in the league. That's because of Janus, and that's it. Blocks, you just couldn't go in there with his length

and his ability to swat stuff. They were the best defensive team in the league. And the other thing that shows value is when he didn't play well, the first two games in this series against Toronto, he played well. They won. After that, you know, they defended him well. He struggled and they lost four straight. If he doesn't, if he can't do what he needs to do, they don't win games.

I mean, they were a dominant, dominant team at home. They couldn't win at home. They couldn't come back and win it. home. So to me, the word is valuable. James Harden's talented. Russell Westbrook's talented. Statistical aberrations, they're so amazing. Yannis is the MVP and completely worthy. It's a regular season award, so playoffs don't matter. But that kid has turned around that franchise. They are number one in the NBA defense. That's a Yonis stat. And when he doesn't play, and he's not on the floor or not playing well, they're just good. They're not special.

Joy with the news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. So sticking with Janus, the bucks were eliminated from the playoff Saturday night after losing game six to the Raptors, 194. Janice was clearly frustrated after the game and even left the press conference following a question about the team's playoff experience. You guys have talked a lot about how at this point, you know, sometimes it takes experience. I'm wondering if now that you have some of that experience.

experience if you see more validity to that point or what you think about that now that you've gone through it. They didn't like that. It's kind of an ironic situation to leave the ironic question to leave the press conference on. Now he'd been there for a while, as you mentioned. It's not like he was cutting the press conference short. It's just, you know, he just had had enough. Chris Middleton looks a little confused or he got stuck with the having to answer it. But this is true.

It's a fair question because they did not have as much experience as the Raptors have. And this is why I always like the Raptors this season, because the Raptors were always there. And as you mentioned, they went up against LeBron James every year. And sometimes you can be a great team. That's just what happens. The Houston Rockets get made to look like they're not a great team.

They are great team. They just end up playing the Warriors. They're one of the best teams in NBA history every single year. Phil Mickelson is one of the great shot makers in the history of golf. It's just that Tiger was right in his physical prime with Phil Mickelson. I mean, sometimes that's just how it happens. Utah Jazz were a great team for like nine years with Stockton and Malone. Sorry.

You know, I mean, it just, that happens all the time. In every sport. And this is not to say that the bucks are over and the road, Rihonis, they're going to be right back there next year. Yes. They need to move some pieces around. And sometimes it does take losing in a big moment like that to give you the experience that you need to know how to overcome that. Here's another one, Jokovic, the tennis player, because I play a little bit of tennis.

Djokovic has given Federer fits. If you took Federer out over the last 10 years, Djokovic, many would say he's the best player in the history of the sport. Like, you just don't understand. Michael Jordan stopped a lot of potential dynasties. Are you back playing tennis? Less of it. My right knee is a problem.

Of my many problems in life, my right knee is a problem. It's hard on your joints. Oh, Lord is it. So the Raptors are heading. to the NBA finals for the first time in NBA history. And after the big game six win, Raptors president, Masayo Jiri, said that he thinks Kauai is the best player in the league. And when Kauai was asked about that praise, he remained humble and focused on the team. I don't really judge my, you know, game like that. I'm more of a team, team aspect, see what my team is doing.

Just want to win. I don't care about being best player. I want to be the best team. I always said that it's turning out well now. I mean, we're in the finals and we're not done yet. You know, for all the criticism that Kauai got for his exit from the Spurs and he kind of got painted to seem like he wasn't a team guy and, you know, the whole issue with his leg and was he really hurt or, you know, was he heard? And really no one know what to expect from Kauai this year after what happened with the Spurs and that injury. He really deserves a lot of credit because not only has he played incredible, he has put this entire franchise on his back and pulled everyone through the ups and downs of this playoff run.

Yeah, and I think, you know, the whole organization is full of smart people, and it's like this could have been a disaster. They fired the coach of the year. Derosen was beloved. So this could have been a mess. And, you know, I mean, listen, Kauai is not the only quiet Pete Sampras, Mike Trout. We've had a lot of stars who are a little tougher to figure out because they're a little more private. He just happens to be his personality-wise.

He's a little private. And I think I've been guilty of this. I use the word odd. It's like he's, but if you really think about it, there's been a lot of superstars in sports. Pete Sampras was for 10 years, the best tennis player in the world. He was the opposite of Andre Agassiz and John McEnroll.

The personality opposite. And I think Kauai is a guy that leaves a lot of us with a question mark, but you cannot deny, first of all, he's been so good late in games. Jordan-esque. He has been Jordan-esque. And I think a lot of that personality, like the disconnect that we have there

is because he did start out with the Spurs, who are traditionally a quiet franchise to begin with. So he's just sort of stuck out as a great player on a great franchise, but we didn't know too much about his personality in general. And then when everything kind of started to fall apart, you know, Popovich is this huge personality, very outspoken and, you know, aggressive.

And then, you know, you contrast it with kawai. and then I'm not working with the Spurs. It was a lot of confusion about who he really is. Not every, you can be too good people can just not work together. It happens all the time. And look, they had success together. So it was not like it was a disaster. So the Steelers have been very vocal about how the atmosphere surrounding their team has improved since the end of last season.

It's going to take some time to see how that all really shakes out. But Steelers cornerback, Joe Hayden, thinks that they can handle the pressure and turn it into a great season. I've been planning to get the Steelers for seven years. They were never the underdog. So just having that chip on our shoulder, having that, you know, people doubting us. I think that's something that we could take use of our advantage. And I'm just come out here and grind. And it's all literally about what you're doing between the lines.

You hear the outside noises because usually, man, the Pittsburgh, they're always, oh, no one, they're going to be playoffs. And it just is what it is. They just basically put us in the playoffs. So now just hearing people not talk as highly of us, you know, is kind of put a chip on people's shoulder. Do you think that's positive? Can you guys use that?

Oh, I think that's a great thing. Tackling Fuel. It's a good thing. actually for the Steelers, that they're looking at it this way as opposed to just ignoring all of it or pretending like it didn't happen. I still don't know what's going to happen with the Steelers this year, but I do like where they are in their division. I know everyone's giving it to the Browns, but I do think the Browns are going to be successful

this year. By successful, I mean they make the playoffs because that should be the standard of expectations for them at this point, despite all the talent that they have. The youngest team in the league, and they have a lot to do. Cleveland is the youngest team in the league. Yes. Wow. They only have three players over the age of 30.

God, that is young. They are young. So, Steelers have the experience and the expectations of being a championship-level organization. Who are the old guys for them? Duke Johnson, the running. I mean, I'm trying to think of the old. They have an offensive lineman that's an old guy. They have a defensive and an offensive lineman that's an old guy.

Man, Cleveland is young, talented, really young. But this is an interesting position. for the Steelers because the Steelers have expectations of a championship every year and everyone is thinking that it's going to fall apart. And I did fall apart last year, so there's no denying that. I just think if you're going to use all the criticism

as a motivating factor, then be that culture again. Like that's where I feel like the Steelers lost. Even though they have high expectations every year, they are a grinding team. It's a blue collar city. Now they're just noisy. Yeah. So get back to the tradition, get back to the culture and

stop worrying about it. If it's really about all individuals that cause all the problems, then it should be a team atmosphere again. That's what they should focus on. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd-Lie News.

Mark Medina's a guy. Used to cover the Lakers for the LA Daily News, and then he bailed and upgraded and went to the Mercury News. In San Francisco, of course, the Bay Area, where they cover the Warriors, and Mark's a regular on our show. Mark, how are you today? Thanks.

Good, good to have you on. Let's start with this. It is fascinating. I've never seen anything like it. Warriors are 31 and 1, last 32 without KD. I think he's handled it pretty well. I don't know how I'd handle it when I would keep watching my team win, especially be great latent games without me.

I think KD's handled it well, but how does it not irk him a little, right? Like a little? Well, I think, you know, maybe earlier in the season, things like that would Irkham, but I remember a few days that he had his injury. He was more than eager to entertain that question. And the numbers speak for themselves, but I think there's some context that needs to be laid out here. Like, it's very impressive.

The wall hands-on-deck game six against Houston, right? And then they played a Portland Trailblazers team that frankly just doesn't have the personnel to match up with the Warriors. So I think if Kevin Durant's injury had happened earlier in the Houston series, we might very well be talking about the Warriors being eliminated in the Western Conference semifinals. So, you know, how this pertains to the NBA finals, like, it's unknown when exactly Kevin Durant's going to be coming back. And if he misses a significant chunk of time, I don't know if it's a foregone conclusion that the Warriors would win.

Yeah, no, I think it's a really interesting series with or without Kevin. It's interesting. So you guys have had this long break. I read a story the other day. The team went to, like, Cabo or something. I mean, I'm hearing all sorts of stuff. What are the Warriors done for the last seven days? Yeah, for my understanding, they haven't gone to Cabell, but they've definitely been able to dial it back. Like, they took two days off of just rest and recovery after sleeping Portland. And then they've been doing practices almost like it was training camp.

Like one day, they just kind of have a light practice. Another day they get up and down in scrimmage, which is a rarity for the team, because they're always just trying to make sure that guys are healthy and saving them for the games that matter. But yeah, this has come at a very opportunity for Kevin Durant, DeMarcus, Cousins, Andre Woodall, because they're all nursing different ailments. But the Warriors will be the first to tell you, they are a little bit concerned of, will all this off-time, you know, maybe hurt them, not because they're going to Cabo, but just because they don't have that same kind of rhythm that maybe Toronto has

because, you know, they had just played in six games against Milwaukee. Now, Boogie Cousins could play in this series, from what I understand, Are we sure Kevin Durant's going to play in it? Well, we'll have more answers Wednesday for both guys. That's when the Warriors plan to re-evaluate him, both of them. But right now, the Warriors are anticipating Kevin is going to play at some point in the finals, but it's very unlikely to open game one, you know, probably unlikely even to open game two. DeMarcus cousins, I could definitely see him opening against the Raptors in game one.

He's already gotten a full scrimmage, which is a prerequisite. that Steve Kerr often has for adventure players, and he's been able to actually do on-court contact work. Kevin Durant at this point hasn't been able to. But as much as it's right now, DeMarcus is making better progress than Kevin Durant. I think that there are more question marks regarding DeMarcus's return because he's been out for much longer. When Kevin Durant comes back, they know how to plug him in. He's obviously the best in the NBA right now in scoring when you're looking at his averages, where DeMarcus, it's kind of been mixed results this year of how he's integrated with the Warriors so much that when Steve Kerr was asked,

hey, is DeMarcus going to be the definitive starter when he presumably comes back in the finals? Steve Kerr couldn't really give that answer definitively because of all the extenuating circumstances with his injury matchups and just how he will look once he actually starts playing. You know, it's with Boogie out, I don't think they'll resign Boogie. And if Kevin left, they would need size. I mean, they could go pay $4 million and get a Brooke Lopez to hit threes. But they, I would argue, they do need some wing size because if Kevin left and Boogie, I don't think they'd retain.

What direction, you know, we'll know in three weeks, but what direction do you think they would go? They could actually, you know, I ruled this out the other day. Josh Jackson, Phoenix, sons were about done with him. He's a long, very good wing defender who's kind of in the doghouse in Phoenix. And I think they, I think they, you know, he could fit into this culture because it's such a strong culture, even though he's been a little bit disappointing. I think they need some size. What say you if Durant and Boogie are both gone? Yeah, well, I mean, Clay Thompson.

I think that's an expectation. But number two, they don't, they'll only have the mid-mid level, which is around $5.3 million. the top two guys that I would look at if Kevin Durant's gone and presumably bogey is gone as well. Is Rudy Gay. He's a much poor man's version of a wing player that can score. If Brooke Lopez is willing to leave the bucks, he would be a guy that would be perfect as far as having a big.

It's a much different big than to Marcus Cousins. But I think that that's actually to the worst benefit because he can shoot threes. He can pick and pop. He can bang it inside. He's also a very much team. oriented guy, and that's all in the Warriors wheelhouse. But I think other than that, it's really going to be who can they get with the first round pick and then just see within some of those young players that are free agents.

Can they get some kind of bargain discounts with some of these guys? It's definitely going to be a much different team, but I think the worst case scenario that the Warriors are looking at themselves as is maybe they can be this generation San Antonio Spurs, where maybe they're not always the first. favorite to win the title, but they're always in the conversation. They're always contending. They're always going to be at least having a realistic shot to make some noise in the playoffs. It'll be an interesting July. Loonie's played well for them. I mean, I just think with Iggy, you got about a year left. Livingston, again, I think you can see, and by the way,

if you win another championship, it's four and five years, three straight, you've bought so much equity in the market. You could roll the dice a couple of times. I mean, I, I, I, I, I don't think they're going anywhere. I think they're going to be really, really solid going forward. I think it's been a fascinating year for you. You know, I mean, Kevin Durant, first of all, we were sure he was gone. Then he gets hurt. Then they win without him.

If they won and he didn't come back, he'd have to go. But if they started trailing in the series, he came back and helped them win. It would feel like, oh, that would validate his talent, that they needed him. I almost think this, Mark. the best thing for the Warriors is to get behind of the Raptors in this series need Kevin Durant, and then he swoops in, and they win the series. That feels like Kevin, who could change his mind daily, would understand how valuable he is. That's my best case scenario.

Trail Toronto, and you need him. Thoughts on that? Yeah, no, it definitely makes sense. I think, you know, in fairness, how the Warriors are thinking, like, because of all all the different ebbs and flows that you outline pretty well, they're just very mindful. Like, for better or for worse, Kevin's decision could just change, and you don't know if it's as simple as does he like being here or not or winning.

If it was, this would be a very simple decision for him. So I think psychologically the Warriors have almost treated this season as the possible last season. So just win the championship and let the chips fall after that. And they've been preparing themselves, I think, mentally, you know, this is Kevin's last season, he'll be gone, but then just kind of having that outside optimism that, hey, maybe he comes back on another one-year deal to experience Chase Center and try to ride this championship train, you know, at least one more run, or, heaven forbid, he does that max five-year deal because that's the most money that he could make

around $21 million. But I don't think the Warriors of the mind that they want to be down too, oh, but I think from our perspective, your perspective, like outside of people on the team. That definitely makes sense as far as, you know, how Kevin might feel where he fits in right now. Because the narrative ever since Portland, you know, got swept by the Warriors is, hey, you know, the Warriors are going to be fine without him if he's not available in the finals will be fine with him next season where I think that's misleading because you're looking at a five-game playoff sample size, four of them against an underman Portland team. and I don't know how much that really equates to a full 82 game season and then against some future playoff opponents that would be much more difficult. Mark Medina, he is joining us, Warriors Rider for the Mercury News, regular visitor to the herd. Have fun. We'll talk to you during the series, Mark.

Colin, always looking forward to it. You bet. Thanks, man. Man, I don't know where anybody's going. I saw that story where Kauai Leonard's sister deletes a video saying her brother is going to leave Toronto, but it's not Kauai's sister who says it. It's somebody in the background who says it. So I thought that was like, oh, okay, now we find out. And then I watched the video and I'm like, yeah, that's not really a sister saying it.

It's somebody screaming it in the background, but he may leave. I don't know. None of these guys. It's just fascinating to me. You know, I love the NBA conference finals and the finals. It's my favorite time in the NBA. Kind of like second round conference finals, finals. I think my second favorite time in the NBA is the free agent stuff over the regular season.

Like easily. Free agency has become bigger than the regular season. Yeah. I mean, all these seasons are too long. I mean, baseball, NBA, they're all too long. Can you imagine if you, Joy, if you started a sports league today, like you were, you were an investor. And I had $20 billion. And I said, guys, I've brought you investors here today.

We're going to create a new sport. What's it called baseball? That's going to be 162 games a year. People would be like, nope. I'm out. I'm not going to invest. That doesn't work with the devices, the urgency. I mean, all these, NBA, remember the strike short in year? It's great. Sixty-eight games in, out. Like, all these seasons. I mean, anytime you have a greater sense of urgency, it's going to-

Big. I mean, it's going to drive attention to it because you have to find out what's going to happen. I think there's whole weeks where it's like, well, you know, you had a bad run there, but you can get it together, especially with baseball. I don't think the NBA is actually. as bad as baseball because the sport is also in itself designed to be very urgent. So it's not like, you know, you have a time limit. It's a shot clock. It's more energy to it.

I still contend the NBA because, I mean, listen, we all watch the finals, conference finals. I contend NHL crushes college hockey ratings, Major League Baseball crushes college baseball ratings, and NFL ratings crush college football ratings. But March Madness actually holds up. up very well against the NBA playoffs. And the reason is urgency,

if I was commissioner, the only major change I would make, I would shorten that first round. I mean, to create the idea that that will never happen. I know, because it's too much money. It's too much money. But it would make it the first round.

Although this year, the first round was very interesting. It was. But generally, it's like, you're just kind of waiting for, all right, let's let the, even if a favorite loses, like Toronto lost Orlando.

Remember that first game? You're like, yeah, that won't last. That's not going to. last too long. It would have felt a lot different if there were five games, yeah. Yeah, no question. We wrap it up. Best for last next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app. Absolutely great to have everybody in. Please drive safely on this Memorial Day. It was an interesting weekend. There was the Indy 500. There were some

baseball games. But, you know, the Raptors and the Bucks, which a series I thoroughly enjoyed. I know it didn't get TV ratings because Milwaukee's a small market and Canada, Toronto doesn't count for our ratings. I thought it was one of the most even series I've seen. I thought it was the Toronto crowds were just so, oh, they were just so great. I have said this before. I feel very lucky to do what I do for a living. I look at people that are in politics and the corrosive nature of it. And I just sat there watching that with a buddy and our kids were in the pool and I'm like God, this is great. Drinking a

beer, grilling, watching Bucks Raptors and watching the country, Canada, it's just that team means so much to Canada. It's always great when you see, you get to experience a moment like that where, you know, they make the finals for the first time in franchise history or, you know, a city

has a moment that's really historical and they all celebrate together. Even if you're not a part of it, like you can enjoy the happiness that that city is enjoying. And it's not just the whole country. It's more than just Toronto that's behind the Raptors. So just the crowds in the

streets and it's amazing to watch. So let's do on a Monday, a Memorial Day Monday, our best for last. After almost three hours, Colin apparently hasn't gotten to the point yet. Quit holding out on us, cowherd. It's the best for last. People complain

about the lack of parity in the NBA and the Warriors' dominance. But I've been saying this now for a couple years, Dominance is everywhere in America. Excellent people in regardless of gender and religion and people separate. When you give them the freedoms in capitalism to separate, there's a percentage of people that do. I just want you to think about the dominance and how it is everywhere in our world. Let's start with the Patriots.

They have been in four of the last five Super Bowls. They have now won 10 straight division titles. They own the record for the most consecutive NFL winning seasons 18, and they are again favored next year to not only win their division, to not only win the AFC, but to win the Super Bowl. Let's go to college football. It's very southern. Clemson Bama have won the last four championships.

They have won seven of the last 10 championships. And they are favored again this year. to meet in the national championship. How about golf? Brooks Kepka has won four of the last eight majors. Oh, by the way, when he didn't win, that Tiger won the Masters, so we've heard about him too.

He dominated the previous decade. In tennis, Federer Nadal and Djokovic have won the last nine Grand Slam events. And here's a number for you. in the last 15 years, Roger Fedder, Raffi Nadal, and Djokovic have won 51 of the last 61 Grand Slam events. That is absurd. But it doesn't end in sports.

Amazon, one company, Seattle-based, now accounts for 50% of all e-commerce. one company in America. Google. Remember the first time I went to Google? Used to have competition. 75% of all internet searches go through Google. Disney, of the top 30 highest-grossing movies all time, 17 are Disney.

Star Wars, Marvel, animated movies. Now, think of all the movie studio. Think of all the movie studios. Disney 30 grossing biggest 17 to 30. Starbucks. What percentage of coffee sales in America do you think that? 40% of all, by the way, another Seattle-based company. Apple, everybody's got a smartphone.

Everybody's got a smartphone. 47% of the smartphones of the shipments in America for smartphones. in the United States. 47% are Apple phones. McDonald's has $25 billion in global revenue. That is more than double number two subway at $11 billion. Stock has been climbing, climbing, climbing, McDonald's in recent years.

Folks, it's everywhere. You're part of it. NFL, college football, golf, tennis, NBA. I didn't mention Yukon women's basketball. I didn't mention Serena. I didn't mention that, I mean, I'd have our staff look this up. If you go, I mean, like, we're based right outside of Hollywood.

It's amazing in all this city of all these creative people, how often it's like six movie directors. and 20 actors that are basically connected to the top films. So you see it on Main Street, you see it on Wall Street, you see it in sports. And I've said before, I don't have an answer for all of this stuff. But if you go to the Olympics, you do realize, I can tell you right now, winter or summer Olympics, the top five gold, silver, bronze medal winning countries, the most prestigious sporting trophy in the world is the World Cup. three countries, off the top of my head, I think it's Brazil, Italy, Germany, have 13 of the World Cups.

The second most prestigious global event for a long time was not the Super Bowl. It was the World Series. Yankees have 27 of those. So if dominance isn't your thing, you're in the wrong country. And in sports, I've just gotten used to it. In the 60s, the Montreal Canadiens dominated hockey and the, it's been around forever. And the Celtics, in fact, the most dominant. decade was actually the 60s because hockey Montreal

Canadians dominated it and the Celtics dominated it. So it was here in the 60s and then in the 80s it was the Lakers and it was the Celtics and then in the 90s it was the Bulls and now it's the Warriors and it was the spurs and you just got to get comfortable with it. I think it comes down to culture. If you create a winning culture within any organization and it carries from generation to generation, you're going to have success over. a sustained period of time.

It doesn't matter who you bring in as long as everyone buys into the culture you're going to have that success. The reason why those companies are so successful is because you can go to any Starbucks on the planet and if you order that drink, it's going to taste the same everywhere you go. Because there's an established culture.

Did you notice yesterday? So we had the Coca-Cola, Coke 600 yesterday. Goulet, you're a big NASCAR fan. Yep. Huge 600. It was on Fox yesterday. Did you guys notice who drove the Pace car yesterday? My favorite person in the world next to my beautiful wife, Charlotte Flair.

Did you notice that? There were about seven people that came to mind when you said favorite person. No, there's one now. There's only one now. It changes because I was going to say Andrew Locke and then there's like Peyton Manning for a second came to mind. Russell Wilson. Charlotte Flair. Shut down the internet except for her Twitter account.

I don't know what it is with Charlotte Fair. I cannot get enough of Charlotte Flare. She's very talented. Very, and she's outspoken. She's tough. Great personality. Great personality. Now she's happily married to a guy that bench presses Rhode Island,

so I'm not going to get, you know, crazy here. But she, Charlotte Flair. Pace Car. America's finally figuring out who dominates it. Charlotte Flair. Rick Flair, Baton passed a Charlotte Flair. Incredible. All right.

We're back tomorrow. I want to thank Chris Broussard. Dan Wojke, L.A. Times, Doug Gottlie, Mark Medina. Man, good show today. Drive safe, be safe. We'll see you tomorrow. In L.A. It's the hurt. I'm Michelle McPhee, and I've been unraveling the strangest criminal alliance I've ever reported on. A Mormon polygamist and an Armenian businessman.

Multi-million dollar house, Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, a billion dollar fraud. But how long can this alliance last? Tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Life is full of hurdles. So how do you keep going? On Hurtle with Emily Abadi, we're talking with the most inspiring women in sports and wellness,

from professional athletes, coaches, and Olympic champions about the challenges that shape them and the mindset that keeps them moving forward. At our level, at this scale, being able to fail in front of the entire, World. Like, I can do anything. I can do anything. Listen to Hurtle with Emily Abadi on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHart Women's Sports. Last night, a blown call changed a game.

This morning, the internet lost its mind. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. And every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headlines. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment,

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Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.