The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Roger Goodell, Rookies, Drew Brees, Dabo Swinney

Episode Date: June 8, 2020

Colin discusses why he believes Roger Goodell made the right choice by siding with the players, why he's for starting rookie QBs, his thoughts on the Drew Brees backlash, and why he feels Dabo Swinney made a mistake. Guests include Chris Broussard, Warren Moon, Justin Gaethje, and T. J. Houshmandzadeh. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the Look Back at it podcast. From 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 is big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down,

and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild. I mean, it was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, what's good, y'all?

You're listening to Learn the Hard Way with your favorite therapist and host Kear Games. This space is about black men's experiences, having honest conversations that it's really not safe to have anywhere, but you're having them with a licensed professional who knows what he's doing. How many men carry a suit or armor? It signals to the world that you not to be played with. And just because you have the capability that does not mean that you need to, listen to learn the hard way on the IHard radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for listening to The HARD podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1.

Find your local station for the Hurt at Fox SportsRadio.com or stream us live every day on the IHartRadio app by searching Hurd. Fox Sports Radio. Ah, live in Los Angeles, on a Monday, this is The Herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening, we are on IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS1. One hour from now, Colin Wright, Colin Wrong on a Monday. Yesterday, I was in a place that actually snowed on June 7th, Utah, and Joy Taylor is joining me.

It snowed for two hours straight where I was. and I thought, it's time to go back home to Los Angeles. I don't want to see snow June 7th. I'm over it. Yeah, you love snow, but just not in summer. Not in summer. Good to see you again. You too.

So it was a big weekend for the NFL. No games, no practices, but it was a big weekend. And Roger Goodell came out and did the right thing. And I'll get to that in a second. But here's Roger Goodell. I imagine somewhere in the basement of his house saying, I'm now going to align with the players. Here's the NFL commissioner.

We, the National Football League, condemn racism and the systematic oppression of black people. We, the National Football League, admit we were wrong for not listening to NFL players earlier and encourage all to speak out and peacefully protest. We, the National Football League, believe Black Lives Matter. By the way, many owners did not know Roger Goodell was going to do. do that. He did and should have, and here's why. For the last several years, three or four, since Colin Kaepernick took a knee, there's been this walking on eggshell thing with the NFL and Trump's Twitter account and players Eric Reid and Malcolm Jenkins and other players

talking about protests and it's walking on eggshells and the networks that broadcast games, this one included. Everybody is just hoping this doesn't have. and that doesn't happen, and I just don't think it's a healthy relationship. Finally, Roger Goodell took the power away from Donald Trump's Twitter account and said, these are my partners. I'm splitting revenue with them. I love these players. I have relationships with these players.

I'm not going to let anybody divide us. I'm on the player's side. I'm on their side. we have a president whose brand is division. It's over. He'll be gone in November. He will. And he can divide people on his Twitter account.

But Roger Goodell said, no, time out. I don't want to walk on eggshells. It's the right thing to do for humanity. It's the right thing to do with my business partners. And frankly, it's just the right thing to do. Support the players. I don't know exactly what the NFL player-owner split is, but owners make more, but players make like over-furt.

40, 45% of the revenues, I believe. Sorry if I'm wrong. Probably should have looked that up. But if you're in a business with people and they're valuable and you like them and this fear-based stuff that, well, if the players protest, they don't want to blow the league up. It's their industry. It's generational money. The NFL players, they don't want to blow the league up.

They just want to be heard. And, you know, here's the thing. It's easy. I mean, Twitter makes a living out of this. Gotcha. You said this six years ago. You said this nine years ago. You said this nine months ago. I'm over that. If you want growth and Roger Goodell showed growth, it's very hard to demand perfection. Derek Jeter didn't wake up hitting 300. He struck out a lot. And that's just sports. We're talking race and human beings and social justice. These are delicate topics. And it takes, not everybody learns at the same. speed. Bill Maher said this. Bill Maher, HBO, you know, he's one of those crazy old liberals. He actually said during Michael Sam, when Michael Sam got drafted, the gay NFL player and kissed his partner. And everybody freaked out. And Bill Maher said, not everybody learns at the same time. It's okay if one or two fans were a little shocked. They'd never seen it. Had to take a

deep breath and then can respond. Never forget. One of my favorite presidents of all time, I've always told people my favorite presidents are Reagan and Obama. Nobody can figure out why. And for different reasons, I like their leadership abilities. But Obama's first term is president. And I think he's one of the smartest presidents we've ever had. He was opposed to gay marriage. And at the time, I remember thinking, smart guy, bad take.

And then he listened and he learned. And that's how growth happens, is that you don't hear enough angles. You don't listen well enough. I thought Roger Goodell, and he's been criticized for years as a commissioner, and I keep saying this, he's not stubborn. He's not rigid. He's always been willing to the rules, the television business. He listens to players. Too much of this stuff that's going on in America is sphere-based.

I've been watching CNN. I'm old enough. You've probably been watching it 20 years. I've been watching it 30 years. We're having a revolution in this country. other countries I've watched CNN for 30 years on revolutions they don't look like ours

99% of ours are peaceful protests I mean I'd be honest with you 99.9% of protests for our revolution have been peaceful I watch CNN it's not always like that there's too much fear out here

you know I was talking to my daughter about this I mean really for the entire weekend with my family it's not called only Black Lives Men It's Black Lives Matter. Your partners in this amazing sport of the NFL are just asking, will you listen to us? Will you hear us? We're partners.

We're not looking to end the league, just improve it. And Roger Goodell, as he's done many times, he gets a lot of criticism, sat down and went, players are right, I was wrong. Just because you're over 50 doesn't mean you can't grow. I mean, Greg Popper, Greg Popovich, I think he has a military background in his 70s. He's constantly evolving. It's okay.

I don't know when this became a weakness. I don't know when we became so partisan that stubborn was smarter than evolving. I don't get it. It's not my DNA. It's just not the way I'm built. I have stronger and different opinions today on subjects from just two years ago. I'm talking about a couple subjects today that I just see the world differently. some people are never going to get it.

They're not curious. They don't want to read. They put their feet. They burrow in, and they're not going to move. But here, here for Roger Goodell. The only thing I would warn is that you don't get growth without some mistakes. You've got to stumble often to get to the right place. The NFL did.

And I thought it was a great weekend, actually, for America with a peaceful protest, kind of blown away by it. And it was a great weekend for. for the NFL. They took the power out of Trump. I want to work with my players. These are my guys. These are the guys on Sunday I'm going to battle with and I'm supporting. That's the way it should always be. That's now reducing, eliminating the power from somebody in the White House who's trying to be divisive and has everybody walking on eggshells. This morning to me, I don't feel the eggshells. That's my interpretation

of this whole weekend. I don't feel the eggshells. Let's talk about it. Let's support each other. I want to back my partners. Let me shift to this. A football topic. I am, and this is the way it works usually, I find some of these young quarterbacks, and I like someone I don't like others.

And, you know, I like Sam Donald a lot. Baker Mayfield drove me nuts. I like Tua a lot. Joe Burrow's good. I don't think he's good as everybody's saying. So Bruce Ariens is, is known in the NFL sort of as the quarterback whisper. He worked with Andrew Luck, and he's worked with, you know,

Ben Rothlisberger when they were young. So he has this great history of working with young quarterbacks and spotting the talent and elevating the talent. And he said this weekend, it's time, game one, let two a play. I figure out depends on his health. You know, if he's healthy, I'm playing it. I don't think you learn anything to hold him a clipboard. You know, had Peyton Manning his first year,

Andrew Luck, his first year. Dan was one of those guys that run in by accident because Tommy Maddox got hurt. But, you know, you miss all the practice reps. You miss the game rip. I don't know what you learned holding the clipboard watching. Now, this is one of these things where I believe I see it differently today than I did a couple of years ago. I think it's time to play to them. I was always somebody in the, you know, what's the rush on this stuff?

Bring them in, let them watch, let them play. But four or five things. are now happening in the National Football League. And they've happened over the last four or five years. And I've become more of a draft them and let them play guy. Number one, the NFL is now adopting lots and lots of college schemes. They didn't used to do that. So they're taking your college stuff.

Bring it with you to the NFL. Did not used to be like that. Number two is there's a lot of great young coaches, offensive in the NFL. A lot of really good coaching out there. Shanahan McVeigh's Cliff Kingsbury could end up being that. That didn't used to be the case. It was like the old, good old boys network. There's just a lot of kids now coaching. Like 30 years old to me as a kid. Number three is the rules are changing. They're almost all overwhelmingly offensive rules. It makes it much easier to be dynamic early. Number four is all these

young quarterbacks now have 100,000 reps by the time they're juniors in high school. Elite 11 camps, quarterback development camps. This group of quarterbacks last couple years, they grew up with that. The previous generations did not. But here's the other thing. Number five is because of the new collective bargaining agreement that was struck 10 years ago, you don't pay first round quarterbacks anything. What does that mean?

I can surround them for the next three years with all sorts of weapons. back in 2010, Sam Bradford came into the NFL. Rookie, never played a game, 78 million. NFL said, we can't do it. We can't pay somebody who's never played in the league the most in the locker room. The following year, Cam Newton number one pick, 22 million. The advantage, you can surround Cam with better players.

You could not with Bradford. You're not going to be paying Joe Burrow anything, to a anything. They're still not paying in Buffalo, Josh Allen anything. That's why they can go get Stefan Diggs. You're not paying Lamar Jackson anything. That's why the Ravens continue to sign and sign and sign good players.

Is that without the burden of this massive rookie contract, bring them in. You know now within 10 to 12 games, if they've got it or not. These kids have come in with so many reps, with such good training, with so much development, 10 11 games in, if you don't see it, you have got the wrong guy. Better to learn that in year one than in year two or year three.

Arizona found out quickly, said, wrong guy, boom, next. And it worked. So this is something I've literally changed my mind on. There's new legislation, new rules, new coaches, new CBA, and overtime, let them play. Let them play. You'll find out soon enough if they can or can. Coming up next, thoughts on Drew Breeze and his weekend as well. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio,

FS1 and the IHeart Radio app. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode we're cutting through the noise. breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines.

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Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so rapid. up in the chase, that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid?

Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking.

What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know.

I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history.

Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me. A, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her.

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Good to have you in. So it was, I took, I left after Wednesday's show. Drew Brees had a statement, and he got in a lot of pushback for being insensitive on his statement about the flag and the death in Minneapolis a couple of weeks ago. And I had, I was off. I was gone. So I thought this morning I wanted to talk about it again. The media to me, and I'm part of the media, and I've made this mistake before, I try to do less and less of this as I get older and I learn more. But the media often is into absolutes and extremes.

This person's the greatest. This person's the worst. Maybe those are easier columns to write and easier rants to make. I think context matters. I prefer to be measured. I think over time you look back, it's smarter. and I made my share, fair share of mistakes. Drew Breeze, before he said what got him in trouble,

had given $5 million to Louisiana for COVID, had won the Walter Payton Man of the Year, Sports Illustrated man of the year, sportsman of the year. That's his resume. And I do think context matters. He had been very supportive of his community in crisis. That doesn't mean he's got it all figured out. But I never considered Drew Bree's the world's greatest person.

I thought he was a solid guy, a great quarterback, a good human being that cared about others. And then I thought he was tone deaf. And then, and this is how growth works, he came out and apologized. I know there's not much that I can say that would make things any better right now. But I just want you to see in my eyes how sorry I am for the comments that I made yesterday. I know that it hurt many people, especially friends. teammates, former teammates, loved ones, people that I care and respect deeply. That was never my intention. I wish I would have laid out what was on my heart in regards to

the George Floyd murder, Ahmad Arbery, the years and years of social injustice, police brutality, and the need for so much reform and change in regards to legislation and so many other things to bring equality to our black communities. I am sorry, and I will do better, and I will be part of the solution, and I am your ally. I never thought Drew Brees was perfect, and I don't think he's Lucifer.

I think he's human, and he was tone death, and he learned what side to be on. What Drew did is something I'm a believer in. I tell this to my kids. I tell it to anybody who will listen. I've said it on this show so many times, Joey's probably done with it. This is not a great time for stubborn, rigid people. Let's worry about getting it right, not being right. Drew Brees, within a couple hours of being tone deaf, decided, I got to get it right,

not be stubborn and be right. And he moved to the right side on this. As Shannon Sharp on the show before us, talk to Drew Brees this weekend. who I don't consider this morning a hero. I considered him a solid, caring, giving human. And then suddenly I thought he was tone deaf. And then I listened to his apology, and I thought he was on the right side.

We in the media too often are building up people to be something none of us are capable of. Here's Shannon Sharp on Drew Brees. I don't believe one incident should rule. I mean, there are certain things that can, but I don't believe him saying what he said should be the end of Drew Brees. I believe he deserves an opportunity for redemption

because he's been too good in that community for let this one slip up undo 15 years of great service. And that's what I told him. I said, Drew, I'll be here. I said, my criticism was harsh. There's no question about that. And I understand that's probably why you're reaching out. But I wanted you to understand

not only the hurt that the community felt that I felt, I said, Drew, we need strong, white men, powerful, influential, like you, to help us get the ball across the finish line. And I say, Drew, I think you understand that. I think the blowback that you got was, I think it was deserving. But I also believe that you have a great heart. And I believe you will make right about the wrong that you spoke. If somebody says something I don't agree with, one of the first things I look at is, what is their life resume tell me? I mean, you can go to Google.

Everybody's an awful person if you go to Google. I mean, you can find anything about anybody and they've ever done. Drew Breeze's life resume, quality guy, who's tone deaf, and then decided smartly to get it right, not be rigid and be right in his worldview. Here's Joy Taylor with the news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news.

Jack Prescott and the Cowboys still have not come to an agreement on the contract extension, and Michael Irvin said on The Rich Eisen Show that he thinks Stack deserves a huge deal because he's been underpaid for the last four years. Has been not great, not great. That has been perfect. I mean, perfect. Not necessarily and wins and losses, of course,

but I'm talking about just the person that he's been, the kind of investment you want to make the kind of point, the kind of guy you said, man, we hit it. We hit it with this guy. We got him in the fourth round. So you stole the fourth. years. You stole four years. So whatever you get, he deserves. Now, I do understand where he's coming from.

Dak has been underpaid based off of the performance that he's given being a fourth round draft pick. However, that's not how you generally want to do contracts. You want to pay someone what they're worth and what in a salary cap situation. Going forward. Going forward, what you project them to be. Now, also, everybody can't be paid what they're worth in any sport, even without a salary cap. Oh, that's right. There's just certain players that their value cannot actually be measured. I mean, if you win, if you win a division as a quarterback of the Cowboys, you cannot be paid enough in the current infrastructure of the NFL salary cap because of the marketing.

The reality is it's the same. If LeBron wins a title with the Lakers, you just don't understand. The value of that for the league is 100. could be $50 billion. For the Lakers, it's a billion dollar win. It's a billion dollar day if they win the championship for global marketing. So, DAC is worth something. It's just, is it a $35 million something or a $30 million something? Again, I've always been on the side that DAC deserves to get paid.

And I don't think that there's many people, unless you're just completely out on DAC being the franchise quarterback of the Cowboys, who don't think that he deserves to get paid. I, again, just feel like he should get this deal done before the seats. and starts because what I would hate to see is him playing under the franchise tag and God forbid have an injury and then that long-term contract then all of a sudden is no longer available. Now, DAC is extremely durable, but, you know, these things happen. So I want to see DAC get paid, but within the reason that's going to allow the Cowboys to move

forward and be successful long term. I don't know what exactly the holdup is with Dak because to me it seems like a very reasonable contract based off of the success that he's had. but I also see DAC as the franchise quarterback for the Cowboys moving forward. I mean, they don't really have a backup plan unless you believe that Andy Dolan is capable of being franchise quarterback for the Dallas Cowboys. Not long term. I do not. Yeah.

So, Bronk is joining a strong, tight end group in Tampa Bay with O.J. Howard and Cameron Brayt. And Bruce Ariens is planning to make good use of all three of them this season. He told the athletic that he loves the 13 personnel formation, which features three tight ends on the field together. He said we have a package, and if you don't know how to stop it, it can hurt you. Very interesting. You know, Ariens has not been a tight end guy. If you really look at it, if you just go wide receiver tight end, Tampa Bay's got the best unit in the NFL. I mean, listen, Brady didn't just like decide he wanted to go to Tampa for the weather and jet skis.

It's seeming less and less random. Yeah, it's not random. Like this is two, I saw a ranking a couple weeks ago where they had Chris Godwin ahead of Mike Evans. I think Mike Evans is a top 10 player in the league. They are, and they have, they have, I'm trying to think of the tight-in. OJ is OJ Howard from Alabama? He was going to leave, and then Aryans talked him back to staying plus Gron. They have five minimum elite people.

Now, Gronk's elite for, as a blocking titan, he's still elite. Brady knew exactly what he was doing. More and more, Brady knew exactly what he was doing. Well, O.J. Howard didn't have a huge season last year. He blocked on about 15.5% of it. which is much higher than Cameron Bray, who only blocked on about 3% of his snaps. So I'm interested to see how they use Gronk as far as blocking goes, because he did have the year off and has now had to rebuild his body. But we know that the influence that he had is last year playing before he retired was those key moments.

And he did serve as a blocking tight end. So I just think that Tampa is going to try and take advantage of the cerebral elements that Tom Brady brings to the team. and all those years of experience and years of experience working with multiple tight ends, obviously. Like, you remember the Aaron Hernandez days with Gronk as well. So I don't want to get too far ahead of myself

with Tampa Bay. But I just think that people are really discrediting what Tom Brady is going to be able to bring to a team that was right on the edge, like without the mistakes that James Winston had. I don't get the doubters here. It seems so obvious. They need, this team needs efficiency.

That's all they need. Just give them. I mean, you could, in my opinion, you could put Andy Dalton with this team because he does throw a ton of picks and they would be a nine and seven team. What's Brady going to be? Like, James's issue wasn't productivity. It was, I mean, pick six after pick six. It's inconsistent. If you were, if you had, you know, Teddy Bridgewater was rumored to get this Tampa job.

And I think both of us said he's perfect. If you take the picks out of Tampa, they're a 10 and 16 with the same players. Just take the picks out. And Tom will. I think he's going to take him to another level. So Connor McGregor announced his retirement from the UFC on Saturday night. again. He posted to Twitter, Hey guys, I've decided to retire from

fighting. Thank you all for the amazing memories. What a ride, it's been. Here's a picture of myself and my mother in Las Vegas. Post one of my world title wins. Pick the home of your dreams, mags, I love you, whatever you desire, it's yours. This is the third time. He said he's retiring from UFC. Dana White said he's not surprised.

He said that's Connor. You know how Connor works. That's how he does things. He has a record of 22 and 4. I don't... Is he a side show now, or do you like watching him as a boxer. Which is he to you? I mean, I would like to see him continue fighting as a UFC fighter. I don't want to see him as a boxer again. And at this point where I thought most certainly before the pandemic that this was trending towards another, a rematch with Mayweather and

himself. Now, Mayweather did come out and make a comment about it and basically, you know, But he's three and three in his last six bouts. This is what I'm saying. I want to see him get back to UFC, but I don't know how good he is anymore. It seems like his career just took this huge turnoff with the Mayweather fight, which I was okay with. I mean, it's a huge payday. It was great entertainment. We all watched. It was a great, great sporting event.

But then he came out after that and got smoked. Right. To me, this whole retiring on Twitter thing, like I read it normally when someone of McGregor's caliber retires on Twitter, it's a big deal. I was like, oh, that's happening again. Yeah. And how convenient it's on the night of the U.S. I'm just wondering if he's become 6040 side show. over fighter.

Because, like, by the way, Dennis Rodman and 98 with the Bulls became 60-40 side show. Previous to that, he was like 70-30 player with a little side show. But when players get older and they want the money still in all these sports, I check out when I feel the side show has eclipsed the productivity as you're... Right. And particularly in the fighting game, you need to have a side show in order to gain the interest. Like, that's a little. That's a big part of what's made McGregor, what he is, is he is a completely polarizing

dynamic promoter of fights. But is he a dynamic fighter anymore? Well, that's kind of the problem. Yeah, I think he's got one more fight. Like, to me, I'm giving him, he's got me as a television consumer, one more fight. He's three and three in his last six. If he loses, if he fought Justin Gagie and lost, I'm out. Like he's got.

I would agree with that. Yeah. I'm giving him one more fight. I'll pay for UFC for one more McGregor fight. Then I feel like you're manipulating me. Well, also, when it comes to fighting, I think all of. of us kind of see it in the fighter, that moment where it's like, uh, all right. Like you had, you had your time and then it's kind of over. And especially in UFC, it's, it's such a bad

scene when a fighter has, has walked off the cliff. Like, nobody wants to see that. Yeah. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd Lye News. Chris Broussard, NBA guy for Fox Sports, been covering the NBA since 1995. That's 25 years. And I'm not even good with math. Former New York Times guy as well. Let's bring in Chris Broussard via the Coward Global Satellite Network brought to you by Mercedes-Benz, the best or nothing. All right, here we go. 22 team format, Chris.

22 teams. You down with it or not? I love it. I think they got it right, and that's hard to do in this situation. But you didn't bring the teams there to have nothing to play for. That helps you in safety and other ways. And every team that's there has a shot. And a lot of guys that were free agents, a lot of guys that were very agents, a lot of guys that were

veterans, they didn't want to play in meaningless games. You also got the eight regular season games, which will give teams time to get in some semblance of game shape and develop some semblance of chemistry before the real important game start, which is the playoffs. So I like it. I think the play in will be fun if they end up having it. So yeah, the NBA got it right. Okay, now, this could affect different teams differently. If you look at the 22 teams, And let's talk about the teams that are the four or five that can really win this thing. Is there a team, Chris, that you believe benefited from two months off? Without question, Colin, it's the Clippers.

And they were my pick to win it anyway. But look, they were arguably the best team in the league already. They beat the Lakers twice, the only team to do that once they beat them without Paul George. And they were that good with their best players going in and out of the lineup. Kauai Leonard missed 13 games, Paul George missed 22, Pat Beverly missed 16, Landry Shamet missed 17. Imagine how good they'll be with their top players playing consistently now. The chemistry will be better. It was decent already, but it's going to be that much better.

The other thing, Colin, is we know they are headed for a collision course with the L.A. Lakers, okay? that playoff series under normal settings would have essentially been seven role games for the clippers because the lakers in l.A even when the clippers are technically the home team are going to have the crowd now that home court advantage is wiped out completely and the lakers have no home court and obviously there's no disadvantage for the clippers so i think those two things benefit the clippers and make them the favorites this in this when this thing resumes.

One thing you and I always disagree on and it's an annual event now is MVP. You like, you see valuable as different. LeBron's my runaway MVP. You have a vote. Who are you voting for? I can just guess who it's going to be. I'm disappointed in you, Kyle. And obviously LeBron's having a great season.

I understand why Skip Bayliss is saying LeBron's MVP because he wants it to set LeBron up when they don't win the fighters, he can rip him, right? But you, I'm shocked, Colin, we are not grading on a curve, okay? I can't, I'm not taking into account that LeBron's 35 years old,

that he's playing in his 17th season, that we've never seen a guy played this well this late in his career. That doesn't matter. What matters is who was the most valuable player on the team. I gave you my criteria last year, two years ago, an age or

place in career was not one of them. So Janus is clearly the MVP. He's going to win it. And ESPN did a poll in March of 70 writers and 60 of them voted for Janus. So he's going to win the MVP award as he should. And look, the one caveat in this that I would give you with your line of thinking was if LeBron had never won the MVP. then you might say, wow, he's been so great, let's make it a lifetime achievement type thing. But LeBron's won four of them. And many of the reasons he won them are the same reasons for Janus. In Cleveland, he didn't have a second star yet they had the best record in the conference or even the league. You know, things like that.

Janus is doing the same thing. So he deserves it. By the way, you said you're not going to count LeBron's history in his age. but when Westbrook won it, history was used because nobody'd ever done what he achieved. And if I think if you, I think, I think in both cases, I'm not voting LeBron, the MVP because of his age. I'm saying he was asked to change positions. He has been asked to play virtually with an entirely different set of players. And their chemistry was seamless a week into the season where the clippers can't even quite get the chemistry right.

I don't think it's history play. Janice has got the same group of guys playing the weaker Eastern conference. It's been an easier year to dominate. I think the challenges for LeBron are at the paramount of my argument. What say you? Well, first of all, yes, he's technically playing a different position, but let's keep it real. LeBron's been a point guard, point for his entire career. And so it's not that much of an adjustment for him.

And then one of the new players, Colin, is Anthony Davis. I mean, come on. You got a top five, six player in the league with you. And look at it. Look, LeBron is clearly the Lakers MVP. There's no doubt about that. However, he only leads the Lakers in assists. Anthony Davis leaves them in points, rebound, steals, blocks, P-E-R.

Like, I wouldn't argue for Anthony Davis as the MVP, but that just shows you how valuable he's. is to the Lakers. So people have talked about LeBron took a team that wasn't in the playoffs last year. And now look at him. Yeah, he got Anthony Davis. And then there's some other good veterans like Danny Green and others. All right.

By the way, Kevin Durant says I'm out. I convinced you. No, not really. I can go 10 minutes on this. I just think I don't even care about history. All I know is this. You and I and me and most every media person in the country, we disagree on the word valuable.

Like I think Tom Brady's value, some of it is just when he goes to the line of scrimmage, he's seen every defense. He'll put all of his teammates in the best position to succeed. I can't measure that with a stat. I always say this about presidents. They never get credit for the disasters they avoid. I think LeBron's not getting credit. This Anthony Davis thing, if LeBron wasn't unselfish, it could have been like, you know, animosity and envy,

and it doesn't work, and how come you're hurt? LeBron's just lubricated all of it, like he lubricates everything. You and I just disagree. We don't disagree on the argument. We just disagree on the word valuable. Well, how about we make LeBron executive of the year for getting AD there? That's fair. Well, that is.

By the way, KD said season's over. I'm shutting it down. I'm good with it. Your thoughts? Look, I'm not going to criticize KD because he has to feel right, not only physically, but mentally. And players always, when they come back from a long-term injury, have to overcome that mental hurdle. And if he's going to be out there second-guessing himself,

not comfortable, thinking too much, hesitant, that is not good for him. And that could lead to an injury. And I think for him, the mental hurdle is even harder because he came back last year in the playoffs. This is essentially when he would be coming back this year in the playoffs. So look, I get all of that. And part of it wanting KD to come back was selfish as a fan.

Like, man, it would be a great story to see KD and Kyrie out there in this truncated tournament that they're kind of going to have. But I would say this, Colin, if I were in KD's shoes myself, I would go down to Orlando with the Nets and work out. If the doctors say I'm 100%, and in March he was going 5 on 5. If they say, look, you can go ahead and practice with the team and see how you feel, I would practice with them. See how I feel physically, mentally, go hard, 5-1-5.

And if I felt good, then I would be willing to come back. That's me. I wouldn't just say, well, I didn't plan on coming back this whole season, so I'm not going to change it out. Everything's changed with this virus. Like the season would have been over. Dominique Wilkins, Colin, came back after the Achilles' injury. It was like 283 days later he was playing

and playing awfully well, average 30 points a game when he got back. Chauncey Billups was like 296 days after his Achilles injury. He returned. DeMarcus cousins was like 380, something around there. Kevin Durant, if he played July 31st, it will have been 417 days since the injury. Now, again, I'm not going to be too critical because you've got to be right mentally. but I'm just saying if I were in that situation and I'm ready physically and I can get my mind right,

I'd play. Good stuff. Chris Broussard. Good talking to you, buddy. All right, Colin. Hang in there. All right. Yeah, presidents never, any president, they never get credit for the disasters. Same with parents. They avoid.

I try to convince my kids all the time how a great a parent I am. Just dad walks in and solves everything. I've never convinced them of that once. Coming up next, Dabo Sweeney, getting some. Heat is it deserved? That's next. I heard. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened.

That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls,

we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it.

And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth, or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely.

And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way. Open your free, our heart radio app, Search Learn the Hard Way and listen now.

Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jay. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down,

and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack all day, but just so you all know. I mean, at this point, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now.

Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys?

This is Clever Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What?

Time out. Quarterback on office, Blue, 42. A rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's he at? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. We're apart these days a lot.

We're sharing more. Geico's sharing more, too. Geico Giveback, 15% credit and car and motorcycle policies, both current and new customers. Full term, too. Geico.com slash give back. More info and eligibility. Dabo Sweeney's probably the most popular football coach in his region or state in the country. He's made Clemson of Power.

He and Nick Saban right now are probably the highest paid, the most coveted. Football coaches in America, he's a very, very good football coach. He's built a great program. By and large, from what I know, which is very little, he keeps the same assistance year after year after year. There's not a big turnover rate, so he's probably decent to work for. He also recruits very well, and players don't abandon the program, so I imagine most players like him a lot.

Most coaches like him. Again, there's not a huge turnover rate. You go, you commit, you play. People say nice stuff about him. But one of the things I've learned about life is when people have power, the more power you have for the longer time, it's much tougher to relinquish it. And nobody has more power in college sports than the popular college football coach. And Davos Sweeney right now has more power than anybody in college football, except maybe, maybe,

Nick Sabin. So over the weekend, there was a picture taken with Dabo's Sweet. wearing a shirt, football matters, not Black Lives Matter. I'm not asking him that he has to wear a Black Lives Matter shirt, but I don't think this is appropriate and here's why. Now, it should be noted, football matters is a slogan that has been used for years by the National Football Foundation, which he's part of. He's used that phrase before in speaking, football matters, and also used it three years ago

in a speech at the South Carolina State House about the quality of football and how it changes young men, his quarterback said he's been wearing that shirt for months. Fine. I just don't think this is the week to wear it. It comes off as obstinate. Okay? I'm not asking everybody to protest.

But here's a guy who reads the room. He's one of the great recruiters of all time. When you recruit, it's walking in and reading the room. Reading mom, reading dad, reading the son, reading the daughter, you're reading the room. You're kind of figuring out, okay, what matters to mom, what matters to dad, what matters to the recruit. Oh my gosh, he's got two daughters or two sisters.

Recruiting is all about reading the room. Dabo is great at it. I don't think in this instance, college coaches, especially the local Southern football coach, they have so much power. I mean, we've heard a lot of these coaches in college sports talk about COVID over the last couple of months, oh, stop talking. Now, a chef knows food. So I don't ask a chef about the GDP of Yemen. I don't generally ask a college football coach about social justice, but a big part of coaching is mentoring young men. You're often almost a surrogate father. And what matters to

those players is the lifeblood of your entire program. I don't mind him wearing the shirt. This week feels obstinate. It feels like it's a rigidity bubble. I'm used to it. I've seen it my entire life with college coaches. But I prefer Tom Herman at Texas coming on my show last week and addressing Black Lives Matter this way.

To see the pain and the struggle and the fear, the confusion, on my players' faces, we've got to find a way to stop. We've got to find a way. The thing I told our players is this cannot be like it's always been. Two weeks from now, three weeks from now, a month from now, a year from now,

this has to have meant something. We have to have affected change by not just our words, but our actions. Coaching is teaching, This week, there have been a lot of teachable moments. I just don't think it's the week to wear that shirt. All right, hour two coming up, Colin Wright, Colin Wrong. It is a Monday.

And it is The Herd. One more Herd? The Herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHard Radio app. Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Last night, a blown call changed the game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened.

That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear.

The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants. answer. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it.

And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust.

I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keer Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Do you remember when Diana Ross

double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English.

Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but yeah, yeah, literally. But just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now.

I'm going to finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me, he goes,

Hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Quarterback on office blue 42. Hey, rec, my mama wants you to wave at her. What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clifford show on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

Here we go on a Monday. in Los Angeles, this is The Heard. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening, we are on IHeart Radio, we're on Fox Sports Radio, we're on FS1. It is great to have you in today. He took a couple of days off last week. The sports are coming. It's just going to take a while.

We've got about another month here to figure out what we're going to do while. Sports are getting prepared. Joy Taylor is joining me. Joy, how are you? I'm doing good. What did you this weekend? Just relax a little bit. He needed a little

chill time. A little chill time. But it was a nice weekend though. Yeah, snowed where I was. Wasn't as nice. My dogs love the snow, though. I'll tell you that. Snow in June.

They're fascinated by it. Well, every Monday at this time, we do Colin right, Colin wrong. I have strong opinions. Hold myself accountable when I whiff. So here we go. Where Colin was right? I've been a fan of Roger Goodell.

I've met him a couple of times. And I think one of the things I like about Roger Goodell is that he is not rigid and stubborn. He is not perfect. I thought he whiffed on domestic violence. He is not perfect. But the league has grown by over 50% revenue since he took over. And I thought this weekend and last week coming out on the side of the players and acknowledging the NFL wrong was something that's very hard for a lot of people to do for their records. he did not tell all the NFL owners.

For the record, I would guess, at least 50% of the owners voted for Trump. So I think Goodell's taken unfair criticism. Listen, the NFL's powerful. It doesn't really need the media. Media people like to feel needed. And the NFL doesn't really need the media other than its broadcast partners. There's a lot to me of projecting anti-Gadel this and that. I thought he had a great week.

where Colin was wrong. So the NBA didn't change one damn thing. They had all these formats out there. I liked all of them. Nope, all smoke, all talk. I whiffed on all of them. In fact, they're not even going straight to the playoffs. So they're not even creating urgency.

They're going to do eight regular season games into the playoffs. And I'm sure the Lakers, who were six games up, they just can't wait to play eight regular season games. I mean, it is what it is. players want to be healthy. Players want to play a bunch of regular season games, so they're not too tight with the playoffs. But I thought we were going to get several deviations of what we had, and we got none of them. Where Colin was right? Well, I've changed my mind through the years, but I've said I think Tua is special and Tua needs to play early and yes, Bruce Ariens, the quarterback

whisperer said this weekend, I've had Big Ben, I've had Andrew Locke, I had him with their kids, and this kid is ready to play. There's nothing you're going to learn from a clipboard. And I got to tell you, I think he's right. I think the kids got an it factor. I think he was the best high school player. I think he was the best college quarterback when he was healthy. And Bruce Ariens agrees, what is the point?

These days in a passing league, you will know very early if he's right or if he's not and get him out there. So Bruce Ariens is on our side with Tua. Where Colin was wrong. This is exasperating. Pro football focus came out last week with. their top 50 NFL players, and Carson Wentz was not listed. They had six other quarterbacks, not Carson Wentz.

6-4-240, athletic, huge arm, second only to Mahomes in terms of like arm talent, went 4-0 down the stretch with his number one receiver being Greg Ward, 101 passer rating down the stretch. The team had cluster injuries on the offensive line and wide receiver. spots. Cluster injuries. He had 27 touchdowns and seven picks last year. Does my television have a camera, a Carson Wentz filter? Like, what am I watching that nobody's seeing here? You could have made an argument. He was easily the MVP of the league in the last month of it. When you have O line issues, when you have wide receiver issues, and you can go 4 and O down the stretch with a passer rating over 100,

I do not get it, but pro football focus looks at their numbers, and they don't like Carson wins. Where Colin was right? I have my questions about his talent as a quarterback, but I've always thought DAC is above average off the field. This weekend, he gave a million dollars to police training in Dallas. It's kind of classic DAC, let's help fix the problem. Now, he's gotten blowback for some of his takes off the field on Kaepernick and such. But I do believe that when you're a quarterback, it is better not to inflame situations. And what he is simply saying is, we got a problem in police departments, and I want to help fix it.

And a million dollar check is a substantial check when you've yet to receive a big one. So I thought it was the Dak Prescott that makes me believe he can be a franchise quarterback. He is willing to lead. He is willing to have opinions. He is willing to take stands on big issues. He's never shied away. And to me, whether I agree with you on all of them, that's the leadership quotient I think he strives with.

Where Colin was right. Oh, that's funny. Zion's now playing basketball. He will be back. Isn't it interesting? The NBA chose a 22-team format that just happened. happens to include the 10th-seated Pelicans. They could have done 20 teams.

That would have been too obvious. So they stretched at the 22, so guys like me won't say, you just did this to get Zion into the playoffs. And they're right. This is a star-driven league, and this kid is just built to be on television. Between the platform in college, the shoe controversy, his smile, his game, his personality. Listen, he is special. You can't teach stardom.

It's not just about your game. It's how you deliver it on multiple platforms. And the NBA, what do you know, found a way to get Zion in to their remaining season. Where Colin was wrong. I have been almost dismissive of the baseball media for freaking out that we're not going to have a season. To me, it's just optics and leverage. But I will say, even respected baseball media, this weekend looked pessimistic.

I thought the owners saying, let's have a 50 game season was just a shot at the players. I mean, you can't go from 162 games to 50. That is just kind of mocking the sport. I am not as optimistic today. We're also looking at a calendar issue. Basketball's played indoors.

You can play it anywhere, anytime, anywhere, right? Baseball's not. You get into November. It's not the same game. It's just not. And now you've got the MLS going, the NFL going, college football going, major golf going. Like, I'm sorry, baseball you have wasted six weeks on this stuff. Six weeks.

And the worst part, it's not been about COVID, which I would get. That's been the NBA's thing. We're worried about COVID and the players. Health. This has just been about money. Bad look. Where Colin was right. Two more people last week endorsed Jimmy Garoppolo.

Trent Williams, their new left tackle, said, I've been in this league a long time. that kid got to a Super Bowl. He's awesome. And Kyle Shanahan said, I think he has a chance to be an all-time great. I want to remind people, can we just talk numbers for a second?

I'm not a big numbers, arguer, but I'm going to throw stuff at you. 21 and 5 is a starter. Let his team to a Super Bowl and led in the fourth quarter. But here's what's amazing. Last year, on a team that's really known as a power team,

he had 102 quarterback rating, completed 69% of his throws. that is in the toughest division in the NFL. Also had major injuries at wide receiver and offensive line last year. Again, it's like Carson Wentz. And I'm not saying he's Carson Wentz. I don't get the Jimmy Garoppolo stuff. Is it because they could have acquired Brady?

Is it because Joe Montana was there? Is it because Kyle Shanahan? Anybody can win with Kyle Shanahan. Folks, 21 and 5 is a starter. I'm out. I win. I'm over it. Let's stop arguing about it.

26 starts, NFL. That would be impressive for all but like Clemson's quarterback. 21 and 5? That would be good for like Michigan's quarterback. USC's quarterback. This is the NFL quarterback in the toughest division. And finally, where Colin was right. I used to work at another company and I used to make fun of James Dolan,

owner of the Knicks, and he called that company and complained about me because I called him a meatball. I'm not taking it back. He's a bad owner. He seemingly was the last or need. the last NBA owners to talk about the protests. He initially came out and said, we're not qualified to discuss it. And then a day later, he said, I condemn racism. Oh, boy, we could have said that a couple of days earlier. Listen, I feel bad for New York basketball fans, because I think it's an unbelievable basketball city. I just don't think he is obviously financially qualified to own a

basketball team. I can't argue with that. But I feel sometimes Nick fans are held hostage by somebody that just never really gets the temperature in the room, doesn't understand his fan base, doesn't understand the league. I mean, who's the next coach this week? Who's their GM? Seriously, they've gotten, they've had good people, they've gotten rid of good people. I thought, not shocking,

they didn't handle themselves well publicly on Black Lives Matter. All right, Colin Wright, Colin wrong on a Monday. Warren Moon, see, I grew up. I always tell the story with Warren Moon, so I grew up, little boy, hard to imagine. And at one time I was a naive little boy. And I was just getting into football. It was the mid-70s.

First game I ever watched as a kid that I remember was the Dolphins, Washington Redskinned Super Bowl in 1972. It's the first game I remember on a black and white TV in my room. My mom, I had a little bunk bed downstairs in my room. And then I remember watching Wilk Chamberlain. I think Brent Musburger did the play-by-play for CBS. I think he did. I'm aging Brent.

But it was Wilk Chamberlain with a headman and the Lakers playing the Portland Trailblazers. It was a Sunday game. I've tried to look it up. Portland came from way back to win the game. And believe it or not, I've Googled that trying to look up the game. And then I got into college football because I lived in Washington State, and Warren Moon was the quarterback of Washington. It's kind of when I fell in love with college football.

And I've said today, if Warren Moon, and you go back and look at his YouTube stuff in college, if he was playing college football, he'd be the number one pick. He'd be the number one pick. He could run. He was big. He had a huge arm. And he had to go to Canada to play. and then he dominated the CFL.

That's the route he had to make to play in the National Football League. Institutional racism exists. That's why we're having the Black Lives Matter movement. I'm going to bring on Warren next. Talk to him from time to time, and he'll be joining us coming around the corner. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app.

a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context,

and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsSlice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me,

your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough.

Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross. Because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust.

I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keer Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black. people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do a little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jay. And I'm Alex English.

Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so you all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people.

Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up guys? This is Clever Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me, he goes,

hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Parker.

Listen to the Clifford show on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Wednesday night on FS1, NASCAR Cup Series racing is live in primetime from Martinsville. Then Sunday, NASCAR hits Miami for the Dixie Vodka 400 at 3.30 Eastern on Fox. Both races are also available on the Fox Sports app. Good stuff. I told you about Warren Moon. I grew up as a Washington Husky fan.

Warren Moon remarkably went undrafted. Then he went and dominated the CFL like no player ever has. Five Grey Cup champions. He was an MVP. He was there, Tom Bray. then he went to the NFL, played 17 years, and was a pro bowler in nine of them. And now he is a Hall of Famer, and he is joining me live up north in Washington State, where he was a college football star and a lot of his football career started via the Coward Global Satellite Network.

So let me ask you about the Drew Breeze situation. I like Drew, his resume shows, Katrina, COVID donations. He's a good guy. I thought he was tone deaf. And I liked him calling out Trump because I think it matters. what Michael Thomas and Malcolm Jenkins think, not a divisive president. So I was for it.

But do you think everybody will be back? Do you think everybody buys into the apology? I like the first step, but you tell me what will play in the locker room, Warren. Well, I think it'll come back. There's no question about it, but it's going to take time. And I think it'll happen faster in the locker room

than it will outside, say, with the fans and with the public, because those guys in that locker room know who he is. They've gone to work with him every day for the last, how many every years those guys have been on the team. They've seen the work that he's done in the community not only with what he does, but also with some of the other guys' charities that he support it. So this guy is a true leader in that community, but he did make a mistake by not being more open to what was going on with his teammates. And it was all about his thinking as opposed to thinking outside of the box and what other people's perspectives might have been. and that's too bad. You just didn't think a guy like Drew Brees would be that close-minded.

But one of the great attributes for leadership is being able to admit you're wrong and change your opinion. And that's exactly what he's done. But like I said, it's going to take a little time for some people to get over it because those were some pretty strong statements he made right after. You know, I've always thought Roger Goodell is a good commissioner. I don't think he's stubborn. Now, I think there are situations he's struggled with. But, you know, the late David Stern was a great commissioner. He created a new basketball and didn't give the players a heads up.

Commissioners make mistakes. It's hard to be a president. It's hard to be a CEO. It's hard to be a commissioner. It's a fluid situation. The world's changing. I thought Goodell had a good weekend. Your view on it.

Yeah, I thought he did, too. You've got to remember Roger works for 32 other owners who kind of, you know, give him his marching order. So even though he might think a certain way, he can't always go out with what his feelings are because he has other guys that have other ways of thinking as well. And, and, you know, Roger was brought up in a very liberal household. I think his dad was a senator. So he has more of a liberal way of thinking where a lot of those owners in that ownership group are not that way. A lot of conservatives, a lot of Republicans. And so he has to navigate through all of that. But I thought he did a great job of delivering that apology. And again, leadership starts

with being able to say you were wrong. And he showed that he was wrong, admitted that he he was wrong and it feels like that he's going to get more involved of what his players are doing as they go forward. So that's all you can really ask for at this point. Now you just have to see if the proof is in the pudding. You know, when I look at your career, and I could be wrong on this, so correct me if I am, but you have every reason to be better. You spent five years in Canada, where you literally, like no player in the history of the sport up there dominated. You had five years taken away from you because of things we are now, people are now marching for. You've never come across as angry about it.

But when you go back and you were dominating the CFL and you knew you were watching the NFL and you knew you were significantly better than 90% of the quarterbacks, why weren't you bitter? What in you allowed you to just head down, keep working, I'll get my chance, because I'm not sure I'd have that in me. If I wasn't allowed to at least pursue, you were undrafted, pursue my dreams. You know, I think a few things. I think first, you know, watching my mom, the way she took care of our family when my dad died when I was seven years old, she could have quit and become bitter with the fact that she was left with six kids and no husband, but she didn't. She kept fighting.

She went back to school and reeducated herself, started working, and took care of our family. And I think I kind of watched that and saw how she took, took everything under her responsibility and made the best out of the situation. So when I was dealt my hand, I went ahead and said the same thing. I'm just going to do the best that I possibly can. And if that opportunity comes for me somewhere down the road, I'm going to be ready. And one of the great things about that situation was we were winning. When you're winning championships every year, it really erases a lot of homesickness. It erases bitterness.

this, it erases the why me situation because you're winning. And that's what you play football for is to win championship. So as long as we were doing that and I was being paid well, I didn't have a whole lot of reason to be too bitter. You know, I said, I've changed my mind on something. I used to be a believer in. You draft a quarterback. You sit him for a year.

And then you play them. And I think I've changed my mind, Warren, for a couple of reasons. Number one is they're taking the college schemes and letting the quarterback in the NFL now have a lot of his college schemes. I think the offensive coaching in the NFL is better. You dealt with a lot of defensive coaches. Now it's all about offensive coaches. The rules are now offensive.

The CBA allows you to draft a quarterback in the first round. Pay them very little and then surrounded with a bunch of good players. So you can tell very early. Guys got it or guy doesn't. I am for playing Tua early. I don't think I would have been five years ago. What say you on what's happening in the league at quarterback, what would you do with a Tua or a Joe Burrow?

Well, I think like you said, these quarterbacks come into the league a lot more prepared to throw the football than back in my day because they're being coached by quarterback coaches all the way back to maybe junior high school and up through high school. They have all these passing league camps. So they come in a lot more aware of how to throw the football of different coverages and things that they're going to see when they get to that level. But I think it really boils down to what you have around a player.

and if he has good talent to work with, that's going to help a young quarterback, so it takes some of the pressure off of him. And if you look at the young quarterbacks in this league that have had success early, it's because they were surrounded by maybe a great defense, maybe they had a great running game, and that really helped them.

So that's going to, I think, depend, I mean, that's going to determine what happens with Tua. What do they put around him in Miami? Because I always think that a guy should wait a year or at least through that first year. You look what happened with Patrick. Patrick Mahomes. They didn't play him until I think the last game or two of his first season, and then he had a chance to come in the next year. And what did he do? He wins an MVP award.

So I think you don't always have to be in a hurry to put these guys on the field because you could ruin their confidence very early if things don't go right because they don't have a lot to work with. By the way, finally, Joy and I have talked about this. The Buccaneers have three tight ends and two great receivers. You said a couple of years ago, and you played forever, How long? When were you, were you 43 years old when you were tired? How old were you? Yeah, I was 44.

I played 23 total. In an era when almost nobody got to 38. So you said a couple years ago, Tom Brady's deterioration is coming. So let's talk about that. And when you sensed, you may have not said it publicly, but when you knew you could always make the throws, but the knees didn't feel the way, same way. Your back didn't feel the same way. Give us your thoughts about Brady.

yourself and that age thing? I still think it's remarkable what Tom is doing, and he's still playing really good football, but I can see, especially as it gets later into the season, and you can see this with Drew Breeze and some of the other quarterbacks as well. Their arms don't have the same pop at the end of the season that they had early in the year, and that has to do with their age, and that's something I started to see in my career when I got older that I didn't have that same pop in my arm, and a lot of it has to do with your legs, because you just become fatigued over the course of a whole season.

And you saw Tom's arm that same way at the end of last year. So, yeah, it's not a huge deterioration to where he can't throw certain routes, but there will be times when it gets late into the year that you're going to see some of that start to take its place. So he has great talent around him, which is great, and he doesn't have to do as much on that football team, which will be good for him at this stage of his career. So I still think he's going to have success because of those reasons, but he is not the same quarterback he was three or four years ago. Warren Moon, it's great talking to you again, very professorial in those glasses.

So I can see, too, you know, that helps. Good to seeing you, Warren. Great to see you as always, Colin. Take care. All right, the great Warren Moon. It's really amazing. He played a 44. In an era, like 38, you were a gray beard. It was over. I mean, that's something.

Joy Taylor with the news. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Well, we're just talking about Tom Brady. He's making a very strong impression on his buck's teammates, according to Mike Giardy. Brady has been the Pied Piper for Tampa Bay and is bringing new energy to the team. He's reportedly been lighting up Zoom meetings with intelligent questions and a lot of personality. Oh, really? That's it.

And he's already established himself as the leader for the rest of the players. Okay. And he has organized some unaffected. official workouts with some teammates in Tampa as well. We saw him out of it. So he's crushing Zoom meetings. Crushing Zoom meetings, yes. That's a story.

I'm not saying you shouldn't do the story, but it's Zoom meetings. Well, I think there's a little something to this. One, I think it's kind of a, I mean, obviously they weren't doing Zoom meetings last year at this time. But there's something to him. Players are already feeling like he's the leader and they're feeling, you know, attracted to the things that he's saying in a Zoom meeting, which has become our, you know, personal way of communication for meetings.

You know, obviously, obviously, then doing conference calls, there's a little bit more of a personal element to him because you're seeing everybody. I think that's something. It's, I mean, we've always been on Zoom meetings at this point. It is, you do have to be pretty compelling to cut through. I was on a Zoom meeting a month ago. and the best guy was drunk

until he was so funny that he dominated the Zoom meeting. I don't know what kind of Zoom meetings are on Tom. Most of the Zoom meetings that people are happening, they're not really encouraging you to be drunk on.

Okay. I'm just, I'm skeptical of Tom is crushing Zoom meetings. That's what they're saying. They're saying that the players are already, you know, they're getting behind him. They think he's the leader

of the team already. All right. I think it's a good thing. So eight team seasons are over after not being including in the restart in Orlando for the NBA and according to Woj, at least seven of those teams have expressed interest in getting league approval for organized offseason activities. Some of the proposed ideas are voluntary and mandatory workouts for two weeks in July, regional mini camps in August that include joint practices and televised games.

OTAs in mid-September and the opportunity to start training camps for next season earlier than the teams would be that are in Orlando or that would be in Orlando. So Atlanta, Charlotte, Chicago, Cleveland, Detroit, Golden State, Minnesota, and New York. are not going to Orlando for the 22 team restart, obviously. The Warriors were the only team not mentioned by Woj as having expressed interest in off-season activities. That doesn't mean that they're not interested, but those are the teams that have come out and said that we want to do this. I actually think this is a good idea.

You know, it's been a very, well, it was an abrupt stop of the season for all the teams. So these teams that are going to get to go back to Orlando, get back in playing shape, playing games, even if they do get knocked out of the playoffs, are going to have that workout and that ability to play basketball again at a high level, whereas these other teams haven't gotten the opportunity to get the teams back together, to get back in shape.

It's going to be a big gap. This is obviously what most of these teams feel, between not playing from the shutdown to whenever the season, whenever next season's preseason activity starts again. So I actually think this is a really good thing for those teams to do. It'll provide some extra concept, but more importantly, it'll keep their players throughout the rest of the year in basketball shape, which is a big deal to all the players,

which is why they're going back early. So there's been some speculation that Kevin Durant could be able to play when the season restarts in July, but he shut those rumors down, confirming that he will not suit up when the Nets get back on the court. He told the undefeated, my season is over. I don't plan on playing at all. We decided last summer when it first happened

that I was going to wait until the following season. I had no plans of playing at all this season. This has been kind of thrown out there, Even before the shutdown that if Kevin Durantz is healthy, will he come back and play in the playoffs? I don't think he should. I think it's just, you know what? Just sometimes just there's no, what's the value? I mean, like Chris Broussard said earlier, he's had like 400 days off.

They're not winning the championship. Like, let's just wipe it clean, get stronger than ever, stay hydrated, make sure it's all good. To me, there's no value to rush him back. They're really, they're not a championship level team. I don't, you know, it's just like it's, it's, what's the point? What's the upside to this? You come back, have a couple good games. The downside is you aggravate something.

I mean, I guess the upside is you get your, you know, you get some games under your belt and get your confidence back. You can, you know, start leaning on that foot again and feel like you're, you know, ready to play basketball again at a high level. Mentally coming back from an injury is just as important as physically coming back from it. But if he's saying he's not going to finish the season, he's sit this one out. He should, no matter how long. this season goes. I mean, we're not

expecting the Nets, obviously, to go to the finals. But again, I've always felt like this season for the Nets was just, it just is what it is. Like, they've still maintained their a reasonably high level of play despite the fact that they've had injuries through their three stars. So, like you said, what's the value of them coming back?

When everyone is healthy, when you have KD, when you have Kyrie, and you have everything set in place, then go. We already saw what happened when you rush KD back. It's not a good thing. Not a good thing. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Heard Lye News.

T.J. Hushman's orders around the corner. This is interesting. So Michael Irvin was on Dallas radio and he was talking about Dak Prescott deserves back pay. You know, and I've said before, I'm just, I have DAC contract fatigue. I'm over the story. But one of the interesting things about DAC is it is really hard to evaluate DAC because he got so many breaks coming into the Cowboys. If I said to you, okay, it's essentially the opposite of what Joe Burrell has now.

But if I said to you, okay, here's what a quarterback needs to succeed as a rookie. Protection. He inherited the best offensive line in the league. A running game. They drafted Zeke the year he arrives. A patient head coach with experience. Jason Garrett was patient. to a fault.

Hey, is it possible one of his coaches could be a quarterback in the NFL formerly? Oh, that was Jason Garrett. Number six, a division with a couple of rebuilding teams, Giants in Washington. And finally, could you get him in weapons?

They've had weapons. They had DES and they have Witten and they had Amari and they had Randall Cobb and they had Michael Gallup and it's hard to evaluate him. It's much easier to evaluate somebody like Andrew Luck who comes in and other than the teams rebuilding in his division,

had a battle line and a defensive coach and didn't have a competent GM and didn't have any weapons. And went 11 and 5, 11 and 5, 11 and 5, and made the AFC championship. That's very easy to evaluate. He's great. Carson Wentz last year. Very easy to evaluate.

He's almost perfect in the last month with nothing to work with. To me, with Dak, I've never seen him for a season without everything mostly aligned. So is it DAC or is it 30% DAC and stuff around him? Remember, Andy Dalton won a lot of games in his first five years and got to the playoffs when the Bengals had a great O-line and Andrew Whitworth protecting his butt. Andrew Whitworth left at left tackle.

They never found a replacement and Andy Dalton plummeted. I'm not anti-Dak. I've just never seen DAC without everything aligned for him. LeBron James' career. He got a bad owner to start and a bad franchise. And then he went to Miami and the Wade Bosch thing could have blown up because they didn't really fit together. Then he goes back to Cleveland with needy Kyrie Irving.

And then he comes to Los Angeles. I have seen LeBron just overcome and win and overcome and overcome and I'm not saying DAC is LeBron. But I think Dak's hard to evaluate. So many things have lined up well that I think he could be B to B plus. but I don't know. Tyron Smith missed a couple of games left tackle. Zeeke was out. He was bad.

Priy Amari Cooper. He wasn't very good for a year. I don't know. One of my favorite guys, T.J. Hushman Zata, joining us next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying,

and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports slice brings you closer to the action, with stories told by

the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark.

Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, We get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on Earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid?

Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keir Gaines, as we have real. conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way. Open your free iHeartRadio app.

Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English.

Each episode, we pick you. you here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack all day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack, so I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now, so.

Then you're finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important, you know. year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history.

Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game.

This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me, he goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? quarterback on office blue 42 hey rec my mama want you to weigh better what where's she at hey miss parker

listen to the Clifford show on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast Casper has everything you need to build a dream bedroom now Casper offering free contactless delivery as always free returns go to casper.com Casper.com for more information. One of my favorite guys played in the NFL for over a decade. I covered him in college, T.J. Husman Zada, who is joining us now via the Coward Global Satellite Network.

So let me ask you how, if you were a New Orleans saint, and you like Drew Breeze, he'd throw in the ball to you a lot, he'd been a good community guy, then he comes out, says what he says, and then he apologizes. When you woke up this morning, if you were a teammate of Drew Breeze, Would you accept the apology? Where would you be emotionally in your relationship with Drew Brees this morning if you were a wide receiver for the Saints? I'd obviously be disappointed. That's no question. You would think, think about this.

When Cap Nailed it was 2016, four years ago, Drew Brees actually has nailed himself. So you've in essence had four years to come up with an answer to a question if you or never asked. And that's the answer that you come up with in you. That wasn't even the question that was asked. That's just what you wanted to say. And so that was disappointing. I feel like his apology, it was a public relation thing. He didn't understand all the hate that was coming his way. So let me throw an apology out there. We're teammates. We're going to move on if I'm on in New Orleans States. We're going to go past this. I don't know Drew Brees personally. Those guys in the locker room,

They know how he is. So they know his DNA. They know what he's about. And so when he made that comment, they know if the apology is real or not because they know exactly what type of dude he is. But for me, I was taking the back. I was shocked because he didn't come off as being that type of guy. But I'm a firm believer in your mouth speaks what comes from your heart.

Yeah. You know, it is interesting. I said earlier, we, demand growth from people, but we can't demand perfection. And because to grow, I mean, I think I'm a better broadcaster today because I've made a bunch of mistakes. Does Drew Breeze's resume matter that he's been a good person? I'm not saying it has to, but to you, do you think, listen, his history is good dude? Does that help him at all in this?

100% it helps him. And that's why you're willing to look at his apology and say, is it sensitive? sincere because of what he has done and the impact he's had on that community. And again, his teammates know the Mike Thomas is in the Kamars and the Kamjorn. They know what type of duty is. And so I know Drew Brees. I do not know him personally. And that's the thing where we can sit here and try to judge.

But I don't know him personally. Again, his teammates, it will be interesting. They're going to have to start the season well. Because if they don't, then in the back of their minds, some of their better players, they're going to have that thought. And so it sucks. But 100% they can move past this. It's how do they move past this and the steps taken along the way. Roger Goodell is not perfect.

But I always think he has good intentions in mind even when he makes mistakes. It's hard to be a president. It's hard to be a CEO. it's hard to be a commissioner. It's a leadership position. Leadership is imperfect. I thought he had a good weekend. Did you buy into his shift on the supportive players?

I did. And the reason I did is when Roger Goodell became a commissioner, I was actually on a committee. If you would recall this, we're getting in a lot of trouble down in Cincinnati. We're kind of the postal boys for it. Yeah. And so he gives me a call.

He wants me to. participate in this committee that he was forming. And I did. And we had some calls. We met together. I got to know, Roger. And he's sincere. He's about the league.

He's not about a team. He isn't about a player. He's about the league, the NFL. And so he's doing what he thinks is best for the NFL. And he sees the plight of the African-American person in the world. The league is made up predominantly African-Americans, black players. And so he can't, nobody can walk in the shoes of a back player. You don't know when you're driving down the street and the sheriff gets behind you,

we're licking a rear of your mirror tons of times. I know I do. And for other people, that's a different experience. And so for Roger to come out, say what he said, it was refreshing. But Roger is always, for the most part, I wouldn't say always. But for the most part, he's always done the right thing when it comes to issues like this, whether they're popular or not. Well, I don't remember.

When you played a TJ, were you vocal about social issues or not? I don't, you're the kind of guy that could handle it. Like Malcolm Jenkins clearly cares. He can handle it. He's good in the room with multiple people, an owner, a GM, a coach, a player. Were you vocal? I wasn't vocal about these issues. These issues weren't a topic of conversation at all.

And when you say, was I vocal? I mean, I was vocal about a lot of things, practice, practice, conditions. A lot of things that occurred, you know, that you go through on a team, I was very vocal about it. But these social injustices, they weren't an issue when I was playing. I actually wish they were because I don't know what I would have done, but me being a type of person that I am, I would like to think I would have been on the front line of this. Do you think players will kneel now? I mean, do you think that'll become a thing now? What's your takeaway on that? If you listen to Adrian Peterson, yes, I'm not 100% certain.

I don't know what kneeling is going to do, but the word is out. The word is out now about what's going on. Everybody's on board. And I'm a realist, Colin. You need cooperation in order for there to be progress. Is that cooperation going to come at the local and estate level? local levels to start implementing change. It's going to take some time. It's not going to be an easy road. Nobody in power wants to get power up. And that's just the reality of it. And so it will be interesting to see how this plays out. But it's long overdue. We've been discriminated against in so many different ways. I mean, you just, people condemn Kaepernick. And he was well ahead of the curve. And he wasn't the face guy that everybody wanted him to be, oh, why hasn't he coming out saying this? That's not what

he wants to do. That's not how he's going to lead this. And we wanted him or people wanted him to lead it, how they wanted him to lead it. And that's not what he wanted to do. Do you think we're going to see change? I watch this weekend. I'm a 55-year-old white male. I was really captivated by the protests. I thought it was remarkable. The last three or four days, I thought spoke well of America. But that's my view on what I watched. Do you believe there's real change coming? It's hard. It's hard to say. Again, you brought up Malcolm Jenkins. You got guys like him that's in the league and he's at the forefront of this. He's leading to charge and you got former players like Anne Quimbo. If you can get, the key is you have to get the popular white

players to be with you because when they're with you, then they want to understand the problems. And again, there's so, there's so many different things that it doesn't matter how much money you have when you be in profiled. It's happened to me numerous, numerous times while I was playing and especially now that I'm not planning. So I believe there will be changed. It's going to be gradual and it's going to be slow. Maybe not as quick as some would like. But as long as people keep this energy and it's peaceful, change will come. It's just going to take some time. Well, T.J. I love having you on. And T.J., by the way, has been for the last year, you know, he's rebuilding a house and his marriage is still strong today, which speaks

speaks volumes of the quality person, rebuilding a house for a year, and still he and his wife love each other. That is amazing, my friend. Yeah, we're getting along pretty well, man. I can't complain. Just a long process. I will say that.

Good to seeing you, T.J. Collin, I appreciate it, man. Take care, man. All right. Good dude. Really, really good dude. And by the way, he says something, which we've talked about time and time again.

And I'm not saying this for any other reason that it's a real thing. Every African-American male that I've ever asked that's been on my show, and I would say one out of five I ask off the air, they all have the same thing. It's just different with police for us. Why would they make that up? Why would they make that up? I've known TJ for years. Why would he make it up? There's no gain in it for him. In fact, he's never brought it up to me until that. Not once. Not once. All the years I've known him. We talk about family life off the air. T.J.

and I talk, we go deep. Not one time. Why would he mention it now? Okay? Believe people. Get your free credit card today. If you're not a Discover customer, include your FICA credit score. Learn more. Discover.com slash credit scorecard. Limitations apply. Joy, we're through to

Justin Gachie last hour. The next UFC star. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd. Weekdays and noon Eastern. AM Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHard Radio app. One of the things that's great about sports is the stories of the people in sports. And whereas a Peyton Manning or an Eli Manning have a father who was an NFL quarterback and Ken Griffey's dad was a baseball player.

And then there are stories where people have doubters and critics and don't get breaks. And you're not even sure physically if they're designed to be great. Justin Gaichi had vision that was so bad that he had to have corrective surgery so that he could see fighters. The story was, and sometimes it can be embellished and I'll ask him, he was a great high school wrestler. His family was in copper mining where people regularly work 80 and 90-hour weeks. He escaped that, wanted to go to college, had all sorts of critics in the copper mine and says, I'm going to do something different. Goes to the UFC, not initially.

So he ends up, you hear a guy's name, he ends up fighting Tony Ferguson. Wasn't even scheduled to. It was supposed to be Tony Ferguson and Abeeb. But Abe's from Russia. They had travel restrictions. Wouldn't let him fight. So he gets inserted into this fight against Tony Ferguson. Nobody thinks he's going to win except Justin Gaichi.

And he systematically takes him apart for five rounds. and he's joining us now via the Coward Global Satellite Network. So it's interesting, Justin, because I watched you, and I sat there that night, and I'm like, you know, the old saying, this guy is tougher than a bag of wrenches, man. He is just bomb after bomb. My first thought is you were a profoundly great wrestler in high school, a two-time state champ, Arizona.

But when I watch you, you don't wrestle. You go toe-to-to-to-you want to fight. So explain that. Shouldn't you be more inclined to wrestle because your great wrestling skill? I mean, on paper, maybe, but the one way for me to get out of a wrestling match fast was to pin my opponent. I was never there to go to the whole match. Now the quickest way out is to knock them out. So that's, that was, I guess, where my theory started.

And then, you know, the energy consumption that it takes to wrestle for 25 minutes, The college wrestling match is seven minutes long. These are 25-minute fights, and I used to be able to barely walk off of a wrestling mat in college. So, you know, that's an aspect. And I'm crazy athletic. You know, my coach was a striking coach. First time I ever started striking was nine years ago. And, man, I picked it up fast.

I'm crazy athletic. And, you know, I'm really good on my feet. I'm really good at striking. I was really good at defensive wrestling. So it's hard to take me down. I use my wrestling in there to keep them. in my comfort zone, which is in my feet now, on my feet. You are the interim lightweight champ.

A lot of people, myself included, I think you are now. Obviously, Connor McGregor is a heavier weight, welterweight. He would come down. Does it even interest you? Because he is a star, and the pay-per-view would be big, and it would introduce you to a lot of people, Justin, that don't know you.

if the fight was offered for Connor, it could be very lucrative for you, but would it be interesting as a fight for you? Yeah, I mean, you know, it's something I've actually had to, you know, when I sit around my family and run the two scenarios by them, you know, everybody is like, you know,

fight Connor, make the money. But my theory is, when I be Habib, Connor's still going to be there, and I will make, you know, four times as much money. as if I was to fight Conner right now. I want to bring,

I want to fight for the title. I have the interim title. When he got the interim title, he fought Jose Aldo right away. That's how this works. I want there to be a way that it works. You know, he tries to throw a wrench in this whole process, and I want to,

I want to legitimize the process. You win the interim title, you fight for the title. If you win a, if you win a fight, you fight someone ranked in front of you. who's a fight, you fight someone ranked behind you. You know, there has to be a process. So that's more important to me right now than the financial side. The financial aspect's there.

I'm going to make a lot of money versus Habib. And then I'm going to make a lot of money after I beat Habib. You know, Joy and I'm a partner here. We're talking this morning about Connor McGregor, I feel like at this point, it's 60% schick and 40% fighter. I don't. He's lost. He's three and three in his last six fights.

Do you respect him as a fighter today? Does he concern you? Do you think you match up well? Or do you think now he's just loud? It's all about selling pay-per-view and not really about the fighter because he's deteriorated. I mean, I think he possesses some incredibly good skills. I mean, he's so fast. His timing is awesome.

You know, his distance management, his confidence. Those are all crucial things in there. But, no, I have no respect for him as a fighter. He's trying to skip the process. You know, he could have fought me. You know, everybody knows it's becoming more and more known that he could have fought me. He chose to fight Cowboy. And now he's in this predicament.

You know, this was something he could have avoided by fighting me. You know, we were both available. I was looking for a fight. He was looking for a fight. And there needed to be a number one contender to fight the winner of Habib and Tony. That was supposed to be me and Connor, but he decided not to do that. And those are the facts. I was tweeting him.

I have, there's so many examples. You know, I seem like a little, a little whooped girl calling him out because, you know, I was in, he was ranked ahead of me. I was, you know, when I started winning again, I thought I deserved people in front of me. And that was the fight to make. He chickened out, man. There's no doubt about it. There's no doubt in my mind that he chickened out. And now, now he sees it passing him by.

He's an attention whore, man. He really loves attention. He's begging for attention right now. he saw Dana White laugh at him when an interview was told, and if you were told him that Connor said he was going to fight Gaci next, and Dana laughed. If you're Connor, you know, that can't feel good. I would say you're obviously one of the best pound-for-pound fighters.

In fact, I think you're ranked in the top 10. Habib is 28-0, I believe, and he may be the best fighter, Justin, I've ever seen in UFC. He's a combination of a lot of different things. Tell me, you're the expert here. What is it about him that is so unique? I mean, it's tenacity. He's so tenacious in the fact that he, you know, there's a fence,

360 degrees around you. If he could put you against the fence, then his game is going to work. It's almost impossible to keep him from taking you down on the fence. If you watch a lot of his fights, he has problems, taking guys down out in the open. He had problems with Iyatita for a little bit. He's had problems in a few fights.

So the key is to use my athletic ability, my striking ability as far as my feet, the way my feet move and work to stay off the fence and use my wrestling defensive ability that I have worked on my whole life to stop him. And then I hit like a truck. I got crazy, dense bones. I got to kick his legs,

the lower calf kick, four or five good kicks and you almost can't use your leg. So that's going to be crucial. Yeah, I didn't know about the whole bone density thing, but man, when you punch... Oh, I got crazy dense bones. Whatever you got...

Whatever you got, bro, it's just a... It's a sack full of wrenches and hammers, man. It's just... I have a question, though. There's a story out there that you had really bad vision. And you really... It's almost like the man upstairs did not give you on a break on this stuff.

How bad was your vision that you had to have surgery? How bad was it when you first thought? So my entire childhood, you know, growing up until I was 27. 27 was when I got my surgery, 27 and a half. And it was terrible. Playing baseball, I think I could have been a lot better at baseball. I was near-sided in one. I am far-sided in the other eye.

So it was a constant, you know, trying to find range. And finding range is the most important thing when it comes to fighting. So I really had to get my hands on my, you know, I was constantly feeling for the head. I tended to poke people in the eye, you know, maybe more so than usual, because I was constantly having to find their head. And when I couldn't find their head, if you used to see, I used to cut my hands up and just go high guard, because if they're punching you, you can also determine range.

And so that was my method. It's taken me, this is, I think I've had six, seven fights now with my new eyes. And it's, it's been a process. It's been hard to, hard to understand and hard to take in and really accept it. But, you know, now, now I'm comfortable. And it really is life in general, you know, going hunting, going to the outdoors, seeing a swarm of gnats hovering, seeing mice went across the road down in Arizona, the craziest things.

But yeah, I had very bad tissue. Justin Gachie is joining us. He has not been in the UFC this long. He is a rising star, and he is a fighter's fighter. You know, when I watch UFC, I think to myself, when you walk into the octagon, can you sense that a guy is afraid of you? Do you know he's apprehensive? When you're at the way in, before you come into the octagon,

Do you have a sense of how your fight's going to go? You know, for me, it's a little bit of a game. I'm constantly telling, you know, I would never tell myself they're afraid of me because, you know, that would be false confidence. I can't get something I can't control. What was I going with that? That's okay. Take your time.

Are you, I know. When you walk into a ring, have you ever been, have you ever been nervous? You can't put anything into something you can't control. I'm constantly telling me out there stronger, better, faster he's going to kill me in there so that way whenever the bell rings

it's a natural it's a natural process for your body to go it's fight or flight and you know there's these chemicals that just flood your system it's adrenaline and to be able to be comfortable there you can't

you can't have anything being a factor it's just being present so there's no nothing about my opponent that I'm thinking of. The second I step in there, I do not take my eyes off of them. I look them in their eyes. And as soon as they don't look me in the eyes, I look their coaches in the eyes.

And every single time I've sensed something. This time, Tony, you know, took him about 10 seconds. He looked away from me. And as soon as he looked away, I knew that he wasn't as bad as everyone says he is, pretty much. Well, that's actually a fascinating answer. So you actually come into there thinking he's better than you. So that fuels your adrenaline that you're going to get beat or humiliated if you're not totally focused. That's the opposite of what I expected for an answer.

Yeah. No, I'm going to, if I don't allow myself to go there, then I'm dead. It's over. You know, it's me or him at that moment. It's, you know, someone breaks into your house in the middle of the night. You have a wife and children. you're not going to hesitate. You better not hesitate.

And that's the adrenaline that flows. That's the natural course that your body will take to protect you and protect your family. And that's something that I've been working my whole life to find comfortability. That's great. That's one of the best answers I've ever had on this show. That is absolutely fascinating to me. It's a great answer. Justin, the highlight, Gachie.

When are you going to officially fight again? When can I watch you again? When do you think it is? September is my plan. That's what I have in my little book. I'm going to 12 weeks. Right now I'm taking about a little a month off, you know, trying to just relax and get myself ready to push myself like I need to push myself again.

But I think in September, me and Habib have the same manager, so pretty much, you know, whatever we want. Absolute pleasure meeting you, talking to you. I think you're a remarkable story, man, and good luck to you the rest of the way and your family. Thank you, man. I love watching you. I'm very impressed always of how intelligent

and how much information you can retain. Thanks, Justin. Get back in the Octagon, man. We want to watch you. Yes, sir. Thank you having me on, man. You bet. You bet.

Isn't that a fascinating answer? That was the opposite of what I thought. He's like, I come in there with fear that if I'm going to get humiliated. I've never heard a fighter say that before. It's just great. I'll tell you that, that has a chance. Habib and Gachi of being the best fight in history of the UFC.

I'm not joking. Those guys are different styles. I mean, tough. You know, I'm finesse. I don't even, I watch these guys and I'm like, how do they, how do you take the punches? I mean, it's a lot of things. Calus, he's talking about bone density.

I mean, you've played sports before. Yeah. So you've run into guys who are necessarily bigger than you, but they're just not really, you know, they're not. They're like country strong. Right. And then you run into a guy that's, that maybe isn't that big, but you can't, you can't move them. They're just built different. Yeah.

All right. Let me read this before I give the mic to you here. Get your free credit scorecard today, even if you're not a Discover customer. Learn more, Discover.com slash credit scorecard. Limitations apply. Joy, tailored with the news. No, no, no, no. Turn on the news.

This is the herd line news. I think also, you know, you have to be willing to get punched in the face or kick to the face or knee in the face or elbowed in the face. And that takes a certain type of mentality. Like you have to be simultaneously courageous, fearful, brilliant, and skilled. Like, you have to be everything. Yeah, and be willing to get punched in the face while you're trying to do the same thing to the other person. I would, listen, I've, the idea that I could host a show while getting punched in the face seems so outrageous to me. Well, I mean, they're not being asked to host a show, but yeah, like, you know, they are, you have to execute a plan.

So in the NBA, some have expressed their concern with the unhappiness about finishing the season without fans at the games. Rockets coach Mike Dantonie does acknowledge it's a big deal to play without fans, but it actually could be a blessing in disguise. Some guys, I think, will form even better without the pressure of fans doing that. If you're on the, you know, you don't have home court advantage. Is there a home court advantage now, no. So if you're not the higher seed, maybe that's advantage for the lower seat. You know, some guys respond to just practice and go out and competing more than, oh, the lights are on. Here's the fans.

They're on you. It's something that will be fun for the fans to watch, fun for us. coaches to evaluate players maybe differently, but definitely interesting. You know, Denver, to me, gets jipped because Denver in the high altitude, very good home team. They're a young team. So Denver's young teams tend to be more emotional. Right. And so they're better at home.

The young teams can struggle on the road. That's why the Lakers this year were so great on the road. It's an old roster. The older of the team, the better generally the team is away from their comfort zone. The LeBron-Bosch Wade teams were great on the road. Denver, young, great at home, done, no home court advantage. Like that's where I see Denver could be a team as much as I like them that could get shocked in the first round. I think it's just going to be really unprecedented for a lot of reasons.

Not just like the fans not being there creates, obviously it eliminates the energy and traveling to your home court and having your court be your home court and your own locker room and your own process and all those things will be changed. So you have to consider that. I think the visual aspect of not seeing the stands full will have an effect on players because that's like whether you're home or away, there's people there. So there's a depth thing with shooting and everything that I think will be interesting. So I wonder if they'll cover the seats at all, if they'll have media in those seats, like how they're going to address that.

The other thing is the sound for the broadcast. For UFC, it was weird. But once I watched a couple fights, I was like, I don't really mind that I'm. there aren't fans. I honestly, I don't need fans. No, I watched the card this weekend. I'm so into the fighters. Right. And the commentators. I've been to UFC fights. It's great. But on television, if you give me good announcers and fighters, and by the way, the mics are so close to the athletes, you can hear everything. You can hear their feet move. Right. But I don't know how that's going to, how that's going to work for basketball, because the announcers are going to be there.

So, I mean, how the close to the court, we don't know, but you're going to be able to hear a lot more. there's more players. So that could be interesting for the broadcast too. So Gardner Minshu transferred schools a few times during his college football career. And he says the constant moving prepared him for dealing with the limited off season in the NFL this year. When I was at Washington State, this was kind of a similar thing because I wasn't there for the spring. So I had to do a lot of it on my own as well. But I mean, we've been fortunate.

We're meeting every day with Coach McAdoo, Coach Gurdon, the other guys in the QB room. I think we're all helping each other. and, you know, getting, you know, as good at work as we can. And then I think you have to take it, take ownership on your own as well. He not only plays like Baker Mayfield. He looks a little like Baker Mayfield. Does he not? He is.

Similar, like, facial hair. Somebody out there in the blogosphere. Go get Gardner Minchew's college career numbers and NFL numbers and Baker Mayfields. They look alike. They're literally the same size. They look alike. Their styles alike. They talk alike.

They play alike. He is the Baker Mayfield down in the sun. I swear to God, I think that's his comp. He's not as abrasive as Baker is. No, but he's kind of got a style. Baker has a style. He does have a style. Yeah, and Gardner's got a style.

I find the kid fascinating. If Gardner's drafted number one and Baker is where Gardner is, are we just, they both played under the same offensive system. Baker played with much better personnel at Oklahoma. expectations change everything, of course. I think if Baker wasn't the number one overall pick, we wouldn't be as hard on him. And that's not Baker's fault that he's number one overall fake. He shouldn't apologize for that.

But that just is what it is. Gardner and Baker both had to move to different programs. One ended up going to Washington State. One ended up going to Oklahoma. But it's amazing how similar their styles and life stories are. Gardner looks like he's changed his body up a lot this offseason as well. Jack. He looks different.

Yeah. So Lamar Jackson has the operational. opportunity to do something only the Manning brothers have ever done. Lamar is one of the 31 quarterbacks that have gone to in their first two playoffs since 1950. Of those 31, only Peyton Manning and Eli Manning went on to win a Super Bowl afterwards. So two have. Eli and Peyton. Yeah. Well, Lamar's going to be in a lot of playoff games. Well, yeah. So, I mean, that's kind of the point of the statistics. Like, if you can struggle in the playoffs earlier in your career and then move on to greatness.

But, I mean, Eli Manning and Peyton Manning are both Hall of Famers, right? So, like, of the other 31 quarterbacks that have done that, are they at that caliber? No. I mean, Lamar Jackson, we're not calling him a Hall of Famer yet, obviously, but he is incredibly talented. And if he continues down the path that he is right now, he most certainly will be a Hall of Famer. He's 19 and 3 in the regular season.

God, his highlights, they almost look like college highlights because he makes guys miss so badly. Like, generally in the NFL, a corner won't. miss badly if he miss tackled. If he misses on a tackle, he gets an arm on you. He has incredible, incredible body control matched with speed that you don't necessarily see with quarterbacks usually. I can't wait. His ability to stop and change direction is something that you really usually only see with wide receivers and, and amazing running backs. Yeah. I watch the highlights. I think Baltimore is my favorite to get to the Super Bowl and win the

Super Bowl, and I think their roster now. First of all, their secondary is easily the best in the NFL, along with the Chargers. Those two secondaries don't even look like everybody else's secondary. So they've added pass rushers. Man, I'm telling you. They're going to be a problem. They're going to be a problem.

You can talk about Joe Burrell. That guy's going to dominate that division, and it's not going to be close. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd-Lie News. Chris Brousard and I differ on the MVP. I like LeBroni, likes Janice. He'll join us next to talk about that. And Warren Moon joins us. How will the Saints players respond going forward to Drew Breeze? That's coming up.

Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the IHard Radio app. Spending more quality time with our family, so invest in something that's great for them in the summer. A rec tech grill. Rectechgrills.com with an S built by grill. for grillers. You can use your phone, you're driving home. You can turn the grill on. Then you can check the meat. That's what it sounds like. Actually, phones don't make noise, but I just thought I'd add to the commercial endorsement. So, you know, the MVP of the NBA, because we're going to start the season back up,

and then you're going to have eight regular games, and then you get into the playoff. So you can only count the regular season games toward the MVP nomination. So it's essentially decided. I would take LeBron because I do, believe with presidents and athletes, quarterbacks, guys like LeBron, you never get credit for the problems you avoid. And the fact that LeBron has changed positions,

changed teammates, changed coaches, change, and he just makes it all work. Chris Brousard's got to vote. He's choosing Janus. Here's why. We are not grading on a curve. Okay? I can't, I'm not taking into account that

LeBron's 35 years old, that he's playing in his 17th season. that we've never seen a guy play this well this late in his career. That doesn't matter. What matters is who was the most valuable player on the team. Look, LeBron is clearly the Lakers MVP. There's no doubt about that. However, he only leads the Lakers in assists.

Anthony Davis leaves them in points, rebound, steals, blocks, P-E-R. Like, I wouldn't argue for Anthony Davis as the MVP, but that just shows you how valuable he is to the Lakers. So people have talked about LeBron took a team that wasn't in the playoffs last year. And now look at them. Yeah, he got Anthony Davis. Well, there's only going to be eight regular season games when they start July 31st into the playoffs. So the MVP is overwhelmingly decided.

I think it'll be yonness. But I really, it's not an age thing. I'm not using history. I just think what LeBron has done with this new cast. I mean, Joy and I said it the first week, we're like, oh, the chemistry works. Like overnight. I don't even think the Clippers have great chemistry yet. I don't have anything to do.

I think they're the best team, but I thought the chemistry play by LeBron was largely overwhelmingly due to LeBron's ability to make everything work all the time. Meanwhile, Warren Moon, the Hall of Famer came on earlier. I left after Wednesday's show, previously scheduled a couple days off. So I did not have a chance to kind of respond to what Drew Brees had said. I thought he was tone deaf. I thought then he figured out it's better to get it right than be right. and he shifted his position, which I think is important. It doesn't matter what the president has to say.

If you're Drew Breeze, it matters what Michael Thomas and Malcolm Jenkins say, they're your teammates. And quarterback's a unique position. I asked Hall of Famer Warren Moon earlier, how do you think going forward? Are players going to respond to Drew Breeze? Do you think he got him back? How's the relationship at this point going forward work? It'll come back. There's no question about it, but it's going to take time.

And I think it'll happen faster in the locker room than it will. outside, say with the fans and with the public, because those guys in that locker room know who he is. They've seen the work that he's done in the community, not only with what he does, but also with some of the other guys' charities that he support it. So this guy is a true leader in that community, but he did make a mistake by not being more open to what was going on with his teammates. And it was all about his thinking as opposed to thinking outside of the box and what other people's perspectives might have been. And one of the great attributes for leadership is being able to admit you're wrong and change your opinion. And that's exactly what he's done. But like I said,

it's going to take a little time for some people to get over it because those were some pretty strong statements he made right after. Yeah. You know, a lot of this stuff, Joy, you and I have talked about this. It's if you are proven to be wrong today, social media is just relentless and punitive and nobody wants to be wrong. So people dig their feet in and I'm, this is what I believe, and I'm going to be right. And I'm not saying Drew Brees did that. I'm just saying social media has made people more stubborn because if you are proven wrong, the avalanche of hate comes flying down in social media and people are just relentless. They're anonymous. They don't care. They say awful things about you. But I never thought Drew Brees was the greatest person. And after his comment, I didn't think he was the worst. I think

in context. I think he's a good, solid guy, a great quarterback who was tone deaf, corrected it, and I'm willing to give people a second chance. That's kind of the way I operate, you know? Yeah, I think it's, to your bigger point, you don't have to be right about everything.

And in this situation, what are you gaining from digging in on your position? You get like extra donuts or like what is it? What are you gaining other than some strange satisfaction that you have held on to your point for longer than everyone else.

Like it's okay. Let go. All right, I'm hungry. I'm going to go get a sandwich. You love sandwiches. You know it snowed where I was at yesterday. That's built up a hunger for me, an outdoorsman. We'll see you tomorrow. It's the hurt. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind.

And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. In every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment,

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