The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Steelers, Lakers, Le'Veon Bell, & the Herd Hierarchy

Episode Date: September 25, 2018

Colin discusses why the Pittsburgh Steelers are so frustrating, why the Los Angeles Lakers should have low expectations, which teams should go after Steelers RB Le'Veon Bell, and the Herd Hierarchy. Guests include Travis Kelce, Jarrett Bell, Robert Woods, and James Harrison. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode, we're cutting through the noise,

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You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Mark keep coming to. He's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball.

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However, you may be listening. Live in Los Angeles, Steeler Colors on. IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS1 in one hour from now. We bring out a Tuesday staple, the herd hierarchy, the top 10 teams in the NFL. after Monday night football is completed. Joey Taylor is back. Little under the weather yesterday. Still slightly under the weather today.

The voice is not 100% back. But I like all the black and yellow, though. Yes. It's about time they won a game, huh? We both have our steeler from Pittsburgh, of course. You know, I want to start, I'm watching the Steelers last night. They're one, one and one. Their win was exciting.

Their tie was exciting and their loss was exciting. Is that when you try to change people, that's when it gets frustrating. Don't try to make a Republican more loose. liberal, or a liberal more conservative. You women out there date the biker guy, stays up late at night, the rock star, that's who you marry, don't try to change him, then you'll get frustrated. And all you guys out there, the pretty girl, you flirted, other guys will, that's the downside. Don't try to change the world. When you try to change people, that's when it gets frustrating. That's when you and I get angry. Get into a relationship with people and understand this is what

they are. This is what they are. Pittsburgh Steelers last night. This is what they are. They win and they drive you nuts. They tie and they drive you nuts and they lose and they drive you nuts. Big Ben once again saved the Steelers. Disfunctional, 13 penalties over 150 yards in penalties. The defense gave up over 450 yards to Ryan Fitzpatrick. They pinned Tampa at the one at one point and got a penalty because a player was yelling with a ref. And here's Big Ben to essentially save the game because this now is what they are, Ben saving the dysfunctional mess known as Pittsburgh. Second and 10.

They will pass. Rolfelsberger. Sidearms at Daleksuster. What a play. Classic Big Ben for 18 yards. What a gutsy play by Ben. Yeah, and that's classic Pittsburgh. They can build a 20-point lead.

they can lose a 20-point lead. They have the most penalties through three games in two decades in the NFL. That's who they are. Super talented. And if you can't spot it, I can't help you. If you don't think this team, and a lot of it goes on Mike Tomlin, you've got players barking at the refs as you're pinning them deep at the one, you've got to be kidding me.

And by the way, New England, their brand is smart and efficient. Pittsburgh's talented and dysfunctional. And if they're still driving you, when I turned in that game last night, I got home, my wife's like, anybody good on Monday night at football? I said, oh, it's the Steelers. They're always fascinating.

They are the roller coaster rider in the NFL. They're fun. They're exhilarating. And when you get off it, you're a little sick to your stomach. And just come to terms with it. It's not going to be easy. They're going to give you a dozen penalties a game. They've got players squawking at people.

Sometimes they don't look well. coached. I mean, just think of what they offer you that nobody else says. Mike Tomlin is the best sound bite in the league. And Antonio Brown is the best perimeter player in the league. And Big Ben is the best flag football quarterback, make it up as you go, quarterback in the league. And they have the most penalties in the league. And they have the most outspoken players in the league. And they're the only team that has a player off to the side barking with officials as you pin Tampa at the one in the league. This is what they are. In the last 10 games for the Pittsburgh Steelers,

nine have been decided, mostly because of their dysfunction and their talent, by five points or less. Now, why does that matter? Because some of those have been against good teams. And then some of those have been against winless Cleveland and the Brett Hundley Packers. But Jacksonville was a one-point game, and playoff Kansas City was a one-point game, and New England was a five-point game. and this is what they are.

And you just, when you start trying to make a conservative liberal and a liberal more conservative, you get frustrated. You yell and scream, people are what they are, and the sooner you can come to terms with it and accept people and teams and coaches and players for what they are. Look at this. Since 1950, this is funny, the most penalties through three games, and the Steelers are one of the four most penalized teams.

Last night, that's exactly what I expected. My wife asked, well, you're going to watch the game? I'm like, oh, oh, God, yes. They tie fun, they lose fun, and they win fun. And that was terrific, wildly entertaining television. Big Ben saved him again. Jared Bell, Robert Woods, James Harrison, and the great Travis Kelsey will be joining us.

He will be joining us in about 20 minutes. One hour from now, little less, the herd hierarchy. So, LeBron held his first press conference yesterday as a Los Angeles Lakers, certainly not his first in the league. And what's interesting about this experiment for LeBron James, he is, as I'm looking at all the photos and stuff, he is surrounded by two groups, kids and castoffs. That's what this is. Kids and castoffs. And I'm watching all the shenanigans. the laughs and all the pictures.

I was thinking, I'm looking at the pictures and I'm thinking, who's going to be his best friend on this team? The kids are the castoffs or Luke Walton. But I want you to look at one of the team photos. I want you to look at this picture. Lonzo, LeBron, Kyle Kuzma, and Brandon Ingram. Let's put this up there. They look like kids.

They're skinnier. They're not as developed. Any of those guys going to be his best friend? Now, think about this in the NBA. Three teams can win the champion. championship this year. Overwhelmingly, Golden State, Boston, and Houston. Then there's about 10 teams of which the Lakers are one of them that should be good, but they have no chance of the title. Some will be really good. Some will be good. Some will be sort of good. Some will be

just slightly less than good. LeBron has not been in the spot he is in now for 12 years, where he has no chance to win a championship. He is the only star on the roster, and he is essentially a mentor to a bunch of C&C Plus players. Now remember, he hasn't been in that spot for 12 years. And the last time he was in that spot 12 years ago, he was very, very frustrated. And eventually held a press conference and said, I'm going to Miami, a mentor to C&C Plus guys.

And I would say the gap between Golden State and the Lakers is the gap between the Grand Canyon and here in L.A. Laurel Canyon. It is massive. And you know how they say, a picture says a thousand words. You've heard that before, right? A picture says a thousand words. Now, I want you to think about that because I'm going to play a soundbite from LeBron James yesterday.

He was asked about being the old guy, and he had a funny comparison. This is via the official Lakers podcast. You've got the young guys who may be generationally, you know, it's different than you. And some of the older guys that have been around the league are known as kind of big personality guys. Who do you think you might connect with most off the floor?

More like the godfather. You watch the godfather, and you see how Don Crowley-on throughout this whole entire life was just setting things up throughout this whole life to know that at the end of the day, Michael was going to take over, take over the family, and nothing was going to ever stop. The Lakers, the 16 banners up there. They only know winning.

And that's what it all comes down to. And you don't want to be afraid of. No, nobody wants to be afraid of. I'm smart too, Mike. I'm smart. I want to go back to the picture. Because as I'm watching the Lakers yesterday, they're doing all this, you know, kind of nonsense,

kind of team photo stuff. But I do think pictures matter. And, you know, that's the Laker picture. I mean, they look like kids. So I want to put up arguably the greatest team of all time. I want to put up on Photo Day one of their pictures. These are the 95-96 Bulls. That is Rodman on his third team, Michael Jordan and Pippin.

Those are men. When you look at that picture, is it me or is this the music you instantly think of? That's a bad ass trio. When you look at that picture, you're looking at that picture. you're looking at men, fights, anything to win, been through the wars with the pistons, Celtics, tackled by Rick Mahorn. When I look at that picture, that is the music I think of. Dramatic, big games, men physical.

Now I want you to look at the Laker picture with LeBron and the kids. And this is the music I think of. The ice cream truck? These are children. LeBron, good luck. Kyle Kuzma would like a snow cone. Brandon Ingram wants a vanilla sandwich. I like the baseball mat.

Oh, Chaco Taco. Lonzo, yeah, he likes that. Yeah. So that's what it takes to win in the NBA. What it takes to win championships in the NBA is the Bulls music and men. just lower expectations. That's what you're dealing with here for the next 12 months. LeBron, a mentor to C&C plus players and cast off.

Kids and castoffs. Lower expectations. I think this is going to be a good team. One of about 12 with no chance, though, to win a championship. All right, coming up, we could have, I honestly, sometimes I get a sense that a story could be. break soon and I really feel strongly about an NFL star changing teams and I want to give you an update. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific

on Fox Sports Radio FS1 and the IHeart Radio app. I don't want to make stuff up but there's a story out today and I have a feeling it feels like it could happen sooner than later. There's a story out there that the Pittsburgh Steelers, this has been documented, are shopping Lavian Bell. It'd be hard to bring him back into that locker room. There are two teams, one that has been reported, the Jets are interested. I believe so are the Colts. Because I think in both instances, the teams desperately need weapons. The Jets really have one of the league's worst running back tight-end wide receiver

situations and a bad O line with the rookie quarterback. Outside of T.Y. Hilton, Andrew Luck did not have much to work with. He just doesn't. Their defense is actually playing well. So it's interesting, and I read this quote on why the Jets may want to wait to get Lavian Bell. This is from CBS Sports.com. The writer says a trade would be complicated because he'd be nothing more than a one-year rental. It might make more sense for the Jets to wait and target him in the offseason when he becomes a free agent.

Really? Let's just sit back and wait. here's something that's happening all over the world. Aggressive wins in politics, Donald Trump, aggressive wins in business, Amazon, and aggressive wins in life, you've got to ask the pretty girl out first, and aggressive is winning in sports.

Who's aggressive in the NBA? The Warriors. They want a title, let's get better, Kevin Durant. We want another title. Let's get better, Boogie Cousins. The Rockets, let's go get Chris Paul, let's go get Carmelo Anthony. the L.A. Rams. We've already got Aaron Donald. Let's go pay for Andaman Su.

Marcus Peters. Akeeb Taleb, Sam Shields. Let's get Todd Gurley's contract wrapped up a year early. Brandon Cooks. We already have good receivers. Let's get another. By the way, the Boston Red Sox, David Price, J.D. Martinez, Chris Sale. I'm not saying nice guys finish last, but they generally finish third in the AFC East. You may not finish last, but aggressive is winning in politics. it's winning in business. Yeah, Facebook gets pushback.

Yeah, Trump gets pushback. Aggressive's winning. We have a fragmented world, a million choices. The aggressive companies, the aggressive people, the aggressive teams are winning. Okay, here's three reasons why the jet should go after Lavian Bell. They don't have any offensive weapons right now. Pro football focus rates their offensive line, they're running backs, their tight ends, and wide receivers among the worst.

They have a ton of cap space. they could use a great running back, pass rush or corner. They don't pay Sam Darnold anything. And third is, he'd also be their best receiver. Dude had 85 catches last year. So, you know, this idea that you can sit back and wait, it makes no sense at all. The Colts want him, and they're going to offer something,

and the Jets are going to sit back. You're not paying Sam Darnold for the next three to four years. This is what the Eagles. did. This is what the Rams did. When you're not paying your starting quarterback, you go all in on assets. And it's a position of need. You have a ton of cap space. You've already got your defense mostly solved. Jets have a good defense. Jets have good special teams. They have no weapons. By the way, Kansas City was aggressive two years ago. They traded up to get Patrick Mahomes. How's that working out for them? Buffalo this past year.

Got picks, gave up picks, traded up to get quarterback Josh Allen. Do you watch this weekend? Looks like they got their franchise quarterback. So if you're going to, listen, I'm not saying education doesn't matter. I'm not saying always be hyper aggressive. But if you look at what's happening in politics, in business, in life, and in sports over the last four or five years, if you got the money, spend it. Because it creates a momentum.

Players now want to play for the Warriors and the Rockets and the Rams. and the Eagles and the Red Sox. The Jets out there going, hey, Levy and Bell, we take care of stars here. Oh, well, maybe that left tackle who's on the fence is like, oh, wait a minute. I can block for Lavian Bell and the free agent center on the market. Oh, really? I like the Sam to Arnold. And I got Lavian Bell in that defense?

I mean, Brady's not going to play forever. Create momentum. And you do that by being aggressive. Travis Kelsey, one of the great, great players in the NFL's around the corner. Here's Joy Taylor with the news. No, no, no, no, turn on the news. This is the herd line news. So winning usually overshadows all drama, even the Steelers,

who seem to have the most drama this year. And after they went over the bucks last night, Rathusberger said this team is used to it and said he felt things were never that bad inside the team. The biggest issue, if you will, was outside the locker room. perceiving different things. I'm not saying we don't have issues. All teams have issues and there's different things going on.

But I think it was a little bigger than people probably, than it really is than what was. There's just, there's quite few of these stories around the team. It's not like as one lingering issue with the Steelers. I believe that if every star they have wasn't constantly banging on the organization, yes. Right.

Yeah, exactly. So, but last night was a big win for them, although before the year, you would have said winning over the bucks on Monday Night Football would have been a huge win for the Steelers and might have seemed ridiculous, but it really was actually a big win for them. Not only it was the first one in the season,

it was looking like Fitzpatrick was going to come back and just ruin the season for the Steelers. It was like, as you said, as it always is. Every game is the Steelers, you have to watch every single second of the game. Because you never know what's going to happen. That was one of my favorite Monday Night football games I've watched in years. I got the Tony Dungey

night. I got all the four, I used to work in Tampa. A lot of the all-time great dudes, great players were there. I got the Pittsburgh Steelers in their dysfunction. I got Fitzmagic. I thought it was one of the more entertaining football games on Monday night I have seen in years. I watched every second and thought it was a riot. Well, you couldn't turn it off. Couldn't turn it off. Couldn't turn it off. Couldn't turn it off. So the Josh Rosen era is alive in Arizona. Steve Wilkes made it official yesterday. He named Rosen the starter against the Seahawks. Josh plays with a lot of confidence. I think he gives us the opportunity to be.

able to be successful. When you look at the situation when he went into the game, I didn't have a problem putting him in at that time because, again, I know he's very confident in what he's doing. As I talked before when Sam, I said Sam was out started and it was his job to lose. And I'm saying the exact same thing about Josh Rosen. Josh is out starter and it's his job to lose. They paid Sam Bradford a lot of money to play three games. A lot of money. And for the record, it doesn't matter who's quarterback right now. The two worst offensive lines in the league that I've seen are the Jets and Arizona. True.

Although I do feel like there was a certain person on this show who maybe called at all of the rookies should have just started from week one. Yeah, you said, you want all these guys. You just go out. They really needed those extra three weeks on the bench to figure out the NFL. That's what I feel. They're all playing now except Lamar. Now, yes. So finally, the NBA is back.

LeBron knows what excitement around the Lakers, the excitement around the Lakers is the highest that's been in a while. And excitement usually leads to expectations, which leads to pressure. So what causes LeBron to feel pressure? He was asked that yesterday. What, if anything, at this stage of your career,

creates pressure for you? Wings about pressure? Nothing. Nothing. I can actually believe that. I mean, at least this year, we has nothing to prove this year. If they improve in any way, which they obviously will, it'll be a success.

No one has any actual expectations of them to win the title this year. Yeah. So this should be the most fun he has playing basketball, maybe, in his entire career. Yeah, it's a completely different spot for him for the last 12 years, which is he had a chance to win a championship. He had another star minimum one, often two. He's really a mentor to kids and castoffs and mostly C-plus players. I mean, Kuzma, Brandon Ingram, Lonzo, Rondo right now, they're C-plus guys.

Rondo has moments. He's a B-player, but it's a lot of – by the way, last time he was in this situation, Joy, he didn't like it. He got really frustrated at his last year in Cleveland before Miami. Remember, he went to the Olympics. He played with great players. He's sitting there with all these C-plus guys, and he didn't like it. Right, but he didn't have any rings then. And he wasn't the LeBron that we know now.

Also, a bit of Lakers news, as Lonzo continues to work as well. way back from off-season knee surgery. Rajman Rondo is expected to be the starting point guard for the Lakers. Luke Walton informed ESPN of that decision yesterday at Media Day. So Rondo will be starting while Lanzo

recovers. Yeah, I don't think that's a big surprise. I didn't know how far long Lanzo's recovery was, because it feels like that was the conversation, is Rondo going to start over Lanzo in the feeling that like he was going to be better than Lanzo, but it's apparently just his knee that is recovering.

at this particular point, why he's going to be starting. So it's just official now. All right, good stuff. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lie News. Travis Kelsey's around the corner.

So I was thinking about this. In 30 minutes, the herd hierarchy, we do it every Tuesday. I was thinking about this. Is that with the advent of Facebooks and Instagram, or as Bill Belichick calls it, Snapface, we have what I would call a pile on culture, is that we build up celebrities, and then the minute we can tear them down,

everybody piles on. It's very easy to go on Twitter and pile on people. It's very hard to go on Twitter and social media and have a contrarian voice and support the guy who's getting crushed or the woman. And so last week, I bet $1,000 on a regular season football game. I've never done that. and then I put the pick into a suitcase,

and then we unveiled the suitcase after the game was over, and it just so happened that I had picked the Cleveland Browns minus three, so I want $1,000. Now, I didn't know Baker was going to play, but I thought we had so much fun doing that last week, is that I'm going to do it again this week, but I'm not going to be mysterious. I'm going to be completely up front.

Because Baker Mayfield won me money. His new name on this show is Baker. Baker money clip maker. Baker made me money. So I thought instead of a mystery, people were so into it, let's just bet Baker-Mayfield's game this week.

Now, I want to go back to my belief on what has happened with the amplification of media in America, the Facebooks, and the Twitter and Instagram, is that what we do now is we overreact to everything. We either oversimpathize, or we over-criticize.

Right now, Baker Mayfield is getting all this love. Cleveland has now won one of their last 20 starts. One of their last 20 starts. That was at home last week against a rookie quarterback, making his third start in 11 days, against a very, very good Cleveland defense, and the Jets have absolutely no weapon. In fact, if you go back to that game, the Jets led in the third quarter, six minutes left, 14 to 3.

Sam Darnold had just dug the Jets out of a hole and completed a first down pass. If this hadn't happened last Thursday, the Jets might have won. Here's the play. There's a nice throw and catch. And a first down, but the ball is out. Anderson made the catch, and Denzel Ward, the rookie. takes it inside the 10, just took it right out of his arms. That kid can play.

And another takeaway by this Cleveland defense. If that does not happen, and Robbie Anderson's knee, which was this far from going down, goes down, it's 14 to 3 jets. They have a first down. The Browns don't get the ball. An easy three points. They couldn't move the football. and the momentum in the football stadium completely changed.

It would still be Jets ball. They would have a first down. Maybe they got another first down, second down, and they punt the ball and Baker gets it deep and we're entering the fourth quarter. And maybe they don't get that comeback and miraculously at the end score with a minute and a half left. It's very possible that happens, right, or two minutes left.

That is not to say the Browns didn't deserve it. That is not to say the Browns didn't deserve it. I am in no way saying the Browns didn't deserve it. What I am saying is this is the amplification of media. So the Browns this week are going to the Oakland Raiders for their first win in 20 games. Let's look at the Raiders. The Raiders have led every game this year going into the fourth. The best team in the league so far looks like the Rams, they led them going into the fourth.

They also, and it's tough to beat the Denver Broncos in September and Denver. They've won 32 of their last 35 games, first two weeks of September. And they led them going into the fourth. And Miami's undefeated. And they led them going into the fourth. We are over-criticking John Gruden and the Raiders. They are not a hapless 0-3. They've got a star quarterback.

They are now at home. They could easily be two-in-one. They weren't as good as the Rams. That is clear. But the Rams are dismantling every. so far and are favored by a touchdown over the Vikings this week. So you have two things going on. We're falling in love with Baker, who the Jets had no film on, played half a game,

Sam Darnold's third game in 11 days, great Cleveland defense, bad Jets weapons. Now you go on the road where everybody is telling you, oh, yeah, Gruden's a stiff, he can't coach. Look at the Raiders next eight games. Play the Niners without Garoppolo. Play Arizona's Josh Rosen, the rookie. They get a buy. Colts at home. Cleveland at home.

So here it is. Fun for everybody. Baker, Baker, Money Clip Maker. I am going to give you a blazing five pick early. The line is currently two and a half. That is the line I guess. get to use. That is the line.

I'm not, I'm taking the line now. I've never done this. I am going to take the Raiders minus two and a half at home against Cleveland. I get to use that line. If it changes, that's somebody else's problem. But that's the line I've bet, my $1,000. The thousand I won with Cleveland, not knowing if Baker would play, I'm going to take the Raiders at home.

this woebegone 0 and 3 team with this coach who doesn't know what he's doing against the amazing baker baker money clip maker so there's my bet never done it before there it is raiders at home minus two and a half lock it in baby lock it in so excited i'm so excited this is how it starts calling what gambling degeneration That's how it begins. Lock it in, baby. So excited. Travis Kelsey is right around the corner. His brother, obviously, in the NFL plays for the Eagles. Not even a rising star. Six years, three Pro Bowls, one of the absolute top 10, 15 players in the National Football League,

not at quarterback Travis Kelsey. Kansas City Chiefs, Red Hot, joining us next. Well, they are the talk of the National Football League, the Kansas City Chiefs, Andy Reed, Patrick Mahomes, Tyreek Hill, Travis Kelsey, Kareem Hunt, they are a firework show, and without further ado, six years in the league, already a three-time pro bowler. I said it about two years ago, two, three years ago, I said,

forget Gronk, he gets hurt. Who's Travis Kelsey? I didn't watch a ton of his college games in Cincinnati. He is joining us via the Coward Global Satellite Network. Holy Lord, I watched this offense. So you've got to tell me, Travis. Was there a moment when you first saw Patrick Mahomes? Was it a practice?

Was it screwing around? Was there a moment when you went, oh, he's good. He's really good. When was that moment with this kid? I mean, off the jump. Off the jump, every single practice, he's throwing at least one or two that are eye-opening. There's not an 80-yard pass that goes around that is an eye-opening. And he's throwing a couple of those in practice.

So, I mean, there have been kind of areas throughout the preseason last year, the preseason this year. But it wasn't until the bullets were flying in a real game against the Chargers where he threw a pass to Tyreek. Tyreek took it to the house that I was all right. Everybody put your seatbelts on. This thing's real deal. By the way, the offense, you were a star in high school in college, in the NFL. But is this the most fun you've had ever playing football? offense? I mean, these first three games, I mean, it's unbelievable. It's, we go, everybody on the

offense, really on the team keeps looking around like, man, we've never been a part of anything like this. And sure enough, all we know is just to keep coming into work, hacking away at the fundamentals, listening to Coach Reed, who challenges us on every single area of the game. And it's, it's fun. It's fun right now. We just, right now we're focused on getting better every single week. your brother Jason won a Super Bowl and did one of the great speeches in league history and he's wearing a mummer's costume it's part of a kind of a Philadelphia thing right I want to play the tape we can watch it individually here this is your brother I'm just a media guy but let's watch the tape here I don't love the Phil late Johnson can't lay off the juice Brandon Brooks has anxiety so when you are watching your brother what is your takeaway on that Jason. That's classic Jason. If you know Jason, you've heard one or two of those speeches like that to where he gets just a little bit intoxicated and starts speaking from the heart, man.

I think he was prime. He wasn't hammered. He was prime when he was doing that one. I don't know if you saw it. He was walking down the street grabbing beers from fans. So I mean, it's just it's prime Jason Kelsey at his finest, you know, grasping the moment and letting everyone know, you know what I mean? It's the hungry dog runs faster. You know, Travis, it used to be the NFL was more buttoned down, but OBJ just got an NBA contract. The Philadelphia Eagles, the Seahawks, yourself, Grunk,

personalities now. I mean, you probably grew up in a generation where you listen to the coach, you didn't do a lot of talking, but the NFL, to me, is in a really good spot where stars are allowed to be stars. I'm not saying if you guys win, you have to wear a mummer's costume. But you let your personality out a lot.

Has that always been who you are? Always, man. And you know what? I think Coach Reed fuels that on this team. He tells everybody, let your personality show. Because that's when you're yourself. That's when you're at your best. And I think it's something that the NFL wants to see.

You know, they want to see guys get out from these face masks, these helmets. and show their personalities because of how it's been a success in other sports. Yeah, no, I totally agree. I think this is something the NFL was uncomfortable with for a long time. Now, I've got to ask you about the offense. Mahomes is very good off script, rolling right, throwing. How much of the Chief's offense and these big plays are on script? Because sometimes, Travis, it looks like Sandlot.

How much is off script for you? I mean it's huge It's a huge part of Pat's game Being able to To elaborate on plays And being able to Instinctually make decisions When the play breaks down

To go out there and just Play football Play backyard ball I mean the past Chris Conley against the 49ers Is a huge example of that right there It's a he threw an absolute dart The play breaks down

And that's when Pat's kind of at his best Because he still feels very very comfortable And how he plays the game Even when the play kind of breaks down or turns into something that we weren't expecting it to. I talked to Michael Vic yesterday, and he said, he said literally, I've never had a coach. I would go to bed at night, and I could visualize how the game would turn out. Michael Vic told me, he goes, I'd never had a coach like that.

Take my audience in, because I've known Andy for a long time. I've been saying this for years. He was one of the first NFL coaches 15 years ago to say, you know what, we can throw the ball on third and two. I'm going to use the tight end. I want stars. How does Andy Reed elevate? you because you could have ended up with a stoic coach who was a defensive dude what does

Andy do for your game i'm i don't have the same success anywhere else i mean coach reed is uh he's he's helped me develop as a as a professional as a as a past catcher in this league as a run blocker um overall just a a football player and the mentality you have to have it's uh he puts everyone on the offense all over the field and he presents uh matchups for you that uh that you don't get everywhere else. I mean, it's something that I've definitely been blessed to have Coach Reed and be a beneficiary

of this offense and how he schemes. Your family must have been fun. You must have... Your family was... Were they partiers? What's the whole backstory here? I think we got a party bone in us.

I didn't see too much... I didn't see too much of my mother and my father partying growing up, but I know once me and Jason got into the life, we we hit it pretty hard. You do. By the way, only at Amazon.com, Old Spice Beard Collection,

designed to help guys achieve the soft nurse. Touch that beard. Look at that's a beautiful, that is a well done. Between you and Ryan Fitzpatrick, look at that. You should be proud of that. I am.

I'm very proud of it. I'm happy to be with Old Spice because they're the only reason why I really grew this thing out. It was an itchy and ungroomed beard before I got to them, and sure enough, they got this thing looking at it.

pretty depper if I might say myself. By the way, Goulet, look at John Goulet on our staff. John Goulet, your beard looks... It's not as good. It's not as good. It looks bristly. It looks like you just dipped it into soup. And then look at Travis Kelsey's beard. It's luxurious. It's handsome.

It's soft. Old Spice. Where to go. Rock it out. I got to tell you, Travis, you're so much fun to watch. That offense is ridiculous. Mahomes is great and humble. And Andy Reed's one of my favorite guys. Keep crushing it. You're having a great year.

And I love watching your play, man. I love listening to you, big guy. Appreciate you having me. Travis Kelsey, Kansas City Chiefs Old Spice, only at Amazon.com. God, their offense is crazy. And I'll tell you that, you know, for all the dysfunction of the Steelers last night, that was such a good Monday night football game. God, it was great.

It was a great. Now, I mean, you know, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Fitzmajic came down a little bit, wasn't quite the same guy. I, for one, was shocked that that was ever going to happen. But in the end, he still threw for 400-some yards. right? Unbelievable. It is.

You know, the, you know, I'm just sitting, yesterday was a really good day in sports because you got the NBA, you know, and the NBA is not going to really matter for another 8, 10, 12, 15 weeks or more. The LeBron thing is, you know, as much fun as it is. You know, it's interesting when you talk about the LeBron thing. We had Chris Mannix on yesterday and we were talking about, you know, LeBron. It is funny. The media is in two groups.

There's the anti-Lebrons. and then there's a kind of pro-Lebrons. I would be seen as more pro-Lebron. But I think they're going to be a good basketball team. I think the Lakers won 35 games last year, and I think this year they'll win about 47-48 games. Chris Mannix was on our show yesterday. He tends to lean a little less optimistic for LeBron through his career.

He thought the Celtics would win all last year. And I kept saying last year in the East, when LeBron's in the East, he'll win the East. Game 7, wherever it's at, he'll win. He did. Manix was at the press conference yesterday. Here's his thoughts on this year's Lakers. The ceiling for the Lakers is going to be making the playoffs.

You know what's going to take in the West. 47, 48 wins or more to get there. And rarely, very rarely, do teams that are put together almost wholesale at the end of a season, do they come out fast? Even with the guy like LeBron James, you're incorporating a bunch of non-shooters like Rondo and Lance Stevenson. You've got a team that played fast last year, bringing in a superstar who played slow,

for most of his career. These are all things that are going to take time. I think at best, Colin, they're going to be a 500 team around Christmas. And the question is, can LeBron, with that group, dig themselves out of that hole to get to the eight seed in the West? Okay, so he's got a 500 team. Now, LeBron James was asked. LeBron, Lakers, new team, kids in castoffs, what do you think?

I don't expect nothing. You work for what you want. and you can't expect anything. I think that's all, for me, it's all part of the process. We don't know. It's the unknown. The unknown is, you know, what to expect at the end of the road. So I don't, I don't ever base anything off of that. You know, what I know I can bring to the table was, you know,

being committed to, you know, having excellence, you know, every single day. So here are the facts. Manick sees 500. LeBron's very fuzzy and ambiguous. They won 35 games last year. Is it reasonable assume that Kuzma will be better? Yes. That Lonzo will be better?

Yes. That Ingram will be better. Yes. That's reasonable to assume. LeBron has also, every team he's enter has gotten at least 11 games better. When he joined the Cavs out of high school, when he joined the heat, and when he went back to Cleveland. They won 35 last year. There are three young players.

I should say four with Josh Hart. I think all make a jump. I think they're 13 games better. I think the West is a little overstated. It's good. It's not that good. It's good at the top. Lakers win 47 to 48, the herd.

This hour two in Los Angeles is the herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening. Iheart Radio, Fox Sports Radio and FS1, Travis Kelsey just on the show. Robert Woods, L.A. Rams, receiver, former USC kid in 45, minutes from now. Joy Taylor is joining me. Sick yesterday. Doesn't feel great today, but she's a total gamer playing hurt, having her third cup of tea this morning. It's essential. I had no voice yesterday, though. I would have not been a good help on the show. But we're both wearing Steeler Cudders today. Black and yellow. After a wild game. So every Tuesday after Monday night football, Thursday night football

starts the NFL week and Monday night football closes the NFL week. So at the start of the second hour, every Tuesday. I do the herd hierarchy. I don't know why I take so much time, why I care so deeply about this, but I do, and here we go. Heard hierarchy. Time is now, let's go. The top 10 NFL teams, according to college, number 10. My staff pushed back strongly on this, but I'm going to give the Miami Dolphins some love. They lead the NFL in picks. Their defense is top six, but here's what's really impressed me with the Dolphins. We know what's happening in the NFL right now.

Quarterbacks that get offensive-minded head coaches are flourishing. Ryan Tannahill has won 10 of his last 11 starts. I want to say that again. Ryan Tannahill has won 10 of his last 11 starts with Adam Gase. In that time, take a deep breath. He's completing 70% of his throws. I don't think Ryan Tannahill's that special. We have a trend in the NFL.

Ryan Tannahill and the Dolphins. I know they play just the Jets, the Titans, and the Raiders at home. home, but they get into the herd hierarchy for the first time. Number nine. I still like Atlanta. They can't stop anybody. I mean, they can't. I mean, their third down defense is 31st in the NFL.

They can't get people off the field. They've lost both safeties for the year. They've lost three defensive starters for the year and four starters overall. But I still love this offense. They're tremendously efficient. They've been better in the red zone lately. Last couple of weeks, they've been better in the red zone offensively. There's not a lot I don't like about this football team.

except for the fact now they're beat up physically. And what's ironic is they were the only team that enter the season completely healthy. Nobody on the I are of note. But I've taken them out of Super Bowl consideration. I just don't think they can get people off the field on third down. I have them at nine. Number eight. And the team they lost to New Orleans at eight.

I think basically New Orleans is Atlanta with an offensive-minded head coach. Second points, 15 yards per play. That's a big Vegas stat, yards per play. Saints deliver big time. But again, like Atlanta, they can struggle to get people off the field on third down. I put New Orleans, a little snazzier version right now, a little healthier version than Atlanta at number eight. Number seven. Let's not go crazy on the Minnesota Vikings. Okay, everybody has one of those Sundays. The Steelers have about four a year. They had one. This is still an excellent roster. By the way, the Rams corners are both hurt. Watch them give the Rams

fits this Thursday on Fox. Their secondary is still one of the best, if not the best in football. They have a great home field advantage. They got caught napping. Don't pile on. This is still an elite team that could be playing in January. Vikings

31st in rushing, but there are fourth in passing. They're getting the ball on explosion plays. They'll get the running game figured out. Number six. This is my dark horse Super Bowl team. You rolled your eyes at me. They lead the NFL in total defense to Baltimore Ravens.

You think of them as a defensive team and a special team's juggernaut, right? Because John Harbaugh was a special teams coach. Twelve trips to the red zone this year. 12 touchdowns. Yeah, that's them. They drafted two tight ends. They acquired three wide receivers. Give this puppy time to bake.

Okay, they got all new pieces for Joe Flacco. Second in the NFL and point differential. Don't go crazy. My dark horse Super Bowl pick, 12 for 12 touchdowns in the red zone. This team just needs time. They got five new guys for Flacco who's in a contract year. He's got a little Lamar Jackson now behind him. This team is going nowhere.

Number five. The Steelers, who are basically a little less consistent version of Baltimore and more explosive on the perimeter with the Juju Smith-Schuster, James Walker. Washington, Antonio Brown. Listen, they have nine more penalties than the next closest team in the NFL, and they are the roller coaster ride in the NFL. But they're second in total offense. They're tied for second in sacks.

You just have to get comfortable with being uncomfortable, because they're all over the map. There are times I don't think they're well coached. I mean, last night they had that game wrapped up, and then all of a sudden seven, eight minutes left, you're like, oh, good Lord, what's happening? Wildly dysfunctional, heavily penalized, but incredibly fun and explosive Steelers.

Five. Number four. Philadelphia Eagles, first of all, last week, Carson Wentz is back. It was wet and rainy, and they're all banged up. So don't take last week's narrow win over Indianapolis. Is any sign of anything? They still are statistically the best rushing defense in the NFL. Their second and third down defense, they get people off the field.

And that's a real big thing. Okay, the Saints and the Falcons can't get people off the field on third down. The Eagles get people off the field. They're banged up. They had a super conservative game plan on a wet field for Carson Wentz. Eagle still, top four. And the top four teams in my herd hierarchy, to me, should be Super Bowl favorites. Number three.

Never had Jacksonville this high. It's not about their defense. Their defense is second in the NFL in scoring defense, fourth and total defense. I know that's good. What's kind of blown me away is with Leonard Fernette not healthy, Blake Bortles has looked really comfortable. He's not looked really great because he's not great. But Blake Bortle's now second year with Tom Coughlin running the show has looked very, very comfortable.

That defense alone can't win you a Super Bowl. There's too many points scored in this league. There's too many rules, anti-defense pro offense. But right now the Jags are third. Number two. Kansas City. You know, they always say in Vegas that don't get too caught up on turnovers because they're random, except with Andy Reed and the Patriots. they have one turnover this year.

To be as explosive as they are offensively and not turn it over, that's coaching. Even Vegas says fumbles are random. Not really with Andy Reid and not with Bill Belichick. Those guys coach their players to hold on to the football. They lead the NFL in points per game. They lead the NFL and I will say this. They give up a lot of gash plays. But they're third in the NFL and third down defense.

They'll get you off the field. They'll get you off the field. Now they give up chunk plays. which worries me because when you face the best quarterbacks in the playoffs, do you get burned on that? But there, the firework show of the NFL I have them at two. Number one. I don't think anybody's close to the Rams.

In fact, the biggest break the rest of the league got this week is Akib Talib is hurt and out for a month. And Marcus Peters is hurting out for a month. And they're studs and they're both out for Minnesota. So Minnesota, which is a very good passing team right now, not a running team, will give the Rams real problems Thursday night in Los Angeles. This team's stacked. I like their coach.

I like their coordinator. I think Jared Goff's the most underrated quarterback in the league. He doesn't talk. And the Rams are kind of like an expansion team, so nobody's paying attention to them. Third down offense, number one. Offense. Scoring defense. Point differential.

I don't even know what their weakness is. They're not great at linebacker, and now they've got an issue at corner, which makes them vulnerable over the next month. But from coaching to defensive coordinator, Phillips O-line receivers running back quarterback D-line secondary safety special teams are the best in the league the Rams looked like the number one team in the national football league coming up next we got a crazy thing happening in the NFL and it is not a coincidence it's happening it's real I got Robert Woods of the Rams I have USA Today reporter columnist Jared Bell on the NFL both around the corner not even halfway home today

we are packed. Thursday nights are about to get a lot bigger as Fox becomes a new network home for Thursday night football. Jared Gough, Todd Gurley, and the undefeated Rams host the Vikings in a battle of NFC heavyweights Thursday at 730 Eastern on Fox. Also live on the NFL network and streaming on Amazon Prime. Borrow up to $40,000 to pay off your high-interest credit cards, Lendingclub.com slash sports.

Lendingclub.com slash sports. He is an NFL columnist, has been for you. years at USA Today. There's potentially a breaking story here soon with Lavian Bell. The Jets have called. I'm told the Colts are interested. And with that, we bring in Jared Bell onto our set, had him on about a month ago. We are now, the season is underway. We got stories happening, Jared. The Lavian Bell thing is interesting to me because I kind of have this belief that when you have a Jared Gough, a kid quarterback, they can use the star back. I don't think Lavian Bell. when you have Antonio Brown, you have Big Ben, you have two bro bowlers, you have Juju

Smith-Schuster. I don't think Lavian Bell is as crucial to that offensive success. But I look at the Colts, Andrew Luck needs weapons. I look at the Jets. Sam Darnold needs weapons. I've got to tell you, the Jets have two third-round picks. I think he gets moved. I think it's going to be hard, Jared, to go back to that Steeler locker room.

That's a good point. I think the thing that's really interesting in this whole scenario, is that the franchise tag is there. So the Jets would be renting him for this year with the idea, maybe the understanding, probably the understanding, that you'll do a long-term deal after this season. And there's the risk. So Levyon Bell, staying away from the Steelers right now,

pretty much because of the risk factor and the load factor. Well, he's still going to get that. But I understand exactly what you're saying. Paul George, Oklahoma City, and understanding you take the risk, give stuff away, you get a guy in house, you feed him the rock, you give him love, they talk about him in New York, boy, it would be hard to leave that. And it would all depend on what kind of deal they make to really kind of, you know,

solidify the whole idea that you're going to stay there. But if you're the Jets and look at, if you're Todd Bowles, there's no guarantee that you're going to be there two years from now, three years from now. It's a win now situation. Thank you. Why not make a wrong? run for it and then see where the chips fall. They have a ton of cap space. That should be noted. And by the way, I talked to Chris Ballard in the offseason. Chris told me, he goes, we're going

to have to get some weapons for a guy. We got to show up our defense. We need weapons. So the aggressive teams in sports, the warriors, the rockets, the Red Sox, the Rams, the Eagles, aggressive teams are winning in sports. You create a culture of momentum and stars want to join stars. When you watch the Steelers last night, you know, I said to start the show, Jared, that where you get frustrated in life is when you try to change people. The Steelers are dysfunctional. It works for them. The people that are getting driven crazy are people that want them to be New England. They're not New England. Like, I watched them last night and I'm like, this is who they are. Yeah, they definitely keep you on the edge of your seat

if you're a Steelers fan. The Steelers have become two things. One, Colin, they have the biggest tease in the NFL. Because you look at that collection of talent that they have. And even though they've had a lot of problems on defense, they've got some big-time players, some big-time talent on defense too. And obviously, you know what they have on offense. And so you look at them every year, you go into the season, or at least for the last four years or so, and you say, this is a team that can get over the hump, that can get

past New England, and can go all the way. So that's what you expect for that team. But the other thing that the Steelers have become is the most dramatic team. in the NFL. Team drama, team terminal, whatever you want to call it. And so we've seen that this year. And I think the conversation about, you know, Levion Bell and obviously the locker room chatter from the offensive line and then Antonio Brown, you know, go back to last year. And there was several situations and incidents that you could look at and say, boy, this is a dramatic team. But I think this year, it kind of masked some of the problems that they've had on defense. And, you know,

Kansas City surely exposed them, but I think that is the bigger issue for Pittsburgh as opposed to their psyche, as opposed to them dealing with the drama, because they can deal with it. And I think Ben Rothensberger said it last night after the game, where he talked about, hey, it's all about winning. And the noise from the outside doesn't matter if you win. But, yeah, there are issues in Pittsburgh in terms of being able to play up to their potential. You know, I was saying this, that the amplification of media, Twitter, Facebook, you become a star faster, and you fall faster. That's just the way the world works now. So John Gruden comes into the league, and a lot of people think he's cocky and obnoxious, and they're rooting against him. Then he goes 0 and 3.

And we've labeled him, and I'm guilty of this, it's not working. But they had the Denver game won. Miami, 3 and 0, they had the chances to win that. And by the way, the Rams are unloading on people. They went toe to toe with them for three quarters. Are we now dumping on Gruden when this is not a man overboard O'N3, Jared? Yeah, I think that's a good point because John Gruden can still win as a coach in the NFL. And like you said, all three of those games, two of them were very winnable.

And the one against the Rams, they were winning at halftime. So it's not time to panic yet. But I think the thing with Gruden, it's optics. Okay, that's part of it. And, you know, he walked in the room with big optics because he's coached Chuckie, he's John Gruden. But then when you deal away Khalil Mack, the type of player that every team in the NFL would love to have in their locker room.

And by the way, the Bears are now in first place. So they're one of the talks of the league. Yeah, and the Raiders are last in the league in sacks, right? Right. And so that is going to really define what we think of. John Gruden for many years to come. And the reason why I say that is because we're going to be looking at those draft picks that they got for Khalil Mack. And there's always going to be the comparison whether this player stack up or not. And, you know, with the draft, it's still a

crapshoot. So this is going to be something that is going to linger over the Raiders and Gruden for years to come. Now, if you win, you win through all of that, then it goes away. But until they get to the point where you say we're going to pay $100 million. for a coach. Right. Watch this, though, Jared. I want to show you something. So this week, they host Baker Mayfield.

If you look at the Raiders next games, I think the narrative could change. So they get a rookie quarterback at home this week. And then they get that Seahawk offensive line at home that's a mess. They get the Colts at home. They get the Niners without Garoppolo. Josh Rosen, rookie quarterback, Arizona. It gets tougher at the end of the year. But I think it's very possible that in about seven or eight weeks, the narrative is like, oh, it was a little bumpy to start, but John has righted the ship.

I think this week against Cleveland's big, because I think we're going a little overboard on Baker Mayfield. They have lost 19 of their last 20 games. This is a really hungry, desperate Raider team with a better quarterback. What were your interpretations of Baker's opening game? on Thursday against the Jets. Are you a Baker guy? Yeah, I'm in on Baker-Mayfield, but also with a degree of caution, because it was one game, and you know what they say in the NFL, you give a defensive coordinator three game films to figure out a quarterback,

and they will figure out exactly what they should and could and can and shouldn't do against that quarterback. The thing that's going to make Baker Mayfield so interesting to watch as we go on here is how he performs all. script because there are going to be situations in every game where you're going to have to make decisions and you're going to have to make things happen that may not be by design. And I think that's one of the great things that Baker Mayfield will bring to this equation. The other thing we saw at the other night in Cleveland where he just electrified the team, he made the great

decisions. Oh, and he can throw the football. And so when you've got that working at quarterback, it raises the level of everyone else. And so I think Baker Mayfield is, the guy to go with, but they're going to be bumps along the way. I mean, we know that. This is not the time to say that the Browns are going to be contending for the playoffs this year, but you kind of have to see it play itself out. I got a text message the other day from the Browns GM, John Dorsey, and, you know, basically it said, hey, it was one game. Let's see where we are in December. In between now in December, obviously, you know, Baker Mayfield and the opponents will go through the process. And how they deal with that is going to be the storyline of this season.

But when you look at Cleveland and how depressed it's been with that organization, year after year after year, this is the jolt that they needed. By the way, your sources around the league, there's obviously well-documented tension between Brady and Belichick. That was as lethargic and uninspiring as a New England offense has been in years. You know, I said before the year, the game now has been regulated. It is more offensively geared. It is officiated with offensive players in mind.

New England outside of Gronk doesn't have a lot of supremely gifted offensive players. Sometimes a culture changes. In the NBA, Jared, if the NBA becomes a three-ball shooting league and as a GM, you don't have three-point shooters, you go through a transition period. The league, look at the teams that are winning now. Offensive coordinators in the NFC lead every division. Offensive coaches do. They lead every division. And by the way, the second place team in every division in the NFC also as an offensive coach.

I look at New England. Jared, I don't see the players. I don't think they have the players for the cultural change. Do you? I don't think they have dynamic perimeter players. Well, the one thing you have to have the most important player they still have and Tom Brady. And when you have a quarterback who can make the decision, who can manage the game, you give yourself a chance to win.

And obviously, when you get to the bigger games and you start talking about getting to games in January, there's a reason why the Patriots have been to seven consecutive AFC championship games. But guess what, Colin? We've seen the Patriots here in September before where it looked like there's no way this team is going to be there at the end, and then, lo and behold, by the end of the season, they're there.

And the reason why they are there is because no coaching and a, is as resourceful as Bill Belichick. No coach in the NFL is able to transform his team to meet whatever the circumstance is like Belichick. Now, talent wins, no doubt about that. But I think you've got to look at this situation with them and say, okay, you know Julian Edelman will come back. It's not one player that's going to make the difference,

but you take Julian Edelman, and I will bet on Josh Gordon right now with Bill Belichick in this situation. Now, if you say, okay, what do you expect from Josh Gordon, post-Cleveland with whatever team in the league, sure, you can look at his track record and have major questions. But you put him in this situation, give him Tom Brady, give him a structure around him, put him in a place where there's obviously a need there. And so you talk about Josh Gordon, Edelman.

If both of those guys come through, what does that do for him? Sure, they still have problems on the offensive line. They still have problems on defense. but if you can sustain yourself with an offense that can strike, you can win in this league. And I think that's what's going to give the Patriots an opportunity. That and just kind of building as the season goes on as they have before, figuring out what they need to do and how to do it. Yeah, I will say this. The AFC has flawed teams.

Pittsburgh defensively struggling. Kansas City is giving up explosion plays. We like the Jags. We think there's limitations at quarterback. Kansas City, it would be wonderful. but have they been AFC championship? That's a young roster, young stars, Patrick Mahomes. So where the NFC's got some teams that are loaded,

and we have really high expectations. The AFC right now is a crapshoot. So you go to January and you look at Belichick and you look at Brady and you look at Gronk and you look at Edelman and the game. To your point, it could be a different ballgame. Jared Bell, NFL columnist, USA Today, Sports. Love having you on.

Joy Taylor with the news. No, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the. The herd line news. So you had them on top of your hierarchy. The Rams looked like a contender again this weekend. They beat up on the Chargers.

Yes. And three games in, Jared Dopp is showing this that his growth hasn't stopped yet. But whatever you do, don't call him a system quarterback after the game. Sean McVeigh told this to Mike Silver. Saying he's a system player that's just disrespectful to total discredit to a great player, those who know, no, flip the tape on. I know this. I wouldn't want to be working with anybody else other than Jared Gough right now.

I don't think there's been a quarterback in this league in years that he doesn't talk. In Los Angeles, he hides in his house. And because they have Gurley and Indomicon and a really energetic coach, they're kind of an expansion team. They just moved here. Nobody talks about Jared Gough. The NFC's got all these star quarterbacks, Aaron and Carson Wentz. This kid now is like 15 and 5 or 13, 14 and 5. I don't buy the system quarterback.

Well, I mean, because his start was so bleh, which shows really how great Sean McBay has been for him. But I feel like this tends to happen when you have a quarterback that's successful on a team that has a solid coach and pieces around him, which is a little unfair to him. You know, we always give the credit to someone like Tom Brady, you have no receivers, or Aaron Rogers, who hasn't had a defense, or it doesn't have big players around him this year. Like, you tend to give more credit to guys like that. where Jared Gough has been solid. I have a friend Jedfish, who's a coach on the Ram staff, and when I saw him about a month ago, I said, what do you make a golf?

And, you know, I'm not going to divulge everything he said. But one of the first things he said is, when you see him up close, you're like, oh, that's the number one pick. He goes, he's taller than you think in person, and his arm is better than you think in person. And he goes, you know, he goes, I've been around, and Jedfish has been around college and pro football. And he's like, you stand next to him, you watch him throw it,

practice and he's like, oh. And by the way, Jed Fish was with Josh Rosen at UCLA. Okay, he's been around Brady before. He's like, when you're around him and you're in his aura and you see how big he is and you see his arm at practice, you're like, well, that's what a number one quarterback in the NFL looks like. And Jed isn't a BS or he's, I feel comfortable saying this. He's like, the kid can really play.

He's a really special player. And he's winning, so isn't that all you really ask for? Yes. And it's not just that he's winning. He's not turning a hand on the ball off. He's making big, difficult throws. Yes. So time now for a fantasy headline, sponsored by Draft Kings.

Tampa Bay has a little bit of a quarterback controversy on their hands now. Fitzpatrick didn't play great on Monday. Not really the game that you want to throw three interceptions on three consecutive passives in the first half. But he rallied the bucks late, and Dirk Cutter was pretty coy about the impending decision last night when he was talking about James Winston's return. Of course, we love James. I mean, James is a member of our team and anxious to get him back. He'll be great in our locker room. And I know James, whatever role that he ends up in,

I know James will embrace that role and give it everything he's got. So pretty noncommittal there on who the quarterback is going to be next week. I mean, in my opinion, obviously everyone was freaking out about Ryan Fitzpatrick leading up into this game. And yes, he did throw three interceptions, which is not what you want to see when James Winston is coming back to work today. But I think you have to stick with Fitzpatrick for now. with a contrarian opinion. I think they go back to James Winston quicker than people think. Do you think, I'm not saying they won't do that. I'm just saying I don't think that they should do that. Do you think they should go back to James Simpson?

Yes, because I think we all know what Ryan Fitzpatrick is. Listen, I went in before the season. I was looking at James Winston. He was getting in trouble and I'm like, okay, let's just get out all the noise. His completion percentage, his yards per completion, his yards per game, and his passer rating were going up the last two years with Dirk Cutter. James Winston's the better quarterback. Now, Ryan Fitzpatrick is hot, and there is value in hot. But if you're asking me going forward, who I'm going to bank on, it's not Ryan Fitzpatrick. What we saw from Ryan Fitzpatrick last night is what I've been watching for years. He can go on these streaks.

Case Keenham can go on streaks. James Winston is more talented than Ryan Fitzpatrick. This offense, it's catching people off guard, because they've got a bunch of draft picks, the Mike Evans, the O.J. Howard. They got a bunch of dudes that can play. And Sean Jackson still has a ton of speed. Oh, no, no, no. The talent's not even, they're scoring for a reason. It's not all schematics. They got dudes. And they're creating, their guys are open.

But I think in the end, you have to give James Winston and this team eventually. Tampa Bay is going to come back down to Earth. Last night was just the start of it. They've got some tough road games. James does a lot of juvenile immature nonsense, but I still think going forward. He's your guy one more try on him, one more run at him. I don't know if you lose the locker room at this point going back to James right after that. I know it wasn't a great, it was not the game that Patrick struggles. Next week, I'm moving on.

Well, yeah, I agree with that. You don't want to go on a downside. All right, so finally, one of the biggest questions for Carmelo Anthony is what his role will be with the Rockets and Mello told reporters yesterday. I haven't had that conversation with anybody yet. I'm very clear on what my role is. So Mello seems to be sure, but Mike D. Antonio, on the other hand, was pretty non-committal. We'll see how it fits. I don't know how they play together.

We have a great analytics team that will help gut feelings. So we do a lot of it just scientifically that this is the best way to go. So basically, he said that they're going to focus on analytics to decide what's going on with Carmelma. I don't really think at this point it matters what Carmelo wants his role to be. Like this team is trying to win a championship. And Carmelo is at the point in his career where he needs to win a championship. So everyone talking about whether he's going to come off the bench or not. It's not disrespect to Carmelo if he comes off the bench for the Rockets.

I just feel like the whole thing is overplayed. That's obvious. That doesn't mean Carmelo gets that. I agree with that. I think everybody in the world agrees with that. My knock on Carmelo from day one has been he lacks self-awareness. He still sees himself as a top 10 player in the league, and he's not a top 30 player in the league right now. He's not one of the two best players on his own team.

Right. If Trevor Areza was still on that team, I'm not sure he's as good as Trevor Arisa on a night-to-night basis. Certainly not defense, certainly not effort. Certainly, you know, I mean, so what you're saying is right, but that doesn't mean the player gets it. Well, this is his opportunity to show that he does. Go ahead and Taylor with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by.

The Hurd-Ly news. Best team in the league's the Rams, Robert Woods, one of their star receivers will be joining us coming up next in Los Angeles. It's the herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. We were talking about the offensive revolution in the NFL. Offensive head coaches in the NFL today are 28, 24 and 1. Defensive guys are 16, 21 and 1. In the NFC, every divisional leader has an offensive head coach.

and the second place teams. You think about the Bears' defense, but Matt Nagy's an offensive guy. The second place teams, eight for eight in the NFC, all offensive coaches. The rules have changed. It's almost like the NBA, where if you can't shoot a three,

you're of very little value to be on the floor late in big games. In the NFL, with all these rule changes, you better pay perimeter guys. You better have world-class corners and world-class-wide receiver groups because the rules have changed. And at the forefront of this are the L.A. Rams and via the Coward Global Satellite Network,

Robert Woods, one of their many targets is joining us. You know, Robert, when I watched the Rams on TV, I watched you play in high school, USC, Buffalo, and now the Rams. The offense looks really complicated. There's a lot of motion. There's a lot of groupings. Is it as a receiver a more complicated offense to learn? I wouldn't say so. I would say it's a fun offense, creative offense. You're always moving, always getting the defense guessing, communicating, moving around. I think that's the plan and that's our goal.

We're having fun with it. We're flying around. It's fun seeing the defense miscommunicate and make big plays off of it. So it's work for us, but it turns out to big plays, and we keep being creative and find ways to keep doing it. When you look at Jared Goff, he's a number one pick. He played at your right. rival at USC Cal. And he doesn't talk a lot. He's very quiet. He's not out on, you know, he's not a guy doing commercials. But how would you explain to my audience for people that don't know Jared and haven't

seen him because he made a throw to you this weekend that was the best throw I've seen in the NFL this year, along with Patrick Mahomes having a couple? What makes Jared Goff to you special as a quarterback? Probably exactly what you said and what you said. all on the field, probably just the throws that he make is just shows his confidence. When you see Jared walk around here in his facility, it's straight confidence. When he's on the field, he's leading his offense, leading his team. Second year, but he's a leader.

This guy, or I said third year, second year starting, but he's a leader. This guy leaves his offense, leaves this team, and is in control of every bit of it. And you see why we're winning is because of Jared. these throws he's making, his confidence. He's spreading around this locker room because of Jared and credit him to our success. You guys have a lot of personalities, Sue, Peters, Akeep Taleb, Gurley, yourself, Gough, your left tackle. Whitworth's a funny guy. You've got a lot of big personalities.

You've got a coach who's young and energetic. When everybody got, you know, Sue got here in Akeep Taleb and Marcus Peters, a lot of people were like, oh, my lord, a lot of personalities. Watch out. This is explosive. Did you have any concerns about that stuff? No, actually, like I saw a little bit about that when the guys all got here, just about a lot of personalities, the different mixes.

That's our team. We welcome that. You know, I feel like it makes our locker room fun. It makes our team fun. It makes practice fun, makes games fun. And you see just the work that these players put in, the emotions that they put in. It's all just one to win, all their drive, one to win.

You see the work, and you go out there on Sundays, and you win with these guys, you succeed with these guys. It's fun. You see their personalities. You see their characters. You see guys flex on after big plays. You see DBs wave their hands after incomplete pass. That's this team.

It's a lot of character on, and I think that's why we're good. We have a lot of guys with personalities and are not afraid to show it. By the way, on a week-to-week basis, so you guys obviously have a playbook, and then week-to-week you have different game plans. is Sean McVeigh a guy that is it, does week to week he make radical changes? Or is it kind of like, this is our base offense, this is what we do, or do you come in certain weeks and Sean's like, fellas, we're doing some different stuff? Again, what is Sean like to play for?

A little bit of everything. That's the good thing about it. He's creative. He's always adding new stuff in. What we do is in the training camp, you know, we try. try to put in our whole offense and then we trim it down each week we have selected play certain teams stuff like that and then uh and then we watch the film we get a crater we find holes we find gaps and we just try to expose them um just the tape doesn't line we fight hole find holes

exploit the defense uh get our fly motions in our go sweeps and uh just try to get the defense to move around talk fast communicate and um and fly and compete with our offense as fast as they can Is this the most fun you've ever had playing football? I would think so. I think this team is a brotherhood. I think it's a family. I think we mean it when we break down this team as a family. But just the work that we put in, I think, like you said, the personalities,

but it's a grind. These guys are pushing each other. We're pushing each other in the wait room and meeting room and little cone drills and our BGL. All these little things. It's always a competition. And I think that's what drives this team. that competitive nature and then the drive and willingness to win.

So you play high school at Sarah in Los Angeles, then you play at USC, Buffalo briefly, back in Los Angeles. What is it like to be a little kid in Los Angeles and you end up playing for the hometown team? Now, when you were a kid, the Rams weren't in L.A. So, I mean, USC could have been your favorite team. But does it feel cool to be a kid that grew up in L.A., and now you are starring for the Rams? How does that land for you? What is that like? Yes, big time.

Just in free agency last year, the Rams coming up on Target. Well, initially before that even started, when the Rams first came to L.A., I was hyped. And back in Buffalo, like, okay, L.A. has a home team. And that's good for the city. And then for me to come back in free agency and be on the team, be on the home team. And just turn the whole thing around winning, success, young team. I think it's really good to come back to L.A. winning football, to be a part of it, I think it's great.

Well, Robert, you were six years in the National Football League. You're back home in Los Angeles. It looks like a wild offense, but you say it's not that crazy. There's a lot of motions. When you look at this RAM teams going forward, it's the Vikings this Thursday. Now, that was a really ugly Sunday last year. Does revenge mean anything in the national football league? Or is that just media guys talking?

Do you guys remember that Viking loss? I think we do remember that loss. I know it was last year, and the biggest thing is a whole new team for them and for us as well. But it's a fresh new slate. We're rolling right now this year. We're worried about this year. We're about this year's Vikings team. We've got a quick turnaround this Thursday.

We've got to line up against them and play physical. We know they're a physical team that's still showing that on the tape. And we know they're going to execute their offense. And our biggest thing is just be ourselves, run our offense, play our defense, and move the ball up and down the field and score points, and do it at home on Thursday night. Robert, great talking to you. A continued success for you and the Rams. Thanks, bud.

Thanks, Colin. Good talking to you. Good talking to you, Robert Woods. We are seeing, it really is amazing. You look at the NFL right now. Think about Ryan Tannale. Just Ryan Tannehill. And I say Ryan Tannehill, Joy, you're from Pittsburgh, but you lived in Miami.

Nobody thinks special quarterback. But Ryan Tannahill got Adam Gase, an offensive guy. Right. Robert, Ryan Tannehill has won 10 of 11 games with Adam Gase, completing in that stretch 70% of his throws with Adam Gase. His passer rating is 105 with Adam Gase. He has three touchdowns to every interception, 20 to 7. with Adam Gase, and he's 10 and 1.

And we don't think of Adam Gase is a guy, you know, he's a young kid, he's a Dolphins coach, Ryan Tannahill. We don't think of either as special. What is happening in the NFL, Ryan Fitzpatrick, 400 yards, 400 yards, 400 yards, it's a revolution. This is what's happening in the NBA. We have a revolution going on where the rules are changing, and they're changing fast. And this year we had two more offensive rules.

The catch that wasn't a catch. is now a catch, and we're seeing pass rushers penalized for just like legitimate tackles and late hit penalties. This is why I said during the off season, why are these wide receivers making all this money? This is why. It's like the three ball. People forget you could shoot a three in the NBA for 20 years.

The three ball was around with Michael Jordan. The three ball was around in the 90s, and nobody was shooting it. And then all of a sudden, Steph Curry comes. And a lot of analytics start taking over, and everybody says, why are we shooting mid-range jumpers? And overnight, in like a two, three years set, you can't be on the floor. We want our centers now to shoot threes. And the world changed overnight. I mean, people think they just introduced a three-point shot.

It's been around for 30 years. But when you combine Steph Curry's emergence, the little guy taken over the league and the analytics that were implemented into basketball, there's no reason to shoot 16-foot or, It's a wasted shot. Either dunk it, high percentage, or shoot a three at 35, 38%. And it's happening in the NFL right now. You got Ryan Tannahill when he has an offensive coach tearing the league up. In the NFC, 8 for 8, the leading team in every division in the NFC and the second-place team all have offensive coaches. And guys like Mike Tomlin and Pete Carroll, who have Super Bowls, are getting a lot of flack because they feel a little outdated, a little too pro defense.

They need Russell Wilson and Big Ben to save them on an average week. Look at right now in the NFC, the division leaders. The coaches are Doug Peterson, Jay Gruden, Matt Nagy, Mike McCarthy, Dirk Cutter, Sean Payton, Sean McVey, and Kyle Shanahan. Eight for eight offensive coaches. And by the way, the two best offenses right now statistically in the AFC, Andy Reed, Kansas City, offensive guy. And Miami and Adam Gase is the undefeated team with the Chief. offensive guys. So I'm watching Monday Night Football last night, and it's a video game. I mean, Ryan Fitzpatrick's a backup. It is a video game. And the Rams and the Vikings, by the way, the Vikings are struggling to run the ball. Kirk Cousins and the Vikings' offense is fourth in the league in passing. So Thursday, not on Fox, it's going to be incredible. Yeah, here's the stat. The offensive head coaches in the NFL right now are 30 and 25, and the defensive coaches, head coaches are 16 and 21. It's a real thing. It's happening. It's the three ball in the NBA.

It is happening. It's getting more dramatic. If you've got a young quarterback, you have to strongly consider as an owner a guy who knows offense. Hour three next. Hour three in L.A. This is the herd, wherever you may be. However you may be listening. Iheart Radio, Fox Sports Radio.

I think we're on Fox Sports Go or something right now. Joy Taylor's joining me. I just read something. I just saw. You remember making a murderer? Yes. Netflix documentary? Yeah.

The new one's out. I saw that. They have new evidence or something. What's that, John? I don't think it's out yet. They announce it's coming out. Yeah, October 19th. It's very exciting.

October 19th. We're watching Ozark right now. Ozarks fantastic. A lot of these shows, people keep telling me how great they are. I only watch about two shows a year. That's it? Narcos, the helpers,

the killings, my stuff's dark. True detective, year one. True detective is the darkest. Yeah, True Detective, year one with Woody Harrelson.

The best. Year two stunk. Ozark, I watch both seasons. I binge watch about two shows a year. You know, everybody, I've never watched Breaking Bad. I've never watched Game of Thrones.

A lot of this stuff. I've got to do Game of Thrones. 24-7 or lost. I think if you're just a. defended your I'm not really a sorcerer guy. Your take on Game of Thrones. But you're an intellect, though.

Game of Thrones is actually a very smart show. I don't, I don't, I think intellect's stretching it. I think I don't slobber and I can walk and chew gum at the same time. I don't slobber. Sometimes I can walk. I don't think, I like shows that are dark and real. If you're like, hey, Game of Thrones, I went over to this guy's house and they were in a castle and they were the Harry Potter stuff.

It's too escapism for me. I need realism. I understand. I like drug dealers and mob guys because those guys exist. Snowfall's very good. We're watching that also. Snowfall? Yes.

What's that about? Snowfall is about the emergence of crack. Oh, it is? FX about the emergence of crack. Yes. That sounds uplifting. Okay. That's right in my wheelhouse.

That's right down you're out. People dying, guys getting whacked? Drugs, yes. Very exciting. All right, coming up in 15 minutes, two-time Super Bowl champ James Harrison, and former Steeler is all fired up. Best for last, I'm going to tell you why I'm fine with the NFL going, quote, unquote, soft. You'll love this.

But Monday Night Football was absolutely riveting last night. So let's start with the Steelers who are now one, one, and one. Their win was exciting, their tie was exciting, and their loss was exciting. Is that when you try to change people, that's when it gets frustrating. Don't try to make a Republican more liberal. a liberal, more conservative. You women out there date the biker guy, stays up late at night, the rock star.

That's who you married. Don't try to change him. Then you'll get frustrated. Big Ben once again saved the Steelers. Dysfunctional. 13 penalties. Over 150 yards in penalties. The defense gave up over 450 yards to Ryan Fitzpatrick.

They pinned Tampa at the one at one point and got a penalty because a player was yelling with a ref. And here's Big Ben to essentially save the game because this now is what they are, Ben saving the dysfunctional mess known as Pittsburgh. Second 10. They will pass. Ralthusberger. Sidearms.

Downfield complete. Smith Schuster. What a play. Classic Big Ben for 18 yards. What a gutsy play about Ben. Yeah, and that's classic Pittsburgh. They can build a 20-point lead and they can lose a 20-point lead. They have the most penalties through three games in 10.

two decades in the NFL. That's who they are. Super talented. And if you can't spot it, I can't help you. If you don't think this team, and a lot of it goes on Mike Tomlin, you got players barking at the refs as you're pinning them deep at the one, you've got to be kidding me. And by the way, New England, their brand is smart and efficient. Pittsburgh's talented and dysfunctional.

And if they're still driving you, create, when I turned in that game last, night. I got home. My wife's like, anybody good on Monday night at football? I said, oh, it's a Steelers. They're always fascinating. They are the roller coaster right of the NFL. They're fun. They're exhilarating. And when you get off it, you're a little sick to your stomach. And just come to terms with it. It's not going to be easy. They're going to give you a dozen penalties a game. They've got players squawking at people. Sometimes they don't look well-coached. I mean, just think of what they offer you that nobody else says. Mike Tomlin is the best soundbite in the league. And Antonio Brown is the best perimeter player in the league. And Big Ben is the best

flag football quarterback, make it up as you go, quarterback in the league. And they have the most penalties in the league. And they have the most outspoken players in the league. And they're the only team that has a player off to the side barking with officials as you pin Tampa at the one in the league. This is what they are. In the last 10 games for the Pittsburgh Steelers, nine, have been decided mostly because of their dysfunction and their talent by five points or less. Now, why does that matter? Because some of those have been against good teams. And then some of those have been against winless Cleveland and the Brett Hundley Packers. But Jacksonville was a one-point game and playoff Kansas City was a one-point game and New England was a five-point game. And this is

what they are. And you just, when you start trying to make a conservative liberal and a liberal more conservative, you get frustrated. Last night, that's exactly what I expected. My wife asked, well, you're going to watch the game? I'm like, oh, oh, God, yes. They tie fun, they lose fun, and they win fun. And that was terrific, wildly entertaining television. Big Ben saved him again.

So, LeBron held his first press conference yesterday as a Los Angeles Laker, certainly not his first in the league. And what's interesting about this experiment for LeBron James, he is, as I'm looking at all the photos and stuff, he is surrounded by two groups, kids and castoffs. That's what this is. Kids and castoffs. And I'm watching all the shenanigans, the laughs and all the pictures. I was thinking, I'm looking at the pictures and I'm thinking, who's going to be his best friend on this team? The kids are the castoffs. or Luke Walton. But I want you to look at one of the team photos. I want you to look at this picture. Lanzo, LeBron, Kyle Kuzma, and Brandon Ingram.

Let's put this up there. They look like kids. They're skinnier. They're not as developed. Any of those guys going to be his best friend? Now think about this in the NBA. Three teams can win the championship this year. Overwhelmingly, Golden State, Boston, and Houston.

Then there's about 10 teams of which the Lakers are one of them that should be good, but they have no chance of the title. Some will be really good, some will be good, some will be sort of good, some will be just slightly less than good. LeBron has not been in the spot he is in now for 12 years, where he has no chance to win a championship. He is the only star on the roster, and he is essentially a mentor to a bunch of C and C plus players. I would say the gap between Golden State and the Lakers is the gap. gap between the Grand Canyon and here in L.A. Laurel Canyon. It is massive. And you know how they say, a picture says a thousand words. And, you know, that's the Laker picture. I mean, they look like

kids. So I want to put up arguably the greatest team of all time. I want to put up on photo day one of their pictures. These are the 95-96 Bulls. That's. is Rodman on his third team, Michael Jordan and Pippin. Those are men. When you look at that picture, is it me or is this the music you instantly think of? That's a bad ass trio. When you look at that picture, you're looking at men, fights, anything to win, been through the wars with the pistons, Celtics,

tackled by Rick Mahorn. When I look at that picture, that is the music I think of. Dramatic, big games, men, physical. Now I want you to look at the Laker picture with LeBron and the kids. And this is the music I think of.

Our children. LeBron, good luck. Kyle Kuzma would like a snow cone. Brandon Ingram wants a vanilla sandwich. I like the baseball mat. Oh, Chaco Taco Taco. Lonzo, yeah, he likes that. So that's what it takes to win in the NBA.

What it takes to win championships in the NBA is the Bulls music and men. Just lower expectations. That's what you're dealing with here for the next 12 months. LeBron, a mentor to see a. C-plus players, lower expectations. I think this is going to be a good team. One of about 12, with no chance, though, to win a championship. James Harrison, what do you make of the Steelers last night? He's around the corner. And I'm okay with the NFL going soft, and I'll prove my point later in Best for Last. Thursday nights are about to get a lot bigger as Fox becomes the

new network home for Thursday night football. Jared Gough, Todd Gurley, and the undefeated Rams host of Vikings in a battle of NFC heavyweights. Thursday at 7.30 Eastern on Fox. Also live on the NFL network and streaming on Amazon Prime. And the Rams corners. Marcus Peters is terrific. So is a keep to leave. These are great players.

They're both out. So that's like a thing. And the Vikings have really good wide receivers. So that game will be really, really competitive. Everybody's bailing on the Vikings. But come on, man, this is the NFL. Some weeks, I mean, Buffalo got out to a 27-0 lead on Minnesota. Nobody in the world thought that.

This is why whenever I hear this argument, Alabama could beat the worst team in college. I'm like, are you out of your mind? The worst team in the NFL? Buffalo would beat Alabama 50-0. I don't even know if it would be that close. I mean, in general, most teams in the NFL lose a game, at least a game of season, right?

Like, did people think the Vikings were going to go undefeated? I mean, obviously that was a bad loss and a shocking loss. You said before this weekend, that was the one dud this weekend and it ended up being the biggest surprise. but sometimes you just don't come ready. Half of the NFL is undrafted players. Like they don't all come from Ohio State and Alabama. With that James Harrison, former NFL linebacker, two rings, all-time Steelers sack leader.

By the way, you went to Kent State. You were undrafted. So that's amazing. In the history of the NFL, the Steelers and the Cowboys are the biggest, and the Packers are the biggest franchises. So I always laugh when I hear this. Oh, Alabama could go toe to toe. because there's always one stinker team in the NFL.

So you were undrafted. Why? I was at a small school. It was the D1 school, but I was at a small school. Yeah. And that was the biggest thing. You're playing against competition that's not Ohio State. It's not Alabama.

You were never on TV. No. No, we played in the Mac. I think the biggest game I might have played in was against Drew Brie's when he was at Purdue. So did you get to go to the senior bowl? No. No senior bowl. I didn't even get a invite to the combine.

You didn't go to the combine? No. Okay, what was your break? They just picked me up as a free agent. You know, afterwards, like you said, everybody don't get drafted. And I was picked up as a free agent, and I was basically a package deal. They needed a linebacker and the agent that I was with was like, hey, I got one. You know, I got this guy, too, you know, take them both.

and ended up, you know, getting sent to Pittsburgh. When did you know you could play in the national football? Because you played over in Europe in Dusseldorf or something, too. Yeah, I played at Ryan Fire in Dusseldorf, Germany. I did that in 2003, 2004, in between those two. And then went through that whole process, came back, ended up getting released because I went over for Baltimore. ended up getting released by Baltimore and picked up by the Steelers like two weeks before training camp started.

Was there a moment with the Steelers? Because you're their all-time sack leader. Was there a play a moment that you thought the coaches saw that I'm making this team? To be honest with you, no. I was cut so much that, you know, I said, I'm just going to go out here, put my head down and grind as hard as I can't, you know, do everything that I needed to do. You know, I learned how to play both, you know, outside linebackers. I learned how to play both inside linebacker position. and I did the best I could on special teams.

And, you know, they ended up keeping me. That's an amazing story. Yeah. That story in Antonio Gates, who didn't play college football, are two of the all-time stories. When you watched Pittsburgh last night, I said to start the show. You know where Antonio Gates went, right? Ken State.

Wayne State. Ken State. He went to Ken State? Yeah. Do you know him? I don't know him like that, but yeah, we know each other. We're not tighter. Ken State's got to do a better job promoting its athletes.

Jack Lambert. Jack Lambert went there? Wow. What did you see from the Steelers last night? I saw a team that got what they needed to get, which was the win. The win helps to cover up a lot of issues that are still there, obviously. The offense came out. They did a good job of starting off.

They scored a lot of points, but the second half came and they did nothing. They didn't score a point after that. Same thing with the defense. You know, they came out, you know, like I said before, it fits magic turned into picks Patrick. He started throwing the ball to him. You know, even with that, that was three turnovers. I think it was four committed altogether. And you're in a dog fight at the end, you know, just to come out with a three-point win.

So they did what they needed to do with winning, but it's still issues there. Yeah, I said earlier that I've just come to terms with what the Steelers are, talented and dysfunctional. And I'm okay. I mean, if I think of the Patriots, I think of smart and efficient. When I think of the Steelers, I think talented and dysfunctional. There was a play on that game when a player was barking on the sidelines with a ref. They punted the ball down to the one pinned Tampa Bay, and there's a penalty on it. And I'm like, what are you doing?

Like who, is that a Tomlin thing? You know, it has to go to the head coach because the head coach is the guy that, you know, he's supposed to lead these guys. So, you know, the wins, the losses, all that, you know, is part of him because he's the leader of his team. you know guys in situations like that you know have to have to sit back calm down and really just think about you know what they're doing before they do it and that's a situation where a guy I think just lost you know lost control of uh you know he's emotion you know I'm looking around the NFL right now and I was saying this earlier today that just the way that works with all the media and stuff like everybody now is crushing John Gruden but two of the three games they led going into the fourth um They've been very competitive. Miami's undefeated. They gave him a good game. They led the Rams going into the fourth. Rams are really good. They could. They might have kept that if they had Mac.

Yeah, well, if they had a pass rush. So when you look at the Raiders in Baker Mayfield, I kind of, I take a step back and I'm like, I think we love Baker a little too much, and I think we're dumping on Gruden a little too much. I actually think if you look at the Raiders schedule over the next eight weeks, they'll figure it out. I mean, Garoppolo's hurt now. They play them. Josh Rose and the rookies start in Arizona. They play them.

Their buy comes up at the perfect spot. They get the Colts at home. They get a Seahawks with a bad old line at home. I kind of look up and down the Raiders. When you look at them right now, do they seem dysfunctional with Gruden? Or do you think they get it together? I don't know if they get it together. I think that when you get John Gruden and him being the coach that everybody sees him as,

you're expecting him to come in there, tighten this ship. up and get it going and moving and and that hasn't happened um you know the first thing that happened is you let probably the best defensive player in the game like go to chicago um so that's not really go be helpful when you're losing games and they're winning games um to write the ship can he do it um i don't know it's yet to be honest how would it play in the locker room if a great player was let go like my my concern was how when because calil max no way he's not a lot of known as a good guy. He's a player's player. Not every player's a player's player, but he's a team guy, a good dude. How does that play in locker rooms? It doesn't, it depends on how it had all,

you know, banned out. I don't know if it was an issue of Gruden didn't want him or if it was the issue of the organization themselves, not wanting to do what needed to be done or if he didn't want to be there. But if it was he wanted to be there, then that means either the team didn't get it done or the coach didn't want him there. And that won't, you know, groove too well with the team, especially if it comes down to the head coach not wanting that person there, not wanting him to. Can you win in the NFL if the locker room doesn't like the coach? Can you win in the NFL if the locker room doesn't like the coach? I believe you can, I believe you can because at the end of the day, you're there to do a job. And your job is, long as the coach is giving

you good information, you have good skills. games, good plans, then you could get the job done without liking the coach because you have to win in order to get your ultimate goal, which is a Super Bowl, and, you know, be holding a Lombardi. So I believe it can be done. Who was your favorite coach? Was there a coach that you loved playing for? Dick LeBoe. Okay, why?

What did he do? Dick LeBoe treated everybody the same. He didn't cuss you. He didn't fuss you. He treated a guy that was a rookie. He talked to him and treated him with the same respect as he did, a guy that was dear 10, 15 years. You know, Dick LaBeau gave me the same respect at the time that he gave Joey Porter,

and that's something that resonated with me. You know, he didn't try and dog cuss you up and down because you were a young guy, and he felt like he could get away with it. He loved you, like, genuinely loved you. And that's why you wanted to play for him. You would do anything for him. You could ask anybody that played for Dick LaBoe. If Dick LaBoe told you to run through a wall, when you hit that wall, it's going to come down.

You do it because you believed him and you anything. he said you would do. And was he the exception? Most coaches not like that. There's not a lot of coaches like that. Did you have a coach that didn't like to play for? Yeah, I had a line breaker coach. Yeah, I did not like to play for him.

You want name one? No, no. I did not like him. Let's just say that. And he didn't, he thought he could talk to me any kind of way that he wanted to. So we exchanged words. I mean, probably led to me being cut. But, yeah, I don't take me and talk down to especially if that.

that's not the way that you talk to everybody else. I really don't take me and talk down to, period, to be honest. Yeah, well, yeah, who does? I mean, it's funny about LaBeau because LeBoe is an old guy, and the fact that the other coach had to have been younger than Dick LeBoe because Dick was old, so you like the old school guy. No, it was times, you know, in the locker rooms where, you know, reporters would come in and they'd be, you know, asking a guy a question.

And I'll give you an example, Ike Taylor. So, you know, yeah, yeah. So they're asking Ike a question, and they're basically trying to talk bad about Dick LeBow and his defense. So we literally have to stop, like, from being ready to put hands on this guy because we're like, dude, it has nothing to do with Dick LeBoe. We messed up that defense. We messed up to play the scheme, whatever it is. His defense works. We just have to execute it right.

And that's really how we, you know, felt about him and still do to this day. Isn't that amazing? Yeah, you know, what if a coach, so you said you can win with a coach, don't love. You love Dick Leboe. I've had different guys tell me this. Some coaches have huge egos. Yes, it's true. They do. Did Belichick have an ego? I didn't think he had ego. You know, he's not the guy that y'all see on TV. He's so far from that. He's actually funny. He got like a dry sense of humor. You know, he's very relatable. You can talk to him. How did he treat you? He treated me like he treated everybody else. You know, he was.

like I said, it was fine. I had no issues with it. None. Because he's a defensive guy. Yeah, I had no issues. Like I said, if you go there and you're a person that don't like organization, you don't like discipline, then you're not going to bond. You know, you're not going to like it there.

If you're a guy that, say, doesn't really want it, like, because they're going to test to see if, like, you really want it just through the regimen of what they do. And if you're like, you know, you've got guys that come there and they're there for a few, weeks and they're like you know what I'm retired you know yeah that's happened a few times yeah so if you if you're not really there and you don't really want it I mean you may end up doing that yeah by the way you and Tomlin may not have ended great he's seen as a player's coach is that a fair label of him yeah pro player talks to players like a play like he's a player um not not not well yeah I guess you could say that yes yeah you could say more yeah I could say more yeah I could say more yeah I could say more

but it's, you know, it's no need to. Yeah, I, I, it was funny. Last night there were a couple moments when he was on the sideline and a player talked to him during the game. And his facial expression, I was noticing this, it changes. Like, Mike, it's almost like he wishes he was a player sometimes. Like, it's a weird, the way. Well, you got to realize, like, when he first got, you know, his head coaching job,

he was actually the age of some of the players that, you know, he was coaching. If not a few years, you know, far removed, not, you know, far removed, them. So, you know, I think it is a little bit of, you know, you relate to them and, like, just through living situations, you know. Sure. Yeah. What you drive, the music you listen to, what you eat, what you do. Right.

Yeah. Where you go out. Where you go out, what you hang out, you know, what you listen to in college, high school, you know, things like that. Are you a Baker Mayfield guy? I am not a Baker Mayfield guy just yet. Let me see what he does over the course of the next, you know, three or four weeks or so after, you know, he has to actually sit down and he knows that he's going to be the starter.

He has to sit down and study the defenses and see what's going on. And when it gets out there, it's not too much information for him because he just went in. What was it? The second, third quarter. Yeah. Mostly second half. And now he's, you know, he's basically just going off raw talent. You know, he wasn't going into that game expecting to start or play.

Have you ever played a rookie quarterback or he's coming to? a game and you just didn't know what to expect. I mean, because obviously the Jets hadn't, you know, they had Harrod Taylor film. They didn't have a ton of Baker. Well, he never played in the NFL. Have you ever been caught off surprised by a young quarterback you don't have tape on? I won't say a caught off

surprise. I would say that you know, we've had times where we went against a guy that we didn't have a lot of information with. Right. But our whole thing was we're going to do what we do best and make him try and beat that. And, you know, just run from there. But quarterback's

do have what they call in poker tells. Quarterbacks do have habits. Like there's guys, okay, this guy doesn't throw well to the left. Right. I mean, everybody's got, like, if I say Philip Rivers to you, what comes to your mind as far as Philip Rivers, having faced him, what's he do a lot? Or if I say flacco to you, what comes to your mind in terms of a habit, flacco? Well, see, I don't, to be honest, I don't look at quarterback's habits as far as, like,

where they're throwing, because most of the time, I'm rushing. Right. So I'm just hoping that, you know, with Flacco, he's going to hold him to the ball a little longer. Yeah. With Philip, I'm hoping he goes and pats and I can slap the arm down when he goes to take off to throw it. So for me looking at tails of quarterbacks, I'm mostly looking at what this tackle was going to do. So you just dive deep on the tackle? To say dive deep?

I mean, I think I asked you this before. I think the best tackle I've ever seen is Walter Jones. That was the best tackle I ever seen. You went against Jonathan Ogden. Yeah, but I went against Ogden in the later part of his career. He was older, yeah. Best left tackle you ever faced. Joe Thomas.

Yeah, Joe is a beast. Why? He could take a bull rush and hold on to it. And you were a bullrusher. Mm-hmm. And he would just hold on to you. Yeah, he could absorb it. You know, he would take two, three steps, but he could absorb it and get it stopped.

So that was, that was, yeah. And he had good feet. So that was probably one of the best tackles that I had faced. James Harrison, former NFL linebacker, good stuff. Pittsburgh gal, Joy Taylor, with the news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news.

All right, so Pittsburgh finally got that first win. It was over Tampa Bay. Although very exciting, now Tampa Bay has a quarterback controversy on their hands because James Winston is back from suspension. and Fitzpatrick didn't play that great last night. He threw three interceptions on three consecutive passes in the first half, but he did rally late, mostly because Pittsburgh's defense isn't all that great right now. And Zirk Cutter was pretty coy about the impending decision last night

when he was asked about James Winston's return. Of course, we love James. I mean, James is a member of our team and anxious to get him back. He'll be great in our locker room. And I know James, whatever role that he ends up in, I know James will embrace that role and give it everything he's going. God. Boy, that was full of clichés, wasn't that?

He is a member of the team. He will play a role on the team and give it everything that he's got. Good Lord. I know you think that they're going to go back to James sooner than what people think. Look, that was not the showing that Fitzpatrick wanted coming into this week with James returning back to the facilities. However, they have overall just about the same winning percentage, 41% for Fitzpatrick, 40 for James Winston. Fitzpatrick does have the third best Rocky VR behind just

Holmes and Breeze so far this year. I mean, he's been playing out of his mind. He's thrown three games in a row over 400 yards. Yeah, it all... The thing about the NFL is September's a weird month. There's still some experimenting. You're playing a bunch of young players that you don't have film on everybody you play.

I kind of feel like with September, I've seen so many weird things in September, this is just another weird thing. that it's not going, you have all these young players. Ryan Fitzpatrick now, you haven't seen him in this offense. Not that I throw out, I mean, you don't play on Labor Day in the NFL. I kind of kind of feel like in the NFL, the season starts around Thanksgiving, and it's not that I don't buy stuff.

Like in baseball, Tom Verducci years ago did a story on this, that you can tell by June 1st who can play and who can't. Like, if you're eight games out of first place, June 1st, you're done, you can't play. I always feel like in the NFL, September is sort of a washout, month. It's Belichick's worst month. And then you get into October and you're like, okay, people are getting hurt. And then at Thanksgiving, by Thanksgiving, I know

who can totally not plan who can. And I think by Thanksgiving, James Winston quarterbacks, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. I think James will be back in this year. I just think you keep riding it with fits until the wheels totally fall off. They are at the Bears next week. Then they're at the Falcons and then they have the Browns

at home. So there's a lot of things. I mean, if he lays an egg next week, it's pretty certain that James Winston will be back in. I just think it's an interesting situation with the Bucks, the way that Fitzpatrick's playing, and the fact that James is not coming off an injury, but a suspension for something he involved himself in. So it's like an ongoing thing with James Winston, so we'll see what happens.

Another quarterback, the Josh Rosen era is alive in Arizona. Steve Wilkes made it official yesterday, and he names Rosen the starter against the Seahogs. Josh plays with a lot of confidence. I think he gives us an opportunity to be able to be successful. When you look at the situation when he went into the game, I didn't have a problem putting him in at that time because, again, I know he's very confident in what he's doing. As I talked before when Sam, I said Sam was out-started and it was his job to lose.

And I'm saying the exact same thing about Josh Rosen. Josh is out-starter and it's his job to lose. They spent a lot of money on Sam Bradford to play three-cent. starts. That's like 20 million bucks. What does that mean it's his job to lose? The Sam Bradford thing, I understand, but Josh Rosen is your quarterback. That's who you drafted. Huh?

If he loses the starting job, isn't that a disaster? Bradford's contracts one year, right? That's it. So it's one year. All right. They have to get a better. Listen, man, there's two offensive lines. You can sit and watch television at home. Jets and Arizona's offensive lines are not good. like those teams it doesn't matter i mean sam darnold and josh rosen baker's got a better offensive line baker's got carlos hyde baker's got jarvis landry

baker's got an offensive coach sam and josh rosen have bad o lines and defensive-minded head coaches those team got to those those those teams got to upgrade the o lines fast also you can't take anything away from the four minutes and 35 seconds no he's off from rosal he again i watched josh in the preseason and i've watched him now with arizona for four and a half minutes he just doesn't have time to throw. The pocket's money. He's not a big scrambler. I can't make any judgments on him.

I can't wait to watch the game because I watched him in preseason. He made a couple of great throws. I can take nothing from that offensive line. No, he just needs to get reps, which is why he started from the beginning. Finally, much was made about Lanzobal and Rajo Rondo's dynamic during the off season, and that was put to rest mostly yesterday at Media Day. Even after Luke Walton announced that Rondo will be the Lakers starting point guard for now, Lonzo had nothing but praise for Rondo.

I watched Rondo a lot growing up, especially when he played for Boston. You know, Ray John's usually the smartest dude on the court every time. So just watching him play pickup 5-on-5 is crazy because he's talking the whole time. And for me, I want to be more of a vocal leader, so he can definitely help me with that. And we already had a film session.

It's probably one of the best film sessions I ever had. So I'm definitely going to learn a lot from this year. That's cool. I like to hear that. By the way, Lonzo looks bigger in the shoulders. His body is completely changed. It looks like he's gained 15 pounds. Well, Ars said he was going to get his ball body over the summer.

He looks big. He looks completely different. I'm really, you know, it's so funny last year. Everybody was on this, he's a bus thing. And it's like, listen, these college kids, they play one year of college. They play 30 games. And so it's like, listen, until the All-Star break, here's the earth thing. They get hurt a lot in their first year because they go from 35 games to 80.

And most of them, and they go from regional travel to national, they're exhausted. They break down. Brandon Ingram breaks down. By the way, Ben Simmons first year, Mark L. Fultz. It's amazing how many of these rookies get hurt. They just wear down. Jason Tatum last year hit a wall. Then he kind of rebounded in the postseason.

But Lonzo looks thick. He looks bigger. It's a big jump from being a teenager to a man. Your body changes. You're eating differently. You're eating MBA meals. You're working out with MBA-level trainers and nutritionists. College basketball.

You're training harder and more often. Think about when you go to like UCLA. So most of your out of conference games are all at home. There's no requirement. So UCLA teams come. So you play almost no road games before conference play. It's mostly, you know, you get the teams at home. And then you get into conference play.

And it's a bunch of hour and a half to 45-minute flights to Arizona and Utah. And then you go to the NBA and you're playing every night. Game ends, you're on a flight. You're flying. Some kids don't like to fly. They haven't flown a lot. anxious flyers, get into town at three, go to bed, up for shoot-around. These guys are overwhelmed as rookies, emotionally, physically.

You look at Lonzo, you're like, oh, okay, God. It's a whole different lifestyle. He looks like a different body here three months after the season. Yeah. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd-Ly news.

Coming up, if you think the NFL's gone soft, a couple of things you're forgetting, We'll remind you it's funny next and best for last. Want more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Car shopping can be confusing dealer price, list price, invoice. TrueCar shows you what other people paid for the same car you're looking for.

Truecar.com. New or used. Truecar.com. All right, it's time for one of our favorite games. good rule, bad rule. Let's go best for last. After almost three hours, Colin apparently hasn't gotten to the point yet. Quit holding out on us, cowherd.

It's the best for last. Everybody is whining. The NFL's gone soft with all these rule changes. My argument's been this is the way it works in society. There are two kinds of men and mostly two kinds of people. I miss the old days. I'm not willing to evolve. I'm a tough guy. I want my body to be put to the ultimate test.

Then there's the other type of guys I would call reasonably smart guys, which is, oh, I should eat better, stop smoking camel filters. There's new information out. Maybe I should change a live longer guy. I'm a big believer in you don't have to change everything, but be willing to evolve, be curious. And so we're going to create a game today called good rule or bad rule. These are actual rules in the NFL at one time. Tell me if they were making the game soft, bad rule or good rule. Here we go.

All right, Colin, let's start in 1994 when the NFL introduced the controversial two-point conversion. Before then, all you could do after a touchdown was kick a boring extra point. Was introducing the two-point conversion a good rule change? Joy, I think we agree on this. I will go with yes. Good rule. Actually, if you're down by eight and there's three minutes to go, you don't need to. you don't need two possessions

and everybody freaked out you know who didn't like it coaches who were going to have to make late game decisions it's a great rule when you're down eight you got a chance to tie it plus some of these two-point plays that have been dreamed up by the smart coaches have been wildly fun

the only people that I think would oppose you would be Falcons fans who lost a Super Bowl because of Brady getting two-point conversions is this a good rule change or not in 1974 the goalposts were moved behind the end zone from their previous position on the goal line and in everyone's way was moving the goalposts behind the end zone a good rule change. Yeah, I'd say having a giant piece of metal in the middle of the end zone wasn't good

for player safety. Yeah. We saw several guys run into the stands behind the goalposts now. And I'm pretty sure the walls have been there for a while too. So the goalposts in the middle of the field seems like a good thing to. move out of the way. That'd be like staying on a tarmac. Listen, we used to have a pole right in the middle of the tarmac. Plains would bump into. We moved it away from the tarmac.

I'd say that's a good rule, John. Think about it. It made field goals easier and touchdowns harder. Why would you want that? Good point. In 1940, quarterbacks were finally allowed to pass the ball from anywhere behind the line of scrimmage. Before that, quarterbacks had to pass the ball from five yards behind the line of scrimmage. So you couldn't do a bubble screen. You couldn't go high, let go of it. had to be at least five yards back to throw the ball,

was allowing quarterbacks to pass from anywhere a good rule change. Ah, the game, that was so soft. Bubble screens are soft. I would say Brady had one of these the other night. Hike ball out. Like he didn't even take a step, and you get the ball out quickly to skill position players on the perimeter. When they do those bubble screens, I love bubbles screens.

Or how about when you're about to get tackled and you step up in the pocket? That would be illegal. You wouldn't be able to throw the ball at that point. You basically have two lines of scrimmage. Like you have the line that you line up on, and then you have the line you can throw behind. They make it more complicated. By the way, sports radio back in those days probably complained that it made the game soft. I think it's a good rule.

I don't know if they had sports radio in 1940, but if they did, I'm sure they complained. In 1942, the league made helmets mandatory. Before 1942, you didn't have to wear a helmet. Was requiring players to wear helmets a good rule change? I can guarantee you in sports radio in 1942, people had aneurysms on this. You have to wear a helmet. Look at this. There's a guy catching the football with no helmet.

That's incredible. I don't think you could have a play in the NFL without a helmet today. Huh? I mean, a singular play. You get fine for taking your helmet on on the field when the play is not going. on. But this made the game very soft. Made the game incredibly soft. John, I think the new helmet rule,

it's a good rule. Great of they were leather helmets, but it's good that they were at least mandatory. All right, last one. In 1927, the league forced quarterbacks do hike the ball from between the hash marks. Before that, there were no hash marks. So you could hike the ball from right next to the sideline if that's where you got tackled or that's where you wanted to.

That one really was inventing hash marks a good idea. It sounds like chaos. It does, doesn't it? I didn't even know that. Look at this. Look at somebody. Where do we get the, that's a good rule, John. I like the idea of not hiking the ball a foot from the coach on the sidelines.

I mean, it looks like rugby. But this is my point. It's a cultural thing. There's people in America, 40% of people never move out of the area code. And those people hate change. And it's okay. There's nothing wrong. And then there's kids that were in the military.

their dads were in the military, moms in the military, that bounced all over the country. And I've moved my kids around the country, and they like change. They can't wait to move. So these people, it's cultural. It's not even about football. There's just a group of people in America that any change is bad. They want to grow up in the same house, same friends,

same neighborhood, same corner bar. And the idea, if you go look at the NFL's history, the reason it overtook baseball was a willingness to adapt to modern technology. A football game on television doesn't even look like a football game television in 1985. Adapt. Tomorrow, Doug Gottlieb, Joel Clatt,

former Packer-wide receiver, James Jones, Eric Decker, who was with the Patriots for an hour. Jets and Titans much longer is joining us. Thanks for joining us today. We will see you tomorrow. This in L.A. is the herd. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind,

and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guide, Not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clifford Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Clifford Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What?

Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clippers show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was harmed. You just understood. That's how personal it got.

Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis' keep coming to him. He's like, you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.

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