The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Straight Fire - Messi's Historic Night, NFL RBs are Stuck in Mud & Steph vs LeBron

Episode Date: July 24, 2023

Jason discusses what Lionel Messi's iconic MLS debut means for the sport of soccer moving forward in America, what the financial future holds for NFL running backs like Saquon Barkley, Derrick Henry and Nick Chubb following their well-reported meeting of the minds over the weekend and why exactly Steph Curry left LeBron James off his all-time NBA starting five (again).  Follow Jason on Twitter and Instagram. Click here to subscribe, rate and review all of the latest Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre podcasts! #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque.

Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok's podcast network on TikTok. Hey, what's good, y'all?

You're listening to Learn the Hard Way with your favorite therapist and host, Kear Games. This space is about black men's experiences, having honest conversations that it's really not safe to have anywhere, but you're having them with a licensed professional who knows what he's doing. How many men carry a suit or armor? It signals to the world that you not to be played with.

And just because you have the capability that does not mean that you need to. Listen and learn the hard way on the IHard radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. The volume. This is Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre. What is up, Straight Fire, fam? It's me, Jason McIntyre, Straight Fire. For Monday, July 24th. The month is nearly over.

I got my kids asking me, Dad, how much longer is left in summer? And I feel like summer's flying by. July 4th is usually the midway point. I was out of town for July 4th, first time in a while. And now here we are like the end of July. Women's World Cup is starting to chew into summer. MLB trade talks allegedly heating up.

And, oh, by the way, this comet named Lionel Messi hit the American Soccer League MLS over the weekend. Oh my gosh. Before we get to that, the running backs around the NFL set up a Zoom conference call to deal with what's happening in the NFL. A little silly, but we'll get into that. And we've got some interesting stuff coming this week.

I do quickly want to start, so you guys know my men's league for basketball. We've expanded the roster a little bit because it's summer. You guys are traveling. And I had a funny moment this weekend. So we've had like soft numbers a lot. last couple weeks, people are traveling. And so this week, a lot of guys were able to show we had 10 guys. So it was like clunky a little bit.

And then we ended up blowing out the third place team. We won by like 30. But midway through the game, and these guys are definitely fans of the herd. And oh, by the way, they're listening to the podcast. So I know they're tuning in. One of the guys, at the end of the last time we beat him, he's like, we are playing like the Minnesota Timberwolves right now. And I just start cracking up on the court.

So anyways, he's coming up to me in the game. He's like, Jay, you like that move. I was like, that was a nice move. you know, you're down 25. And he's like, yo, maybe I tag you, I slide into the DMs and you pop it online. And I looked at it above like, dude, are you serious? He was mostly joking, but also serious. And it's just like the response has been overwhelming to podcast listeners, watches of the herd.

Oh, by the way, I am hersting the herd. Today, Tuesday and Wednesday, while cowherds out on vacation, I am going to have so much fun. And actually I'm going to talk about Lionel Messi here for a second. I know not everybody loves soccer. But think for a second. I want you guys to transport yourself back to when you were like 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, in your basement playing on the nerve hoop. I know you did this because I did it.

I know all of you did this. Or you're on your driveway shooting buckets or in your backyard wherever you had a hoop. And you're counting down. Five, four, you're dribbling between your legs and you're jacking a prayer. And if it misses, you just like get the rebound and start over. Four, McIntyre, three. And you're chucking. And eventually you'll make one, you'll make one.

Oh, the crowd goes. And these are the moments you soak up in sports. You want to be the hero where the adulation is all showered upon you. And I'll never forget. I've mentioned this several times on social media. One of my favorite buzzer beaters ever in sports. And there's a million, so it's tough to sift through. But one that really was memorable.

Dwayne Wayne gets a rebound at home, dribbles up, like looks at the clock, shoots a half, like inside between the half-court line and the three-point line, and he buries a three to win the game at home. Crowds going wild. He does like the airplane thing and then jumps on the scorers table and is pointing, this is my house.

I think that's maybe my favorite celebration ever. And it's just like that is everything about sports. That's why we love sports. Those moments. And folks, when Leo Nel Messi played for Miami on Friday night, I'm toggling between women's World Cup, USA, Vietnam. USA did not look great.

They dominated. I think I saw a show. shots on goal were 23-0-0. They did dominate, but not finishing a lot. And so I'm going back to the Messi game, Inter-Miamy against Cruz Azul, Liga's Cup. Messi comes on at about the 50th minute.

LeBron is taking photos, Kim Kardashian. It was like a scene in Miami, Fort Lauderdale, technically. We had the guest on Friday. He was like, oh, I don't think Messi's going to score. Messi had some dynamic moments. And then, of course, you know, it reaches the day-new mall. Messi fouled right outside the box. He sold it well, and then Messi lines up the free kick.

And I'm telling my kids, like, I got the kids. I'm like, guys, come on. This is the stuff dreams are made of right here. Messy's lighting up for the free kick in the 93rd minute tie game. And I'm transported back to my basement, shooting on the nerve hoop. And even, like, it wasn't exactly the same. You can't do the same with football because it's tough. You need the quarterback to throw you the ball.

Like maybe your brother could chuck you balls and you catch for the game-winning touchdown. Baseball, you know, you could maybe throw it up to yourself and just crush it over the fence. I've done that. But soccer, you can do it with a kick. Messi lines up the free kick. And, I mean, folks, it was one of those moments. Even if you don't love soccer, Messi scores, and it's like,

this is a storybook moment. You know, I start going crazy, running around the house. Oh, my gosh, are you kidding. The kids are freaking out. Like, how? Is this real? Did this really just happen?

Messy's first game for the last place team in the league. He comes on and drills a shot, a free kick, top shelf, out of the reach of the goalie. I mean, game winner. And he's running around. It's just bedless. him in chaos. If you haven't heard the announcer on, I think it's Univision, he is just yelling.

He's just like indiscriminately yelling words like, oh my, I don't even know what the words were. Just screaming. And Messi's running around. Everybody's chasing him. Folks, listen, you think of the essence of sports and, you know, like the Joe Carter walkoff home run in the World Series, whereas, you know, surrounding the bases, Toronto wins the World Series.

Damien Lillard with his shot and then the bye-bye. There's been a lot of great moments. And I know this was just a Liga's Cup group game. But man, this was, for me, this moment was just like, that's something I don't think you'll ever forget. I'll be on my deathbed at 91, 97, whatever the age is. And I'll be like, that messy goal was sick. Do you remember running around? Like, it was just one of those moments, man.

I don't know. That was for me, the highlight of my weekend. If you notice, I had been hyping tennis recently. And first time playing doubles in tennis in a tournament. did not go well. Didn't go well. We're just not going to talk about it. We're going to pretend it did not happen.

We're going to move on to the NFL. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds.

I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media.

Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered. conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clivert Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger.

So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do a little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at a podcast.

I'm Sam Jett. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick you here. unpack what went down and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack all day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack.

So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for Blank. Black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way with me, your host, and your favorite

therapist, Keer Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, We get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch.

Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust.

I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keer Gang. is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. There was a secret, although it was not so secret, Zoom conference call among all the running backs or many of the running backs in the league.

Now, a lot of the centers on the Saquan-Barkley, Josh Jacobs stuff, but remember, these are two important numbers. Aaron Jones took a pay cut to stay in Green Bay. Joe Mixon took a pay cut to stay in Cincinnati. I think Mixon took a $5 million pay cut. And Miles Sanders, coming off the best season of his career, outstanding numbers, signed like a three-year, $12 million deal to go to, I think is Charlotte.

Three years, 12 million bucks. For a guy who's coming off a great season, they just went to the Super Bowl. It's like, you know, running back situation is bleak. And the running backs are trying to get together, and, you know, I don't know what their game plan is. but they want to battle and push back to save their position. Nick Chubb, who is getting paid handsomely as he should in Cleveland because he's one of the elite running backs.

By the way, there's an out in his contract after this season. Nick Chubb, you know, good luck. Here's Nick Chubb on the conference call. There's really nothing we can do. We're kind of handcuffed with the situation, but I took from it. McCaffrey, Derek Henry, and Sequin, a lot of good points. But the biggest thing is, we're at a position. where our production hurts us the most.

If we go out there and run for 2,000 yards with so many carries the next year, they're going to say, you're probably worn down. That's the biggest thing I took from it. It's tough. It hurts us to go out there and do good. That obviously is a very bad situation. You're being penalized from being the bell cow and carrying the team. The win is don't carry the ball as many times.

That's the job. The job description is take the ball, run into the line of scrimmage, Jet sweeps go wide, inside handoffs, everything. Bottom line is you want to carry the football, gain yards, and then you're supposed to get a big contract. But that's not how the position works. And again, listen, I feel awful for these guys. But as others have pointed out,

the union for the NFL is the weakest. When you look at MLB, NBA, the union for the NFL is the worst. And, you know, they don't have guaranteed contracts. It feels like it's every man for themselves. And, you know, like Nick Chubb can get on the call and be like, you know, I'm making a lot of money this year. Sorry, guys.

And then next year, he could be one of these guys getting the short end of the stick. It's funny. We don't even hear about Kareem Hunt or Z. Kellyan. Like, what do they got cooking? Who knows? Sadly, Dalvin Cook, like, he's in that same boat. Like, do they need someone to get injured for them to get on the field? And it just doesn't look good.

I know this topic is kind of getting worn out. people are annoyed with it. But the reality is like, it's a thing. I don't know how it affects like an Austin Echler going forward because he's a little different and he's like a big receiving back. But yeah, if I'm a running back in high school or I'm a running back in college, I start to think, well, shucks, it would be foolish of me to go to the NFL. I almost would be better served to stay in college and try to collect as much NIL money

as I can because guess what? In college, they love you for carrying the ball. Michigan's got two damn good running backs this year. One of them could go on to the NFL. He's stuck around. Imagine if he can clear a million in NIL money. You know? Second contract might not get that.

So Rob, I don't know. I feel bad for these guys. I don't have a solution. I don't think there's an easy solution. I don't anticipate them all going on strike. Hey, man, power in numbers. If all of us strike, like, these guys got to put food on the table for their families, you know? It's a tough spot, Rob.

And, you know, frankly, I don't have an answer for them. Somebody much smarter than you. me is going to have to say, hey, running backs, here's what you got to do. Yeah, it's definitely not a black and white situation. But as far as Nick Chub goes, there's two things that I latched on to. Number one, he says right now there's really anything we can do, which even though it sounds the fetus is a thousand percent accurate because of the current CBA, they are locked in for seven more years.

There is zero chance you're going to be able to make an amendment to the CBA to appease just one small portion of the NFL family. You're not going to go ahead and have a huge strike just to appease running backs. Like that's not, it's got to be everybody. That's not going to happen. But the other part that I latched onto was you didn't even mention because it's way down at the end of the story that they kind of buried it. They asked him about Sequin and he says, I know it can be me one day and I'm just kind of playing both sides. I'm here for my team, but I'm also understanding the situation that I could be in. And that to me, plays to exactly what you said a minute ago, this is the problem in today's NFL. You are never

going to get guaranteed contracts. You are never going to get good health care when you retirement. You are never going to get a quality pension fund that you see in the NBA and the Major League Baseball unless you're willing to do something extreme. And these players, because they understand the position that they're in, they're easily replaced. One thing that was mentioned in the meeting was, hey, if we hold out and we don't play, then one issue is that leads an undrafted guy or a late round guy to come in and he balls out and suddenly we lose all our leverage. So that, you know, kind of an issue right there in itself. But unless somebody is willing to be extreme, or in this case, a group of people are willing to take a stand and risk their careers or risk their own livelihood, it's never going to change. It's one of the reasons why we talked about this years ago.

I was so frustrated with the way Tom Brady and Patrick Mahomes operate their contracts because if the guys who truly have leverage, like Tom Brady, Patrick Mahomes, if we're a running back situation, Derek Henry, if you're in a situation where you can ask for everything, not just the most guaranteed, not just the most years, not just the most average annual value. But if you can say I want three years, years, 150 million all guaranteed. I want a full no trade clause. I want, whatever, pick

everything that you want. Until the guys who fully have leverage, actually have to actually use it, this is going to keep happening. You're just going to keep kicking the can down the road. And so because these current players have consistently conceded on dumb shit, like we don't want to get tested for weed. We want less padded practices. That's why they're getting nickel and they're accepting these nickel and dime concessions while not keeping an eye on the big dollar things such as

guaranteed money eliminated the franchise tag and things like that one thing that I think they don't really understand is that we're all replaceable listen I like to think hey man I've been on the herd we set records January through July or sorry

through June first six months of the year set records for viewership on FS1 on the show and I think, oh, I'm bulletproof, yo, we're crushing it. We're dominating. I can't start to all of a sudden act of fool and say, I'm going to hold out, I need more money because we're setting records. It doesn't work like that. They'll look at me and say, hey, man, we get it. You don't want to do it. There's 50 million other guys willing to fill that role. And just like you said, there's probably at least 100 guys who either played college or

playing semi-professionally somewhere who would more than gladly try to jump in and fill the role of the running back. And listen, let's be real. Running back is not like left tackle or quarterback. You're not the captain of the defense where it's, hey, you've got to dig into that playbook and know all the calls and everything. You're running back. I'm not devaluing the position.

That's just the reality. It is kind of a plug-and-play spot. I do want to drill down on one thing, though. I don't know if you saw this, Rob. So Xavier McKinney is the defensive back from Alabama who's on the Giants. and he was asked about the Sequin Barclay situation. And again, I know people think I'm picking on the Giants because I'm a Jets guy. Just hear what I say.

Xavier McKinney on Sequin Barclay. I've talked to him, and regardless of any decision that he makes, whether he's there or whether he's not there, I respect it 100%. I'm behind him 100%. I would have no feelings, no nothing towards him, whatever decision he decides. Essentially, Xavier McKinney is saying,

we're all with him. We respect him. If he doesn't want to go to camp, I get it. Now, that to me is significant. And I know people don't want to believe that the Daniel Jones contract is really driving a wedge in that locker room. But the players understand Barclay's value to the team. They definitely do. I know the Giants fans don't. They think, oh, Daniel Jones, hey, him and dayball crushing.

Without Sake 1, this is a six or seven win team. They're not a playoff team. and I think the players saw what Daniel Jones got and outside of his wide receiver room, my guess, just a guess, would be that most of the New York Giants feel that Sequin got screwed. And they paid Daniel Jones way too much money.

He got way too much guaranteed money. And Sequin is more important to that team than Daniel Jones. If you're asking me to rank who matters most on that team, Brian Daibald, Sequan Barkley, Daniel Jones. Now, you could throw in, you know, some of the defenders are integral and, you know, the offensive line, obviously. But Daibol made Jones. Sequin is a massive, massive stud.

And if he's healthy, that team's in great shape. If he's not, Daniel Jones ain't carrying him anywhere. So I don't know, Rob, the McKinney quote, you just read them and you're like, wow, sure as hell sounds like that locker room is riding with Seekwan. No mention of Daniel Jones, except for his receivers caping up for his low Madden score, you'd expect, hey, throw me the damn ball. Well, it's funny that you mentioned that because when Darius Sladen, who caped up for his guy and his Madden rating,

and it got picked up by a few outlets, notably Pro Football Focus, where, you know, he says, L.O.L. Daniel Jones is 75, count your days Madden developers, I'll find you. You'll answer for your sins against humanity. I'm sure he was kind of joking. Problem. But, you know, former NFL-wide receiver, I think he's with Showtime now.

Brandon Marshall retweets it. And he says, tweet that for Seqwan. not this meaningless ish. And suddenly that gets almost just as much run as the initial tweet did. Because it kind of points to what could be considered a bigger issue that you pointed out. Are you sure that everybody in that locker room is happy with Daniel Jones? Are you positive that they're fully on board with their franchise quarterback knowing that because he had to get that deal, which I don't think anybody thinks he actually deserves at this point. in his career.

But because he got it, that meant that they lost their best player. Rob, there's a body of work of Daniel Jones. The Giants, before last season, did not want to pick up his fifth year option. Everybody knows what he is. It's not his one-season wonder with Day Bowl. Put it all together.

Like, it's a Giants fans, I'm not picking on you. This is just the reality. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all,

embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. Yep, that's me.

Clipper Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skisks of a win. hits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment.

And the next, we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right what you need to be. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people.

I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with a little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill,

waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack all day, but just so you're just so you. y'all know. I mean, at this point, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Now you're finishing that sentence. And yes, I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Welcome to my new podcast. Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your face. favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing,

we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it, and we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns. Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth?

Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keir Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way. Open your free I Heart Radio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now.

I'll say this. NFL starting to pick up. I could talk about the Jets and how good Aaron Rogers looked in practice. I see my guy Albert Breer pushing. Boy, Carol Wilson looks amazing. I mean, you're seeing all these Jets passes. I'm going to just dial it back and just try to chill a little bit. Just dial it down to like a notch.

Yes, I'm excited for the Jets. But I'm star for NBA news, Rob, and we still have nothing on Dame Lillard. I saw Joel and Bede got married over the weekend. I didn't see the full guest list. I did not see James Harden in any of the pictures or videos or IG stories. I just don't know what's going on there. It feels like the NFL is starting to go full force. And the NBA is officially going to go in hibernation for about a month.

Sorry, the NBA is going to go in hibernation for about a month. But it's kind of disappointing. Hold on. I think I have something that's right up your alley, actually. Oh, boy, here we go. Your guy, Steph Curry, the greatest point guard in NBA history. He's been doing a media tour to promote his new documentary. Yes.

And for the second time in seven months, he left LeBron James off his all-time starting five. Now, when he did it in December, you think, hey, maybe it's just competitive juices flowing. Its initial top five was Shaq, Magic, Jordan, Durkin himself. Is this top five or starting five? This is his starting five. Okay. Okay. So you're like, all right. Well, you know, Steph Curry's in the middle of his season. Him and LeBron are actually jostling for playoff position. You understand that kind of thing, right?

Right. When that became a story, you would think that when they asked him again over the weekend in a promotional interview that he would wise up, you know, and say, hey, I got to include LeBron James. But no. This time he removes himself, I guess, because he wants to be humble. And he says, I've got Shaq, Tim Duncan now instead of Dirk. Magic Johnson's still there. Michael Jordan. still there. And he says, I'm going to put Larry Bird at small four. No, actually, you know, I'm going to take off Larry Bird. Okay, we said to put LeBron, right?

No, he replaces Larry Bird with Kobe Bryant. Wow. So he moved a guy who wasn't even a small forward, a small forward ahead of the king. Your thoughts, Jason. No, geez. Curry, what you got to do? You know, is Curry willing to be the villain? Is that where he's ready to go? Because they first

acquire Chris Paul. I'm assuming they ran that by Curry before pulling the trigger. And now he's taken digs at LeBron. One thing that comes out, Rob, is, you know, Curry, there's all these famous videos and pictures of him alongside his dad going to NBA games in, you know, the 90s. Del Curry was with, I believe, the Hornets. And Curry watched a lot of the alleged starting five there. And I say alleging is like, come on.

Like, Shaq the best center in NBA history, like totally dominant. Are we really putting Wilt ahead of Shack? Now, this is hypothetical, and I do think a lot of the modern players would roll over the older players. But Wilt versus Shack is interesting. Like, Shaq was massively powerful. Wasn't Wilt like 7-1-270?

He was a large individual, Rob. Shack versus Wilt would be fascinating. I'm sure Shaq would get his, but it's weird. I put Russell down a peg. It's not bashing Russell. I just very limited offensively. I felt Will at 7-1 could do whatever he wanted.

Russell was like 6, 9 and a half, which is insane. Magic at point guard, I get that. You look a little egotistical. Like, where's the win, Rob? If he just puts himself on the team over Magic Johnson, Curry, oh, he's so arrogant. Oh, my gosh. He's celebrating on the court.

And now he puts himself above magic. Like, it wouldn't be a great look. Tim Duncan, I totally get underrated superstar. I'm surprised no bird. I could not go Kobe at the small forward over LeBron, but Kobe is a safe pick. Rob is a Laker fan, you know this. You know, RIP Kobe.

I was ever the massive Kobe fan. Obviously a really, really good player. A lot of my buddies are huge Kobe fans. I just was never the biggest, oh my gosh, Kobe Bryant, I got a ride with him guy. I was kind of a shack guy, but let's not talk about it. And like nobody's going to get on your case for talking about Kobe after the tragedy with the helicopter a few years ago. So it's an interesting starting.

I don't think there's anything malicious there. I am not totally surprised. Remember, he didn't go with any totally modern players, right? I guess the only guy on that list is modern would be Shaq and Kobe. But other than that, he went with all guys who played as he was like growing up or in college. Yeah, well, I mean, Tim Duncan, too. I mean, I know people forget that he was part of that same Shaq Kobe generation. That's a good point.

Right. But to me, I love that Steph Curry left LeBron office starting five again for the second time. Because even if I disagree with it, like the overall point, the fact remains is it leads credence to the idea that Steph does not hold. LeBron in this upper echelon mythical being kind of guy that some younger players do now and a lot of people in the media do. Steph Curry, does me psychoanalyzing him. This is him saying, I don't even think this guy's better than me. I've beat him in the finals head to head three times.

I am his peer. He is not somebody who I need to hold in such high regard as if I can never touch. him in the same way that I'm going to view Michael Jordan and Kobe and Duncan and Shaq because I never had to really play against those guys in their prime so I can only make them mythological creatures. I went toe to toe to toe with LeBron and I was the one who won. I went toe to toe to toe with LeBron and if you went and looked at those 2015 and 2016 rosters, I could make a case that the Cleveland Cavaliers had a better roster top to bottom

more talent than those Golden State Warriors teams. The difference was, is that the Golden State Warriors played a good team game and they played well together versus the Cleveland Cavaliers, which was a lot of overwhelming you with talent, not necessarily as much of a cohesive unit. So if I'm Steph Curry, and again, even if I disagree with this, but if I'm Steph Curry, hell yeah, I think I'm just as good as LeBron. I have, I was just as much a part of dominating that decade as he was. He can say that he got to the finals as many times in a row, and that's cool, and that's cute and everything like that. But you know who is regarded as having the best teams during that era? Me. Not him.

So I'm 1,000% on board with Steph Curry willing to say that, no, LeBron's not all that in a bag of chips. Because if he is, then I am too. So I'm not going to put him on a pedestal like the rest of you peons out here. Wow, okay. That begs the question. Do you have Curry top 10 and where do you have LeBron? I have LeBron 2 and I have Curry just outside of the top 10. Like 12, 11.

Outside of the top 10? Yes. Interesting. LeBron just beat Curry this year to make it, I believe, 3 to 2 head to head. So 2015, LeBron lost Kevin Love before the finals. Then Kyrie got hurt at the end of game one, I think, in overtime. And it was basically LeBron again. against everybody.

And Curry came out on top. The following year was the Draymond suspension, wackiness, 3-1, comeback. So it's 1-1. Then Curry gets Kevin Durreat. Now it's 3-1. And, yeah, so it's 3-2 head-to-head. Huh.

And if you're in the LeBron camp, well, Curry was never a finals MVP, head-to-head against LeBron. He was never the best plan on the floor. LeBron was. Okay. Is Curry on LeBron's level? I have Curry, I believe, at 10, 9 or 10, and LeBron at 1.

And I know people hate that, and I put it out over the weekend. Like when LeBron was at Messi's game and hugged him, I was like, look at that. The greatest basketball player in the history of the sport hugging the greatest soccer player in the history of the sport. And of course, all these Pele-Maradona fans freaked out and all these Jordan sick of fans go crazy. I don't think it's slanted to call Jordan too. I have LeBron won. Just the accomplishments, the still playing, the no retirements, the consecutive trips to the finals.

I don't, I have been on this since, like, I think it was since he came back against the Warriors. I said, if he could, listen, he's leaving Cleveland. If he gets one more in another city, basically anywhere he goes, he gets titles. He goes to Miami, gets titles, goes back to Cleveland, gets a title, goes to the Lakers, gets a title. Like, that's unbelievable.

It truly is. It builds teams everywhere he goes and wins. I wonder what LeBron thinks of this. Can we get him on the pod, Rob? Can you effort that? I'll shoot Rich Paul at Tex and see what happens. Well, I do know that you guys know my son would play in this summer basketball league out here when he's not an end this summer. But USC's basketball coach was my son's coach last summer and lives, I don't know, three blocks from me.

And, you know, I drive by his house often. and he recently had a gathering and Brani was there and like the whole USC team and it was, you know, in my head, I'm like, oh, imagine if LeBron showed up and I happen to drive by and LeBron's outside. I was like, yo, Brani, let me haul out LeBron real quick. Like I have so many questions for LeBron

because, yes, he answers basketball questions, but there's so many questions I have outside of the obvious that he's just not going to answer. but I would love just in a one-on-one setting to just ask him and just get his real thoughts without like a camera in his face, which wouldn't have as much value, but you know what I mean. Anyways. All right, Rob, we've gone long for a Monday morning.

We have a strong guest list so far for this week. NFL camps are happening. I think we're less than two weeks to the Jets Packers season. Not Jets Packers. Who's the Jets opening with Rob? Oh, jeets somebody in the Hall of Fame game. Fetz fan. That should be something you know off top of your head, man. I should, yeah, but it's preseason. I don't put a lot of stock in that.

Anyways, all right. Jets Browns. We're back tomorrow. Jets who? Jets Browns. Oh, geez. I can't wait for that. Talk to you tomorrow. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Street. Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

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A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my time. my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes,

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