The Herd with Colin Cowherd - The Draymond Green Show - Pascal Siakam

Episode Date: April 6, 2023

Pascal Siakam joins 'The Draymond Green Show' to discuss his journey to the NBA from Cameroon, how he felt when DeMar DeRozan was traded for Kawhi Leonard, his relationship with Joel Embiid, beating Steph Curry, Kevin Durant and the Warriors in the Finals, Kawhi leaving for the Clippers, his MVP pick this season, and more.  Produced by: Jackson Safon #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

The volume. What's up, everybody? Welcome back to the Draymond Green show, this next guest. I'm excited to have. It's two-time All-Star, but as you all know, we always talk about this. You've got to have a resume coming on this show. Two-time All-Star NBA champion, 2019 Most Improved Player. Now, the interesting thing about this guy being an NBA champion is, as you all know,

there aren't many guys that can say they beat us, me, and an NBA finals. LeBron being one, and obviously the Raptors being the other one. I'm honored to have this next guest, my brother, Pascal Seaccom. Thank you for coming on the show, bro. Thank you. Appreciate it, man. Appreciate it for having me. I'm not a podcast guy, but there's a couple of them that I, you know, like,

when they tell me, I'm like, I'm in it. I'm in it. So let's go. I appreciate that, man. I can't say that I'm over 2019 yet. I know we won a championship last year. No, man, come on, bro. It's hard to get over that.

You got too many of those to be to do that. You got too many of those to say that. Like, you got a lot of them. But see, here's what you have in the experience. And it is actually one of the worst things in the NBA that can happen to you, which is you go to the NBA finals and you lose. Right. Yeah.

Because as you know, celebrating that, like, it's great. Like, you celebrate all. everything's fantastic, right? But I had the same short summer you had. Yes. And so you go that far and then you lose, and it's like the worst experience of all times. Like you lose two months of your summer.

Right. No, I definitely agree with that because I remember, like, when I went through, we went through that year, like the whole, the whole, like, season. And I started the season probably, I was like 240 when I started the season. And once we got to the final, I was probably like 218, 2, 17. Like, bro, like, I was like skinny.

I'm like, yo, like, this is crazy. So, like, I can just imagine, especially like you guys, like, LeBron, like going through like going there in a row and like just having that type of time. And then the summer was like new to me because usually I'm like, yo, like I'm in the summer. Like that's my favorite time of the year basically because like I'm in a gym every day. I'm working like just routine, routine.

And you get to that point. It's like, man, like we don't want your. even have a summer, you know? So like, yeah, it was crazy. So I, I can get that. I can definitely respect that for sure. Absolutely. But, bro, I want to, I want to start this off by going back to the beginning of your journey. Now, this, you know, when I do these podcasts, you like to do research so you know a lot about guys or in particular, we had a woman, our first woman last week, one of the ghost, Candace Parker. But you like to have information. I want to. to be 100% honest with you.

I have the information that I know about you, and I didn't want to do much research, because I wanted to hear the story from you. I wanted to learn more about you from you. And so what I know, like, born in Cameroon, you came over, played at New Mexico State, you got to the NBA, but I don't know all the fillers, and I didn't want to because I wanted you to fill me in on that. So just start me off, like, take me back to Cameroon. What age did you start playing basketball?

Right. Yeah, because growing up in Cameroon, if you're from Cameroon and probably like a lot of countries in Africa, like when you grow up, you play soccer or football, like they call it. And it's like that's the first thing you do. Like we never like, you don't know anything else. For me, I was lucky because my brothers play basketball. Like they started playing soccer, but then they started playing basketball. I'm the youngest, you know, of six. And I have four brothers.

I have three brothers. And it's like, yo, like they started playing basketball. basketball. And growing up, like, I just, I just, you know, watch them. And I was like, man, like, maybe I'll try it. I was probably like, first time I was playing basketball, probably like 16, 17. Yeah, like, it's like my first time. And I remember we went with my friends, like, one of my friends, I came back, because I was in boarding school. I mean, I feel like I'm, I'm like going everywhere. But I was in boarding school, like, and I came back. I usually come back for like the break. And I come back and some of my friends was like, you know, like,

we're going, we're going to this camp. And it's, is this. NBA player and stuff. And I'm like, okay, like, I have no idea. I don't know anything about the NBA, really. And it was looking about Amuta. And it was like, oh, okay, man, like this is an NBA player. He's doing a camp. He's from Cameroon.

And my friends was going. So they were like, all right, let's go. So I'm like, all right, cool. I have nothing to do. I'm like, I don't mind, you know. So I just went. And I was one of the best player in the camp. And from that, I'm like, I didn't even know anything about basketball, you know?

So it was just like super crazy that I was selected to that. And then after that, it was just like, I went to basketball without borders the year after. I was over like 17, almost 18. And it was like, after that, it was just like, man, I'm going to college in the NBA. Oh, I'm going to college and then the NBA. So it was like pretty crazy, pretty fast, like the way it happened. And so at that point, you're pretty much just, you're just going off all sure athleticism. Yes, that's it.

Like, literally, because, I mean, in school, like, I was always, obviously, I was probably, I was all you are the best in like just like running like high jump. Like we did all that stuff in school. So I'm like, I'm one of the best. But it was just like just pure athleticism like from playing soccer and just like my stamina was good. So I could like run for days. And and I could jump.

So it was just literally just that like literally just running and jumping, hustling and doing that. And that was just the first, probably my first skill in basketball for sure. That's crazy. And one thing that I did. here was that all of your brothers received Division I scholarships to play college basketball in America? Yep.

Yep. How did that come about where they're receiving Division I scholarships? Like, what was the path for them to get that exposure? Yeah, no, the path for them is like, obviously for me, growing up in Cameroon, like, I was blessed at my dad. Like, my dad was like, you know, like, he was okay, like financially. Like, you know, like we, yeah, we went like, you know, like, we had mostly everything that we need it. And he's, like, he always dreamed about basketball in, like, the NBA. Like,

like, this was his thing. Like, he, he loved that. And, and so he always saw that, oh, I mean, like, people that go in the NBA, they play college and then they go to the NBA. So, like, that was, like, his thing. So he was like, all right, I'm going to do everything that I can to find a scholarship. So he, he did all the work, like, talk to the schools, like, find schools. He had friends because he used to travel, go to the U.S., like, back and forth for, like, even the friends. And so he had, like, connection. So he would just find, And you found people, they begin, like, oh, okay, your son can come here and play high school basketball or something. Like, because they left earlier than me.

I left when I was like 18 years old. Like I graduated high school and then I went to the U.S. My brothers, they went earlier. Like, so they started. They did probably like two years of high school or something like that, like probably each of them. And then was able to play high school basketball, get a scholarship, and then go into the college. So how were you eventually spotted? You ended up at New Mexico State.

How were you eventually spot? Yeah, so I went to basketball without borders. After I went to basketball without borders, it was like, I mean, I got some attention, you know, from people. Some people talked to my dad. And it was like, all right, like, you can go. We're going to find you a scholarship to go to like a prep school. I went to a prep school before in Texas. And I probably did like probably like a year there.

And then after that, the prep school I went to, the coach, his son went to New Mexico State. So then his son wants to do exist. So from there, that's one I learned about the coach. I had no offers already. Like I had no offers or anything like that. The dad, he talked to the coach about me or whatever. And then from there, it was like, all right, the coach likes me. This is my only college offer.

I'm like, all right, cool. Like, I'm in it. Like, so it was just like, it was just, that's just how it happened. That's crazy. I have no offers at all. Like, I don't. Man, when you came and you eventually go on the beach. the 27 pick in the NBA draft.

But again, I'm going to be totally honest with you. My first year playing against you when you were with the Toronto Raptors, I'm like, yo, this, like, all right, this guy's athletic, but like, I can go help. Like, I can help off. I can go plug the gap. Like, I don't really have to worry about this guy much

other than, like, him slashing, cut and getting to the rim offensive rebound. And then it's like the next year you came back. And you're a totally different player. All of a sudden now you got the ball in you. your hands, you're pulling up in the mini, you shooting the three. I'm like, yo, like, who is this guy? How did he get this good, this fast?

Obviously, your work ethic is tremendous. I've seen you work. We've trained in the gym with some of the same people, Trevelle Games, athletic games with James, and I know how hard you work. But if you had to point to one or two people to say, without these people, I would not be as good as I am. Who would you point to outside of just your peer work at? Right.

Yeah, no, for sure. Like, I think, again, like, it takes a village for sure. Like, you know what I mean? Like, to be able to get to this level. And I probably had a bunch of people in college that, like, one of the coaches in college, his name was Preston, like, we was in the gym every day. Like, literally, New Mexico State, I mean, we in Las Cruces, there's not much to do. Like, we, like, you're not going to.

going to go out there and find, like, you know, places to go where you're going to go party and all that. Like, you got to drive like 45 minutes to go party somewhere. Like, and that was in El Paso in Texas. Like, so I'm like, yo, like, I'm sorry. I'm not doing that just to party. Like, I can't. So I'm like, after the parties. I'm in a gym every day. Like, you know, we're working out every single day. So that was like college. And then we get to the NBA. I remember like my first time meeting Rico Heinz. Like that was, for me, that was like the first person like that I got to work with like really. like, you know what I mean?

Like, we sat and just build a plan together. And I remember my first time meeting him, I think it was the first year they started doing, like, you can go put your name in a draft, and then, like, you see if you want to do it or not. Like, I think it was like, I'm sorry to the first year they did that. So, which I think was a blessing.

So I'm going there and I'm, and I'm working out with Rico. Like, it was like my agent knows Rico. They went to UCLA together. So it's like that relationship already. And I get there and I'm like, all right, like, I'm trying to do. test the waters. Like, I want to see, like, I want to see if I can, if I can make this happen.

And my first time working, I would recal, and we played a little bit, like, the first time he saw me, like, he was like, yo, like, I don't even know what you're thinking about. Like, stop, stop thinking. Like, like, I don't, I don't want you to think about testing the waters, whatever the case might be, like, you're an NBA player. Like, I don't want to hear nothing. Like, going back to school is going to be a waste of time because I remember at that time, like, I was really debating because, like, my dad, like, he loved basketball, but, like, his thing was like, you, we got to finish school. Like, he was so big on that.

Like, we got to finish school. Like, I don't want nobody just, like, going out there with no education. So, like, that was always playing the back of my mind. Like, you know, like, I want to be able to get my degree and all that, you know, so. But then, like, once we had that conversation over Rico, man, like, he just put so much, like, confidence in me, like, so much, like, you know, like, I've never really had, like, I've had that before, obviously my family, you know what I mean? But like people outside of that, like, just believing in me.

And like from that first day, it was like, yo, like, like, let's do this. Like, you ready. And after that, it was like, man, like, you go out there every summer. We're in a gym every single day. Just grinding. Like, I'm there 24-7. You know what I mean? Whenever you're looking for me in the summer, I'm in the gym, you know?

Like, he's a person that's there with me. So, like, that's a guy that I can definitely say, like, you know, like, you know, we put the work in, like, and he was always there committed to the work every single day. I mean, Rico is incredible. You know, a lot of us have had the opportunity to be touched by Rico. Obviously not for most guys, not to the extent that you have, but I just want to make sure on this show that Rico Heinz get the love that he deserve. You know, I, and just pointing at you, like, all NBA player,

an All-Star, and like, I've watched you guys grind from the beginning of your career to all of a sudden the entire Toronto Raptors team is out in L.A. trying to get better. And I personally, I think that all stems from your success in watching you and everything that you've done and the growth that you've had. Brother, I take my hat off to you because I. Thank you. I appreciate it. I mean, you literally went from a guy that they were spotting up in the corner

that was not a corner shooter to, like, all of a sudden, you're like, you out of nowhere becomes the second option. And like, all right, like most guys can't take that next step to become the number one option, bro. It's amazing. And so I just want you to know, man, I take my hat off to you as a competitor, as someone who got to guard you. Like, when I guarded you well in the finals, we won.

Clearly I couldn't guard you well enough. for y'all, see you know what I'm saying? So, much respect. I appreciate it, bro. Now, for sure. And that means a lot because I ended there, like, for me, like, I just feel like, you know, you put the work in and you do everything that you're supposed to do. But I think just like getting, especially being in Toronto, too, like, we don't, like,

nobody really, like, people, there's a joke around. It's like, nobody really cares, right? Like, so I think that just to see that respect, you know, from somebody that that's done it at the highest level, you know what I mean? Like that, that means a lot for sure. No, no doubt. I appreciate it. And so y'all win the NBA Finers your third year.

The two years leading up to that, Kyle and DeMar, leaders of the team. And you guys are having great regular seasons, great regular seasons. And eventually you run into LeBron in the playoffs and can't quite get over the hump. It's like it almost looked like LeBron's just, all right, I'll get to the Raptors and I'll win, no problem. Right, right, right. you guys then go on to trade Demar for Kawhi Leonard. When you see that trade happen,

I'm super close to Damar. I know you have a relationship with Demar as well. So number one, you see that trade happens. What are you thinking about the business of basketball, number one, to see your number one player get traded and at that early in your career. What are you thinking about the business? But then also, what are you thinking

when you see that y'all got Kawhi Leonard coming? Right. Yeah, no, I think that, like, obviously, like, instantly, like, the first thing is just the shock value of everything, right? Like, because I think for everyone, we saw tomorrow in Vegas. Like, we saw Demar and Vegas before all that. So, like, for us, it's like, yo, we saw tomorrow. We have our meetings that we usually do. We're in Vegas. It's summer league coming up. Like, so we're hanging out. So, like, I see tomorrow. So from that, it was just like the shock value of it. It's like, yo, like, what is happening? Like, I'm just, I'm confused. And, and obviously, like, for, someone that just close to Demar and just love him as a person. Like, bro, like, Damar as a player, he was always one of my favorite player. I always used to tell him, like, even when he was on our team, I'm like, yo, like, you want my favorites, like, just the mid-range, like, the things.

Like, he just looks so easy and effortless for him, like, the way he was doing it. So I think just from being a fan and also, and then also being, like, his teammate and his brother, I'm like, I'm hurt, right? Because I'm like, yo, like, this is crazy. And, like, you said, it's early on my career. I'm thinking like this can like if that happened to do more I can't even imagine what's going to happen to me

you know what I mean so that's the way I'm thinking about it like yo like this is crazy so those are the first thing and then after after the shock value everything calmed down you're upset you're mad you know like you're in your room

you're upset about everything but then after that you think about like the player that you're getting and in Co Islander like another person that I watched you know what I mean for me like just someone I want to San Diego was state mid-major.

I was a mid-major. Like, he came in the NBA. Like, he wasn't really, like, doing all these things. Like, he was a defender. Like, he was, it was this and that. And then he became this huge star. So that's another person that I'm like, yo, like, I watch from far. And I'm like, yo, like, his game is dope.

And so from that, I'm just like, yo, I'm excited. Like, yo, like, this is crazy, you know, like, getting an opportunity to play with someone like that. And being on the same team, being able to learn from him. So after the shock, it was just like kind of like an excitement to say like, you know, what can we do with this person? Because we've got a player that's, you know, that's like really, really, really, really good, you know.

So, yeah. And, you know, you guys, you know, summer plays out, you guys going to training camp. Are you thinking at that time, like, that Kauai is possibly the guy that gets us over to hunt? Because, again, what you just mentioned was, hey, you're in Toronto where no one's talking championships like it's Toronto like basketball isn't that and like basketball has grown in Toronto over the last 15 20 years but hockey's the biggest thing in Toronto hockey and Drake like and now no no no that was the case but now you guys have changed that but that change also comes with winning a championship for sure when your rookie year that wasn't the case like but then you guys

win a championship and now a lot of people care about the Raptors but are you thinking at that point you guys are going in the camp you got Kawhi Leonard like yo this team can possibly win a championship is that the conversation around the team going in?

I don't think it for us like for me I don't think for Kauai I think it was you know but for us it's like again obviously like we've never done it before so like you know like obviously we want to be we always had great great teams you know like We go to playoffs, we do everything.

So we're thinking we're a great team, but at the end of day, you don't really think ahead of that. Like, you don't really think, like, it doesn't get in your mind right away, you know what I mean? Because it's just like something that you really haven't done. But just looking at our roster and the players that we have, I'm like, yo, like, we have a damn good team. You know what I mean? Like, that's what I'm thinking, you know, but I don't know to what extent. Like, I don't know how it's going to work with Kau. We never play together.

Like, like, so at that point, I don't know what's happening, you know? Like, I had no idea. Obviously, it was Nick, was the coach, like, all these different things. Like, it's just a little different. And I had literally no idea what was going to happen at that point, you know. Like, so I couldn't really pinpoint, like, from the beginning of the season, I couldn't see that. I couldn't see it right away. Sure.

Why the season was going, then you're kind of like, oh, my God, like, this is getting interesting. You know, like, I think that's what I would say, yeah. You guys end up matching up with the – Philadelphia 76ers in the second round of the playoffs. And obviously, we all know Kauai hit the big shot in the corner, bounce, bounce, it drops in. But I thought there was something interesting that took place in that series with a fellow Cameroonian for yourself and Joelle and B.

And you came out then and you said, he's a fake, tough guy. And I would like to know, A, number one, what made you say that then? And where do your relationship stand now being, you know, two guys from the same country? Right. No, I think it's just, it's all love because I think he's, well, I'm from, you know, I'm from Duala. He's from Yon-Dhi. Right. Like, we, if you're from Cameroon or you know anything about Cameroon, like, those are the two cities, right?

It's like, Duolah, yeah-und it. And it's always back and forth, like, just like, always talking trash. beef, like whatever you want to call it. We have the best city. We have the best girls. We have the best parties. Like, we always, you know, so it's always like,

like that little back and forth. So I think for us, like, just going back and playing against each other, like, every time we do, it's like, it's always that, like, that little, like, I just want to do better for my city because I know that, you know,

better than y'all, you know what I'm saying? Like, so that's always that. So, and you know, Joel, like he's not going to hold his tongue. He's not going to hold his punches. Like, he's going to, he's going to talk, he's going to do all that, and when we play against each other,

he's going to make sure that I don't score. Like, he's going to, like, be there helping, do whatever he got to do. Like, you know what I mean? Like, just because of that. But in terms of our relationship, like, actually, like, it's like, man, like, we cool. You know what I mean?

Like, we talk all the time. And it's like, it's always love. Like, at the end of day, like, two kids from where are we from, like, being at this level, like, it's unheard of. You know what I mean? Like, obviously we had our big brothers that was there before us. Like, like the Lungbaumte, like, like the boom-cha-booms, like all those people.

But to be at this level, like, and play where we at, like, it's crazy, you know, so, so definitely we feel blessed and stuff. But at the end of the day, once we go on the court, like, it's beef. Like, we add it. There's no friends. Ain't no friends on this court. I'm at your neck. Obviously, that plays out.

We end up, you know, go through the conference finals. Then we end up playing against each other in the NBA finals. And we come into that series. Kevin Durant's out. You guys immediately take control of the series. Kevin Durant comes back in game four. Game four. Game four.

Game four. Game four. And when Kevin Durant comes back, I look up six minutes to go on the clock, and we got 36 points. And I'm like, yo, it's six minutes to go on the first quarter. we got 36 points. When you see Kevin Durant come back,

he's clicking like that, we're clicking. What's the thought in your mind at that point? Bro, I'm not going to lie to you. So before the game, like, so you guys are working out and stuff, like, in our person, it was like, it was always like a debate. Oh, is KD going to play, whatever, whatever. So we get there and it's like, yo, like he's warming up. And I was like, all right, I bet.

Like, KD's here. He's playing. Like, it's a little like, all right, all right, man. Like, we're not expecting this, but whatever. like, we're like, okay, we kind of like thinking still in our heads because, you know, like you said, we took control of the series. So in our heads, we're thinking like the momentum is on us. Like we have the momentum.

Like, we're still good, you know? But we get in that game, bro. Like, oh, my God. Like, I don't think KV, like, I don't think he touched the, like, the rim like one time. Like, I don't even think you touched the net. Like, he shot the ball and I don't think, like, I don't think it touched the net, bro. Like, it was just, like, straight.

Like, he was pulling from, like, whatever. Money. That shit was like. Like water, like nothing. So I'm like, I'm just like, yo, this is going to be a long night. Like, at that point, like, literally, like, if there was, like, any panic, like at any time, I think it would have been, like, that point, like, when Katie, like, came back. Because it was just, like, for us, like, we felt like we matched up well with you guys.

You know what I mean? Like, and obviously, like, it's tough to guard, like, play, Steph, like, obviously with you, like, all the things like the movement, like, all your offense and everything that you guys do. And it's like, yo, it's crazy. But then you add KD that we would feel like, yo, like it's really like unguardable, it feels like. Because like some of the time you got to hope that he missed, right? Like you got to do your best and like challenge you the best that you can

and just hope that it missed. Absolutely. It was just like, you know, like adding KD. And the way he was playing, like he started that game. It was like, yeah, like it was a little panic right there. No, for sure. And then obviously Kevin gets hurt. Actually, this game, that's game five.

Kevin came back because Kevin gets hurt in game five. We go back to go to State Game 6. Clay gets hurt in Game 6. And so that was definitely game 5. But walk me through the feeling. You know, you guys eventually close the series in game 6 going on the first championship for the Toronto Raptors.

But your first championship, walk me through that feeling of getting over that hump. And then you're like, wow. Like, wait, we're NBA champions. Walk me through that initial field. Because I'll tell you something. For me personally, obviously I've been fortunate enough to win four. And I'll tell you what, you win that first one,

and it's the most amazing thing in your life. You win the second one, third, one, fourth one. And the most amazing thing to me after that is seeing the guys who win it for the first time. So you got guys now on a team who hasn't won one, and like you celebrate with those guys and seeing the guys who won it the first time is the most amazing thing.

Talk to me, walk me through that feeling of winning that first championship. Yeah, no, like, it was crazy. Because I just think that for us, like you said, like we've had that talk of like, oh, yeah, the Raptors are going to go, they're going to have a great regular season. They're not going to do anything in the playoffs.

So, like, we hear that all the time. And I heard it when I was with Kyle, DeMoy, and all those guys. And obviously, I was younger coming up. But that's all we heard. So I think you already have that in your mind. And I think for us, like, just winning was like, yo, like this is like we actually did it. You know what I mean? And it wasn't just like it was like a team where like everyone like kind of like played a part in like winning a championship.

Like obviously you remember the Kauai shot and all these different things. But like, you know, Milwaukee series, Fred coming back and hitting all those threes. You know, even even in the finals against you guys like those three like me making the shot like, you know, Mark like. Kyle, that first, that game six coming up, like, going crazy, you know, like that first quarter. You just think about all those moments, you know what I mean? Like, and it was just like amazing, bro. Like, just like the hard work that you put in and just like that joy that you get from like knowing that you are the best team in the NBA, like, it's just incredible.

And the other part of that is the city, like the country. Like, you know what I mean? I mean, like, it wasn't, it's like, okay, obviously, like, you win as, as the Warriors, right? Like, San Francisco, everyone is happy and stuff, but imagine you won that and the whole U.S. is, like, it's excited, you know, like, so that's high. Absolutely. You know what I mean? Like, a whole country is excited about it.

Like, God, people are going crazy. Like, you hear stories until today. Like, I'm, I still hear stories of people being like, man, like, that championship, I remember where I was. Like, I remember, like, you can't even, you don't even know what that brought to me, my family. like things like that. So I think that's just what makes it like so much sweeter. No, I think that that's amazing, man.

And I always wonder about that feeling, which actually brings me to my next question because when it happened, I looked and I'm like, how can you walk away from that? Shortly after that, two weeks, not even, you get the news that Kauai Leonard is leaving and going to the L.A. Clippers. Quite frankly, I'm not sure how you can walk away

from having an entire, I mean, I feel like Kauai would have a home Canada at he state. And, you know, he walked away. What's the mindset then once you realize, like, yo, we're losing Kauai. And not only are we losing Kauai because, you know, when you look back at it, not often do you lose stars or people like that for nothing. And when you look back at it, like that was the deal. Like, that was the risk. Like Maasai makes the trade for Kauai.

He got one year left on his contract. And you're risking him walking off, but ultimately in hopes that you get the championship. So you accomplished a goal. Yep. But on the flip side, you'd hope that the goal that you accomplished allows you to run it up a little longer. And then Kauai leaves.

What's the mindset once y'all find out that Kauai is leaving and headed to the L.A. clippers two weeks later. Yeah. I think, well, it's like mixed, right? I think at the end of the day, like, for me, it was just like, man, like, if there's one person that I would see do that, it would be quite. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, like, in my head, like, that would be the only, like, the one person that I'd be like, yo, like, I can see him, like, doing that. Because, you know, the way he conduct his business, the way he is, like, all the things that he does, like, it's always in, like, just like a particular way, you know what I mean? Like, so I think for me, like, I'm thinking, like, man, like, I don't think he can live.

leave, but at the same time, like, yo, like, it's Kauai. Right? Like, Kauai is going to do what he wants, like, and much power to him because like, that's who he is as a person, you know what I mean? Like, that's how he's always been conducting anything. So, obviously, like, you hurt because it's like, yo, like, what can we, like, we look at our team. It's like, yo, like, we can really do this, you know what I mean? I'm evolving.

Fred is evolving. Everyone is getting like, you know what I mean? Like, it's growing to the own. And we're thinking like, yo, we can really build something special. And Kauai leaves. So it was just like, man, like this is, this is, it was, it was sad. Like it hurt. But at the same time, like, I can't, like, like I said, like I can only see Kauai do that.

You know what I mean? Like, and, and it didn't really feel like, oh, you know, like, because I can see that happening. Like, I'm not totally like surprised by, you know, at the same time. Yeah. Did Kauai make a mistake? Did Kauai make a mistake? I mean, I don't want to say he made a mistake.

Like, that's, that's crazy to say because, you know, like, I. at the end of day, man, I think, as we all know, it's like, the man, happiness and, like, and, like, being, you know, doing what you want to do and being in a place

that's going to make you the most happy. Like, that's the most important thing above all, you know, like, I love Kauai as a brother or someone that we won a championship together, but, like, I would never, like, be like, oh, you made the wrong choice, you know what I mean?

Just because he made a choice that was good, like, for him, you know, like, and I respect it. But do I wish that, and I look at it in highest, if it was on our team, like, wow, we would look, you know? Like, yeah, maybe it would look a little different, but I can't blame the man for making a decision for himself and his family. No, I can appreciate that, man.

You watch people in this league that think, like, our lives belong to them or our decision-making belongs to everyone else. And so I can appreciate your stance on that because I watched, like, when Kevin Durant first came to us, and like people were mad at him. Like, how can you be mad at someone for deciding what they want to do with their life? Like, you don't just wake up and go to the gym.

Like, you wake up, you live in that city. You wake up, like, everything that you do. Like, that's a huge part of it. So I can appreciate your stance on that. Yeah, no, it's a lot that comes with that. Like, it's so much more. Like, and you understand it. Like, I think for us, we understand it.

And I want to say one thing about, like, because it's one thing that I really hate. It's like this whole, thing now, like, people are betting and stuff. Like, it's probably, like, that culture is, like, the craziest thing to me. Because, like, people would literally, like, like, really wish you, like, death because they miss whatever they was betting on. Like, it's the craziest thing to me.

I just want to say, like, I don't like it. And stop messaging me about you lost your polly, I don't care. I don't really. I can tell less if you meet your collie today. Tomorrow, like, whatever you did, whatever you bet, I really could care less, bro. like, I don't care. It does not matter. It doesn't matter.

Yeah, I see how to go and tell me and the people that I love. Like, I don't care about nothing else. Absolutely, man. A few more questions I'm going to get you out of here. I know you in Philly want to get on with your evening. I appreciate you taking the time. In 2022, you were not named an All-Star, but you made all NBA team. Right.

Which to me is like kind of crazy because it's actually harder to make our NBA than it is to be an all-star. Right. What did you make of that when you see your name come out in the all-NBA team and you're like,

I didn't even make all-star. You're like, what did you make of that? I was just, I was confused because again, like, it just, for me, I don't, I don't understand, like, the criteria, like, I don't understand anything. I don't understand the criteria of, like, what it is to be an all-N-Star

or an NBA, MVP, like, all these different things. Like, I'm just literally, like, lost in all of that. So, like, I was confused. Obviously, I felt like I was an all-star, but then it didn't happen. Then in my head, I'm like, all right, whatever. Like, I'm just continuing my season. I'm, you know, I'm bawling.

I'm doing whatever. And then I get all NBA, it was just like, I was just confused, like, to be honest with you. Like, I don't know, I don't know how it works. You know what I mean? Like, and I just learned for me, like, with everything that happened in my life, like, I control the things that I can control.

And then the rest of it, like, man, like, I can really care less. Like, all I care about is just doing, doing what I love, going out there playing, control what I can control, and I'm not going to stress over things that I can't really control. So people pick who's on NBA and All-Star and all that, and that happens, and I just go with it.

And speaking of that, there's been a lot of news lately, and I'm sure we'll probably see it soon with the new CBA coming up. But there's been a lot of news about criteria as you just spoke on for all-NBA, for All-Star, but in particular for these major awards, MVP, defense player of the year, most improved player in which you won.

And should there be a game limit in all of these things? Where do you stand on that? Should there be a certain amount of games that you have to play in order to be rewarded with one of those major awards? Yeah. No, I mean, I do think so, because I think that, like, it takes, it takes a lot.

And most of the time, like, obviously, like, when I was coming up, and I think for me being just, like, one of the players, you know, spying up in a corner and just, you know, and just playing defense and running and doing all that, like, it's like, it takes a lot. But at the same time, it's like, man, like, you play 20 minutes a night or whatever. Like, you're cool, you know, like, and I think that there's some people that, like,

out there playing 30 plus every single night, like, people like you guys that go to the playoffs, go to the finals and do it like consistently. I think that that just makes it like so much harder. Like being out there doing it every day on a consistent basic. Like like, you know what I mean? Like it just, I think it just makes it like so much harder and it takes like so much.

Like like that's why I admire people like, you know, the LeBrons and those people that like, man, like it's crazy to do it consistently in that amount of time. You know what I mean? Like an everyday point of working, not missing really games. I mean, unless you're really, really injured. and just doing it every single day.

I think that's what makes it hard because I think there's a lot of people that can do it. You know, like you can do it one year or you can do it, you know, for 30 games, 40 games, you know, but can you do it for 82 games for 5, 6, 7, 8 season?

You know, like, I think that's what makes the greats who they are. And that's what, you know, for me, a player, like you strive for that, you know? Like, I want to play as many games as I can, put the work in to be the best, like, for the longest that I can. and I feel like that's what makes it like really special. So, yeah, if you ask me, I would say, I would say, yeah,

it should matter like how many games you played, you know, to be able to win the worst. No doubt. A foreign player yourself, this league has grown in tremendous ways. It's a very global game, a global league. And top three this year for the MVP race is international players. I think that says a lot about the game. that says a lot about the growth of, you know, basketball in other countries is huge.

But if you had a vote, who are you voting for MVP this year? Oh, yeah. If I had to vote for MVP, I mean, like, obviously it's got to be, it's got to be like, you know, my Cameroon brother. Like, it's got to be, like, you know, it's got to be and be, like, I think that, you know, he's doing it, you know, all, like, he's been doing it for years, but, like, just, you know, this year doing it at an incredible level. And he's just playing unbelievable basketball.

Like the team is winning. He's doing on both hands on the floor. And I'm sure there's like a lot of other people out there that deserve it. Like, you know, like the Tatum's and and the Yolkish and like all these people. But I think for me, like, you know, obviously I might be biased, but at the same time, like, it would be awesome to see someone from where I'm from, like win an MVP. Like that would be crazy. these crazy inspiration, like, just to know that, like, man, this is really possible. Like, and not only that, not only that I'm biased, I think he also deserves it.

No, for sure. I think he's deserving as well. I must say, and I now know Joelle listens to this stuff because he busts my ass last week because of something I said on her. So I'm going to throw that out there. But I must say, after he had that conversation with me at half court about why he just played the way he played for him to not play versus Denver, especially the way he dropped Joker off in Philly. Like he really went that Joker in Philly. He got the best of that matchup that night.

I was a little disappointed that he didn't play in Denver that night. I must say that. But you just said something very interesting. And it's a real thing, which you said, I may be biased. And what I want to say to that is, you probably are biased. And you are. And you are. There's no probably. You are biased. Now, it's a good bias because Joelle is right there. It's not like you're saying something random.

Like, Joel should be MVP. But my point with that is, the people who are making these decisions are also biased. And that's one of the issues that I have with these awards. Because you think about these awards. These awards decide if you're going to be in a Hall of Fame. These wars decide how you're going to be viewed and what you put 15, 20 years of your life

into ultimately in the long run. And like you have these people voting. And I just disagree with the voting criteria. Like, I mean, like, who's voting? Like, I don't quite understand that because there are biases. Just like you just said, I'm a little biased. You can't tell me, like, if I'm up for a defensive player

of the year and it's me versus someone, Do you think Kendrick Perkins wouldn't be biased towards me as defensive player, like voting for me, defense player, even if I'm deserving. Like, I 100% think he'd be biased. And so, like, what do you make of, like, who's voting for these awards? And, like, the way is determined. Because another thing it does is it determines how much money you made. And that's crazy to me.

For sure. Yeah, no, it's pretty crazy. And I think for me, that's why, like I said, like I've, I've just disconnected myself totally from that just because I'm like, yo, like I really don't understand it. Like, I don't get it. You know, and like you said,

it's like just people voting for that. And there's some might have biases, you know. Like, so it's like, like, what do you, what do you do? Like, who do we make to have these votes? Like, I don't know. Like, who do we choose instead of those people to vote? Like, do we have computers voting? Like, what do we do?

You know what I mean? Like, I don't know. Like, I feel like it's just so hard. and and I feel like, yeah, it's going to be biased. And it's hard. Like, it's like, what do you? I just don't know how to respond to it because I'm like, who do you put in that position to make those votes?

Like, like, who would you suggest, like, to be voting for all NBA and like all this stuff? Like, what do you think? I think, I think, I think just like other things, coaches, because, like, there's a way of doing that that you can't vote for your player, right? Like, you can't vote for your guy. I think they have a better sense. They watch the most film. Like they, like, I just think it has to be a better way

and decide these things. Now, what you, I know the argument that they would make as coach, well, some coaches would do this so you don't make as much. Like, I don't think there's a perfect answer. Yeah. But I do think at some point it has to be addressed. Like, for instance, All-Star Star Star, maybe there's a situation of media carries this much weight.

Coaches carry this much weight. Then we, like, you know, we equal out the two of some way. But I just think the way that it's done right now, I'm just not totally sure. It's tough, man. It's hard. That's why, like, I told you, bro, like, I try to just like, man, like, I can control it. Whatever happens, happens, you know. No doubt, no doubt.

And something, two more questions. Number one, your name came up in a ton of trade rumors. And, you know, I kept watching your games and watching your, Checking the box scores when I didn't get a chance to watch. Play steady. Same thing. Doing what you do, not being bothered by that. How do you handle all of the trade rumors?

Because your name come up every year. Just, I mean, and quite frankly, it's just because of how good you are. Your name's going to keep coming up. How do you handle that, you know, when all those trade rumors are coming up? Yeah, no, it's tough. It was tough early on. I think that, you know, like early on, like for me, like just seeing that and, and I think that I was, I mean, I'm not a huge social media person,

but at the same time, like, early on, like, I was really on social media. I'll go on Twitter, like, I'll check what's going on. Like, like, I'll be on Instagram, you know, I'll see the comments and, and, you know, like, and even the worst thing you can, like, possibly do. Like, if you're a young player coming up, like, don't ever, like, go on Twitter and put your name in. Like, it's probably the worst thing you type your name on the search bars. Like, it's horrible. Like, don't do it. You know, like, and I'll do that, like, as a young person.

And I think for me, like, just what I understood from, like, just going through it, like, the trades, like, you know, with tomorrow and, like, all the stuff that I saw. All these things happening, like, seeing, like, how someone can be loved. And then the next minute, you know, you're the, you're the worst person in the world, like, going through the pandemic, like, like, all these different things. Like, I just, like, learn, like, for me as a person, like, to disconnect myself with, like, with that. You know, like, I try to, you know, I'm not on Instagram all the time. I just make sure that I have control over like what I do. Like what do I follow? Like who do I, who do I?

You know, like, you know, what pages do you follow? Like, what do you see every day when you wake up? Like, and all those different things. And I try to just like have my mental right in a space where like I'm focusing on what matters. You know, I'm focusing on my family. I'm focusing on my team and playing basketball, the game that I love and and try my best. It's hard. Obviously, like it's hard.

Like you want to be on Instagram all the time. You want to be on Twitter. You want to check these things. But I just think that what changed for me was just being able to have that balance and knowing like what really matters and trying to just like disconnect, you know, whenever I need it. And it's been the best thing for me because it's helped me to just be kind of like level-headed and just like knowing that they're like, yo, like I got to come in and do my job every single day. No matter ups and downs, bad game, good game.

I still got to show up at 9 o'clock, 8 o'clock in the gym and work out. I still got to, I still have a game the next day. You know what I mean? like I still have these things. Absolutely. And once I just understood that, like, I was able to just be like, man, whatever happens, happens.

And yeah, like, you're also fortunate that being at a certain level, like, I feel like my value is the same everywhere. Like, you know what I mean? At the end of the day, as long as I'm going to work in, like, wherever I'm at, like, I'll be, I have the same value just because of the work that I put in. And so I just try not to focus on what I can control. No doubt.

And before we get out of here, there's a rule in the NBA that if an owner of an NBA team is the lead investor on a deal, we can't invest, which I think is like some old rule that needs to be changed. Because quite frankly, like, you look at the owners of NBA teams today, they are some of the most powerful people in business. Like, you look at a Michael Rubin who recently just sold, but like Michael Rubin is one of the most powerful business, and soon to be of our generation.

You know, Joe Lacob, who's, you know, one of the majority owners of the Warriors, he's huge in the tech space. Peter Goober is huge in the film and producing space, who's another majority. Yet, if they're in the deal, I can't quite participate in it. And it's the same for you, obviously, as an NBA player. But the question I wanted to ask you was this,

and it's a two-part question. Obviously, the BAL, Basketball African League, which I'm sure you're, I know you're super familiar with. Would you want to own a team in that league and say at some point in your career, maybe later in your career, because you'll probably make another few hundred million dollars here in the NBA? But at some point in your career,

if they said, Pascal, we want you to go play in the BAL, we'll give you ownership of a team or we'll allow you access to ownership of the team that you're going to play for, but you'd have to go play in that league. Would that be something that you would entertain if you were given the opportunity at ownership in the BAL league?

Because I think that league is going to grow crazy over the next five or ten years. Yeah, I think for sure. Like, I think for me, obviously I want to be involved in that, you know, like I think that as an African player, someone that came up and for us to be able to just kind of like, you know, be the voice and the, you know,

like the younger generation see us and they see Joel, they see me, to see all the African players and like, they want to be like us. And I think that we're just part of like that machine that's growing the game in Africa. You know what I mean? Like, obviously with the NBA and all those other entities.

And I would definitely love to be an owner, an owner of a team, you know, a BAL. Like that would be crazy to me. Like being from Africa and being able to do that. And, you know, I don't know. Maybe in my career, if I'm like, oh, maybe, yeah. Like you'd be like, yo, let's go and play over there.

And if the game is growing the way it is over there and like, which the growth that you talked about, like, if it's going that way, like, yeah, like, why not? But owning a team for sure. Like, and, like, that's something that I would love to do and being a part of it, you know. So hopefully that can happen. Yeah. I hope it can't happen for you.

Because what brought me to the idea was like a couple years ago, Andrew Bogart, who's a former teammate of mine, taught me a ton. He went back. He's part owner of the Sydney Kings in Australia. And he went back and he played for the team. They won a championship. And like to go, to think,

this man just went to play for his own team, helped him win a championship, how great that is for their brand as a team and continuing to grow. But also he gets to participate in the upside. You know, it's like for us, Like, you want a championship for the Toronto Raptors. You don't get to participate in the upside of that.

Like, I won four championships here with Golden State Warriors. I don't get to participate in the upside of that. And I just think, like, again, it's one of those old tired rules where it's like, no, we understand ownership at this point as players. You know, like, we're more privy to information now. Yes, maybe that was a rule in the 67 to 80s when we weren't privy to the information that we're privy to now. But we understand ownership now and to be able to participate

in the upside of the asset that you're driving, I think it's long overdue. And when I was looking at the BAL league because it's something that I've actually researched and been watching because at some point I would love to be involved and I just wanted to know your take, you know, as an African-born player.

Yeah, no, I appreciate it. And I think that, like, again, like, I think just having known that, you know, like, even for you to be able go out there, do the research and, and, you're not just going to research anything, you know what I mean? I think that just shows that for us, like how the game is growing. You know, obviously the NBA is involved, so it makes it, you know, like already like a big thing. And just to know that, like, man, like there's going to be young, young kids out there in Africa that could go to that league one day and then be able to find themselves in the NBA.

Or maybe it grows to a level where it's big enough where some people will just go out there and they play, they live a good life. And, you know, like, and they play the game, they play basketball. and they stay in Africa and do great things, you know? So I just, I hope that, like, yeah, like it keeps growing. And, and, yeah, I just, I hope that we can get an opportunity to be involved in it. My brother, Pascal Seaccom, NBA champion, although it burns me to say that one. I appreciate you coming on the show, man. Thank you so much.

Welcome back anytime. And I appreciate it for sure, now. And, again, want to give you your flowers, appreciate you, everything that you, do and and obviously like being being able to do what you did, you know, and winning those championships and being a part of that organization. And another person that for me, you know, you watch and he's like, man, like he's doing all these things on the floor. I want to be able to do all those things on the floor, you know.

So, nah, that's, it's great and I appreciate it for having me. Thank you, brother. You're much better than me. I appreciate you, though, champ. I appreciate it. I appreciate it. Thank you.