The Herd with Colin Cowherd - The Draymond Green Show w/Baron Davis - Knicks-Pacers & Wolves-Thunder reactions + 2016 Warriors & Game 6 Klay Thompson stories

Episode Date: May 29, 2025

Draymond Green and Baron Davis react to Tyrese Haliburton's historic triple-double leading the Indiana Pacers to a victory over Jalen Brunson's New York Knicks in Game 3 of the Eastern Conference Finals. Dray explains why he thinks New York failing to take advantage of Karl-Anthony Towns in the post is a big reason for why they'll come up short of reaching the NBA Finals. Also, Dray and Baron discuss what went wrong for Anthony Edwards' Minnesota Timberwolves against Shai Gilgeous-Alexander's Oklahoma City Thunder, the anniversary of Klay Thompson's legendary Game 6 performance for the Golden State Warriors in the 2016 Western Conference Finals against the Thunder, why Dray doesn't consider Giannis Antetokounmpo the best power forward of his generation, and Paul George’s take about lockdown NBA defenders going extinct. 3:00 - Knicks-Pacers reactions 29:30 - Wolves-Thunder reactions 34:30 - 2016 Warriors & Game 6 Klay stories 39:30 - Giannis the BEST PF of his generation? 54:00 - Paul George's take on NBA lockdown defenders (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) #Volume #Herd Follow The Draymond Green Show on social media:  https://www.instagram.com/draymondshow https://x.com/DraymondShow https://www.facebook.com/people/Draymond-Green-Show https://www.tiktok.com/@draymondgreenshow New episodes of ‘The Grudge’ air every Wednesday at 10 PM ET — only on VICE TV. Find your channel here: https://www.vicetv.com/en_us/channel-finderSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

The volume. What's up, everybody. Welcome back to the Draymond Green show with my brother, B.D. What's happening in my dog? A lot of small boys, bro. How are you doing, my brother? I'm good, brother. You know, I'm just, I'm chilling, taking the off-season end.

Got to, you know, get up there and get a little bump with the inside of the NBA guys. It was always, always fun to get up there, man. They've been the guys so legendary. So that was fun. Checking these series out. bro, you know. Nothing much, man. I'm good, bro. But since you want to get into your next tape, I quite honestly think the series is over. How about you? Man, I still got hope. Look, I'm a firm believer.

One game at a time. You're going back to the garden. You've been in all these games. You let two of them slip away. So you can't rely on nothing on the past. You just come out and dominate at home. And I haven't seen the Knicks do that yet for a full 48 minutes. I do like the substitution with Mitchell Robinson and Josh Hart. I don't like the timing of it. But from a matchup standpoint, I think it saves Josh Hart some minutes, which makes him a little bit stronger.

And I also give Mitchell Robinson some minutes that he can get off to a good start, get through some easy buckets. The way you have to look at it at this point is we going home, we got to win game five. That's it. You mentioned twice going home to the guard. It's kind of just a feeling I've had playing there. I don't think, and you've played there so maybe you can say differently. But I personally don't think going to the guard serves, you know, like it does you any justice.

Because does the garden get loud? Yes, of course, like the fans. The Knicks fans are dying for her success. So, of course, he gets loud. But I personally just don't think there's much of a home court at the garden. And the reason I feel that way is not because where most teams have, like, issues or a lot of some teams have issues where, you know, if the Warriors are in town, it sound more like a Steph Curry home game thing that does a road game or like, you know,

Lakers fans travel, right? like some fan bases travel, the Knicks fans travel, right? So like, not even from that standpoint of the fans, but the garden is such a show. Like, it's the Mecca, it's the garden. When I step in the garden, I'm like, oh, like, this is it. Like, I'm putting on the show. So you're almost not even phased by the crowd

or how loud it can get because you're so into the moment, into the stage. Like, the garden is like one of a couple arenas where, you can't see the crowd. Like if you look out into the crowd, it's dark. The spotlight is on the court. And you feel that and you're going to put on the show and you know the celebrities are there.

So I don't think they get much of a boost by going, but just going back to the garden. Because guess what? Tyrese Halliburton is like, yo, I got a chance to put these boys away in the garden like with spikes in there. And so you kind of get that same boosts from playing at the garden

that the whole team can get. in my opinion. Yeah, I mean, most of it I agree with. Just looking, when I went to the garden, it was always like, hey, man, this is Broadway. You get that level of confidence, that level of showmanship, right? But as a Nick, you plan in the garden,

you get to hit first. It's a hit first mentality. And so a lot of times when people living in that essence, if you come out aggressive, you have to establish your level of aggression. And I think that is advantageous to the NICs, because if you look at overall physicality in the series, they've been kind of bully, so to speak.

And the retaliation, when the Nix make a comeback, is the NICs start bullying and start playing bully ball. But I think what's holding the NICs back is the silliness, right? the unnecessary files, the getting in the bonus early, right, allowing Indiana to get in the bonus early, but the silly files, off ball files, boxing out files, and then the turnover.

So hopefully, hopefully both teams get to fill that Broadway essence and that Broadway presence. I think the Knicks coming out with a hit first mentality. and a do-or-die mentality on their home floor should be advantageous to them with the crowd behind. I think all that's great, but it gets to a point to where you have to try to do different things. But you keep doing what you're doing,

you're going to keep getting what you're getting. So when I take a step back and I look at the next team, like they make substitution adjustments. Outside of that, they haven't made many adjustments this series, offensively or defensively. Like, I don't see many adjustments that they've made. Like, maybe it's like, yo, we're going into the post more

because if you look at the Knicks from a post-backdown standpoint, Carl Anthony Town should have the advantage or posting up Pascal. See, Alchem, right? Yep. All right. So you go advantage just from,

I'm not saying overall player, just from a post-up standpoint. Just from in the block. Yes, Carl Anthony Tiles should have that advantage. Carl Anthony Tels can't catch the ball in the block. That's the problem. Man, he getting pushed all the way out the post. And so you really don't have a block advantage

because when Carl Anthony Tills make a good move, it's one, two, three dribble spin to a layup. He's not catching it in the post. Drop step, jump hook, drop step, get inside for the layup. It has to be on him creating space for himself because he gets pushed down there all the way 20 feet from the basket when he posts up. Okay, so again, I'm going to go back to coaching. So as the coach, then I have to run some things to get him closer to the basketball touches. Meaning right, like maybe it's an old school guard big cross screen.

And he, you know, he getting a better catch there. Right, like, as the coach, that's on me to figure out how to get him closer to the basket. Because I think on a one-two-dribble spacing, like, necessary spot catch from Carl Anthony Towns, he should have the advantage on Pascal. He got streamside. All right. O.G. Annobe should have the advantage on Nimhar, correct? Right. All right.

So there's those two. Mike Carroll Bridges should have the advantage from a postup standpoint on Halley, correct? Yeah. All right. Mitchell Robinson and Miles Turner, Mitchell Robinson, we're not posting him up. So we'll throw that one out the window.

And then Shailon Brunson, he's very good in the post, actually. Very good. That's kind of his game. Will he be able to pull out on Neesmith? Neesmith got to. side advantage, I don't know. But anyway, if you just slow the ball down and post it up, and again, this is the playoffs,

this is not regular season basketball, this is not, oh man, the game has changed. This is how can I win this series? What looking at some of those matchups and the posts do is it can cut down on some of the turnovers because you can see the pictures develop easy, right? Like, you've got the ball. If you double team comes, you can see it, you get it out of there. You can see the pictures develop easier. It also slows down the Indiana Pacers from two standpoints.

A, it can slow their breakdown because you get them in foul trouble you saw with Jay LaBronston kept getting to the line last night. It slowed the Pacers down. Now you've got to run a half-court offense the whole time. That's not quite where they excel, right? So it slows them down from that standpoint. But it also slows them down because now you got those guys guard in the post, that's taking them legs away a little bit more.

It's not as easy to run, you know, and just push the tempo. But with the Knicks just trying to push the tempo and them trying to push the tempo, it don't make sense. So then you end up like the Knicks are playing into their hands because they're better at pushing the tempo than the Knicks. And so I just think there needs to be some adjustments offensively. There needs to be some adjustments defensively that I quite, frankly, don't think they've done. Like if you start switching five, right?

Like, we've seen teams try to switch five on Hallie and the Pacers, and Hallie has given some of these teams fits throughout the course of these playoffs. However, is Hallie beating you one-on-one to where you say, I don't care if this guy goes and that's on that one-on-one match up all night. But I'm not helping, right? So, like, say he gets to switch with Mitchell Robinson and he wants to go to Mitchell Robinson. If he get a half a step on Mitchell Robinson going towards the rim, hey everybody, you stay home.

We want to see him beat us getting layups over Mitchell Robinson. Number one, Mitchell Robinson going to make up something out at the rim. And if Hally going to beat us with stepback threes over Mitchell Robinson, you kind of got to pick something that you're going to live with. But

him driving and kicking him playing picking wrong coverage and him coming off, picking their picking role coverage apart, that's not going to work. We know that's not going to work. So I just think at some point, man, some of Adjustments got to be made. You can't just keep doing the same thing.

I agree. I was saying on the defensive, and when I watched last night's game, every time the Knicks got into a pick-and-row situation and never knew what they were doing. And that is not a good look. I'm talking about one-three, three, two, one-two, one-four. It was just ultimate confusion, right?

So you got to do something because you're not getting over screens, under screens. You're just getting confused. And really what I hate saying, like everybody's pointing. And then when you look on Indiana side, there's mono, a mono pressure, get over the screen, make them work, make them take tough shots. I think Indiana has taken what the Knicks need. And if the Knicks slow themselves down and play their style of basketball, If you can slow Indiana down, make them play half court. Then, like you said, take advantage of the post situation.

You're not going to out-shoot these guys. You're not going to out-run them, right? You're not going to out-play-make them as a team. And then Halliburton, you know, you got to pay attention to this man. He is their engine. So the start of the game, him getting those first four, five, six assists and not even looking to score. Like, you plan into his hand. Oh, let me get Miles Turner a few.

Oh, let me get them hard a couple. Let me get past. He's just coming to the game to make sure everybody, you know, got their coffee, they eating, you know, they're in the flow. And then everything starts to just open up. So you got to make him pick one way he's going to play. Either you're going to beat you on the points, or are you just going to make him pass and make somebody else become the playmaker.

Exactly. But 32, 12, and 15. Come on, man. That's BD numbers. That's crazy. Four steals, zero turnovers. That is BD number. BD you had a game like that in your career.

Yeah. Zero turnovers, two steals. I mean, Holly had the edge. Two steals, I highly have four. Ten assists. You had, Holly had 15. 14 rebounds, you had, Holly had 12. You got Holly there.

You had 33. Holly had 32. You got him there. You remember that performance? I had to get a winner that day, and that is the sole reason why we have replay. They called it off. They waved him off. That's great.

Man, there ain't so. It wasn't no replay to confirm that. Man, he called it off before I even released the ball. It was 0.7.0.8 seconds. He went to the replay, doubled down. It was like, no way he got it off. Who's the official? What was his name?

Bernie Friar, maybe. I can't remember his name. Maybe. He waved it off. We wound up going to overtime against Orlando. But then in that same, I think playoffs, Derek Fisher hit, remember the shot against

San Antonio? 4. Yeah, and then that's when they came with the replay. Oh, we're going to have to start going to the replay to see if these shots work or not, because how could Derek Fisher shot count? Am I not? That's crazy. So a little taste of history.

NBA history, man, history in the game. But shout out to Halliburton. You know, a performance like that, you ain't your back. You have control. I remember playing against Orlando feeling that same thing. Anytime Patrick Ewing was in the pick and roll because Pat was older, man, it's two dribbles. Make him slide twice.

He got to go back and I'm following him right to the basket to create. Right? If there's anybody else, they switch. It's over. When you have flow like that and you see everything, the game for Halliburney. he'd be wide open. He'd be shooting wide open threes. It's like they give him so much space.

And his shot takes a little time to load it up anyway. And they give him so much space and he's just like, get it loaded. Nobody's putting pressure on him. I mean, he's a great guard. And you got to, like, once again, pick your poison. But nobody has challenged him. Nobody's challenges handle, challenged his ability to create his, shot off the bounce.

They just let him set him up. He's genius. He's genius. He has set you up. I was talking to Travis that the dad about his tribe was like, man,

his day is his handle like that. And I'm telling you, the reason they're on pressure him like that though is highly handle is very underrated and sneaky. And all them boys know at different points where they tried

the pressure here. He hit Michael Bridges with one at the end of the game, the play where he got past, got to Mitchell Robinson and ran back. If you watched that play, he... Oh, he turned him around. Oh, crazy. And so I think all of those guys also know that if they try to pressure him here,

bop their ass so fast, and they know that. But it don't look, if you're watching the TV, it don't look like his handle like that. But I'm telling you, man, when you get in front, It's like Steph Curry and Kyrie Irvin, their ball handling starts when it appeared to you that they've lost to basketball

because you think they've lost it and they got it so crazy on the yo-yo where as soon as you go to reach, you're so out of position and they didn't caught in you so out of position that there's no way you can catch up. Howley got some of that where it's deceiving. Like the ball looked like it's there

and before you know it, you go to reach and bye-bye. And Holly's six-seven. So whereas Kyrie or Steph make it up and like erky jerk and like just Ali also like he bad bad he's six, seven, his stride, he's gone. You know, and so it's very interesting to watch because looking at it on TV,

it don't look, it don't appear that his handle is like that. When you play it, his handle is way tighter and nicer than it may appear. And I think those guys know that. That's why they're not pressuring them like that. but you got to, you can't just, he's too good to just let him see the court and pick you apart. Yeah, he's shift.

He's shifting. His is like body movement. Like he's trying to keep you off balance, keep you guessing, and it's not necessarily like attack at you. It's to keep you moving side to side and guessing if you do want to press, he go. If you don't press, he's stepping back.

So just great sign. of a point guard of knowing, you know, your space out there on the floor, your space, your defender space, and being able to control the game by keeping your defender off you. And if they come up on him, he's been getting to the hole, too. So you got to figure out something. Yeah. I mean, also, he had pops back in the building.

Shout out to that. Shout out to Commissioner Adam Silver, getting that done. I think that's fire. I think the only thing now is like they're going to be going on the road like let pops go on the road you still got to sit in sweet pops I'm not in the business of wanting guys

to get punished and like wanted guys to get suspended and losing money I think that's just why so I never like to see that but in this situation and what happened with Holly pops and the punishment and all that and everybody like oh man he shouldn't get special treatment

like yes he should because his son is is Tyree. he's Halliburton and just say what you want in life. Like, different people get different treatment. That's just what it is. Like, we can all sugar-coated and be like, oh, like, everything should be the same. That ain't how this world work.

It's just not. So he should get special treatment. He should be at them games. Granted, he shouldn't be courthousal. He should be in the suite. I think he should still be able to be in a suite at Madison Square Garden, right? Like, Hallie got to pay for it. So that's your punishment, right?

Pop's coming to the game. You end up you got to buy a sweet. somehow. I don't think Holly tripping over that punishment, I'm sure he won't pop at all these games, right? And so I just think, like, find a way, man, for that man to be in the building this don't happen often.

Like, his son is on the verge of taking the India and Pacers to the NBA finals to possibly win the championship. Let them experience that. Did he have a fucked up moment with Yannis? Absolutely. Yonis said he moved on. If Yonis moved on, y'all move on.

Everybody move on, right? And so let that man be in the building at all of them games because as someone who's been in the position, it's nothing like it. And you don't get these, like these moments just don't come back around. I was fortunate enough to be in the moment over and over again, but it just don't happen like that all the time, man.

And so let Pops be at all the games. Make Holly Asper, spend some of that Super Max money he got and bought him sweets at the row games too. But let Pops be at all of them games. And shout out to Hallie for responding the way he did with pops in the building, making it a memorable performance having his pops back in the building. I thought that was super dope.

So shout out to them, man. And I got them closing out to Knicks and 5. Nix 10. What Shannon Sharp say? A tick, a big, Nick, patience, and five. hilarious. Nixen 7. We still got hope.

No, it's over, chat. It's a rap. Let's see. It's rap. It's rap. I mean, it is. Rap City in the basement. Let's see.

Nick's winning game fired just because of J-Bron. I'm just telling you, man, the pace is ready to move on. They're balling now. They're definitely putting it together, man. The NBA finals are almost here. and every play could be the one that changes everything. This is the NBA playoffs, where the heroes rise,

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And don't forget to follow us on all social media at Jemont Show. We are recording this episode before game five of the Western Conference Finals. Will the Thunder win tonight? Yeah, I think it's over, man. I just think, you know, with the Thunder. like I've seen some stuff coming from the Timberwolves that it's hard to rally around, you know, like Ant Man press conference last game

saying he didn't get enough shot. It's like, I want to see Edman just own that moment. You know what I'm saying? Like, no, I wasn't good enough, you know? Because saying I ain't get enough shots, like you got the ball, you know what I'm saying? So if Ant Man shoot 25 times, this coach ain't going to sit there.

So you kind of got to go make that. happened. I told you all earlier in the series, I also didn't like benching Julius Randall in the fourth quarter in the game that he's having the first bad game. He's having in the playoffs. And he could get like bitched in the fourth quarter. Like they haven't been through enough together to do stuff like that. You know, where Steve Kerr in game, game three or four, where I got bench kind of in the fourth quarter and then we started doing the office, the defense, it was game three. actually. For me, it was different because it had never happened before, but we had such a

foundation to stand on. We had multiple championships that we had won already to stand on to where Steve know, like, I can make this decision and I'm not going to lose my guy by making this decision because I've won three championships with this dude. We've been through numerous series that has called for adjustments to be made. He knows how this. works, right? And like, fine. Like, I bounced right back, comeback game four, credible game five, readable game six, right? Like, but again, there was a foundation built for us to stand on. It was a trust. Chris Fishman Julius Randall coached for like 50-something games because you missed a large chunk of the season with injury. So he's coached him like 50-some game.

I'm not sure they have the foundation to stand on. and like bench him in the fourth quarter for his first bad game. So when I saw that, right, like when I say I've seen things come from them that I really don't like, like, let's face it, OKC is the better team. No question, but just because you're a better team don't mean that you win. But when you are facing a team that's better, all of those things have to be right. And if those things aren't right, then you have no chance. And so I think those things catch up to you, right?

Like Benching Julius Rand, then he come out, he having a bad game, last game. It's mentally he like, man, I'm going to come out. Like, I know I'm about to get sobbed out, right? Like, I can't make a mistake, you know? And so there's just different things, man, that coming out of that series, like looking, watching that series that I see coming out that I notice because I've been through it and those are things that you play on and play also you're facing those guys. I don't really, I just don't think they've put themselves in position throughout this series to take it.

Now, as you know, it always, it only takes one game to change the series, but I just don't see tonight being at night. Like I think, OKC, they're coming out, they want to finish their breakfasts. All right, so since you got the Pacers winning, the East, OKC closing this up, why should fans be excited for a Thunder versus. Pacers finals. I'm not one to get ahead of myself because I think I know better. I've come back from down 3-1 and won a series. I've lost a series being up 3-1, so I'm not one that's saying this is happening because these two teams still got to win it.

And saying that I'm not even going to break down that series or even say why people should be excited because I think you've got to finish your breakfast first. This is the playoffs. Anything can happen. So whereas I think the Knicks is done, whereas I think Timorovus is done.

You got, you got, that last game is the toughest one. Yeah, you got to prove it. Both of those teams coming out free swinging because they know like, yo, I ain't got nothing to lose. This is it. This is our last one if we lose. So I'm going to give everything I got off on every haymaker

I got. And by the way, both of those teams have multiple guys that I can beat you and take over a game. Julius Randall can, obviously Ant Man can, Cat Can, Jaila, Brun. Both of those teams have guys that can beat you. So I'm not going to get into which one of those, how that series or being excited about it until this time, because you got to close them boys out and it ain't always that easy. Speaking of which, you being down 3-1 on this day. in 2016,

the great Clay Thompson put a remarkable performance together, scoring 41 points, hitting 11 and 3-pointers in Game 6 against the Thunder and the Western Conference finals. Y'all were down 3-2 playing in O'KC.

What was that like? That was one of my favorite games to watch. You know what's crazy that series? So if you go back and watch that series, to start that series, we outsmarted ourselves. What we did was we did not guard Andre Robes at all. Literally didn't guard the guy to help on Katie and Russ, who was guarding Andre Robes

and literally left him Widal. And it's a gimmint, right? We actually did it the year before to Tony Allen in a different way, though, where we put me on Mark Gassall and I guarded him straight up. We put Harrison Barnes on 2015. We put Harrison Barnes on Zeebaugh and just all out front no matter where he goes.

And then we put Bogick literally behind Zibo to help Harrison and kind of play Tony Allen off the floor. Once we played Tony Allen off the floor from the offensive, and their defense couldn't survive because Tony was just fucking your whole offense up.

Tony, I want the best defenders that I've played against in my time. Tony Alice is insane. Max. Chilling. Oh, my God. And so, office,

we used the offensive in Tony's lack of ability to shoot it to force them to have to take them off the floor because they couldn't score enough. And then they couldn't compete enough defensively against our offense. And so that's how we end up coming back for down 2-1 in that series of winning. Fast forward to this year, 2016, one year later, we're playing against O.K.C.

We don't guard ropes and it works. And then they figure it out because it's a gimmick and it doesn't work anymore. And they figure it out. And so now we're rolling the game five and we like, yo, it's 3-1. We're going home for game five. what, like, what we're going to do. And we all were, for Steve, down, stuff, myself, we're all like, yo, let's just guard them straight up.

Make Russ and KD beat us and take everybody else away. Because when we've played this team and we've made Russ and KD beat us and take everybody else away, it's hard. Yeah. So we're going to make, like, we guard it. We're going to guard them straight up. We're going to put Clay back on Rust. We're going to put Andre on KD.

And we're just going to guard them straight up, and they got to beat us. And we won game five. Come back game six. Back against the wall. And Clay, bro, the whole day Clay like, Dre, I got us. Like, there's no chance we lose this game. You know, Clay get this little twitch, like, start twitching the shoulder. They like, I got his day.

No way. Like, you could see in his demeanor, walk the whole thing, shoot around. No way we losing this game, Brian got us. We're down 15. And out of nowhere comes, Clay Thompson. Three, three, caught the ball at his foot, one of them shot at three.

And he's like, I'm telling you, we're not. And so then from that point on, we realize, oh, we're coming back, we're taking this game. But now at that point, you know you got the series because they're not coming back to Oakland, the Oracle. They're not coming back to Oracle and beating us in Game 7, right?

So we came back in that series. And I remember it like it was yesterday. It was crazy. That's a crazy year, man. You think about all the things that happened in basketball history in 2016. That series was crazy. Obviously, we lost in the finals, 3-1 lead. That was crazy.

2016, that's also the year that, like, Steph hit that crazy shot. And OKC we had on those gray-sleeves jersey. And that's like, that shot was kind of like Steph. Like, yeah, it's really me. really him is really it. And then history happens. It's crazy. But like that's all that year with that series

McClain. Just coming back from 3-1, it was insane. So, you know, everything that I said before this about the 3-1 and living through that and being a part of that, there's no way I could count either one of these things up. Okay, agree or disagree.

We've seen a few conversations around the league online that we want to adjust. So during this segment, we will simply agree or disagree with certain trending basketball topics. All right, you ready? Agree or disagree. Yes, sir. Let's do it.

The first one. Janice just got a six straight all-NBA selection. Fans are debating whether Janice is the best power forward of this era. Agree or disagree. Do I get to explain why I agree or disagree? Agree or disagree. Yeah, of course. Okay.

I'm going to disagree. And the reason I disagree is this. Yannis has played in an era where it kind of became positionless basketball. And I don't necessarily quite think that Yonis is a power for and has been throughout this whole becoming of Janus. And so in saying that, that's why I disagree with that because Janus is one of the greatest players of this error. And the gang was kind of positionist. What made people start calling Janus a power for

is because you had to start putting power force and centers on Janus. The team that you build around Janus, because his skill set was so great and driving or still great, driving and getting downhill, is you put a lot of shooting around him. So then when people look, look at the game, they're like, oh, well, Drew Holiday must be this position, and Chris Middleton must be this position, and that guy must be this position. Brooke Lopez is a five.

All right, great, so Janus is a power four, right? And that's why I think people start saying that Janus is a power four. Because Janus is, his attributes, he's 611, 250-some, 60-some pounds, strong as an ox, fast as a gazelle. because of those attributes and his downhill prowess, the way teams had to start matching up on Yonis was putting power force

as centers on him because when you were putting guards on him because he handled the ball so much, they were way too small. And so in turn, I think people start matching up with Yonis putting bigger guys on him

because there was just no way you can guard him at the rim. So then people were like, oh, he's a power four. But if you look at the great power fours, Janus don't play like Tim Duncan. Yonis don't play like Kevin Garnett, right? And so I think people are being lazy and or just don't understand what they're looking at. When they're like Janus, like pigeonhole him into the power four position,

I don't think that's accurate. I just don't think that's very accurate. But we had to guard him because of his skill set and how good. great he is at it with power force and centers, that gives you the best chance at trying to contain him getting downhill and at the rim. That's what people did. And so I disagree because I think he's just one of the greatest players. And I think it's lazy or lack of knowledge if people is just like, yeah, he's a power for. I think you're doing him a disservice and his greatness. All right. Janus is the best power forward of this era. I was saying,

say I agree, starting at power forward. Yonis, onto the coup. Yeah, I don't think they say starting at power forward. They say, out of forward. Oh, they do say forward? Yonis onto the coupon. They don't say power forward? In the hierarchy of basketball structure, if you pick in a team, usually you'll pick

Janus to be a four. But here's the thing, though, BD, because of the way he plays, under no circumstances anyone ever going to say, Janus is a better power for it to Tim Duncan. You just not going to say it because the way. We're saying in this era, of his era, like the 10 years that he'd been rocking, like the last 10 years.

But if he's a power for to his era, then that also puts him in the power for, power four of all time error. And I just don't think people will ever give him a fair shot. Yeah. At passing Kevin Garnett, at passing Tim Duncan, because you're not going to see him with that same eye.

He passed Kevin Garnett. He passed Kevin Garnett as an overall player. But nobody's ever going to just be like, as a power for him looking at what you feel like, I just don't think people are going to give him that dupe. I just don't believe that. I will. You've never mentioned Janus Anto de Kumpo and Carl Malone in the same sentence. You've never done it.

That's my point. Like, he's never going to be mentioned with the great power force. Yes, he is. you're having that conversation because it don't even fit. He's so much, like what he does is so much different than those guys that you've never heard Janus be mentioned with Charles Barkley. You've never once heard anybody say it. That's what I'm saying.

So you're not going to get anybody that's going to be like, yeah, he's better than Barclay. He's better than these guys because it don't even register that, like, look at how this dude play, that he's the same as them. That's not a thing. I just disagree with it. But I would just say he's a one-of-one in his position, right? Because if you look at somebody like Dirk Nowisky, he's a power forward. He's not the traditional power forward, but he is.

He's not, but we mention him when we talk of Power Force, because he played on the block against those Power Force. He wasn't dribbling the ball up to court going coast to coast. He wasn't, like, he wasn't doing that stuff. The only thing Dirk did different than most Power 4s is. the ball. Yeah, Yanis has more, you know, he gets to his spot. Yeah.

But, like, Janus just do so many different. He's a hybrid. He's a hybrid forward, I would say, but power forward. If you had forward, Janice, Antenacumpa. He's going to have to guard somebody and somebody going to have to guard him. And if you're saying, power forwards and centers guard him, then I got to say he's a power forward. Yeah, but then, so what about the night where the coach gets smarter and they put a smaller

guy on him, like Alice Caruso, then, so now he got being guarded by Caruso. So then what? That happens. Then what? That happens. Now the power for they guard them no more. So because it's all about your makeup of the opposing team's team. So then now we have a team that feels it's better suited.

But he's still. If we put Alex Caruso on Joker, does that make him now a power for still? Because Alex Caruso ain't no power for. It's a matchup. This is a matchup. But that's what I'm saying, though. But he's kind of been called to par for. Marcus can be.

Does that make me a power forward? Well, you just say he'd get guarded by power four so that make him a power for. I think people has done that. Yeah, people have to put power forwards and centers on him. Yeah, but that don't make him a power forward or center because that's the only, yeah, I disagree. He's a big man.

LeBron James came into the league as a point guard. Yeah. Kind of. These are facts. Kind of. James came into the league as a point guard. Kind of. And because of then, you saw Yonis came into the,

they played Yonis at point guard when he first, when Jason Kidd's ago. Absolutely. I agree. They did. Just like Ben Simmons came into the league as a point guard. So let's make him a point guard. So then you put, you put what fits in, right?

Like, James Harder came into the league as the two guard. People still mention James Harder with Dwayne. Nobody be mentioning him with Steph Curry and Chris Paul. Yeah, they do. These things don't make sense. No way. He's a point guard. People mention James with this.

All right. He's a point guard. Is he not? Or he's a hybrid guard. That's what I'm saying. He's gar. Like, I don't know, man. I just, again,

you see what people's skillsets are. We're arguing over how many roses we're giving Yonnas at this point. So we agree and disagree. but we both agree that he's a one-of-one. One thousand percent. That's why I would think, following him into the Power 4 conversation, I think is a disservice to him.

Yeah. Just my opinion. We'll do our fantasy, all-time fantasy draft, and see if you draft Yannis, where would you draft him as a three? Okay. Second one. The asshole.

The second one. Get ready for more must-watch TV from Vice Sports, introduce to Grudge, a new series that will relive and unpack many of sports most intense personal and team rivalries, exploring the egos, history, and high-stakes drama that turn ordinary interaction into unforgettable battles.

Delivering something for everyone. Each controversy-laced episode of The Grudge digs into the grievances between teams and the top sports personalities in football, basketball, MMA, baseball, hockey, golf, and more. Narrated Will Compton, former NFL linebacker and co-host of The Bussing with the boys, will be joined by a cast of personalities, including retired NFL-wide receiver, Steve Smith,

Sr., four-time Stanley Cup champion Darren McCarty, former MLB player and manager Bobby Valentine, and renowned NBA journalist Howard Beck and others who tell the stories of these animosities. You'll also see nostalgic archival footage from witnesses, fans, players and coaches closely connected to that week's story. The Grudge premieres Wednesday, March 26 at 10 p.m. Eastern Time, with the new episodes every Wednesday, only on Vice TV. Go to vicesv.com to find your cable channel. Paul George says the days of lockdown defenders are gone.

Ooh! And that you can't do anything against players in the league today. So you know our league, the days of stoppers, those are pretty much gone. The Tony Allen, the TAs, Tony Allen types, you know, even myself. I call myself a defender. There are guys that I can't do anything with. I just have to help them there enough for this to be a tough shot for him. He might make the shot, but I did all I could to make it a tough possession for him.

You just got to tip your hat. Agree or disagree? I disagree. I completely disagree. Has he seen A man Thompson play basketball? Yeah, that's what I'm saying, man. I completely disagree. Have you seen Ney Smith, knee Smith?

What's his name? Me Smith? You seen him, who? I completely disagree. I think when I look at the Thompson plans, those guys alone just kills that narrative. Now, I also think Paul George is making a huge mistake putting himself in the category with Tony Allen. I was just about to say that.

Paul George is not a lockdown defender. He has never been considered a lockdown defender. A two-way player. Ever. Yes, but that's different. That's not locked down. That means you play offense good and you got good defense awareness and you're a good defender. But he's never been a lockdown.

defender to really speak from that perspective. You know, he's a, he's an offensive guy. And so I think that the fact that people say he's a two-way defender, and maybe he pride himself on defense, which you have to be anyway, but there's some young dogs in this league that's just coming out to lock people up. Has he seen Tumani Kumar? That dude can play some defense. So don't tell me these types of guys are not around anymore.

They're young. And I think when you look at the NBA, you're starting to see the tie turn. Yeah, it is. We're about to have an NBA finals with somebody newest winning an NBA finals that's never won before. Last seven years. Last time of years. Right, right. So you're starting to see a tie turn.

Cool. Like, so yeah, you got to give these young guys the chance to actually become Tony Allen, right? Like that takes time. Tony Allen wasn't Tony Allen in Boston, right? Tony Allen in Boston was building to where guys like, yo, this dude, unbelievable defender. And then he starts showing this wreck, you know what I'm saying? He's showing it against Kobe. And then he became Tony Allen, right?

So you got to get these guys time to actually do it. But by no means that they're not there. Like, they're there. Maybe Paul George can't identify them because he ain't never been that. and that's okay. But to think that they're not there or say they're not there is disrespectful to these young guys that I see coming,

they will possibly turn out to be locked down defenders that in 15 years guys that they play with like, man, I played against, Hey man, Thompson, I played against Tumani Kumar and them guys, like the Tony Islands of our, you know, when we're coming through. Yeah, it's not fair for it.

Yeah, it's not fair. Disagree. I completely disagree. And, you know, I would just say the PG, don't. They'll sleep on these young boys. They're coming for you. Don't do that. Don't.

Carl George is a lot of things. First ballot hall of favor is one of them. He ain't Tony out. They ain't never been. Ain't never going to be. We ain't going to do that. But we'll be a first ballot for sure. Anybody who want to question that,

I'll make the argument for on his behalf. But he ain't Tony Allen. Don't do that, PG. That's crazy. Before we get into our next segment of the show, I'm going to answer some of your questions in a segment called Bet with BD. All lines and odds we discussed today

are subject to change, courtesy of draft kings. First question. Barrett, do you buy into the zigzag theory of the NBA playoffs? in your career, did you ever come off a game one win and think we're definitely losing game two? Heck no. You think I'm going to get another steal if you're on the road. You've figured out a way to beat them, but you know that that team is going to make adjustments.

So you're definitely not thinking like, oh, we're going to lose game two. You're thinking like, hey, this is an opportunity to get up too well. So that's really not the mentality. I don't think anybody has. Next up, Barron, what stats or trends do you look at when betting on the NBA? Does it differ if you're betting in the regular season versus the playoffs? I would say for me, you're looking at games at home, games on the road, the last five games, minutes, and touches.

That's how I would measure anywhere when you're looking for people if you bet on, you know, lines about people scoring or rebounding, you always want to take the last five games and then look at their playing time too to see how much time have they been getting consistently. Is it increasing or is it decreasing as a coach looking at different lineups for that matter? And then I say in the playoffs,

you know that the coach is probably going to play a tighter rotation. So you just really should look at, you look at the regular season numbers versus the playoffs numbers, certain players have a magic for showing up and overperforming in the playoffs. But that's usually going to be your superstars or one or two guys on your team. That's going to be relied upon. And usually that's somebody that people are not paying attention to. And if you take a look at these this year playoffs,

it's been a lot of the three, four guys who have been coming up with explosive games as well. final one. Barron, when do you prefer to place your bets early in the week when the lines are open are closer to tip off? I say for me, I would place one earlier in the week because it just kind of relieved the stress and the pressure. And then if I need to double down or move something, then I'll make another bet closer to tip off.

You know, it could be based on injury or based on, like I said, a lineup adjustment. or something that comes in from the news later in that in that week or closer to tip off. I appreciate y'all chiming in. That was our segment, betting with BD, sponsored by Jeff Kames.

We got one get-at-me question for our fans. What do you think about the Dallas Mavericks getting the number one pick in the NBA draft? What message does that send to tanking teams? Don't tank. Don't tank. It's not going to work.

out. Hey, man, for Dallas, I mean, I've traded in the European actor for the great American hero in Dallas, in Texas. I mean, come on, man. And this kid is probably the missing link in the trade for Luca that you get in addition to AD. So the great American hero, G.I. Joe, Cooper Flagg. Cooper Flag is like a G.I. Joe type of brand. We need like Cooper Flagg type of figurines. Dallas, the South, Texas.

Come on, he's going to have some dogs around him. And his versatility, that's a win. Dallas wins. Golly. That's some incredible luck there. One message that's sent to the 10 continues for me. That shit don't work anyway. Anytime you're trying to lose that, they never work to you. favor. Stop.

Okay. Who created the four-ring handshake you do with Shaq? Oh, man. It's just kind of, so Shaq, you know, be able to do it. There was always the pick-on-Charles moments up there. It's so fun, picking on Charles. And Chuck's such a good sport about everything. And funny as hell that he'd get crazy comeback. So it's just always unknown. And so Shaq going around, I got four-reins, hey, Kenny, when I was, one of my first, couple times on the set. Kenny, how many rings you got? Kenny got two rings. Yeah, Drayblin, how many rings you got?

I mean, this is actually, I had three, but then I ended up getting four. He's like, oh, four. And you do the bump. You know, Kenny do us too, you know? Like, Charles. I mean, we're going to talk to you. It's what I just kind of came about. That's too far. Me and, me and Shaq throwing up our fours and boom.

So that's all I did, you know, four rings, baby. You got to lead an OG Chuck alone, man. Chuck is the legend. Stahl him out. Chuck is the legend, you know, but Chuck talked a lot of shit. Yeah, he did. A lot of shit. So it's always fun of getting that Chuck.

Chuck one of the best, though, man. I've been so fortunate to be around those guys, talk basketball with those guys. I'm strictly grateful TNT, Craig Berry, Terrell August, who was there when I first came on. Yep, all good people, man. All great people. So I've been very fortunate to be with that crew, man. But it's going to be a wrap from this episode of the Dremont Green show with the legend of my brother, Baron Davis.

There it is. We will chop it up with y'all after some of these games. After what I think will be after the series. Nix is seven. Let's go, baby. You don't even believe it. I don't even think the Nix believe that. Until next time, that's a wrap.

Peace.