The Herd with Colin Cowherd - The Herd - Hour 1 - Can Boston do it?

Episode Date: May 26, 2023

Doug Gottlieb in for Colin The Celtics keep their season alive. Can they win game 6? Adam Silver believes the NBA was too physical in the 90s   Guest: Marc Stein   #DouggottliebshowSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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I'm Doug Gottlieb in for Colin Cowherd. He and Jay Mack on a little well-earned vacation. Don't worry. Looking all the stuff you come to enjoy about the herd. With the exception of the LeBron to the Golden State Warriors trade idea. Yeah That one ain't happened, bro. I hope you having a great day.

It's a Friday. Kind of curious as I was driving in Los Angeles and looking at the map and there's not a lot of traffic. So either people got out of town already or they're just readying to get out of town and then the massive rush to get to Palm Springs, Santa Barbara, Arizona,

Lake Havasu, wherever, the airport for Memorial Day weekend. And it could have been a Memorial Day weekend without hoops. It looked like it was trending towards a Memorial Day weekend without hoops until the Miami Heat won game four. I said, don't let us win one. Now they won game five. And how I, how I deemed it on my show, which is the Doug Gottlieb show, it follows this

show on most Fox Sports radio stations or your IHeart radio app. how I deemed it was if you watch the weather channel I have the weather channel up in studio right now and they'll go to the tropics you go back to after game four and it was like look at I'm just going to use Anguila

I don't know where Anguila is but let's just say there's a storm forming off of Anguila it's not yet a named storm but if it takes this path and gets to this warm water and gets to the Gulf, then all of a sudden it could be a hurricane. Right? That's what it felt like.

The seas win game five combined with the fact that the heat are currently without three of their rotation players, including their starting point guard and they're starting shooting guard. And it feels like a full-blown hurricane is right off the coast. I mean, it does fit with, and please stop with the hurricane analogies. People lose property and lives. I'm not, I'm not insensitive to that. I'm just trying to tell you that something was sort of brewing away and now getting close. And Miami game six, this is a, it feels like a win or die.

It really does. Yes, there will be a game seven. Yes, we have seen road teams win a game seven. but it's Boston. The Red Sox obviously famously are the only team to come from three games to none down in the ALCS against the Yankees. That was 04. The heat are depleted by injuries.

The Celtics have not played up until recently to their level. And momentum is a real thing whether you want to account for it or not. here's Jimmy Butler on if he thinks they can close it out at home. We just got to play better, start the games off better on the starters, make it more difficult for them. They're in the rhythm since the beginning of the game, but we're always going to stay positive knowing that we can and we will win this, and we'll just have to close it out.

This is Joe Missoula, explains the series this way. Sometimes you have a bad week at work, and we obviously didn't pick the best time to have a bad week, but we did. And we're sticking together and fighting like hell to keep it alive. And the guys are really coming together. Jalen Brown, who seems to be playing better on facing adversity. Obviously, we didn't imagine being in this position being down 3-0. But, you know, when adversity hits, you get to see what a team is really made of.

And, I mean, it couldn't get no worse than being down 3-0. but we didn't we didn't look around we didn't go in separate directions we stayed together we doubled down on what we're good at on defense and I think now it's a series so we just got to take it one game at a time and keep playing it is now a series it is very much up in the balance they did change some things defensively what's most curious is that they laid down in game three there was just there was a quit element to it like man they're done, finished, washed, moved on. Do you fire Joe Missoula?

That's, I can't tell you how many texts I got from, from basketball people like, man, they got to get rid of Missoula. He's just, he's not getting him going. You know, we do this thing where we, we make fun of the cheerleader coach when they go to the timeouts, right? Because they can't give us the substance of the X&Os, the substance of the, of the, of the, of the, of the, changes that they're making because nobody wants that aired on national TV.

So they just give us the, we're okay, we're okay. Listen, one play at a time. But the truth is that a good portion of coaching is not actually the X in Owing. Sure, X&O is important. Sure, matchups, playing time, rhythm, flow, calling a timeout, not calling a time out. Remember David Blatt said it's like being a fighter pilot and how many decisions you have to he's right. People killed him for saying it because they didn't like David Blatt, but he's right.

Like there are so many different things going on at once with five guys at both ends of the floor. Plus you have your bench to worry about. You have timeouts. You have momentum. You have a game clock. You have shock clock. You got a lot of things to manage. But the number one thing is getting to play hard and getting to play together.

Getting to play hard, getting to play together. and they were dysfunctional as hell in game three. And if you would have turned on last night and said, hey, who was leading this series three games done? And you didn't, there was no sound on, no score on.

You're just watching like, well, the Celtics are clearly going to win this series. Now, what's the magic to it? Why has, what has happened in this series? Look,

no one else has ever said this, but I'll say it because it's true. When the Bronn came from three games to one down, with, Kyrie Irving and the Cleveland Cavaliers against Golden State Warriors. People do discuss the fact that Draymond got suspended. How many people have remembered the fact that Andrew Bogot got hurt? And you're like, Andrew Bogot, what did he do?

He was a great passer, a great screener. He defended the rim. He started for them. He required nothing in terms of shots or ego. He was great. when he got hurt in game five, he didn't play the rest of the series. The whole thing changed.

The whole thing changed. And I know the heat of been playing without Tyler Hero. I understand that hadn't changed. But you lose Gabe Vincent. And the idea that gave Vincent one game off and now he's back and he's fine, that's not how ankle injuries work. Doesn't mean he can't play, but can he be as effective at both ends of the floor?

and Kyle Lowry was a great player. He just didn't have it anymore. And the longer the series goes on, the less he's going to have because he's playing more than he should at his age. And he has to because, well, because Vincent was hurt and still is hurt. The other part to it is not just the injuries.

You have a team who, you know, I don't think they wanted to get down three games to none. but there was a little bit of arrogance because they had been to the finals last year and they had played this game going back to the Sixers Series, right? They were down three games to two. And look, if you're down three games to two again, you've got to go on the road and get a win. It's just like the Sixers Series now again. You play with fire too long.

You're going to get burned, but they didn't get burned last time. And they may not get burned this time. And then the final element to it is, I understand. what I think most people are coming up to speed on, which is you can't really correlate the regular season and postseason. So just because the Celtics had a great record, the regular season doesn't mean that they're absolutely better than everybody below them.

But there was a reason that they had the seed they had. And this is why a seven-game series is incredibly important to the NBA, because you want to make damn well sure the better team advances. Because when the better teams don't advance, when you get some sort of an upset, oftentimes the next series is crap. That's really what happens.

Mark Stein joins us next. We'll get his thoughts on what changed with this series and can the Silthics win two more? Plus, what does LeBron's retirement talk really mean? what happens with Kyrie and wait to hear what Adam Silver had to say about physicality in the NBA. That's how coming next. I'm Doug Gottlieb. In for Colin. This is The Hurd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app.

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Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fans. so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of taun tons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Doug Al-Libin for Collins to Hurd on a Friday, happy Memorial Day weekend to you. We'll do the Laker Beach guy. Which are you? Yes, I know. I'm gym guy, right? Basketball gym on a weekend. That's what we do. Mark Stein is a gym guy.

Of course, he's also a Titan, not just in the industry, but a Cal State Fortin Titan. He's an NBA correspondent on substack, but most importantly, if you want to download a really cool, interesting podcast, if you're in the NBA,

and you want to know what's really going on, there's a new one called This League Uncut. It's Chris Haynes, who you use, see on TNT doing sidelines and Mark Stein, who's been covering the NBA for years for over 20 years now as an NBA insider. This league uncut dishes on the biggest NBA topics and rumblings beyond what Stein and Haynes report on social media with more candor and opinion. Again, it's called This League Uncut, Mark Stein, Chris Haynes, wherever you get your podcast or just, you know, IHeart radio at Mark Stein joins us here in the herd. what do you think of this this Boston kind of awakening do they legit

legit have a shot in game six I think we have to say they have a shot and you know look I thought they were getting swept I didn't think they were going to win game four when you you know look so can Coon bound in game three to surround to to rally just the way they did. I mean, they're down nine in the third quarter of game four, and since then, they've just been absolutely lights out. So, yes, we have to give them the respect and say they certainly, you know, have a chance. But I also think this Miami team, you know, they've, they've risen to the moment so many times

in these playoffs that I do think they're going to finish it. But look, I mean, let's face it, Gabe Vincent is a huge. miss for them. They didn't have them in game five, but we don't know if Miami will have them in game six. And frankly, I think a lot of injures on, are they going to have Gabe Vincent? I mean, this team is thin. They've already lost Tyler Hero. They've already lost Ola Depot. They can't afford to lose another key contributor. So, you know, the Celtics certainly have hope and nothing to lose now. So, I mean, they're, they are dangerous. Was Joe Missoula's job in jeopardy if they got swept?

I don't think any of us know for sure. The pressure would have been significant, but it's also true that Joe Missoula is Brad Stevens' handpicked choice to replace Mewdoca, and Brad is Missoula's biggest backer. And it just would be very, it would class in a huge way with both Brad Stevens' track record and, frankly, the way Boston ownership has operated. It would really be a departure for both of those teams to make Missoula one and done. But look, I think a sweep or even a heavy loss last night would have so much negativity into the Celtics atmosphere that, you know, I don't, you know, I wouldn't sit here and say he is absolutely positively safe. I mean, he shouldn't be fired after one year because he stepped into an impossible. job. I mean, you never see someone go from the back of the bench to head coach like that. It just never happens. And really to do so on the eve of the season starting. I mean, these are, these are pretty unprecedented circumstances. But, I mean, you see the climate in today's NBA. And

coaches, you know, even winning championships doesn't insulate you anymore. I think we all know LeBron's not retiring, right? Like, that dude is not going out without a victory parade without a farewell tour. So what was, what, I mean, you and Chris with your new podcast, you guys know way more than anybody else. What was the reasoning behind him opening the door to it? And I back, it's not just the post game comments. Anybody sees their mortality.

But there's also some of the tweets beforehand, I think Windhorst was like, this could be it for LeBron. You know, if they get swept, like somebody told them something, put that out there. What's behind it? Well, look, I have to admit, it's hard for me to sifle the cynical part of it that is, is this a move to deflect attention from the fact that the Lakers just got swept? In round two, they take out the defending champs and they don't even win a game against Denver. Is this a way to deflect from that?

Is this a way to heat more pressure on the front office to let the front office? look, the Lakers stated plan is, I mean, you heard Rob Polinko's day after the season press conference, they want to keep the young court together. What that means is they're going to match any offer on Austin Reeves. Austin Reeves will be a Laker. There's no doubt there. But really, what we're talking about is, do you match any offer for Ruey Hachamuro, who is also a restricted free agent?

If you do so, that basically takes the Lakers out of the Capspace game, and they're not going to be able to make a run. And these are players we presume LeBron wants. I don't think that LeBron has clearly indicated, yes, this summer I want you to go after Kyrie or try to trade for, you know, Prey Young or try to sign Fred Vandleet. These are a suit. We assume that's what he wants,

but, you know, I don't know that I don't know how hard he's actually pushing for that here at the end of May. But look, I do think also this injury, was more serious than we realized. And if he has a surgery to deal with this offseason, and that's another variable, we still don't know yet. If he has to have surgery and have to go through a lengthy rehab, I'm sure that weighs on him and was weighing on him in those circumstances

when this was a long, draining, difficult seasons. I mean, they were 0 and 5, they were 2 and 10. They were still 13th in the West at the All-Star break. So, you know, I think there also was an element of exhaustion and frustration talking. Yeah. I mean, okay, so let's go through it. Kyrie, the Kyrie thing is interesting in that, I mean, Dallas is going to offer in the max, and the Lakers can't offer in the max.

So it's really a case of, would Kyrie come for less to play in L.A.? Right. And even to come for less, the Lakers have to get rid of several players to make that happen. And, you know, I would be highly skeptical that Dallas is interested in any kind of sign and trade with those players that the Lakers would have to move on from to create the cap space for Kyrie. So it's really hard to see how that happens. But that's why you heard so much reaction that LeBron was trying to, you know, make a leverage play here because, you know, if he's, if that's what he wants, you know, surely the Lakers will. at least take that on board to some degree and at least listen to it. But look, they've also shown us over the season, you know, coming into the season,

you know, they didn't do the trade with Indiana where they likely could have gotten Miles Turner and Buddy Healed. They didn't, they didn't rush into moves to try to appease LeBron. The Lakers management chose the course that they thought was best for the franchise, took the patient route. They were in a very deep hole, but they made three. or four trades at the trade deadline, and, you know, they all worked. So if they want to, if they want to resign Reeves and Hachamura, you know,

they've shown us that they'll do what they think they should do. Okay. So what about Trey Young? Incredibly popular in Atlanta. But they've come to the conclusion that many have in the NBA, which is he's just too slight, not good enough defensively. and as magnificently talented as he is offensively, can you win big with him? I know they got the Eastern Conference Finals one year, a couple years ago.

Can you win big? What's the overall feeling of where Trey Young plays next year? I just think constructing a trade that Atlanta would even consider, given the Lakers' limited assets, it's hard for me to even imagine that scenario. You know, people make the connection because, yes, Trey Young is represented by clutch sports, the same agency that reps LeBron, and he went to a couple games, but is it that simple?

Is that it? So he went to a couple Laker games, and now they're trading for him. I mean, the Van Vleet option, because he's headed to free agency, that probably, to me, is slightly more realistic.

But, again, there will have to be a change in the Lakers' philosophy here. They're going to, they basically would have to say we're only bringing back re-use, we're willing to move on from everyone else on the roster to try to make one of these other moves happen. And, you know, to this point, again, I think keeping Hachamura is the preference. Okay, what about the Warriors? Bob Myers out?

Bob Myers, you know, they're trying to convince him to stay. I really feel like the only two options are he's going to stay or he's going to take a break from the NBA. I don't think you're going to see him with another NBA team. Washington, based on everything I was told, did inquire to some level. They did register interest in, you know, letting Bob Myers and his camp know that they would be interested if he was looking to move elsewhere, and obviously Washington moved on and hired Michael Winger away from the Clippers. I don't think this is about trying to get more money with another team. I think Bob Myers is too close to

Stefan Curry, Clay Thompson, and Draymond Green. He's, you know, he's, and his coach, frankly. I mean, those four pillars of the Warriors and the GM are uniquely close. You don't often see that.

And of course, you don't, you don't often see four championships in nine seasons. So there's a reason that close. So to me, I just feel like he's either going to be convinced to stay or he's going to take some time to

recharge before we see him back in the NBA. Look, he's in a great position. He's such a highly regarded executive that, you know, Bob Myers could take a year off or even take two years off, and there will be a line out the door when teams have GM openings to try to hire him. Okay, so what do the Warriors look like next season? Mike Dunleavy would be the natural successor to Bob Myers if he does walk away. But yet, they have really difficult decisions, too,

because with this new CBA coming in, and it's going to be phased in over two years. So at least this off season, you don't face all the pressure immediately. You have at least two seasons to deal with it. But the way it works, if you have more than two stars, it's really going to be hard to build a deep team around two guys.

And this is what, like, Boston is facing, Jalen Brown is going to be eligible for $300 million over five this summer and then Jason Tatum the following summer. And if you sign both those guys to maxes, you're giving $600 million to two players and it really restricts your ability to put quality players around them. And the Warriors have to reduce payroll somehow. Clay Thompson's up for a new deal. Draymond Green can opt into a new, you know, he has a player option for nearly $28 million.

Wiggins did take what you were. would consider a team-friendly contract, but his number is significant. I mean, there has to be changes in Golden State because they cannot in the new system afford all these guys. So if it is Bob Myers leaving and handing this to Mike Dunleavy, it is incredibly difficult what the Warriors have to do going forward. And that's why you hear so much chatter that are they going to shop Jordan Pool and try to move Jordan Pool because you can't pay four or five guys under the new system. No, no, you cannot.

That whole thing is going to be fast. All right, what about these coaching jobs? I look at the sons and, you know, there's some unproven guys. I don't see them hiring anybody who's not proven when you have Kevin Durant and you have a limited window, right? So then it feels like, okay, Doc Rivers and Frank Vogel. I mean, I get Doc Chicago guy. There's got to be some ties there to Isaiah Thomas. but are we really going to bring

Doc Rivers back in as opposed to Well the one thing I would say about Phoenix In general I would agree with you And I would say the same thing about Milwaukee If you're a team with championship aspirations How do you move off of a coach Like Moni Williams Who took you to the finals

And won a league high 64 games the next season If you're Milwaukee How do you move away from Mike Boodenholzer Who just won you a championship Two years ago And then bring in a first year coach But it's interesting in both of those searches.

I'm not saying that they're locked to get the job, but in both of those searches, Adrian Griffin, Raptor's assistant, he's one of the three finalists in Milwaukee, and from everything I hear, Janice Ante Dacumpo is intrigued by the Griffin option, and then in Phoenix, Kevin Young, an assistant from Monty Williams' staff,

the word is, I reported this earlier this week, that Devin Booker has thrown strong support behind Kevin Young. So, again, I'm not sitting here guaranteeing, you that these guys are going to get the job, but in both of those searches, a would-be first-year coach is a factor. Hmm. Hmm. Okay, so who gets Philadelphia?

Look, they've, you know, I think, I mean, Nick Nurse is a strong candidate in three of these searches in Philly's one of them, so, you know, Daryl has hired Nick Nurse before when Nick Nurse ended up in the Rockets organization coaching their G-League team. That was, you know, under Darrell's leadership. So, you know, I think Nurse is a serious candidate there. You know, they've also talked to Frank Vogel and then, you know, the Mike Dan Tony option has been mentioned because of the connections with Hardin and he wasn't assistant there.

So, you know, I think we're inching closer to answers. My sense is that Milwaukee is probably. in Detroit are the closest to making a decision and, you know, Philly, Toronto, Phoenix a little bit further behind. But, you know, I think these teams, they, you want to have your new coach before the draft. So I think it will start to move here. I know you got to get a move. Just give me one second, because I do want to ask you, you've been doing the media game for a long time. And I tried to tweet out yesterday that I get that people are up in arms about Denver and the lack of coverage. Like, you can't make people care about something they don't yet care about. Can you?

Well, look, I have actually tried to take a different approach. I had a wise editor at ESPN who actually does editing for me now on my substack named Royce Webb. And he used to always challenge me and say, the best stories that you can write are the ones that hit 30 fan bases. And that really is true. And that's, it's interesting, put the nuggets aside, put whoever wins the East aside. You would think that the finals, this is the pinnacle of the sport. And we should be talking about nothing else but the Denver Nuggets and whoever they're going to play in the finals. But here's the dirty little secret.

28 fan bases, yeah, they love the NBA. They're going to watch the finals, but 28 fan bases want to move on. They want to do the draft. They want to talk about free agency. They don't want to talk about who's in the NBA finals. So I have always tried as often as I can to do broad stories because every, you know, not every team. I mean, Lakers fans wouldn't say that. Probably Nick fans wouldn't say that.

But there are a lot of teams out there that would say my team doesn't get enough coverage. And so, you know, that's why. for years, you know, power rankings were always so popular because all 30 teams are mentioned in the power rankings. So, and I saw your, I saw your tweet and, you know, I saw your video. And yeah, I mean, I think I think you make some points there that are hard to argue. People want what they want. Yeah.

And I'd love, I'd love to talk about the things that I want to talk about, but that's not how the business works. You've got to talk about. And, you know, you've got to push against it. You can't simply every day wake up, LeBron, every day wake up. Tom Brady, everyday wake up, New York Yankees,

but you also have to be smart about it because, you know, it's generally seen as a click when you go, you know, if I start talking about things that nobody cares about,

except for me, then it doesn't work. It doesn't work out. One other thing I would just quickly add is though when teams lose, when they get eliminated. We always talk about that. You're going to focus on those.

You know, the party for Yokic, it should have been at 3-0 when they put the Lakers on the brink of a sweep. No, remember, clippers lose. Kauai's hurt.

For two days, people say, well, do you move on from Paul George and Kauai? That's the reality to it. And we have the next week to build up to the Nuggets and then the finals. And if they win, we talk about them. And then, of course, we'll say, is this a dynasty when they've just won one title? Because that's what we do next. Thanks, Mark. All right, man, talk to this.

This League Uncut, excellent podcast, him and Mark Haynes. It's really, really good. Let's get to Heardline News with Jay Stu. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Doug, it's great to have Cal State Fullerton Titans on the program. I think, frankly, National Radio deserves more Cal State Forwardton Titans. Quickly, Doug, a quick aside, the most famous Cal State Forwardton Titan.

What comes to mind? Well, to me, it's Leon Wood. He was an 84 Olympian. He was in the PCAA. my dad was an assistant at Long Beach State, so I saw him play several times a year. Plus, he became an NBA official as well. Leon Wood,

who was just inducted into the Southern California Basketball Hall of Fame. So Leon Wood would be mine. I know there's Mark Katsay, and there's plenty of Titan baseball alums. Sed Sabalos. Said Sabalos. Club said.

Keff. The Cedric Sabalos, like, do people don't remember why he got the nickname club said from your former your former boss, Jim Rome. Right? He missed a couple of games because of a family matter. Turns out he went to Lake Havasu,

which by the way is not actually a lake, went to Lake Havasu and went like water skiing and jet skiing instead. It's like one of the all-timers. God bless him. That's like the greatest thing. That's the greatest lie ever. Like, did he really do that? Like, that really happened.

Really, yeah. By the way, Ced is one of the all-timers. great dudes. Yeah. Like great, great dudes. He's been on the show many times. He's been on a show. He's a good guy.

And I'll throw Kevin Costner in there as a Cal State Faworton type. Sure. Although bringing down Tombstone, you know, like, really? This is what we're doing? Not great. Yesterday, Shams Sharania

said something interesting about LeBron James. Says that he played most of the second half of the season with a torn tendon in his foot, and it might need surgery. Shams thinks that he's going to take a while to sit on it and deal with things this summer and then he's probably going to come back. What's your read on that, Doug?

Look, my read is pretty simple. He had a bad foot. It was screwed up. I don't know how he got himself ready to play, but he was there. And obviously, you know, the camera's caught him, putting in extra work. I'm sure that's why he wasn't as mobile as he wanted to be. And I don't think he's ever had a surgery before. So my guess, just just the guess is, I don't want, like, LeBron's never been a milkett guy. Like the, the story I was always told was like, if you tell LeBron, hey, dude, you're out two to four weeks, it'd be like, I'll be back before two weeks. I just, he spends, whereas Anthony Davis, they say, like, you're out two to four weeks. Like, I'll see you in four weeks.

You know, maybe. So, LeBron's always been a worker. My guess, though, is that obviously he was bothering him, something he could play through, something he may need to have. have fixed in his foot. And then he'll probably spend an excessive amount of time rehabbing it and not coming back until maybe Christmas or after. It gives him the ability to really train, probably get lighter. And then, you know, see Bronny play some, see Bryce play some as well.

I mean, I think that's all part of it. But the Lakers have to be, they have to get another dude, a legit scoring, creating point guard in his stead. Otherwise, they're going to be bad without him. And, you know, at 39, you're just not good enough to be able to lift a team up again and carry them into the playoffs, no matter how good you are. So I think that's kind of what he's all working through. News out of the NFL, Doug, Jameson Williams, who, as you remember, he's been suspended the first six games in the NFL season as he bet on college football games while at the team facility last season. Now, you and I have spoken about this.

We didn't even know that NFL guys could bet on college football, but that's not the point here. Jameson actually was asked about it yesterday, and he said this about not really knowing about the rule. Like I said, hit me out the blue and hit a couple other players around the league and on my team out of the blue. I wasn't aware of this situation, but as it happened, like I said, I took it on the chin. I was ready to move forward as things moved on. I got the consequences. So that's been my whole plan moving forward from things. You know, just looking at the bed of day.

What are your thoughts on just how fair or unfair it is? I mean, you know, the league is in partnership with gambling. That's really not my decision, you know. I'm in the league to play football and I make the rules on gambling and things like that. We found out on that Friday that the suspension was handed down. How early or than that did you know? I didn't really know the day before. I just found out the night before talking to my age and my dad.

Find out things and just went from there. What do you think, Doug? He did not know about the rule. He wasn't paying attention in a meeting. That's what it is. He was on his phone not paying attention to me. There's no way. Again, I didn't know the rule, but any team or organization in sports I've ever been a part of since I left high school has been informed of gambling.

Usually by somebody from the FBI before the season began. And, you know, he's a member of the NBA PA. NFLPA, excuse me, there's no question he was informed of the rule. He just didn't remember it or pay attention to it. It does in fact happen. I'm just stunned that players are allowed to gamble on any sport. It's the lifeblood of what we're all going to do for the next,

for the foreseeable future, but its integrity has to be maintained. And I just, I don't know how you walk that path if you allow athletes to bet on sports. Too slippery. too slippery. And that's Jason Stewart with the news. Well, that's the news.

And thanks for stopping by. The Heard Lye News. There's a lot of us who watch the NBA now, who think of what the NBA used to look like, and it's hard to kind of make comparisons because the league is officiated and played so differently. Adam Silver had a sit down with Kevin Garnett. Wait to hear what he said about the changes that were made,

why they were made, they'll ever go back. That's next. I'm Doug Gottlieb. In for calling. This is The Hurt. Be sure to catch live editions of the HARD weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Two NBA insiders podcasting twice a week to plug you right into the NBA great fight. All happening in only one place. This league uncut.

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I thought this was interesting. You know, Adam Silver sat down with Kevin Garnett on Showtime, and he talked about the changes in the physicality of the NBA. Take a listen. There was a point, I believe, probably in around the late 90s, when the game became too physical. And I think we lost some of the- For our viewers, you mean? Yeah, and I think for our fans, from the aesthetic enjoyment of the game,

where it de-emphasized the particular skill a player had and maybe weighted too heavily physicality, where a big, strong player could come in and prevent a incredibly skilled player from doing those kinds of things. Look, he's right. And it's interesting, you go back and you watch some of these highlights from, and he said late 90s, late 90s had started to get physical. Post Jordan era, there was a culmination of events.

One, you had Michael Jordan out of the game. Secondly, you had a bunch of guys that had grown up watching Jordan and had some of the same swag and personality, but just weren't as good, weren't as complete, weren't as able to compete and didn't play on teams. They were able to be as competitive at the top as, as Jordan was. I'm talking about the Tracy McGrady's who never got out of the first round, the Vince Carter's, the Allen Iversons that was in one NBA finals.

You know, these guys were super talented. Rashid Wallace was a guy super, super talented. But for a myriad of different reasons, everybody didn't put together the consistency of competitiveness of success of the guys in the 80s and 90s who were always in the NBA finals, right? And the 80s, it was Lakers and Celtics and then later Pistons and then and then Bulls. And then it was Bulls, Bulls, Bulls, Bulls,

and then eventually it became, it was the Spurs that were there late, but everyone else, and Spurs and Lakers. But the point he makes about the physicality of the NBA, and he actually ended up pointing out Steph Curry, like would Steph Curry be able to do what he does? And as a guy who missed on what Steph Curry would ultimately become as one of the all-time greats, it's okay to say, hey, if they let guys hand check, he wouldn't be that guy.

He can't do all the things he can do. It's one of the reasons at times in the playoffs or in the finals, especially early on the series, that he's not able to do what he likes to do because guys are able to be more physical with him. Conversely, it's actually helped LeBron James as well. because the offensive players can create contact and play kind of bully ball. And there's no, not only there are no centers meeting you at the rim, oftentimes, there's no power forward.

You know, LeBron would be a power forward if this was 25 years ago. Silver added that flopping and other tactics that have resulted in cheap foul calls, allowing scores to exploit the rules. The NBA is looking into the find the right balance. Quote, we've tried to bring to. bring back a little bit of the physicality. I think people like to see hard defense. We've made some changes this season where unnatural basketball moves were being used in the game.

We reset this year and that's no longer going to be foul. That's the throwing the head back. That's the offensive flops, if you will. I thought it was a very fair and open conversation. And it's one of the reasons that when you can't compare eras. You just can't. because there was an era for, I mean, the longest time ever, the ball had to go inside. And before the use of analytics, the easiest thing was, well, hey, how can we get closest

to the rim as possible? Let's throw it to the biggest guy who's the closest and let him figure it out. Whereas it took us a while to figure out the math that three is more than two. And that, oh yeah, by the way, if you open up the floor, instead of getting post-up shots, you get right to the rim where free throws are, you know, guys are shooting high 70s to mid 80s. And right at the rim, they're shooting in the high 70s, you know, I 70s in terms of finishes. And so it's better than shooting threes and better than shooting mid-range jump shots. I mean, in 1995, I entered college.

I played for John McLeod. And in high school, without the use of analytics, that's basically how I played, which was you'd shoot threes or you'd get to the rim. or you drive and kick. What was Euro style then is now how everybody plays. And my entire senior year, my entire freshman year, I got hounded and worked on it. You need to develop a mid-range game.

Oh, how times have changed. And I agree. There's a balance there. You can't make it not physical at all. But that's why the postseason is so different than the regular season. In the regular season, you can't touch anybody. The post season, you can't. Pat Mahomes had the perfect answer.

asked about his compensation. What was it? I'll tell you next. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is the hurt. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigley. Michael and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged.

It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast.

Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of tauntons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of, of two. Listen to Stuff to Blow Your Mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.