The Herd with Colin Cowherd - The Herd-HOUR 1-Justin Herbert, Drew Brees, Matt Ryan, MVP

Episode Date: October 13, 2020

Justin Herbert looked special last nightMatt Ryan is really good when everything is going well but that rarely happensWe need to stop making excuses for Drew Brees.Russell Wilson should be way ahead of Aaron Rodgers in the MVP raceGuest: Doug Gottlieb Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque.

Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the Look Back at it podcast.

From 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 was big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s.

84 was a wild year. It was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th.

You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes,

follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Thanks for listening to The Heard podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1. Find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Hurd. You're listening to Foxxport's. Sports Radio.

Oh, it is a loaded jam-packed Tuesday live in Los Angeles. This is The Hurt. Wherever you may be, and however, you may be listening, we're on Fox Sports Radio. And right here on FS-1, one hour from now, the herd hierarchy, rich, packed with flavor. Ten playoff teams, what do I do with Brady in the Bucks? They looked awful against Chicago. What do I do with Seattle, worst defense of all time, statistically?

Joy Taylor is joining me. It appears, Joy, we talk about this all the time. All the quarterbacks are getting better. We appear to have another new star at quarterback. Didn't see it coming, but he is, he has arrived. He is really good, folks. I don't want to hear about Michael Thomas wasn't there for Drew Breeze. Stop.

Okay. Justin Herbert's a rookie. Okay, he didn't have his starting right. tackle, his starting right guard, his starting running back, and his best receiver, Keenan Allen, got hurt into the first quarter. And he went on the road against Drew Breeze and was a better quarterback, and it wasn't close. Passer rating, the kid, without two of his offensive linemen, and the Saints have one of the best pass rushes in the NFL, 123 passer rating.

Four touchdowns, no picks. You can do so much more with Justin Herbert than you can do with Drew Breese. They moved the pocket out. He's got a rocket arm. You can throw it deep, short. It doesn't matter. The question now is will the charger screw it up? That's the question now.

Because where you land matters in the NFL, Sam Darnold, punctured by his team, Josh Allen, you'll watch tonight elevated by his. Look how long it's taken Baker Mayfield to finally get a grown-up as a head coach. Oh, Baker looks pretty good. Where you land matters. And the Chargers have a good GM and a lot of talent. but what a shock. Last night, the coaching wasn't good, and the special teams lost the game.

This kid has led in the last three, four weeks. He's led Mahomes, he's led Breeds, he's led Brady in the fourth quarter, and they can't make a kick or they go conservative with play calling. This kid's a rock star. But this organization historically has gone cheap. Is Anthony Lynn the coach? Well, let's look at his own division. In order to win this division, Andy Reed, Patrick Mahomes.

Can Anthony Lynn out duel them? Forget Belichick in the AFC. Forget John Harbaugh on the AFC. Forget Mike Tomlin. Forget Sean McDermott. Forget Mike Vrable. Is he as good? As daring as John Gruden?

Is he schematically clever like Andy Reid? All I know is this. Justin Herbert is wow. The only two quarterbacks in the league that have this talent, this size, this arm, this escapeability. The two of them are Patrick Mahomes and Josh Allen. And Patrick Mahomes got a year. year to sit behind Alex Smith.

Josh Allen was awful his first year and a half in the league. This kid is great now. Will the charger screw it up? Is Anthony Lynn right? Is Anthony Lynn good enough? He wasn't last night. And if they decide he's not, will Dean Spanos, the owner, go out and pay $10 million for Lincoln Riley or $10 million for Urban Meyer?

Not some retread coach like the Cowboys did. Will you go out and spend big boy money to get? at John Harbaugh, to go get a rock star head coach. Because we know in this league, if you give Lamar Jackson John Harbaugh, we know how it turns out. Really good. And if you give Josh Allen a Sean McDermott, excellent young coach, we know how it turns out. You'll watch the night.

Really good. We know that if Mike Vrable gets his hands on Ryan Tannahill, what happens? Average quarterback than better than average. Because I'm watching Justin. I have questions about this staff. They watched all these. practices. They watched all this game tape.

And it wasn't until last week the Chargers went, yeah, we think Justin Herbert's better. What are you watching? I mean, there are things in life that are subtle and nuanced. Justin Herbert has a massive arm. Is huge. This kid, everybody nitpicked him at Oregon. So I watched a lot of Oregon football games because I used to work in Portland.

So they have an offensive line coach as a head coach, very conservative, and they don't have great weapons like Clemson, Ohio State, Alabama, LSU, it's Oregon. They don't have five star wide receivers, right? And so Justin Herbert, it was a very conservative offense. And at the end of the year, Joy was here, they decided at the end of the year in the Rose Bowl, we got no games left for Justin Herbert. Go for it.

And did you watch him against Wisconsin? Wisconsin had a great defense. They couldn't stop Justin Herbert. It doesn't take much. This kid was a dean's list student in college, and he majored in biology. It wasn't like a lot of athletes who, you know, you find the major that kind of works for your ability to not like, you know, go to practice and stuff. He majored in biology.

He was a dean's lister. We've had people of this network who have covered Oregon, interviewed him. They're like, oh, kid blows you away, the wisdom for like a 21-year-old kid. But I wonder about this. Can the Chargers elevate him? Because last night, I mean, when they doinked that field goal, you were all watching that game saying the same thing. Oh, gosh, the Chargers. When they went conservative with their play calling, you were all saying the same thing.

So the pressure is not on Justin Herbert. It's been, he's played four games. First game, again, five minute heads up. You're playing against Patrick Mahomes. I don't know, a little intimidating. Can you imagine five minutes you're fighting Mike Tyson? Five minutes, you have to face Messi. Five minutes, Patrick Mahomes, a little nervous.

He outplayed him for the first half of that game. He outplayed Tom Brady, first half of that game. He out played Drew Brees last night. are the chargers good at the pressure's not on Herbert it's on the organization because the organization has a history of being cheap screwing up special teams and in and they got players don't kid don't kid yourself it's not woe is me justin herbert's got real receivers i mean it's a real football team with real players but uh four games the first one a touchdown a pick second one a touchdown a pick third one three touchdowns a pick last night four touchdowns no picks Cameron heyward of the saints great player on a great defensive line says said, oh, oh, watch out this kid's special. He's a baller. Young kids out there taking a lot of hits today. I think our D-line, I think our front seven got after him pretty well.

You know, he made a lot of great plays down the stretch. And that's something, you know, that he may be a force to be reckoned with for the years to come. He's showing us some huge potential. Cameron Jordan, my bad. All right, let's shift to this. Yesterday I said something to Joy during the show. and it wasn't trying to be a hot take, but I watched Matt Ryan this weekend. And I'm watching the NFL in 2020.

And I'm like, Atlanta fired everybody. They fired their GM. They fired the coach. And I'm like, I think I'd move off Matt Ryan in one year. Cap space, you got to keep this year next year. But if I could draft the Trevor Lawrence, if Atlanta keeps losing, if I could draft the Justin Fields, I draft him. Very interesting.

The owner of the Atlanta Falcons, Arthur, blank said we're not quite sure what we're going to do at the quarterback situation with Matt Ryan. Matt has the ability to play at a very high level, even at this age, whether that's going to continue or not, I'm not sure. I appreciate his willingness to consider doing that and the level of what he's played for for us for 13 years, which has been incredible. So I will have to say. But then again, that's going to be a decision at the end of the day. That'll be part of me be up to the player and part of it would be up to the coaching staff and whether or not, you know, Matt can keep himself together. And I hope he's going to be part of our plans going forward,

but that would be a decision that I won't make. Not exactly a vote of confidence. Matt Ryan's not bad. We all know that. Matt Ryan's not special and dynamic. We all know that. He's Kirk Cousins with an MVP. Would you move off Kirk Cousins? Kurt Cousins gets talked about a lot because Kirk Cousin wins and got that initial big contract. But Kirk Cousins is actually more mobile than Matt Ryan. You can roll the pocket out with him. Kirk Cousins actually throws a better deep ball than Matt Ryan. What do you do with Matt Ryan? I watched Matt Ryan this past weekend. When everything's set up for success, it can be nice. It's sort of like marriages. Everybody gets along on the honeymoon. The kids are at

camp for the summer. No in-laws around. And the money's rolling in. But how's the marriage when the money's tight? In-laws are in town. Kids are melting down. That's a real marriage. That's what all of us go through. Matt Ryan is great when everything set up for him. But it's

2020. Nothing's set up for anybody. Justin Herbert, Josh Allen, Patrick Mahomes, Lamar Jackson, Those guys make plays when the world isn't perfect. Matt Ryan plays in a dome. There is no wind. He plays in a warm weather division.

If he played in Pittsburgh, you'd see even more issues. He is largely protected. Julio Jones plays in a dome. But this is the real question. Your marriage, it's tested when the kids melt down, not when they're away at camp. And in 2020, what's your quarterback like? When you're missing a left tackle, your top running back is out, your number two receiver is out, and your back is killing you because he got sack five times the previous week.

And that's for Matt Ryan territory he can't elevate. I'm watching the NFL right now, and there's about seven teams that I would say would not draft Trevor Lawrence. about seven. Everybody else, that kid at Clemson, I'd take him, sit him for a year in Atlanta, and move on. If you want to be special, you've got to have a special quarterback. Matt Ryan is special when everything is set up to succeed. As you watch the NFL going forward, when is everything perfectly set up to succeed? The answer, almost never. coming up, stop making excuses. I know he's iconic and I know he's beloved,

but we got to stop making excuses for an NFL player. That's coming up. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the IHeart Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unresed.

unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast, Superhuman, documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions. my journey from basketball to college football or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way,

this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be.

Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye They said that George Bush didn't like black people.

I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do a little kill? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jett. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack.

I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed correct. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really?

Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it.

And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth, or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you

to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free, our heart radio app. Search, learn the hard way, and listen now.

Evian, this excuse I am tired of officially, I'm getting, you know what I mean? I don't like excuses to begin with. I tell my kids this all the time. Don't want to hear victimhood. Got a good life. Granite countertops. We're all good here. I don't want excuses.

I don't want to hear Michael Thomas is not available for Drew Brees and that's the problem. That ain't the problem. Michael Thomas is worth one point in Vegas. That's what he's worth. NFL scoring has never been higher. I saw a stat this morning last. year there were like 25 games where they scored over, you know, like combined 50 points or something. We're already at like 22.

Michael Thomas is worth a point. Okay, there's four old quarterbacks in the NFL. Let's be honest. Two can't play and two can't. Philip Rivers and Breeze right now can't win big with them. Big Ben and Tom Brady, I think you can. But Breeze needs to outsmart you. And he's great at it.

But Sean Payton is one of the smartest offensive coaches of my lifetime in the NFL. He's on a short list. When he wants athleticism or a deep ball, he brings in Taysam Hill. And everybody's complaining last night on Twitter about Taysam Hill. Oh, the Saints offense doesn't need Taysam Hill. Hell it doesn't. Their first six possessions last night against the Chargers who were a beat-up mess defensively. You got no Derwin James, Brandon Ingram's out, Bosa's Limited.

Their defense is a wreck right now. They're all banged up. The first six possessions, Drew Brees led, punt, punt, field goal, punt, interception, punt. and the field goal was an 18-yard drive. And their only touchdown of the first half, they basically got it at midfield. You're not smarter than Sean Payton. Sean Payton's watching practice.

Sean Payton's like, we got to throw it deep, we got to bring in the other guy. We need an athlete. We're going to bring in the other guy. And I love Drew Breeze, a first ballot hall of famer. But at some point, I'll be on the air, and I'll have no more teeth left, and I'll be hacking and wheezing,

and you'll be like, ah, it's over for Colin. You can't win with Colin. Right now, still got a shot. still got a shot with me. But, you know, this is not about Michael Thomas. This is a pop gun offense. I mean, the offense is Alvin Kamara. Little dump pass make it work.

It's not a knock on anybody. This is an elite defensive line, a very good offensive line. Camaro's a stud. But there's four old quarterbacks in this league, and Philip Rivers and Drew Brees, your eyes aren't, they're not fooling you. Okay, what you're seeing is Justin Herbert. You can do a lot more with Justin Herbert. You're going to watch Josh Allen tonight.

You can roll the pocket. You can throw deep, intermediate. I mean, Josh Allen and Justin Herbert are the kind of guys. Justin Herbert was getting the crap knocked out of him last night. I mean, he was throwing off balance. He was throwing while getting hit. He's got two offensive linemen out. He doesn't have his best running back.

Keenan Allen gets hurt. And they are a field goal away from beating Drew Brees. So I don't want to hear about Michael Thomas. Great player. He's worth a point. Okay. You got two offensive linemen out for the Chargers. We all know what quarterbacks need.

Good coach, good offensive line. That's just as valuable. Joy with the news. No, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. We can still win with you, Colin. Huh?

Can still win with you. Right now. I feel like this year was like your Tom Brady Falcons Super Bowl. Right? We had five months with no sports. We were behind 28 to 3. And then we came back triumphantly. You were Edelman.

You made a catch. You made a kid. The ball was one inch. And Joy swooped in and made the catch, or I wouldn't have won it without you. I appreciate that. So, Dak Prescott's ankle injury Sunday brought up a lot of questions about his future in Dallas. But Stephen Jones made it clear that the team's feelings about DAC haven't changed. Jones said he's our future.

He's special. If anyone can overcome anything, it will be DAC. It's something our doctors feel like he'll overcome and he'll come back better than ever. He's the face of our franchise. He'll come back ready to go next year. I saw Alex Smith play Sunday. Dack's going to be fine. It's a four to six month injury, as gruesome and brutal as it was.

And of course, you see that and everyone's first thought, obviously, other than him being injured and hoping that he gets well soon, is that, oh, my God, like, this, what happens with the future of him with the Cowboys? Like, he did not sign that long-term deal. This is the risk that you take when you bet on yourself. And everyone loves Dak as an individual, and he's done everything right. So we're rooting for him to be successful. It just feels like he was going to be franchised next year anyway. That's how I feel. Like, I feel like Mike McCarthy, they'll franchise him again, and they'll say,

listen, we're going to give you $35 million again. You know, this is in Dallas. I'm likely going to win NFCs. I'm not as confident as you are on that. Who? I like Philadelphia. They're going to pull together? I, well, because they just lost again.

I know. It's week four or five. I think structurally Dallas. So is everybody to understand how limited the Giants' offenses and what it looked like Sunday, I'm not saying that the Cowboys have it together either. They just have it together a little more than the Eagles have it together. And the other two teams in the division are not in the conversation. That's a milkshake bet.

Well, I'm lactose intolerance. So we'll bet we'll bet dinner somewhere. Fine. I'm Philly or Dallas. I'm sticking with Dallas. But I do think that Dak will be back next year and franchise tagged again. Yeah. My feelings about Dak with the Cowboys changed when he was franchised the first time.

That kind of felt like, okay, Dack's not going to finish his career with the Cowboys. because he's going to get franchise tags again next year. And then unless he has some spectacular of the top year where they make a deep playoff run or get to the Super Bowl, what is Dallas going to do? Because you're basically saying you're unsure. Now, I understand that they offered him a contract. But they knew what kind of contract that he wanted.

And I mean, for whatever your opinion about Dak is as a quarterback, he's 42 and 27 in the regular season and 1 and 2 in the postseason. He's not been in the league that long. Right. And he now has a new head coach. He's dealing with the circumstances that are there. Yeah, he's a franchise quarterback. Nobody disputes that.

I never doubt he's a franchise quarterback. The question becomes, and actually, one of the things I like about him, real durable, and he can move. And in 2020, I like my quarterbacks to have a little wiggle. So he's a franchise quarterback. The question's going to become, and there's a Garoppolo thing where there's these bad Sundays and you're like, I can't go to 40, I can't go to 37, I'll go 29, 30. and I think he's in that sphere.

And I don't disagree with you because he's not going to carry a team to the Super Bowl and their defense needs to be focused on right now. And carried. Yes, definitely. Finally, Josh Allen has led the bills to a strong four-and-o start

and his performance this year so far has got the attention of former MVP Patrick Mahomes ahead of their week six matchup. Josh has played top-notch football, MVP caliber football. So when you have the offense or defense that are both clicking like that,

there's going to be a hard team for us to beat and I'm ready for the challenge. I didn't love Josh Allen in the beginning. He was awful his first year. He was awful. He has really, really developed. I mean, honestly, that's where I, when I see something like that, I'm like, okay, who's his coach? Who's his coordinate?

Like, when a guy does, boom, you're like, like Patrick Mahomes, nothing against Andy Reid, but Patrick's got some gifts that are just super natural. But, and Patrick, I mean, Josh Allen wasn't a good kind. college quarterback. Like he was all over the map as a college quarterback. He was terrible his first year. And then you see him turning around. He's going to get Brian Daebel a really nice head coaching job somewhere in this league. There'll be about five coaches fired because when you watch him tonight, he is now accurate. He always had a huge arm. He's accurate. He's had a tremendous development. Patrick Mahomes has things that you can watch and say, okay, no one taught him how to do that. Well, Lamar. He just does it. He just has that extra magic to him.

Some guys have magic. They have that it factor. Josh Allen doesn't have that to me, but he is, he has developed so much since he's gotten in the league. Like, you just, I can't deny it anymore. Like, he is a franchise quarterback. He's playing tremendous football. The Titans had no positive tests. So the Bills and Titans game is on for today. How great is it?

What times are it on? It is at four Pacific, so 70s soon. It's early. It's all the, you know, I love the West Coast. Tuesday night football. I love it. Give us a lead tomorrow. Well, the bills are favored by three and a half, according to Fox Betts.

And it should be a good game tonight because we haven't seen the Giants for a while. So glad that they're back. Finally, the Braves kept their undefeated postseason alive in game one of the NLCS. They can hit. With the Dodgers. At the top of the ninth inning, Austin Riley hit a huge home run to break the 1-1 tie. That was just the start of the Braves four-run rally to get the 5-1 win. Game 2 is today at 5 Eastern on FS1.

And some big news for the Dodgers, Clayton, Shaw has been scratched from today's game due to back spasms. So Tony Gonsolin will get the mound instead. Dodger fans are getting tired of winning the division and not getting the payoff. They need to get over that hump. Yeah. But that's big news that Clayton's out. Big game today.

It's not great. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The herd lie news. You know, it is interesting. Like in basketball, if you see a talent, You're like, okay, that kid's a talent, and then he just needs coaching and everything.

In football, we see this talent. And then it's so weird, we talk ourselves out of it. And like when you see Justin Herbert at Oregon and you're like at the Rose Bowl, you're like, Do! He's just running over Wisconsin guys. Wisconsin had a very good defense last year. And it's like there was a lot of criticism about him. And I said this during the Rose Bowl, and during the draft, I said Justin Herbert.

I said, I watch a lot of Oregon games because I, you know, I cover the ducks. And I watch a lot of Pac-12 football. Everybody watches SEC football. Everybody watches Big 10 football. I watch Pac-12 football and that stuff. And I said, I don't understand. He's a four-point student in biology. He's big, strong, and mobile, and he's a good kid, and he got better every year at college.

I'm like, I don't get the nitpicking. We did this with Andrew Luck. We're like, ah, Andrew Luck's arm is good enough. It's a B-plus arm in the NFL. It's fine. It's like almost like we talked ourselves out of this kid. Holy moly. And I just watched him last night.

I was like, whoa. Doug Gottlieb, Doug Gottlieb show. All ball with Doug Gottlieb, the podcast now joining us, brought to you by Mercedes. Ben's the best or nothing. Are you a little surprised? A little surprised, Doug, that there was, like Anthony Lynn kind of pushed back, let's start with Tyrod. And then, you know, they kept saying it's Tyrod's team. Like, I look at that and I think, man, what at practice didn't you see?

It feels, or were they just protecting them? the kid. What were they doing? Well, there was no OTAs, remember? Yeah. There wasn't all of the normal stuff after the NFL draft column had gone away. And if you remember, when Anthony Lynn was in Buffalo and they went to the playoffs for the first time in I think 13 years, Tyrod Taylor was his quarterback. So there's, you know, he had that, that was his rabbi in the room. That was the guy who believed in him. And he tried to have us believe that you don't lose your job to injury. But, you know, Wally Pip lost his job to injury and never got it back. and clearly Justin Herbert is going to Wally Pip the Tyrod Taylor.

That said, look, there were a couple of inaccurate throws, and that's, I think, the biggest question mark. You guys were talking about Josh Allen. And, you know, we all, we've all bought into this idea that you don't get more accurate at the higher level of football. That was what held people back from believing in Lamar Jackson. And look, it's still an issue at times with Lamar Jackson, especially outside the numbers. It's still an issue at times for Josh Allen, although they found a way to navigate it.

and it's going to be the biggest issue, I think, for Justin Herbert. But Herbert was one of those guys that checked a bunch of boxes, but it was like one of those, this is, you know, the old adage, if something's too good to be true, it probably is. I think that's what people thought. Yeah. I also think in this, I know it's two different offenses. I know two different coaching staffs, but there's some similarities there.

I think Oregon's style, their tempo, the dink and dunk, a lot of screen passes in their offense. I think that covered up Marcus Mariotas flaws, and I think it covered up some of the immense amount of skill that Justin Herbert has, because he's way better than advertised at this point in his career. Doesn't mean top end he becomes better than Burrow

or better than Tua, but as of right now, it is stunning how good he looks. You know, it is interesting about, and I was talking to a friend watching the games this weekend, and I'm like, like, there's certain guys in this league. We know they are not super dynamic, and we know they're not bad. Matt Stafford, Matt Ryan.

And you start watching them and you're like, if I'm Atlanta and it's like, and I'm Detroit, it's like, I know they're talented, Doug, but the game's changing. You saw last night with Breeze, they're just only, you can't do certain things. And I said to myself, I was talking about Trevor Lawrence this weekend, and I'm like, I think there's seven teams that wouldn't take him. You know, obviously, Kansas City, Seattle, Green Bay. I mean, we know who it is. I even think New England with Cam would say, we'll take him and just keep

can for two years. But take Matt Ryan, for instance. He's been an MVP. If you could get Trevor Lawrence, would you take him with Matt Ryan if you're Atlanta? Probably. I mean, or you, look, everyone has a value, right? It's like when Kaleel Mack was traded for two first round picks, everybody said John Gruden, one couldn't get two first round picks he did. And then, you know, how can you give up on your team? Well, look at what you can surround your quarterback with. So I do think that Matt Ryan still has an immense amount of skill. I mean, they had leads in all of these games to give away. Now, was he part of the offense that gave away the lead?

Sure, but it was the defense that was completely dysfunctional and a team that just found ways to lose games they should rightfully win. So I'm not selling Matt Ryan right now like others are. I think it just depends. What can you get from Matt Ryan? What can you get for Trevor Lawrence? You balance that out with who's the new GM, who's the new head coach, and how long their contract is. Because in the short term, Matt Ryan's going to win you a bunch more games.

In the long term, having a rookie contract under a rookie deal and a chance to get something back for Matt Ryan in return, obviously looks profitable in the future. But the idea that you're going to win right away with that team that has a bunch of holes to it. Look, Julio Jones isn't what he used to be. And Todd, everyone knows that Todd Gurley is after the knee, some of the work ethic. issues. He's going to have moments of greatness, but he's not a great long-term fit. That's a team that probably needs to start over, and starting over usually means the quarterback. But I think Matt Riley and Ryan still has a lot more good football left in him. The question becomes, it feels like it has to be a team in a dome because he's always had some arm strength issues.

I want to go to basketball. You know, it's one of the things that really jumped out to me in the bubble is how much leadership mattered. Jimmy Butler, I had my questions, but I really felt like, wow, this kid's a real leader. He plays with young guys. He was, I just really felt like my whole opinion of Jimmy Butler changed. And I watched a lot of these veteran teams. And there's a lot of great players in this league, Harden and Westbrook and Janus and Paul George and Kauai.

But I looked at LeBron's leadership. And I mean, he's got kids. He's got a family. And he just pulled this thing, Doug. He just pulled it all together. And I thought, if leadership matters, and I think it does. LeBron's the best player in the league again next year, isn't he? He's the only guy that I think can make everything work.

And I watched this bubble and I'm like, I think leadership was 50% of the bubble beyond players. I would say the two things to me that the bubble taught people who don't pay enough or give enough respect to the NBA is one, leadership matters and coaching matters. Let's not kid ourselves. Frank Vogel and his staff did a marvelous job. Yes. Okay. It helps, it fixes everything when LeBron buys in, but he had to get LeBron to buy in. They had excellent game plans, and he helped execute them. Whatever was discussed in getting him on board, he didn't fight him on things.

And when your star fights the coach, it ain't going to work. So the first thing is coaching did matter. I thought it mattered for Miami. I thought it mattered for the Lakers. I thought those were two beautifully coached teams. But you're right in terms of leadership. But they're different. you know, LeBron was a little abrasive last year as a leader.

This year, he was just constantly in the ear of Anthony Davis. And then Anthony Davis was his number two. And Anthony Davis then cleaned up some stuff in the locker room. And, you know, look, there's a lot of interesting stories that I think will come out of the bubble. The Lakers weren't in great shape mentally. And then, you know, with what happened in Kenosha, when the league took like four or five days off, they actually missed two games. That helped recharge them.

And then their family showed up. help recharge them. And then the, and then the rockets were talking a little trash to them. That helped him. And then the clippers lost. And then they were like, well, the hell with it. Now we're going to win this thing. We're already here. Let's just, let's just finish it off. So I think that LeBron's leadership, not just in what he said and how he carried himself, but how he respected his coach, but also the fact that he empowered Anthony Davis to then be his attach, his number two. And so it wasn't just LeBron being a dictator in that locker room. The heat, you got a bunch of a bunch of young guys. And obviously, Jimmy Butler finally found a group that will listen to him.

Right. Butler can be, again, abrasive and a know-it-all, and that old head who thinks he's seen and done everything, but it did work with this group. I think coaching and leadership was a huge part of the bubble. You know, it's interesting. We were talking about this yesterday on the show that, you know, greatness just isn't talent. Like I've always said, you can say what you want about Jim Harbaugh, but it's not just that he made Michigan better. San Francisco, the Niners were a wreck when he left. Like, what happens when you leave? And as great as Jordan is, North Carolina was great when Jordan left. And by the way, the Bulls were fine when Jordan left. They went 5755. But LeBron's teams are terrible when he leaves. They're horrible. They're like get the number

one pick. Could I just argue this? Forget talent as a foundational pick. LeBron makes... Why are we doing? He makes everything work. He makes everything better. He's an all-time great player. Let's not do the Jordan. When Jordan left the Bulls the second time, they were an abject disaster.

Now, everybody else left as well. When LeBron left Miami, one of the reasons that they sank so far down was Chris Bosch had blood clots, right? If Chris Bosch comes back with that gigantic contract, there's still a playoff team without him. You know, the first time LeBron left Cleveland, they had once. 61 games. They did. They had gone all in. Remember, they got Shaq and Anton Jameson. They tried to throw everything to make it work. And then they tore it all down. They fired their coach. They tore it all down. So I think context does matter. But again, I don't, I heard your foundational piece. If that's true, then why wasn't their foundation better last year? I think it takes the right

mix. I think that these things take usually a year to marinate. I mean, the truth is that that even when he got to Miami the first time. It wasn't perfect that first year. And they had to figure out the point guard situation. They jettison Mike Bibby. They moved Chris Bosch essentially to center. And then they acquired Ray Allen. And the rest is in fact history. Right. So I think we have to understand that the clippers are going to be real next year. The Warriors are going to be real next year. The nets are going to be real next year. Boston should only get better. I think Milwaukee, as long as Yonis stays, I think they'll be right there. I think it's going to be an unbelievable year. LeBron and what he's done to me was my MVP because of where this team was at the end of last year.

Magic quits. They couldn't pull off the trade. People didn't want to deal with Polinka. That's what everybody said. Tailu is the only coach. Tailu turned down the job. And you look at now, they were the best defensive team, clearly the best team in the NBA. Whatever the road they had to go through isn't their fault.

But if you want to do the whole what happened when they left, when Jordan left the Bulls the second time, they've never, they've literally never recovered, never recovered, except for the year they were the one seat with Derek Rose. So I think he's great. I think he makes everybody better. That's the true sign of a great player. But it takes a while to learn how to play and function with LeBron James, especially this version of LeBron James, who's not as athletic as he used to be defensively, but he uses his brain at a 50 times rate of most NBA players to get everybody else to do the things that he used to be able to do. The Dougger show after ours on Fox Sports Radio, we're having, we're having stakes tonight, Doug and I in Washington. Am I cooking?

I heard you don't know your way around. You're cooking? I'm like Bobby Flee with a microphone. You're not, I'll be cooking. I'll be doing all the cooking, very talented. Doug Gottlie, good stuff. Coming up next, I want to end the MVP debate, Russell Wilson, Aaron Rogers. Let's just stop it. Let's not get into it. There's certain times, I don't even want to engage in conversations. So I'm going to stop everybody else. from talking about it with a little context on why it's not a competition. It's like Burger King to McDonald's. You can be two, but it ain't close to one.

That's coming up. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all. embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year.

Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clever Taylor the 4th.

You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right what you need to be. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs?

Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do a little kill? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack.

I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really?

Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests.

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deductible may apply. It's a warranty when yours runs out. So I saw some, it's unfortunate, the media has never been worse. And I've seen these Aaron Rogers should be the MVP stories in the last couple of weeks. And it's like, stop. Let's let's stop. Let me give you some perspective on this. There's no story here. Russell Wilson is 5'0. This Seattle defense this morning is statistically the worst in league history. In league history, here's the worst four defenses.

For our radio audience, Seattle's won. They're 5 and 0, including a win over Belichick and Cam. Atlanta's is now the second worst. They just fired their GM and their coach because of it. Drew Breeze, 2012 Saints, third worst defense. They were 7 and 9. Remember, they had the best offense in the league? Drew Breeze couldn't get a winning record with the best offense in the league

when he had a bad defense. And the 81 Colts were awful. You cannot win in this league with a historically awful defense. So let's start with that. Aaron Rogers, much better defense. Here's the other thing. I mean, Russell has scored 35 against Belichick, 31 against Brian Flores, and 27 against Mike Zimmer this weekend in a driving rainstorm,

three good defensive coaches. But ask yourself this, offensive lines, do they matter? Do you know the number one rated offensive line in the NFL? this morning, PFF? Green Bay. Green Bay also has a top five running back in the league, Aaron Jones, a top five wide receiver, maybe a top two wide receiver in Devante Adams. Green Bay also has an offensive coach. That obviously helps.

I mean, you don't think Jared Goff had a defensive coach than an offensive coach? Kind of a difference. The only advantage Russell Wilson has over Aaron Rogers, Russell Wilson's number two wide receiver, Tyler Lockett, is better than Aaron Rogers. number two wide receiver. Most valuable is the ability, this is what LeBron just did, to take a lot of disparate parts or average parts and elevate all of them. Aaron Rogers is number two in the voting,

like Burger King is number two to McDonald's, but it's not close. Okay, it's not close. Aaron Rogers could not take this offensive line and this defense and be 5 and 0. Aaron's in a easier division with a better defense, an offensive coach, the best offensive line in the league, a better number one receiver, and a better number one running back. It ain't close. Seattle's 5 and 0. Worst defense in league history so far. And they haven't even faced, you know, they haven't even faced some of the more dynamic offenses they'll face.

All right. Jerry Jones, owner of the Cowboys this morning on Dallas Radio and the big questions now, what are you going to do with? DAC, how are you going to pay DAC? Is DAC the future of the NFL in Dallas? Jerry Jones, ever the businessman, doesn't generally like to talk publicly about money. Totally get it. If I own a team, that's how I would act, said this about DAC. We've got to be reminded that to have a team really manage anything you want to put on a piece of paper, relatively speaking. He's to evaluate what he can do to help us win championships. We've got to make it work.

So what am I saying? I'm saying exactly the same thing that I said the last time we asked about this before the season started. It's a part of the game is the business and the contract part. What's interesting about Dallas to me is the DAC injury is going to allow potentially Dallas to have excuses. Well, I mean, we lost our quarterback. We're six and ten. We're seven and nine. But let me offer this.

Dallas is rebuilding. They just don't know it. You watch the Giants and Dallas this weekend. We know the Giants are rebuilding. It looked like the same team. One had a really good defense. One had a really good offense. One had a bad offense.

One had a bad defense. I mean, hear me out here. Offensive line now is bad. Defensive line is old and not very good. Secondary, outside of Trayvon Diggs, not very talented. Linebackers, expensive, overrated, banged up. Outside of the wide receiving corps, which is, substantial and the running backs. I like Pollard and Zeke. Outside of that, what do you mean

rebuilding? Because most of us know Detroit is rebuilding. The Giants are rebuilding. Washington is rebuilding. I'm not denying that. But there's also these teams, and we also know Green Bay isn't rebuilding, and Baltimore's not rebuilding, and Kansas City's not rebuilding. We know that. But then there's these teams in the middle that are, and you're like, they just don't want to talk about it. Dallas is rebuilding. What does rebuilding mean? If you, go into a draft, the next draft, and you've got half or more of your units need somebody, a playmaker, because you're not making enough plays, offense, or defense, you are rebuilding. And again, there's seven, eight teams not rebuilding.

Dallas needs two offensive linemen. Minimum one, maybe two defensive linemen. Another linebacker, a safety, one to two more corners that could really use an elite tied end. Again, they don't need a running back. Tony Pollard, nice dimensions there. Like them both, actually. I think Pollard's a little underrated. Zeke right now is still really good.

Wide receivers, they're loaded. They don't need to draft a wide receiver for two years. They are all good at wide receiver. But that is why the CD Lamb draft pick to me was so weird. Like you just paid Amari Cooper a ton of money. You want to get him touches. Michael Gallup's becoming a star. And you had Cedric Wilson in practice.

And all I know is when I watch Cedric Wilson, and I'm like, that's one of the better third receivers potentially in the league. So I think the DAC injury gives Dallas opportunities and say, you know, we're going to be blank. I think Dallas is rebuilding. I think they're a rebuilding team. You go into a draft, six units need a playmaker. You are rebuilding.

And I feel Dallas is. All right, the herd hierarchy, hour two. Live in LA next, the herd. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, Not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform?

We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not. not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential.

Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the Look Back at a podcast. That was a big moment for me.

84 was big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild year. I mean, it was a wild year.

I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show.

This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford, and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. This is an IHeart podcast, guaranteed human.