The Herd with Colin Cowherd - The Herd - Hour 1 - The future of Lamar Jackson

Episode Date: February 21, 2023

Nick wright in for Colin Cowherd   What will Lamar Jackson's future be as the franchise tag window opens? Nick pleads with us to treat New York Giants quarterback Daniel Jones as a legitimate quarterback that deserves a big contract The NBA top players list left off one huge in its Top 10See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening to The Heard podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1. Find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the IHeartRadio app by searching Heard. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. It is the herd. Nick Wright, one. Once again in for Colin Cowherd, the wonderful and talented Alex Curry in for Jason McIntyre. Today is my last day doing the Hurd, Alex. You will continue doing it with the Great Joy Taylor tomorrow.

I thought you were excellent yesterday. It's always fun working with you. How are you doing this morning out in Los Angeles? Oh, thank you, Nick. Fabulous. Life is good. I have like a happy, it's my vibe kind of outlook on life. So every day is a good day, especially when you're feeling good and you're working.

Well, you know, it's very, what Alex Curry just said, I don't know if any of you, I'm sure many of you do follow her on social media. Happy disposition is the exact way I would describe Alex Curry. And if you're having like a bad day, just find Alex's Instagram and she will make you smile. We have a ton to do today. There's a lot to get into as the NFL franchise tag window opens today. So we'll get to the hoops later in the show. but right now I do want to talk some NFL as there is an obvious

franchise tag decision around where I live and there is a much more complicated franchise tag decision about 90 minutes south of where I live over here on the east coast of New York City down in Baltimore and let's start there

with the Baltimore Ravens and Lamar Jackson. I want to very, very quickly explain to you that what the Ravens options are. They can trade Lamar. They can re-sign Lamar. That is proven difficult. Or they can franchise tag

Lamar. There are two different types of franchise tags, and this is the nerdy part, but it's also the important part. I'll do it very quickly. There's the regular franchise tag. They would pay him $32 million for next year. However, if any other team wants him, they could then

openly negotiate with Lamar, sign him to a deal, and if the Ravens did not match, that deal, that team would be able to take Lamar for two first round picks. Whether those are good or bad first round picks, it does not matter. The Ravens obviously cannot risk that. So they will sign him if they sign him to a franchise tag to the exclusive tag. And this is where it gets messy for Baltimore.

And this is where I believe this is why Lamar Jackson has played his last snap as a Raven already. And even if right now that is shocking to you here in the last. the next few minutes, I think you might come to agree with me. Assuming the Ravens are going to offer him the non or the exclusive franchise tag, that is $45 million guaranteed. So that would be, we have the franchise tag you. We can't come to a long-term deal. We don't want to risk losing you for just two first-round picks because they could be bad

first-round picks, a team that made the playoffs, like the Giants or the Patriots who almost made the playoffs. mediocre first-round picks could say we'll sign Lamar Jackson, we'll give up that. So it would be the $45 million exclusive franchise tag. So let's play that forward. Lamar, let's just assume he would play this year under the tag, which I am not certainly would. Assume he would, though, $45 million this year. Then next year, you're in the exact same situation.

He wants a fully guaranteed deal. You don't want to give him a fully guaranteed deal. The next year, it's $55 million, and that is where you are negotiating from. Right now, the Ravens are already in a bad spot because the negotiations have to start at $45 million a year, because that's what the tag is. A year from now, the negotiations would start at $55 million a year. And if you tag him twice, you then lose him for nothing. You get nothing back for Lamar Jackson. Well, Nick, you can tag him a third time.

A third franchise tag for Lamar would be $79 million for one season. It's not happening. So the reason I lay all of that out is this. The Ravens, in my estimation, have two options. None of them are great options, but it is where they find themselves. Either give Lamar the deal that he is demanding or trade him right now. Because you kick this can down the road for a year. and his trade market and trade value drops precipitously,

not because he necessarily plays poorly or because he plays great. It drops because the entire league will know you will be one year away from losing him for nothing. So they are not going to give up the same type of compensation they would give up right now. So why can't this deal get done? and this is where, and I know this is not the hottest of takes, but it is the most honest and fairest of takes, this is where you totally understand where both sides are coming from. For Lamar, he looks around and says,

what are the most recent deals signed for, take Russell Wilson out of it, non-super Bowl winning quarterbacks? Well, Deshawn Watson, Got about 50 million per fully guaranteed. I have accomplished by any measure more than Deshawn Watson in this league. Our playoff resumes are identical. My regular season resume is far better.

And obviously, my off-field baggage does not exist compared to Deshawn. What about Kyler? Kyler did not get a fully guaranteed deal, but he got well over $100 million guaranteed. And Lamar is rightfully thinking, don't compare me to Kyle. Tyler Murray. I've won an MVP in this league. Don't say that you're worried about me in the playoffs. You gave him that deal when he had played one career

playoff game and it was one of the worst performances of any quarterback in a playoff game in the last decade. So you're damn straight I want. If not fully guaranteed, double his guarantees. 200 million in guarantees. That's Lamar's stance. He's not moving. Here's the Ravens stance.

And this is where I think a lot of the media actually agrees with the Ravens but in some regard, but is afraid to say it because so much of the initial Lamar Jackson criticism was so obviously

racially coded and has been so clearly proven incorrect. Nobody wants to be lumped in with those people. However, if you're the Ravens, are you fully confident in Lamar's development as a passer? No. Are you fully confident

in Lamar's ability to stay healthy? No. So are you fully confident that $200 million guaranteed is a good idea? Probably not. So rip the Band-Aid off because there are teams out there that will absolutely give him the contract he wants

and right now this moment give you massive draft compensation. And I'll go through those teams in just a second. But before I do that, one other note on Lamar and the franchise tag. Because I think some people are like, well, just offer the franchise tag. And what's he going to do?

Sit out the year? Maybe. I think it's on the board. I think it is fair to say that Lamar did not finish out this season because he was dealing with an injury and because he had no long-term security, he was not going to put himself at risk. So could he potentially refuse to sign it?

Absolutely. Even if he were to sign it, though, if you're Baltimore, are you fully confident that this player with this style of play, if he gets dinged again near the end of a season for what would be the third straight season, when once again he would have zero guaranteed dollars remaining coming to him after this year, that you're not going to be in the exact same spot you were in the last two seasons. We're a really good team. We could be the top overall seed.

We could go to the Super Bowl. Lamar gets hurt and we're sunk. I don't know how you could be confident in that if you're Baltimore. So if you're not going to swallow hard and give him $200 million guaranteed, which is reportedly where his starting point is, Then I've got some trades for you. And I think these are trades that I don't know if you could make, you obviously can only make one of them. I don't know if every, all of these teams would do these trades, but I'm sure at least one of them would.

Call up the Colts. You've been on a quarterback carousel for the last, you know, since luck retired. The number four pick might be no man's land. You might end up trading this exact package just to move up to number one to take five foot 10 inch price young. what about the number four, the number 35, and a future, and next year's first for Lamar? And if the cult say no, call up the Raiders and say, okay, what about this? The number seven, your second rounder number 38, and your first and your second next year for Lamar Jackson. Go down the board.

Call up Atlanta, I think, would be Lamar and Kyle Pitts on turf in that city. the number 8 pick, the number 45 pick, and a first rounder for Lamar Jackson. Or call up and you might have thrown a second rounder there as well. And I don't know if we have the Jets graphic ready or not, but it's a similar idea. And the Atlanta should have had a second rounder on there. That's my mistake. These are all very similar trades. Two ones and two-twos for Lamar.

And for all of these teams, the other part of it is, obviously, you are having to sign Lamar to a deal. if you're Baltimore for any of these trades except for the Jets one, you might be able to draft your quarterback with the pick you've acquired. But then there is this pushback, and I got one more trade to show you, but don't put it up yet. Well, the Ravens have built an offense specifically around this style of quarterback. Okay, fair. So if you're Baltimore, do you quietly call the team with the most capped space in the entire NFL, a team that hasn't had a franchise quarterback in 70 years,

a team that is going to be looking to spend money, probably more money, they probably have more money than they can spend, and say, you want to do a very simple trade, your mobile quarterback on a rookie deal for our established quarterback, call up the Bears and just see Lamar for Justin Fields. And then the Bears can do whatever they want with the number one pick, trade that down and get more.

more assets and the Ravens can start this thing over without not start over the clock on the paying the quarterback maybe with the guy that they're more comfortable with. Because if you're not comfortable in paying Lamar Jackson right now, you're not going to be comfortable paying him a year from now. And what you are able to get back for him just gets worse and worse and worse as time goes on. All right. So the Ravens quarterback franchise tag decision is complicated. The Giants one is not at all.

So reportedly, allegedly, Daniel Jones wants $45 million a year. Spoiler alert, that's not happening. So the Giants, to me, have the easiest decision any teams ever had when it comes to this. They are franchise tagging Daniel Jones. And not the $45 million exclusive one, the $32 million. Yeah, if someone wants to come in and give up two first round picks for Daniel Jones, go right ahead. But that's the easy part. Here is the harder part for the Giants and what they want to do,

what they should do with Daniel Jones. Franchise tagging him is simple and obvious. This next part is going to take some real fortitude by Brian Dable. You need to treat him next year like he's an actual NFL quarterback. not this running back quarterback powerback hybrid that we're just happy he stopped turning the ball over. Daniel Jones this year threw the ball for more than 230 yards three times all season. Once against the Lions, terrible past defense, and twice against the Vikings, one of the worst past defenses in the league this year. Three games all year, not more than 300 passing yards.

not more than 250 passing yards, three times all year more than 230 passing yards. Daniel Jones all season had 15 passing touchdowns. If you are going to franchise tag him and use this year to determine whether or not he can be your long-term answer at the quarterback position, then it is incumbent upon you even if it doesn't give you the best chance to win week to week, to ask him to play quarterback like an actual NFL quarterback. Multi-level reads, drop back passing, read the defense, layered throws. And if he can't, then you have your answer. If he can, then you give him the long-term deal.

But if they franchise tag him and run the same paint-by-numbers, quarterback power-heavy offense, you are not going to have the answer to the only question that matters for you. Can this guy be your quarterback for the next five years? And so for Brian Daibol, a guy many people thought was coach of the year

this year. I don't know, did he win it or Sierra Anna went it? I don't even remember. But I thought Daibald did a hell of a job. You've got to be willing to, I think you want it, you've got to be willing to potentially take a small step back in service of the greater good, which

is answering the only question you need, Dan. answer. Can this guy be our long-term quarterback? And then lastly, sticking with the NFL for one more story, speaking of potentially taking a step back, Matt Bowen, who's I think a former scout and also coaches now, but also writes for ESPN, wrote an article of the 50 best free agents for this season, this upcoming off season. And something stuck out to me when I was reading it. Holy moly, there's a lot of Eagles on that list. So it's 50 guys.

So each team should have one or two if you're just doing the average. The Eagles have seven. And these are, you count them off. That is five defensive starters. One of their, you know, not one of their two best, but probably the third best offensive linemen. And then a running back that they're fine moving off of because they have gained well. Boston Scott, by the way, also a free agent.

and it just is a reminder of how fleeting these moments can be. Now, don't get me wrong. Jalen Hertz, I'm a believer in him after the Super Bowl. They have an extra pick thanks to Howie Roseman doing the smartest thing you can do in the NFL, which is due business with the Saints, very sharp by him to have their first round pick. I am not acting as if the Eagles are in the position the Bucks or the Rams were in after their Super Bowl appearances where now they're screwed. but you take the fact that seven of their 22 starters are pending free agents.

They're going to have to pay their quarterback, and unlike this past year, here's what next year's schedule looks like. You're not going to play 16 of your 20 games against bad to mediocre quarterbacks. All of a sudden next year, you have theoretically DAC twice. you have Josh Allen you have Tua who's not great but he's not a bad quarterback obviously you deal with

we'll see who the Jets have at quarterback Gino had a hell of a year Stafford obviously and then Patrick Mahomes if you just go home games and away games you're in a spot now in Philadelphia

where I do wonder if they are going to look back on 10 point lead at halftime in the Super Bowl when we had a fully loaded team, the best two through 53 man roster in the league. And I didn't even mention Jason Kelsey could be retiring. You lost both coordinators. Our path to the Super Bowl was Daniel Jones and then a team whose quarterback,

they were on their third string quarterback, and we knocked him out of the game, and then they were on their fourth string quarterback, and we knocked him out of the game. I wonder if Philadelphia, while I think they are well positioned, are they quite as well positioned for a long-term run as many people thought? I saw one of my pals on a different sports network say before the game that if the Eagles don't turn into a dynasty, it will be a massive disappointment. I wonder if what's more likely than them turning into a dynasty is they look at this and say, God, dog it.

We made it to the Super Bowl and Jail and Swarrow it. first full year as an awesome player, and now it's been his sixth years our starter, and we haven't been back. Very, very hard to replenish all of that talent, and they are not going to have the cap space to bring everybody back. Some very interesting to look at as far as which teams are potentially losing major contributors and which teams have the money to add to major contributors as we turn the page going into next season.

They're also, speaking of next season, there is a wild story involving the Dallas Cowboys in this year's draft. We'll discuss that. Plus, Alex with the news. Next, Nick right in for Colin on The Hurt. Be sure to catch live editions of the HARD weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential.

Either way, the podcast, Superhuman, documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skit. the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes,

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or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars,

fan so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun thought-provoking Star Wars related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of taun tons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. That's a great take by Colin Coward. Nick right in for Colin on the herd. If you didn't see it, he just did a rant about 15 of 16 years. The AFC quarterback was Brady Manning or Rogers.

I think Flacco would be the one guy mixed in there, doing it off top of my head. I think that would be the year. And discussing how the AFC now with Mahomes, Burrough, Trevor, and Josh Allen could be set up something similarly. Yeah, I don't necessarily disagree. Three of the last four years, Mahomes has been there. borough the one other, so you spin it forward another decade. You figure Mahomes in the next decade conservatively. What is?

It goes to seven more Super Bowls and then one apiece for the other guys? Sounds about right. Maybe Justin Herbert squeezes one in there so Josh Allen doesn't get there. Who knows? Okay. Speaking of quarterbacks, where we get to Alex with the news? Very interesting article by Mike Fisher. So Mike Fisher lives down in Dallas, covers the Cowboys for SI, And I think he has his own website and does a really, really good job covering the Cowboys.

This is not someone whose Cowboys stuff should be ignored or disregarded. Mike Fisher reports that Cowboys are intrigued by Ohio State quarterback CJ Strout. So I obviously have no unique reporting on this. And I have learned my lesson on trying to tell you which college quarterback's particularly which Ohio State quarterbacks are going to be great. I called my shot on Trevor Lawrence. I'm calling my shout on Caleb Williams. And, you know, Bryce Young feels a little tiny for me.

But I am not the greatest at the college to pro quarterback evaluation. I mentioned the calling my shot on Trevor Lawrence. I also called my shot on a few guys who, well, Josh Rosen. Oh, Josh Rosen be awesome. I didn't turn out right. But here's what I'll say. The Cowboys being intrigued by C.J. Stroud should not be disregarded, but we also should be very specific about the only way they could acquire him.

They would have to trade Dak Prescott for the pick. If the Cowboys really want C.J. Stroud, they would have to call up Houston and say, hey, D'Amico, you guys got cap space, you got good draft picks, you want to just have a 12. 29-year-old, soon-to-be-30-year-old franchise quarterback, he lives in Texas already. We'll trade you him for the number two pick. And if you're sitting here saying, for the Cowboys' perspective, that would be crazy. If you really like C.J. Stroud, no, it's not. Because the Cowboys are in a position where, reportedly, they are about to re-up Dak, Prescott,

two years left on his deal. That's probably when you would do it. They would re-up him this off-season because Dax had. a weird spot because he's already been franchise tagged once, so one year left on his deal is kind of his free agent year, like you've got to make a decision by then, so they want to do it early.

And if you're Dallas, considering whether or not you would like to go from a $50 million a year quarterback thereabouts to a $8 million a year quarterback, it's not a terrible idea.

And if you are the cowboys and you feel like DAC is good, but not good enough, or good but not great. I don't hate the idea of if you fall in love with one of these quarterbacks sniffing around to find out if you could. Now, I don't know that Houston would do it, but could you get the number two pick of the draft for DAC? If you could, what it does for you cap-wise and what it does for you as far as opening

up other options and other avenues is intriguing. So this should not be flatly dismissed as nonsense. Obviously. Now, the idea of drafting them getting C.J. Stroud and somehow having him learn from Dack Prescott, that is nonsense. That's an impossibility. They have no way to move up high enough in the draft other than trading away the entirety of their future drafts to do it. And that wouldn't make sense. But if you're like, you know what, we do want to keep to. Polly Pollard. We do want to make sure we have money for Micah and for Diggs and to keep the defense together. And it's very, very difficult. And C.D. I know that CD they're not worried about losing. But to keep everyone together, I understand the idea that there's one way to find

an extra $40 million a year for the next five years. And that is instead of having an expensive veteran quarterback, have a quarterback on a rookie wage scale. And it's become cliche at this point, but that is the cheat code. We saw the Seahawks go to two Super Bowls with that. We saw the Rams go to a Super Bowl with that. We saw the Eagles twice go to Super Bowls where their starting quarterbacks on a rookie wage scale. Now, one of the times he didn't even actually play. The Chiefs have been to three Super Bowls like that.

The Bengals went to a Super Bowl like that. Or the Chiefs have been to two Super Bowls like that. Pardon me. This year, Mahomes had already been paid. and I'm probably leaving one or two out. That is the workaround. So I don't think this is going to happen. I don't anticipate Dallas is going to try to trade DAC,

and I don't think that Houston would want DAC rather than the second best quarterback in this year's draft. But it's not an insane idea for the Cowboys to try to squeeze an extra $40 million of other player value out of moving on from their quarterback to draft one. Here's Alex with the news. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news.

All right, next, let's start with some NFL free agency because Derek Carr is starting to look at his options in free agency. He already made a pair of visits, one to the Saints before the Raiders released him, and another to the Jets this past weekend. But don't expect the decision to come anytime soon as brother David Carr said Derek's free agency is going to be a long process

and that he wants to do his due diligence. As he should, it was a dumpster fire for Derek Carr the last couple seasons in Vegas. He had six different head coaches in his nine seasons there. He gave that team everything he had, and then at the end,

he didn't get a proper goodbye. It didn't end well. He didn't get to finish the season with the team. Now, he didn't have his greatest season, this past season, but I do believe he is still a solid quarterback who just hasn't had that proper all-around support on the field,

on the coaching staff. So the question is, where do you think Derek Carr is going to end up? Well, before I answer that, I just want to echo the point you're making. Eric Mangini on our show yesterday showed the graphic. In Carr's career with the Raiders, they were bottom

four defensively in points, yards, passing yards. They At no point did he have a top 20, much less a top 10 defense. So I don't think Carr's a perfect player by any stretch. I don't think he's top 10 quarterback. But I do think he's right there in the middle. He's right there from at best 12th, at worst, 18th, right in that middle, you know, the highest part of the bell curve, if you will.

I think the Jets make a ton of sense. I think the Jets are so starved for adequacy at the quarterback position. I think Carr right now is you could make an argument that for next season, Carr might actually be a better player than Aaron Rogers, but more importantly, you don't have to give him a draft pick to get him. He's not nearly as much of a headache, and he's not nearly as expensive, and the Jets just want stability there. I think going to the Saints would be insane.

I think that team is $60 million over the cap already. I think they missed their window and they don't want to acknowledge it. Some people argue, oh, go to the NFC, it's easier to win. I get that, but things do change. Mahomes isn't going anywhere, but things can change. But if the Jets had just league average quarterbacking this year, they would have been a playoff team. They would have been an 11-win team.

They had the offensive rookie year, the defensive rookie the year, the other guy who could have won offensive rookie year, the running back haul got hurt. So I love the Jets for Derek Carr. That would be my number one choice if I were him with a bull. it. I think another important thing to note is the stability and the leadership that he brings. Because you just hear from guys that he plays with in the locker room, they want to listen to him. They want to follow him. And you're going to get a veteran guy. People like him. Yes. People like him. He commands the locker room, which is a huge task. So I agree. I think he's a

great pick to go after this offseason. All right, well, let's move on to the NBA because Yonnas suffered a wrist injury in the buck's final game before the all-star break. He traveled to new york on Monday to undergo further testing, which reportedly revealed a ligament sprain in his right wrist. Now he will miss some time while getting treatment, but he is expected to return when the pain subsides. Now, there's two parts to this. I think the bucks are very lucky that it was not a worse injury and didn't end his season, but they also have a little cushion to give him some time. And I think you give him as much time as he needs. You have 20, four games left. So make sure he's coming back 100% so he can give you what you need down the

stretch. Yeah, listen, I think Janus has a really good case as a top three MVP candidate. That could cost him that this year. But it looks like the voters are going to give that to Yokic, no matter what. And Yonis already has a couple of them. Now, I will say you do because of Middleton's injuries over the last nine months. You would like to see the Bucks have a few weeks before the end of the year with everyone together to try to get rolling. But I am super one of the, I am super fascinated by the top of the east. Because now that Brooklyn has imploded officially,

we're in a spot where Milwaukee won the conference last year, two years ago, Boston last year, Philly is lurking as a should we be included amongst those teams or is it just Boston, Milwaukee? And obviously Milwaukee's only path is a fully healthy, Yannis. He's clearly the best player in the league. Yeah. And as long as they should be the favorites in any series in the,

maybe any series they play, but certainly any series in the East if they're fully healthy. But I agree with you. And the All-Star game was weird. It's like, wait, Janice is going to play with this injury? Did the opening tip play 20 seconds? Yeah, and that was that. All right, go ahead.

Yeah. And just to note, I mean, they're neck and neck. They're half a game behind the Celtics. But remember, they are 35 and 12 with Janus this season. and six and five without them. So obviously, you want Janus there, but they can get the job done. Right, but you can tread water. Yeah, they can get the job done and they can maintain kind of that one, two top spot without them.

Sure. So just get them healthy. Get him healthy for the end of the season and the postseason. All right, moving on to Luca and Kyrie, who have only played two games together and lost both, but they are quickly building their chemistry. They were both starters on Team LeBron for the All Star game and mentioned how they were able to bond during the weekend. Now, Kyrie said they had an incredible

dialogue as teammates so far and Luca added that there were lots of laughs and that Kyrie is a great guy. Now for them and the league, I really hope that this works out and it lasts, but they are very much still in the honeymoon phase right now. And I don't know if you saw the videos of when they were at the All Star game. They were kind of joking around like Luca tapped him on his shoulder, did that like little joke where he turned and he laughed and whatnot. Now even though they've lost both the games that they've played together. Oh, here it is right here. It's cute, you know?

We've got a good laugh out of it. And Luca finds that so funny. He's a little kid. I don't know why, but Luca finds that so funny. It's a little kid joke there. Here's what I'll say, Alex. Players love Kyrie. Yeah.

As polarizing as he is to fans and the media, players love him. Now, I think at times, you ask James Hardin, guys can get sick of him. him, but like you said, it's the honeymoon phase. Oh, yeah. This is an all-time big risk. The Mavericks are taking.

The Mavericks were my pick to win the title before the year. And they obviously added a lot of talent in adding Kyrie, but they gave up some defense and they gave up some stability and they gave up some future flexibility. And then you have LeBron looming with his constant flirtations with Kyrie about this offseason. So the whole thing is there is no team. team, well, we can talk about this more later. The Mavs have as much to gain and as much to lose as any team over the stretch run of the season.

Because if it goes poorly, Kyrie will bounce and they will have lost. They will have traded away Dorian Finney Smith and a first round pick for essentially nothing. And so they have a ton on the line here. There's Alex with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lie News. My apologies, if I cut you off there, Alex, I didn't mean to, but I know I'm running way late.

My bad, I talk too long. But take a very quick break. Come back. There is a new NBA list, and I feel like I'm living in a simulation. We'll discuss that next. Nick Ryan for Collin on the Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. This is Steve Kavino.

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Just search Covino and Rich wherever you get your podcast and subscribe. I'm such a rocking dude. The show features our unique take on sports, injected with some fun, humor, and relatability. Listen to Covino and Rich five days a week on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Covino and Rich, give me your hell, yeah. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

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And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away,

such as the biology of ton-tons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to bowl your mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Sunday, the NASCAR Cup series roars into Fontana for the final race on the two-mile oval. Will Kyle Larson repeat or will a new West Coast King be crowned? The engines fire at 3.30 Eastern on Fox. Nick right in for Colin on the herd.

So CBS Sports, good folks over there, updated their preseason top 50 NBA players. And I think they actually, in the preseason, did a top 100. But they've now done a top 50, an updated version of it. And here's the top 12 looks. And there's two things here that I want to talk about. First, let me talk about LeBron at 11. Because yesterday, my dear friend and colleague, Rick Buecker,

alleged that I've been on television, despite the Lakers record, arguing that LeBron is still one of two or three best players in the league. Simply not true. In fact, going into the season, I think on my NBA player pyramid, I had LeBron on the 7th through 10 row. And right now, to me, there is no question that Janice, Luca, KD, Steph, Yokic, Embed, and Tatum are the seven best players in the league. So in that regard, the CBS list got it.

Now, the order I would disagree with, but those seven guys have to be your top seven. Now, would I have LeBron inside the top 10? Do I think that LeBron is better than SGA? I do. Do I think even when you incorporate the mistime and the defensive lapses, do I still think right now this moment

LeBron's better than Shea? I do think he is. So if I were to put this, so I guess my one tweak would be I'd drop Shea down just a bit. LeBron versus Dame. It's a tough one. You can't really nick LeBron for defense if we're comparing him to Dame. But LeBron's got to be somewhere 8, 9, 10. I probably would have Jha 8, LeBron, 9, Dame 10.

And then there's another bucket after that where you have SGA, where you have Donovan, where you have Devin Booker, Anthony Davis, Jimmy Butler, and then another bucket after that where you have guys like Jalen Brown, Anthony Edwards. I won't leave anybody out. But so not a huge, I think for the most part, I actually agree with this, the who is on the top 12. If you want to say that Devin Booker is getting, you know, Devin Booker versus Donovan Mitchell, I think Donovan's been better this year.

I think they did a good job with the top 12. and I would tweak a bit, you know, I would probably flip-flop LeBron and Shea and then move jaw up a bit. But that's about right. And I hate to do this in consecutive shows now. But number one on this list makes me feel like I'm living in a simulation. Does anybody outside of, certain analytically inclined members of the NBA media and Denver Nuggets fans,

does anyone actually believe Nikola Yokic is better than Janus? Forget the other guys. Forget Luca when I would argue, I think Luca's better. Forget Durant when I would argue I think Durant's better. Now, this is not an MVP discussion because Durant's obviously missed a ton of time so he can't be in the MVP discussion. I have the same with Steph. But this is the best players.

This was not an MVP ranking. This is the best players in the league. Are there actually people out there that think Yokic is better than Janus other than the people who evidently are voting on these awards and writing these articles? In what universe? How can anyone make an argument that Janus is not a unanimous, clear-cut, undeniable, best player in the sport?

He gives you, let's call it, 90% of what Yokic and Luca give you offensively, and quintuple what they give you defensively. I would say this is without precedent but I thought about it a lot and there actually was a time when something similar to this happened but the context for it would be as if

in the late 90s we just started giving Carl Malone all the MVP awards and people argued no he's the best player in the league yeah forget Akeem, forget Jordan it's Malone look at his efficiency

look at his regular season numbers. Now, Caram Malone did win a MVP during Jordan's three-peat, won. And then he won a second MVP in the 50-game season when Jordan had retired. But he was not winning back-to-back, much less three in a row, and then being called the best player in the league. So I was thinking about, has this ever happened before? And then I was like, oh, of course it has. And it's a very similar situation, actually.

a guy in this league who had these semi, not even unprecedented numbers, but almost an unprecedented style of play who nobody at their core actually thought was the best

player in the league, was as great as he was, clearly had some postseason limitations that could be exploited, and was a liability on the defense event. Anyone back-to-back MVP's during the primes of

Kobe Bryant and LeBron James and that's of course Steve Nash and you can say I was at LeBron's prime one of those years LeBron finished second an MVP voting. So we did this 15 years ago and amazingly we didn't learn our lesson

where it was like no, look at the efficiency of the Sun's offense and look at we know that Nash doesn't score like the rest of the stars of the league but look at what he creates offensively, and they're playing such a beautiful style, and just close your eyes and pretend the defensive end doesn't actually matter.

And he won an MVP over LeBron, an MVP over Kobe, MVP over Duncan and Dirk, and Garnett probably was not quite an MVP caliber guy either of those years. And we just, we were so fascinated by the uniqueness. of his game and by how aesthetically pleasing the Sun's style of basketball was that we temporarily befouled

our MVP archives. And now it's because prior to Nash winning back to back, the back-to-back MVP's had been Wilt, Russell, Kareem, Moses.

Moses is the best player on the best team ever, the 83-6ers. Bird, Magic, Michael, Duncan. That was the entirety in NBA history

of guys who had won back-to-back MVP's. Then Nash did it, and then we got back on the right track. Then it was LeBron, and then Janus. It's like, oh, okay.

So you take out Steve Nash, and every single person that's done it is one of the, at that point in time, 12 greatest players ever. The worst one was Moses, a three-time MVP, and as I mentioned, the best player on the best team of all time.

You want to argue that the 17 warriors supplanted them fine, but it was the best team of all time for quite some time. And now we're rinse repeating, not just with the MVP awards, but with people arguing, listen, I call Luca Donchie to my large adult Slovenian son. I think he is going to be a top 10 all-time player. I really believe that. I don't argue he's better than Janus.

How can anyone argue anyone's better than Janus? Makes no sense to me. I don't know. All I do is watch the games. Nick right in for Colin on the Hurt. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey. Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman

documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far far away, such as the biology of taun tons and wampas on the ice planet hot,

or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to Stuff to Boar Your Mind on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.