The Herd with Colin Cowherd - THE HERD - Hour 2 - Biggest challenge for Caleb Williams, Shedeur Sanders is the 3rd string QB, Greg Cosell

Episode Date: August 21, 2025

Colin talks to Greg Cosell from NFL Films joins the show to breakdown the biggest hurdle Caleb Williams is facing under new head coach Ben Johnson He reacts to breaking news out of Cleveland that has Shedeur Sanders as the 3rd string quarterback with the Browns despite Dillon Gabriel turning the ball over twice last weekSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Find your local station for the herd at Fox SportsRadio.com or stream us live every day on the IHeart Radio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. We're listening to Fox Sports Radio. here we go it's a thursday we're in chicago it is our number two by the way last night i don't john i went to a restaurant john you and i went to in chicago i am here to tell you if a restaurant has a pork chop on the menu order it because nobody puts it on there unless they're good at it everybody has to put like you know you go to an italian restaurant you got to put lasagna on the

the menu. Whether you're good at it or not, you go to a steak house, you got a lot of steak, salmon. The restaurant puts a pork chop and it's not like a steakhouse. You need to order that puppy because I did last night. And I walked home and no man in America was happier than me last night, John, not even you. You know, I spoke to my wife and she ordered some obscure item on DoorDash and hated it. I said, Maria, we can't keep ordering these crazy items. Just the pork chop, the steak, the chicken. Let's not outthink the room. It's not out think the room. Well, that's Greg Kosell. He doesn't outthink the film.

46 years at NFL films. Thursdays during the football season. We love him. So, all right, so I let's, this is where I lean on you. So I think Shadoor's bigger. I think he, I think he's really accurate, but he's a different quarterback than Dylan Gabriel. They are different quarterbacks.

You've watched all, you know, you watch Dylan, you've watched Should Doer. What is the film say? What do you see? Who does Stafansky trust? Who do you face in pressure? What is the film say on the Brown's young quarterbacks? So I think we're trying to figure out who's going to be quarterback number three on the Browns.

Right, right. Well, you know, Dylan Gabriel is a player that Stafansky really liked because the way it works in the league, Colin, and you know this, is offensive coaches. they think about how does a player work within my scheme. And what Gabriel is, is he's essentially stylistically similar to a two at Tegoviloa, in that he hits his back foot and the ball comes out. He's a rhythm player, he's a timing player. That's his game. He's a shorter quarterback, so he needs to play that way.

And he did that effectively for two years in college, one at Oklahoma, one at Oregon. Sanders is a little different player. He's not quite as rhythmic. And he has a tendency, and this showed up on tape, by the way, even though the good outweighed the bad when he played two weeks ago, he tends to drift a little in the pocket. He tends to retreat in the pocket. Now, he can throw the ball well, but there are some things he would have to clean up clearly. And, you know, he came from a program at Colorado where there were a ton of tunnel screens, a ton of easy throws. He would need to learn how to better navigate the pocket, although he showed. some signs of that. But again, I think we're talking about, you know, how many quarterbacks are the Browns going to keep? No team keeps four quarterbacks. So it's going to be interesting

going down the stretch here. And then Sanders got hurt and missed some time in practice, and that's not going to help him. I mean, what you're saying basically, and we've seen this from offensive coaches before, run my play. Sean Payton loves Bow Nicks, but he really likes him because he runs his play effectively. And what you're saying is Dylan Gabriel, like Atua, runs the play they call should do or sometimes ad-libs out of it. Is that what you're saying? It's not that he ad-libs out of it. He's not as efficient in that style of just hitting his back foot and getting the ball out. You know, that's the way Dylan Gabriel has always had to play because of his size. But that's the way coaches think. And I'm not sure a lot of people

think that way and understand that. As coaches, the term that's used a lot in the NFL is scheme adaptability, Colin. Coaches think on both sides of the ball in terms of how does a guy fit into my scheme. Can he run my scheme? You know, you know this. Coaches work 16 hours a day and they're putting in their scheme, their game plan. It starts with OTAs. They want all this executed.

And when it's not executed, then it becomes a problem. Yeah. So Brock Purdy, when the roster was younger, healthier, less brittle, was a really, really good quarterback. Last year, roster gets beat up. He's one in six against playoff teams. Now, right now in camp, their wide receiving corps is in complete shambles, and they open up against a pretty lively athletic Seattle defense up in the northwest. That's a tough opener. So when you looked at film last year of Purdy, going one in six down the stretch against playoff teams. Was it that he couldn't make certain throws? Was it that the yards after catch were limited?

Like one and six from Purdy kind of jumps out at you when you look at his early success. Now, without Christian McCaffrey, it's a different offense. But what did the films say about Purdy last year when he had to start games with a patchwork group around him? Well, it's funny you mentioned Purdy, because last week I watched 250 dropbacks of Purdy over a two-day period. Purdy is a really good quarterback, Colin.

The thing with Purdy is he's not Josh Allen or Patrick Mahomes. He's not necessarily the kind of quarterback, even though he does have mobility, that's going to make those kinds of plays by himself, that we think of, you know, that our Mahomes make and Alan makes, a Lamar makes. He certainly doesn't navigate the pocket the way a Joe Burrow does. But in terms of being what we call a post-snap operator, in other words, when he takes the snap, he has such an intuitive feel for what he sees, and therefore he's a really, really good timing and anticipation thrower.

It's just innate to him. He sees it really quickly. So Purdy is a high-level post-snap operator. He's a really, really good player. You know, it gets to that old question of how many quarterbacks, Colin, and you can go back years and years are really great when their teams not very good. I mean, that's, you know, Purdy is a really good quarterback. He's just not a dynamic athlete who's necessarily going to make those kind of special plays

on his own. But as a pocket quarterback, he's pretty high level. Boy, too bad Jason McIntyre's not on the show today. He'd be doing back flips after that. Okay. Caleb Williams. I went through the schedule this week, and I said, said, listen, Chicago historically has struggled in division. They went one in five last year in

division. They don't have Detroit's roster. They may not have Green Bay's coach or quarterback, and Minnesota's roster is better front to back as well. So what have you seen with Caleb? I'll address it this way. What is Ben Johnson doing to Caleb? Where is he made strides improving Caleb from what the film said last year? Well, I think the number one thing, is not when he throws the ball. He's a great thrower of the football. That is evident. Everybody knows that, and he's obviously a great athlete who can make plays on the move. The main part for Caleb Williams and the key for Ben Johnson is everything from the huddle until the ball is snapped, because they call multiple plays in the huddle. There's a lot of shifts. There's a lot

of motions. You've got to be able to do that with the necessary speed and efficiency so you get to the line of scrimmage and there's time enough on the shot clock because you're going to have the shifts, you're going to have the motions. Now it's up to Caleb to decide if there's two plays called which one am I going to run. That part of quarterbacking is the bigger deal for Caleb Williams as he's learning the Ben Johnson offense because Ben Johnson will set you up beautifully with defined and clean reads and throws and Caleb Williams throws it as well as anybody. I mean, you can see that. Everybody knew that when he came out. That was never the issue. but it's really from the point of the huddle until the ball is snapped,

that's going to be the main part that he has to become efficient at. So so much of, there's such an advantage for a Jaden Daniels getting at Cliff Kingsbury, where Justin Fields has had a lot of defensive coaches. I do think Sean Payton, Bo Nex, I don't think Bo would have been that good had he had a defensive coach perhaps. I think just offensive coaches and quarterback. They rebuild old lines quicker. There's a sensibility about it.

Sure. So I look at Jackson Dart. Three years with Lane Kiffin is high-level coaching, and then he gets Brian Daible more than capable, won a playoff game with Daniel Jones. And my thing is, you can tell me that he's not quite ready, but three years a lane and a camp with Brian Daibble, when you look at the film of Jackson-Darton preseason,

do you see areas where, oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, he's not ready? or does he see the field? What does the film tell you? Well, they really did a good job in the preseason of allowing him to get comfortable, and that's what the preseason really is for. A lot of empty sets. Okay, he's very comfortable and empty sets.

It spreads the field. They got a lot of base defensive looks that were not difficult to read. They played a little bit up-tempo, which he certainly used to in Lane Kiffin. So they did a lot of things that help him really get comfortable. So when he's on the field, you know, he's not going through major progressions here. He's not doing that.

If he becomes the starter and we'll see how all this plays out, you know, who knows what's going on there. But I don't know how you feel. But there's a part of me that wouldn't be surprised if he's named the starter. But we'll see how that plays out. But they try to make it easy for him so that he can make confident throws, which he did. And he obviously has movement ability. So, well, you know, obviously when the regular season starts and teams game plan, things get different because you're going to see a lot of different things. But he certainly was efficient, just like Caleb Williams was super efficient against the bill's, you know, second and third team players.

But that's what you want. You want efficiency so the quarterback feels good. I said, I didn't think the Steelers was a great choice by Aaron Rogers, much like the Jets, defensive head coach, unpredictable offensive. line, inability in recent years to run the ball. And I said it's just this is an offensive line under Mike Tomlin that has had six years and not a lot to show for it. They have not run the ball consistently. They lose Nashi Harris, their left tackle. And I just thought San Francisco, Minnesota, I thought there were better spots for him. So if you go back to the Jets and Aaron last year in the film, it could look a little bit like the Steelers to me are a best. better run version of the Jets, right? Like a better front office, a better coach. Go back to the Jets

last year. Is Aaron way past his prime? Does he do anything that resembles the great Aaron? Yeah, he throws the ball super well. You know, I think when you sign Aaron Rogers, Owen, he's your quarterback, to me, the bigger issue is how you mesh would you want to do as an offensive coordinator and it's author smith with the fact that right one of rogers greatest strengths has always been his ability to control the game at the line of scrimmage and and be able to adjust and change plays so that i think for an offensive coordinator that's something that you really have to work on because you don't want to take that away from aran rogers because anybody who works with aran rogers will tell you he's among the smartest quarterbacks they've ever seen and he's so good at the

line of scrimmage in controlling the game. So to me, the larger question is, how do you mesh, how does author Smith mesh what he wants to do with his offense because he's got a clearly defined offensive approach with the fact that Aaron Rogers is so good at the line of scrimmage and likes to change things based on what he sees? Yeah. So an interesting storyline that has developed this, this offseason in training camp and in the preseason is Matthew Stafford's help. Yeah. So if you think about last year, the Rams were driving in the snow in Philadelphia after a Pooka Naku completion to beat the Philadelphia Eagles who tramps Kansas City in the Super Bowl. So my take is the defense, there's a lot of talent. I'm sure the film says that, especially

in the box, there's a lot of talent up front. But when I look at their offense and their point differential last year. Does the film tell you this is really, this is about McVeigh and Stafford's brilliance, not really the offensive roster composition? Because I said the other day, I said if Matt Stafford doesn't play, this is the only team in the league that could win the Super Bowl or finish 4 and 13, because I think even Kansas City with their roster and their overall talent and coaching could win seven, eight games of Mahalms got banged up. When you look at the Rams film. What is their offense? Is it is it basically the brilliance of two guys and kind of a limited offensive roster? To some extent, I mean they don't have a great offensive roster and certainly

the wide receiver position now is they don't have great players there. You know, Naku is really good, but he's a certain kind of player. And Stafford has just always been so good. And another guy that is really good at understanding what he's seeing, changing plays, calling audibles, still has a big time arm, can make any throw, an aggressive thrower, which you really need to be in the NFL. And McVeigh has always been so good in terms of formations, shifts, motions, getting guys open, making it tough for the defense. But yeah, you're right. Offensively, they do not have great players throughout that offense. And Stafford's injury, the back, particularly, you know, don't forget, he had back injuries when he was 25 and 26. This is not brand new.

And now he's, I think, 37. So, you know, I love watching Matthew Stafford play. He's always been one of my favorite guys to watch on film. But I'd be a little concerned about that back injury. You know, that's a tough deal as you get older. Okay. Finally, you know I've always loved Sam Darnold. Last year, through 14 weeks, it was a very fun story for me. But when you watched him, was it about Kevin O'Connell and Justin Jefferson? Do you see? see him going to Seattle with a defensive coach, with an offensive line that was bad last year. Do you think he replicates it? Is he now overvalued based on a remarkable coach, Justin Jefferson, solid run game? Where are you on Sam Darnold off of last season? What does the film tell you? Well, I think that the reason that Seattle wanted Darnold is because with Kubiak there is the OC,

they're going to run a lot of similar concepts as the Vikings did. They're putting them under center because I believe Darnold last year was either the second or third most dropbacks as a conventional play action quarterback, meaning he was under center. That's what he did really well under Kevin O'Connell, and that's what Kubiak is going to do. They're going to start with the outside zone run game, put Darnold under center, and let the play action game be a foundation of what they do. There's less reading involved in the play action game, particularly when you're under center. It holds the second level defenders better because they have a longer time to wait to see if it's run or pass. So I think the thought process was, Darnold was very good running that style of offense, that philosophical style,

and now we're going to do something very similar. And Colin, by the way, most quarterbacks need a particular style, a particular philosophy to be effective. There's very few transcendent quarterbacks that you can just say, let's do anything, and they'll be great. So that to me is not a knock on Darnold. That's the way it is with most quarterbacks. Greg CoSell, 46 years, NFL films. This point forward for the next 2022 weeks, it's going to be Greg CoSell on Thursdays. As always, great seeing you.

Thanks, Colin. Appreciate it. You bet. Well, Middilcoff, you and Jay Mack have been selling me on Brock Purdy for years. I eat a little crow there. He loves him on film. But I do think that opener for San Francisco on the road against Mike McDonnell's defense, and they're basically going to be using number three, four, and five wide receivers.

I do think that is a tough opener. Would you agree with that? If he lights him up, will you apologize to him? If Brock Purdy lights up Seattle? Yes. He's done it before like seven times, but. A little comeuppance for me, perhaps. Want more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHard Radio app.

Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. He's Mike Harmon. I'm Dan Byrd. We have a fantasy football podcast called I Want Your Flex. That's right, Dan. Every week we're going to scour the waiver wire to find the pickups to turbo boost your fantasy lineup. Sit, starts. Fantasy football players' rankings to get you ready to dominate the competition. Listen to I Want Your Flex with Mike Carmen. and me, Dan Byer, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you be your podcasts. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, huge news? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast. Well, we didn't

invent it. We just contributed to a podcast. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's extra special. So how did we, how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call. about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band. Before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down?

Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast.

or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel. Help an Acapella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform?

We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert. Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source,

the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis.

and I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris, every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on Clay. Jenchian win. I mean, she went down at three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay.

Listen, Lina Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface, because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court-side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs Tennis Podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports.

Welcome back in, halfway through it. Urban Meyer will be joining us in the last hour. He thinks Jim Harbaugh should be suspended in the NFL. I think what's happening in college football, which is between the NIL and the transfer portal. It's a little bit of the Wild Wild West. They have put some bumpers into the bowling lanes, but you can buy high school players now.

And so for me, I'm not getting worked up over an iPhone shaky video, some labeling it KGB level by Connor Stallions. I, you know, listen, I think they got, they're going to get fined. They'll lose $30 million. And Jim Harbaugh can't come back into college coaching. but I think Michigan, if this quarterback they got can play and this coach can coach, they're fine. I think the easiest thing for a big brand to do in college football or college basketball is write a check. You don't want to lose, you know, you don't want to lose bowl practices, you don't want to have vacated wins.

And so I think Michigan could be fine, as long as the coach can coach. Now, if you find out by this year you got the wrong guy at coach and you have to go get another coach, he may be turned off by all this stuff Michigan's dealing with and the noise and your field, your options may be limited. But let's wait and see if this guy's the right coach. Because the quarterback, Dan, the recruited, with the NIL money, a big-time player. John Middlough for the news. No, no, no, no.

Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Okay, Colin, your guy Baker Mayfield, he's had a career resurgents leading the Tampa Bay Buccaneers of the playoffs in both seasons since taking over for Tom Brady. Tampa won 10 games last year, and there's a lot of experts. expectations surrounding the team. But Baker says no matter the expectations, it doesn't change the team's approach and their

ultimate goal is a Super Bowl. Baker, he's 25 to 1 to win the MVP and he's coming off career highs in completion percentage, yards, touchdowns, and pass-for rating. Colin, what are your expectations for Baker, Mayfield, and Tampa this year? Well, I have him winning the division, mostly because

I just don't, I don't necessarily trust what Atlanta is. So I'm going to go with Baker to win the division. I do think Atlanta, I I think Atlanta beat Tampa twice last year. I like Pennix. You like him. I do worry about losing two offensive linemen here in preseason because they already moved

off Drew Dalman, an excellent top five or six center. So I'm going to give Baker the division. I feel pretty good about it. Yeah, I mean, I'm not only giving them the division. I think Atlanta's going to be in shambles if their offensive line falls apart. I think Carolina can finish second. But I actually like Baker 25 to 1. I think it's one of the better long shot, you know,

MVP bets on the board. Typically, it's Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Mahomes, Aaron Rogers, Lamarge. But every once in a while, there's a Matt Ryan. He was the number one overall pick. He's won a Heisman. There's a lot of momentum for this player. What if you tell me that Baker throws 45 touchdowns?

Chris Godwin was just activated off Pupp. You know, Mike Evans, they draft a first round wide receiver from Ohio State that everyone loves. Bucking, their offense is going to be awesome. Baker, the last two years, has put guys, Canales and Liam Cohen become head coaches on his watch. Yeah.

Something big, like Russell Wilson could never do that. I mean, I think there's a lot of momentum for Baker Mayfield ended in this season. How about Emeka Obuka, the receiver from wide receiver? How about throw this up? Dark Horse, offensive rookie of the year. What if they double-dip, MVP, offensive rookie of the year? I mean, if he gets 10 touchdowns and Baker throws 45, and they'd have to win, you couldn't win 10.

But if I told you they won 12 or 13 games and they were the two seed behind the Eagles, I think, you know, assuming that Josh Allen Lamar, a little fatigue, Mahomes probably won't have the numbers. I think it's possibility. Speaking of a team that will not have the MVP, the Jets, they're coming off a bad preseason loss to the Giants last week, and in response, they held a secretive, quote, players only practice without the media or assistant coach is present. But the problem here, Colin, is there was a coach there, was the head coach Aaron Glenn. During the practice, players reportedly conducted their own drills called their own. plays so the players could take ownership of what was going on.

Colin, what do you make of this? I don't like you. I don't know. I just, I said it when he was hired. I don't know. I mean, listen, half the coordinators you hired don't work. Like that. I mean, when you hire Jim Harbaugh, it's going to work.

Or when Kansas City hires, Andy Reid, it's going to work. Or when Denver hire Sean Payton. There are certain things, like Mike McCarthy in Dallas, you thought it would be somewhat successful. it was. Coordinators are 50-50 at best, and the defensive coordinators feel like it's less than 50-50. I just, I get a vibe that this thing could roll backwards, fast.

Well, I think one problem, obviously they do have a lot of good young players, Soss Gardner, Garrett Wilson, Quinn and Williams. Their quarterback play, Justin Fields seems like a great guy, and he was really impressive the way he's handled the last couple of years, but he's not a very good football player at quarterback. I mean, he struggles to pass. So I think offensively they're going to be in shambles. Obviously, the bills are a powerhouse.

The Patriots are going to be a lot better. I know we love kind of dragging the Miami Dolphins. I think the Jets are going to be pretty bad as well. So do I. It's going to be a long season. Speaking of a team that's not going to be bad, the Houston Texans, and their star corner Derek Stingley, Jr. He had a hell of a season in 2024,

earning a Pro Bowl selection being named First Team All-Pro. He got a big contract. His head coach, high-level guy D'emiko Ryan's, had some high praise for the young player. Derek definitely has one of the best hands that I've seen from the corner perspective. You can throw in, you know, Coach Prime, some great hands as well. But Derek, he's a unique player. He's very talented, very gifted. And for me, what I'm most encouraged about, you see from where I first got here to see where Stingley has grown.

to and what he's become, it's very impressive to watch to see the growth of a player, the development of him, and for him to be just the top of, top of his craft, top of the game as a cornerback position, like he's done an outstanding job. You know what? We've got to give Houston's front office some credit here, John. They have done a really good job. This roster, several years ago was a bit of a mess. I don't care if it's getting stingly first round or tank Dell in later rounds. They got some dudes. When you watch Houston play, they got dudes. They match up with almost everybody in this sport. You know, I said it yesterday.

Belichick fell apart when Josh left. How about Nick Casario as well? So he lost Cassario. He lost Josh McDaniels and the whole thing kind of unraveled. I've always heard, I don't know him personally. Nick Casarro is a really high-level guy. Yes. Hiring D'Amico, who I know is a really high-level guy,

watched him for years in San Francisco. They got a really good thing going. I thought last year they could be the number one seed. Obviously, the offensive line issues. Well, they also fell apart at receiver. Their team is loaded. I mean, defensively, I think they have a chance to be the best defense or one of the best defense in the league. It's like sometimes you have to trust your eyes.

When I watched Seattle last year, I'm like, they got dudes. I watched Houston. Like Houston's one of those teams you watch play at Kansas City and you're like, they may not have Mahomes, but they got guys everywhere that can play. And think about this. We love the Lions Corps, that young core we talked about yesterday, the Houston, Texas. CJ Stroud, Will Anderson. Derek Stingley played on a team. with Joe Burrow, Justin Jefferson, Jamar Chase.

I mean, we love that team. It's only aging better as time goes on how good their players are in the pro. So I like the Texans a lot this year. Yeah, having to win their division as well. John Middlecalf with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd-Ly News.

Well, it's often repeated on this show that offensive coaches really help quarterbacks, especially young quarterbacks. So, you know, I was watching the discussion. online last couple of days when Shane Steichen decided and the wording was clear. Daniel Jones is the starter this season. What it's telling you, it's sending a message. And the message is Anthony Richardson, he's a backup. When Kyle Shanahan moved off Trey Lance, didn't want to, did not want to.

They gave up a lot of picks. It's signaled to the league is Trey's not a starter. He can be a backup, good kid. And so somebody, like when Netflix passes on a script, there's not a long list of mega hits from the Netflix recycle bin. They know what they're doing. You know, when the CEO and insiders are selling company stock, nobody knows the company better than those people. You may not want to buy a ton of it. And so I think, I mean, a prime example is Colin Kaepernick, when Congress, when Congress,

Colin Kaepernick had Jim Harbaugh. He was 25 and 14 and got to conference championship games a couple of time in the Super Bowl. Without Harbaugh, he was not an NFL starting quarterback. He was 3 and 16. Quarterback rating in the mid-80s. Colin Kaepernick, his career was a mess down the stretch. Harbaugh made him a Super Bowl quarterback. You took Harbaugh, when Harbaugh bailed thought he was, you know, said all the right stuff, but distracted.

inconsistent, kind of only had a fastball, not real nuanced as a thrower. The minute Harbaugh moved off him, he was a rack. And like Anthony Richardson, this idea that he's going to go somewhere. I mean, Shane Steichen took Jalen Hertz. Jalen Hertz before Shane Steichen completed 52% of his throws. He completed 66.5% with Shane Steichen. So it's one of these things where don't outthink the room. Like don't out think the room.

is that, and then I think Kaepernick's better than Anthony Richardson, I'm not saying that. But if you look at his numbers without Jim Harbaugh, they're kind of Anthony Richardson, a big athletic guy who's not terribly deft at the pocket stuff, not great at it and doesn't win a lot of games. And again, Kaepernick is better than Anthony Richardson,

but I think when somebody that really knows an industry or knows, is like an insider, and Shane Stike and knows quarterbacks, look at his numbers, with Hertz and Herbert. Like, he knows what he's doing. I mean,

Shanahan made Matt Schaubb a pro bowler and Matt Ryan and MVP. That's why it was inexplicable. The Cowboys were like, we'll give you a fourth round pick for Trey Lance. Trey can be a backup. I mean, Jim Harbaugh is like, hey, put him on the squad.

I got no problem with that. But to me, it's like Anthony Richardson's not going to be a starting quarterback in the league. Well, he's young. Nobody cares about age. I do not care how old my surgeon is. fix me.

I don't care how old my pilot is. Well, I mean, listen, we hit the side of a mountain, but he's a young kid. He'll get better. Land safely. I don't care about your age and lack of experience. That's a you problem. So I just think it sends a signal. Albert Breer was on earlier this week on the Colts choosing Daniel Jones over Anthony.

And on offense, the idea is we've got to be way more better. at taking way better at taking care of the ball than we were in 2020. And so I think they feel like Daniel Jones, his ability to operate the offense, his ability to protect the ball, was just at a higher level right now than Anthony Richardson. And there are jobs on the line there this year. So they felt like for the team they have right now, Daniel Jones was the better answer. And the other thing is this is not the NBA. So because the NBA, more than any league, allows all their video to go on you,

and there's clips everywhere. And that the NBA, more than any sports league, has a lot of fans that just watch the clips. And they don't watch the games. Like baseball's always been like, you can't use our video. So it's not as clip driven as NBA. And because of that, an NBA player can be a legend and never win a playoff series. John Wall. Everybody says, I love John Wall.

In the awful East, he could never win a playoff series. He's super, super talented guy. But the point being is the NBA that you judge and you go, oh, I love this player because it's a clip-driven view. Like the NFL, we watch the games. It's not a highlight league. You've got to complete third and seven in the flat. A hundred out of a hundred times. You have to hit the layups.

So the NBA, there's a lot of players who are legendary or iconic, and they're not winning players, but their highlights are awesome. And that's okay. It's a different sport, different culture. 82 game regular season. But, I mean, La Mello Ball. I don't want Lamello ball on my team. But, man, he's a good highlight guy. Remember a Jason Williams out of like West Virginia, Randy Moss's buddy?

That guy was so much funny. It was so much fun. The clips were amazing. And then you, I mean, he's doing bounce passes off the elbow. And then you watch him over the course of a game and you're like, yeah, that's a turnover machine. is out of control. And so it's just different in the NFL. I've said this about Patrick Mahomes.

If he completes 27 throws, 24 are 12 yards and in, 14 yards and in. And about three times a game from the pocket, Mahomes is magical. And one or two times with his feet, he's magical. Five times out of 33 dropbacks, you're like, whoa. No, same with Josh Allen. He jumps over a linebacker, he makes two throws, running against his body. But this is, you got to get the layups. And Anthony just struggles with him.

And, I mean, with your career, he didn't average 60% completion rate, high school, college, or the pros. And like, when your career, go look at career completion percentage. If it's under 60, you're not really, you're probably not a starting quarterback. Now, that doesn't mean you can't get an offensive coach that can elevate you for a couple years. But it's just, I mean, I'm looking at this right now. Look at some. Yeah, John Morant, six years in the league, his three-point shooting's gone down, immature off the court, can't stay healthy. But in this highlight-driven league, I'm like, oh, in top five guy in the league, he may not be top 20.

Can't shoot, getting worse, can't stay healthy, not terribly mature. But I like watching the clips. And that is a real NBA reality. You can be a Hall of Famer, honestly, without making the playoffs. Your clips are great. Your moments are great. It's not the NFL. It's just different.

You got to complete 64% of your throws. You got to stay healthy. You know what I mean? Passer rating's got to be mid-90s or up if you want to get big money. It's the herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd, weekdays, noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news.

What's the news, name? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast. Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a... We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. We were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band.

Before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast.

But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio. app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies,

and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis, and I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris. Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on Clay. Jenchian win. I mean, she went down to three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay.

Listen, Lerner Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world. right now and I actually can win on any surface because if she's serving well good luck consider this your court side seat to the French Open listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the iHeart radio app Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts presented by capital one founding partner of iHeart women's sports tonight the game's most historic rivalry takes center stage as Alex Bregman and the Red Sox take on Aaron judge in the Yankees or the Astros battle the Orioles. Check local listings for the game in your area tonight at 7eastern on Fox. In recent years, one of the best coaching jobs was done by Kevin Stefansky of the Cleveland

Browns in 2023. In that division, he won 11 games and his quarterbacks were old creaky Joe Flacco, odd Deshawn Watson, PJ Walker, and Dorian Thompson Robinson. Kevin Stafansky's a hell of a coach. went to Penn. He knows more than you do about offense. I know. Hard to believe he does, and he knows more than me. He has announced that Joe Flacco will start against the Rams, 25 to 30 plays for the starters.

Dylan Gabriel is the backup. Shador Sanders is third. I know you've got your Shador slash Barry Sanders jersey you're wearing. I know. And I've said before, I think Shadour was underdrafted. I think he was. But speeding tickets, silliness, Dylan Gabriel's a much more kind of centered, serious kid, and Shadour is third. I got to trust Stavansky.

I won 11 games with like musical chairs at quarterback in 2023 in the AFC in a division with the Ravens. Joe Burrell. He won 11 games. He knows more than I do. I know. You are absolutely sure you could be president. You would do a better job. It's the world we live.

Everybody's an expert. Everybody's an epidemiologist during a pandemic. Kevin Stefanski's a smart guy. It's one of the two Ivy League coaches in the league. He's a pretty smart guy. He won 11 games with that nonsense in 2023. He's got Dylan Gabriel 2 and Shadour 3. Greg Kossel was on 25 minutes ago, and I asked him,

What do you see? You've seen both of them play in the preseason. What do you see? Offensive coaches, they think about how does a player work within my scheme. And what Gabriel is, is he's essentially stylistically similar to a two, a Taga Viloa. Sanders is a little different player. He's not quite as rhythmic. And he has a tendency, and this showed up on tape, by the way,

even though the good outweighed the bad when he played two weeks ago, he tends to drift a little in the pocket. he tends to retreat in the pocket. You know, how many quarterbacks are the Browns going to keep? No team keeps four quarterbacks. So it's going to be interesting going down the stretch here. And so then Sanders got hurt and missed some time in practice, and that's not going to help him.

So let's be honest. The entire NFL told you he's a fifth round pick, and the Browns are telling you he's a third-string quarterback. He was overvalued. I'm guilty as charged. I thought, oh, I can see him fall into the second round. I guess I'm wrong. But the league told you.

And by the way, seven teams annually are desperate for quarterback. And another 15 are desperate for a backup. The whole league passed for four rounds. And many of us believe Jimmy Haslam, the owner of the Browns, is the one that nudge the front office into drafting him. So the Brown drafted Dylan Gabriel two rounds before. So you can run to your Reddit board. and dog pound.com and say it's a conspiracy,

but the whole league told you, he's a fifth round quarterback. And the Browns are telling you, Kevin Stefanski, who won 11 games in 2023 with nonsense, in a division with the Ravens. The AFC, he's like a third string quarterback.

I, you know, I think I'm pretty good on the quarterback thing. Now that Sam Darnold can play, I haven't missed a ton on quarterbacks. I thought, I thought Shadour, I thought, I don't know, I watched Jackson Dart with better teammates. I watched Shadur with a bad college O-line and no-run game, be really productive, against much better rosters, much, much better rosters. But the league and the Browns, they're telling you, eh, eh, I mean, I know this is hard for guys,

but sometimes you have to admit there are people that are behind the rope, they have access, they see stuff. I mean, it sounded like to me, remember Greg Kosell said a couple of weeks ago on the show. He said, he said, Shadur is accurate, but he's not as accurate as the analysts are saying. The film tells you he's not that accurate. He's accurate. But, and for the record, the Browns have everything to gain on Shadur playing. if Shadur, I mean, if Shadur could be the starter, are you kidding me?

That would be unbelievable as a fifth round pay. Look what it's done to the Niners. You can stack your roster. You can get out from under that horrible DeShon Watson contract. They would love, they would love for Shadour as a fifth round pick to be a starting quarterback. There's no advantage to the Browns bearing him. And I said, I looked at Dylan Gabriel in college, and my take was he had great coaching and talent at Oregon. He's just too small.

He's going to struggle, kind of see in the field, and he's acknowledged he can. I just thought, I mean, he looks smaller. And I'd seen photos of him next to other athletes at Oregon, and I thought, I just don't see that as an NFL quarterback. I've always said size matters unless you're like Kyler Murray or Russell Wilson and you're prime and you can run around and you're so elusive. That's not Dylan Gabriel. Shador's a legit 6-2. Shadur moves well enough, and he was really accurate behind, with no town around him at Colorado.

But, Stefansky knows more than I do, and I trust him, and there's no value in bearing him. I would love to be on dog poundbarks.com today. I bet you that website is lit. I bet they're going crazy. In everybody's stinking. but us in Cleveland.com. I would love to be on that.

I don't have my phone with me. Dogs by nature, is that the big one? Woohoo! That site is roaring today. John, what do you make of it? Didn't Sifansky tell you what he thought about Shador when he had the chance to take him in the third round and he took another quarterback?

And even if you say, well, the GMs pick the players, no one picks a quarterback for an offensive head coach. That's the offensive head coach, even if he's not the boss in the draft room. Quarterbacks are his baby. He chose Dylan Gabriel in the third round. Now, we can disagree, and I do. I thought that was a little crazy.

But he clearly likes Dylan Gabriel. I mean, that's not debatable. And Dylan Gabriel is what? Two, three, four, five years worth of college experience that they're basing this off of. Let's check out Wolfwolf.com and see what they're saying. Man, this is, this is good. Dogbiscuit.com.

Let's go check it out right now, hour three now. Guys, it's us of the Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions.

Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel

help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Podcasts. What's up, fam?

It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast, Point Game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was part of you. You just understood. That's how personal it got.

Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis come until he's like, you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your Turn someday into right now with Buddy by Jake Radio. Non-stop workout music and expert tips 24-7.

Hey, head over to iHeart.com. Search Body by Jake Radio and stream it for free right now. Awesome health and wellness tips 24 hours a day, seven days a week. Remember, stick to the fight. When your heart is hit, it's when things seem worse that you must not quit. Don't quit. Body by Jake Radio, where hope meets momentum. Search Body by Jake Radio and stream it for free.

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