The Herd with Colin Cowherd - The Herd - Hour 2 - Comparing Aaron Rodgers and Eli Manning

Episode Date: January 19, 2023

Looking at the careers of  Aaron Rodgers and Eli Manning We should look at the level of importance of stats between MLB and the NFL Previewing the NFL playoff games this weekend   Guest: Greg CosellSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Ah, here we go, live in Los Angeles, it's the herd, wherever you may be, however you may be listening, IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio FS1. So we're getting into this, we're getting into this discussion about, you know, Aaron Rogers, who's obviously a Hall of Famer, and a gifted thrower, and Eli Manning's career. And Ryan Glasspegle's a New York Post Media critic guy, and he put it up yesterday. And I'm sure, I didn't see what the results were. I'm sure it's like 99% I'd rather have Aaron's career. But baseball's a stats board, J-Mac, and I'll give you an example. Why do I know that Nolan Ryan has seven no-hitters?

Why do I know that Pete Rose's career average was 303? Why do I know that Hank Aaron had 755 homers and that Lou Brock had 900 and I think 38 stolen bases? Ricky Henderson finished with like 1,400. I'm not even a baseball guy. Why do I know that? Why do I know those numbers? I don't know how many MVP's Brady has. Because it's not a stat sport.

That's baseball. Baseball nerds, if I have, you can listen to radio hosts that love baseball. They can't mention the sport without bringing up Mickey Mantle. I've never once brought up Red Grange on my show or Hugh McElhaney. Football's about tomorrow. Football's about evolving. Football's about winning games. Dan Marino, zero Super Bowls.

Eli Manning, Brady twice. and I would take Eli's career over Dan Marino in one second. One second. Now, the question is, Aaron does have a Super Bowl and a far greater body of work. But the I've, first of all, who had the better early career, Eli? Aaron didn't play for three years. And his first year, he won six games. So the first four years, Eli was on the field.

Who's ending, well, Eli did end poorly. Aaron's not aging particularly well. I mean, he's been a few MVPs the last couple years. Not this season, but... But again, we're not an award sport. Yeah. That's not what... If I said to you, you're a sportscaster,

how many MVPs does Peyton Manning have? I have no idea. No idea. Nobody cares. Nobody can... By the way, the Heisman winner mostly sucks as a pro quarterback. Nobody cares. Football's not a plaque sport.

Okay, so how about this? Dan Marino, no Super Bowls, but was widely considered one of the best quarterbacks for almost... Many of the years he was in the league. He's considered a top five quarterback all time, correct? Now he doesn't have a Super Bowl. So is his career useless, even though he was incredible? No, no, let's not go to useless.

Okay. His career is completely redeemable. But you can, you know what you can always say to Dan Marino to get under his skin? Never won the big one, huh? What do you say to Eli? Well, you only got two. There's nothing you can say to Eli to get under his skin. nothing.

You'll probably dig a your brother was way better. Hey, hey, hey, Brady. Yeah, I know I'm two and oh in Super Bowls against him. You cannot tell the story of the NFL without Eli Manning. That's fair. Only guy to beat Brady twice in the Super Bowl. Manning family. And I think we undervalue how good Eli was in his prime.

He was a great, hurry up offense quarterback, never miss starts, always there. Unbelievable team. Aaron's become prickly, luth and can't beat Garoppolo and Goff at home and is outplayed by both at Lambo. So Aaron's not aging and now he's holding the franchise hostage over B and C level players. Yes, Aaron has a greater body of work. Nobody's disputing that. But I go back to this.

Dominique Wilkins had an unbelievable career. Steve Kerr has used those rings to get a coach and a gym. whose career would you take? Steve Kerr's, who was a marginal player, but his basketball life are Dominique. Well, since I'm more Steve Kerr than Dominique, I can't dunk. I would go Steve Kerr. Okay. So the idea, that's outrageous to think that a great, Dominique's an all-time great player. That's the big knock on Charles Barkley. Can't tell the story of the league without Kerr. You can tell it without Dominique. You can.

Now, now, you can't tell the. the story of the NFL without Aaron. Nobody's saying that. Let me ask you this. If Aaron had no Super Bowls against Eli with two, then what would you choose? So then it becomes, oh, he's Marino, Aaron's Marino. So I'm not taking it away. You can certainly out-argue me on the inner web, Aaron. I get it. But I'm saying is, this is not baseball. It's not a plaquesport. Nobody cares. Absolutely nobody cares. I mean, Matt Ryan's numbers are probably better than Eli's. Philip Rivers are.

Eli was great when it counted. And to me, that is the heart and soul of football. Let the baseball guys wax poetic about Mickey. And let the NBA guys think Westbrook's good because he plays hard. He's a disaster in half court offense. Football is winning big game. Brady's not the most talented. Brady doesn't have, if you look at,

Brady's stats, they're closer to Craig Beigio, where their accumulation stats. But Brady wasn't walking off with, I mean, Tom was never the highest paid. He was never the most athletic. He never had the best arm. He's the best big game quarterback ever. So the goat in football, it's not even top 10 arm strength,

not even top 20 athlete. He wins big games. And that's the goat. And number two is Montana. Smaller, not hyper-athletic. Montana was what was running a West Coast offense, which made its simplified passing.

They didn't ask him to throw stuff, and he had the best receiver in the league in the world, Jerry Rice. I'm just saying, winning matters. That's why I love football. I don't care about plaques and Mickey. It's just, I don't care. Greg Kossell, 43 years NFL films. I know he thinks I'm crazy.

I don't care with it. I'm okay with it. I don't have any plaques, Colin, so I'm okay with it. You're not a black guy. You know what? You're very good and big spot. That's why we love you. You're a full.

There you go. There you go. Okay. Let's go. Trevor Lawrence now is his hands full going to Kansas City with Mahomes. We know the first half was awful. We all saw it. Right.

Go to the second half. Trevor Lawrence. What did you see that he did? Because I thought he was pretty darn good. You know, a couple of things really struck me when I watched the tape of that second half. Because, you know, when you watch the game on TV, I don't know how you watch games, but I'm not sitting there taking notes and studying X's and O's.

just getting caught up and watching the game. So when I watched the tape, I was really kind of surprised, but yet really impressed by what Doug Peterson did. He did not come out to try to score three touchdowns in five minutes. They played very, very methodically. They got a lot of zone coverage. There was a lot of quick passing game. They got Trevor into a rhythm. And then I thought the play, and we just saw it a moment ago, that was all Trevor Lawrence, was the long 39-yard touchdown to Zay Jones because that was no huddle tempo. So he had to make that call at the line of scrimmage. And he recognized the defense based on film study because Brandon Staley comes from the

Vic Fangio school. And that was a specific Vic Fangio kind of defense. And he knew what he was getting. And he made that play call and hit Say Jones for 39 yards and a touchdown. But I thought the way in which they played allowed Lawrence to get into a really comfortable rhythm. get his confidence back, and then he made a couple of really big throws. But there were also a lot of pitch and catch throws based on the way the Chargers

chose to play defense, a ton of zone with a big lead. Now, Mahomes carved up the Jags in their first meeting. What does the film say? How is he able to do it? And that's a little bit of an issue in this game. I mean, obviously Mahomes is an issue for any defense in any game. But the Jaguars, and a lot of people might not be aware of this because of the focus on Trevor Lawrence and how we played in the last half of the season and the game last week.

But the Jaguars are one of the worst third down defenses in the NFL. And the Chiefs are one of the best third down offenses. The only team with a higher conversion rate on third down than the Chiefs through the regular season is the Bills. So the Chiefs are really good on third down for many reasons. Scheme Mahomes' ability to make throws from the pocket, his ability to get out of the pocket and make throws outside of structure, which breaks down the discipline of your defense. And I think that third down is going to be critical because if they cannot get the chiefs off

the field and we know what happens when the chiefs get in the red zone, there's no more creative a red zone play caller and designer than Andy Reid. It's going to be very difficult for the Jaguars. Their defense is going to have to play at a very high level on this game. So listen, if you look at what Brian Day, Abel did. He basically saved Daniel Jones. We talked about it yesterday. It was like your kid was flunking out. You hired the best tutor and got him to a C plus. It's not like Daniel's an A plus. He carved up the Vikings twice, but you basically saved his career. What does the film say? Are there things

they have done? Obviously, he's running more, but are there things they've done to make it an easier offense for Daniel? Because he is playing. I think this is indisputable. He looks more confident. He looks like a complete, his body language, bigger, more aggressive. Like, what are they doing? Well, I think, again, we do a couple of things we don't know. They played Minnesota twice and they allowed Daniel Jones to drop back significantly in both those games playing against a bad pass defense. But I think they've subtly made a change in the idea that Daniel Jones can line up and can make

throws. And what they've done, there's a lot of boot action. He's very good getting outside the pocket because he gives you. you a run game element to that as well. They're very good with the play action pass game. They're very good with the quick game where throws are more quickly defined. These are things that Daniel Jones has executed really, really well. The key for them is to stay in games because if they get behind big, which they were not in many games this year at all, then they have to be a drop back passing team. And that's where I think Jones is not quite as good. And that's where some of their old line

weaknesses show up as well. That's the other thing people have to keep in mind. If they have to get into a drop back passing a situation, the right tackle, the rookie Neil has struggled in one-on-one pass protection. The interior of that O line is not very good. So they have to be in a situation where the games are close and they can be proactive with how they choose to utilize and deploy their passing game. And that's where Jones has really shine the last number of weeks.

He looks tall in the pocket. He's efficient. the ball's coming out. He's not getting stuck in the pocket. We used to see him get stuck in the pocket a lot. Yeah. So what will Jalen Hertz? We know Dexter Lawrence is great. There's no disputing. He's a total disruptor. Leonard Williams pretty good. What will Jalen Hurts see? What is predictable the Giants do week in and week out? Well, just one quick point. In researching that game, you know what? Speaking of stats after your baseball rant, Dexter Lawrence has played 77% of the Giants' defensive snaps at 340 pounds. I just found that absolutely remarkable.

But anyway, you know, the big question here is Jalen Hertz. I know he's not on the injury report, but the question is, will the Eagles be able to run their entire offense, which includes Hertz as a runner as a significant factor in what they do? But one thing that's really stood out on tape over the last month is the Giants have made a very dramatic change in how they play defense. Everybody thinks of Martindale correctly so as being heavy pressure, heavy man-to-man coverage. Well, over the last month, they are playing heavy zone with a lot of split safety and they're not blitzing much at all. So they've almost

changed 360 degrees. And one thing I've noticed watching the Eagles, they are very good attacking coverages when they feel they have a strong probability tendency as to what they're going to get. They create a lot of good throws by NFL standards, relatively easy throws for Hertz with what they do and how they go about attacking defenses. So I think their coaching staff does a really, really good job. But when you play Wink Martindale, you're still not sure what you're going to get. So that to me is a really intriguing aspect of that side of the ball. All right, Cincinnati Buffalo. Yeah. I, it's fascinating. Let's say Buffalo loses. It's like, what are they? I still don't love the offensive line. They're

too Josh Allen-centric. Now they're making too many turnovers. I don't like what they are now. I said this the other day. I covered early Mike Tyson. He moved well. He had a jab. He had great corner people. I covered the older Mike Tyson. He stopped jabbing. He wasn't in great shape. His movement wasn't as good, but he could still knock you out. Buffalo feels like they're not aging well. I don't like what I see. What is the tape say? Yeah, you know, and I've

spoken about this now for quite a while and I think, you know, you have to watch the tape to understand what they are. You're right about their all line. Their all line is probably average at best, maybe below average. They don't really run the ball with any real commitment and their run game and

their past game does not sync up. Sometimes I watch them and I feel like they say, well, it's time for a run, so they hand it off. And, you know, I don't feel like there is really a synchronicity between their run game and their pass game. As far as receivers, as far as who you can count on every single week, you really have digs. Everybody else is week to week. You're not sure. So they're Josh Allen-centric, as you said, and it's hard to play that way.

You know, so he makes, the thing about Josh Allen is he makes throws that when you're watching on TV, probably look pretty routine, but they're not. He's really a special play. I mean, in terms of pure physical gifts along with his size, he's the most physically gifted quarterback in the league. Now, if he has a great game and he's, look, you go back to last year's two playoff games. Obviously, we know they lost to the Chiefs in that wonderful game.

But if he plays like that, they can score 40 and beat anybody anytime, you know. But because they're so Josh Allen's. and because he has such an aggressive mindset and mentality, there's always going to be throws he makes that you scratch your head. You hope that they don't turn out to be turnovers. And by the way, it's not as if he threw 25 interceptions. He only threw one or two more interceptions than Mahomes. People just get caught up because of the way in which he plays. There's at times a reckless, undisciplined nature to the way in which he plays. Sometimes that leads to an unbelievable play. Sometimes it doesn't.

Yeah. And, you know, this interception was a great example that we're looking at. John Brown is a clear-out player on that route concept. The ball never should have been thrown to John Brown, but sometimes Josh Allen can't help himself. Yeah. But their offense is Josh Allen. They're not that talented on offense. Yeah.

There you go. They're not that talented on offense. Okay. Joe Burrow against the Ravens. Pretty conservative stuff the tape looked like. Yeah. The last two weeks. Now, division opponent could be a function of that.

they also now have offensive line issues. They're going to start three backups. By the way, the bill's pass rush is not great either, by the way. That's another area that can be a concern for them depending on the opponent. So what they've done the last couple of weeks has been a lot of quick rhythm throws, get the ball out of Burroughs hands. His longest pass play last week was 19 yards. I think he only took one vertical shot in the entire game.

Normally he takes vertical shots outside the numbers when he gets one-on-one. so it'll be interesting to see how they go about playing this week, given their offensive line issues with the three backups. But you're right, the last two weeks, this offense has had much more of a conservative feel to it than sort of the aggressive mentality that we've seen with Burrow. Because Burrow, really, when I watch the tape for 90% of this season, I always think of a guy that is aggressive,

that when he sees one-on-ones, he's going to throw it. Yeah. Okay, let's talk Niners, Cowboys. So I was talking to somebody the other day, and John Lynch pointed this out earlier in our show. Brock Purdy is a lot more athletic than they thought. Now, Herbert in college was restricted. And then the Rolls Bowl came out and people went, oh, Justin Herbert actually can run. C.J. Stroud restricted at Ohio State.

They didn't have a good backup against Georgia. He runs. And everybody goes, oh, I didn't know C.J. Stroud was that player. So Niners, John Lynch said, we need. knew he could move. We didn't know he was nearly this athletic. And I think to myself, if you want to be hyper aggressive like Dallas can be defensively, you could really get burned here if he extends plays. I think pretty, I mean, what's the film say? I think his athleticism is better than I thought and better than the Niners thought. Well, and it's added to their offense because one of the things

I've spoken about for a number of weeks now is he's added two things to their offense, Colin, that Garapolo couldn't give them. The play action boot game, because he's got light feet and can get outside the pocket, and the second reaction movement game. He makes plays outside of structure, and we didn't see either of those two things from Garapolo. So he's given them two dimensions to their offense that Garapolo could not. So that's a factor, but it's funny. You talk about Dallas.

They like to be an aggressive defense. But what do the Niners do? The Niners line up in base personnel, what we call 21 personnel, more than 40 percent of their snaps. two backs with use check and one tight end. And it's very difficult to be really aggressive when you're in your base defense because the Cowboys' Base Defense is what we call Big Nickel. They play with three safeties. They never play with three linebackers.

And they're not really aggressive from that personnel package. And the thing about the 49ers, they have five eligible receivers in that 21 personnel package that can line up anywhere in the formation. and that makes it really hard for a defense and easier for Purdy because it gives him far more pre-snap information based on what the defense shows him before the snap of the ball. Okay. Dak Prescott, that's as good as I've said. The best I've ever seen him playing a big game.

I know you got the film. You had to have been impressed. His movement, I thought, was really good. Yeah. I thought that it was in the second quarter, the final drive of the second quarter where you could really see Prescott settle in and be sort of the Prescott that we've kind of seen for much of his career. He started the game still playing fast, kind of a continuation of the week prior against the commanders. He still wasn't seeing things with clarity. And then all of a sudden,

he settled in and you could just see that everything kind of came together. He saw the field. His vision was expanded, not condensed and limited. He moved better. When he threw that touchdown his Schultz, the movement touchdown. You could see he was moving. with purpose. He was not playing fast. It was almost the old John Woodenline, be quick, but don't hurry. He was playing, moving with a purpose. And I thought that it all kind of clicked in for him. And I think that's the way we expect Prescott to play. That's the way he's played a good part of his career. Okay. So your big play of the week to a player that got dinged up early, took him to about Thanksgiving, the Dalton Schultz, who I think he's a really

good player. This year was a little uneven for him early, but he's back to being really, really important for this offense. And I'm glad you said it that way, because no one would say Dalton Schultz is, you know, George Kittal or Travis Kelsey or Andrews or those guys, but he's really

important to them, and that's all that matters. So let's go to the play. This was the first touchdown to Schultz. It was the seam ball that he hit, and you know, it was wide open. And so how did he get wide open, particularly in the red zone like that? So here, we know that he caught the seam ball.

So let's walk through this and see how this all happened. So the Bucks are in cover three. It's a single high safety defense. Now, you need to control two defenders to make this throw. You need to control the post safety, and you need to control the corner to the boundary. So what they do is they run double seam, okay? One player can't play two seam routes. That's really hard in cover three.

And then they take the corner and they have C.D. Lamar on a stub. go because you don't want the corner overlapping the seam by Schultz. So now there's an element of Prescott here as well. He looks left on his dropback because he also must control the post safety. So you have the post safety control. You have Lamb Stutter go controlling the outside corner. So now the seam is wide open because the two players on defense who needed to be controlled were controlled by the routes and by Dak Prescott looking to his left.

So this was beautifully designed against cover three and beautifully done. Good stuff. You know, I just thought, I'm going to argue more about this. Eli Manning, let me ask you this. Eli Man. So both Aaron Rogers and Eli are rich, commercially viable. They'll be Hall of Famers. They're iconic.

That's not the question. That's not the question. Eli was also a better high school college quarterback and a better quarterback for first four years because Aaron didn't play for three. Now, Eli has ended. He ran out. Aaron's better late. But if you go to the heart of their primes, six-year primes, Eli's got two Super Bowls. Aaron's got one.

The heart of that is closer than you think. Aaron's got some hardware in the last couple years MVP's. Eli was better early. Aaron's better late. If you go to the heart of it, boy, Eli for about six years in the middle there. And by the way, he's the best Giants quarterback of all time, isn't he? Y.A. Tiddell and Eli, are they the two best? I guess you'd have to think, but probably.

I mean, yeah, I know the Giants for a long stretch didn't have what would be considered great. Although Phil Sims, you know, he obviously played great for a couple of years as well and had a phenomenal Super Bowl. How about this one? You could argue Bart Starr got more rings and Farve was more talented. For a lot of people, old-timers, Aaron's third. Am I not? Well, let me ask you this very quickly. It comes down to the question about Super Bowls versus other things.

Right. You know, if you just want to look at Super Bowls and you can say that, hey, you can just look at a math equation and say a guy's great because he won Super Bowls. Well, it's not just that he won Super Bowls. He beat Brady and Belichick twice, had two of the most iconic throws. And there's nothing in America like being a New York legend. He's a legend. He's Joe Toro. He's Derek Jeter.

He's Eli. There's like, there's like seven. It'd be a fascinating conversation. Colin with coaches. You know, you mentioned Philip Rivers. I have spoken to coaches who, some who feel that Philip Rivers was a better quarterback than Eli Manning. Now, again, there's not speaking about it from a numbers or a hardware perspective. Right. So that would be a fascinating conversation to have with coaches. Maybe I'll have dinner with Sean Peyton again next week. There you go. There you go.

Greg, great seeing you. Thank you. Thanks, Colin. Appreciate it. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the IHard Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential.

Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app. Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement

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Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics

from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of Tontons and Wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith Rule of Two. Listen to Stuff to Bole Your Mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's interesting. They're both Hall of Famers.

They're going to both be Hall of Famers. They're both rich. They're both iconic. They're both viable. Eli was a better high school, college, and first four year in the league quarterback. Aaron's better late. Go to the heart for six years. My guy's got two Super Bowls.

Because quarterbacks, even Mahomes, you're not great in the first couple. Most guys end a little choppy. Tom's ending a little choppy. Go to your, go to your six to seven in the middle. I got two Super Bowls. Eli and those six, seven, it's pretty damn good. He's pretty good. Now, early, he was a mess, but he was playing.

Aaron didn't have to play. So a lot of Eli's interceptions in those first three years, battle line, he's, Ernie of Corsi, you know, they were building an empire. He had to sit out there and play. Aaron got to sit back and watch Favre play. Eli had to play in the pressure cooker of New York. and he has a lot of interceptions. He popped, I think, in year four.

Well, wait a sec. He didn't, the pressure cooker of New York, remember, he forced his way there at the draft. Remember where the Chargers had the first pick? Yeah. They were going to take him. And Eli's. Sounds like courage to me. Courage?

Eli's like, I'm not going to at the time, San Diego. I'm not saying I'm winning the argument. And I don't really care if I went in or not. What I'm saying is New York legend, Brady Belichick twice. Yeah, I know. I got it. You're a big Eli Manning fan. Well, no, I just.

I mean, I think Eli, one of the great things about Eli is his coachability. You cannot find an E. Lay Manning teammate that doesn't worship him. People love him. There's value in that coachability. He never missed arts. He never got hurt. There's value in that. There's value in letting teammates get the praise.

If you want to count everything, that's a landslide for Eli. Interesting. I just looked up Eli's career playoff. off record. Any guesses? When he was in it, he was good. When he was in, he was good. What is it? Eight wins, four losses. Basically two Super Bowl runs, both, I believe, from the wild card.

Eight wins, four losses and beat Brady and Belichick. What's errands? Now, he was fairly awful in the games they flamed out early in the playoffs. He was putrid downright. Fifty-two percent completions. Well, let's go to Aaron's. 51 percent completion. What's Aaron's? What's errands? Eleven and ten. Should we go to Mark Sanchez? four and two, all wins on the road.

I got a K-pop's my guys. Okay. But Eli's got two Super Bowl. Okay, that's Mark's not a fair. No, obviously. And also, Eli was, I'm not saying I'm right on the argument. I'm saying my, the basis for my argument is, baseball is a rear-view mirror sport.

Nobody gives a rip about that stuff. I've never bought, not one time have I brought up Hugh McElhaney or red grain. Be honest. Is Hugh Macle? Is that a real person? Yeah, exactly. I never heard the name of my life. Yet, if I say, yet,

In baseball, I can say, High Cobb, Bob Gibson, Bob Feller. Those are how, everybody knows those. Baseball's rearview mirror. Football is windshield. Nobody gives a rip about Tom Brady Super Bowl now. Tom's like,

get me new coaches or I'm out. That's the sport. The sport is winning today. That's the sport. And there's nothing wrong with baseball being about a folklore. But then stats matter more. get it. There's arguments about, you know, Nolan Ryan would, but for the record, Nolan Ryan is, I'll give you an example. No one Ryan is Eli Manning. He had great moments. He had seven no hitters.

Nolan Ryan won like 55% of his games. But in baseball, he's an absolute legend. No one Ryan is legendary. You put it. Eli had great moments, but like Nolan Ryan, he wins half his games. but we dock him for things that we don't care about. We don't care about stats. Okay, is it weird, though, on some level? Eli Manning played, I'm just off the top. Let's say he played 200 games in his NFL career. Just pick a number.

We're basically boiling it down to two games. No, two playoff runs. Big difference. Okay, fine, two playoffs. But he won the Super Bowl, right? So if he loses those Super Bowls, for instance, John Elway, great career. He loses the Super Bowls pretty badly and then gets to run.

Davis wins two on the way out the door. And we view... Is it fair to boil down an entire career to one huge Super Bowl game? No, no, no. I'm not, I'm being completely honest about my Eli Manning summation or my opinion, which is Eli was never, he was like Andrew Luck. He never cared about stats. Eli is all about winning.

I know Eli a little. Eli is about winning games. Aaron now feels like he's protecting stats. Doesn't he? He plays safe. There's some LeBron of that going on with the Lakers. He's building stats. I think there's a very real narrative that Green Bay fans who are adults would admit.

Aaron now often plays safe protecting passer rating, protecting stats. Why is Aaron so bad and come from behind wins? Because when he's had a bad start, a couple of picks, shuts her down. Eli didn't care. Stats meant, now Eli was about, if Eli had three interceptions, he'd have five. He just wanted to win the game. You don't bake in all that stuff about Eli. Eli was about coachability, teammates, communication, handing credit to others.

That stuff doesn't get baked in. It's real. It is, by the way, I talked to Sean Payton, about Russell Wilson. They have issues. They're not, the issues are communication, coachability. Fixable. But they're stuff that don't show up in a box score. Right, right, right.

That stuff's real in football. My biggest takeaway from this Aaron Rogers, Eli Manning thing, we need Aaron Rogers to still play in the NFL because this is a great topic out of thin air and he's still playing football. If he retires, Colin, we need him in the NFL. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week, within the IHeart radio app.

Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Paulie Fusco here with Tony Fusco. Yo, as you all know, we're the host of the number one rated show in all of sports talk, the Polly and Tony Fusco show. Numero uno. Yeah, and we know why millions of people tune in every week. Yeah.

They want to hear us talk sports, not our idiot guests who think they know more about sports than we don't. Yeah, listen to these dummies. You don't know crap about sports. You don't know nothing about football. This is the worst thing I've ever been to phone. Wait, he's still on the law? You don't know basketball.

If you want to hear how sports talk should be done, yeah. Listen to the Polly and Tony Fuscoe show on the I-Hart radio. Apple Podcast, wherever you get your podcast. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential.

Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app. Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement

to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger.

So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of taun tons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and

corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. They say good things come to those who wait. The 2023 Mercedes-Benz SUV family approves otherwise. Test drive, one of their new eight SUVs at MBUSA.com. J-Mack with the news. Turn on the news.

This is the herd line news. Some breaking news here in the last 20 minutes. The Ravens announced they have parted ways with offensive coordinator Greg Roman. He's been with the team since 2017, took over his O.C. in 2019. He was the assistant coach of the year in the NFL in 2019 and was leading the offense during Lamar's MVP campaign. So do Lamar want him out? Well, a couple things here.

So, oh, if you read it, depending who you read, sounds like Roman went to the team and said, listen, I got a year left on my deal, but I think I'm done here. did not like Roman. The offense really struggled down the stretch, but their best receiver, Bateman, was out, and the quarterback was out. They were playing with backup and Anthony Brown. I don't know what fans expect. But, Colin, this has to have

trickle-down ramifications to Lamar Jackson. Well, if I knew, did John want him out? No. According to the report, Roman went to Harbaugh and said, I'm stepping down. I got a year left on my deal. I'm out. So it doesn't sound like, at least on the surface, Harbaugh

pushed him out. So you have to go fine. the lesser version of Greg Roman for that offense. I think you've got some options. Do you totally reboot the offense and make it attractive to... I think it makes it more likely they move Lamar Jackson. I think Miami's a fascinating choice. I think Carolina's fascinating. What about the Jets?

I think it could work. Could Sala go and say, hey, Greg, you and Lamar? Now, I don't know the relationship with Lamar and Greg Roman. Does Lamar... I mean, you don't want to say Greg Roman made him, but Lamar was like a late first round pick. And he came on as just a running quarterback. And instantly he was like, oh my gosh, flinging it around.

Is it numbers improved? No, I think the Jets, a defensive run first team when Brees Hall comes back and their defense, you insert Lamar and you're like, listen, we are going to be a very physical run downhill team. That's to a large degree San Francisco's M.O., which is, you know, you see how San Francisco with Brock Purdy, who can move a little bit? I mean, it's, I don't know. I look at this and I think Lamar's got a heck of a market. And I think Derek Carr is a market.

I think Lamar is a bigger market. If I was Miami, I'd do it today. If I was the Jets, I would do it. Now, here's what's interesting. Greg Roman was with Kaepernick in San Francisco. When Kaepernick took the league by storm, Niners go to the Super Bowl. Lamar Jackson, Greg Roman works.

Awesome. MVP. They make a run in the playoffs. Are you concerned? What is Lamar? without Greg Roman. Do we know? Fast. I mean, he's still athletically dynamic. It's a very fair question, though.

Greg is uniquely tied to Kaepernick and Lamar. His offense is built for the hyper-athletic quarterback. And we're getting more and more players in the league that are very, very athletic. Daniel Jones, by the way, you could run some of that offense. He's a big, strong kid. So I think, I guess the audience watching now, what is this mean is what people are asking? my takeaway it means there's a higher percentage Lamar leaves doesn't guarantee it but if I was if I was 50-50 I'm now 60-40 Lamar's gone okay if you're Harbaugh do you go to

Lamar say hey Greg Roman left you know do you involve him in the offensive coordinator search well no because he does he have great knowledge of offensive coordinators that's Harbaugh's league and you're not going to let him have some say he has a unique style where I think Harbaugh would have to lean on his history in the league and his connections. If they left on good terms, John would call and say, hey, Greg Roman, you tell me, who's you? Where do I hire you?

Because I do think the offense, they don't have enough receivers. I think this offense works when they lean into Lamar's gifts. You don't have to reinvent Lamar. Just find somebody that runs largely. This is a tough punch-in-the-mouth offense and defense culture. I like what they were doing. I think you win a lot of games playing the way they play. Okay.

Let's go to another team in search of an offensive coordinator of the Chargers. Brandon Staley, you know, listen, they were. some concern he was going to be dumped after that collapse against the Jag. They ended up parting ways with their OC and quarterback coach. Weird, Brandon Staley said he never felt like his job was in danger. Well, maybe he didn't inside the room. A lot of confidence, Bill, and how we do things here and what we've been able to accomplish. And that's the truth.

And everybody that's been around me on a day-to-day basis knows that. And I am aware of the speculation about me, but I'm not. I was not worried about that because I know what goes on here on a day-to-day basis, and I know what we have in our locker room. I know what's out on that field, and I'm excited to keep going. He says no, but Colin, we know he has rabid ears. The numbers say he stopped going for two. Remember two years ago?

He went for two all the time. Now he dialed it way back. Fourth down, ultra-aggressive. In a playoff game, fourth and three. All we'll punt the ball fourth quarter. Staley knows what's going on out there. I don't know. Do you involve Justin Herbert in this offensive coordinator search?

Again, he's a kid. What does he know? I don't think Lamar and Herbert have this encyclopedic knowledge. Now, Aaron Rogers or Brady, they've been around the league so long. If you asked Aaron, who are the three best coordinators? He's golf with somebody, he knows somebody. Aaron and Brady are Russell Wilson, older quarterbacks. But if you're asking Lamar and Herbert, hey, what coordinator do you like?

They're kids. I mean, Herbert's really a kid. What do they know? They don't have a roll of decks. They don't have knowledge of the best coordinator. That's up to a GM to do or a head coach. It's like to say. I think the offensive coordinator has to be tailored to your strengths.

Look at Jalen Hurts. But that's a coach's job to figure out, not a quarterback. That's what a coach does. He's like, Sean Payton, I got Russell. I need a coach that understands the value of movement and mobility. Brandon Staley, a defensive coach, knows a lot about the quarterback. John Harbaugh and a special teams guy knows a lot about Lamar Jack. It's tough.

There's no right answer. Agree to disagree. Finally, NFL announced the teams will be home teams for international games next season. Five overseas in 23. Bill, Jags and Titans will play in London. Chiefs and Patriots will host games in Germany. Love that. The cities to be announced later.

Germany games were cool. That Germany game was awesome. I'm excited about this. What was that? Buck Seahawks, right? I'm going to retire in Ducel, Dors. So I can't wait. I'm going to be over there.

You can be hanging out with David Hasselhoff? Well, Zurich. I'm going to retire in Zurich. So I'd be to a little plane flight over to watch Belichick will still be coaching. He'll be like 94. And I'll be right in the second row. I know that alcohol is very good in Germany. How are the slopes over there?

Well, Austria, Switzerland. Decent, huh? Not bad. Beers very good over there. I haven't done October Fest over there, have you? In my house, we call it Rocktober. We get wild with the cowherd rotto. Those games, I thought the Germany game was great.

I think the NFL's done a great job of this international stuff. Baseball is weird. They go over to Japan. Nobody wants to go. It's too far. It's like, I never understood that. Like, that's way too far. If you live on the East Coast, it's a six-hour flight.

So is San Diego or so is L.A. So, I don't know. I think the NFL's international game plan is really strong. And increasingly, when you watch those games, Europeans are into it. Like, really into it. Of course. I mean, we love our game.

soccer now increasingly. They like their pro football. We love our football. Yeah. J-Mack with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The herd-line news. Speaking of that, I'm going to retire over there in Zurich. I started a series last night. Lockness on Acorn,

which is the British Channel. It's the best streaming service. Nobody watches that apparently in America. It's the back... Acorn. Acorn? Oh, it's fantastic. It's British. So all the actors look like us. They've got bad teeth and splotchy skin. Bad teeth. I've never had Braces, bro. What are you talking about that? I'm just saying they look like regular people.

Oh. Nobody looks like Ryan Gossel. I love watching regular people on television. I want to watch hot people. That's what I like. Attractive people. Right. Isn't that what? Why have you started a White Lotus? I'm not into that stuff. It's popular. I like the stuff. Garage bands under the radar, locked Nass on Acorn. Garage bands under the radar. Well, I mean, I like, you had the best line of the day, though. I like hot people. Not me. I like splotchy skin. I like receding hairlines. That's all you. That's all me, buddy. Hour three coming out. Another podcast from some SNL, late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel

and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. honest. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, what's good, y'all? You're listening to Learn the Hard Way with your favorite therapist and host, Kear Games. This space is about black men's experiences, having honest conversations that it's really not safe to

have anywhere, but you're having them with a licensed professional who knows what he's doing. How many men carry a suit or armor? It signals to the world that you're not to be played with. And just because you have the capability that does not mean that you need to. Listen to learn the hard way on the IHard radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. This is an IHart podcast. Guaranteed human.