The Herd with Colin Cowherd - The Herd - Hour 2 - Game 4 of the NBA Finals

Episode Date: June 9, 2023

NBA reporter Dan Woike joins the show in studio to breakdown the NBA Finals between the Nuggets and the HeatSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Here we go. It's a Friday hour number two live in Los Angeles. It's the herd wherever you may be and however you may be listening. Thanks for Megan Us part of your day. By the way, I said this earlier. Little East Coast bias with ESPN putting the jets above the Niners in their core rankings. And I said this.

I don't know why I was doing this. I have no idea why. But I checked the other day you were surprised when I knew. the baseball during the commercial we were started asking me about baseball standings and i knew all the baseball standings because i that's my old school i don't talk about it on the air but i'm always update i'm always watching batting averages attendance and baseball and so like the mets are just not that popular in their own division they have the third best attendants they're they're they're basically like the angels and the angels were in an old outdated stadium down in orange county the new york

Metz in the biggest city in North America in a stacked roster with stars in a nice, fairly recent stadium. Highest payroll. Highest payroll are like 10, I don't, somewhere, they average like 31,000 a game. When you say, well, there are stadium smaller. The Dodgers Stadium is bigger, but the Dodgers sell more tickets per capacity because the Dodgers Stadium is big, but they get 48,000 a night. Yeah.

So it's impossible to get in and out of. Do you want to know why, by the way, for the audience, I asked Colin. randomly during a commercial break, can you name any of three division leaders in baseball? And he got, I think, five or six. Yeah. It all spawned. Some guys sent me a tweet,

are you guys going to talk about this prospect from the Reds who just got called up? And he wrote the guy's name down. I'd never heard of the dude. So I googled him. Apparently, he's a major superstar. Yeah. He homered in, like, his second game.

Yeah. And that's why I started thinking I should ask Colin about baseball because I could name the division leaders right now. I mean, it's June, you know? I can name, I think, American League, East right now is, you know the order of that. I'm like, well, yeah, but that's because I'm old school. I grew up with newspapers, looking at the batting averages. So attendance is a funny thing. Like the Dodgers are so far ahead of the entire sport in attendance. They average 47,000 a home game.

Now, you say all their stadium's big. Yeah, okay. But city fields, 42,000 capacity. Mets get 31. You can't even fill a smaller stadium. So you look ridiculous in a huge stadium. So my point is I mean, I like ESPN, right? They were fine. But there is a bias and an East Coast bias. When I was there, I remember specifically, they were taught, there was a college football promo on. And they said, the Seminoles from Gainesville.

And I'm like, no, that's Tallahassee. Gainesville's the Gators. Nobody in the building, it ran for like two days. And I heard it. And I'm like, guys, you got to get the towns right. You just lost all credibility. So, you know, you have a bunch of people that are Yankee Jet fans. Jets get way more love.

Now, on this show, I'm tracking. But they get way more luck. Okay, I want to do this before we go to our guest. So I saw this headline by Sports Illustrated. It was like Sports Illustrated. You were the Bible. The Bible's supposed to be right. Sports Illustrated headline, it's time to admit Jamal Murray's a superstar.

Two words. Good hell. Messy, Steph, LeBron Mahomes. Jamal Murray has 1.1 million Instagram followers. Lonzo Ball has 17 million. The Angelo ball has three. Superstar equals popularity, not just production. Star equals high production in your sport.

Devin Booker's a star. Jalen Brown's a star, an all-star. They're very productive, very good players in their sport. Christian Yellich in baseball, Brewers, that's a star. Superstar is production, endorsements, popularity titles. You get mobbed at the mall. You've got multiple. Travis, Kelsey, maybe, or Patrick Mahomes, multiple national commercials, 10 million plus, 15 million plus on Instagram. People freak out when they see you. John Elway is bigger today in Denver than Jamal Murray.

John Elway hasn't played in like 20 years. When did John Elway play last? So star equals production. Superstar is production plus titles, plus popularity, plus endorsements, plus people freaking out. in a mall. TV networks literally build around you without mentioning the team. Shack and Kobe coming to town. Don't even have to mention the Lakers. We see the jersey. So there's a big gap between star. There's a lot of stars. Taylor Swift is a superstar. Taylor Swift is bigger than anybody in America in sports by a mile. She's a thousand times bigger than Patrick Mahomes. If Taylor Swift pulled up to this studio and Mahomes did

and there were a thousand people 900 would surround Taylor Swift. Taylor Swift or LeBron. Taylor Swift? It's closer though. Closer Taylor Swift easily. I have walked by... Taylor Swift or messy.

Globally messy. Yeah. But Taylor Swift is, I'm sure she does stuff abroad. I'm going to say it for the third time. I cannot get tickets to our concert here at SoFi. Somebody help your boy. But I think sports, fans struggle with that.

Because sports fans think, well, I like my sport. Like hockey fans always like this. Everybody I know likes hockey. Well, you're drinking too much. You're probably hanging around hockey guy. You go to the games. You go to the message board. Like golf guy tends to think everybody loves golf.

Not really. Three million people start every year and three million people quit. Golf is hard. It's really, really hard. I've started golf a thousand times and I've quit it a thousand times. And now I've played in frequently. It's hard. You have to be dedicated.

So sports fans tend to think, my mom didn't know who Derek Jeter was. She knew who Ken Griffey was. Ken Griffey had national spots. Jeter was doing local commercials for Ford. That's the difference. A. Rod was a superstar. Griffey and his peak briefly was a superstar. My mom, who watches all the time, she doesn't know who Jamal Maria is.

There's no way. No chance. I don't think she knows who Yokic is. Well, Yokic is not a superstar yet. He's a star. Now, if he was, Shaq was a superstar. LeBron. But Shaq was also embraced it.

Jack was highly verbal. He's very funny. He's animate. Charles Barkley, by the way, is one of the only sports TV superstars. Like, I mean, Barclay literally moves a TV rating. I know you have a thing with Barclay. He's a star. You and Barclay have a... He's so overrated.

He literally moves the needle. Entertainment, that's all. Well, what's wrong with that? What are you and I? Entertainment. He doesn't have any analysis. Any at all. It is horrible.

Everything he says is way off. If he picks the heat tonight, just run and put your house on the nuggets. Like, honestly. Come on. And I like the guy. He's entertainment. But in terms of basketball analysis. Sounds like you love him.

Sounds like you're really good friends. You bad mouth for eight minutes. Can you get him on the couch? I don't want to get thrown through a window like he does to other people. Oh, good God. I'd hate to hear you talk about people you don't like. You roast Barkley. I like Barclay.

He's a wildly entertaining. Indeed. And by the way, I don't want my guys on TV giving me too deep analysis. I'm not interested in that. I'll listen to your podcast for that. Zach Lowe can give me analytics. So are you watching, or Barclay's, what is that new show that he started on CNN? Are you watch?

Oh. I'll probably watch one of them. Oh, okay. But I would watch, I would watch Kenny, Shaq, Charles, and Ernie. Ernie's great. I would watch those guys over a regular season game. I could give a rip about the game. I'll watch them.

I have gotten on my treadmill, watch the pregame show, turn the game off, come back at halftime, go back outside with my wife and have a call. I'm a means to an end guy, and, you know, I do like gambling, and I like winning money in gambling. They're not ever offering you anything that's actionable. They're not paid to do that. So that's why I'm not, like, I enjoy the show, but I'm not like, oh, this is the greatest thing ever. I'd rather watch this than Anthony Edwards versus Luca Donchich. No, I would.

I would not. In February, I would. I'd rather watch Luca Donchich in practice than I would inside the NBA. Oh, I thought Barclay was your friend. I like him. I didn't say friend. You're a lighten the guy in fire. Let's bring in Dan Wojke, our buddy L.A. Times, Lakers, beat, writer, among other responsibilities.

Do you like him? I hope you like him more than you like Barclay. Roasting him. Good analysis from Dan. Okay, so we were talking about this. Baseball attendance? I'm sorry, I'm a loser. Okay, so there's three players in history that are hard to quantify.

Yep. You're like, I love Bob Coosy. That's not the way it works. LeBron was positionless. I'm going to guard Derek Rose. I'm going to guard a four. Yokic has sort of become that, hasn't he? Yeah.

I mean, I tweeted something about this the other day after kind of listening to some Yokic discussions on television and stuff like that. And people really struggle, I think, to talk about him because there's no historical comp. and when we have these conversations about players, usually like we lean on these historical comps as a crutch. Like you can say, even with LeBron,

for instance, right? Like, at least with LeBron, like you could point to George's magnetism, Kobe's proficiency and stuff like that. And LeBron is a totally different player, but you could look at like best player in the league,

like type of, there's a straighter line drawn between those three guys. I mean, I don't, if we're going to have like a real honest discussion about what Nicco is, Kola Yokich is doing on the court, I mean, you start pulling some wild names and you start mixing them together, right? It's like, okay, so there's some Bill Walton passing, but better. Moses Malone's size and rebounding maybe, you know.

Vita Sabonis, Sirbonus, Dirk's touch. You know, you start adding all of these guys. I mean, like he runs the fast break, like kind of like Magic Johnson. Right. So it's really hard to have a straightforwards like this is who this player is because we have not seen players who play like this. This is completely unique. I was at an event earlier this week and we were talking to Kareem Abduljabbar and Yokic's name came up and it was sort of like had you know he was just basically like no one approached the game at the center position the way Nikola Yokic did when I played like I mean he's completely foreign it is like basically like going to the 1920s and giving someone an iPhone and like their head would explode. You know, like I have access to all the

information in the world. Like this is a guy who can do everything on offense. You know, he's, he looks like he should be slow, but somehow he's the fastest guy down the court. Like he throws every pass. He makes every shot. You know, like he has an, as the kids would say, an unlimited bag, right? Like he, like the skill set is insane. Yeah. And, you know, he's on his way to having a championship, which is like the ultimate validation. And like, you know, If he gets that, that'll make it a little bit easier. But I mean, when we start talking about kind of what he's done over these past three years, it's you look at the efficiency, you look at the counting stats, you look at the winning,

generally, too, in the regular season, it's pretty unmatched. Well, our staff put this up earlier, because assists now mean more than they did 15 years ago, because they can become three, he's not two. Points created. Points created. Yokic, he's not double Shaq, and Shaq was certainly valuable. he is a mile ahead of all timers, Duncan and check, he's worth 54 points a game. And people say, well, he's not as good defensively.

For the record, Duncan was great defensively, so is he honest. But it is an 80, 20, 70, 30 offensive league. Sure. And I think, you know, I do think that his defense is probably, like, you can focus on the things he can't do, right? Like you wouldn't put him in a switch on a pick and roll the same way you would, Bamadabio or Anthony Davis or some of these guys who are like these total, you know, Swiss Army knives on defense. But one thing Nicola Yolkich is, is gigantic. And you watch him and the way his strength and the way he like holds his ground around the rim. It gave Anthony

Davis real problems in the conference finals. And like he's got great hands. He deflects passes. You know, he's a really smart player. I think like him being terrible on defense is pretty overstated. I think it's more, again, like, yes, he has shortcomings on that end of the basketball, but I think he maximizes what he has. Also, the Warriors have always done a good job to insulate Steph's weaknesses with Clay Thompson, Raymond. The length of the nuggets, Gordon and Porter, masks some of the deficiencies of Yokic. They're just so damn long.

They've volleyball stuff out. And I think over time, like Yokic too, Steph's defense, totally overstated. Like, like, he tries. Yeah, he got better on that side of the ball. You know, using his smarts, using his, you know, increased strength. I mean, you know, he's still a very slight person. But, like, you look at before and after pictures, basically, from Steph's third year to now. I mean, he looks like Schwarzenegger compared to what he used to look like.

And I think, like, you know, Yokic, again, similarly, is trimmed down. He's changed his body. There was a lot of pudding there three years ago. Probably some, you know, some Serbian delicacy, I'm sure. But, like, you know, I think, like, he's now, though, a guy, like, who understands exactly, like, what his limitations are, and he's figured out ways to maximize what he can do. And I think, you know, when you're talking about great players, I mean, that's, he checks the biggest boxes, right? He makes his teammates better, which is, I think, when you're talking about the tippy, tippy, tip-y-top guys, because that's the difference between being winner and up. That's being winner and LeBron and Bill Russell.

and stuff, yeah. You make the world easier for those around you. He's as good as anybody in the league right now at that. And then you look at just the actual, I mean, like, you can look at the stats. I love what he said about statistics, though, the other day where it's just basically like, they're just numbers. Like, just use your eyes and watch him. Like, he's a magician. Like, he is just like, you watch him and you're like, how did he do that?

I said the other day, if you never seen bird, you'd be like, okay, he's not bird, but he does bird-like things. Sure. His touch passing, his vision. He's 70 pounds more than Larry Bird. Like that's like the thing too. He's like Larry Bird of Larry Bird was just like a big giant octopus. Like I mean like he with these crazy long arms and like the balls attached to his hands. I mean like my friend Scott Cassiola at the New York Times once wrote a story about Yokic and his water polo past.

And like, you know, because that's a huge sport in Serbia and stuff like that. And like he throws these water polo passes like where he gets a rebound and with just one hand like cocks a ballback and just whips it. We saw it the other day. Yeah, and it's it's unmatched. You know, so I want to throw something at you. I'll get to Chris Paul to the Lakers in the second, but I want to ask you something because I think the three best cultures in sports over the last 15 years have been the Patriots, the Warriors and Spurs in terms of pro sports. I got championships. I get defiant coaches. They were ahead of the curve. The heat on the edge there? On the edge, but not enough championships quite. LeBron's kind of, you know, brings those

to you. But New England, before Tom left, he had voiced concern on television and to those close. The team was too culture oriented and slow. The game was changing. Bill's culture was suffocating reality. Stop drafting guards and kickers. Get fast. We've seen what's happened when Tom left. It would be nice to have a running back every once in a while. Yes. Greg Popovich. Their 30th and three-point shooting since 2015. Your culture's great. Get shooters. So Coach K and Saban, both iconic collegiate coaches, moved a little out of their culture. They maintained a culture. But Coach K said, we're going to be a one-and-one program.

That was a real shift. Remember, for years, they wouldn't hang your banner if you didn't graduate. Yeah. Mike changed his culture. Still maintained high principle. Nick Saban, when they first got to Bama, it was linebackers and corners. And then it became quarterbacks and receivers. He spread the offense out.

the tempo was faster. They played a different game. Lane Kiffin got in his ear, Sabin smart enough. So I look at the Warriors, and I see this headline today. Number one thing in the off-season is to rebuild that culture. No, it's not. It's to get bigger. It's to not resign clay.

They're doing a New England, and they're doing a San Antonio, which is the culture starts suffocating all this sports stuff. The only reason the Miami culture means Bukas is Jimmy Butler's great. if he's off that team, you're not a playoff team. Culture matters, but athleticism, twitching size. I think culture, it matters, but not in like the all-capital letter way. We kind of project it, right? Like, obviously, right?

Like, talent is the most important thing. Like, you want to see a good coach, give them good players. Right. Right? You want to see a good coach that struggles, give him bad players. Pop. Yeah. I mean, that is what it is.

And I think, you know, Popovich has shown, like, and if you track back, pre-2015, like they did change styles, you know, from like the more Robinson, Duncan-focused teams to more Tony Parker, more Kauai Leonard towards the end. And they did switch things up. I do think, though, so I was texting with an executive this morning about this very same thing, which is sort of this idea of when do you, when do you move off a path? If you are on a path, right? Right. Like, you don't want to be sentimental for sure. Thank you. But you also don't want to fix. what isn't as broken as maybe it is as you think. Okay, so how broken are the warriors?

I mean, that's a really good question. They're getting really old. I think they're definitely getting old. There will be a moment in which, you know, they are, they are not a credible contender. But I don't know. I think like sprinting into rebuilds are, rebuilds stink. Like, they are painful. I'm from Chicago.

Like, that, the joy. Ford and rebuild that the Jerry Krause sprinted into lasted a decade. Like, it's not a fun time. And they have stars. They do have an established culture for sure. But, you know, they have won different ways, right? Like last year, that team looked very different than, you know, the Kevin Durant version of the Warriors, which looked very different than the pre-Cevind

of the Warriors. So I trust them to be able to sort of massage what they have. They do have to change. They can't be exactly the same. they've been limited by, and they will continue to be limited by, you know, you miss on some, you know, Steve Kerr caught a little flack for this, but like you miss on some picks, like you don't establish the same depth and have the same role players. Yeah, you know, but I mean, look, I think the bet like that maybe Moses Moody is a better player,

that maybe they'll figure something out with Cominga. And if not, they can use those players to augment what they have. I think you have the most important thing in the NBA, which is you have a transcendent player and Stefan Curry. And a really smart coach. You have a good coach and you have players that know each other. I think there's value in that. I think sometimes culture is, if you view it rigidly, it can hold you back.

If a good culture, though, is flexible. And the reason why I mentioned the Miami Heat is like, you know, like the backbone of their culture is that if we bring you here, we believe in you. We don't care if you played at Lewis University like Max Drew's did. Like, we don't care. You know, like, Duncan Robinson played at a division three before we went to Michigan. We don't care about that stuff. We don't care if you were undrafted. We don't care if you were a top five pick.

Like, you are going to fit what we do, and we're going to make it work, and we're going to find what you do best, and we're going to bend to that. You know, like every coach, I mean, you think Pat Riley, at his core, wants to see Duncan Robinson running around shooting contested threes. Like, Pat Riley is a super tough-nosed player, coached a super tough-nosed team. in New York. That was more of who he is. What good cultures do is they allow people to express themselves, to be themselves in their craft, and you open your arms to that. So Chris Paul to the Lakers, I've said earlier, I've been very lucky. I've worked for good companies.

Any time a company stumbled or I had questions about the direction, there was always one thing I asked. Who's making the decisions now? Warriors, Heat, Kansas City Chiefs. Eagles, Howie Roseman, I know exactly how he's running that franchise. Nick Seriani's coaching it. When you get into trouble, it's who's running the franchise? Chris Paul to the Laker rumors feels like LeBron would be running the franchise. I think Chris Paul and LeBron similarly. The Celtics two best players are young, prime, 70 games, big minutes.

They can handle some age. but when your two best players are AD and LeBron, the worst thing is, here's another guy that plays 48 nights, and by the way, he'll be on the IR three times. Chris Paul to me doesn't work with the Lakers. I think any decision,

and I wrote about this a little bit in our Lakers newsletter this week, any decision that a team makes is, I think in a vacuum, like a lot of what you're saying makes total sense. I think, though, but if you look at cost, if you look at role acceptance and like the opportunity that Chris Ball would have and what he'd

be willing to do, I think it starts to make more sense if his vision is aligned with yours. If he is signing with the Lakers to be a 30 minute a game player, the starting point guard, the guy who pulls all the strings. Where's Austin Reeves go? Well, I mean, Austin has played off the ball. But what I would say, like, generally speaking, is if that is what he is signing up for, you're setting yourself up for failure. Like, they just went through a version of this in terms of.

of you with Russell Westbrook where they were spending 47 million dollars on a player that wasn't giving them 47 million dollars of production um if you're paying chris paul the minimum like why not like i to me that i i view chris chris likes money he does like money and he's going to get you know he's going to if he gets waived he's going to get 15 million dollars of his contract and it'll but but i mean that if he wants to go win none of these teams that are close to winning have 20 million dollars to hand chris ball like they don't have it they have either the mid-level exception the mini mid-mid exception of the veterans minimum. Like that is going to be, those are his, going to be his contract options.

And I think, and certainly I think there is a cost in which Chris Paul makes sense. You can look at, you know, sort of this notion of like a part-time, like you mentioned 45 games or whatever. If they're the right 45 games, it's not an issue. If they're the wrong 45 games. But you also get into a Brooklyn situation where those three guys never played together, you get to the playoffs, they play at 11 games, and you're like, yeah, our chemistry stinks. The reason, like the reason Miami is winning down.

I don't think it's a horrible. Just on the record, I don't think it's a horrible idea. I think it is something that if you were paying him an unrestricted free agency and you were like sitting down ready to offer him a $60 million contract over two years, I would say that's a bad idea. It's a horrible idea. I think at, there is a price point here where you can benefit from the fact that the sons are paying him. chunk of money, that he wants to win, that he obviously loves Los Angeles, has his family

is still here and stuff like that. And you have Austin Reeves play off the ball. And you have other guys. Well, I mean, if he's going to miss all these games, like I think and ideally play a more limited role as you try to save him, you should have enough guys, whether it's Austin Reeves. It's not Chris Paul or. I think it's Chris Paul and at the minimum, right? It's Chris Paul and you can re-sign DeAngelo. It's Chris Paul and Austin Reeves. It's Chris Paul and Rory Hotchamur. And you would have all of these guys and you have this other. guy sort of just waiting for the moment. Now the question becomes, is he, is he going to accept that and will he stay in a good enough rhythm? I think you can look at like Miami with Kyle Laurie and they've

reduced his role, right? All-Star player, they don't have a ball handler. They pay him. They pay him 40 plus million or you're, I'm sorry, not 40 plus like 25 million, I think, you know, but they've used him in more of a hybrid sort of role. But I would argue this. Bam and Butler do not initiate offense. LeBron and Austin Reeves do. I've already got that. Chris Paul has been off the ball three of the last four years. Like really, like, I mean, he played off the ball with James Hardin. He's become a much better catch-and-shoe player.

He had a really bad shooting season two years ago. Shot the ball pretty well this year. And I think, like, I feel like I'm caping for him right now. But again, I think, like, there is a cost point here where the risk is so low and the upside is high that it makes sense to do. I think certainly his relationship with LeBron James is a factor in all of these things. Like, right? Like they're part of the famous banana boat crew and stuff like that.

But I think if you can have him on the floor and you expect less of him, you can lessen his burden that you provide him, you know, instead of looking at Austin Reeves and D. Russell's hindrances to that. These are things that if Chris Ball is willing. They're like I was going to say. I think there are people in the organization who still view value there. I think, and it's, again, it's D-Lo or what, too, right?

So I just, I think it's, you sound like Jason talking about Charles Barkley. I think that the thing will be, you know, again, Chris Paul could be one of the, I had him to say this, an insurance policy. I feel like he just got to check from State Farm when I said that. All right, let's segue out of this. Okay, finally. First time I think Dame's considering moving. Yep.

Butler, Bam, Dame feels like the best team in the East. It makes sense they have players that they could give. Sure. They have, I mean, they've got draft picks. They've got players. Chance, and by the way, Chris Hayne said yesterday is like, yeah, first time I've heard somebody say, it's a possibility. You buy it.

Yeah, I do. I mean, I think that, you know, they're at an interesting fork in the road, right? And, I mean, I think the, if you believe in Scoot Henderson, right? and I think a lot of people do. You have to ask yourself, if you're Portland, like, what's best for this franchise? Is it placating a star who's been incredibly loyal, been incredibly valuable? Yeah, but, you know, a guy who is taking you to a conference finals once,

but, like, really is limited defensively or whatever and needs more help, right? Like, I don't think the three-pick gets them the kind of help that they need to get to the level they want to go. No. So it's probably best for their franchise to draft Scoot Henderson. And then it becomes, well, what's best for Damien Lillard? Like, what does he want to do? Does he want to be a part of, by the way, I believe Scoot Henderson, Damien Lillard, Anthony Simons can play together certainly over the course of the season. But he's a rookie. He's a rookie, yeah, he's not going to totally move the needle

for you in that way. But if Dame wants to move on, I mean, like, this seems like a window in which to do it. It also kind of feels like a time when, you know, the stars that are going to be kind of out there in trade rumors. Like it's not a super robust market. That kind of felt like it was more last summer. Donovan Mitchell, Rudy Gobert, like the jazz blow up and stuff like that. I think, you know, Kevin Durant got traded already. James Hardin has been moved already.

Like, and seems like that's a two-way street between Philly and Houston. Like, there is maybe a really opportunity here for Portland to recoup good value. Yeah. And to move forward at a logical starting point with, you know, the future face of your franchise. It should day one out. Dan Wookie, good stuff. Thank you. Want more Herd?

The Herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart Radio app. Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year.

Within probably 10 days, I'd put it. on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media.

Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brain. a new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast.

I'm Sam Jek. And I'm Alex English. episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84's big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack, so I'm starting to see that there's a through line.

We also have AIDS on the table right now, so. Then you're finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

It is good to have you in into your first year. Discover Card automatically doubles all the cashback you've earned. Check it out. Discover.com slash match J-Mack with the news. No, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Dude, I just spent the commercial break.

Some nerdy guy pulled all these clips of how the Nuggets tweak their attack against the heat zone. It's awesome. I'll send it to you. Really cool. Michael Malone is a genius. All right, let's go to the NFL. We're going to talk about the New York football jets who you're trying to slander because of a certain company in the Northeast. So Rogers goes to the Jets.

They've got a great core now. They're a Super Bowl contender. That's right. That's right. And they're building chemistry. Defensive tackle, Solomon Thomas, said the team feels the excitement that came with their new quarterback. The room is buzzing right now.

The building's buzzing. And it's buzzing for a reason. You bring a solidified Hall of Fame like Aaron Rogers, and it's going to change some things. It's exciting. Bottom line. The building is buzzing. Now, the latest battle today is the Jets are,

they don't want to be on hard knocks. They're eligible to be on it, but they're lobbying hard. Now, who else is eligible? There's four other teams, I guess, that are in the mix. The Bears are one of them. Maybe they go for Justin Fields. I don't like, I don't think. Saints and Commanders are the other ones.

Oh, God, who'd want to? Well, Derek Carr, a lot of newness. Commanders, there's nothing there. Let me tell you something. This is one of the things about the NFL. You make enough money. Can we stop the hard-knock stuff? That's a good point.

I mean, you make enough money. By the way, I didn't even watch last year's version of much. I haven't watched in a couple years. It's intrusive, you know, and you don't need that. And also, it's repetitive. I thought the Baker year Cleveland was kind of interesting. Remember that? But I mean, in the end, it's like, I mean, it's nothing against the NFL network,

but I can get so much NFL talk not on the NFL network. I don't watch the NFL network. There's nothing against the people. There's so much information on the NFL, hard knocks. I don't feel like I'm getting that much special, that much behind the scenes, because I already get so much information behind the scenes on the NFL. So I don't, what's the point? All you're doing is ruin somebody's season.

These coaches are getting, fired. These coordinators getting fired nonstop. You're adding a leg. What if literally this company had another camera crew taping our show and we had to act to it and play? If you put a camera in a room, people act to it. I would have probably been fired already for some of the discussions we've every time you have one of these families, these couples that do one of these shows, they always get divorced. Oh yeah. Or it unravels the family. Like, why are you hurting your product? Why are you? How about the CNN guy who let a reporter follow him around for like, four months. Chris Lick.

Yeah. What in the God's name was he doing? I don't know. This massive profile of everything he said. He said a lot of things that he shouldn't have said. He let a reporter follow him for three months. I wouldn't let one in my kitchen. What was he doing?

I don't know. Less is more, baby. Next up, Denver Broncos. I think they're like one of your top five teams. They have signed former Chiefs defensive end, Frank Clark. My first question was, how can they afford this? I thought the Broncos were cash strapped. And they've been some interesting moves this offseason.

Yeah, but I think Russell Wilson's contract really gets surly. It really gets punitive. I think it's next year. So Clark, one-year deal up to $7.5 million, five and a half guaranteed. Clark spent the last four seasons in KC, two Super Bowls, a bunch of sacks. Interesting that they, Sean Payton stole the backup quarterback from the Raiders in the division, and now he's stealing a defensive end in the division. I kind of like these moves from Peyton.

I do. I think their roster, right at the rivals. I think their roster right now, because they were such a mess last year, I think Denver's got the most underrated roster in the league. It might, like, for instance, it's a significantly to me better roster than the Packers, and I like Green Bay's roster. But I think there's more speed here. I think there's more elite. I think there's, I think they're just, I think this is a really, really top six roster in the league.

I know we've spent some time devaluing running back to maybe more than you, but this Giovante Williams injury is going to be significant. Like if he's not able to come back for like the first five or six games, there's some concern that he's not going to be ready. But he's a thousand-yard guy. I mean, he's a very dynamic. Like you need that. I'll say I went to a couple games last year, NFL games.

I think Patrick Sertan was the most impressive physical dude I saw. He is just huge, shut down the entire half of the field against the Chargers. He's one of the best quarterbacks in the league. Yeah, he's a awesome player. Final story. Big Ten is transitioning to a new season. schedule with the additions of UCLA and USC in 2024. There will be no divisions.

Each team will play every other conference opponent at least twice, once at home and once away every four years. Conference opponents for the Bruins and Trojans were announced Thursday. Here's the breakdown, Cowherd. Yeah, boy, that big ten is tough. I sure hope USC can overcome Maryland. Purdue. UCLA now has to travel to Rutgers,

That's cross-country. So what? Michigan, middle of the country. These are much longer road trips than they're used to. Yeah, but Michigan and Ohio State, I'm worried about their players, not the plane. USC has to go all the way to Happy Valley. Hopefully they won't have to go back to Maryland immediately. Listen, we talk about this in the NFL.

It doesn't mean anything. Oh, stop it. These West Coast trips and the travel, that matters in the NFL, man. So because UCLA is joining the conference with them, USC is going to have four road games per year, Four. Now think about this. Everybody's like, oh, the weather. So the last Big Ten game, Ohio State Michigan's played about Thanksgiving. That's the last one. So you figure outside out of conference games, USC and UCLA's schedules for the Big Ten will start late September, all the way through October. You don't get snow in the Midwest until like later, let's just say November 15th. So over the course of four, five, six, six,

seven weeks. You're going to play three or four road. Remember, USC's always going to end playing UCLA. That's going to be their last conference game. So the latest USC would ever go to a snowy place or UCLA would go to a snowy place is like November 17th. That's the only

time you'd fight. It could snow in November and Happy Valley, no? No, no, I'm saying November 17th, not November 1. So, I mean, there's a chance you're going to play. And by the way, the way the schedule works, USC, UC, and in LA. So there is a chance

that you're going to play a snow game. If you have better players, you're going to win it. Okay. I mean, how many big 10 games do you watch? Maybe, I would say, everybody plays about two games in like really windy cold weather.

Define windy cold. Are we talking like in the 20s? That's a cold game for UCLA. How many games at Ohio State play? And Ohio's got crappy weather. How many games at Ohio State play last year in under 32 degrees? One?

a few. So remember, USC and UCLA's last game is always against each other. So you're out of that window. The latest you can play is like the third week in November. Yes, you may get snow then. You don't get it in November. We make it sound like Wisconsin is Alaska. The Dells, the Wisconsin Dells, beautiful.

Not a mall. J. Mack with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd Lie News. Simply Safe doesn't rest on its. Flores, always innovating, a new 2-1 smoke and CO detector right now 20% off. SimplySafe, collin.com. No safe like Simpliceaf.

Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. Hey, it's me, Rob Parker. Check out my weekly MLB podcast inside the Parker for 22 minutes of pipe and hot baseball talk, featuring the biggest names and newsmakers in the sport. Whether you believe in analytics or the I-Test, we've got all the bases covered. New episodes drop every Thursday, so do yourself a favor and listen to Inside the Parker with Rob Parker on the IHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcast. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged.

It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it. all embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators,

and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you

get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to? Do a little kill. Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English.

Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS. on the table right now.

Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We are just one day away from the 2003 Belmont Stakes. National Treasure is one of the horses to watch following his win at the Preakness.

Now they'll try to go back to back. He takes on a loaded field, including the favorite, Forte, who was the favorite at the Kentucky Derby, and then got scratched the morning of the race. The 2003 Belmont Stakes coverage begins Saturday at Four Eastern on Fights. By the way, I thought this was interesting. Carolina Panthers have named Bryce Young as their starting quarterback already. They're not going to waste any time on anybody else getting the number one snap. So the Steelers, defensive coach, couldn't figure out when to play.

play Tribisky, Kenny Pickett, a conservative defensive coach. The Bears couldn't figure out. Andy Dalton, Justin Fields, Brian Flores, defensive coach with Tua, starting him, pulling him, getting bench, starting Ryan Fitzpatrick. So a lot of these defensive coaches, I mean, John Harbaugh, special teams leans defense, he couldn't struggle. You know, he stayed with Flacco a while on that. And when do we not play Flacco and play Lamar?

The defensive guys, I think, struggle with us. Now, Matt Nagy was the one that struggled with the Andy Dalton, Justin Fields thing. I think Matt Nagy wanted to play Justin Fields, but I think people upstairs had made a promise to Andy Dalton. And so I think Matt Nagy was an offensive guy. He wanted to play Justin Fields. I think he got trapped because they made promises to Andy Dalton. And so here, the offensive coach, by the way, it's – and I'm not saying offensive coaches haven't made this mistake. But I think Frank Reich's an offensive coach.

He gets offense. He hears it. He feels it. He plays it. He's not tone deaf to it. Just give the guy all the snaps and go. You're not a Super Bowl team, so it doesn't matter. Now, now, if you have a really high-end quarterback, like Alex Smith had made a Pro Bowl in Kansas

City, and you want to showcase him, you want to show it off, you've got some inertia, some momentum in the franchise, you can play him for a year and then go to Mahomes. That I get. But it's like the whole Brian Flores-2 thing for Ryan Fitzpatrick, you screwed up his development. I mean, the Chargers at one point, they started Tyrod Taylor for a week. It's like, if you're not a Super Bowl team, play Kenny Pickett. Now, I think Pittsburgh maybe thinks, oh, we're going to be really special. Now with Trabisky.

So I think this is the way to do it. Just play the young guy. And again, I used to be one of those. Let the young guy sit. For years and years, I was always like, ideally they said. But the world's changed. These kids come out, I mean, Bryce Young was a three-year starter in high school at a legendary Southern California program that feels like a college program.

It's got like 20 Division I players, right? Like it's, he played at a high, high, high, high end high school program in SoCal, starter. He goes to the SEC and Nick Saban, two-year starter. He's ready to play. He's ready to play. I know Joe Burrow, by the way, ready to play was a little overwhelmed, had some real clunkers. Mac Jones, ready to play, had some real clunkers.

I think it benefited both. I think Mac Jones issue was Matt Burrow. Patricia, and I think Joe Burrough's issue was a horrendous offensive line. But by and large, Mack Jones' rookie year, he was ready to play. They gave him protection. He was ready to play. Joe Burrow had star receivers. He was ready to play.

Bryce Young's ready to play. I don't think he's a guy that lasts 10 years anyway. I don't think his body has built to play 10 years in the league. Get him in there. Don't waste any practice game hits or exhibition game hits. Get him out there, get him playing, see the field, win games. I think sometimes Sean McDermott did not start. He started Nathan.

Peterman over Josh Allen, a defensive coach. What are we doing here? What are we doing? Just get Josh Allen on the field. Just get Justin Fields on the field. Get Bryce Young on the field. Get Justin Herbert on the field. Let's go.

You're not a Super Bowl team. It's okay. You're overwhelmed for a few weeks. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNLN. Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel

help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care which I'll say. Yep, that's me. Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media.

Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. On the Look Back at a podcast.

For 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84's big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex E. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it, with our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. It was a wild year. It was a wild year.

I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.