The Herd with Colin Cowherd - THE HERD - Hour 2 - New Herd Hierarchy, the Chiefs are back, Buffalo Bills might need to make a change, Nick Wright

Episode Date: October 14, 2025

Colin also unveils his updated Herd Hierarchy, with the Kansas City Chiefs reclaiming the No. 1 spot for the first time this NFL season. Plus, Nick Wright from First Things First joins the show to discuss the state of the Buffalo Bills and whether it’s time for a coaching change after another disappointing performance under Sean McDermottSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

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you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was harmed. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis come until he's like, you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the I Heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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Body by Jake Radio, where hope meets momentum. Search Body by Jake Radio and stream it for, Free. Have a great day. I heart radio. Here's something that should not be as complicated as it is, getting a racist statue removed. And here's something that should be a whole lot easier than it is, getting a new one put up in its place. I'm Akela Hughes, and Rebel Spirit Season 2 is about both of those things. As I was watching these statues come down, I was thinking about what it meant that I grew up in a majority black city,

in which there were more homages to enslavers than there were to enslave people. Listen to Rebel Spirit season two on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening to The Heard podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in noon to 3 Eastern, 9 a.m. to noon Pacific. Find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the IHeart Radio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. Or listening to Fox Sports Radio. Here we go. It's our two and a Tuesday. We are live. It's the herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening, thanks for making us part of your day. So we do the top 10 every week at this time. And there are these teams out there that I think are pretty good.

The Rams, the chargers, the bills. But I sit and I go through all the numbers. And I, again, this is not standing. I consider your health. Pooka Nakuwa, out for the Rams, that's not the same offense. You got running backs that fumble, you struggle with the Ravens. So I count what's your health like. I don't care what you did Sunday. What is your health like going forth? What do you do with San Francisco?

No Bosa, no Fred Warner from last year, no Hufunga, no Greenlaw? I mean, Robert Sala has limitations. So here we go, our herd hierarchy on this Tuesday. Heard hierarchy. Time is now, let's go. The top 10 NFL teams, according to college. Number 10. New England Patriots, easiest NFL schedule going forward.

This is not a mirage. Drake May Leads ranks top five in completion percentage, passing yards, big plays, and passer rating. He's getting better than average protection. He's got a running game. The kid moves well. Easy schedule. Well, 3-0 also, as J-MAC pointed out last week, since Christian Gonzalez, the cornerback has returned.

Three and O. Number nine. Number nine, the Steelers. Listen, they don't turn it over and they take it away. That does count as a good trait. They're taking the football away. Now, they're not facing great quarterbacks, but their only loss came to the Seahawks, a team that is better. They're the second-leased team, and they have a receiving core and a tight-end core

that looks like an NBA front line. It looks like the Dallas Mavericks. Everybody's six, six and up. So they are using some height advantages, some size advantages. They don't throw it down the field, but it's working Pittsburgh at nine. Number eight. I like the Colts. I think they have the second best offensive line in football to Detroit.

Few as sacks allowed in the NFL, Indianapolis. They are scoring on 62 and a half percent. of their drives. They also should have beaten the Rams. They have the number one scoring offense, leads the NFL in first downs. Again, Warren the rookie, Pittman, Jonathan Taylor, a top two or three offensive line. Daniel Jones this year, all you need to know, he's completing over 71% of his throws. I think they have a ceiling. I don't think they're a conference championship team yet. They may be this weekend. If they beat the Chargers, I may reassess, but I have the cold. at number eight.

Number seven. Green Bay. They're young and can't figure out how to put away inferior teams, but all three wins have come by 13 plus points. I like Jordan Love. He's more far than Aaron Rogers. He could get a little careless, but they're the best third down offense in the NFL,

and you can't run on them. They're the opposite of the bills. You can't run on them. So they're doing a little bit of takeaway this year, which they haven't historically done, crafts, an unbelievable tight end. I like this team a lot. They're very young, which concerns me.

The quarterbacks, the receivers, the tight end, really young. But Jeff Halfley's got that defense. Can't run on it, and they're taking it away, Green Bay at 7. Number 6. Well, Seattle was my surprise pick in the NFL this year, New England and Seattle. They lead the NFL in yards per play. That is a huge stat. and if you watch them, JSN is absolutely become a number one ride receiver in this league.

Sam Darnold, according to PFF, is the highest rated quarterback in the NFL. I think Baker would be my MVP, but they can run it, they can get you over the top, they throw to their tight ends, they are young and athletic defensively, and lead the league in yards per play. Vegas loves that number. Number five. 30th ranked offense. I mean, it's pretty simple.

When Jalen Hertz throws the ball 33 times plus, they're not good. When he throws it 25 times, they win. I do think they're eventually going to, to some degree, write the ship. But they've been outgained in every game this season. And they have had three or four of the worst halves in the league. 30 puns this year? Only Cleveland and the Bengals have more. So their personnel puts them at five, but I'm not sure they're five.

Let's see them play Minnesota. Let's see Minnesota off a vibe hosting Philadelphia. I may knock him out of the top 10 like I've done Buffalo. Number four. I think Detroit's good. I just think Kansas City is separated from the league. Four games with 34 plus points. Best offensive line.

They're doing something that the Lions haven't done, and I said this last week. A lot of sacks, a lot of takeaways. They have the hardest remaining schedule. Again, this is a really good football team. What Kansas City did to them, nobody else in the league, in my opinion, could. In fact, they play Tampa this week, and I think Detroit's going to win that game. And maybe comfortably, Detroit at 4. Number 3.

Colin, what are you doing putting Sean Payton at Denver at 3? Do you know they are the best in the league at protecting their quarterback and the best in the league at getting after yours? I think they're one of the few teams that actually can make Kansas City a little uncomfortable. High altitude for home games. I like their weapons. I don't think Bo Nix is playing particularly well. But you can't get to Bo Nix.

And I think he should run more. You can't get to him. And they get after your quarterback. So they have the number one ranked offensive line. Best third down defense. Best Red Zone defense. They don't have to be great at quarterback. They can play poorly and win like this past.

week, I have them at three. Number two. Tampa's 5 and 1. They could also be 2 and 4, but Baker Mayfield would be my MVP. They are playing without their number one receiver, their number 2 receiver, their number 3 receiver, their number 4 receiver. They're going to a D2 guy and Tess Johnson. No Bucky Irving. Baker Mayfield has accounted for 1700 yards.

Only Mahomes is accounted for more. I think they're resilient. I think they're tough. And they're doing it. I've always liked their GM. They are doing it right now with backups. I think Tampa's two. Number one.

But I don't think it's particularly close. I think Kansas City is with Rishi Rice coming back. He's not going to get 13 targets in his first week back. He'll probably get four to six. But Hollywood Brown, Juju Smith, Travis, worthy, O line, didn't even have their left tackle. There's a good football team. Suffocating defensively. I said when they beat the Ravens, I don't want to hear about injuries.

they physically stopped Lamar. Lamar was completely not only in his head, he didn't have any space. So next to the Colts, they have the second most efficient offense. They're not giving the ball away. I mean, to play Detroit did not have a penalty, not have a turnover in one punt. Detroit's good, really good. That's why I only dropped him to four. This is my herd hierarchy.

And with that, Nick Wright is now joining us live. I know you think Let me explain Denver. I know you don't think Denver's that good, but my takeaway is I'm looking at people

that can match up a little with Kansas City and their O-line and D-line pressure at least makes it interesting. I don't know if anybody else does, and I don't think I'm over the top. I think they've found Kansas City looks like

Kansas City three years ago. No, absolutely. And starting next week, Kansas City will have the best receiving core it has had since Tyree Kill was on the team. And for the first time in three years, Colin, Patrick trusts his offensive line. Yeah. Even last week, to your point, with a backup offensive left tackle, shout out Brett Veach,

who this summer signed Jalen Moore to be the starting left tackle. Then Josh Simmons falls to him in the draft. He's the starting left tackle. And last year after the Chiefs had four different left tackles, none of whom really could play the position except for their left guard. Joe Tuni who had to go over and play it, they now seem to have an excellent rookie and a really good swing tackle. And so I think the Chiefs are, you are correct there. I know this is a very difficult and sad day for JMAQ as the Chiefs are back where they deserve a top third hierarchy.

But I do think you, Colin, I want to talk about the Broncos. You're right because I agree with everything you said. Nick Benito might be the best defensive player in football at this very moment. The offensive line is excellent. I see Sean Payton scheming guys wide open three to five times a game, and then I see Bo Nix miss them by five yards. Can you, in the modern NFL, be the third best team in the league with a quarterback playing as poorly as Bo Nix is playing week in week out?

He has his moments like the fourth quarter a couple weeks ago against Philly where he was excellent. But on a down-to-down basis, he has not been good. And I don't think it's unfair to say, Colin, that if Denver were playing 29 of the other 32 teams this Sunday, past Sunday morning, they'd have lost that game. I think only the Jets and the Brian Callahan Titans find a way to lose it. So this past week didn't exactly raise my hopes about Denver, but the O-line is excellent, and the defense is spectacular, which is carrying them. So I watched the bills last night, and I'm going to throw this at you. I said, there was a moment, Mark Jackson was a good coach, but he was a good coach. You kind of felt like, boy, Steph Curry needs his conductor, and they get Steve Kerr.

And you're like, okay, this, this. So defense is easier to coach. You would argue that offense. There's a lot more movement. It has to be more choreographed on average, certainly in football. And so it worked. And I watched Sean McDermott. I'm like, he's fine.

Is he Mark Jackson? Because once again, because once you pay, as you know, once you pay the quarterback, you're not going to be great. You have to be able to turn Juju Smith-Schuster into a reliable target in Hollywood Brown into more than just a kind of a, talented guy and Andy Reid can do it. Andy can tweak. He's the engineer. He lifts the hood up. He can tweak. Sean McDermott feels like a really good supervisor. Are the Bill's issues really the coach? I think it's multifaceted. I think the defense isn't that good this year. I think that's

more probably on Bean than the coach. I think that the here's the tough part for me. Well, let me start with the coach. Then I'll get to Josh. all of NFL history, and I keep going back to this stat because I think it's instructive, every single coach quarterback combo that has ever won at least one Super Bowl together, won their first Super Bowl together within five years of being together. For McDermott and Allen, and by the way, Lamar and Harbaugh, this is year eight. no one else has taken this long to have it happen, and then it actually happened. So history tells us for either of those teams to get over the hump, they probably will need to at some point make a change.

And listen, I think Sean McDermott is under massive pressure. I think he's a good coach, and I think the Mark Jackson comp could be a good one. A good coach, but they've reached their limit there. With that said, and I think Josh Allen is pretty clearly the second best quarter of back in football and he's a great player and that MVP last year made him a future Hall of Famer. But he lives in a narrative space with the media that is so unique to me. I watched after week three when they beat the Dolphins and he played great, one of the most respected members of the national media say he plays the position better than anyone in the history

of the league. And last week, he turns the ball over three times and they lose scoring 14 points and you showed the key fourth down where he flips it like that. They have the ball three separate times in the fourth quarter of the chance to tie the game. And people seem hesitant to say, hey, Josh, the last two weeks got outplayed by Drake May and got outplayed by Michael Penning. That shouldn't happen. And so, like, I think he's the second best player in the league. I really do. But he's not beyond criticism.

I do think the bills have structural issues, but the biggest issue last night was with the offense, and that, to me, is more on Josh than anyone else. So last night. Yeah. So I want to talk about bears and go a little deep on this, is that if you look at through five games compared to last year, they're a touchdown a game better.

And that's a lot. Last year, seven of the 12 Bears' losses were one possession. So a touchdown is different. But their energy last night was incredible. But my takeaway in the Bears this year, they've just eliminated the ridiculous. Losing on a Hail Mary when your player is chatting with fans, losing as the clock runs out in Detroit, losing six to three, losing a game with a block kick. They just run the ball and don't turn it over.

That's so much of what – because I still think Jaden Daniels last night is more real. find more accurate and more consistent. Caleb was okay. But my takeaway is the bears have the talent to be really dangerous. Like I'm talking conference championship viable with their skill people and their pass rush. What Ben's really done is said, let's just get rid of the nonsense, run the ball and don't turn it over. I don't think the play calling is unbelievable. They just don't beat themselves is what I'm seeing. So yes, I agree with you. And listen, Listen, they have back to back 25, 24 wins by the skin of their teeth, one against a Raider team that isn't good, even though I thought it would be, and one against a commander team that I think is pretty good. And that's how thin the margins are in this league.

If they missed the field goal last night or missed the field goal again, or, you know, the Raiders drive down the field and beat them, we're talking, it's a totally different conversation around the Bears and they're probably not much worse or much better. They had to win last night. You can't win the turnover battle 3-0 in that spot and lose that game. And I also think that the, how crowded the NFC playoff picture is, last night's game might be a tiebreaker that determines a playoff spot between these two teams. It was wildly important. Where I would be optimistic if I'm Chicago is, I don't think Caleb has played great yet.

I think he will continue to get better. I do think you're right that Ben Johnson is right now on the most vanilla part of the playbook as he slowly tries to build it up. I also, however, do want to be fair, and I know Jaden has earned far more of a benefit of the doubt than Caleb. And I know last night was weird, and Jaden's coming off an injury, and it was rainy. But the pick Jaden through took points off the board and was brutal. And if Caleb Williams had mishandled a snap, into a fumble with four minutes left in a game they were leading, we would be killing it. I'm not trying to kill Jaden for it, by the way.

It was a weird game. Mistakes happen, but I do think we have to be, you know, kind of measured and fair with the expectations for Caleb where they're at. Now, I also think it, you know, if you would have asked anyone in the world going into the draft, the overwhelming consensus, who's the best was Caleb? at the end of last year, the overwhelming consensus would have been Jaden. Right now this moment, it feels like the overwhelming consensus would be Drake May. Like these things are fluid and it's going to, there's going to be a lot of different iterations over the next three, four seasons between those top three picks.

So I want to end with Baker Mayfield because you know, and I've told you this, I'm, I like him. I think he's a good guy. I just, I thought he was a reach at number one and I didn't think he had the maturity I wanted to in a dysfunctional Cleveland. and I thought that's not a great fit. And it ended up when Stefansky got there. It wasn't a great fit even though he won a playoff game. But I watch him now and he said, you know,

it used to say I was cocky and now I'm a dog and it's all the same. And my take is you're too smart not to grow up. We all grow up. We all learn from our mistakes if you're reasonably bright. Why do you think? Because he's 6-1, not a super athlete. He's always thrown a great deep ball. What do you think the turnaround is?

says he's the same guy. I think he's too smart to be the same guy. How do you explain this metamorphosis in his young career? Well, I agree with him in this regard that him chirping at the fan that he did in Seattle would have been met with scorn had he done it as a rookie and now is met with, you know, that's what makes Baker Baker. But that is, I mean, that's not unique to him. I mean, what what he said, I think is correct. Was it, I know this is cliche and it's fiction, but was it any given Sunday? What was it where the guy would throw up

before the game or during the game? And one of his teammates was like, listen, if we're winning, people will think that's awesome. And if we're losing, they're going to say you're scared. It's the same thing. Like, that is pretty common across sports. I think, honestly, what happened with Baker was he got better as his career went on,

He became a more refined player. I think he understood better his limitations as far as his speed and ability to escape the pass rush. And now his best scrambles seem to be where it looks like he's dead to rights and it's less about speed and more about toughness. And so I think that has helped. I think he is now, you know, he is in a far more functional organization than the Browns. He has better weapons, even though this past week they were all hurt. And I also do think in professional football, the thing he has that really has always mattered is he is, and I know it sounds corny, but he is a true alpha, and those guys love him. I think that when you're, to me, it is the opposite of the dynamic I feel between Tua and his teammates.

It feels like Tua's teammates are waiting for him to throw them under the bus. I think they roll their eyes. I think he makes a bunch of mistakes. And then he talks about other guys being late for meetings. And I think that has a real negative impact on the team. I think with the bucks, they see Baker to the exact opposite. Always build guys up. Always try to lead from the front.

And be one of the toughest guys playing the position. and it gives everyone more confidence, it makes everyone play better. And so I think it's an all-time great story. I think to be a walk-on to a Heisman trophy winner to a number one pick, to trade it, to cut, to fighting with Kyle Trask for a job, to now be the MVP of the league through six weeks, and it looks like it's going to come down to him and Patrick over the course of the year, is really one of the coolest stories in my professional career in this league.

It's such a unique arc and one that no one else is going to have. And Colin, I think they are super dangerous. They have a tough next six weeks. And then the end of the year, they have Carolina twice. They have Arizona. They have New Orleans. They have Atlanta. They have one other, I think Miami.

They could go into the playoffs, 13 and 4, the number one seed of six game winning streak. This can absolutely be a Super Bowl team. And he absolutely can be the MVP of the league. Nick Wright, first things first, as always, buddy, great talking to you. Great senior, Colin. Yeah, it is, yeah, I mean, when you look at Baker, that's a franchise quarterback. Similarly, when you look at Sam Darnold, you know, a lot of people are like, hey, Sam's a great story. No, Gino Smith, that was a great story.

He's not a great player. Baker's a great player. Sam's a great player. There are great stories. Like Justin Fields, oh, he's going to be, he's not a great player. It's not even a good player. So, but the Darnold Baker stuff is about this new group of lots and lots of smart football out there for older coaches willing to embrace it or younger coaches ascending. But Darnold's a franchise quarterback. There's no reason for Seattle to draft one.

They've got their guy. And for the record, Minnesota, probably privately, wishes they still had Darnold. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week, within the end. iHeart radio app search her to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like hi this is jay i'm the producer of the paulay and tony fusco show usually in these promos they ask you to listen to the show i'm here to ask you please don't listen to this show the host are two absolute morons who have the dumbest takes on sports imaginable don't listen to this show so it can get canceled whoa what the hell are you doing in our studio get him paulie

ignore that fool listen to the paul and tony fosco show on the iHeart radio app or wherever you get your podcast. He's still moving. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, new? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast. Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a podcast. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how did we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it.

Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast, Point Game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows. Without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game.

We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted. this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court, licking his fingers why he got the bar like, you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah. You figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the

And you're going to get the bomb. So listen to Point Game on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Keith Gianmanca seemed like a mild-mannered suburban dad. But secretly, he became someone else, a master of disguise who went on a crime spree. At the time, did it seem like a crazy idea? It seemed very crazy. But I felt so desperate that I felt it was.

the quickest, easiest way out. Did you allow yourself to think about how it could go wrong and what that might look like? No. I didn't want to manifest that. I was trying to manifest success. Every family has its secrets. But what happens when you discover that your dad

has been living a double life? That is not the look of an innocent man. This is going to change my life and my family dynamic forever because everything that had existed prior in my reality is now untrue. Listen to Deep Cover the Family Man on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Here's something that should not be as complicated as it is. Getting a racist statue removed.

And here's something that should be a whole lot easier than it is. Getting a new one put up in its place. As long as there's a politics of race in America, there's going to be a politics of remembering the Civil War. To get to school, I had to go down. Robert Lee Boulevard. Get to the grocery store. I had to go down Jefferson Davis Parkway. If you're an historian and you leave out half of what the history is, you're not doing your job. I'm Akila Hughes. In Rebel Spirit, season two goes deep on both of those things. The fights, the politics, the people who won, and my personal campaign to add something to the Kentucky State

House that's actually worth the wall space. We are more than our bodies. We contain essence. We contain spirit. How do you represent that? They are just fuel. a fire that is really catching. You'll see what I mean. Listen to Rebel Spirit Season 2 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Scurry to look up analytics on the Urban Dictionary. I don't know what that means.

But let's start with Tua and the Miami Dolphins, Colin. Here's a team. You're not analytics. It's not working. Anyway, Tua questioned the leadership of the dolphins. After that Chargers loss, his head coach, Mike McDaniel, addressed to his, Comments on Monday.

After a loss as the franchise quarterback, that's not the form to displace that. I think he knows that now, I do honestly believe it was not, there's no ill intention, but you're talking about, you know, I think kind of a misguided representation of player-orchestrated film sessions. I like Daniel, man, but he sounds like. like Colin, one of these like seventh graders standing up in front of the classroom. Oh, uh, uh, uh, like, come on, dude. You're a head coach. He's not looking senatorial at the podium. Again, McDaniel made the playoffs twice in Miami.

I do believe he's a good coach. Sometimes as your first go-round, it's not great as a head coach. You could have Cliff Kingsbury in Arizona and commanding the locker room. I'm not selling all my Mike McDaniel stock yet. I'll just say that. I think he's a good football coach. I don't know if he's a head. coach. We'll find it. There is

something to be said. Do you think it's a coincidence that overnight Mike Frable's created a culture? Overnight, Jim Harbaugh created a culture. Overnight, Sean McVeigh. These guys are 60 years old. McVehan's like 40. It takes decades to do that,

man. Oh, McVeigh. I thought you said, okay. All right. No. It doesn't take decades. You can create a culture if you're the guy. By the way, Sabin did it in a year and a half. He's 5'6. It's not about how big you are. There is something to be said about the ability to command and intimidate and get people to rally around you. It's always been my knock on McDaniel.

He's a little squirley. He's smart. I'd hire him in one second to be my OC. But there is something to be said. When you look at all the culture builders in the NFL, a lot of them are like intimidating. Vrable, Mike Tomlin's a great. You've always said, Zach Taylor's smart. Is he a culture built?

Well, it's tough. Some of these young guys. Okay, McVeigh's one example of a young guy who came in and built a culture. Shanahan. Excellent job. Shanahan's father was a coach. He's been around football since he was eight. Like, I mean, again, it's really tough for these guys to come in.

And we saw Callahan in Tennessee. He got dusted. His dad was a coach forever. He came in. He couldn't handle the room. He's gone in 20 games. Again, I'm probably higher on most than McDaniel. And maybe you're right.

He's not a general. He's more of a lieutenant or whatever the ranking is. I do think that this game. is interesting. You see the Browns are three. It was two and a half yesterday. I hit the Browns. I think the Browns defense at home bottles them up. The weather looks like it could be inclement. Yep. You know Tua in bad weather. This is a weather game. Yeah. So we both like the Browns. All right, let's move on. This is an interesting story. This Matt Rule, okay, the Nebraska coach, he's being linked to Penn State. Feldman talked about it yesterday here on the show.

But it's deeper than that. The Penn State AD used to be at Temple. He hired Rule. They have a deep relationship. Anyway, Rule was asked about the rumors yesterday. Here's what he said at Nebraska. I'm not going to talk a lot about job openings when they come. Maybe it's been a while here, but this is what happens when you win. I've dealt with it. We've won at Temple and I dealt with it all time. I've dealt with Baylor. I'm not going to talk about those things ever. I'm not going to talk about my contract here. I'm going to talk about the team. But yeah, I absolutely love it here. And I just want to, I want us to continue to take the steps needed for us to turn this thing into a beast. But I'm really happy here.

I'm excited to get going this week on Minnesota. Yeah, I, you know, there's, if you're making $8,000, $8,000,000, and your family's happy, I think NIL and Transfer Portal, it used to be about facilities and geography. Who's got the most money? Oregon has more money than Big City, Seattle. That's why Oregon's better. They go buy better players. And by the way, Ohio State had big NIL money.

is Columbus blowing you away as a place all players? They've got more money. So it doesn't matter if you have a good NIL, if you're in that $12 million space and the staff is happy. I don't think, I hear this, you know, Kurt Signetti's going to Penn State. Just show me what Indiana, I'm looking at Indiana's defensive front

and their pass rush and their quarterback, and I'm like, somebody's spending money in Indiana football to buy good players. So I just, I don't think, you, I remember 15 years ago when Oregon built these crazy facilities, it became a facilities war. It's not. USC built facilities. It's because their NILs 20 million a year.

That's why they're buying good players. So it seems like a lot of fans are like, wait a minute, you hired Franklin who couldn't beat good teams. And now you want to bring on Matt Rule, who is, wait for it. Two and 23, Colin, against ranked opponents, which is James Franklin territory. Now the counter is, hey, man, you're two and 23 against rank. opponents when you're coaching at Temple and Nebraska and your big underdogs? What would Rule do if he had, oh, I don't know, the five-star recruits that Penn State has? Maybe it's a different story.

And then, of course, we had someone smart on the staff say, well, wait, Jay, what did Rule do in Carolina with Baker Mayfield and Sam Darnold? And then you're like, oh, he didn't do much. Now, you could say the owner was getting in the way and meddling and Maker, maybe it just wasn't a good fit, and you can make excuses. There's no right answer here. This is a fascinating story. That rule would not be my choice at Penn State. I think he's a fine coach. Signetti would be a guy I would look at, but if I was Kurt Signetti,

is it worth rebuilding it again for another $2 million? Now, he's from Pennsylvania. They're going to offer him more than $10 million, come. Well, if Adidas has a big Penn State deal. If they give him $15 million a year, I'm almost doubling my money, then I have to sit down and have a conversation. But I mean, listen, Indiana just went and beat Oregon and Outson. You can play with anybody.

There's an argument. They're the best team in the country. I mean, but it's tougher than that. You know, you've got to factor in your wife and what she wants to be around. Maybe his wife loves Bloomington. I don't know. Maybe this is just dream job. You know, like, there's a lot of stuff out there.

This is going to be an interesting one because I'll be honest. I don't know that Penn State's as great of a job as we think it is. I'm just putting that. Like, if you're ranking the big 10th. jobs, Colin. And you'll probably have clad on tomorrow. Is Penn State a top five job? Yes. You're sure.

Go down the list. Come on. Ohio State 1, Michigan, 2, USC, Oregon, Penn State. We're certain Penn States checking in a 5? Yeah. Four or five, yeah. Okay. I'll give it to you.

Final story, Colin, is Nick Benito. One of the best edge rushers in football leaning the NFL in sacks with eight right now. He was part of the defense that held the jets to 11 points. Remember last year, Pat Sertan with the defensive player of the year. He's now suggesting Benito should win the award. The numbers for him are pretty damn good coming off the edge. He's probably going to mall Jackson Dart this weekend.

This is one of the games I like a lot. I know it's a big number for the Broncos. They didn't just cover. But Jackson Dart against his defense is going to be at a hell of trouble. Well, also, remember, when can a coach coach the hardest? When his team plays poorly yet wins? Yeah.

So, Sean Payton, this is going to be a rough week of practice. This is also one of my, I think this is my third favorite bet or fourth favorite bet. I already turned my bets in. So to the staff, it's Tuesday. I usually wait until Thursday. This is one of the ones I like. You're turning into. You're on the same page on a couple.

I think Cleveland, watch out. And I think Denver's going to come hair on fire. Yeah, I mean, you're turning in in Matthew McConaughey, too, for the money. Remember he was just turning in his bets early in the weekend going golfing? Well, that's when he was on a heater. You go four in one. This is what happens. You get all excited.

Just a quick note, I am concerned for Denver. Bo Nicks still not playing great, Colin. At what point are we like, oh, it's a sophomore slump? Because I think we're a little past that now, right? He just did, listen, I know the story with the Jets couldn't do anything. Bo Nix, I think, had something like three first downs in the second half. Like, they couldn't move the football. He has not been a good deep ball thrower, and they have deep ball receivers.

So Sutton and Mims and Franklin can get deep. He has struggled in the deep ball. Not just missing deep ball throws, like missing them badly. He may not be a great deep ball thrower. I remember coming into the draft, people said Derek Carr has a better arm, and Derek didn't have a great arm. He had a fine arm. So maybe it may just be Bo Nix is 18 yards and in.

He's not a good deep ball thrower. And I think what frustrates Peyton is they have a deep ball receiving court. Yep. Sutton and Mims and Franklin all have excellent length and speed. J-Mack with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lye News.

I'll tell you the man-a-lilics that should have taken over analytics last night. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. On Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the I-H-H-Hawood. Radio app. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, new? Huge news.

We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a podcast. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys?

I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Oh, we were thinking, I'm an original. calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast where people could call in and say,

Hey Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas.

And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast, Point Game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows, without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have

Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court, licking his fingers why he got the ball. Like, after you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Keith Gianmanca seemed like a mild-mannered suburban dad, but secretly he became someone else, a master of disguise who went on a crime spree.

At the time, did it seem like a crazy idea? It seemed very crazy. But I felt so desperate that I felt it was the quickest, easiest way. out. Did you allow yourself to think about how it could go wrong and what that might look like? No. I didn't want to manifest that. I was trying to manifest success. Every family has its secrets. But what happens when you discover that your dad has been living a double life? That is not the look of an innocent man. This is going to change my life and my family dynamic forever because everything that had existed prior in my reality.

is now untrue. Listen to Deep Cover the Family Man on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Here's something that should not be as complicated as it is, getting a racist statue removed. And here's something that should be a whole lot easier than it is, getting a new one put up in its place.

As long as there's a politics of race in America, there's going to be a politics of remembering the Civil War. To get to school, I had to go down Robert Lee Boulevard, Get to the grocery store, I had to go down Jefferson Davis Parkway. If you're an historian and you leave out half of what the history is, you're not doing your job. I'm Akila Hughes. In Rebel Spirit, season two goes deep on both of those things. The fights, the politics, the people who won, and my personal campaign to add something to the Kentucky State House that's actually worth the wall space.

We are more than our bodies. We contain essence. We contain spirit. How do you represent that? They are just fueling a fire that is really catching. You'll see what I mean. Listen to Rebel Spirit Season 2 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. After powering their way to a two games to nothing series lead, the Mariners head home to Seattle for a pivotal game three of the ALCS.

As the Blue Jays look to climb back into the series, coverage begins at 7 p.m. Eastern 4 Pacific tomorrow on FS1. So I remember years ago when Lou Pinello was managing the Cubs and the Cubs got into a big playoff series. This is a long time ago. And he made a pitching change and he was like, hey, I'm going to set it up for later in the series. And my take was, you're the Cubs. Win the game in front of you. You're the Cubs.

And so when they, Dodgers, and I love Dave Roberts. He's a regular on the show. When they took out Blake Snell, I wish I had Dave Roberts today because this is a 10-minute conversation to me. I would have kept Snell in for a lot of reasons. Number one, he just threw the greatest Dodger postseason performance probably since Kofax. That puts enormous pressure on the bullpen because he's sitting on the dugout steps, and that's better than even Kersh on the playoffs. So there's that pressure.

Also, he went to Rokees Tazaki, who's not a natural closer. He's a rookie. And this is game one against the team Milwaukee that led baseball in hits, or at least the National League. So I would use Roki at home at Dodger Stadium with a more comfortable lead. I would use it maybe not in a crucial game one on the road. But I think the pressure on the staff and Roki in that moment,

who's not a natural closer, he's done a good job. But that's not his not. This is not Mariano or Raleigh Fingers. That's not what we're talking about. It's a young kid, game one on the road. You're in a, you know, I mean, let's be honest. Snell just through the greatest game, I think I've seen a starting pitcher throw in a playoff game. They could not get good contact on him.

And Snell's a guy that actually gets, he's really good post 100 pitches. Really good, like ERA goes down. So this is not a guy in the previous innings, he had shown nowhere in tear. So Dave Roberts' takeaway is, listen, he was at 100, 200, 103 pitches. We're thinking about setting up for game five. It reminds me of that Lou Penella moment with the Cubs like win the game in front of you. Worry about tomorrow tomorrow. When you get to the NLCS, the ALCS of the World Series, just win the game.

Just win the game. We'll figure it out. These are pro athletes. Hell, you may bring in a starter. You may bring in Snell for an inning in game six. You just make it up. That's why analytics in baseball or the NBA. And the NBA analytics are silly in the playoffs because it's literally officiated differently.

they don't blow the whistle. So you're not getting to the free throw line in the playoffs. They're going to let you play. And in baseball, you'll use starters in the pen. You will manage it totally differently. So again, Dave Roberts forgets more in a day than I've known in my life about baseball. But when they pulled him on like he's not struggling, I've never seen anything like this. Milwaukee is a great hitting team.

They could not get bad on ball. I mean, he made Milwaukee look like a AAA lineup. They were behind. His off speed stuff was just on. fire. So I wouldn't have done it. So the Brewers, my bad, there were third and hits. Second National League

behind the Phillies. My bad. But that was a classic example. Like, there's a man. He's on the mound. He's Kofax. Maniletics. I want him closing. I want him. It's like an NBA playoff game where a guy's at 44 minutes. He's an older player and I'm like,

bro, I just want his IQ on the floor. LeBron's had some of those. You're like, well, he's blowing way through his minutes. We need to win the game. Keep LeBron in the game. So, yeah, I get the reasoning. Analytic says pull him. But, and also, again, an unnatural closer.

He's a starter, rookie on the road against the team, and he didn't have his stuff. And I think some of it was because his last outing, he was great. I honestly think that Blake Snell was so good, it put more pressure on road. I mean, can you imagine watching Don Larson Sandy Gofax? He moaned through it. And it's like, yeah, I'm going to sit in the dugout and watch you. Watch you. And then a man gets on.

And then a guy gets solid bat on it. And you're like, oh, this thing is unraveling fast. But Dave trusts his guys. He wanted to get Blake out there to his reliever in the pen. Thank God they swung in a bad pitch. if you're a Dodger fan, but it is that classic example. I tend to look, when you get into these, you know, obviously in a one game setting in college or pro football, you win the game.

But a lot of times managers in baseball are about, hey, I want to set up my bullpen. I want to get my guys back on their regular rotation. But man, I could be in the minority. Maybe Dodger fans were all for it. But that dude was, that is, I had the TV on my big screen last night. And I'm like, they're not even, they're not even. they're swinging at bad pitches. He is in Milwaukee's head.

These guys don't want to even go up there. Ask yourself this. What do you think Milwaukee's batters did when they pulled Blake Snell? Hallelujah. Ask yourself, what did the Brewers' batters do? They would much rather face the kid in a huge spot on the road than Blake, even if it's for the fourth time. Like, nobody wanted to face that guy.

So that's my man, sometimes guy in a heater, let him go. Just blow through the analytics. Let him go. Peyton Manning always said this about football analytics. He said everybody's always like, go for it. He goes, well, it depends on the drive.

He goes, I've had drives where you're picking up first downs by a foot all the way down the field. Like four yards is hard. He goes, other times, you're just chunk play, chunk play. He goes, chunk plays, go for it. He goes, but not all fourths and threes are the same at midfield. You go into games and you're getting worked up front and fourth and three is fourth and eight and you cannot run the ball guard center guard and they know you can't run the ball.

So the performance outweighs the equation. Last night the performance outweighed the equation. That was just my take. Our three, Robert Mays from the athletic, great writer. I'm Kong. Hey guys, it's us and the Jonas brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin.

And I'm Nick. And guess what? But we created our own podcast called Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions.

Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano.

It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast. point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was hungry. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow.

Then after that game seven, Mark keep coming to him. He's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Every family has its secrets.

But what happens when you discover it? that your dad has been living a double life. That is not the look of an innocent man. Is everyone lying to me about who they are? I felt such desperation. I felt it was what I had to do. Listen to Deep Cover the Family Man on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Here's something that should not be as complicated as it is, getting a racist statue removed. And here's something that should be be a whole lot easier than it is. Getting a new one put up in its place. I'm Akila Hughes, and Rebel Spirit Season 2 is about both of those things. As I was watching these statues come down, I was thinking about what it meant that I grew up in a majority black city, in which there were more homages to enslavers than there were to enslave people. Listen to Rebel Spirit Season 2

on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.