The Herd with Colin Cowherd - THE HERD - Hour 2 - The message Bears HC Ben Johnson is sending, players who fell in the draft, Nick Wright

Episode Date: August 12, 2025

Colin also talks to Nick Wright from First Things First about Caleb Williams not playing in the preseason and the message Bears head coach Ben Johnson is trying to send. He talks about Sheduer Sanders still being the 4th QB on the Browns depth chart and players who have fallen in the NFL draftSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio.com. or stream us live every day in the IHeart Radio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Here we go. It's hour two. It is a Tuesday. It's great to be here today. I've said this before. I've been very, very lucky. I've had really good management around me for my entire life. for about a year and a half, two years in Tampa, I did not. It was a circus. And that was the worst two years in my career.

So I've always, and I probably took it for granted in Vegas or Portland. But, you know, at ESPN, I had good radio bosses. It's been great. I heart. So I've been very, very fortunate. But when you get bad management, which I had for about two years in Tampa, where, and I've told the stories a couple of times, there's a couple of them that are just absurd,

you really notice and really appreciate good bosses. And so I had very good teachers in high school. I had a couple great college professors. I've been lucky. I've had a lot of good mentors, surrogate, like almost dads in my life, my coaches. So that's a big part of it. And it's funny. So Netflix has this new show called America's Team.

And Emmett Smith is saying, yeah, we've had a real drought in Dallas. and he kind of lets Jerry Jones off the hook. Here's the bite. But Jerry never caught a pass. He never ran a ball, and he damn sure they throw one. So at some point, players got to take ownership of what they've been trained and what they've been taught to do. We had to do it.

I said we went back-to-back some flows, and then we lost our leader. And we was in disarray for a year. Okay, so I totally disagree. If I said to you, here's seven or eight teams that are just losing franchises. The Jets, the Raiders, Cleveland, Carolina, Chicago, and Washington with Dan Snyder, what do they all have in common? Do they all always have bad coaches? No, no.

It's shaky ownership. I mean, the Bingles, it's almost impossible in the NFL to have a top five-quartered. and not make the playoffs. The Bengals did that last year. It wasn't on Zach Taylor. It's why I always support Zach Taylor. He's not Andy Reed. He's not Jim Harbaugh.

I'm going to support him. They have the smallest scouting department. They may still in the NFL. So to me, it's, I mean, think about this. The Angels had Mike Trout and Shohei Otani and could not make the playoffs. That's because the baseball franchise Up I-5 called the Dodgers is much, much better run. It's not all about money. research and development, scouting.

It's just a better organization. So when Jerry Jones empowered two coaches, Bill Parcells early, Jimmy Johnson early, they won Super Bowls. I mean, think about this. In a passing league, the Bengals had a quarterback that led the league in passing, a receiver that led the league in receiving,

an Ed Rusher that led the league in sacks, and they missed the playoffs. It's impossible when 14 of 32 teams make the playoffs. So, you know, again, You could say that Zach, Zach Taylor. Okay, go ahead. He got to a Super Bowl. He did something right.

All right, with that, Nick Wright, first things first. Weekdays at three Eastern on FS1. So I'm in a weird space with Shador Sanders. So, you know, so it'd be very easy to be a troll and marginalized me. But I liked him coming out of college. Then I thought he was way too immature with legendary in the same. speeding tickets, unsurious,

really bothered me. And then I watched them Friday, and I'm like, stop saying he's not athletic enough. He is more athletic than all but about 10 guys. No, he is fine. And so now I'm stuck.

I did not like, I'm really, I like the traits. But I said yesterday, if your traits aren't Mahomes, Alan Lamar, then you better be good at the other stuff, the other 30, 35%.

Years ago, you said something very smart. You said the NBA, you don't have to be a great defensive play. because offense is 70% of the league. You shouldn't be hardened and be atrocious. Same thing here. Traits are 70% of the league, but you have to do some film study.

Like, it can't be, like, so I am back and forth on Shador, but I loved how he played Friday, and then he drove me crazy because he goes after a local radio guy, and I'm like... Oh, see, so I didn't... So here's the deal.

I actually think you and I were in a similar spot on Shador, and the Browns have given us an out, and then I'll get to the radio guy for him. So I think you and I both, before the draft said, there's a very real chance. He's like people were talking about Shador versus Cam Ward at one. And then it moved to, will the giants take him in the top five? And then it moved to should Pittsburgh trade up to 10 or 11 if he's there. And I think you and I were two of the few people that said,

he might be there for Pittsburgh if they don't move at all, if they just stay where they are in the 20s in round one, that we thought as a prospect, he was a late round one, round two player. And so we weren't as high on him as some, but I don't think any of us thought he was going to fall the way he did. So there's that part of it. Then, I don't think you or I loved him as a starting quarterback, his rookie year in the NFL. But when he ends up on a team with the oldest quarterback in the league in Joe Flacco, with Kenny Pickett, who is not an NFL quarterback, and in fact, when you have Mike Sandow on in an hour,

ask him about Kenny Pickett maybe being the first player in the history of his tiers to be in his own tier. Tier five this year for Sando was just Kenny Pickett. It's the saddest thing I've ever seen. He has no friends. He has no roommates. He has nothing. He's out there all by himself.

And then Dylan Gabriel, who, you know, looks eye to eye with Kyler Murray, literally. Then all of a sudden it's like, well, Shador might be a good option in this specific quarterback room. Because Blacko is not playing all 17. Pickett's not a starter. And you watch as much college football as anybody. Nobody watched Oregon last year and was like, that kid, that's a franchise NFL quarterback. So you then add to it that I think Shador played quite well under somewhat adverse circumstances in week one of the preseason. And you have the recipe for a fifth round pick starting the season as the backup quarterback for the quarterback most likely to be benched of anyone in the league.

So that part of it, I don't think that's in conflict with your president. previous opinions. There's 28 teams in the league where Chador would not be in a quarterback battle. He's on one of the three or four where he is and where he might end up moving up enough to where he's the eventual starter. There's that. Now, the Tony Grossie thing, Colin, listen, I know it has been years since you had to go in locker rooms, and it's been some time since I went in locker rooms, but we know that is not uncommon. The athlete going up to the loudmouthed radio guy and being like, hey, what I do to you? I remember 12 years ago, I don't know, I guess 15 years ago being in the Chiefs locker room

and Matt Castle saying to anyone who would listen in my vicinity, hey, does anybody like this guy? He sure seems to talk a lot of S to everyone, doesn't he? Like, that's pretty common. And so, and I, let me add one other thing about the end of that. And this is just a reality of life. Never underestimate the power of charisma or a great smile. Like that Tony Grossy-Shadour interaction reads not great. But when you watch it and Shador hits you with the 5,000,

and watch smile and the laugh at the end, it seems like it's okay. So I had no problem with that. The walk-in with the boom box and the staff I maybe could have done without, but I also did just turn 40, so I'm becoming a curmudgeonly old man like you, but I thought he played well. Yeah, he was fun to watch. So I said, almost everybody played this weekend. Mahomes, Burrow, Tua, everybody but Tom Brady played this weekend. And Caleb Williams didn't. And my take was, stand alone, bears dolphins, Ben Johnson's like, you know, it's like when tech companies come out with a new product and they say, you know what, we're going to delay it.

It's going to be revolutionary. But you just want to tighten it up. It means the engineering staff's a little behind. My take is Caleb is creating a little bit of drama where it's like, listen. Do we want another nine days or seven days getting crushed? He's not quite there. We're asking him to do stuff under center, and it was strategic in not playing him,

not that he got a bunch of good snaps against the dolphins. What's your take on that? I think you have gone, swung the pendulum a little too far on the Caleb's stuff. I'm being honest. I think you are a little too pessimistic at this point. After, admittedly, you and I were both probably a little too, too optimistic last year. But listen,

I would, if I were running an NFL team, I would simply say, hey, what does Andy Reid do in preseason and training camp? Yeah, I'll do that. Because the chiefs start every year off, sharp and ready, and he plays his guys, and Mahomes is out their first preseason game,

and they have tough practices. But the second best, in my opinion, coach and football, Sean McVeigh, does the opposite. So there clearly isn't just one way to go about it. I would be more critical of this if it weren't for the fact. It also should be noted. The entirety of the Bears starting offensive line sat.

They're starting running back tight end and their top three wide receivers sat. So of course Caleb is going to sit. Now, he does need to play probably more snaps now in week two than they otherwise would of. And is this bin Johnson protecting Caleb? Is this bin Johnson protecting himself? Is this bin Johnson simply saying, yeah, we're not exactly where I want us to be yet, but I think there's no harm in waiting an extra week. I'll tell you this much.

Like everybody loves Drake May, even though you can't find the stat, the number, the game where Drake May was better than Caleb last year. Drake May got five through five passes in week one. one of them was backwards over his head to the other team. Nobody cares. And so, like, is it good or bad that Caleb didn't have that moment? I'm not sure. But I do think it will be a little rocky early as this transition takes place.

But I think by Thanksgiving, Colin, Caleb, I believe, is going to look like the player that you and I both believed he would be. Well, I hope so. So the quarterback, Mike Sandoz, on in an hour, and I love it. It's an annual survey. I said yesterday, I woke up and I saw it, and it was like, oh, it was like Christmas present in August. It's great. I love it.

Did you have anything, anything in the tears, because you do your own tears, anything that jumped out to you as a revelation or I thought Bo Nix was a little low. I thought Aaron was a little high at this point. I think if you asked GMs, who would you take today, Aaron or Bo Nix? They would take Bo Nix for a lot of reasons. one, he's just in his athletic prime. But it didn't bother me, but was there anything here that jumped out to you?

Well, first of all, just because you opened the door there, I heard you tease in the previous segment that there's going to be an adjustment tomorrow, is it, to your preseason predictions? Yes. And then you revealed that a charger injury, Rishon Slater, and so when I was like, and at first I was like, oh, okay, good. Colin, who had every single defending division champion repeating, except for the Chiefs, is now going to use the Rashawn Slater injury as a reason to elevate the Chiefs.

Why do I have a terrible sinking feeling that somehow the Rashon Slater injury is going to lead to Bo Nix and your beloved Sean Baton going from third to first in the AMC West? It is. Somehow Rashon Slater gets hurt. And the Broncos go to first place. I saw that train storming down the tracks. I was like, that's what's happening here. All right, so sorry.

Spoiler alert, I haven't seen the list, but I know that's what's happening. I just know it. All right, now to the list. I thought the list was really good. Now, I am higher on Stafford than most, but not than NFL GMs and front office people. Because I think he's the fifth best quarterback in football. Obviously, the three or four people that had Josh Allen or Lamar as Tier 2 are just out of their mind. Like that, that to me is not a viable opinion.

Unless people are arguing Mahomes is in a tier by himself, which they should, but they're not, then Alan and Lamar have to be there with Burrow in Tier 1. I know there was a lot of consternation about Jalen Hertz's ranking. I think, listen, I would have Jalen Hertz ahead of Justin Herbert. I would rather have Jalen Hertz than Jared Goff. But aside from that, like, I don't have a problem with Jalen Hertz being high tier two. I also think it should be noted. People are awful quiet these days.

You know, we don't hear from so much anymore these days, Colin? The Brock Purdy Truthers. They were chirping at you and me for quite a while. And now he's hanging on for Dear Life in Tier 2, about to drop to Tier 3 when this thing comes out next year and you don't hear from as much anymore. I thought this quarterback tiers was, I thought they were really well done as they typically are. I think Josh Allen's the second best quarterback in football. But, you know, 47 people voted him Tier 1. 50 voted Joe Burrow.

It's such a small margin. I don't really have a problem with it. I think this is a pretty fair reading of the league. I agreed with you. I think Aaron was a touch high. I also thought Kyler. I thought the top of Tier 3 are two quarterbacks that I just don't really believe in in, and Kyler and Aaron.

So I wouldn't have them quite as high. I think Gino's a little disrespectful and listen, I understand. Nobody's ready for Mack Jones 2.0, Bo Nix, to take the league by storm. I'm very excited to see it. Yeah. You know, by the way, the Brock Purdy thing, and it's going to really bother Jemak. But I said when Dak as a fourth rounder came in and the Cowboys had Zeke, who was the best back in the league, the best offensive line, an offensive coach, the division was kind of wonky.

And they could spend money because they're paying deck. Yeah, they were three. And then the more they relied on him. Well, if you go to Brock Purdy's first year as a full-time starter, he had four pro bowlers on offense. now they're receiving core in this camp is a mess and in his last 15 games as the team got old brittle is losing defensive players meaning they're in more shootouts do you know what brock pretty is in his last 15 games he's six and nine

and they just paid him so my take is what brock pretty is going through not only the last 15 games but in this camp where all his receivers are gone or heard is that's the real NFL not of dach's rookie year or brock's first two years Of course, and by the way, listen, some of these, the Brock Purdy folks are not going to be reasoned with. And I've said this before, but I will say it again. This is essentially a six-year-long how do you view football war that started with Jimmy Garoppolo. Jimmy Garoppolo won, but objectively was not that good. And some people were like, nope, he's a winner.

Got it. And there were those of us who were like, I actually think with that coaching and that talent and that scheme, you could throw almost anyone in there and they would be successful. And those folks were like, no, you can't. And by the way, how would you ever prove that? And then they put in literally the last player picked in the draft and added Christian McCaffrey. And instead of those folks being like, oh, yeah, the talent, the scheme, and the coaching, they're like, nope, that guy's a super. And then those of us were like, no, he has this amazing team around him. And they said, well, how do you know he wouldn't do it if he didn't have that team around him? And then last year, he didn't have it around him. They won six games.

And they're like, no, Brockford is still great. Like, he's fine. He's overachiefer's draft status. I'm happy for him and his family. He got paid. But anybody that watches the NFL and thinks he is a force multiplier or he is a substantially, you know, that he is unfairly ranked and the 14, 15, 16

range. There's just, they're not going to, they're not open to the evidence that keeps pouring in year after year or game after game. I will give you credit though. The fact that you were able to sniff out bonex going.

I saw it. I know it. Of course. I was shocked. When I saw you didn't have the Broncos in the playoffs, I'm like, that's, listen, I know, I know Uncle Colin really well. And one of the things I know is around this time of year, he loves, he loves him some Sean Peyton, loves him some, you know, how impressive is it really to go to seven straight

conference title games and win three and go to three straight Super Bowls? Like, when we see that all the time? And now, do I wish you had this type of energy for J.P. Lossman and the Bills, circa 2009? Sure I do. But listen, everybody can't be the 2024 Denver Broncos who went 0 and 7 against AFC playoff teams, but now they're a real threat because have you seen Cortland Sutton? I mean, it's the

silliest thing I've ever heard, but I'm glad you're now going to join the chorus on it. And I still, please explain tomorrow how Rishon Slater's injury moves the Broncos up two spots and the Chiefs stay where they're at. I don't see it, but I'm sure you will explain it. I will. First things first, my buddy Nick Wright is always good seeing you. See you, Colin.

Yeah, two major moves tomorrow. You know, it's a couple years ago. Nobody was playing. I can remember the year that Kenny Pickett came out. That was the only real August topic. Because Sean McVey decided when he broke into this league, I'm not playing starters in the preseason. Everybody criticized him.

He went eight and no to start the season. And so a lot of people scaled back and the NFL realizes joint practices probably better for health than games. Anywho, this year, everything's cyclical in sports. Everybody's shooting nothing but threes. Everybody wants this. And then Oklahoma City, you know, has a great two shooter. And Chad Holmgren's doing twos and SGA's doing twos.

And all of a sudden you look up and you're like, oh, they're the NBA champs. by playing defense. So in the NFL now, like everybody's playing in the preseason. So everything in sports, I mean, the political media overreacts to everything. In sports, we overreact to some stuff, but the truth is in sports, everything comes around. Everything, like three-point shot, you got to take 73-point shots. And then you start watching the Celtics, and you're like, the downside to shooting all those three-point shots is, you have bad nights shooting three-point shots.

You really don't with mid-range. Those Michael Jordan's teams, mid-range, you kind of got the same team every night. And you say, well, what about the Warriors? Well, they had KD. Klan, Steph, the three-best three-point shooters in the league, arguably on the same team. That was different.

But I just look at the preseason this year, and it's been fun. I'm watching starting quarterbacks. I'm watching starting players, and I don't want my quarterbacks to get hurt. I don't believe in preseason. I would eliminate it. I don't think you need it.

College football doesn't have it, but it's been a good watch. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Hi, this is Jay. I'm the producer of the Paul and Tony Fuscoe show. Usually in these promos, they ask you to listen to the show. I'm here to ask you, please don't listen to this show.

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He's still moving. Hey, it's us to Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, huge news? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually

come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys. I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band. Before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this.

We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite.

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The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis. And I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs. And on the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris. Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on clay. Genshin win. I mean, she went down in three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted.

She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lernerabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now. And I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports.

Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth.

Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Have we already discovered who got the steel in the NFL draft? I think there's an argument we did. We'll get to that before the end of the hour. First, J-MAC with the news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news.

This is the herd line news. Ah, yes, it's time, Colin, for the Cincinnati Bungles. Let's update them. Uh, listen, the historically slow starts in the Zach Taylor-Joe Burrow era. cannot deny them. It is really bad. But T. Higgins, he doesn't want to hear about it. In a recent interview, Higgins said that he rejects the narrative that the team gets off to slow starts and says the biggest thing is just the team executing in all three phases of football. Well, you know, T, men will lie, women lie, the numbers they don't lie. Let's get them on the

screen. Joe Burrow in the last two seasons, starting slow period. Like, there's no denying it. Look at this. In September, he has been wretched. The offense has been. Putrick. The rest of the way, the numbers go significantly up. So I know T. Higgins doesn't want to hear it. But, Colin, that's a fact. The Bengals slow starts have really hurt the game. Yeah. And when you put those numbers

on the screen, I'm not going to read all of them for our radio audience, but it is like a backup against a superstar quarterback. Like, he is so good October 1st on. I mean, his completion percentage is 71%. 49 touchdowns,

12 picks. and really mediocre early. And again, I always think it's something to do with injuries. Joe doesn't want to get banged up. I don't really have an answer for it. Usually offensive coaches, I mean, Andy Reid's best month was September for years and years. I always feel like offensive coaches spend the offseason drawn up new stuff, right? Defensive coaches don't, right?

That's not what they do. Belichick's worst month was always September. He's experimenting with personnel. So it is odd to me that Zach Taylor, who is a disciple of Sean McVey, McVey's a good September coach, Shanahan, Andy Reid, Sean Payton, historically good September coaches. And so you can bang on Zach Taylor, but October 1st on, Zach Taylor wins a lot of games. So it's, I don't have an answer for it. Yeah, I like to chalk it up to being unprepared.

I just don't think Taylor puts in the work necessary to get his team prepared. And he's out game planned by opponents. Now, Colin, I will just say this. If you want to bet Joe Burrow to win the MVP, I don't think that's a terrible bet. He is going to be slinging it because the defense is going to remain putrid. He's going to have to be playing catch-up. He's got great receivers. No, this is a good call.

Now, here's the thing, though, will NFL voters, you know, the voters are dopey, will they back a guy who ain't going to be a number one, two, or three seat? They usually just take the quarterback from the best team in the league. But I don't know. If they win 10 games and are the sixth seed, can Burrow be the MVP, with massive 50 touchdowns and 5,000 markup. I think one of the more interesting stories is that Joe Burrell last year was completely authentic. He did not hide his disappointment in the organization.

Remember when there was video of him talking to Zach Taylor after a loss? Burrow was hyper competitive. This is one of my arguments why he separates. He gets out of Cincinnati in the offseason. He like needs to clear his head because he's the only great quarterback in the league. Right now, you look at the great quarterbacks in the league look at their support stafford Sean McVeigh, Stan Cronkey, Lesney.

I mean, I would say Goff, by the way, that front office is unbelievable, good personnel. Dan Campbell is above average coach. Lamar has the Ravens. Herbert now has Harbaugh. So you start looking around to the best quarterbacks in the league. Say what you're on about Sean McDermott. Sean McDermott is a good football coach. He may, like Mickelson not being able to beat Tiger, he may not be able to beat Andy Reed and Mahal's. McDermott's a good coach. But I get Burrow looking and thinking, I have the cheapest owner.

Every offseason is contract disputes with our sack leader and our star receiver. I think a fascinating storyline. What if Burrow, and I suspect this is going to be true, is great again this year, but an injury, a holdout squabbles, and it feels like he is the one great quarterback in the league. Jalen Hurts has a great support system. Herbert now does. He'll be the one guy that doesn't. That's where I think pro athletes have a right to be upset

is when you are elite, it is obvious you're elite, and they can't get you help and won't spend money. That's where I think Burrow last year said enough of this. So he was, he didn't even hide his animosity toward the organization, nor should he. Andrew Luck was always two. Everything's great here.

No, it was. be honest. That's part of leadership. I like how you said, and I'm sure the audience heard you closely. Burrow likes to get out of Cincinnati in the off season. Yeah, fashion shows in Paris or Cincinnati. The Amalfi Coast where Burroughs hanging out with the new celebrity girlfriend or Cincinnati. It's a no-brainer. Let's move to Cam Hayward, Colin.

This is not great. The veteran has had some issues with the Pittsburgh front office in recent weeks wanting a new deal. There are reports claiming Hayward wants an extent. and he may be willing to sit out the season if he doesn't get his new deal. Now, he is getting up there in age. It feels unlikely that he's going to sit out. He was first team all pro last season, only missed one game due to injuries. He's a great, highly productive, great academic.

I mean, he's a, there are not many Cam Haywards. But he's 36. No, I'm not denying that. He may not get the contract he wants, but he was highly productive last year. So I think, and by the way, T.J. Watts on the edge, you can find edge rushers. It is really hard to find guys as big as Cam Hayward that are that productive, that healthy. Like, there's just not, I've said before, quarterback's number one, left tackle number two, I'd argue interior defensive lineman, there aren't many Cam Haywards in the league.

They're just, they're just not that many guys that are that size, that fast, that smart, that instinctive. He is a great, and I know he's old. but I feel much better. Trying to find another Aaron Donald, Jalen Carter, Chris Jones, Cam Hayward,

you may get two of those, you may get one of them a draft. What? You get four edge rushers, six edge rushers, 12 receivers a draft that can play. Imagine the chances. They could have decided

we'll trade Cam Hayward, get something, max value, he's all pro, and we'll trade TJ what? And they could have picked up multiple picks to make a run at Archmanning instead they're going to just

go back with a loaded defense. Look at that, look at that, though. Look at some of those highlights. Like, he is still elite. And I know, I get the age thing. I totally get it. You can't give him everything he wants. But folks, outside a quarterback,

you can find corners, receivers, linebackers, tight ends. I mean, go look at how many tight ends. Gronk, George Kettle, are not, they're not first or second round guys. They're receivers, six and seventh round guys that can play. and not a lot of Cam Hayward body types in the league that are that quick and that twitchy for that size. A final story is some good news out of Buffalo. James Cook, the running back who was a monster for my fantasy football team last year and also the Buffalo Bills.

He returned to practice today after McDermott said conversations about Cook's new contract and the team have been progressing. McDermott didn't say whether or not Cook's hold-in is over. But again, he's practicing with the team today, which is just great news. This kid is electric. I have him as a top five back in the league. He is a game changer for Buffalo. He and Josh Allen is just... Who are the best?

The best five backs are Sequin, when healthy Christian McCaffrey, although he wasn't last year. Who's three? John Robinson's up there. Jamir Gibbs is up there. Jamir Gibbs. And I think you've got to put Cook in that class.

I know people will say Josh Jacobs, Derek Henry, but Cook is like entering his prime. I mean, that guy's... And he's a dual... Well, people are putting on a... When staff says Derek Henry, I think he's, I think he's very good. You could ask around the league. I bet you GMs would take Cook over Derek Henry for this year,

given the tread on the tires of Henry. You can't give Henry 20 carries for like seven games this year and expect him to show up in January. Come on. We don't have a ton of great running backs. There's Kyron Williams is, there's a lot of very good running backs. But Jay, I think you're probably right. I think you're probably right.

I think James Cook's top five. Yeah. You're right. J-Mack with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lye News. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific.

On Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, new? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it.

We just contributed to it. First people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band.

Before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast. could call in and say, hey Jonas, and then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes.

Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis, and I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris. Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on Clay.

Jen she went. I mean, she went down at three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lena Rubakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your courtside seat to the French Open.

Listen to the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds.

I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Bryson, Kepka, Ram, Phil, and DJ. Some of the biggest names in golf are keying it up in Indy for Live Golf Indianapolis. Catch coverage of round one Friday at 2 p.m. Eastern with coverage on the weekend of round two, and the final round starting at noon eastern only on Fox. By the way, for those in Indianapolis, I went to this last week in Chicago with my buddy John Middilkoff. We had a blast.

The music, the merch, the access to the golfers is great. So it's really fun. They don't have that many domestic events. They've got a Michigan one coming up, Indie, Chicago. They do a lot of stuff globally. There in person, it's a scene. It was really fun. So it's interesting about every year in the draft, there's one or two players that fall in the draft.

That was Shadur Sanders. And, you know, Aaron Rogers fell late first round or a Dan Marino falls. There's a rumor, this and that. Shadur really fell. And then there's also, there's a steal of the draft. Brock Purdy, seventh round, that's the steel of the draft. Actually, the Niners got Joanne Jennings years ago into seventh round. That was a steal of the draft.

George Kittle was a fifth round pick. So it's hard to call somebody in the second round a steal of the draft. But it is interesting. Like you, I watched about eight to nine Ohio State games this year. And they had two running backs, Travion Henderson and Quinn Sean Judkins. There was never a point, although in the Natty Judkins had a big run and he had a good game. I thought Trayvian Henderson was just bigger, stronger, faster. and yards per carry, Henderson, much greater, better receiver, better blocker.

Also, he was like leading prayer groups for Ohio State. Just a great, great kid. So this week, Josh McDaniels came out and said, this is the fastest running back I've ever had. And in his first NFL preseason game, the first time he touched the ball, he went 100 yards for a touchdown. So it is interesting. He was also a higher rated college or high school recruit. He was a five-star recruit. and I watched eight Ohio State games

and I never thought he was the second best of the running backs yet he got drafted after Quinn Sean Judkins. Judkins was a three-star recruit and Judkins now is sadly in some trouble off the field. So it's just interesting and I know he's a second round pick but I watched all these Ohio State games. He was faster the combine. He's a better receiver.

He's a better blocker. I just thought he was an unbelievable player and I was. it reminded me of when Sony, Michelle, and Nick Chubb played for Georgia, and New England in the first round took Sony Michelle, and Cleveland in the second round took Nick Chub, and Chubb was a much better bro. It's hard because they're both getting carries. I thought Michelle would have a better career, but Chubb was a bigger, stronger, it could be more of a pounding running back. So, I don't know, it looks like to me, sometimes you need breaks.

Cleveland takes the Ohio State running back, who every time I watch, outside of the nanny game, I thought, well, Trevion Henderson, we said it multiple times, that guy is going to be a great pro. And he was. Speed, size, receiving, blocking. And then I found out this morning, when I went and looked it up, he's like leading prayer groups for the team. So he's a pretty exceptional kid. The other thing we were talking about, oh, by the way, here's Josh McDaniels, the coach, the coordinator for New England on the Buckeye rookie. He's a tremendous kid. awesome individual, really hard worker, smart kid can process a lot of information.

We've had some really good players with skill sets that are somewhat like his. Maybe nobody quite as fast as, you know, Vareen was probably the fast. Him and Danny Woodhead were fast, but Trayvion's fast fast fast. Yeah, I think New England may have found themselves a really game-breaking star. A second guy drafted out of his backfield at Ohio State. I was saying that I do question, and I said it's with Cam Newton and Johnny Mansell and Baker. I see the traits. I question the maturity.

And in all those cases, I think the lack of maturity did hurt Baker, although he's rebounded nicely. Mansell, it crushed. Cam, it didn't help. And I think we should do her Sanders, it's not ideal. And I did not like after the game in which I thought he played really well. and I think it's kind of ridiculous. He's fourth on the depth chart. Dylan Gabriel hasn't been as good in camp

and can't stay healthy and staying healthy is like a skill. Brett Farr, Eli Manning, Tom Brady. You know, Tom Brady practice getting stacked. It's a skill. You know, Lamar Jackson got hit too much early. Started practicing getting out of the way. That's a skill. But Nick Wright did make an interesting point

about Shadur Sanders confronting the very positive. local Cleveland radio host. That is not uncommon. The athlete going up to the loudmouthed radio guy and being like, hey, what I do to you? Like that Tony Grossy-Shedore interaction reads not great. But when you watch it and Shador hits you with the 5,000-watt smile and the laugh at the end, it seems like it's okay. So I had no problem with that.

walk in with the boom box and the staff, I maybe could have done without. Yeah. So we'll see. I do think it's kind of ridiculous at this point, though, and I know it's hard to admit, everybody, guys don't like to admit they're wrong. Yeah, I don't love this stuff either. We're showing, you know, all the pregame stuff. I'm coming into the stadium. I don't love that stuff. It'd be one thing if you were a four-time all pro. I don't like it now as a rookie, a fifth round pick with two speeding tickets. But I do think you have to admit now, even if you're a critic,

he made some really nice throws. He was excellent 10 plus downfield in the face of pressure. The other thing is, stop telling me he's not athletic. I don't want to, I mean, like right there. This run right there, he is more than athletic. He's not Lamar, Josh Mahomes, hurts.

I'm not saying that. He's not Kyler Murray. Now watch this. Him again, it's a really nice throw with a guy in his face. You know, we've got to be honest about this. He is more than accurate and more than athletic enough. You know, your dad, you grow up, he's Dion Sanders.

He's a little into himself. That part I don't love. Jay Mack, you're looking at me. You've got some condemning. Say it again. I can't hear you. Hold on, buddy. Say it again.

I'm sorry. I'm excited for Mike Sando coming up. I'm surprised Shadour didn't crack the quarterback tier. But interesting. I do have one note. Colin, this is one of the cooler NFL stats I've seen, okay? The 2020 NFL draft class was amazing for quarterbacks. You remember that, right?

Burrow, Herbert, Tuah, Hertz. Hertz and Jordan Love. Yeah. Playoff wins from the 2020 NFL quarterback class. Jalen Hertz has six. Burrow five. Jordan Love won. Herbert, zero, two, a zero.

So Jalen Hertz has as many playoff wins as every other quarterback in his 2020 draft class, which is a historic draft class, yet Jalen Hertz somehow is still only ninth among decision makers and front office people. Well, again, that's how fans see it. Fans are like, they win games. Well, Dan Marino didn't win a Super Bowl, and Brad Johnson did. So you have to contextualize this stuff. General managers have to not just go, quarterback equals wins.

Brock Purdy, when he's had a team that's all beat up, he's six and nine in his last 15, and they just gave him 270 million. Dak Prescott and Brock, when they came in with four all pros on offense, both did first year. It's amazing how good they looked. They also didn't make any money, and you could go free agent hunting. So now Brock, starting next year, a little bit of a cap hit. So it can't just be wins. No, because Dan Marino

No Super Bowls and only got their ones. Hey guys, it's us The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick, and guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast?

Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know.

Tired and sick. Tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an

a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headlines. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to

hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slicelife 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Winning on Clay is an art. The rallies are relentless. And at the French Open, only the toughest survive. I'd know. I competed there for decades. Join me, Renee Stubbs on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast for no nonsense breakdowns of the biggest matches, the toughest players, and the moments that define Roland Garris. Jen Chinchin win. She's an outsider to win the French mate. And she likes Clay.

Listen, Lennarabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now. And I actually can win on any surface. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcasts on the IHeart Radio app. Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.