The Herd with Colin Cowherd - The Herd Saturday Special Podcast: 03/02/2019

Episode Date: March 2, 2019

Colin talks with former NFL Scout and 3 & Out podcast host John Middlekauff about Kyler Murray being undersized and Dwayne Haskins as an NFL Prospect.  Plus, they discuss why the 49ers are a potential landing spot for Odell Beckham Jr in this exclusive podcast. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode, we're cutting through the noise,

breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her.

What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, Wreck, my mama want you to weigh better. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was harmed. you just understood.

That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis come in to her, he's like, you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I might have heard some things, Colin, that the 49ers, I'm hearing that they're going to be aggressive to try to land.

Oh, Del Becker. Hi, everybody, and welcome to the Hurd Saturday morning podcast. We like these to be as timely as possible. Last week, we had Ben Mancovic talking about the Oscars. And I thought I'd bring in because I love the NFL Combine, John Middlough, who's a former NFL scout. He's also part of the HARD Podcast Network host of Three and Out. And this is one of the weeks that I really dial in to John Middlokoff. And now he's joining us up in the Bay Area. Let's start with this. 510-206 is the official Combine Kyler-Murie measurement. But as some have pointed out, Russell Wilson, when he went to the combine, was trying to keep weight down. He plays closer to 225.

Kyler's a guy that's trying to bulk up to prove his size whose resting playweight's closer to 190, 195. When I look at Russell Wilson at Wisconsin, the pictures, the images, I see a shorter guy, but not a small guy. When I look at Kyle Murray's picture at Oklahoma, the helmet looks too big on him. his hands, his shoulders. It's very Johnny Mansell to me. And I know, I know size is not everything, John, but he doesn't feel like Russell Wilson to me physically. Does he do you? No, because Russell Wilson, to me, is built more like a truck and Kyler Murray is built more like a sports car. And that's why I think such a big deal was made. Five-10 was a big deal for him, getting to kind of that threshold. That was a positive. But to me, the weight,

And it's one thing to weigh 207, but what's he been doing the last month, you know, eating cheeseburgers and protein shakes and adding that weight? Is he going to run and the play speed? Even if he runs a fast 40, what he played at, you know, in the fall and looked like Michael Vick 2.0, how much did he weigh? 185 pounds, 10090 pounds? That's when he's fastest. We knew Russell.

I checked this morning what Russell ran at the combine, and he ran a 455. And he was fast, but we didn't view it. him, Kyler Murray fast, Kyleorrie's best attribute really is his just explosive speed. Now he's a great thrower. He's really accurate. And I think Russell kind of paved the way

of smaller guys. They're athletic like that, having a lot of success. But the size, remember Colin was a couple years ago, Teddy Bridgewater. Yes. Different body type, but everyone he had small hips, skinny legs. Yep. Yeah, that's a lot of people on social media

that just why does anyone care about size? I don't think they've ever been to an NFL practice or gone to an NFL game and seen the size of these humans that come out in warm-ups. Even a small defensive player, a linebacker weighs 240 pounds, and he's built like a Greek god.

These guys will hurt you. RG3 a couple of years ago was more slender, and he lasted a couple years. Even Kaepernick, at the end, the tail end of his 49er kind of tenure, he was a big strapping guy, and he broke down because if you're a runner, you're just going to take hits. So that's still going to be a huge unknown, just the body type, because the 5-10, big positive, and I know you've been talking on your show, I think there's a decent chance that he ends up somehow

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Let's talk about Steve Kime, the GM. Listen, you can make an argument. The weakness of that team's their old line. it was beat up last year, should be healthier this year, but it's not a strength. They're unathletic. And the way to solve that is not with a brittle Josh Rosen who's not really mobile. You could argue the way to solve it is a mobile quarterback to avoid a lot of the hits any quarterback would take. And secondly, Cliff Kingsbury probably matches up with Kyler, I would say definitively,

better than Josh Rosen as far as skill set and what he would recruit as a quarterback. So, you know, what would you do if you were Arizona? Are you acknowledging if you trade Rosen and get Murray that you butcher last year's pick? Because Arizona's had very little success with their first pick last six, seven years. Have you already acknowledged that when you fired everyone from the coaching staff after one year? I mean, they kind of already did. And Steve Kime has a resume of a lot of success with him and Bruce Ariens. But last year was a disaster.

And I like Josh Rosen, but I don't know. It's really hard in this day and age. Like you said, he's brittle. I mean, he's been injured a lot. Yes. And he can't move at all. So in this day and age of a league that's much more spread and speed, I do think it's going to be a challenge.

And I've always been a Josh Rosen defender. But I had some red flags watching them. Now, again, you talk to people in the league, the first response they give you, worst offensive line in the league, not close. So you got to take it with a grain of salt. But you go with Cliff Kingsbury. They didn't give up that much.

You know, it's not like they traded up 15 picks and traded multiple first rounds. They traded a third round pick to move up five spots. Yeah. Now, one problem would be value, what would you get for Josh Rosen? Could you get a late first, early second? And if you are going to go Kyler Murray, you could just kind of punt. You could really reset your whole franchise. Yes.

You could trade Josh Rosen maybe to the Giants or something for an early second round pick. You could then trade Patrick Peterson probably for a first round pick. Kyler Murray, Cliff Kingsbury, all these picks, and just kind of hit the reset button a la what John Gruden did last year. And it would be fun, it'd be sexy. And I know you talked to Steve Kahn. That division, Kyle Shanahan, Jimmy's coming back. Pete Carroll and Russell are rolling. I mean, they've missed the playoffs once in six or seven years, and clearly the Rams.

So you better come equipped, you know, with a machine gun to the fight because you're not going to win with a water pistol. I want to talk Dwayne Haskins, Ohio State. A big strong pocket kid, not great feet when he moves his accuracy dips significantly. So, you know, again, I think 90% of these quarterbacks should sit and wait, but that's not the reality. Haskins, I would love to see him go somewhere like a New York giant situation and just sit behind Eli for a year. What do you make of him as a prospect? I thought all along that he was going to end up going number one. when you're that big, when you're that productive, you talk to scouts that went through there.

Sometimes you read Flag a guy. Why was he only a one-year starter? And people at North Carolina, when it came to Mitch Trubisky, he couldn't beat out the other guys. And the other guys were no names. Well, in Ohio State, Urban Meyer viewed J.T. Barrett as his long-lost son. There was an emotional connection there that kind of overrode football, even though he's not as good as Dwayne Haskins. It's really not even close. So he was the backup, not for necessarily football reasons, but it was a lot of, it was more personal and emotional.

He was good enough. People have told me that when you went through last year, they said, God, we should be starting this other guy. And then you saw this year clearly why. Imagine if he returned to school and had another big year at Ohio State. He'd be the no-brainer number one pick this year. And really, if it wasn't for just Kyler Murray taking the world by storm, but I think as these guys, I was watching some of John Gruden this morning,

and he met with Kyler and Dwayne Haskins. Just imagine sitting there on a couch. The way they do these interviews is in like every team has a little hotel room. So you're kind of all cramped in there. You know, there's 10 guys in the room and then the player walks in. Kyler Murray walks in. You know, he's 510 or whatever. And then Dwayne Haskins at 6'4, just big strapping.

That does matter. That resonates with these coaches that definitely for the coaches and most of these GMs, with the underclassmen especially, it's the first time they've ever met these guys in person. They've watched them on film. They've watched them on TV. This is the first time they're sitting right next to him shaking their hand. And that first impression, as it does in life, in football with body size, with mass, it really resonates with these guys. Hi, guys, I'm just like you.

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and some Gruden stuff, you've been to a combine. Is it a waste of time or do you do feel like you found a gem or two? Yeah, I think the days of gems with the Internet are kind of over. I think for just the scouting community, it's not that important for the decision makers, the GMs, the agents, the coaches when it comes to trades. Because this is kind of the unofficial start of free agency. Deals are done. You get a feel for the market. How much is going to cost to sign a guy, how much it's going to cost to keep one of your own free agents. That to me is by far the most important stuff.

Most of the scouting community is just kind of there to drink and hang out. I mean, it's kind of a networking convention for everyone else. Sure. And the GMs are working hard. To me, trades now more than ever because of the salary cap has risen so much in the last five or six years. You see it all the time. I mean, these guys, I mean, how many trades did we see last year?

Several. And I would imagine we're going to talk about Odell Beckham in a minute. That wouldn't even have been possible. with a guy making that much money to trade them, you know, half the league could take on that money and not even flinch. I think the top 10 teams in the NFL have over $700 million in cap space. Well, you Google the free agents. There's not $700 million worth of talent out there,

especially after these guys get franchised. So the trade market right now with these aggressive young general managers and just kind of the younger influence in the league is where it's really taken off at the combine. John Middilkoff Bay Area, former NFL Scout, host of three and out, a podcast on my network, the Heard Podcast Network. I rely on him greatly, especially Combine is one of your real go-to draft evaluation. Let's talk free agents. Odell Beckham. I talked to him for 25 minutes the other day. FaceTime Odell Beckham, which is, I thought I found him incredibly authentic. I found him frustrated. And I would go get Odell Beckham. I think I'd pass on Antonio Brown. Is there a place? Beckham fits in your opinion? I might have heard some things, Colin, that the 49ers, it's clear if you just Google their roster.

They're desperate for a wide receiver. And they were interested last year, but the timing was off. There are some other guys out there, but I think the 49ers are big on youth. And when you look at O'Dell Beckham, he's 26 years old, I'm hearing that they're going to be aggressive to try to land O'Dell Beckham. Now, the problem is it takes two to tango, and as Dave Gettleman said the other day, we didn't sign him to trade him.

But, you know, there have been some rumors about Pat Schumer. It's not as easy that, you know, they don't quite get along. And I don't blame Odell. I'm an Odell Beckham guy. Yeah. I would be, my offer, if I was the Niners would, I'd flop from two to six. I'd give you a second round. I'd give you another first round pick.

I would much rather have Odell while he costs more. And he hasn't been as productive than Antonio Brown than Antonia. than Antonio Brown, just given kind of everything he's bringing to the table right now. Antonio couldn't be any more productive. They forced feed him the ball. They paid him for six plus years, and he wins, and they're still unhappy. To me, O'Dell just wants to be in a competitive football environment. With a legit quarterback.

Yeah. Yeah, I mean, can you imagine if Jimmy coming back and they land O'Dell Beckham, the buzz that would be for the 49ers this off season? Then you'd have Beckham, the young Dante Pettus. You'd have Marquis Goodwin, I think. George Kittle. And Jared McKinnan. You'd have pass catchers.

So that would be, and I think Kyle Shanahan, and we've seen this in Atlanta and several stops, he elevates good players. They become very good. And Odell Beckham would be remarkable. Hi, guys. I'm just like you. I'm older. I want more energy. I want more drive.

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So he's not going to let his age beat him. I'm doing the same. Energy, strength, drive, MDrive. I trust these guys because they use clinically tested ingredients to increase natural testosterone levels. All right, a lot of other benefits. Get it at Walgreens, Vitamin Shop, GNC, or go to MDrive. for men.com. Enter the code heard.

M drive for men, code heard. And get 20% off. MDrive for men.com. Code heard. H-E-R-D order today. Refind your prime with M-Drive. Now, the Raiders have three first-round picks. I mean, to me, I know Gruden's an offensive guy,

but don't they have to use most of those two out of the three at least on defense? Well, their offensive weapons are. anemic, but their defense is terrible, but they do have a franchise quarterback. At least that's what they've been saying. If you're going to stick with Derek Carr and you're already paying him, I definitely think you have to use the fourth pick on a defensive player, and this is, Mayock said the other day in all his years of doing this, this is one of the deeper defensive drafts, and we all know if you watch college football, defensive players everywhere.

But the 20s is going to be a sweet spot for offensive players. Some of these tied ends, a lot of these wide receivers. The Raiders, Mari Cooper, as Stephen Jones says, when our first round pick comes up, we'll just watch Amari highlights. So they traded Amari Cooper, who they drafted fourth overall

several years later for pick 27. They need a wide receiver. They need a tight end. Derek has no weapons. And at the end of the day, the thing I always hear is Gruden, Gruden loves offense. I mean, he talks a big game

about the coaching staff. Offense is his baby. And last year, it was an embarrassment. Their defense is always bad for the Raiders. But offensively, when they were humming, especially with Gruden, they were putting up points. And I think they reset the franchise last year.

You got to use those two picks to me in the 20s. If the guys are there on the Ole Miss wide receiver, one of the Iowa tied ends, you have to get some weapons. Yeah, I have a friend that knows Belichick, and Belichick told my friend about a month ago, he goes, we're going to be really, really much more athletic next year. They had three picks they liked last year. I think New England's a really

interesting team. The Raiders in New England to me are the two teams in the draft I'm fascinated with. I think New England's got 12 picks. Iowa's got themselves two good tight ends. Those are the teams that I'm interested in, kind of the Raiders and New England. Is there a team you're looking at? Jets, by the way, have cap space. It's a bad year to be limited offensively because they need offensive help. Those are teams that I'm looking at. Anybody in the draft you're looking at? Yeah, I think New England's fascinating because Sony Michelle was awesome in the playoffs. And he's a big chipper first rounder, so he's going to be a stud next year. They got a first rounder, two-toes, and I think three-threes. So they'll, they will reload. I know you've talked

about it. The Patriot, or I mean, the Packers have two first-round picks. Now, the second one is the Saints. It's at the end of the first round. But, you know, You're paying Aaron Rogers NBA-type money. You might as well put your cards in the middle of the table here and go all in. And I just wonder if they're going to get aggressive or they're going to slow play it like they have historically. Because for them, what's the 30th pick? Why not go out and maybe try to trade for a Julio? I'm not the biggest Antonio Brown guy just because of the baggage that he brings.

Maybe an AJ Green. Maybe go get Patrick Peterson. I don't know. Just do something big. You got the bears. They're not going away. The Vikings kind of had a down year. They'll bounce back.

I think the Packers have to use these two first-round picks, especially that second as kind of capital to make a move. And it's hard to feel confident that they will because that's not really their MO. Yeah. John Middlecough, former NFL Scout, good stuff. Three-and-out podcast on the Hurt Podcast Network. Love talking to you.

Saturday morning, Hurt Podcast. Thanks, everybody for listening. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where SportsSlice comes in. I'm Timbo. And every episode, we're cutting through the noise,

breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes.

Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert. Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Clivert Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, A, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out.

Quarterback on office, Blue 42. Hey, ref, my mama wants you to wave at her. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clippers show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano.

It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was funny. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven,

Mark keep coming to you. He's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.