The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Vic Fangio, NBA, 49ers, Aaron Rodgers

Episode Date: June 3, 2020

Colin talks about the recent comments by Broncos HC Vic Fangio, the return of the NBA and its possible rule changes, what he likes about the 49ers, and why he doesn't agree with Pro Football Focus' ranking of Aaron Rodgers. Guests include Doug Gottlieb, Chris Haynes, Rich Kleiman, and Mark Schlereth. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the Look Back at it podcast. From 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 is big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down,

and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild. I mean, it was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, what's good, y'all?

You're listening to Learn the Hard Way with your favorite therapist and host Kear Games. This space is about black men's experiences, having honest conversations that it's really not safe to have anywhere, but you're having them with a licensed professional who knows what he's doing. How many men carry a suit or armor? It signals to the world that you not to be played with. And just because you have the capability that does not mean that you need to, listen to learn the hard way on the IHard radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for listening to The HARD podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1.

Find your local station for the Hurt at Fox SportsRadio.com or stream us live every day on the IHartRadio app by searching Hurd. Fox Sports Radio. Ah, here we go. We are live in Los Angeles. It is a Wednesday, and this is The Hurd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening, we are on IHeart Radio, we're on Fox Sports Radio, and we are on FS1, and we are strangely packed on today's show today, despite no sports.

Joy Taylor is joining me. Joy, how are you today? I'm great. Seems like we're. Getting some good news on that no sports front, though. Yeah, it's coming, not as fast as we'd like, but we're getting some news. I thought we had a lot of different stories today, and I thought it was fitting to lead with a coach who I think is a good coach. His name is Vic Fangio.

He's a coach of the Denver Broncos. And I've actually, in the last month, said I think Denver's going to surprise people. I think he's a really good head coach. But that doesn't mean he can't be tone deaf. And timing is everything. And Vic Fangio was talking about the current national. topic of note, injustice and racism. And a lot of things he said as I read the story, he supported all his players on the George

Floyd death. He was very happy that many were protesting. But he also, at 61 and white, was tone deaf, and here was a moment of that. I think our problems in the NFL along those lines are minimal. We're a league of meritocracy. You earn what you get. You get what you earn. I don't see racism at all in the NFL.

I don't see discrimination in the NFL. We all live together, joined as one for one common goal, and we all intermingle and mix tremendously. You know, if society, reflected in an NFL team, we'd all be great. No racism at all? Well, again, I think much of what he said he was trying to get right. But there's a difference between individual racism and institutional racism.

All greatness, it doesn't matter what you do. Doctor, politician, football coach, radio host, quarterback. It's all born from one thing. Talent! No, no, no. Genetics. No, no, no, no. It's all born from opportunity.

I mean, I've worked hard in stuff, but I was in a small market and given an opportunity at a big syndication network. And I wasn't very good the first year. I was allowed to make a lot of mistakes. Nobody questioned whether I would make it. I had that it thing.

What is that it thing? We have 32 NFL teams. 31 are owned by white owners. Change is slow. It's why we have a Rooney rule and need to have a Rooney rule. Because all greatness is borne out of opportunity. Listen, I'm 55. I'm white.

I got kids. I ask questions. I've spent the week listening and learning. That doesn't stop after you go to high school or college. Some of this stuff I don't face. I don't see it. It's blind spots. I've reached out to people I've never reached out to before.

Just think about it. 32 teams, three black head coaches. That doesn't line up with the demographics. Ron Rivera makes it four minority coaches. And coaching isn't like being a running back or a left tackle. There are several steps you have to take to be given the opportunity to be a head coach in the NFL. First of all, you have to be given a position coach. and then if you're lucky, you're given an coordinator job.

And then if you're really lucky, it's the head coach. And we always pay attention to the head coach thing. But there's a term in the NFL that was used for years. Still is, not as much, but still is. Good old boy network. Bob's been fired four times. He's a good old boy. He's a good guy.

He's a good old boy. We're hunting fish. Good old boy. We're trying to get rid of that term. because to be a position coach, people in life, I think of all races, we hire who we know. We hire our friends. We hire who we're comfortable with. That's why the Rooney Rule exists to give coaches opportunities.

I'll give you a great example. Bill Belichick was fired. He's still got a great job. Andy Reid was fired. He's still got a great job. Pete Carroll was fired twice. He got a third. job. Take Todd Bowles, coach of the New York Jets. I've heard so many Jets fans, he's no good. Really?

He went to the New York Jets. He had an incompetent general manager. His quarterback was Ryan Fitzpatrick, then he got a rookie. The defense, the minute he got there, was significantly better. So were the special teams. He couldn't score enough. Oh yeah, Tom Brady was in his division. Maybe you've heard of him. He's good. And Bill Belichick, the best coach maybe of all time, probably. Bowles then is fired, goes to Tampa, becomes a defensive coordinator. Do you watch Tampa's defense last year? End of the year, last six, seven games. May have been the best in the league.

They didn't have the best defensive players. Will Todd Bowles be given another opportunity? Are you going to tell me Todd Bowles has this New York situation, incompetent people around him, not great ownership, incompetent GM, doesn't have the quarterback right, fired, goes to Tampa once again, in a year, defense is spectacular. will he be given one more opportunity? The last two MVPs in this league

have been black quarterbacks. To be a quarterback in the NFL, you have to be allowed to be a quarterback at 7, 8, 9 years old or in high school. Those opportunities now are happening in most of the country. In the last 10 years, Mahomes, Lamar Jackson, Jackson, given opportunities, given the football in eighth grade, you run the team. It's your football team.

You call the plays. You make it happen. Those opportunities were not granted for a long time. You know, it's the good old boy network. Listen, there are parts of the NFL that are a meritocracy. And again, I'm learning as we go. This week, I have asked short questions and heard long answers. I'm not pointing fingers on this.

I'm not trying to do a gotcha like on social media. You said this years ago. This means you're, if we are going to demand change, then we have to allow people to change. But folks, Colin Kaepernick hasn't played a football game in what? Four years? People still get worked up over it. Still, Vic Fangio may have meant well, but this is all greatness, coaches, all of them. It's all born from one thing.

Who you know, who your friends are, who you're connected to, what are your opportunities? It's not a true meritocracy. either if you listen, ask short questions, listen to long answers, either is our country. All right, I want to go to this. As Joy said, there are hopeful signs we will get sports in July. I am a little disappointed in the NBA. They're saying now if the NBA goes to a game seven,

It would be October 12th. So the NBA, unlike baseball, has never put its playoffs up against the NFL. Baseball has. Ask them how it works if the Yankees aren't in it. Not well. Because of budget shortfalls, because of our pandemic and economic situation, states are now passing legislation on gambling quickly. What does it mean?

We gamble on football. We watch football more than we've ever watched it. Last year, the ratings went up, even as our television choices, Netflix, Amazon, Prime Hulu are more fragmented. What does that mean? Football's getting bigger and more powerful than ever. We've got an Italian soccer league. They were a hot spot for the virus. They're starting here in a couple of weeks.

Disney World's opening up. Vegas is opening up. This seems like the NBA was really concerned. about the beginning of the NBA season and maybe not as concerned about the end date of the season? I'm a married guy. So I have to make choices with sports. I mean, my wife understands. I'm a sportscaster. I have to watch a lot of sports. But I want to remain married. And so there are times I have to make choices. Just to give you an idea, the NBA will be fine if LeBron and the Lakers make the finals. But what if it's Milwaukee and the Clippers, two teams that don't have a national brand? Kauai Leonard's not even overly verbal.

Janice is, but we don't follow the bucks nationally. This is the week of October 8th through the 12th. This is what, I'm not even going to count baseball. And the Dodgers and Yankees, two national brands, are favored to be in the postseason and win their division. I'm not even going to count that. These are the games that will be played October 8th through the 12th, which could be the NBA finals. In college football, first of all, on Thursday, the 8th, Tom Brady goes and takes on the Chicago Bears. Then there's five huge college football games.

LSU against the best Florida team in a decade, Auburn, Georgia, Texas, Oklahoma, Michigan, Michigan State, Stanford, Notre Dame. In the NFL, it's rivalries, Eagles Steelers. Giants Cowboys, Vikings against Seattle, Chargers at the Saints on Monday Night Football. I'm going to have to make choices. And unless it's LeBron and the Lakers, I know my audience isn't going to gravitate. I mean, think about this.

I love the NBA. We love the NBA. There'll be NBA finals games that if LeBron's not in it, I may not lead my show with. The NBA paid a lot of attention to starting the league. I think they should have started it sooner and been more concerned about the end date of the league. Charles Barkley talked about this.

Good luck going up against a monster known as the NFL and college football. College football is king of the world. Full football is King Kong. We ain't never going to compete with them. We should start the NBA season around Christmas. So I think we should show up in the season of 75 or 70 games. Christmas should be the big day like we do every year. We have set five games on Christmas Day.

That would be a great way to start the NBA season. Why are we starting in the middle of college football season and pro football? I mean, it's just too much going on. We're trying to compete for dollars. And now, think about this now, Colin. It's going to be worse going forward trying to compete with those dollars of the NFL and college football. Yeah. The good news is, and I just saw this on my phone, Adam Silver wants 22 team Orlando tournament,

teams to play eight regular season games. Owners expected to okay the plan. So 22 teams, eight regular season games, then they go into the playoffs. I wish them luck. But facing football with increased sports gambling all around the country is an avalanche you don't want to get in front of.

Coming up next, pro football focus, back in favor. And wow. Wow. They're not fans. of Aaron Rogers. That's coming up. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the IHard Radio app. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning,

the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source. The athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action

with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slicelife-Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kier Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark.

Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. and we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person

while you hear on earth, or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing,

growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way. Open your free, iHeartRadio app search learn the hard way and listen now do you remember when diana ross double-tap little kim's boobs at the vmase or when conge said that george bush didn't like black people i know what you're thinking what the hell does george bush got to do a little kem well you can find out on the look back at it podcast i'm sam jay and i'm alex english each episode we pick a here unpack what went down and try to make sense of how we survived it including a recent episode with mark lemont hill waxing all about crack in the 80s.

To be clear, 84 was big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so you all know. I mean, at this point, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really?

Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Cliver Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game.

This linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office, Blue, 42. Hey, Wreck, my mama want you to weigh better. What? Hey, Ms. Parker.

Listen to the Clifford Show on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Get your free credit scorecard today, even if you're not a Discover customer. Learn more at Discover.com slash credit scorecard. Limitations do apply. I'm off tomorrow and Friday. Joy and I have, listen, we're all working hard. I'm going to take a couple days off, hang out with my family. And are you off Friday?

I'm off Friday, yes. Okay. So we're going to make today's show count. We're going to put everything into it today. Listen, I've given up on the hair. I just, I don't know what I'm doing. You can keep banging on me for the hair. It is what it is.

I'm keeping it real. This is authentic me. This is me without a comb, okay? So a pro football focus is something I follow. I like the guys there. Don't always think they're right, but I follow them. They're kind of back in my good graces. They did the top 10 NFL players.

They rank the top 50. I'll just give you the top 10. It's not the most valuable. It's not about stats, although stats matter. You know, it's Aaron Donald of the Rams number one. Patrick Mahomes, Julio Jones, Atlanta, Quentin Nelson, Colts, George Kittle, tied-end Niners. Michael Thomas, six Saints. Russell Wilson should be higher, but seven's fine.

Lamar Jackson, 8, D'Andre Hopkins, 9, Christian McCaffrey, 10. No real problem with it. I moved some people up, some people down. mostly right. Aaron Rogers did not make the top 50. Now, he makes my top 50. I absolutely think he's influential.

He has a unique skill set. He's really smart. He runs around. He makes place. He's in my top 50. But they had three Packers in the top 50. Aaron wasn't one of them. And they used data.

And they had Devante Adams at 38. 42 was a tackle. David Bactieri. And 44 was Kenny. Clark. By the way, they had all make my top 52. Aaron would, but he didn't make theirs. And it was interesting because this week I have talked about why is Aaron Rogers the last two years led the NFL in throwaways? Two different coaches. Why? Because I think he's protecting his legacy more than elevating it. I think he's become a very safe quarterback. The great young

quarterbacks in this league. Mahomes and Carson Wens jump out to me. They are risk takers. They are gun slingers. I think going forward, so are the young GMs and the young coaches. They are risk takers. I think that's the future of the NFL. I think it's less conservative. I think it's more progressive, more risk-oriented than it's ever been. And I think it's a better brand of football. Aaron's become safer. Farve was a gunslinger to the end. But it's interesting. when they talk about David Bakhtiari the tackle, one of the things they put in here is he has the hardest pass blocking responsibility of any tackle,

protecting Aaron Rogers, a quarterback who holds the ball longer than almost all other passers. Throwaways, holding the ball longer, paralyzed by making a mistake or throwing an interception, not just letting it rip like a Mahomes, like a Carson Wentz. Don't tell me it's all about weapons. Carson Wendz doesn't have any weapons. So this is what we've gone back and forth on.

I would have Aaron in my top 50. My point has been, I think as he's aged, he's become a safe quarterback, and I don't think, maybe it is his DNA. I think he's at his best, kind of letting her rip. Planting a foot and letting it rip, and you get some interceptions. This is what Greg Kosell has said on our show now for three straight years. Say what you want about Aaron Rogers. He's super talented.

We know that. He'll be a Hall of Famer. But Aaron Rogers, over the last number of years, has evolved, or one could say devolved, into a player that plays a lot outside of structure and outside of rhythm. And when you get a chance to watch the coaching tape as I do, and this is not an interpretation, this is what the tape tells you. He leaves a lot of throws on the field within the timing of the offense that are there to be thrown. and I guarantee that that bothers Matt LaFleur.

And given the age of Rogers, and who knows how long Rogers can play, the age of Rogers and Matt LaFleur clearly coming off last season, having probably pretty much carte blanche at this point, I think he's looking to say, hey, I'm going to start to put this offense together the way I want it to look. And while Rogers is great, I'm a little frustrated with the way our offense plays out. They drop plays. Aaron thinks there's too much risk.

He throws it away, holds it too long. What did LaFleur talk about? That clip from the Rich Eisen Show. What did Matt LaFleur recently say in a press conference? We're not dynamic enough. PFF's telling you, they got dynamic players. They got players. This goes back.

I'm not trying to be right. I like getting it right. I see something. I observe something. I say something. And then in recent days, pro football focus. Matt LeFleur come out and say, yeah, I mean, there's a structure of a player. he won't do what the coaches want.

He wants to do it his way. And his way, to me, has become too safe. Here's Joy with the news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Well, the NFL has informed teams about new training camp rules this season. In a memo, since the teams yesterday, the league stated that all training camps must take place

at their home facilities and no joint practices with other teams will be allowed. This makes sense to me. Yeah. I mean, this is an easy decision to make. Last year, 10 teams had their, they practiced away from their main facilities. And obviously, the Cowboys are most notably known for having their camp in Oxnard, which is not far from here in California, which is obviously a big trip for that entire team and all the personnel and reporters and everything else.

So they're going to have to have it in Dallas or at the Frisco Star, their training facility there. So NFL players are also not expected to return to their team facilities. until training camp, which is another kind of interesting note. So they will continue working out at home until training camp. Because of the murder of George Floyd, COVID has been taken off the cable networks. Right. We had a pandemic. We had not solved it.

We do not have a vaccine for it. So just listen, cable networks follow the hot story or the story that is in the moment the story of note in America. The murder of George Floyd is. But we're still dealing with a pandemic with no vaccine. So what teams are saying here is let's not forget that. We're not going to travel around the country. We're not going to have the fan experience. We're going to stay close to home.

We're going to keep people socially distance as long as we possibly can. It's just that because that story is not being discussed, it has not gone away. We have a, we're in, we're now, has the curb been flattened? Yes. Is the fatality rate going down? Yes. Is there encouraging news? Is the, is the virus not as substantial as perhaps.

some perceived a month ago or two months ago, it appears to be the case. But it's still a real living, breathing thing we're dealing with. It's a crisis. Right. And people who have to make decisions that are putting other people's health in that fray have to make those kind of decisions. That's a good point that you also brought up as well. Training Camp is going to look a lot different this year because there's always fans at

training camp. Oh, it's a thousands of fans come to watch Training Camp. So that's going to be, that's going to look different as well as I'm sure how the reporters are stationed at camp as well. So Aaron Donald Donald already has two defensive player of the year awards under his belt, and he's in line to get his third in 2020. According to Fox Bet, Donald is the favorite to win defensive player of the year at plus 750. Reigning defensive rookie of the year, Nick Cobosa is second at plus 1100.

Cahleo Mack, plus 1,200, T.J. Watts, Stiffon, Gilmore, and JJ Watts, respectively. Can you imagine? In the odds for Fox Bet for defensive player of the year. You're Mr. Watt? and two of your sons. At some point, there's a Mr. Watt watching this and thinking, both my sons are elite defensive players in the NFL. Yeah, TJ has better odds than JJ.

Yeah, I wonder how JJ feels about that. It's got to be a little inner house rivalry there. I actually think Nick Bosa is who I would put my money on for this year. Kaleo Mack, I think, will bounce back because they'll get better quarterback play. A lot of Vegas guys like Chicago this year, They sold them last year. They're back in because of Nick Foles because they think they'll at least be vertically challenging. Watch Kaleo Mack.

You know, we've talked about this before. When the offense is bad, even great defensive players generally don't play at the same level. I'll go Kaleo Mac. Watch Kalio Mac bounce back this year in Chicago. Are we ignoring Chicago, you and I? I think. Wasn't it Nick yesterday who said that he? No, last year, Nick Wright said Buffalo is the shock of the league.

He was right. This year he took Chicago. He's not wrong because they got the coach. I'm kind of out in the gym. They got the coach I like. And I think Foles is good enough for two years. I love their defense. Oh, yeah.

That's never been the issue. I've, I always felt like they were in a win now situation when it came to their defense. So the NBA's Board of Governors is expected to approve the league's plan to bring back 22 teams to resume the season in Orlando. Adrian Mojernowski revealed some more details of the overall plan. He's reporting that each of the 22 teams will play eight regular season games for playoff seating purposes. 13 Western Conference, 9 Eastern Conference, 8 regular season games per team. The play in for the 8th seeds, and the start date is expected to be July 31st. If it goes, as you said earlier, all the way, it would end October 12th.

And joining the 16 current playoff teams in Orlando, according to sources, will be New Orleans, Portland, Phoenix, Sacramento, and San Antonio in the West, and Washington in the east. If the 9th seat is more than four games behind the 8th, number 8 makes a lot. playoffs and there'd be fewer than four games in a play-in tournament. So it's still a lot of complicated details that they're sorting out, but the NBA is back. They are just now figuring out the details of it and are expected to start July 31st, which is two months from now, but we'll take it. We'll take it. Yeah. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd-Lie News. What were you saying there, Greg Tewy? I don't know. I have to wait a second on Doug. Okay, he's good now. The Dugger of Fox Sports Radio after our show, joining us via the Coward Global Satellite Network.

Sponsored by Mercedes-Benz, the best or nothing. Let me start with this. The pro-football focus, their list is, it's fine. I don't have any real. I'm glad they put George Kittle in. I actually think he fits the culture. I think he's gronk-ish. But Aaron Rogers is not top 50.

What's your reaction to that? Well, look, the Florida pro-football focus is not in, is not in their evaluation. Their player grades are simply for media fodder. That's all it is. I mean, Aaron Rogers not being a top 50 player in the NFL is a joke. It's a joke.

It makes the rest of the list kind of stupid. It doesn't matter what else you say if you don't have Aaron Rogers as a top 50 player. Because if we were to start selecting a football team today, and you ask any general manager in the NFL, he might not be the first player, taken, he would definitely be one of the top five players taken. So look, some of, some of what you portrayed as the Packers' offensive issues are accurate. I completely disagree with Greg CoSell.

I know he's watching film and he says that, you know, that this is why they made the quarterback draft pick of Jordan Love. It's not why they made the pick. They made the pick because he's 36. And in two years, we'll see if he stays to this level, if he improves with more time in this offense and if they won 13 games he's he's one of the two or three best quarterbacks in football now reasonable people know there's going to be some decline and when this contracts some of that money comes off the books they're going to do what the packers have always done which is hopefully have an error parent there but that has nothing to do with their current level of contentment with number 12 so to me if you have Aaron rogers not as the top 50 player in the

NFL. Your list is stupid. We can't pay attention to it, even if we pay attention to the other data that you have outside of the player ranking. So they're going to have this 22 team format. It does feel, it does feel. Hold on. Colin, Colin, do you agree? Do you think he's not a top 50 player in the NFL? No, no, I have him in. I have him. I said before. Like just in or like? Well, I mean, if you're asking me, best quarterbacks in the league, if I started a franchise today, I'd start with Mahomes and Russell Wilson. I'm, I'm a huge Carson Wenz fan, but there's in. I have to consider. I do think Lamar Jackson will take another step in his development, and he's younger and hasn't been hurt. But I don't think any reasonable person can put Aaron below

like a four or a five. And I would say Aaron's health and aged, and I do think he declined the last couple of years. But I think he's a top six quarterback, and they had six quarterbacks make the list, and Aaron wasn't one of them. So, yeah, I mean, the criticism is valid. But I would push back. And I do believe Aaron's gotten a little safe in the last couple years. Could be a lot of reasons. I think he holds it a little long. He throws it away too much. And I think those are reasonable criticisms. I think the reasonable criticisms. I also think it's reasonable to think that when you've been in the NFL, as long as he's been in the NFL, he understands that turning the football over and forcing things, which was the far away, is no longer the way in the NFL. And if you

don't like what you see, get rid of it. Live to play another day. Right. And if you ask people that actually watched their games last year, a big reason they were 13 and 3 as a opposed to nine and seven was Aaron Rogers doing otherworldly stuff, right, when he had to. So he does play it safe when he can and when he can't, that's when he lets it rip. So, you know, and look, the flaws to this team were apparent. They're a bad matchup with the San Francisco 49ers. I'm not sure there's much he could have done about that because they couldn't stop the run and you're playing with fewer possessions.

And, you know, they don't have anybody to take the top off the defense. But I don't think your criticism is wrong, but I think there's a logic. to it. And I would, I would disagree in terms of Lamar Jackson. Like, there's nobody in the, what they do take the league by storm. Absolutely. But people are going to adjust to it. He's going to have to have a second pitch. And we'll see if that continues to improve. I know you're infatuated with Russell Wilson. I would take Aaron Rogers ahead of Russell Wilson. I wonder what the Seahawks would. Outside of Mahomes, I can't think of anybody else, Russell Wilson, who anybody would have a conversation about in terms of right now in the NFL.

That's fair. So the NBA is going with 22 teams. It feels like it was a way to get Zion in, whatever. Do you agree with my assessment that they did? Zion's a star. We like him. We watch the Summer League game. And part of it's, do you like the 22 game format and do you think some of it is to get Zion in? Yes. I think that's an ancillary benefit is getting Zion in and getting Damien Lillard in and getting some more. stars in. But there's a lot more at play. They need a volume of games for their TV partners, but they also, what they really need is ramp up games. You can't go zero to a hundred and play at playoff level intensity. And because they can't really have exhibition games and they can't have those bottom teams that have shut it down for the year play, like they're just money losers.

Now you include some other teams. You're like, hey, everybody's got a shot, even though they don't really have a shot. Look, the team that gets screwed in this thing is Memphis. They earn the right to be the eight seed and now they're just one of the teams, whereas they're three and a half up on Portland, who was injured but also didn't play well for a good portion of this season. Nobody cares about Memphis, apparently, in the NBA League office in terms of the grand scale of things. I think the fascinating thing is that they're going head up with U.S. Open, playoff baseball, college football, NFL football. And I understand that traditionally, that's when people watch TV as opposed to July and August, but man, it could be really, really bad if their numbers pale in comparison

to football, which is king. And then we're not even talking about the other events, which are all going to be like the NFL likes to think of itself as on the rise. We will truly see its level of importance in the grand scheme of things when it has to go head up with college football, NFL football, NASCAR, golf, all of these other events, which we played all at the exact same time. Troy Aikman's really good at his job. I think he's as good at his job. I think he's as good is anybody in our business in analyzing football. He says, smart stuff for three hours all the time.

Great chemistry with Joe Buck. But I do disagree with his assertion this week that the Cowboys roster is as good as anybody. And my takeaway is I can look at the Chargers roster and outside of quarterback, and I think they're capable at quarterback. I don't see holes. I can

look at a lot of rosters. I don't see holes with Baltimore. I don't see, I mean, seriously, I just don't see him. Baltimore's an incredible roster. But I look at Dallas and I see four or five great players, three or four other really good players. But safety, corner, center, you know, defensive tackle. I think the Cowboys have a good roster, which is thin with a handful of, we just watch them so much, Doug. We like what we watch.

And they're on television. So I think the roster's a tad overrated your thoughts. I agree with you. I agree with you on your assessment of Troy. I thought in terms of broadcasting, he took his game to another level this year. He was outstanding. But I think it's one of those things when you see the Cowboys and you get to know their names, you assume that they're that much.

If they're that much better, how the hell couldn't they win that division last year? You know, how did that happen? I think some of it is, you know, we like to think that they have this dominant offensive line. But their offensive line isn't what it was a couple years ago when they won 13 games. They have aged. They have had some attrition. They have had some movement on that offensive line. Look, I think Ezekiel it's top five back in the league.

I'm not as big on Amari Cooper as Cowboy fans are. I think he changes them, but I don't think he's a game changer. He's not in the con truately in the conversation of the elite, elite, elite wide receivers in the league. He's good. I like C.D. Lamb. I even, I like that Prescott. I just don't love it. And then you factor in what Tony Romo long told people, which is, hey, people are so concerned about what I do.

He ain't going anywhere without a top five, top 10 defense, right? go back and track it. You tell me the teams and even Kansas City who got got better and how we look at defenses have changed. So I'm with you. I think, you know, Kansas City is the one outlier because their offense is so explosive, but this isn't the Kansas City offense. They can't score against the good teams or they haven't scored enough against the good teams like Philadelphia late in the year or New England in a rainstorm. So to me, I think their defense is missing something.

I think we're dealing with a bit of dated data in terms of their offensive line. and I think if they're that talented on the offensive side of the football, why isn't DAC better against the best teams? The thing that you pointed out, which is the smart thing, is, yes, they have a very good roster. And they do. So are the Chargers. You know, the Eagles, when they're healthy, a very good roster. Like we kind of go through the NFC, Saints, a very good roster.

Tampa putting together a very good roster. The Packers are putting together a better roster. Joy pointed out when you guys are talking about the Bears, the Bears roster outside of skill position players is pretty darn good. So I'm not saying that they don't have a good roster. I'm just saying in comparison to everybody in the NFC, it's not far superior. It does have some holes and have some holes at some really important positions, which we don't pay enough attention to. Doug Gottlieb, Dougher, Fox Sports Radio, after our show, he's got a nice house.

You can see all those nice pictures in the background. I'm fascinated by that as I'm watching Doug. I don't know why. My wife's in design. Maybe that's the answer. Douger, have a great weekend. I'll be in for you the next two days. I don't know what you're doing, but enjoy it.

All right. Thanks, bud. coming up next there's a team in the NFL that stole something from New England and it's something we don't talk about in fact it's about not talking and it's why I love

an NFL franchise and where they're going they don't talk and I'll talk about that coming up next be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays at noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific last night a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending,

opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsClace on the IHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness, month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we

don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross. Because you find it important to be a good person while you hear. on earth? Are you a good person because you're

afraid? Because that's two different intentions bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free, our Heart Radio

app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do a little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it.

Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so you all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode. where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people.

Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee.

We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me, he goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Quarterback on office blue 42. Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's she at?

Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clippers show on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. You know, one of the things, when you choose friends, you know, we choose them for different reasons. Sometimes, you know, you meet somebody, it's proximity. They're your neighbor. You meet them. You have a lot in common. There's a lot of different reasons.

You know, you have to have some things you share, values, morals, beliefs, hobbies. I think trust is huge. Like most of my friends are people I lean on, I ask questions, but I trust them. If I have a crisis, I trust they'd help. If I had information, hey, I've got to ask you something. I don't want it out there. Trust is a big thing. One of the first things I look at, whether it be the White House or a football team's house, is the stuff leak.

The stuff leak. I was an Obama fan. Nothing leaked. Current White House, everything leaks. Firing, is leaking. It's like a college football program. To hire a coach, he's gone through nine coordinators in three years. San Francisco doesn't talk.

They don't talk. John Lynch became a GM. I worked with John Lynch. We literally went, John Lynch is the GM of the 49ers? I'm in the building. He's an employee. Didn't leak.

Emmanuel Sanders didn't leak. Jimmy Garoppolo from Belichick shocked the world. Didn't leak. Trent Williams didn't leak. This is the way to do it. I knew the L.A. Clippers really got their act together. They have public figures all over the organization. Jerry West is the damn logo.

Doc Rivers is like a basketball coaching star. Steve Balmer, eccentric, verbal. They trade Chris Paul? Joey and I come to the show. It's like, what? We didn't even hear about it. Then they get Paul George to play with Kauai. Nobody heard about it.

There are leaky organizations in sports. You know, I mean, let's be honest, the Cleveland Browns, I think the new group won't be. The old group was the jets are leaky. The Lakers over the last seven, eight years. I mean, it's just a house that you've got to have seven buckets around for all the leaks. Everything leaks. It's the first sign there are people fighting for themselves and not organizations. Because when I was a reporter, I always looked for the disgruntled employee.

He would talk. She would talk. I always look for the recently fired employee, the unhappy employee. You poke, you poke, you prod, you find them. They talk because they were fired by somebody. It's not a united front. Our White House is not a united front. There's too many leaks.

It's telling you. So the point is the Trent Williams situation was a classic example of they got Trent Williams because they didn't leak Joe Staley was retiring. And he knew he was retiring well before the draft. And they didn't let it out. Whatever they did with Joe Staley, whatever they promised him, whatever values they share, he didn't leak it. Let him get Trent Williams.

Peter King, I want to play a bite from Peter King. Peter King talked about this, is the Niners had this thing all set up. Remember, Kyle Shanahan, Mike Shanahan, you know, they drafted Trent. They knew Trent. They figured this out. And it just Peter King about a week ago. how would you like 48 or 72 hours before the draft

they're informed that Joe Staley's going to retire so now you thought going into this draft you have 13 and 31 so what do they do they go out and they get Javon Kinlaw right there in the middle of the first round they trade up a little bit and they go get Brandon Ayuk who they said was the best receiver

on their board and then after that I thought what they did was absolutely tremendous. They take advantage of Trent Williams' devaluation of Trent Williams and Washington's desperation to get them out of their building. And they get a pro bowl left tackle for about 38 cents on the dollar. And the reason I talk about this is Trent Williams may have been the best free agent signing or draft pick this year. He may have more impact than any player. And he was coming from Washington where here's the list of quarterbacks he had at Washington.

Declining Donovan McNabb, Rex Grossman, John Beck, RG3, Kirk Cousins, Colt McCoy, Alex Smith, Mark Sanchez, Josh Johnson. Now he goes to the Niners and everybody's criticizing Jimmy Garoppolo. And Trent Williams said yesterday, hello? If you see what I've played with, I think Jimmy Garoppolo is awesome.

I think Jimmy G is awesome. I think he's as proven, he's a quarterback that you can win with in this league. It's just hard to find. You know, quarterback is the toughest position to pin down. I think that's why you see the contracts where they are. Having a quarterback that you know is going to make the right read, the right throw. I think that that has to be, it has to allow Cal, you know, give him a chance to sleep at night

because just, you know, having a guy that you know who won't throw the game away for you and, you know, you put him in the best position possible, he'll win. Just to show you, what people knocked on Jimmy, Jim, Gee, Joy and I always laughed. He led Patrick Mahomes in the fourth quarter of the Super Bowl his first year. What are people talking about? What are you talking about? Oh, he missed on a deep throw.

It's a Super Bowl. Come on. Patrick Mahomes missed on plenty in the first three quarters. But think about the Redskins. They had McVeigh, Kyle Shanahan, Jay Gruden, all those offensive guys. They could not get the quarterback right. So when you start banging on Jimmy Garoppolo, folks, you know how hard it is? To find a quarterback who can get you to the Super Bowl.

in his first year as a starter. Trent Williams sees it. Look at his NFL experience. Jimmy Garoppolo to Trent Williams is not just good. He is awesome. Add Kyle Shanahan. There you go. You get Super Bowls.

Hour 2 next. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Last night, a blown call changed the game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending.

Opinions are flying. and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves,

their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants.

answer. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kier Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase

that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro.

Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free, Our Heart Radio app.

Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on The Look Back at it podcast.

I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line.

We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys?

This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me, he goes, Hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Quarterback on office, blue, 42.

Hey, rec, my mama wants you to wave at her. What? Hey, Ms. Parker. Listen to the Clifford show on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Oh, this hour two is. The Hurt, wherever you may be and however you may be listening. We're on IHeart Radio, Fox Forks Radio, and FS1.

I'm off next couple of days, Joy's off Friday. We're making today's show count. I just got a little text here. You know that fighter Justin Gaichi, the new UFC fighter I love? Yes. I'm going to get him on the show next week. That's exciting. Yeah.

He is just a bag of wrenches, man. When he punches, just bang. You really loved that part. This is a good card this weekend, too. Yep. Now, I thought that was one of the best UFC cards, and I have such great respect for the UFC because there was so many reasons why it would not work.

I mean, this is why I get frustrated with the NBA. They're going to play July 31st. UFC's already had a card, like three, two, three weeks ago. Like, let's go, let's get on it. And I want to start the show with that. So there are, so the NBA is going to play July 31st. It's 22 teams. It's complicated.

They have an emergency destination. It feels a little gimmicky. they're trying to figure out what to do. Like if you're a one-seat, like Milwaukee, and you worked hard to be a one-seed, what advantages do you get? Now there's no home court. Here's some of the things they've talked about.

The higher-seated team would be awarded the first possession of the second, third, and fourth quarters following the traditional jump ball. The higher-seated team being allowed to designate one player to be able to be whistled for seven-thous instead of six. The higher-seated team being able to, transport their actual hardwood home court from their arena to Orlando. Oh, good hell. John, Woz came out with other things today. You want to throw a couple of these gems out there?

Sure, this took some deciphering. So they're inviting extra teams that are close to making the playoffs to Orlando. And then for playoff seating, if the ninth seat is more than four games behind the eighth, number eight will make the playoffs. But if it's fewer than four games, then they'll have a play in tournament. But then the play-in format requires the double elimination format for the eighth seed and a single elimination for the ninth seed. Okay. My head is on fire. Gimmicky, complicated.

Don't complicate things for sports fans. Like, you just got to keep things. We're simple. We're simple men here. Just first down in 10, third down and one. You can't give too much. One person can save this season. One.

LeBron James. You're going to go head to head with the NFL, college football, baseball playoffs. You've got a gimmicky. And I have sympathy for the NBA. The pandemic hit in the middle of the season. I have sympathy for it. But when we talk about most valuable player, he's an executive, he's the face of the league, he's a coach on the floor, he engineers player moves, he's the best player.

it's not just about 27 points and 8 assists for LeBron James. Like this is the classic example. You can see leadership and value in crisis, right? Like that's when you see it. You know, you can be a senator, a congressman, but when you're state in trouble, that's when you see if somebody's, frankly, capable or completely over their skis. Look at what the league is going through. A pandemic, 70% through their season.

Very smart people. These are billionaire owners. And this is Adam Silver. You have the smartest executives. Smart people. This thing is a complicated, flimsy, gimmicky. One thing here, they're saying the top seed should be able to pick their hotel rooms. That is a benefit of being a top team.

Bring your floor in from Memphis. LeBron can save the season. LeBron plays well, gets to the finals, games on Wednesday, I'm watching. You know, it's just, and you're saying, Colin, are you saying he's the MVP because of TV ratings? What I'm saying is the burden on LeBron James, no other player faces it. No other player has to absolutely do an interview after every game. No other player has to do that. no other player is in conversations regularly with the GM on personnel moves.

That's, that's, LeBron needs to be. His style of play dictates it. His greatness dictates it. He's a, he's like everybody. He's got his flaws. MJ had his flaws. Bird magic had their flaws. But just the sense of valuable, you know, this is one of the things that I've, I've said,

it's funny. The people who vote on these awards, they don't read the words in the awards. It's not best stats. most triple doubles, coolest, newest stat line. It's most valuable player in the league. LeBron's been the most valuable player in the league for a decade. Now, Steph Curry deserves some votes. Don't get me wrong.

Steph Curry is really valuable. And by the way, Steph Curry's value to me has been beyond basketball. His ability to be selfless. Why would we not count that invaluable? Selfless over selfish. You don't think that that doesn't matter at all. Like, it's a team game. Like, Michael Jordan didn't win without Pippin, Phil Jackson.

Like this idea that it's a stat line or a triple double. No, it's not. Valuable comes in many forms. I've said this about quarterback play. Russell Wilson's talked about this. It took about year three, the light goes on. You see the plays before they happen. You see the defense.

You see the audible. You stop thinking it quarterback. It just comes naturally to you. I'm not going to count that. That's why I say today to win a football game, I still think for about one more year, I could choose Russell Wilson over Mahomes because I think Russell's better at the line of scrimmage today. Now, Mahomes may be more talented, but I think Russell pre-snap, because he's been in the league

longer, could see things at this point. Russell may not quite know yet because, you know, he's human. Tom Brady, it took him years and years. And then after the Atlanta Super Bowl, he talked to Jay Glazer and he's like, you know, at since that point, there's nothing I haven't seen. You can throw anything at me. I've seen every coverage. I've seen every blitz package.

So I always think we forget the value. You know, I've said this about presidents. Presidents never get credit for the disaster they avoid. It's the same with LeBron. LeBron is so great. He doesn't get credit for the issues that would surface with a selfish player, with a less talented player. with a player that doesn't have his basketball IQ,

his understanding of people and how he relates and distributes and elevates. You know, Kyrie Irving and him were great and had their issues, but it's really interesting to watch LeBron post-Kiree and Kyrie post-Lebron. LeBron's kind of making it all work. If you look at the Lakers roster, it's an interesting, odd group of disparate parts. I mean, the first team he had and today's team. It's like there's no same players. Like Kyle Kuzma.

It's just a new coach. It's new players. It's new assistants. And yet they're the number one scene in the West. He just makes everything work. It just all the little things you could have go wrong, LeBron sort of cinches them up and they all fit in. And now they're great, boom.

The Clippers have a better roster. But they don't have the chemistry that the Lakers had. When this Laker season started almost all new players, the first thing Joy and I said was, got it, like three games in, you're like, it works. Like overnight. Like LeBron changed positions. It works. Is that not valuable?

Like, I don't get the people voting on this stuff. What is valuable mean? It has to mean beyond stat line. Everybody just stares at rebounds and points. God, LeBron goes, he's the only guy going to save this season. Otherwise, the World Series is going to beat the finals. College football is going to crush it. The NFL is going to destroy it.

Golf tournaments may beat it. He'll save the season. Chris Haynes will be stopping by coming up next. I say this. There are some great mysteries in the world I don't understand. Mysteries I don't have an answer for. D.B. Cooper. Stonehenge.

How the shape of water won best movie. I don't have an answer for these mysteries. Here's another one. How is it that New England gets rid of virtually every star they have? Refuses to even pay the greatest quarterback of all-time market value. And they're always right up against the cap. Yet the Cowboys pay everybody. And the Rams pay everybody.

Come on down. Here's a big fat contract. New England pays Stefan Gilmore and nobody else. Where's the money going? Is there an offshore account I'm not aware of? it's a mystery. How's New England always up against the cap? Who do they pay? They didn't pay Brady. PFF came out with its top 50 players in the NFL. All you Tom Brady doubters? Tampa Bay had as many defensive players as New England in the top 50. One. And oh, by the way,

one patriot, one only, Stefan Gilmore made the top 50 players. Four Buccaneers did. Brady at 24. Godwin receiver at 33. Levanté, David, excellent linebacker at 37. Mike Evans at 45. A little low for me. I think Mike should be higher. Four. You watched New England last year.

Be honest, even if you're in Boston. They look slow. They weren't dynamic. This divorce is not going to be close. Tom Brady is going to a significantly more dynamic, more athletic team. Also, New England had no tight-in. Tampa's got two... Excellent tight ends.

They solved their right tackle issue. They solved, I believe, their running back issue. Todd Bulls' defense down the stretch. I know. All you Brady haters. Pro football focus. Four bucks. One Patriot.

Chris Haynes, around the corner. Coming up next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the I-Hard Radio app. Last night, a blown call changed the game. This morning, the internet law. its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise,

breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with So many incredible guests. I'm talking. Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing.

And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth? Are you a good person because you're afraid?

Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keer Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way. Open your free, Our Heart Radio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs?

Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s.

To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so you all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table. now. So. Thank you finishing that sentence.

Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth.

And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me, he goes, Hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office, blue, 42.

Hey, rep, my mama wants you to wave at her. What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clifford show on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. This weekend, it's a full slate of racing from Atlanta, Motor Speedway. Saturday, the trucks start us off at 1 Eastern on FS1, followed by the Xfinity

series over on Fox. Then on Sunday, it's the Folds of Honor Quick Trip 500, live at 3 Eastern on Fox and the Fox Sports app. You know, it's interesting. We talked about the PAC 12 being very academic leaning. It's largely based in California with Stanford and Cal and USC and USC and UCLA. USC admitted yesterday there will be class on campus, social distancing in the fall, which really signals, we will have a pack to 12 football season. And I've been wrong on this. I thought they would be the last to get going. I thought they would really just dab their feet in it.

But if you look at the virus, if you look at the stats in California, no deaths, zero to 17 years old due to the virus with 40 million people. Young people are the safest group by far statistically. And the numbers don't go up much, 18 to 28 at all. So I think it's the right move. I think it's prudent. I think if you look at where we are with the virus, there's more encouraging news than ever.

But I was wrong on that. I thought the PAC 12 would really roll this out slowly. And I thought the season was in jeopardy. I talked to PAC 12 coaches, assistant coaches, who were concerned. They just weren't going to have a season. It was a recruiting disadvantage. But yesterday, USC said they're back at it and they're back in. Chris Haynes now joining me, Fox Sports NBA analyst,

to be the Coward Global Satellite Network. All right, the 22-team format seems kind of gimmicky and complicated to me, but you talk to players and coaches. Are the players and coaches, Chris, are they in on it? What do they think? Yeah, this is probably the best case scenario for all parties involved. You know, you have bottom feeding teams who had no aspirations whatsoever to restart the season to be a part of that restart.

And then you had teams that were in contention to nab the final couple's playoff. spot. They wanted to be in. I spoke with Damien Little bit last week. He said he didn't want to play if he was going over there just to play meaningless games. And so the Portland Trailblazers, New Orleans Pelicans, you know, the Sacramento Kings, Washington Wizards,

those teams, they get a chance to try to play for a playoff berth. So I think this is the right scenario considering all things that happen. You know, I think they'll be in the crosshairs of the NFL season. College football, playoff baseball, which by the way, the Yankees, Dodgers, two national brands, are favored to win their divisions.

What do you make of the NBA having to go head to head? Baseball always does, but the NBA playoffs going head to head with football and the World Series. Now, when you look at it from that standpoint, that's not the best case in there, but, you know, there's no other avenues that the NBA has. You know, this has been, this hasn't been the best year economically for the NBA. when you go back to the beginning of the season with the Darryl Morey tweet. And so that hurt the NBA from the standpoint. Then this pandemic hitting, this has hit everybody. Everybody's been affected by this in some capacity.

So this is just the only avenue that the NBA has to restart this season, try to recoup as much revenue as possible because there might be a new CBA on the mound real soon. So, you know, they're going to compete with the NFL, the Major League Baseball. But, you know, this is the only way to kind of save. face from a financial standpoint. There's a lot of different ideas to give certain teams like Milwaukee and the Lakers some home court advantages in Disney World. What do you hear about those? Do you buy? I mean, they're talking about you get the ball out of bounds to start quarters. You get to choose your own home floor. You can bring you can you can you can send your home court to Disney World. You get to

choose your team hotel. You get the best hotels. What do you buy all of it? Look, I mean, I heard all that. And those are things that are being discussed and talked about. But is there really a home court advantage without the fans there, you know, without the home fans? So, I mean, all these gimmicks, you know, look, it's all, everybody's under, you know, a considerable amount of pressure. Everybody's feeling, you know, just the fact that there's going to be unease, there's going to be tension with everybody being in the bubble. So everybody is inconvenienced. You're not going to be able to create a real home court advantage over there. So the best situation is to get everybody out there and play games.

Let's just play games. Everybody's inconvenience. Let's just do the best we can with that. You know, it is difficult, Chris, to ask players to play, stop for several months and play again. Do you believe the players want to play? It's more of a money thing? Or do you really think they're all in emotionally to have an NBA season continue? I have to keep it honest.

I think it's more so a money thing. Like I said, the CBA could potentially be up. you know, they've been out for two months, man. There's a lot going on in our society right now, Colin. You know, it seems like entertainment is the least of a lot of people's concern right now. So, you know, if you're asking me, my opinion is it is more so a money thing for everybody involved. Players, owners, management, whatever. Because I think when it's all set and done, should basketball be returned, you know, I don't

No, it's up to the players. But I think most players are doing this for economic standards. Chris Haynes joining us. Chris, we've watched the protest since the murder of George Floyd over the last six days. I think it's six days. Your reaction to what you've seen, how does it land for you? You know, it seems like this is really the tilting point because, you know, we've seen a lot of people of color who were brutally beaten, you know, in police custody. or some were, you know, taken away from us permanently.

And I just think that what we're going through as a society with this pandemic, where everybody's at home, everybody's frustrated. And then this is just hitting right now. I think this is just, for some reason or another, this is the one that's kind of gotten a lot of people's attention more than usual. And, you know, I think it's good for the first time I can really see that this is just not an outcry. from people of color. And I'm starting to see even police officers, white police officers, our white fellows and brothers and sisters, you know, joining in these protests, joining in an outrage. And this being a community thing and not just an isolated race thing. So I'm liking

where this is going. Hopefully we do get to better days and better pastures. But, you know, this definitely has the field of a tilting point. This incident right here. And during this, This time, I think of what's raised so much awareness. All right. Well, we're crossing our fingers. Joy and I are crossing our fingers, Chris. Chris, by the way, just got back. This man is strong.

He just got back from a camping trip. And he went with his four daughters. He went with his wife. You went with your mother-in-law? Mother-in-law, too. Yeah, all in an RV. It was a nice RV. A 2019 Mercedes.

What is it? Integrity. Integra, is that what it called Bay? It's a Tegra RV. It fits seven people. You know what I mean? We went to Santa Bernardino Rainforest, you know, hiking out there, you know, went and saw some, look, first of all, you know, I don't hike.

I don't know many brothers that go hiking. But I did, Colin. I loved it. I was away, no sales service for a couple days. It was good to be, it's just good to be one with the earth. And then we went to San Diego Camp Land up there where it was by the beach, you know, on the boats and everything. It was a good time.

You should try some time, Colin. Yeah. I've camped a couple times. I actually like hiking. I'm a hike guy. But just four daughters, a wife, a mother-in-law, this is, yes, six women.

Listen, we love the women in our life. But even joy is smirking here. This is, this is good for you. That's all I'll say, Chris. It's good for me, Colin. That's one of the reasons why, you know, I can't wait to get back to this NBA season starting hit that road again.

We've had enough family time. I had enough family time. I love them, but, you know, it's time for dad to get the work. All right. Good seeing you, bud. Have a nice weekend. Have a nice rest of your week. Take care.

Good stuff. All right, Joy Taylor with the news. No, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Sponsored by Mercedes-Benz, the best or nothing. I like to hike. I am not a camper, though.

Yeah, I'm, you know, I always had a theory on camping. Why pay to lower my quality of life? Well, I think people like to, you know, connect to Earth and, you know, be out in the wild. No, I do too, but I like bathrooms. Yeah, no, I'm with you. I get what people want to do that. Yeah. I just don't have any desire at all.

Like, I went to summer camp and stuff when I was a kid or whatever, but it was still like cabins. I'm allergic to everything green also, so that's just not. I worked in a state park as a kid. you have to clean bathrooms in a state park as a kid. Camping's not. The lure of camping is not. It loses its luster. But the hike part. No, the hiking is great. I'll hike three times the next four days. Yeah, because you can go on a hike for the day and come back to your home.

Yes. Do you have your nature? Utah is one of my favorite places in the country. Yeah, perfect example. Yeah, just not too high of a mountain, just high enough, spend two hours hiking, sweat, come home, have a corona. I'm good. There you go. So Trent Williams is getting a fresh start in San Francisco after a a trade in Washington. He'll now be tasked with protecting Jimmy Garoppolo,

and he's very excited to team up with his new quarterback. I think Jimmy G is awesome. I think he's as proven, he's a quarterback that you can win with. In this league, it's just hard to find. You know, quarterback is the toughest position to pin down. I think that's why you see the contracts where they are. Having a quarterback that you know is going to make the right read, the right throw, I think that that has to be,

and has to allow Cal, you know, give him a chance to sleep at night because just, you know, having the guy that you know who won't throw the game away for you and, you know, you put him in the best position possible, he'll win. I feel like the future of the NFL has right now three solid teams that we feel comfortable could win, well, in the Chief's case, another Super Bowl, but could win a Super Bowl within the Super Bowl.

the next like five years. To me, that's the Niners, the Chiefs and the Ravens. And then there's like the Rams, obviously, we're in that conversation. We kind of don't know what they are. They had to retool because they paid everybody. The Cowboys, a lot of people feel like they have a lot of talent, but can they ever really get over that hump? Now they have Mike McCarthy. So there's like tears of teams to me, but the young like assembled teams, like maybe the Buccaneers can pull off a miracle or something like that. But to me, like the future of the NFL starts with the 49ers, the Chiefs and the Ravens. Yeah, I just think they have, I think they have quarterbacks. Now Kansas City will change with reasonable contracts.

I think you have really good coaches that align with their quarterbacks. Right. And I think if you look at the history of those three organizations, the Hunt family, Andy Reed, Brett Feet. Yeah, they're good ownership. Yeah, you just have, you just, you've got good GMs, you've got good owners, you got smart people. And, and I, I think, you know, like New Orleans is good, but they feel old at quarterback, you know, fair. Philadelphia, I like, but I cross my fingers on Carson Wentz's health. That's what I've said about Aaron Rogers and Green Bay. I think they're good. I just think you start looking at the top of the AFC and NFC and NFC, and you could see San Francisco, Baltimore, Kansas City, and respective conferences being up there for like 10 years.

Right. And that's my point. There are teams that are building towards the future. Like, we feel great about the Chargers roster, but we have to see what Justin Herbert is. You know, I like the future of the Dolphins. We have to see what two is. Like, they feel a few years off to me. Like those teams are going to be dominant for a while.

So a lot of big name NFL players are hoping to make a splash when they return to the field this year. According to Fox Bet, Ben Rothesberger is the favorite to win comeback player of the year in 2020 at plus 275. Gronk is a close second at plus 300, followed by JJ Watt at plus 550, Matthew Stafford, plus 800. And A.J. Green at plus 900. I'll go Matt Stafford. Matt Stafford, huh? Well, I think we forgot about him. and I think he's talented and I think he needed the rest and he didn't have an OTA.

I think his body, he hasn't has the greatest protection. I think Matt Stafford's body needed a rest. I think I think JJ Watt is probably where I would put my money. But I think Ben Rathesberger is going to, just because he is with the Steelers and they were just on the verge of making the playoffs last year with Mason Rudolph and Duck Hodges. Obviously, there's a reason why he has the best odds. That kind of makes sense to me. But AJ Green is interesting, but I don't think that the, Bengals are going to win enough games for him to be catapulted into that position.

I think he's going to have a good year, but the overall team performance is not going to be good enough to get him comeback player the year. We'll talk more about this on Joy Chat today at 3.30 Eastern on caffeine. Free app. Go download it and subscribe to the Fox Sports channel. So the Giants have only been to the playoffs once since their last Super Bowl win in the 2011 season. Isn't that crazy? Because the New York Giants. They've only been the playoffs once since 2011. 11. Once in nine years.

Yeah. It is, it's, they were, they're a blue blood. Like they're, but that's not good. No. Well, Golden Tate is confident the team can get back to their winning ways this year. I'm just excited to get back out there and play some football, man. Like you said, my 11th season, I still feel really, really good. I love the direction that we're going in as an organization.

Today I walk in the building. I've always thought this is a grade A organization that does everything great. So now we just got to put together on the. field and give our fans something to cheer loud and proud for and get back to what we know the Giants to be. There's a lot I like about the Giants and they have a superstar in Sequin Barkley. They have their quarterback. They have two really good two really good defensive linemen. There's a lot of like about the Giants. But this year, I just don't think is the year. And that's not their fault. There's a pandemic. And I just, I don't, that's a lot to put together new staff

when you can't get everyone together until training camp. Yeah, I just don't. know who Joe Judge is. I have no idea. Now, Jim Harbaugh, John Harbaugh, by the way, was a special teams coach. He became a head coach, and John Harbaugh is great. But generally, there's this, you're a big coordinator, offense, or defense, you become head coach. So Joe Judge is taking more the John Harbaugh route, which is, you just don't know. Like Brian Flores, okay, you're the defensive side nine times, nine years, Bell. That's the way you go about it. So when you bring guys that don't come from the classic coordinator position, you just don't know. Wait, and there's nothing to judge or predict because we have no idea what he's going to be.

But I'm saying the giants who have clearly been a little bit dysfunctional over the past decade have a lot to overcome and get going this year. And they're just behind it. So I think by mid-season, we'll start to see more of a flow and see the system kick in and have a better ability to judge what they're becoming. But the beginning of the year is just, I think it's going to be rough. Yeah, I agree. Joy, with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by.

The Heard Lye News. So I went on for about 10 minutes yesterday about Trevor Lawrence being amazing. Daniel Jeremiah is a really talented former NFL scout works in our business. And he was scouting Justin Fields. Justin Fields is a, we're not talking about Justin Fields. The kid's remarkable. Last year he had 41 touchdown passes, three picks for Ohio State. 6-3, 230, unbelievable athlete.

I mean, he was the number one high school quarterback in the country, not Trevor Lawrence three years ago. I mean, that tells you how good he is. And Trevor Lawrence is like the second highest rated high school quarterback, maybe in the last 10 years. The kid's just a, he's going to be a great player. But he's being overshadowed because Clemson has won a national title with Trevor Lawrence. And Trevor Lawrence is really an all-time unique talent. I think Justin Fields is an A prospect, which is higher than a Joe Burrow.

I think he's a better prospect than a Sam Darnold, who I like. I don't think he's quite Andrew Locke, but I think he is in that class, and that is a very elevated class. And Daniel Jeremiah kind of compared him. He sees some Dak Prescott. I think he's better than Dak Prescott. But it does get me to think, which is a really cool thing happening in the NFL. So let's say this year, let's say Tua works eventually for the Miami Dolphins. Justin Herbert works for the Chargers and Joe Burrell works for the Bengals eventually.

And I think all three will. I like all three for different reasons. I do think Burrell is going to work. I just think it's going to be a really rough first year. maybe first two years. So they work. So we got the chargers out of the quarterback look. We got the Cincinnati, Miami chargers off the quarterback market.

Let's say we gave Dwayne Haskins seven games. Let's take a deep breath. Can we give him 16? Let's say it works. He's a big strong kid with a big arm, played one year of college. Let's say Ron Rivera gets him to 7 and 9, 8, and 8. And Ron's like, I don't want to make a quarterback change. He got better from last year to this year.

It's my first year with him. I'm going to stay with Dwayne Haskins. When Dwayne Askins came out, I said at the time, He looked like a number one pick to me. Big, strong, great program, big arm, athletic enough, pocket guy. As long as he didn't have to wiggle too much in the pocket and kind of stay where he's at. He's a pocket guy. And then next year you have Jacksonville, we presume, getting Trevor Lawrence, who is an A-plus prospect.

And let's say New England moves up. They're 6 and 10. They use their picks because we're running out of teams that need quarterbacks and they get Justin Fields. Then there's a kid that everybody likes named Trey Lance who went to college at North North Dakota State where Carson Wentz went. They say he is a second or third best player in the draft. He's that talented. Now, I don't know, but let's just say he pops.

He works. They're saying he's the third best quarterback in the draft. He didn't throw an interception last year, not the third best player or third best quarterback. Remember, the whiff rate on quarterbacks, college to pro, has, I mean, Josh Rosen, Paxton Lynch is about it. Everything's working. We are reaching a saturation point. I mean, if Burrow works, Tua works, Herbert works.

If Justin works and Trevor Lawrence works and Trey Lance works, that's six teams off the market. If Dwayne Haskins can play, and I think there's something there, let's just give the kid another 16 games. Folks, your translation is, you're going to see a lot more of this Mitch Trabisky. You go 19 and 10, and they're bringing somebody else in. You can't do a baker and call out a medical staff.

They'll move you. we are reaching a point. We are seeing elite prospects, not good, spectacular. Even the guys I like people like more, Joe Burrow. And we're getting like three minimum a year. And this is because the NFL is adopting college concepts. We're getting a point. You're running out of teams that need a quarterback.

And I'm assuming Gardner Minshu won't be a starter. Look pretty good. Look at the talent around him. Look at his numbers. Look pretty good. It's an exciting time. We are about next year's draft away and watching Burrow, Two and Justin Herbert. We are next year's draft away.

There's more quarterbacks than we have teams that need quarterbacks. And it's bad news for guys that act up, come into the league immature, get off to a slow start, maybe don't have the perfect coach to lead them. Coming up next, Mark Schleris stops by. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, F.S1 and the IHeart Radio app. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind.

Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves.

Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the high. from viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsSlice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking.

Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses.

Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, Because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth? Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing,

growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-taped Little Kim's boobs at the VMA? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with a little Kim?

Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack.

I'm down to talk about crack on day, but yeah, yeah, literally. But just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really?

Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Clifford Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game.

This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, rec, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Parker.

Listen to the Cliverts show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Welcome back. Good to have you. And Casper's done everything to build the dream bedroom now, offering free contactless delivery, as always, free returns. Terms and conditions apply. Go to casper.com for more information. Mark Schlerth is joining me, Fox Sports NFL analyst via the Coward Global Satellite Network

and his home in beautiful Colorado. All right, pro football focus, top 50 players. They did have an offensive lineman in the top five, Quentin Nelson, but no Aaron Rogers, Mark, what did you make of that? There's two things. There's two issues. Okay, one, I always put quarterbacks in a different category. Like, I don't consider them like football players.

Like, they're quarterbacks. And I know they play football, and I know they play the most important role in football. But I always kind of put them in their own category. But if we're putting quarterbacks in your top 50 players overall to not have Aaron Rogers in the top 50, it's a stupid list. It's a list that has no merit to it because Aaron Rogers, let's not forget that Eric Rogers was the best off platform thrower that we had ever seen, the most accurate off platform thrower that we had ever seen in football until Patrick Mahomes, the unicorn came along.

So are we forgetting how good this guy is? By the way, here's a guy that's going to the Hall of Fame that has thrown a total of one touchdown to first round draft picks over the course of his career. and that first rounder was drafted by the Jacksonville Jaguars in Mercedes-Louis. It's not like they put a plethora of number one weapons around the guy. He is a phenomenal football player. And for him not to be on this list, to me, it's just a stupid list. That's what it comes down to.

Troy Aikman said this week, he thinks the Cowboys roster stacks up with virtually anyone. I don't. I think San Francisco, New Orleans, Baltimore, Kansas City. I think my problem with Dallas is they have surveillance. really high-end players and then a bunch of holes, corner, center, safety, interior, defensive line. I don't think it's a top five, top six roster. I looked this morning.

I had it at about eight, nine. Your thoughts? I think that probably there are four or five rosters that I put above them, maybe six or seven rosters that I put above them. But the bottom line is, do they have enough talent to win an NFC championship? Absolutely. do they have enough talent to go, you know, to go to a Super Bowl? I think there's no question.

It's more than talent, though. You know, it comes down to coaching. It comes down to organizational structure. It comes down to all those things that really separate you from being a good football team to a great football team, a great football team, to an exceptional football team. Talent is a big part of it. There is no question. But talent that isn't connected, talent that isn't sacrificing for one another. talent that isn't on the same page that isn't complimentary does nothing for you.

So the Dallas Cowboys are not a, it's not a talent issue with their football team, more than it is an organizational structure issue with their football team. That's what's keeping them from winning NFCE championships and going to championship games. By the way, you're a very popular radio show in Denver in the morning. It's one of the highest Reddit Sports Talk Radio Morning shows, maybe the highest. Schlerth and Evans 104.3, the fan in Denver. I imagine a topic this morning. It was leading my show as Vic Fangio,

who I think can be well-meaning, but he said there's no racism. He doesn't see it at all in the NFL. I disagree with that. I thought it was a little tone-deaf. I imagine it was a topic on your show. What are your thoughts on it? Yeah, my thoughts are, in context, I understand what he's saying.

It's that the NFL is a meritocracy, and for you to get an opportunity to play in the NFL, you've got to earn it. Like everything, you've got to earn it. And it's that way inside a locker room. It's that way, you know, from players, to player. We know that it doesn't matter what the color of skin is, where the background is, where you went to school. It doesn't matter if you went to a little school like I did at the

University of Idaho or whether you went to the University of Alabama. If you can play, you're going to get the opportunity to play. That's how it works inside the locker room and that's how it works, you know, from who the coaches pick to play. Now remember, McFandjo's been coaching for 40 years, 40 plus years, I think 32 of it in the NFL. And like he's been a, a, coordinator for 20 plus years in the NFL, one of the best coordinators, and he just got his first opportunity to be a head coach last year. So he's been passed over a million times himself. So, I mean, I look at it more like contextually, he's talking about your opportunity to get on the playing field. He understands, you know, he understands that there is some racism,

there is some issues, and at least the NFL has dealt with it, or at least tried to deal with it maybe not perfectly, obviously not, but at least they've acknowledged it and are trying to do things to fix it. You know, not that you'll ever fix everything, but at least they're trying. So I look at it more of a context issue, but, you know, Vic Fangio is old school that way, and there's been plenty of things he said as the head coach of Denver Broncos that haven't gone over exceptionally well with people inside the organization. And that's part of, that's part of the charm of Vic Fangio is like he's going to say what's on his mind but in context I think it was more about your opportunity to get on the football field and play yeah as a player uh a couple minutes

left how good of shape could you be in today as an NFL player with no OTAs like I think of you as a lifter I mean I'm sure you could jog around the neighborhood or have a treadmill but like how good of shape could you have been in with no OTAs and camps pushback? Yeah, I think it's really hard, Colin. The only thing that you can do to get yourself in shape to play football is to play football. So regardless, you're going to be able to create a baseline of being in shape. But the kinesthetic, like we go into the kinesthetic awareness, the proper reception skills of one guy against another guy, you know, pushing on people and doing all those things. That can only be replicated through playing football.

And so anytime you go into training camp, you're not going to be in quote unquote football until you start actually playing football. And in today's game, even in the OTAs, they can't do that anymore because you're not allowed. You know, we circumvented the rules when I played. Like there was, it was a full go, full contact, no pads. And if you didn't like it, you don't have to be here. That's the way it worked. It's different today, right?

So I think that nobody really is in shape when they get to camp in, quote unquote, football shape and less so today than you know than then back in in my day so I think it's exceptionally tough and now that they came out with hey we're not going to have these joint practices anymore that's not going to happen it makes it that much more difficult for these teams to really get themselves ready to play this upcoming season about 45 seconds here how many things are open in Denver are restaurants where are you guys at we're just outside of Denver so we're in the burbs But like everything, restaurants have opened, but it's more, you know, limited seating, limited capacity, only 50% of capacity. And most of it is outdoor type seating right now.

So there are a lot of things that are open. There's still the masks and the suggested masks and all those things that are being required, you know, pretty much required to go into grocery stores and the restaurants and those things. But things are slowly opening up here in Denver. Good stuff, Mark. Have a great weekend. And the rest of your week. I'm off tomorrow. I'm going to hang out and do some hiking and whatever I do.

But it's good seeing you. All right. Mark Slareth. Yeah, it's, we opened up in our little town for like a day and then it closed down again because of, you know, the protests. So, you know, towns are, so it's been a rough few months for restaurant tours in America. You know, this is the situation we're in. So, all right, two hours down, one to go. Start, start your day with M Drive Start, the world's best morning shake, had one about three days ago.

Check it out. MDrive Start.com. nutrition, lean muscle, all good. MDrive Start.com. Check it out. All right. Hour 3. Rich Clyman, business partners with Kevin Durant's going to be joining us. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd. Weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific.

Father's day can be stressful. Find the perfect gift for dad. Go to Tommyjohn.com. HARD. Get it in by June 17th. Your order, 25% off sitewide. Tommyjohn.com code H.R.D. wearing a Tommy John t-shirt this morning. I'm an unmade bet of a human being for the last three weeks have been on the air. It's getting worse, so I need to get another haircut.

Rich Climitt is the co-founder of 35 Ventures. That's Kevin Durant's business. He founded it with Kevin. That's Kevin's number. He's his business partner. We had him on radio and TV, I should say, about a month ago. Fascinating guy has his hands all over the NBA and many thoughts. And he is joining us now via the Cower Global Satellite Network.

Rich Clyman is joining us. Let's start with this. What are your thoughts on the 22 team format? Are you okay with the format? You bet. I have no simp in the car cut. Well, here's the thing. I think that there was not going to be one solution that unanimously everybody was going to look.

I think from the perspective of getting basketball back and getting it back as safe and getting a season to finish. And I don't know I was here. Kind of gimmicks. If anything, if there was ever going to be a time to look to evolve the game in any way, to try out new formats, to try out new play-in systems, all of these things that you mentioned that may or may not even be accurate, I think it's now and I think people will be open to it.

And I don't think there's going to be enough live sports. So I don't think it will be overshadowed by anything else. I said earlier that Zion Williamson was a captivating kid to me. the size, the power, Duke, the controversy on the shoe, the injury. I just find him captivating. And when I looked at 22 teams, my takeaway was they want to wedge Zion into this thing. And Damian Lillard out west, too. Do you think some of this is, listen, this is a league built on stars.

Those are two of our best stars. Listen, different owners have different opinions. There may be owners that felt, and that then spots to get more stars in Orlando. There's ending megastars enough in LeBron and AD. in the power anyway that, I don't know if it's that. I think that there's teams that probably wanted to be out there and the happy medium was 22 teams. I don't fully understand the play in format,

but I think to be able to add intrigue to the last 10 games of the Cs, 10 games of kind of rule, because generally outside of one or two teams, you pretty much. Yeah, I agree. So, you know, we've talked to, I led my show today with it. I led the third hour with it. you know, what we're dealing with in America right now. You know, whether white people want to admit it or not, institutional racism,

we have created a system for over 100 years, which doesn't benefit all people equally. And people are mad and they're tired and they're in pain. And overwhelmingly, we have seen peaceful protests. You know, it's interesting. I'm interested in your perspective on a star-driven league, your relationship with KD, you have access to people I do not. Let me start with how it's first landing for you, what you're watching on television. Much anger and sadness and in-jerk community has had to deal with. Come to this because I truly deal with it, the next generations, and I think that in a lot of ways, I like to think of my,

myself as an eternal optimist and I think, well, okay, well, nobody can hide. And that gives me some optimism in that maybe a long journey back to some real change, to some change. And that I'm also realistic. And there's so many ignorant people in this world. And if you didn't know it, you can't run and hide from it. And if you still don't understand it, then I don't know how we overcome that. But I know that the conversation has never been louder. And I know that people are seeing it and people are talking about it. And now action has to take place. And that action comes in the form of voting and that action comes in the form of education.

White people need to educate their kids, generation after generation. So, you know, from that standpoint, I feel good about how much dialogue there is and how many people are fully aware of the pain and anger that this system has. So from that standpoint, I'm up. And you know what? With that, like when people are angry, they say things. I'm not saying that every looter was acting at a sheer anger. There's some people that were looting that I'm sure we're using this as an opportunity.

But the majority of the people are peacefully protesting and their anger is... You know, it's funny. I text my daughter this morning and I said, she's a teenager and I said, how are you doing? And she says, I'm not sleeping well. People are dying and I'm finding how corrupt our country is. And my thing I said back to her, my text was, yes, and that's why voting matters because policy, become increasingly corrupt if the wrong people are running the state, the city, or the country we live in. And I said, you know, and I was going to talk later today about that.

And I think one of the things you touched on is ultimate power is getting people out of office that you don't think have the best interests of your state or your country. And I've said this multiple times on the air. I don't think the current person leading our country is the right person. ever. Have you talked about this with players about voting? Because there has been a history sometimes that certain communities get to the voting booth. Certain ages do. Young people don't vote as often as older people do. Have you talked to players about this? Talk about it in general, because I talk about, and the conversation and NBA players are, like I think we talked about this

last time, in terms of understanding society, politics, business, some of the most astute minds we have in this country. The situation and the action, we have to see that make sure that we encourage understand how in this time in our world, a pandemic, and then what's happened now in our country and what we're seeing with, and I'm not questioning, it's bigger than that now for like the first time in our country that if you're a and you're, you want the best for what is in store for them in the future, family and what's right over policy. And that's what I need to happen in this election. And that's what I'm hoping that in this education and conversation, mean, and anger that's been called. That is more important. And that you can have a negotiation

and a conversation with the other side. And people are, we're seeing the other night at the White House, it scares me to think that that's what's in, it's imperative that people look within themselves, get out and vote. And also, I was going to ask you a basketball question, but I don't, I'd rather just talk about this. And I think, yeah. You talk about. You talk about. and talk about basketball. Okay, I'll ask you one more. All right. I don't think we're going to have an asterisk.

I think whoever wins is going to win, and we're going to look, I'm going to take the other end of the telescope. That we're going to look at the team that wins this year, and we're going to go, holy hell, what an unbelievable, no home court advantage. I don't think we'll do an asterisk. I think it will be, it will embolden whoever wins more. If Kauai wins with the clippers, I think people are going to go, you've got to be. kidding me. He won in Canada? He won during a pandemic. That's how I see it, that it won't be seen as a weakness. It will be seen as an unbelievable strength, playing, staying in a hotel, not a single home court game. What do you make of the asterisk talk?

Connotation that things like that are created. No way you can come. I mean, these guys are going to hoop, but no fans changes things. They're not to indicate that this. That being said, I think, all these asterisk. Yeah, they're all facing the same issue. And they're all facing the same crisis planning Disney World next to roller coasters. So I think it's amazing. By the way, your typical day note, Rich, what do you do in a typical day? How limited are you? How limited is Kevin in terms of business? Well, in our business, we create content. We do a lot from that standpoint. And then, you know, we had a few documentaries that came out in the last few months. You know, Kevin leads in different in how they get to work. And Kevin is like, you know,

like a roll up your sleep you know we've been deploying capital and the busy and to stay rich climbing i always love having you own appreciate you man just a love it's a smart guy like talking i just like talking we challenge i want to challenge people we need to good talking to you man i am just i am again an unmade bed of a man right now um i just love rich joy taylor with the news Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. The Browns are learning a new offense with Kevin Savansky on board as the new head coach.

And guard Joel Petonio thinks that the new system is going to be a great fit for Baker Mayfield this year. Okay. All right. Baker, I think he works in this offense great. He's going to be able to sell those runs and set up in the pocket. And it's not just drop back passing 50 times game, which is a benefit to the O-line, too. If you can sell the run and play action and boot and run keepers off of, off of the pocket. the run game, it's going to give Baker another second or two to, you know, have guys get

open and run routes. If you look at the stats kind of from the last couple of years, Baker's actually been a really good rollout quarterback and a quarterback that's, you know, been able to throw off the run and stuff like that. So I think this offense fits them really well. And I'm excited to, you know, get some reps and see a minute. You know, people don't talk about this. It is much tougher for an offensive lineman to pass block than a run block.

Their size and their nature is hike, mow somebody over. To ask them to drop back, not be aggressive, and to pass block somebody like your brother, one of the reasons a running game is important and you don't want to pass 35 times a game, it's simply asking your offensive line to block more athletic people back pedal. Whereas if I'm 6'5-308 and you're asking me to block downhill, I'm just, that's my, That's my sweet spot. So for Baker, Baker throws 27 times a game, not 34. It's just easier on the offensive line, especially in a division that's got nothing

but pass rushers in Baltimore and Pittsburgh. So it's not an anti-Baker thing. All teams, even with Mahomes, it is so much harder on your own line to ask them to pass block 34 times. I do feel like, though, I can't decide if I'm selling my brown stock too early. or not. No, I thought they would make the playoffs last year, and I was very wrong. And, you know, when I put some stock in the Browns and I'm wrong, it's like an extra jab

because I should know better, right? But now this year, circumstances are a lot different. Peter King doesn't like him. I don't know. You know what? I just feel like I want to believe, but every time I do that, it's the same thing. It's me in the Atlanta Falcons. At some point I've been burned so many times by the Atlanta Falcons.

I just quit. You're going to finish third, maybe fourth. You are never going to quit the Falcons. I mean, just always that. The Falcons are going to win a couple games this year. I know it. Well, I like the owner. I like the GM.

I like the quarterback. And I'm usually okay with their coach. So I'm always like, well, they're AAAB. All right, they'll win 11 games. Burned. Burned every time. Burned with Atlanta. I'm done.

That's how I feel about the rounds. So CBS Sports ranked the best shooters in NBA history. And the Splash Brothers are at the top of the this. Steph got the number one spot and Clay is number two, followed by Ray Allen, Larry Bird, and Reggie Miller. How do you feel about that top five? Well, Larry was in a generation where he only shot two, threes a game. So I think, I've said this before. There are certain players in my life that would, like, LeBron would be good at any generation. So would Magic MJ. You know, certain people, like Brady would have been great now then. You know, Larry Bird, I think,

would be elevated in today's game over his game because he was an un-bler. He was the best shooter in the league. He was a forward. So I think Larry's better than people think. Reggie Miller is a very interesting player. Reggie Miller and his sister are like a basketball brand. And he's been a broadcaster. He was in hugely important NBA games.

And he was often great in those games. But Reggie could be a very hot and cold player. And that is not to say he wasn't great, but he was great in spots. So it's not that he's overrated, but I wouldn't put him in my top five because Reggie, he was a big shot maker. He was just his look, his personality, his battles with Spike Lee. You know, he's playing against the Knicks. He's playing against MJ. I think Larry Bird's a little low, and I don't know what to do with Reggie Miller.

So Kevin Durant is eight. I don't know. Where's Dirk Novitsky? Dirk is nine. So they have Kyle Corber six. He doesn't have a lot of big shots to me. Steve Nash. Now, Steve Nash is below Corver?

Yeah. Yeah, I'd put, now, you've got to have big, no, Reggie's got a lot of big shots. I don't love his consistency. He'd be in my top 10. Nash, way more consistent than Kyle Corver, who can do it.

But how many big shots does Corver have in his career? Like, memorable big shots. Nash has several. I have more problems with 6 through 15 than I do with the top 5. So give me, give me the 15. So it's Kyle. Corber 6, Steve Nash, then Kevin Durant, Durk at 9, Steve Kerr at 10, J.J. Reddick at 11, Pisa Stuyakovich at 12, Mark Price, Chris Mullen, and Drazen Petrovich at 15.

Yeah, Chris Mullen's another guy that generationally he would be much higher, but it wasn't. Yeah, I mean, I guess, I guess my, here's my fundamental thing. Reggie Miller's a little high. Larry Bird's a spot low. You look at Ray Allen? Boy, Larry Bird was great. Larry Bird was great. Ray Allen had the biggest shot.

Now, again, you're talking about, we're talking splitting hairs. We're talking about great players. Yeah, no, it's not an egregious spot. But Ray played some. So you have the problem with Steph Curry and Clay Thompson at one and two. I don't really have a problem. I don't. I would say flip, Ray.

Allen and Bird won. Reggie feels a little high. Actually, Durant and Dirk, Nevitsky both feel a little low. Six through 15 is more where the argument starts. So the MLS players have agreed to a new CBA through the 2025 season and that clears the way for the league's plan to resume the season this summer. MLS Commissioner Don Garber held a press conference today and confirmed that all 26 teams will return to play in July with a tournament hosted in Orlando. Orlando's the spot. right now. Dates and details with tournament have not been finalized, but it will not be more than 35 days long, and players will take a 5% salary adjustment in 2020. So we are going to get soccer. This is the sport to me that it's an international sport. They have a lot of international stars.

I think the MLS is going to work seamlessly. We may not pay attention to it as much, but if you look at soccer, foot on ball, goalie wears gloves, you don't share a ball. There is a lot of actual spacing. You have a huge pitch and not many players. Soccer's the one sport to me, the team sport that works instantly. It just works. Even in the Italian league, they're opening back up here in about two weeks. Soccer's been back for a couple weeks internationally.

So this is good news. We'll have some live sports on. Yeah. They're going to lose a billion dollars, though, in the pandemic. And that's not a league that just has a billion dollars to, you know, baseball could lose five to seven. MLS is going to lose a billion dollars. Yeah.

Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lye News. I'm bizarrely accurate, and I'm not going to apologize. I'll predict two his first win. Justin Herbert's first win. Joe Burroughs' first win.

And Jordan Love's first win. The rookie quarterback's first win of next year. There's a science to it that's coming up. Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Okay, Casper has everything to build the dream bedroom. Go to casper.com for more information. the code is heard, H-E-R-D. So I'm going to predict with stunning accuracy like last year and the year before with Lamar Jackson

when Joy, in best for last, a quarterback wins his first game. There's a science to it. There's a science to it. So let's go to the first quarterback picked Joe Burrow-Sin-Sin-A-Sin-A-Bingles. This is the easy one. So people like Joe Burrow, I think he's a good prospect entering a brutal division. He's going to lose to the Chargers, Cleveland, and Philadelphia at open. These are elite defensive fronts.

But I do believe at home against the Jacksonville team that is rebooting, I don't call it tanking, it's rebooting. It'll be one of only maybe four or five wins. I think that's an easy one. I think Joe Burrough's first win is against the Jacksonville Jaguars week for the NFL. Okay. Let's go to Tua, number five-picked dolphins. Now, Ryan Fitzpatrick, according to Mike Garifolo,

Fitzpatrick's the starter. That's a story out today. He's the starter. So Fitzpatrick has a history of playing very well early. He'll beat New England at New England. Belichick's worst month is September. Fitzpatrick's best month is September. He also is a veteran quarterback who's faced Belichick many times.

I think Miami then splits Buffalo. beats a loses at Jacksonville wins. Then they have Seattle and San Francisco. They lose both. The coaching staff in Miami will strongly consider starting Tua at Denver. You're going to have talk shows in Miami. Let's go. We're two and three.

Let's go. Let's get Tua in. The coaching staff, knowing Denver and that altitude in Vic Fangio is not an ideal start. They'll start him the following week at home against the charger. They will not win that game. It's to his first start. Chargers defense is the best secondary in the NFL. But two is first win will be week eight against the Rams at home.

Remember, previous week, the Rams play Monday night football, short week. The week after that game, the Rams have it off. Are they overlooking Miami with a losing record? Rams will have a winning record. Tua's first win will be over the L.A. Rams at home in week eight. Now, Justin Herbert. Number six, went to the Chargers.

Now, Tyrod Taylor is the starter. I am told they're all in on him. And Tyrod, this will be interesting. He'll open at Cincinnati with a win, lose to Kansas City, beat Carolina, then have a two-game losing streak at Tampa and at New Orleans. The staff will stick with him. They have committed to him.

And he'll go on a four-game winning streak. Tyrod and the Chargers will beat the Jets, beat Miami, beat Jacksonville, and beat the Raiders. Then they're feeling good about themselves. They'll face Denver and Buffalo, lose both on the road. And the Chargers staff and Anthony Lynn will go, we are six and five. We are struggling against the better defenses we have faced, which is Tampa, New Orleans, Denver Buffalo. It's time. they come back at home against New England.

Now, Belichick is great at home against rookie quarterbacks. His record isn't as devastating, devastating, on the road against younger quarterbacks. And Justin Herbert gets his first win, week 13, at home. Remember, the Chargers staff is into Tyrod Taylor. But they're going to look at Kansas City pulling away from them. My prediction is Denver's a wildcard team. They're six and five. They get New England at home.

And then the schedule is very manageable. And they're going to say, let's go and give Justin the team in week 13, and he wins. And finally, the number 26 overall pick, Jordan Love. Now, barring an injury, Aaron Rogers will play all 17 weeks. But I know he will start at some point. And I look at that division and I think, let's see, who's not well run? and who will I know be on Green Bay's schedule. So I am predicting that Jordan Love will beat the Detroit Lions in 2022.

I'm guessing it's at Lambo. I know they play them, and I know they're not well run. And they'll probably have a new coach and perhaps a new GM and the same old owner. So in review, Joe Burrow wins week four against Jacksonville. Tua's first win is week eight against the Rams Justin Herbert's first win is week 13 against New England

and Jordan Love wins in two years against Detroit. I like it. So do I. Start your day with MDrive Start. Check it out MDrive Start.com. Nutrition. Supplements. Feels great. Had it one a couple of days ago. All right, I'm off tomorrow and Friday. Joy off Friday. It was a good show today. It really moved.

It was. We just flew through it. Thanks to everybody and be safe out there. Take a deep breath. I'll see you next Monday. Joy will be here tomorrow. It's the hurt. Last night, a blown call changed a game.

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