The Jeff Cavins Show (Your Catholic Bible Study Podcast) - How Do I Explain Catholicism to My Friend?

Episode Date: September 29, 2017

Catholicism is filled with beautiful complexities, but when it comes time to explain our Catholic faith to a friend, we often don't know where to begin. In this week's episode, Jeff gives tips to help us start the conversation, and he reminds us to remember the most important reason for sharing our faith- God's desire to be in relationship with each of his children.

You're listening to the Jeff Kavana's show, episode 35. How do I explain Catholicism to my friends? Hey, I'm Jeff Kavins. How do you simplify your life? How do you study the Bible? All the way from motorcycle trips to raising kids, we're going to talk about the faith and life in general. It's the Jeff Kaven show.

Welcome to the show, my friend. Hope you're having a wonderful, wonderful. week. And I hope you're growing in the Lord and spending time in prayer, reading the word, and listening to the guiding of the Holy Spirit as a modern day disciple. I'll tell you, since I have started to think about my walk with the Lord more from the perspective of being a modern day disciple than just a believer or putting a label on myself, which is not bad. Don't get me wrong. I am a Catholic Christian through and through. But I wake up. I wake up. in the morning and the first thing I think of is that I am a disciple of the Lord.

I'm a follower of the King of Kings and what a great adventure I have been invited to go on. And every day things can change and every single day there are opportunities to do great things and to encounter wonderful people and to call on God in very interesting situations. And so that, you know, following Jesus really does make life worthwhile and just just his friendship and his companionship and knowing that I've got the saints got my back and I've got the Eucharist, the sacraments. I've got the word of God, the catechism, the Holy Spirit, my God, the Father, Jesus, my brother and king and Lord, Mary is my mother.

We're so blessed, you know, to go on this journey and to have so many wonderful, wonderful things to assist us. But you know, what I have run into in my own life, particularly at the beginning of coming back to the Catholic Church after being away for about 15 years in Protestant circles, was this whole problem of how do I get my arms around Catholicism? And this is a question that I have been asked many, many times by people on the road when I'm speaking or I get an email or a text. and it simply kind of goes like this. Mr. Kavens, I want to share the Catholic faith with my friends. I used to be a Baptist, I used to be a Lutheran, I used to be Assembly of God, Nondonam, and it seemed to be easy to talk to people about this relationship with the Lord.

But now that I'm Catholic, it seems more difficult and I'm having a hard time getting my hands, my head, my heart around all that we call Catholicism. in such a way that I can share it with my friends. And I have heard this a lot. That's what I want to talk about on today's show today is I got a solution for you, how to do that. And I think it's going to be really successful. I know it is in my life.

And I'm going to provide you with a structure on which you can do that. And I think that's going to be really, really valuable. You know, I remember as a kid growing up in the Catholic Church, and if you are a cradle Catholic you probably remember this too that when you go to church as a kid, you know, and you walk into

the average Catholic church it can seem a little overwhelming. There's just so much. But before I go on, just let me pause and say something here and that is this. When it comes to explaining God and his family in the church

and his whole plan that he has, it is big. Because God is big. God is not small. His family is not small. small. He is big and he is deep. And so is his world and his plan. But it is worth pursuing to figure this out and to wrap our arms and our head and our heart around it so that we can explain it to other people. We owe this to the world, to know our faith so that we can explain it to the world.

Well, as a kid, you walk in to the Catholic Church and you see so much. You see an altar. You see a priest, you see nuns, you see candles, you see statues, stations of the cross, you've got all kinds of holy cards, and you've got all kinds of ideas, you've got heaven, hell, purgatory, you've got venal sin, mortal sin, you've got saints, you've got the Blessed Mother, you've got the papacy, you've got the catechism, you've got the Eucharist, and there's just so much to Catholicism, and where do you begin in explaining this? this to your friends. I understand that. You know, I'm reminded of a great champion of the faith in England years ago that I quote quite often. His name is Frank Sheed. I'll put the name in the show

notes for you. He's worth looking up. I mean, he's since passed away, but he used to stand in Hyde Park in London and proclaim the gospel as a Catholic, and he was what was known as an apologist. An Apologist is not someone who's running around apologizing for being Catholic, but they are someone who very, very well explains the faith and defends the faith. So he was an apologist, and one of the things that he wrote about is he wrote about the complexity of Catholicism, and he put it this way, and I've quoted it often. Maybe you've heard me mention it. He said that our kids go through all these years of Catholic education. In the United States, that's kindergarten through 12th grade. And after going from kindergarten all the way to 12th grade, we end up with what he calls

a pile of Catholicism, a heap of Catholicism. And you know what I'm talking about. It's a great, big pile of Catholicism, unorganized, but it's there. We went through all those years of CCD or Catholic school and we started to amass and accumulate all these little nuggets, you know, about our faith, whether it's Mary, the Saints, the Eucharist, the papacy, whether it's about the Word of God or whether it's about sin or life in Christ, whatever it is. We've been collecting all this to the best of our ability, and it's in a pile. And the problem is that many of us, once we grow up and we go through adolescence in our young adult years, we kind of wake up, you know, I think, you know, I really do want to serve God, and we have kind of a new awakening

in our life. But we have still the same old problem, and that's, we got this pile. And I remember myself, you know, thinking, well, I'm going to venture out a little bit. I'm going to leave this pile behind when I was about 18 years old, and you say to your mom, Well, I'm going to go over to the Assembly of God, or I'm going to go over and I'm going to look at Eastern Relatives. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do that. And she says, well, you can't do that. And you look at her and say, why not?

And she points to the pile and says, you got a pile of Catholicism and we paid for it. And Dad and I, we've got our pile. And Grandma and Grandpa, they brought their pile over from Ireland. You're Catholic. And you think, yeah, I guess I'm Catholic. But you don't know exactly what it means. and you don't know how to really get your mind around all of this in such a way that you can explain it to somebody else.

Now, St. Peter tells us that we should be able to give an explanation for the hope that is within us. And I would argue that every Catholic should be able to defend their faith and be able to explain the entire plan of God to anybody that comes up and asks. I think that's really, really important. But then we get back to our topic for this week, you know, how do I do it? How do I do it? Well, I would start by saying, get a life.

Now, I'm not saying that in a mean way. I mean it in a positive way. Get a life. The key to understanding Catholicism and explaining Catholicism to people does not stop at the doctrinal theological, conceptual level. It starts with a whole life, that God is giving us a life here on earth that will make a difference all the way into eternity. Now, what I want to talk to you about today is a tool that will literally change your life. And when I mention to you what the tool is, you might think, oh, I have one of those.

I didn't do anything for me. Maybe it didn't because maybe you didn't know how to use it. I want to explain to you how to use it. That tool that really can completely revolutionize your life is the catechism. You see, the catechism is not so much a summation of just what we believe, as much as it is a roadmap for living. It gives you the keys to this life. When I say get a life, it gives you the keys to understanding this amazing plan that God has for our lives.

and it is organized in such a way that you can understand it and you can explain it to other people. So I want to take some time to talk about the catechism. Now, before we get into how it is put together and how it's organized, let me tell you just a little bit about it. And then we're going to take a break and I'll come back and I'll go into more detail as to how it's organized and how it can make a difference.

There are two universal catechisms out there right now. One is an older one that came out quite a while ago. and that actually came out on December 8th, 1992. Originally, the Catechism of the Catholic Church originated with a recommendation made in 1985 by the extraordinary Synod of Bishops. It's the large gathering. And then in 86, Pope John Paul II

appointed a commission of cardinals and bishops to develop a compendium of Catholic doctrine. Well, that ended up becoming this first edition of the Catechism, And then the second edition of the catechism is what we teach from today. That is a green copy. That's the one I would really recommend that you get. And that's the one we call it the second edition. The second edition has some corrections.

It has some additions, including an inordinate love for speed. And it also has a little bit fuller apparatus to help you use that catechism. I don't want to get stuck in the mud there. Just get a green one. get a second edition of the catechism if you can but what is the catechism you know the catechism in broad terms is a text which contains the fundamental christian truths formulated in a way that the church tells us facilitates understanding and that's kind of a loftier way of saying that it contains the truths that you you need and you can come to an understanding about these truths

for us and what God is saying to us. The purpose of the Catechism, the USCB, the bishops in the United States wrote a nice article. I'll give you the link in the notes about some of this. They talk about how the catechism serves several important functions. Number one, it conveys the essential and fundamental content of the Catholic faith and morals in a complete and summary way. Number two, it is a point of reference for other diocesan catechisms. So if a diocese is going to put together a catechism, this universal catechism that I'm speaking of today is the point of reference. Number three, it is a positive, objective, and declarative exposition of Catholic doctrine. I'm going to suggest to you that it is a little bit more than that in terms of what Cardinal Ratzinger, who then became

Pope Benedict says about this, that it is a wonderful, positive objective and declarative exposition of Catholic doctrine. But I want to go a step further than that and to say that even the organization of it, the way it's structured, says something powerful. And number four, it is intended to assist those who have the duty to catechise, namely promoters and teachers of catechises. And so it is intended certainly for the bishops as teachers of the faith and pastors. They have the responsibility in catechesis. Catechesis is passing on the faith. It is also for people who teach the faith, but it is also for the lay faithful. The lay faithful who want to understand better, the inexhaustible riches of salvation. So a little background there,

that's a little bit about the catechism. But I think more importantly for us today, we want to talk about the structure of it and how that will assist you in sharing with your friends, Catholicism. How do you explain it? So when I come back from the break, we're going to get into the organization of the catechism, and I'm going to explain to you how I use it to explain to other people the Catholic faith. You're listening to The Jeff Gaven show. The Bible is such an important part of our Catholic faith, but it's not always easy to understand. There are 73 separate books and so many names, places, and events that sometimes we just stop trying to figure out how it all fits together. The good news is, the Great Adventure Bible studies make it easy for you to understand the Bible.

By focusing on the story that ties all of Scripture together, the Great Adventure Bible studies give you the big picture of the Bible. And once you see the big picture of salvation history, the Mass will make more sense. The Catholic faith will make more sense, and you will see how God has a loving plan for your life. The Great Adventure Bible Studies have helped hundreds of thousands of people to understand the Bible and grow closer to Christ. There's no other Catholic Bible study series like it, and you can get started on the Great Adventure today by creating your free account at ascensionpress.com. Thanks for coming back. We're talking today about how do I explain Catholicism to my friend?

I could have called the show, Help! How do I explain Catholicism to my friends? I know there's been so many times for many of you where you've been in a situation and you've wanted to defend the faith, you wanted to explain the logic of what you believe, and you just didn't have the words for it. I would encourage you, don't be discouraged. This takes some time, but it takes time in practice,

where you start talking to people about the beauty of the Catholic faith and what you believe. Starting off with, I want to on the second half of the show here today, talk about the organization of the catechism in a way that I think will be very helpful to you, all right? And the key to it is the very first paragraph. The catechism is divided up into paragraphs, and we call them paragraph one, paragraph two, and so forth.

And the first one, I think, is key to explaining the catechism. And I want to read it to you, and I'm going to put this in the show notes in case you're driving or you're sitting on the back porch and don't have any pencil or paper. Here's what it says in the very first paragraph. Get this. I love it. God, infinitely perfect and blessed in himself.

In a plan of sheer goodness, freely created man to make him share in his own blessed life. For this reason, at every time and in every place, God draws close to man. He calls man to seek him, to know him, to love him with all his strength. He calls together all men scattered and divided by sin into the unity of his family, the church. To accomplish this, when the fullness of time had come, God sent his son as Redeemer and Savior. In his son and through him, he invites men to become in the Holy Spirit his adopted children and thus heirs of his blessed life.

Isn't that beautiful? That's the first paragraph of the catechism. I love it because it really encapsulates the whole plan. It starts off with blessing, says God infinitely perfect and blessed in himself, and that it ends with blessing. and that is that in the Holy Spirit God adopted children and thus heirs of his blessed life

made them heirs of his blessed life so the very first paragraph starts with blessing and it ends with blessing we like to call that when we teach the catechism in the Twin Cities here we like to call that from blessing to blessing and it says that God infinitely perfect

and blessed in himself had a plan he has a plan a lot of times people forget about that and they think that Catholicism and faith in general, whether whatever branch of Christianity you come from is kind of just a collection of truths and sometimes incoherent truths, not so. It's just not so. It's a plan of sheer goodness. That's what God has for you. And that's what I explain to people when I share the Catholic faith that I always start off with. Look, God has a plan of sheer goodness. and he freely created you, and he created you to make you share in his blessed life.

He did this freely. He loved you. He created you, and he loved you, and he wants you to have this life. So, it goes on for this reason that every time and in every place, God draws close to man. He calls man to seek him, to know him, to love him with all of his strength. He calls together all men scattered and divided by sin into the unity of his. family, the church. You see, when I share the faith with other people, I always want to bring them back to his family because that's his plan. His plan is to bring him into his church, into his wonderful family. And to accomplish this when the fullness of time came, 2,000 years ago, God sent his son as Redeemer and Savior. Now, in Jesus, in his son,

and through him, he invites men to become in the Holy Spirit his adopted children and thus heirs of his blessed life. So we start off and we know that God has an amazing plan, and that plan is to bring everybody into his family, the church, adopt them as sons and daughters, and to share his blessed life. Now, that's the plan, okay? So if you're talking to someone at work or you're talking to someone at school or in the neighborhood or an extended family member, keep that in mind, it's not just to get people to believe certain things. That's not the goal of all of this. The goal in evangelization and the goal of sharing Christ is to bring people to Christ and to his family and so that God can adopt them and share his life with them.

This is his plan of sheer goodness. Now, the catechism is really the tool and the key that explains this amazing plan that God has. And here I'm going to explain it to you. and I'm going to try to make this really simple so that we can, you know, make it doable. The catechism as a whole, a lot of people will look at it and think, well, it's an encyclopedia. Well, not really. It's a reference book. Well, kind of.

It is just a group of thoughts about Catholicism that the bishops want us to know. Not really. Well, what is it? Well, the catechism is taking that pile that you don't know what to do with, and it's organizing it with paragraph one in mind. And that's God's got a plan, okay? So what the catechism does, and it's genius, it really is. The church is just genius in putting this together.

Cudos to the church. Yay. So you've got this pile, and the church comes and says, well, we're going to divide that up into four pillars. Okay. So the catechism at its broadest level is divided up into four pillars. You've got, and I'm going to be talking to you, and if you are looking at your smartphone, we're going to go from left to right. Okay. On the far left there, you have the first pillar called the creed. Then a little bit to the right of that, you have the sacraments in liturgy. And then a little bit right to that, you have the third pillar called Life and in Christ. I'll explain these. And then the fourth, all the way to the right side of your smartphone as you're looking at it is prayer. Let's go over those again real quick. You've got the creed on the left, then sacraments in liturgy, then life in Christ, and prayer. Those four, and these are going to be

in the show notes, those four represent the four major sections of the catechism. And some of them are bigger than the others. For example, the creed is the largest section of the catechism. Now, it starts off with a prologue that's the first 25 paragraphs. Then you get into the creed, then the sacraments and liturgy, then life in Christ, and then prayer. Let's go over those real quickly. What are those? Number one, the whole first section of the creed of the catechism is the creed. And what is the creed? Well, we've all said the creed. creed, you know, at mass and at other times, I believe in God the Father, you know, we go through this. I believe in God, the Father, God, the Son, the Holy Spirit. I believe in one Holy Catholic and

Apostolic Church. We go through the creed, and there are different creeds, but the creed that the catechism is talking about here is a creed that does something really special. What does it do? Well, St. Augustine, the great bishop of hippo, he said that the creed takes salvation history, that is, from Genesis to Revelation, and it puts it in a very tightly wound form. In other words, the creed is salvation history, is salvation history, all of the story of God manifesting who he is in what he does in Salvation history in the Bible, culminating in Christ, the creed takes that story and it, here's a fancy word, squishes it. Okay?

So if you take the Bible and you squish it down, squish it down, you've got the creed. Now, that is important, my friend, for telling people the amazing story. It means you've got to start doing Bible study. I would obviously recommend the great adventure Bible study. I'll put it in the show notes for you. There's a quick way to get involved in this. In eight lessons, I can go through the whole Bible with you and give you a starter course. I'll put those in there.

It's called unlocking the mystery of the Bible. It'll be in the notes. Don't worry about it. So number one is you've got to start learning scripture. If you want to know the creed, the creed is the story squished. You've got to start learning the story. Why? Why? Because the second, third, and fourth pillars of the catechism, that is sacraments and liturgy, life in Christ and prayer, all spring, spring, spring, from the story, which is what the creed is all about.

Now, it was Cardinal Ratzinger, who then became Pope Benedict, who had commented on this about the genius of the organization of the catechism, saying that even the way that the catechism is organized tells a story. It's a roadmap. And that is that, number one, we are people of God's word. We have to study Scripture. So I want to encourage you in that. And like I said, go through unlocking the mystery. Maybe you want to go then through the 24 weeks' Bible timeline that's available to. Now, that's number one, the creed.

Number two, sacraments and liturgy. What's that? Sacraments and liturgy is this whole second section of the catechism. And this is where we have a lot of problems. people about the sacraments and the liturgy. Why? We don't have a context. The context is the story that you've been invited to be a part of. It's the plan of sheer goodness. How do you get into that story? Through baptism, sacraments. We are fed, we are nurtured, we are corrected. We meet Christ, we encounter Christ in this amazing plan of sheer goodness in a sacramental way

and we celebrate and worship in the liturgy, this plan of sheer goodness. You see, it's starting to take shape. Then the third is life in Christ. What's that? Life in Christ is your personal script. It is the script for you. It's the way you live your life. It's how you live in this plan of sheer goodness.

How do you live? You live the life of Christ. I'm reminded of Galatians 220. Galatians 220 mentions to us that I have been crucified with Christ it's no longer I who live the Christ who lives in me

and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God who loved me and delivered himself up for me See I got a life Remember I mentioned earlier Get a Life I got a life I got a life I live the life of Christ

I let Jesus live through me I encounter him in the sacraments and liturgy and I am aware of this great plan of sheer goodness. You see, when someone wants to know about the Ten Commandments or they want to know about the moral life, it's all in that third segment, life in Christ. And then the fourth is prayer, prayer.

And it's, wow, that's what kind of the spice of the whole life, isn't it? You know, that we pray as a community, we pray individually. When we study the Bible, we pray, that's the creed. The sacraments are a prayer. The liturgy is a giant prayer. living the life of Christ and breathing Christ in and out every moment of every day is a prayer. Well, that's what the fourth pillar does. It focuses on the Lord's Prayer.

Now, someone once asked, they said, why isn't there a section on Mary? Since she's so important in the Catholic Church, ah, I'll tell you why. Because she's so important, she is sprinkled in everywhere in this catechism. that's pretty important it's pretty important well let me share with you real quick a little bit about the structure as far as how to navigate through this it's uh it's actually pretty easy you know as i mentioned and i got mine in my hand right now and i'm going to put some i'm going to put some of these pictures uh in the show notes for you okay i'm going to put the pictures in there it'll help you out a little bit you have the first 25 paragraphs as a prologue

If you hear that in the background, that is my catechism right there. You have part one. I'm looking on page 14 right now of the second edition of the catechism. Part one is the profession of faith. That's the creed. And so you have four parts, one, two, three, four that I just mentioned, the creed, sacraments, life, and Christ, and prayer. And then you have sections.

You have major sections. and then chapters, and you have major chapters, for example, on page 13, you have chapter one, man's capacity for God, and then you have a heading, the desire for God, and then a paragraph. So it's organized that way. You've got these headings and paragraphs, and then at the end of that particular section, they have a little section called In Brief, and there's a lot of these. And page 18 has part one in brief, this section, this chapter one has a little in brief. And it's kind of like cliff notes in a way.

It's on this one here, it's six paragraphs that's 44 through 49 that give you kind of a synopsis of what you just read. And then on page 19 you go on to chapter two of part one, God comes to meet man. Article 1, the revelation of God. Heading, God reveals this plan of loving goodness. and then it goes on from paragraph 51 on. So that's the way it is organized all the way through all four of the pillars. Now, one of the things that is really, really helpful is what we would call the apparatus. And I'm looking now in my catechism on page 688 and 689.

The last paragraph of the fourth pillar is on page 688. It is paragraph 2865. 2865. From that point on, which I'm holding my catechism up, oh, a good three quarters of an inch at the end is the apparatus that helps you and assists you in looking things up. So, for example, on page 689, you've got an index of citations. This is way cool. This has every verse in the Bible that is used in the catechism in order. So, for example, Genesis 1-1, it mentions that, well, paragraph 337 uses that. You can go there and see how they used it.

So all the way through Genesis, all the way through Revelation, you've got all of the places where scripture is used, and this is called the Index of Citations, and it's all the verses of the Bible, but then it goes on in the Index of Citations and gives you ecumenical councils, for example, all of the councils that are mentioned in the catechism. Ah, it's just beautiful here. And some of the Vatican II documents, then it gives you particular councils and synods. Don't get all bogged down in the details right now. If you're saying, I don't want to understand that.

Okay, well, you take what you can right now and you'll just grow in it. Pontifical documents, various popes that are quoted. law, the liturgy, ecclesiastical writings, all of this. It's, it really is an amazing index of citations. And then on page 753, and if you're listening in the car right now, you can always go back and listen to this and grab your catechism and look at the notes. But in page 753, it gives you another index of topics like adolescents, adults. I'm looking through the A's, obviously. You have in the B's, you have the body of Christ, blasphemy, believing, beatitude, benevolence.

You go on and on, and it's just really a great, great index. And then, that index, that's a big index. And then you have on page 864 a glossary. It's a glossary of terms that we use as Catholics, better known as Catholic Code. Meta-language, if you will. And like when we talk about almsgiving, well, it explains that adoration. It explains that. These are a lot of the words that you hear and maybe you don't know exactly and you're

afraid someone's going to ask you. This is a glossary. This is a glossary that has all of those in it. It's really, really an amazing tool. But one of the most important things I want to share with you is in this back part on page 861. On page 861, there are abbreviations. This is important because there's a lot of abbreviations for a document. Like, for example, you might have heard of the great document that John Paul the second put together, Familiarious Consortio on the family. Well, if there's any footnotes,

any footnotes at the bottom of the pages throughout the catechism that have the abbreviation F.C. Well, you don't know what F.C. is maybe. So if you go to the page on 861, and I actually keep a marker there, so I can just flip back to it quickly. I'll put a picture of that. I'll put a picture of my catechism in those tags to show you what I'm talking about. I can just quickly go back to see F.C. Oh, Familiares Consortio. All right, that's what that is. And that's very helpful. so it gives abbreviations for different documents used as well as Bible books. So that's very helpful. So I actually keep a little marker there on the side, and I'll put that in the show notes for you.

Well, that's a little bit about it. By the way, also, before every major part, all four pillars, if you will, there's a marvelous piece of art, a picture that has a lot to do. do with that particular segment. And I think that that is really, really valuable. So to kind of bring this to a head, number one, God has a plan for your life. He really does. He has an amazing plan. And the catechism is structured in such a way that it's going to help us enter and celebrate and live in that plan. And that plan is thoroughly revealed in salvation history in the creed, we enter it in the sacraments and we celebrate in the

liturgy. We now live our life in this plan with Christ living inside of us, the third pillar, and prayer is what stitches it all together and gives us that communication and that relationship because the plan is about relationship. Well, it's been good sharing this with you today. I hope it's helpful. Do me a favor. Go to iTunes. Rank the show. Make some comments, if you will. If you want to get in touch with me, I read all the emails. I'll give you my email here. It is The Jeff Kaven Show. That is the Jeff Kaven Show at ascensionpress.com. And I will get it, read it. Sometimes I mention questions and comments on the show, and I would be happy to do that. And if you have any ideas for shows, please let me know. Once again, go to iTunes, rank the show. You can find out all of about all my colleagues' podcasts, Father Mike Schmitz and others, at ascensionpresents.com forward slash podcasts. And there's other ones waiting for you there.

So it's been good to spend time with you once again. Go to the show notes. I'll have all of this information for you. But more than anything, my friend, get a catechism. Start reading it with that overarching plan in mind. I'm telling you, it's going to make a difference. and you're going to know how to explain this to your friends in a more effective, fruitful way.

Let me close in prayer. I want to pray for you. I want you to know I love you and I pray for you and it's a privilege to be your brother, to be your friend in Christ. Name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. Lord, I thank you today for giving us such a gift as the Catechism. You indeed have invited us into an amazing plan of sheer goodness.

Thank you for giving such a tool to understand it and grow in your plan, and I pray, Lord, that you will help us to show tenacity and do this so that we can come to know you. Oh, we love you, Jesus, and we want to know all we can and experience all we can when it comes to you. We pray this in Jesus' name. Amen. Name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen. Thank you. Thank you.