The Jeff Cavins Show (Your Catholic Bible Study Podcast) - Thanksgiving for 7 People Who Have Changed My Life!

Episode Date: November 22, 2019

In the spirit of Thanksgiving, Jeff gives thanks to God for the seven people who changed his life for the better. Who has influenced your life? Jeff encourages you to make a list of those who have influenced your life, and thank God for them this year. Get Jeff’s Shownotes by texting “jeffcavins” to 33-777 or email Jeff at [e-mail]

You're listening to the Jeff Kaven Show, episode 142, Thankfulness, Seven People Who Changed My Life. Hey, I'm Jeff Kavins. How do you simplify your life? How do you study the Bible? All the way from motorcycle trips to raising kids, we're going to talk about the faith and life in general. It's the Jeff Kaven Show. And welcome to a very special episode. So to the Jeff Kaven show, a little bit different than many of the other shows, in that I'm really choosing this time of the year as we are just days before Thanksgiving, 2019. And I wanted to take some time to thank some people in my life that is really, they've really made a big difference in

my life. And it's an exercise that, frankly, I would encourage you to do as well, is just to take some time as we are approaching Thanksgiving, to think about the people who have really had an impact on your life. And I think that's a great way to express thanks. You know, the Catechism talks about that one way of thanking God is to thank those who have had an impact on your life. And the people that I have chosen to talk about today, seven people, are people who, upon meeting, them, my whole life trajectory changed in a radical way. And I didn't know it at the time. You can only know these things afterwards many times, but nevertheless, you do understand it at some point that, wow, that lady, that man, they had a big impact on my life. And I am forever

grateful for them. You know, I'm going to talk about seven people, and maybe you've heard me talk about some of them before. But before we get to those seven people, I just want to say to you on behalf of Ascension Press, on behalf of the wonderful team that we have at Ascension Press, who works hard every week to put out great podcasts. Father Josh Johnson, Ed Sreed, he just came on board. They do a great job, and I want to thank God for them right now. I want to thank my wife for being such a support, you know, this last year. And I'm very grateful for my family and my parents and all my close friends, very, very grateful. So I give a great big to-da offering, a big thank offering to God for my friends. And I'm thankful for you for taking the time every week to

listen to the show. And without you, they're just to just be talking to myself. So I wouldn't do it. So before I get to these seven names, let me also say this, that I don't have listed in this list my parents. And the reason for that is that I would have to take a whole show to talk about the influence that they've had on my life, my father, Robert, my mother, Patricia, and the influence that they've had, the sheer volume that they have invested in me is incredible from the time that I was born on, obviously. And I want to say something about them first, because they're not part of the seven, but they really are part of everything. And I am so grateful for being raised Catholic here in the United States, and I am grateful for them standing with me, even during the time that

I left the Catholic Church for 12, 15 years altogether, and how warm they were and welcoming me back without any condemnation back to the Catholic Church. It's really been a wonderful healing adventure that I've had, both leaving and coming back, and my parents have played such a role, bringing me to church every week growing me up, making sure that I was catechized and that I received the sacraments of initiation. They brought me to confession regularly. We prayed together at dinner before going to bed at night. And they allowed me to hear the word of God every Sunday at Mass. And that word of God took root and spoke to me. And that has become my whole life. And so I say thank you to my parents as we begin the show today. So the seven people that I'm very thankful for, I'm going to go in

chronological order and tell you a little bit about how they played a role in my life. And I didn't see it. Now, as I tell you about these individual people, realize that there are people in your life at this time or in the past, and you didn't realize at the time that these people were going to play such a major role. And maybe it wasn't until years afterwards that you suddenly realized, wow, they were part of making a, you know, in my life making a left-hand turn or a right-hand turn. My whole pilgrimage really began as an adult when I was 18 years old. By then I had been raised Catholic, albeit I think a cultural Catholic at the time, really didn't know much about my faith at all. I did everything I was supposed to do, but I didn't have what I would call a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

everything changed in 1976. At the end of 1976, I was going to Normandale Junior College. I was editor of the newspaper, and it was my second semester, and I was signed up to go to a class called Cultural Anthropology. And upon entering that class, the first day, I looked over and saw this beautiful young lady by the name of Emily. I found out later, and I couldn't stop staring at her. I thought, boy, she is just amazing. She's beautiful. Well, I found out a way to meet her, got her name, and ended up calling her, and long story short, we ended up going out. Now, she was not a Catholic. I was Catholic in name, not really in practice so much, but she was a born-again Christian, and she loved the Lord,

and she had a Bible. That first date, we went out, we just suddenly dawned to me, too, as I'm telling you about my parents earlier, I'd have to say this, that at every single turn on these seven names I'm going to give you, Emily played a major role as well. And so, as I said earlier, I'm so grateful for her, but it's hitting me now just how much she has been a part of my whole journey. Well, that first date, we went bowling, of all things, and that night, that night I dropped her off. And it was in the days after that, that I would go over to her house after my classes in college, and her mother, Alice Tobler, who is the first person on my list. Alice Tobler played a major role in the trajectory of my life. She invited me in,

and I have to remind you, I didn't, I didn't look anything like I look like today. I had long, long hair. I had bell bottoms and platform shoes, and I have even had a bandana, and I have I interviewed rock groups. I had just interviewed Kiss and Three Dog Night and Steppenwolf and all these types of groups back in the 70s. And I would go into Alice's house to meet Emily, but I would sit down at the kitchen table and Alice would open up a Bible for me. And she would begin to teach me about how much God loved me and had a plan for my life and that she would teach me how to read the Bible. And there was something about this woman and her great desire for Scripture that really made a difference in me. It created literally a hunger in me.

I remember that Blue Schofield Bible, which I have in front of me right now, and I'll put a picture of it in the show notes. Many of you have heard me talk about Alice opening up that Schofield Bible and teaching me, well-worn Bible, I might add, and you'll get a glimpse of that in the picture. There were three things that Alice really taught me at the beginning of this pilgrimage that set me off on a trajectory that was going in the area of acting, stand-up comedy, journalism, all those types of things. And the three things were, number one, she had such a devotion to scripture that it really, really influenced. me. Seeing that well-worn Bible and just her hands upon it, and knowing that this is something that she has been returning to day in and day out over the years, really had an impact on me at the

beginning there. And I've never forgotten that glimpse of her old Bible. The second was her teaching ability, her ability to sit down and to clearly explain the gospel and the scriptures had a big impact on me. I knew that I could always go to her with a question, and we could engage in about a one-hour conversation on that. And she had time for me. And here I was just this young, 18-year-old, and she opened up her home in her kitchen, and spent hours talking to me about Jesus. And the third thing that really impressed me about her was her willingness to pray and to trust God. It was such a simple trust and simple prayers that I was attracted to this. And there was something about watching Emily and her mother and her father, Andreas. I wanted that. I wanted what this

family had. Yes, I was very grateful for what I had received growing up, but there was something about Alice Tobler that really caught me. And she made Jesus alive. and from that point on, I had pretty much made up my mind that I, too, would end up teaching scripture, and it was shortly after that that I ended up going to Christ for the Nations Institute in Dallas, Texas, where I started to really study the Bible in earnest. The second person on my list, and I could do a whole show about Alice, which I'm going to at some point. My dear mother-in-law, she passed away, she passed away this last April, and she is very, very missed. And I know that Emily appreciate your prayers, and we appreciate

your prayers, but she had a huge impact on my life. The second person, and you know, this is interesting, I've got two, I got three Protestants and three. Let's see, I got one, two, three, one, two, three, three Catholics on my list. Alice Tobler, my mother-in-law, Methodist minister, she's number one on the list. Number two, after that, was a lady by the name of Joanne Magnuson. Now, Joanne Magnuson came into our lives in about 1983. In 1983, I started to take the position of a senior pastor at a very young church in Bloomington, Minnesota, Open Arms Christian Fellowship. And it was there that I started to study in-depth scripture, and I really enjoyed studying. I happened to meet this lady by the name of Joanne Magnuson, who was Lutheran raised,

and she had a passion for the Jewish people. She came to our church, we hid it off on the area of studying scripture, but we loved working on Macintosh computers, which were brand new at the time, the real early ones, and we both were quite proficient at using Macintosh. computers. Our love for Israel, our love for Scripture, really blossomed into my very first pilgrimage to the Holy Land. This beautiful woman of God with two children, her husband was a photographer for the St. Paul paper, she brought me over, brought Emily and I over to Israel the first time in 1984, rather, and it changed my life. it changed my life. Not only that, but she introduced me to two people on this list of seven

who deepened my relationship with God. Now, when I first met Joanne back in the 80s, in the mid-80s there, I had no idea that this woman who eventually took over 80 pilgrimages to the Holy Land, I'm at 56 right now, I had no idea that she would have had such a big impact on my life. She's still alive today, and she has gone on many trips to Israel with me, but the reason that she is on this list as someone who really radically influenced my life is that not only did she introduce me to pilgrimages to the Holy Land, which have become a regular part of our lives ever since 1980s, but she also introduced me to a world of Jewish scholarship, which deepened my faith in an incredible way. And I had left the Catholic Church earlier in 1981, and I began to study scripture really, really in a deep way. And it was Joanne that really got me connected to these scholars in Jerusalem and in the United States. Once I got introduced to these scholars in the United States, their insight into the early church in the liturgical shape of the early,

church and how the early church lived and existed. And what I later found out were really the Catholic roots of the church. That changed my life in a big way. And so all throughout the years, her perseverance, her love for Israel, her love for scholarship was a constant gift to me in all of those years that I was actually away from the church, which was roughly 81 to 91 to 90. right in that period. And so to Alice, to Joanne, I thank you. I thank you for your contribution to my life. And my listeners here today also offer you a thanks because this show wouldn't be here if it wasn't for the two of you. I can say that about everybody on the list. The third person is a man who had a major impact on my life. And his name is Dwight Pryor.

Dwight Pryor was the president of the Center for Judeaic Christian Studies in Austin, Texas. I met him through Joanne. You see, there's kind of this thread weaving through these relationships. Alice knew Joanne, Joanne knew Dwight. Dwight caught my attention. I got a hold of a cassette tape, and I heard him teaching about the Jewish roots of Christianity and Jesus, the Hebrew rabbi. and it caught my imagination. When he started teaching about Jesus, the man, and his teaching style, it launched me on a 10-year quest to know Jesus even more intimately. I ended up flying down to

Austin, Texas, and spent about a week with Dwight and his wife, Jeanette, who has since deceased, both of them, in fact, have a number of years ago. And I was invited to stay in their home, and it was my first experience of really being accepted, I think, in the academic community where we sat in his home literally for hours and opened our Bibles and we were able to converse about Jesus, the rabbi, Jesus, the Jew. He introduced me to a world of scholars, and we ended up putting on a number of conferences where we brought the top scholars in the world from Israel and in the United States all together to teach about Jesus, our Hebrew Lord. I ended up moving to Dayton, Ohio in 1990, and it was at the request of Dwight

Pryor, who was moved to Dayton, Ohio, and the church that he belonged to hired me as their new pastor. And so this man that had such an influence in the area of study, the area of the Jewish roots and the backgrounds of Israel, this man. man who had such an influence of my life, I now found myself as his pastor, which was a very unusual situation. I owe a lot to Dwight, to Dwight Pryor. Some of these names maybe you've never heard of before, but it's nice at Thanksgiving time now to mention some of the people who have really had an influence on my life. As I pause there for a moment, let me ask,

who are the people in your life? You might start thinking about that and writing down their names. I'm sure you can go back and list father so-and-so, sister, so-and-so, maybe your grandfather. And like I said, I'm going to do a whole show just on my relatives at some point. But these are people outside of my family that had an impact. It was Dwight Pryor that introduced me to the scholarship of my fourth person, and his name is Dr. Marvin Wilson. Dr. Marvin Wilson lives in Massachusetts, and he teaches at a beautiful, Gordon Conwell School, Gordon College out in Winnom, Massachusetts, and he is one of the translators of the NIV Bible, the New International Version Bible. This guy is the epitome of a professor,

and so humble, so hungry, really understanding the Jewish roots. I started to read his writings, some of his books and articles that he had put together, and I just fell in love. with his worldview, and it caused a hunger in me to want to know Jesus even more, to know him even more. And I remember the very first time I met him, I got to share this with you, it's really cool. The way that I got to meet him is I knew all about him, but it was Joanne, who's number two on the list, who brought me to Israel, and that must have been, I think, in 84, something like that, or 85. And I was riding on the bus in Jerusalem. And I said to Joanne on the bus, I said, you know, I've always wanted to meet Dr. Marvin Wilson, this great scholar, Old Testament scholar.

And if I could ever meet him, boy, I'd jump on an airplane. I'd love to meet him. And she said, well, he's in the country right now. He's in Israel right now. And I said, really? Where? And she said, well, he's staying in Jerusalem. And in fact, she said, see, the hotel we're going by? That's where he's staying. And I yelled out to the bus driver, stop. And the bus driver, you know, put the brakes on and pulled over. And I said, let me off here. And I said to my wife and to Joanne, I'll find a way back to the hotel. If he's here, I'm going to take a chance on meeting him. Now, he was a good friend of Dwight prior, number three on the list. I got off the bus and I walked into the hotel room there on Mount Zion in Jerusalem. And guess who I saw standing right there in the entryway?

It was Dr. Marvin Wilson and his wife. And I looked at him and I said, he was talking to someone, so I waited. And then he was done. He turned around and looked at me and I said, Dr. Wilson. He goes, yes. I said, my name's Jeff Kavins. I'm a pastor in Minnesota. And he said, Dwight Pryor told me about you. He said, I know all about you. And he said, I know all about you. He said, would you like to come up in my room with my wife here and we can talk? I thought, oh, I cannot believe this is happening. I went up into his room. We sat up until probably two in the morning talking about Jesus and studying.

And I thought, I have a new best friend in Dr. Marvin Wilson. And he really mentored me a lot. In fact, one time I flew out to when in Massachusetts, went through Boston airport there, and he picked me up at the airport. And he's a real mentor. And so is Dwight. and that's one of the key elements here is these are mentors. These are people who spent time with me and gave part of their life away

that I would become someone who could teach and mentor other people. Well, I flew out there, he picked me up, and as we are driving away from the airport there in Boston, Logan Field, he said, here's my new book, and it was called Our Father Abraham. and it was about the Jewish roots of the Christian faith, and I looked at it, and he handed it to me. I said, thank you. Wow. He said, it's a second one off the press. You get it. And I said, I am so honored. So that night, after dinner and talking, I went to bed at his house, and the next I stayed up all night and read that whole book, the entire book, I read it. And the next morning at breakfast, he says to me, he said, did you have a good night's sleep? I said, I didn't sleep. I said, I read your

whole book last night. And as a teacher, he said, okay, and he grabbed the book. He says, I'm going to quiz you. I thought, oh, no. And he did. He started to quiz me, and I got them all right. I mean, I just devoured what this guy wrote. And Dr. Wilson, he went on to be a real mentor in my life. It was right after this that I started to have serious questions about the church that I was pastoring. I started to really get into the church fathers, and the church fathers really did a number on my heart. When I come back from the break, I'm going to give you the last three. These are Catholics that had a major impact on my life and on the trajectory of, I guess you could say, my career, quote, unquote, and I can't wait to share them with you because, in a sense, they built on Alice

Tobler, Joanne Magnuson, Dwight Pryor, and Dr. Marvin Wilson. You're listening to the Jeff Kaven show. Imagine this. You're walking down the street and a Christian at a table with a bunch of pamphlets asked you. Have you been saved? What would you do? Would you know how to respond? Hi, I'm Dr. Andrew Swofford and I'm co-presenter along with Jeff Kavins in Ascension's new great adventure Bible study, Romans, the gospel of salvation. In this study, we teach you the biblical foundations for the Catholic teaching on salvation, how to explain salvation quickly and easily to non-Christians. What St. Paul really meant by works not leading to salvation and how we can enter more deeply into Christ? Paul's letter to the Romans has been at the center of reflection,

conversion, and controversy from the very beginning, and it's widely considered his greatest work. I invite you to start a small group in your home or parish and embark on this great adventure. Romans, the Gospel of Salvation, is available for pre-order right now and for purchase on September 1st, 2019. To order, visit ascensionpress.com. And welcome back talking about people that I'm thankful for at this Thanksgiving time in America. We are so thankful for our families, for our spouse, our children, and our parents and our grandparents, which I can do a whole show on them. But this year I'm taking some time to talk about seven people who changed the direction of my life and contributed to this podcast and to the great adventure and to the books I've written and to

the talks I've given and to being a father and a husband and on and on. I left off with Dr. Marvin Wilson who taught at Gordon College in Winnom, Massachusetts. It was after him that I started to really go deep into the church fathers, and that posed a bit of a problem for me. because I started to notice that the look of the early church was starting to look very Catholic. And that was a challenge to me because I was very in tune with my Jewish roots and Jesus, the Hebrew Lord. And I love that topic, and I still teach a lot on that. Like I have a class on the teaching methodology of Jesus. But it was after that, when the church started to grow, that the church started to grow, that the church

started to take on a certain shape, if you will, and taught certain things. And, man, that caused a bit of a crisis. And the more I read, the more I started to be really convinced that this early church looked like the Catholic Church. Trust me, I tried everything I could to avoid that. I didn't want that happening at all. I didn't want to leave the church that I was in and become Catholic. Well, the longer that I studied, the more convinced I became about the Catholic Church, and I'm not going to go into all that in this particular show, but what it did for me is it caused me to think of my childhood pastor, Father Paul Dudley. Father Paul Dudley came from a wonderful Catholic family from Northfield, Minnesota. It's the place where Jesse James really ended. his career, along with Cole Younger, which, side note, I'm actually a relative of the younger brothers who rode with Jesse James. Maybe we'll do a whole show on that sometime. The Lord saved me from

this life of robbing banks, I guess. But it was Father Paul Dudley that I remembered so well his preaching, his love, his gentleness and kindness. I knew that he had become a bishop since I grew up. And he was the bishop in Sioux Falls, South Dakota, Bishop Paul Dudley. And he was followed by Bishop Carlson. And Bishop Carlson ended up in St. Louis. But Bishop Paul Dudley, I knew that he was in Sioux Falls, and I ended up picking up some books at a Catholic bookstore, and I started reading them. And it was going deeper into the Church Fathers and the Catholic faith. I had a crisis on my hand. I knew. that I needed to return to the Catholic Church, but I wanted to talk to my childhood pastor.

And so I ended up calling Sioux Falls, South Dakota, Marcus Grody, a friend of mine told me that he knew Bishop Paul Dudley. He said, yeah, you got to talk to him. So I called Sue Falls, and the secretary answered, and she said, Sue Falls, Diocese of Sue Falls. And I said, yes, this is Jeff Cavens. I'm calling for Bishop Dudley. She said, just a minute. it, now get this, how many of you expect to call and have the bishop answer? I guess I just expected it. I don't know. Well, the next voice on the line was Bishop Paul Dudley, and I still remember until today, he said, Bishop Dudley, and I said, Bishop, Jeff Kavens, he remembered me. The last time he heard about me was back in eighth grade, and he remembered me and my father, he said,

is your father Bob Kavens? And I said, yes. He said, how? He said, how are you doing? And I said, well, pretty good. I'm not Catholic anymore. I left and I'm a Protestant pastor. And he said, well, how did that happen? And I started to tell him. And then he said, could you come out to Sioux Falls and spend a few days with me and Bishop Carlson, who I didn't know? And I said, well, yes. And so I flew out there and I got off the airplane and there was this old man now. Holding an old hat, black hat, I still remember it. He put his arms out wide and he said, welcome home. Something hit me that day as my childhood pastor welcomed me back to the Catholic Church. He later celebrated Mass at my parents' house. I went to confession prior to that on the back

porch, and he ushered me back into the Catholic Church. I remember him so well in those days out in Sioux Falls. We went to a Catholic bookstore, and he bought me different books, and he told me he wanted me to go to Stubinville, and to get a Catholic degree this time, and I did. But it was Bishop Paul Dudley that he invested so much into me. At the time of this podcast, I'm going to tell you some things I've never even mentioned before. I ended up going to Stubinville, and I ended up teaching at Stubinville and getting a graduate degree at the same time. And it was during that time that I had very little money.

I'd given up my pastor at in Dayton, Ohio. I didn't have much money. Most of my friends were not so much friends anymore and didn't have a lot of fellowship with them now that I wasn't a pastor, but I was a Catholic. And every month, I got a check in the mail. And it was a handwritten check by Bishop Paul Dudley for $200 out of his own account.

And he didn't want me saying anything about that, but every month he supported me, my family. He put his money where his mouth was, and I'll never forget that. In fact, it was upon receiving a full scholarship at Steubenville with Father Michael Scanlon that I later learned that it was Bishop Paul Dudley that established that fund and that scholarship for returning Catholics with Father Michael Scanlon, and I was blessed, and there at Steubenville, my life changed forever. The trajectory of my life changed, and Bishop Paul Dudley was behind that, and he wasn't the only, that wasn't the only thing he was behind. He was behind the seventh person that I have on my list. Now, Bishop Paul Dudley

was the fifth, the sixth was Dr. Scott Hahn. Yep, my relationship with Scott Hahn changed the trajectory of my life in so many ways. You see, I ended up at Steubenville to get my master's degree, and it was Scott's idea that I teach there. And I taught the Bible timeline for the first time, 24 weeks. I taught it at Franciscan University. It was Scott that took me under his wing as a brother, as really a co-equal, if you will, as brothers only 10 days apart in age. And while we're not co-equals, he treated me that way. And every morning we had a holy hour and prayed the rosary together, and we spoke to one another. We spent hours in his office talking theology, going out and getting something to eat. And Scott and I became best friends.

And looking at the way he studied the Bible and his understanding of the theology and philosophy became such an inspiration to me. Covenantal theology. It just opened my eyes to a whole new way of telling the story. I had created the Great Adventure Bible Timeline, clear back in 1983, 84, right around that time. But it was when I met Scott that I think it really came alive. Scott and Kimberly played a major role. And I remember the first night that I went over, over there, I carried this old tattered Bible timeline with me and showed it to him, and I still remember them today going, oh, that's amazing. We really hit it off. It ended up, I ended up at EWTN, and it was Mother Angelica who asked me to do a 13-week show for her for EWTN.

I thought nobody knows who I am, so I asked Scott. And Scott and I did, our father's plan, the longest running show in EWTN history. And so Scott and I began a life of friendship and working together. He's an inspiration. I've said it often that every time I'm with him at a conference in Steubenville or around the country, things that we do together, whether it's a pilgrimage to the Holy Land or it's a cruise to Alaska, I always leave Scott wanting more. I always want more of Jesus.

Oh, we're competitive. Just ask him about racquetball. I beat him. He's not going to tell you that, though, but it's the truth. That's a whole other podcast. But Scott, I'm very thankful for you. I'm thankful for what you have given me a hunger for Scripture, a single focus that you have in Scripture. It's been an inspiration to me for the last 25 years. And just two weeks ago, the two of us did a conference in St. Cloud, which was St. Cloud, Minnesota, which was a lot of fun. I'll put that picture in the show notes. And then seventh on the list was someone that Bishop Dudley introduced me to, but I didn't know it. You see, when I was at Steubenville teaching, I got a call for Mother Angelica. And Mother Angelica wanted me to come on her show and tell my story of coming back to the Catholic Church. And this may have been the biggest change for me in my life. I came to EWTN in Birmingham, Alabama, and I did Mother Angelica's show. We had a wonderful time.

We really hit it off. In the middle of the show, she said, honey, would you pray about doing a 13-week show for us? And I said, sure, and I closed my eyes, quickly opened them, and said, yes, she started laughing. That ended up becoming our father's plan with Scott Hahn. Mother Angelica, after that show that night, took me over to the side of the studio, and she said, I want you to pray about moving here and starting a show on Thursday night for young adults. She said, I've been praying about it for a long time when the Lord has shown me that you are the one. And I thought, wow, okay. And I prayed about it with Bishop Dudley. And I said yes,

and we moved the family from Birmingham, Alabama, or from Steubenville, Ohio to Birmingham, Alabama. and there we began Life on the Rock. And for six years, I had the privilege of working on Life on the Rock and covering Pope John Paul II, filling in for Mother. In fact, it was six months after I was there at EWTN. The mother called me into her office, and I thought I was in trouble. I didn't know I was actually going to get a promotion. She brought me into her office, and I said, what can I do?

And she said, I want you to pray about subbing for me when I'm not here. And if I don't feel good, I'd like you to take my show. And I was blown away. This young kid who left the church and came back and watched DWTN, even prior to coming back to the Catholic Church, was now sitting across from Mother Angelica, and she was inviting me to sub her show. I was blown away. I said, I'd be honored, but I've got to ask you, why me? And she said, I'll tell you. She said, I know you're thoroughly Catholic, but you sound. like a Protestant, and I like that. Believe it or not, that's what got me there, being the substitute for Mother Angelica, is I guess she just liked that. And so for nearly six years, I was able to

sub for her and do the show with her when she wasn't feeling well, and I can tell you it was a great, a great experience for me. And I owe that lady so much because if it wasn't for EW, WTN and Mother Angelica, the Bible timeline that I later put together in its final form, simply would not be out there the way it is today. In fact, if you took away any of the people in this list, Alice Tobler, Joanne Magnuson, Dwight Pryor, Dr. Marvin Wilson, Bishop Paul Dudley, Dr. Scott Hahn, Mother Angelica, if you took them away, I wouldn't be who I am, and the Bible timeline would not be who the Bible timeline is today. It's really amazing as I look back.

It's really amazing. The Bible timeline is what it is today because of the people who have contributed so greatly and so richly to my life and to all seven of you. At the time of Thanksgiving this year, I thank God for you. I thank God for each and every one of you and pray for you. Alice Tobler, my mother-in-law, with the Lord. Joanne Magnuson, a great, great, great follower of Christ, still taking trips to Israel. My good friend Dwight Pryor, who's on with the Lord. Dr. Marvin Wilson, still teaching in Massachusetts.

Bishop Paul Dudley, who I believe is with the Lord. Dr. Scott Hahn, who most of you know needs no introduction, still teaching. and Mother Angelica, who is with the Lord. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Now, as I conclude, I encourage you at this Thanksgiving time. Make your list. Who are the seven people that have really had an impact on your life? I'd like to hear from you. You can write me at the Jeffcaven Show at ascensionpress.com. That's the email address, The Jeffcaven Show at ascensionpress.com. Of course, you can find me on Facebook where are trips about the Holy Land coming in January. You can find out information there at my website, jeffcavens.com.

And the mega trip coming up, I'm telling you, if you want to go on the trip with Father Mike Schmitz and myself coming up June for young adults, you've got to sign up soon because that's going to be closing, even though June is a ways away. And you can do that on my website as well. Let me close in prayer at this time of Thanksgiving. In the name of the Father and the Son, and the whole. Spirit. Amen. Lord, I thank you. Todal Rabbah. Thank you very much. Thank you for life. Thank you for giving me life. Thank you for giving me such a wonderful family and a wife and children. And this year, Lord,

I especially thank you for the people, Alice, Joanne Dwight, Marvin, Bishop Dudley, Scott Hahn, Mother, Angelica. I thank you for their lives and their influence in my life. May you bless each and every one of them. I thank you, Lord, and I pray that the fruit of their lives will continue to live on through me and those who are even my students on through them. We pray this in the mighty name of Jesus. Amen. Name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. I love you, my friend. I love you. And it's great to be a part of your life. We'll talk to you next week. Thank you.