The Livy Method Podcast - Why do we expect perfection in weight loss?

Episode Date: April 28, 2026

Getting a degree or starting a new business? No one expects that to go perfectly. So why do we demand perfection of ourselves when it comes to losing weight?Gina Livy sits down with food addiction expert Sandra Elia to unpack the real reasons weight loss feels so complicated. Together, they explore the difference between habits, emotional eating, and true food addiction, while addressing the pressure of perfection that so many people feel in their journey. Listen and walk away with a clearer understanding of how to break old patterns, build supportive habits, and approach goals with more patience, awareness, and compassion.Sandra is the founder of The Food Addiction Recovery Program and the author of "Never Enough: Three Pillars of Food Addiction Recovery".Find Sandra Elia:Instagram: @sandraelia.cawww.sandraelia.comYou can find the full video hosted at: www.facebook.com/groups/livymethodspring2026To learn more about The Livy Method, visit livymethod.com. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

I'm going to be honest with you, this podcast is unapologetically a hot mess because that is what midlife feels like sometimes. Why, though? And how do we make it better? Do we all just need facelifts and g-lp-1s? I mean, let's talk about it. No bullshit, no wellness wangery here because we're trying to make real change and change is hard. But we're in this together. Welcome to the Livy Method podcast.

We're focusing on sustainable habits, not quick-fix it? Is it an opportunity to get curious? We're here and help people get to their health goals. One piece of time. You build and build and build. You know, I love our guest intro. We are talking about building sustainable habits and not into quick fixes, right? Like, we know, I know you want to lose your weight already.

You've probably spent years putting a lot of time and energy and money into this, you know, to lose the weight only to gain it all back. And that's just simply how those eat less, exercise, more diets go. And here at the Living Method, we are so much more than that. we truly want you to lose your way in a way you're going to actually be able to maintain and sustain. And now with the introduction of GLP-1s and weight loss medications, they can be really great. Everyone's talking about how they can help with that food noise. They can help with your appetite.

But it's not doing the real work. The real work is working through your issues and associations tied into food. It's working through old habits, creating new habits that are going to support the changes that you want to make. It's about working through your beliefs, believing that you are worthy. and for some people trauma. And one of the reasons why weight loss is so difficult is because we use food for so many things. We need it to survive. We use it to celebrate, to bond over, and, you know, sometimes to cope if you're having a stressful day.

There's different types of hunger. There's actually being hungry. And then there's conditioned hunger, eating out of habit or just clearing your plate or, you know, having some wine and a bag of chips with your favorite show. You know, and then there's also emotional hunger. You have a bad day. You are, you know, you just, you don't want to think about anything. You just want to take your mind off it. And so you go to food. And this is why it's so complicated. So my guest today is Sandra Alia. She is the founder of the food addiction recovery program. She's also the author of the book, Never Enough. You absolutely need to pick this up at an Amazon near you. Today we're bringing her on because although it's only week one of the program and we're just getting started, people can, be very hard on themselves about the choices that they're making or not making. And where is the line? When is it just habit? When is it just I had a bad day? And when is it something more than that? So introducing Sandra Lea. Hello. Hi. So great to be here. Thank you. These sessions are amazing. It's spring, even though it doesn't feel like spring in Toronto, but I love spring.

It's a time of renewal, fresh starts. Let's begin again. things are budding and growing. And one of my favorite things about being human is that the sun rises every single day. And when that sun rises, it's a chance for me to begin again, to be a better mother, to be a better sibling, to, you know, let go of yesterday. And I think that's a really big, important lesson, even in a weight management journey, that anything that happened yesterday, any mistakes, any slips, there's nothing we can do to bring back yesterday.

and the trigger you can let that go because a slip from yesterday is only kept alive through remorse and guilt and beating yourself up. So now, not only do I have this slip yesterday, but I'm keeping it alive today. So anyways, I don't know why I went on that rant, but I'm excited for spring. Please do. You're familiar with the program. And, you know, we run our 91 day live sessions to help, you know, guide people in real time, to help keep them motivated, to share expert advice. but really their journey starts and they have to keep going until they reach their goals. And even after they reach their weight loss goals, there's still work to do in terms of that

mental part. You can have lost all of your weight. And we talk a lot about this in our maintenance program physically, but still have a lot to do mentally. So sometimes I find when you don't do the thing or when you have the thing, when you didn't want the thing, that's a real learning opportunity for people. But it's hard. It's hard because I have people first week, we're barely getting started. Still time to sign up, in fact, to the program. And yet people already feeling like they failed because they haven't been able to follow perfectly. So let's start there. Let's start. How do people, the feeling is valid, Sandra? How do people get over that feeling when they don't follow along perfectly? And that's not what it's about. They feel like they've failed.

I know. So this is the only place in our lives where the bar is set to perfection. And because I'm just a mere human, when the bar is set to perfection, I've already. failed. If you think about any other journey that you've taken in life, got a degree, started a business, started a career, raised children. We accept that every day we're going to make a mistake and we try to learn and grow from it. So one of my big principles in my programs is there's no more failing. So if you've struggled with your weight or eating for years or decades like me, you start to internalize that you are the failure. And when you come from that step, right like that is a terrible state to begin any journey imagine starting a business from a belief that

i'm a failure something's wrong with me how can that business ever possibly flourish yes so that my thing is you know what pick your bullseye what's your bullsie right and it's so easy because the gina livy program gives you the roadmap so the bullsie could be like the water the protein following the plan showing up for these being a great community member so you set the the the the bar for bullseye and you try to hit bullseye and when you do you feel amazing you go to bed. I have those days. Last night I had one of those days. I went to bed.

I'm like, oh, today was so good. And then other days I wake up and I try to hit bullseye and I miss. And I miss so bad. Those days are actually richer. Those days are not failing. Those are the days that you pour so much self-love on yourself and so much compassion. Why? Because you can only learn when you feel.

safe. Nobody feels safe if they're being attacked, whether you're attacking yourself or somebody else is attacking you verbally. So then if you have a slip, you're attacking yourself, what a waste. You'll never, you can never garner any learnings from it. So that's a really important piece is that either hit bullseye or love and there's no more feeling. You can't kill the failure anymore. No more feeling. Bullseye or love. I love that that's it rather than the all or nothing. It doesn't have to be the nothing, the all, okay, you did it great or show yourself some love and kindness and understand. Before we go further, like, where does this sense? You spend a lot of time in the diet industry. You have your own journey. You work with the people at obesity matters. You go to all the conferences. You know, you're well-versed in this space.

Where does that sense of needing to be perfect come from? Like you mentioned, you know, we're not trying to be perfect parents. Oh, my gosh. Like, I wouldn't even got past day one if I needed to be a perfect parent. But where do you think that? Yeah, in helping people understand where that, because this is a learned behavior that needing to be perfect. And if they don't do it perfectly, they've messed the whole thing up. Where do you think that that comes from? Yeah. So I believe, so I was born in the 70s.

I grew up in the 80s. We are all recovering from diet culture. Diet culture has absolutely brainwashed us into believing it's quick, it's easy, willpower, try harder, sweat more. No pain, no gain. Lose 20 pounds in a month. I still see ads like that. Now they have these crazy reels where somebody is living in a larger body and then they spin around and then they're slender.

It's not even the same person. So it's just emotional messages on repeat. And when I work with a client and they tell me that they're in a rush to lose weight, like I have to lose it by summer. It has to be gone. When we unpack that, every time we find self-hatred. And it is very hard to change when motivated by guilt, shame, or self-hatred. So that's like if you totally accept yourself and totally love yourself as you are today,

what's the rush? There shouldn't be a rush. And for many of us, this will be a lifelong journey. And so if it's going to be for the rest of my life, I better have fun while I'm doing it. I better enjoy the body I have today because guess what? I don't get this day back ever again. And like you, I've worked with people in their 70s who wake up every day for 60 years, not knowing what they should eat, feeling bad about their bodies, not buying the being suit, waiting to buy a new winter coat. Yeah. No, they're like, I'm at the end.

Like, this is the last chapter of my life and I spent decades hating myself. Like, and I don't want that for anybody, right? And this journey, and I love how you started, GLP ones, I just want to make this, very, very clear. You can lose weight on JOP once. It's still not easy. No, no, no, no. It's not easy. You still need all the support and you need what I always say it sits on two pillars, a roadmap and resilience. So Gene and Livy gives you that roadmap and you give them the resilience because it's the roadmap will fail. You will take a wrong turn. It's how quick you get on the road again. That's the real trick, not be doing perfectly. I think resilience is as really key, but I think there's a fine line there because what's going through my head is also

people's need to not just do it perfectly, but when they, when they quote unquote mess up, because there's no good foods, bad foods, there's no right, there's no wrong. There's no on plan, off plan. There's like, these are the things you can do to take you one step closer to your goals, but there's a lot of berating. There's a lot of berating. There's a lot of scolding. There is a lot of punishing and that's a vicious cycle. And I don't know if that's our demographic. Here's Heather, who shared. I'm 64 years old, lost my job. Ageism is big. I'm an emotional eater. There's a lot of weight that we are carrying,

especially as we get to that midlife, beyond the actual physical weight that we are carrying. So how do we unpack all of that? Like we're an emotional eater or whatever reason we're eating something. We think it's going to bring us joy. It's a treat. We think it's going to bring us a moment of peace.

And it might for a few seconds, but then we start the, oh my God, why did I eat that? I'm never going to be able to lose this weight. then you physically feel like shit, you mentally feel like shit. If you eat at night, it messes with your sleep. You wake up the next day. You get on the scale. It's just so demotivating.

It ruins your whole fucking day. Then you next thing you know, if you did that on a Wednesday, you're like, fuck it. I might as well like just eat my face off the rest of the week. Start again next Monday. God, it is exhausting. It's fucking exhausting, Sandra. Yeah. So you really were in my head in my 20s.

I didn't get, I lost all a decade of my life to that spiral to that. to that exact spiral. So people, you have, you've made a career out of understanding how to navigate through this. There are people who felt like this yesterday. So how do we, how do we unpack that? How do we even start to get a handle on it? I mean, first of all, I want to say, I'm sorry, Heather, that you lost your job. And, of course, like, you know, of course you would, you know, turn to food for emotional soothing.

Let's call it soothing, right? You're looking to self-soothe. You're looking to self-medicate. It's a very scary time to look. lose your job. You're later, you know, at 64. But you can. Far from old, far from done, far from all those things. But that, I could say that till for days, you're still going to feel how you feel, right? So 100%. Your job or whatever. Let's validate how we feel. Yeah. Exactly. But I'm going to tell you something. We have an advantage. Even me and my 50s, we are wise. We have attention

spans and we didn't grow up watching TikTok. So my friend, you are so, so valuable. Now, emotional eating the only foods that will give you emotional comfort are ultra processed foods these are factory made nutrient poor and cause disease that is the only food nobody gets comforted by six apples or salmon or steak it's just not comforting no one's binging on broccoli no one's binging on broccoli no one's giving you what you're looking for so here's the problem after a while those foods become highly addictive no different than if i had a glass of wine to take the edge off my day And then suddenly one glass turns into two glasses. And now I, let's say I have a predisposition to have alcoholism.

Now I need the whole bottle to make it through. And that's kind of the way it is with food addiction. We start by self-soothing, take the edge off. It works. But we have these food manufacturers who are making highly addictive foods that overwhelm our reward center and make it very hard to stop. Now, you recently had Jason Fung on Dr. Jason Fung, and I love him. I love the obesity code. I picked up the hunger code.

And it makes perfect sense. These foods are designed to make you want more and more and more. And I agree with you. There's no bad foods or good foods. I ask myself and I ask my clients, is it peaceful? Is it a peaceful food for you? Or does it ignite the hunt for more? Does it cause a compulsive spiral?

Does it make you hungry or does it make you have more cravings, right? I work with people who are like, you know what, it's the weekend. I'm going to have a planned indulgence, which I love a planned indulgence. Me too. It's so good because you're planning it. Your intention is to be present, enjoy every morsel and move on. And if you can do that, do that because life is short. But for many of my clients, a planned indulgence sometimes turns into a three-day binge.

It spirals, right? Depending on the day that you have, what's going on and that they have food. And this is where I don't, I don't like. vilifying foods, but the reality is they are creating foods, these ultra-processed foods, processed foods that are addicting to us. So that's why they have that chip commercial, right, where they put people in a room full of chips and they don't tell them. But if they're only, if they're able to only eat one chip, they want a million dollars. Well, that company is not concerned at all because they know as soon as you open that bag and have one chip, they are designed

to have you want to eat more. So that is a real thing. That is a real thing. It's a real thing. And also we have to understand that there is enough evidence to suggest that it is very damaging to our body. Right. So it's all about understanding what it does to you. And some people will have a history. They're like a planned indulgence every time I've tried for the last 10 years leads me into a three-day bender. So then maybe it's just not safe for me. Maybe this is just not a, and a lot of people will say it's easier for me to have a boundary than to negotiate how much and when.

Okay, I had a great question last night because the summer's coming and we want to, we want to go out. We want to go to barbecues and we want to, you know, we want to feel great and have fun. And the issue with this is a lot of times we make choices that don't make us feel good, right? And that becomes then you eat, you start eating things of the barbecue. Then you're all in your head about what you're not eating. You are eating. You start to feel crappy. And it just ruins your good time.

Exactly. What would be some tips to going? Because we don't want people to stay at home and never leave their houses. We want them to learn how to navigate life. We want them to be calm around food, right? Physically, mentally be able to sit around foods and not be stressed out, be in the grocery line with all the chips and all the chocolate and not be like, should I buy it? Shouldn't I buy it?

That's the end result is to work through that food noise. But that takes time. That takes time. And no one's going to work through that today. So what would some coping mechanism for? Give us some using that scenario, you're going to a party, you're going to a barbecue. There's going to be food there. What do you do to ensure that you make choices that make you feel good?

So I never say no to a party because I'm a very social person and I love connection. So I highly if you're, unless you don't like parties and you're introverted, but if you love a party, don't say no. So a couple of things. If it's a party that's only appetizers and cocktails, that might not work for you. That doesn't work for me. So then I just eat my nutritionally dense dinner at home and I feel satisfied and it always frees me up. Then I'm a total butterfly because I'm not worried where are the appetizers coming out. I still feel hungry.

Oh my gosh, I'm the goodness stop. Because if they stop, then I'm screwed and I'm out drinking all this wine and then I'm not even present. So those ones actually work out the best for me when I have dinner beforehand. Now, let's say dinner is the social event. Then I absolutely want to partake. So obviously if it's a restaurant, have a look at the menu beforehand. If it's a party where you don't have control over what's being served, if you feel comfortable to call the host and say, hey, I have a few food allergies, just

wondering what's on the menu. The other thing I do is I bring something. So I make sure, I always know there's going to be a good protein. People always do the protein. There's never enough vegetables. Yes. So I bring the salad. I bring the huge platter of chopped vegetables.

I bring the huge platter of fruit because, you know what? While everyone's eating their amazing dessert and I'm awing, that I've got my fruit. I've got my berries. So I had somebody, we were going into Thanksgiving, no, Easter, and they were worried about the hot cross buns. They're like, oh my God, that gets me every year and I don't want to have them. I said, okay. So what can you bring that you're going to love and enjoy? And she actually remembered Alyssa's recipe for the Mediterranean biscuits.

She's like, oh my God, I love those. I never feel deprived. They're great. Bring a basket. Bring for everybody. And so now she wasn't sitting there white, knuckling. while everybody's having hot grass funds, she's eating something that she loves

and she feels really good about and then doesn't set her up for cravings when the desserts roll out. Yeah. And having another good strategy, I call it book ending. So you have this amazing Facebook community. So if I'm going to go to a party

and I'm feeling unsteady, then I could just put out a post saying, hey guys, I want to be accountable to this group. This is my plan for tonight. I'm going to have this, this and this. And at dessert time, maybe I'm going to walk the dog or, you know, talk to somebody and I'm going to check in with you later.

So when you bookend, you only bookend with kind, loving, supportive people. Don't bookend because you might have to report back. Hey, guys, everything went sideways. And that's okay because you need to feel the love when things go sideways. You need a community that says, okay, we got you. We still love you. You're going to get it next time. Or they're going to celebrate you if you managed to maintain your commitment to yourself.

So book ending is a great strategy. Yeah, we love. We have the best community. Yeah, we have the, we honestly have the safest place for people to work towards our goals. And if you're not comfortable doing that, you can do this yourself. I'm a big fan of setting intentions and the day reflections, just kind of like being aware of your choices and making a plan for yourself.

I think it's really important. I love the hot crust buns. It's not, though, necessarily the hot crust buns at Easter, the candy at Halloween, you know, the stuffing at Thanksgiving. It's like the choices that we're making every single day. And we do have to enjoy life. I see this comment from Mary. She's like, shouldn't we vilify that kind of alter processed foods?

And bigger picture for me is not avoiding it is getting to a place where you can actually enjoy it. You're not trying to control and you're not trying to moderate yourself. For example, I went to the J's game. And we got great seats. And the seats came with like this all you can eat snack bar and whatever. And they had pop rocks. And they had like candy rings, fun dip. They had popcorn.

They had peanut. I had it all. I had it all. Did I feel like absolute garbage? Yes, I did. But in the moment, it was just so fun. I felt like my husband and I were like, what are we like kids? You know, the candy necklaces.

Like that was a whole moment tied in around food. You want to lose your weight in a way where you can enjoy all the yummy bites of bits. What I didn't do is berate myself afterwards or keep the party going. for the rest of the week. It's not like, oh, I ate all that junk on Sunday. So, you know, I might as well just keep that going. I didn't do that. My husband, he saved some fun dip and he was eating some puff rocks last night.

I did not want any of it. I was like, okay, I had that. It was in the moment. It was timely. It made sense. I'm not using it to cope. I'm not using it to deal with my feelings. None of those things.

So that's the big picture, right? That's where you're able to not just lose but maintain your weight. is that kind. Process food's not going away. It's not going your way. Yes. No. And if you don't want it, great, but if you want to enjoy it every now and then, there's also nothing wrong with that. No, there absolutely isn't. Again, it's all about whether it's peaceful for you or not. Now, imagine somebody who is pre-diabetic or somebody who has diabetes. That night could be very damaging for them because they're dealing with something else. If they're on a GLP1, that night would be very, very, damaging for them because they will be in the toilet throwing up horrifically.

Yeah. So it also depends, right? Like, so I think that what you're saying is there's not one root. There are many, many, many roots. I do feel that the food industry, we do need, it is very similar. And there's research papers to show the similarities between them and the cigarette industry. Cigarette industry knew they were making something highly addictive. So does the food industry.

They did it for profits. There was tons of research to show smoking led to cancer. Now there's tons of research to show that sugar changes you metabolically and damages you. So we need to do something about this because our children are eating this and childhood obesity is at an all-time high. In the United States, this will be the first generation where children will not outlive their parents. Yeah, it's crazy. It's totally directed to ultra-processed food. So it's like anything else.

can drink responsibly, why would you stop? I can, that's what, that drinking is not my drug. I'm not that virtuous because the cupcake is my drug. So I'm not saying this because I'm above anybody else. But so why should I ever stop drinking wine? I shouldn't because I can have a glass and not have it again, just like what you describe. I can even go out. Three drinks is a lot for me, but I have three drinks one night, have a blast, dance, so four in the morning, but I don't want to look at alcohol for another three weeks. Okay. But if, If I had the candy buffet that you had, I don't know how long that bender would last for me. Okay.

So let's talk about this because there is, you know, it's interesting because I have a post in the group on chocolate, right? You know, having that dark chocolate, nothing wrong with it. You know, it can be healthy for you. But people come to rely on it. They need it. They look forward to it. That's the issue I have, right?

Getting stuck on what you want rather than you need. And yet I have a post on alcohol that tells people how to choose responsibly and alcohol is that better. And they're like, well, you say we can have alcohol. Why can't we have chocolate? I mean, you can have chocolate. I'm just thinking bigger picture about it. But what's the difference between being an alcoholic and is there a foodaholic?

Because I know for a while there, food addiction actually wasn't really recognized as an actual addiction. How does someone know whether they're using food to cope versus being a food addict? Like, where's the line, Sandra? Like if someone all this can resonate and you cannot have food addiction issues. Like, or it can be resonating because you do. Where's the line? Where do we see ourselves in this? Yeah.

I agree with you. And so it's interesting, and I had to be certified in Europe. So in European countries, they do believe food addiction exists. Their obesity rates are a lot lower. Here in North America, we don't believe it exists. And I think the food industry has something to do with that. But having said that, I was able to have an outpatient program because of doctors like Dr. Sean Wharton, who you often have, who say, yes, there's no evidence to suggest there's

food addiction, but I actually listen to my patients and they're talking about using food in a very similar way to my patients who have alcoholism, the way that they use alcohol. So often the ramp up, there's many ramp ups to food addiction. So first, there's childhood trauma. So as children, we experience scary things, frightening things, we're not safe. We find food. It's available. It's easy and we start eating it to self-soothe. But then over time, we're like, huh, I'm not even upset today. right, like the person who needs the chocolate. I'm not upset today, but I'm still going to eat this. I still have to eat this.

And in fact, if I don't eat this, I don't withdrawal. I get headache. I get irritable. I can't sleep right if I don't have the chocolate before I go to bed. Now we're kind of entering food addiction territory. But here's the deal. Whether you identify as a food addict or not, the reason why I have an outpatient program is because the doctor said, hmm, there's no downside to Sandra's program.

literally if someone chooses to reduce or eliminate ultra processed foods there's no risk to your health so like okay great you got the program now it's in clinics across canada because yeah there there there's just it's it's when even when you're not upset and you need it so for the person who needs dark chocolate before bed every night you might just need a ritual you might just need a ritual of soothing so sometimes it could be dark chocolate so i like the harm reduction if it's It's seven nights a week. Can you move to four nights a week? And then the other three develop another ritual.

So a tea ritual, which is my absolute favorite. And I actually Jones for tea now. Or is it adult coloring? Then you might move from four nights a week to two nights a week, but you're likely looking to have be soothed, to have a little dopamine hits, to just feel relaxed. So give yourself that. Never, the plan can never be, I have to stop.

that's my plan really that's like starting a business i have to make money that's my plan what yeah well dopamine hit is a whole other thing because we're going it's a lot of times it's the anticipation of eating the food and that's a whole other thing i want to um before we go today i want to talk about here's here's sushi uh sushi she she says once i start it's very hard to stop yeah so i'm better off not having it at all i struggle with moderation or just one piece again i don't think the words moderation and control have any place when it comes to weight loss or you're not trying to moderate yourself. You're not trying to control yourself. Just be in tune with where you're at, what you need, what kind of day you had if you're being triggered. Like what's going on? What is this about?

But what's your powerful question. If I could just jump in the power. What's my intention when I'm eating this? So is my intention to calm down? Is my intention to feel sooth? What's my intention? Okay. Okay. Because that was my question. What the fuck do we do about that? Because we're in it like what, like how do we even stop that, right? This kind of. with awareness. And that's what this conversation is today. You know, I'm going to walk away and, you know, deal with this overnight. Yeah. Wake up tomorrow and be a new person. But as soon as you have that awareness, there's something you can do about it. So what, once you start, how do you stop? So a couple. So the intention question is great. I'm going to tell you a little story of what

just happened to me. So I do present as I believe a confident person. So I was at a client site. I was talking to a woman that I've known for 10 years. I love her. She's sweet. And I was telling her about some cosmetic procedures I wanted to do just to keep it young and fresh. And she let it out. She said, why would you work on your face when you're carrying your body around like that? Oh, did you throw punch her? I would have thrown punch her. No, we did the silence.

Sandra. Sorry. I let it hang in the air. And women can process so quickly. This is a very important client to me. This is a big, very interesting. Oh, I actually would not have been a client of mine any longer. I know. I know. But that's the shame. That's the shame a lot of us women or your mother-in-law says something. And you start going, whoa, wait a minute. If I say something, I fight with my husband, it's in front of the kids. And what are the things? Should I show the other? And that struck with me. And so I left that day going, I want to eat. Did you say anything to her? No. Gosh, come on. You're a better person than me. Because, you know, listen, I get like life is frustrating. People have their own shit. But then I also think you can be nice and not being asshole. I know this.

like I digress, but I can't fucking stand assholes. Like you don't got anything nice to say. Don't fucking say it. Fuck off. It is hard enough as it is to get up every day and do the things you need to do without this bullshit. I love that. I just imagine saying you should just go fuck yourself.

I would have been like, are you fucking seriously right now? But, you know, I digress because I think because a lot of people do carry the shame of carrying excess weight, they don't feel entitled to their voice. They don't feel like they, that can say something because like I'm just so tired of that shit. Sorry, I digress. Sorry. I love you. You are like one of the nicest people I know and she's a jerk. Okay. I know you have a moral to the story here. So continue. So I live by this advice. I do not take advice from anybody I do not want to emulate. So yes, I have been friends with her from 12 years. But it's all, you know, work friends. Like it's not somebody I would ever hang out with her have dinner with. She's a work friend. And. And. I would not take advice from her. She's not happy.

She is mean. She is like there's nothing about her life that I want to emulate. So I shouldn't really listen to anything she has to say. Right. But it was so good for me because this is a gift. I believe everything is a gift because then I had to give a. Yeah, it was such a gift because I had to give a talk at a conference at the obesity update. So with all doctors, all people that I'm trying to impress with a doctor who said, I don't know him,

but he said, we don't need a patient to talk about their experience. I don't like when patients talk. So I already had to sympathize him and share a panel with him, which is nerve-wracking. And I started the talk with the most underutilized therapeutic tool is love and compassion. Yes. And when a patient sits across from you, they're not starting at neutral. They're carrying a narrative that they've been building for years and decades, that I'm the failure. Something's wrong with me.

Yes. So can you, how do you show people love and compassion? Because when you don't address the shame, shame changes outcomes. And everybody on this call, I think you can relate. Shame makes you delay appointments, avoid appointments. Shame worsens your mental health, more anxiety, more depression, more emotional eating. Shame affects the outcomes. And when we just pretend like it's not there, that's why I shared that story.

Yes. And people gasped in the audience when I said that. They were like, and I'm like, yeah, she said that to me. And I present as very confident, imagine the person who does it. Imagine the person who feels, who's carrying that shame with them. What is said to them? That's when I'm like, wow, her comment just took my advocacy work to the next level. Because if she's saying that to me, what is she saying to the woman who carries the shame in her eyes?

Yeah, well, we are at a time, but, you know, we could end this by saying that's the way some people speak to themselves. Oh, right? Like, that's a whole, that's a whole other thing. This was, again, there's no to-do list here, right? To everyone watching live, listening after the fact, there's no to-do list for you. This is like, were there things that, and I do believe if someone says something to me and it resonates with me, good, bad, whatever my reaction, that reaction shows me that there's a message in there for me. Right? And maybe it's to have a voice.

Maybe it's to just be more confident in yourself, whatever that is. This is about if there was a moment where you're like, oh, oh, that's all you have to do with that. You just have to bring awareness to this. Sandra is going to be back and joining us later in the program. She also offers her own eight-week online program that can help walk you through the steps of food addiction. You can find more information about this at Sandra Aaliyah.com. If you're looking for more information, she's also giving. our Livy Method members, 75% off with their Libby Love Code.

Is it Livy Love Exclamation? Yes. Okay. That's part of it. It's a lot of love. We got a lot of love here for you. And it's only the Livy community that gets this discount. No one else does.

I love that. It's all our love. All are love. You can also follow Sandra over at Instagram at Sandraalia.ca. Thanks everyone for joining us. I know you got some good tidbits out there. Of course, Sandra Leah, thank you. Always a pleasure.

Bye, guys. Thanks.