The Mel Robbins Podcast - How to Create the Life You Want: Lessons From the #1 Happiness Researcher

Episode Date: February 6, 2025

This episode is your playbook for a happier, more fulfilling, and more meaningful life. Today, renowned researcher Dr. Judith Joseph, MD is here to share the simple, science-backed habits that will truly make your life better. She is here to share her groundbreaking research on this important subject and exactly what to do to feel more energized, excited, joyful, and present in your life again. Dr. Joseph is a double-board-certified psychiatrist who trained at and is affiliated with Columbia University and New York University. She is also a pioneering researcher and the founder and principal investigator of her research institute, Manhattan Behavioral Medicine.In this episode, she’s revealing—for the first time ever—her 5 V’s Framework, a groundbreaking research-backed approach from her Happiness Lab.If you’re ready to take control of your life, achieve your biggest goals, and create lasting happiness, this episode is for you. For more resources, click here for the podcast episode page. If you liked this episode, your next listen should be this one: What Makes a Good Life? Lessons From the Longest Study on HappinessGet a copy of Mel’s new book, The Let Them Theory here. Connect with Mel:  Get Mel’s new book, The Let Them TheoryWatch the episodes on YouTubeFollow Mel on Instagram The Mel Robbins Podcast InstagramMel's TikTok Sign up for Mel’s personal letter Subscribe to SiriusXM Podcasts+ on Apple Podcasts to listen to ad-free new episodes Disclaimer

Hey, it's your friend Mel, and welcome to the Mel Robbins Podcast. Today you and I are going to step into the Happiness Lab with the remarkable Dr. Judith Joseph. And we're going to walk away with five small habits that will change your life. And this isn't just a promise. This is research from Dr. Judith's Happiness Lab. Dr. Judith is one of the most renowned doctors and researchers practicing today.

She is the founder and principal investigator at Manhattan Behavioral Medicine, where she and her team have conducted over 60 clinical research trials. And the most recent trial she's running, it's all about happiness. She has been studying what separates those of you who are flourishing from those of you who feel stuck,

overwhelmed or exhausted. And lucky for you and me, I've enrolled us both into her research trial at the Happiness Lab. So we can get her strategies and actionable tools that based on research, elevate your mindset and will give you the roadmap to making this your best year yet. So are you ready to learn the five steps to being happy

according to research and designing the life you want? I know I am, so let's do this. Hey, it's your friend Mel. I am so happy that you're here because I love the topic and I love who we're going to get to spend time with together. And you know who else I love spending time with together? You. It's always an honor to be able to spend this time and learn with you and laugh with you. And if you're brand new, I just want to welcome you to the Mel Robbins podcast family. You have picked one heck of a winner

of a conversation to listen to because what's more important than your happiness? Not a whole lot else. And the fact that you hit play, you know what that tells me about you? It tells me that you're interested in learning more about ways that you can improve your life and be happier. And you also love research.

I love that because I love that too. And today I'm bringing you a conversation that's not just inspiring, it's transformational. Today in our Boston studios, you're going to get to meet and spend time with the incredible Dr. Judith Joseph. Now Dr. Judith is a double board certified psychiatrist. She earned her medical degree in MBA and completed her residency at Columbia University, where she now serves as the chairwoman of the Women in Medicine Board. And she also went to do her fellowship at NYU,

where she's been a professor for over a decade. Her cutting edge research has earned her national recognition, including a US Congress and House of Representatives Proclamation Award for her advocacy in mental health and her innovative research. She is also at the cutting edge of medical research. She's the founder and principal investigator

at Manhattan Behavioral Medicine, where she and her team have conducted over 60 clinical research trials, including leading the trial for the first ever FDA approved drug for postpartum depression. Isn't that amazing? Well, that's just the beginning. Dr. Judith's mission aligns perfectly with the mission of the Mel Robbins podcast, which is to make life changing information

accessible to everyone in your life, in my life. That's what we're doing here. And why I'm so excited is because through her latest brand new Happy Lab research, she's been working to uncover what she says are the five things based on research that are going to make you thrive. And today, she is revealing them to you. So let's dive in. Please help me welcome the extraordinary Dr. Judith Joseph to the Mal Robbins Podcast. Mal, I'm so happy to be here.

Well, I can't wait to jump into the topic and to all of your brand new research. And I want to start by asking you, could you just speak directly to the person that's here with us right now and listening and share with them, what is it that they might experience differently in their life if they really take to heart everything that you're about to teach us today and may apply it in their life? If you're listening right now and you are feeling a bit empty or restless or just feeling lost, you should thank yourself right now because you are giving yourself the gift of knowledge. You are being curious about how you can potentially be happier and how you

could potentially impact the people in your lives. So I want you to thank yourself because you are giving yourself the gift of making your life better. I was not expecting you to say that. I think that when you're feeling really overwhelmed or lost or just unhappy, that the last thing that you're doing is thanking yourself. You're beating yourself up. Why is that an important thing that you're doing is thanking yourself. You're beating yourself up. Why is that an important thing to do? Many of us are so hard on ourselves. Look, for example, today I'm coming to the Mel Robbins show to see my good friend Mel and I'm like, why didn't I read this? Why didn't I read that? I had to even stop and say, I should be really

giving myself some gratitude here. You know, I'm doing something that's making the world a better place. I'm a working mom. I'm a single mom. I am an entrepreneur. So as a psychiatrist, I have to remind myself of my self-worth that I am doing something good that I should be grateful for me and grateful for the things that I'm doing. What's interesting about what you just said is that I think that we all know that we beat ourselves up, but when I look at somebody like you

and I look at your resume and I look at the work that you're doing in the world, it wouldn't even occur to me that you have a critical inner voice. And I guess where I wanna start, because for the person that isn't familiar with your work, you have an extremely unique lab. You do very important work.

And I would love for you to just share with the person that's with us what you do and why it's so unique and the kinds of things that your lab is researching right now. Well, Mel, I've told you this story before personally, but many people don't know this. In 2020, I was sitting at my desk in my office, and I was given this talk to this major hospital system to people who didn't know what was happening in the world who were faced with uncertainty and were afraid. And they were looking to me for help. And midway through that talk, I was just like, Oh my gosh, I think I'm depressed. And I was like, how did depression sneak up on me?

And it led me to wonder, how many people out there are wearing this mask of productivity? They're really struggling underneath and no one knows it. But they're coping with it by busying themselves, by showing up for others, by being a good mom, by being a good friend, a good sister, a caretaker. And I started to ask this question in my practice, and many people were saying, that is me, that is me. But they weren't fitting neatly into this box because they were still

going, they were still pushing through, they were still functioning. That led me to really understand the human experience in a different way. How is it that people are showing up, but they're feeling empty? What is that? And that led me to understand high functioning depression, that feeling of being numb, being meh, feeling blah, feeling as if things don't excite you anymore. And I want people to know that this is a human experience. It's happening to you, you can understand it better and you could do something about it. You have a very unique take though, on everything everything that you do because you're not only in clinical

practice and you're not only a professor, but you're running this world-renowned research lab. So before we jump into some of the things that you've been researching about high functioning depression and more importantly, the new research coming out of the Happiness Lab. Can you just share with the person that's listening what your lab does and some of the things that you're focused on that are very unique and how that informs the way you think about happiness?

Yes. My lab is focused on mental health issues anywhere from ADHD to dementia. And as a principal investigator, leading teams that study phase two to phase four clinical research, we're constantly trying to work with companies to develop new medications, new therapies, to address things like ADHD, bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, depression. And as a scientific, serious researcher, I know that there's something called the biopsychosocial

model. Okay, hold on. What is the biopsychosocial? What did you say? Biopsychosocial model. Okay. And what does that mean in a normal person's speak? Well, in medical school, we all learn that certain illnesses or conditions have different

components. If it were as simple, let's say, for example, as depression, if it was simple as taking a pill, none of us would ever be depressed. We just put the meds in the water and everybody would be happy-go-lucky, right? But we know that it's not that simple because biologically, there are risk factors for depression. There are risk factors based on your genetics, your past family history, and certain medical conditions. And then we know psychologically there are factors based on your past trauma,

your attachment style, the way that you're resilient or not, the way you cope adaptively or not, and then the social part, which is your environment. So what are your relationships like? What is your job like? What is your school like? What are you eating? How much are you moving? Are you exposed to toxins? So it's very complicated because there are all these factors that lead to your happiness or detract from your happiness. And I wanted to democratize that because why should only medical students have access to this? Everyone should know what their bio psychosocial is

because then we have different avenues to obtaining and attaining sustainable happiness. I think I understand why you're so excited about this new research. What are you researching exactly in the happiness lab? Well, everyone has a different idea about happiness. What is your definition of happiness? For me, feeling connected.

When I was, and it goes back to my childhood, my dad was a pastor and we would go out into the community and help people. And feeling connected to people, feeling that I'm creating purpose in this world, that makes me happy. And connectedness could be with my family, it could be with my friends in my lab, but that makes me extremely happy. I mean, I'm one of four siblings, so I'm always around people and that energy feeds me. It makes me thrive. The moments in my life, in my past when I've been unhappy, I've been incredibly lonely and I need to feel that connection.

Is everybody's definition different? I think so. I think some people are okay with having some loneliness here or there. I call it loneliness, but for them it's me time, right? For others, they need that time away from others to explore, to create, and that's okay. We all have our own idea of what makes us feel happier. Every time you think of the word happy, just imagine, write down what you imagine happy is in your mind.

I immediately thought of my dog. I don't know if my family's going to be mad at me, but for some reason I thought about my dog. Well, I have two dogs, so I should probably say both dogs. And the fact that it's not that I'm happy when I see them, I am. But if I had to think of an image around what is happy, it's the fact that when you open the door, your pet is so excited to see you,

their whole body is shaking, they are nothing but love toward you, they seem to constantly be emoting something that feels positive. Am I in the right line here? Well, Mal, you're healed. You've done the work. But many people, when they think of happiness, when they're being real with themselves, they're thinking about, I have this house, I have this car, I have this partner, I have this

perfect job. I feel complete. The problem with that is that once you get those things, the science shows that you're still not happy, you're still looking for more things. And I've experienced that, you know, I had the fancy degrees, got the marriage, got the kid, had the house, had the business, and I still felt empty, I was still looking for more. And that's an experience that a lot of people come to me with.

They say, well, I don't know why I'm still not happy. But I wanted people to understand why they feel this way. What is the science of your happiness? And there's this whole curriculum throughout America and many schools where adolescents are learning about the science of happiness, college students are learning about it. But a lot of adults don't know about it. And I wanted to basically bring you back to school to understand the science of your happiness.

So in my lab, I take people through their own unique biopsychosocial and help them to understand their biology, understand their psychology and their social factors so that we can work from these three different angles to really cultivate joy. Well, what I think is so cool is that when I think about what you do for a living, on one hand, you're teaching, on another hand, you're in clinical practice sitting in front of people. And another unique thing about your practice is you have people of all ages in your practice.

So your practice is little kids all the way up to grandparents. And so you're seeing the full range of the human experience. And then you're running an all-female clinical research lab that is investigating and running clinical trials for pharmaceutical prescription drugs that will help people with mental health issues. And so you have this lens that where you've seen interventions with prescription drugs, you see interventions with talk therapy, you are teaching this at New York University. And now you've decided to start this happiness lab to try to help people find their blueprint for happiness.

So how did you set up the research for the happiness lab given that you have these three very different parts of your professional life where you're seeing patients? Well, the research is focused on mostly the clinical studies, but the teaching is teaching doctors at NYU how to talk to the media. Because what I found, I'm someone who is kind of like in the late game to psychiatry, I started off as an anesthesiology resident, didn't like it, found that I wasn't fulfilled, wasn't connecting to people.

Dude, you've been unhappy for a while is what I'm hearing. Right. Putting them to sleep and then like never seeing them again. And that's not why I went into medicine. I went in, if I'm being real with myself, to really help people and to connect to people and to feel that sense of purpose, right? It's a little selfish because I feel good when I help people. But if I never see them again, I don't get to follow up with them. And not only is the OR cold in temperature, but it's a cold place. It's sterile, you know? So switching to psychiatry really opened up my eyes and showed me that, you know, I had to examine

my own happiness, the science of my own happiness. But with the students at NYU, I teach them how to democratize mental health. You know, in some parts of America, there's only one psychiatrist for every 30,000 people. Sometimes I struggle with 30 patients, right? Let alone 30,000. So I wanted to take that information from the lab, from science, from medicine, and teach doctors how to really deliver it in a concise, relatable way so they don't appear as the scary psychiatrist is trying to put your meds.

So that we're teaching people from the biopsychosocial lens, how to live fuller lives, how to take care of their mental health. And then the science of my happiness lab, that really pulls all of these themes into one place. So people are learning about something I call the five V's. Five V's? The five V's to thriving. Okay.

So the first V is validation, the second is venting, the third is values, the fourth is vitals, and the last is vision. And if we tailor this to the individual and they learn about the science of their own happiness, then they can practice these things as they go home, they can share it with their loved ones, and they can continue doing the work even after they've left the lab. So Dr. Judith, you've spent almost your entire career treating and helping patients who are struggling with depression and anxiety and who are just feeling off or on autopilot or they have like complex trauma.

And that's the work that you've been doing as a psychiatrist. And then you have this research institute that is also researching and doing clinical trials for all kinds of pharmaceutical interventions that are trying to get approved by the FDA to help people with mental health challenges. And what I'm curious about is why did you want to then kind of flip it from depression and anxiety and truly do research around happiness? Like, what led to this?

So many times we're so focused on the science and advances that we've forgotten the basics. And we all have the DNA, we have the makeup to find happiness. We're just genetically built to have joy. That's why we have dopamine in our brains. But we've forgotten along the way the basics. And I wanted people to know that there were five pathways to happiness that everyone has access to. We all do different things within these five

V's that I created, but we all have access to them. And if we knew them, then we could all find the signs of our own happiness and follow these five pathways. And are these five pathways that you're about to teach us, these five V's that have come out of your research in this happiness lab project, are these related to the same things that keep you unhappy or make you be in a position in your life where you feel lost or overwhelmed? Like, what's the connection between what you see when somebody's really struggling versus what you see when somebody's happy? All of these five V's have a negative and a positive aspect of them.

If we're not doing them right, we will be unhappy. If we're doing them in a positive way that edifies us, we will be happier. Let me just see that I understand what you just said. So as a psychiatrist and a researcher, you see these same five things when somebody's struggling, it's just that they're not actually focused on them. And that means that if you flip it, these same five things become your pathway to becoming

happier regardless of where you are in your life and what you're dealing with. Absolutely. That is so cool. Well, one of the V's I heard you say was venting. Yes. No wonder I'm happy, because I do a lot of venting. Now I actually want to unpack all this, because you keep those saying, tailor it to the individual. What does that mean?

Because I thought that kind of the blueprint is the same for all of us, it's not. The blueprint, right, the biopsychosocial, we all have one, but it's going to be different based on the individual. For example, if you're someone with an autoimmune condition, you're a biological loading, you may have to do more work there.

You may have to work with healthcare providers, physical therapists, you know, you may have to work on anti-inflammatory issues or use drugs. So your biological component's gonna be different than someone who, let's say, doesn't have a chronic physical condition. Someone else who doesn't have a chronic physical condition may have more social loading.

They may be in a toxic relationship. So you can have as low inflammation and eat as much kale as you want. You're still with that bad person, right? You're still with someone who's making your life miserable. So for that individual, I'm going to have to work on their relationship and how that impacts them. Someone else who's got more of the psychological load, and let's say they have a past history of PTSD and trauma, I can tell them to go out into the world and meet people,

but they're getting triggered. So I'm gonna have to work with that person on more trauma responses and coping skills than someone else. So do the five V's that you've come up with in your research in the happiness lab, are those going to help you figure out what aspects of your life? You keep saying loaded. Is that like a clinical term?

I think about that word in a bar. Yes. Okay. So loaded means you got to do more there? So yeah. So wherever you're having the most stress, I think that's a simple way of saying it. Whichever of these circles is causing you the most stress, that's where you may want

to focus your efforts first. And the five V's, when you tailor it to yourself, because we all have the same framework, but we have different stories, we all have different pasts, different genetic makeups. If you tailor it to yourself, then you feel as if there's a chance, there's hope. What I found is that people read books and then they go to talks and they feel like, well, I did all the right things. I did these things. It worked for that person. It's not working for me. Well, you probably weren't thinking it based on your own makeup, based on the science of your own happiness. And that's why it probably didn't lead to the outcome that you desired.

And the five V's that you're about to share with us help you customize what you need to work on now. Yes. That is so cool. Okay. This is personalized medicine, basically, straight from you. Dr. Judith, I just love you. I'm always smiling when you're here because you are so generous with your research. So I really appreciate you coming up from New York and spending time here.

Don't you appreciate Dr. Judith? Don't you love this research? I bet you do. And I bet there's someone in your life that needs a little Dr. Judith Mel Robbins in their life. They need to know the roadmap to being happier. So be generous with this and share it with them. So Dr. Judith, we are inside your happiness lab where you have uncovered the five things based on research that are going to help us thrive.

So let's unpack this. What is the first V in this formula that you have? The first, I think, is the most important. It's validation. And I know it sounds cheesy. But for someone like myself, again, Ivy League trained, two Ivy League degrees, I can tell you that it's one of the hardest things for me to do,

is to validate and acknowledge how I'm feeling. And it's one of the hardest things for me to do, is to validate and acknowledge how I'm feeling. And it sounds so granola, but if you're someone who's a working mom, who's a teacher, who is a healthcare provider, how many times in a day do you ignore how you feel? I recently gave a talk at this very high powered event with all these working women, and I asked them, how many of you have had to really pee, but then you held it in and you didn't because you were doing something very important.

There was not one hand that was not raised. We invalidate how we feel all of the time. We don't acknowledge our stress. We say, I'm fine, I'm okay, good, you. If we took a look at ourselves throughout the day and we self validated, we would be so much better. Because when we acknowledge how we feel, that in itself is an act of therapy because the human brain releases stress, it decreases anxiety when we can pinpoint how we feel and

it's evidence-based. But we don't do it and it's free, everyone can do it. So why does this impact happiness? Because you just said it was evidence-based, because I agree with you. I was really excited to talk with you about this topic, because I think a lot of us hear the same advice, and then we kind of roll our eyes.

And you just said, it does sound kind of cheesy, but it's evidence-based, which makes me go, well, how on earth does validating how I feel make me happier? If you acknowledge what you're really feeling, then you can get to the root of A, why you're feeling that way, what are the stresses in your life leading to that,

and B, come up with a solution for it. It is that simple. And many of us don't acknowledge how we're feeling. We stay in bad relationships and we keep saying, well, you know, I'm getting X, Y, Z from it, but we're ignoring the negatives that I'm feeling disrespected. I'm feeling neglected.

I'm feeling abandoned because it's so painful. And instead, what do we do? We push through it. We busy ourselves. We work harder at the relationship. We keep saying, it's okay, maybe next time, if I just do this differently, they'll change. This invalidation is harmful, and not just for romantic relationships, even in, you

know, certain workplace conditions. Well, if I just get to this next level, if the boss says that if I just do this one project right, then I'll get there. And we continue gaslighting ourselves, not acknowledging our feelings, not self-validating. And that leads other people to invalidate us. It's this ripple effect. So how do you start this? Because I think for a lot of us, if I think back to today, I'm doing okay, like this particular day, tomorrow, who knows what's going to happen when I wake up. But when I think back to moments in my life where I've been profoundly unhappy, I was way too busy.

I was drinking too much. I was gaslighting myself, saying, I'll just get through it. I'll just get through it. But if you're in the middle of that, or you're profoundly depressed, you're so wired to just keep going or to avoid it. How do you even validate your feelings if you've basically been numbing them for a long time? It is a trauma response. Avoidance is a trauma response. So knowing that, right, that's why the biopsychosocial is so important. And I want people to learn about it

because if they know that, wait, I'm busying myself because I don't wanna feel pain. If they know that this is happening, many Because if they know that, wait, I'm busying myself because I don't want to feel pain. If they know that this is happening, many people don't know that, then they'll slow down. Then they'll take a rest, they'll reflect, they'll stop, they'll realize that things have to change. But if your coping skill is to avoid, to not acknowledge, to invalidate yourself, you'll push through until something else happens. You may physically break down, you may start, you know, substance abuse may get worse, or, you know, you may develop a clinical depression, you know, mental health crisis.

But if you know that this is a response, this will help you. I'll give myself as an example. I was in therapy for many years. Before I entered therapy, I was a psych resident, and I had switched from anesthesia to psychiatry. And then in psychiatry, we have these process groups where you sit around and you talk about your feelings. And I was the surgical person in the room and I was like, why do these people complain? They have a good life.

They don't have to wake up at 5 a.m. They get to pee, they get to eat. They have a good life because surgical residency is very difficult. And then they were like, you know, everyone in the program has to enter therapy. And I was like, I don't need that. I don't need problems. Because in my mind, I was like, okay, you know, mental health issues, there's schizophrenia. There are like severe mental health issues where people can't function, right? Big mistake. I entered therapy and I learned so much about myself and how much I just pushed through pain that I wasn't even acknowledging, that I wasn't even saying this happened to me, that I had to stop and I had to be like, wow, I was being so busy.

I didn't realize that I went through this. And my therapist, you know, he actually said, you know, you have this tendency to be a masochist. And I was like, we're not supposed to use that word. A masochist? A masochist. Wow. In psychiatry, you know. What does that word even mean? Because it sounds, well, I think, like, I think I know what it means, but I think it's bad.

Well, the reason you think it's bad is because it was completely ripped out of the DSM-5 and out of the DSM-4. It's a term that was in there in the early versions of the Bible of psychiatry, the DSM 3, where it really described a person who kind of cheated themselves out of good things, let other people walk all over them, people pleased to the point where it actually hurts. Wait, that's a masochist? Yes. And people, when they think of masochism, they think of sex, but it's not that type

of masochism. Wow. I don't even know what I thought. I guess I thought it was more, I had the definition completely wrong because I actually thought the word masochism means like you're somebody who's full of themselves. It's the opposite. Yeah, that's narcissism. Yeah. Wow. So masochism really is someone who's kind of like what we would consider a people pleaser.

People who don't really acknowledge how they're feeling and just do for others and show up for others. And through therapy, I learned that I had these tendencies. Had I not gone to therapy, had I not slowed down, had I not self-reflected, then I wouldn't have done the work to discover that I had these underlying type of behaviors. So now when I go through life, I'm like, is this masochistic? Am I being a masochist? And that has really helped me in most of my decisions. Like if I'm about to take on a study, I'm like, do I have the team for that?

Do I have the hours? Do I have the time? I'm going to pass. That seems masochistic. If I take that on, that is masochistic. I had no idea that's what that word meant. I literally have been using it wrong my entire life. No, for real.

Like, I'm sort of in shock because I'm sitting here thinking people pleasing, masochism, victimhood, masochism. Well, the reason that's... Well, it sounds kind of disgusting. And I kind of like that word because a lot of times when you are a people pleaser and you are somebody that cannot say no and you struggle with guilt and then you're exhausted and you're always last on the list, there's this real kind of weakness that masochism is a strong word. And so when you start to call yourself,

I'm being a masochist, which basically means you're destroying yourself if I'm kind of tracking with you here. You had the benefit of going to therapy. The majority of people do not. So do you as a psychiatrist running a clinical practice have a tricky question, like a sneaky one? No, I'm serious because the act of learning how to validate how you feel, it's very difficult for a lot of people. I remember this funny thing that my mother said once. We were talking about therapy and she just kind of quipped, well, why would I want to

go to therapy so I can find out I hate my life and I don't like your father? Like, I don't want to look at myself. And we had a good laugh and she was kind of kidding. But is there a way, and I really mean this, for somebody that's never stopped to think about how they're actually feeling because they've been in survival mode or they've had an experience in life where they've just felt kind of invisible, where you could give the person listening a cue or a journal prompt so that they could truly do step one. Absolutely. And you're going to say it's simple. But the first step is ask yourself,

how do I feel? I know it sounds so cheesy, but how do I really feel? That's like the internal validation. People are neurodivergent. Some people can't do that introspection. So what I do with some of my clients is I say, well, because you're a visual learner, sometimes it's helpful for you, may not be helpful for someone else, to look in the mirror and look yourself in the eye and say, how am I feeling today? Be honest with yourself. Other people, again, people learn differently. They're more tactile, so they use their hands, they're more manual.

So I'll ask them to write, how do I feel? In some cases where people have something called alexithymia, which is a condition where you have a really hard time pinpointing your emotions, I'll actually have a face chart of different emotions and different words, and I'll ask them to circle, how do I feel? It sounds very basic, but there are people who can't. They just either culturally were not taught to validate themselves or in their family it just wasn't the norm. Or again, they have alexithymia.

They just don't know how to identify feelings. So depending on the person, I have artists sometimes who come to my office and I'll say when you're playing a song, maybe play a song that expresses how you feel. So that's how you can self-validate. You can verbally acknowledge it or you can write it down, but it's important to do it. I think I understand why. Let me give this back to you. You can't be sober until you stop drinking.

And if you want to be happy, you're not going to be able to access it if you are going through life denying the fact that you feel overwhelmed or sad or lonely. Like stopping to acknowledge where you're at opens the door for you to walk through it into a different room. Yes. So what is the second V? The second V is venting. I love this one. Okay.

If you think about venting, so from the scientific term, it's like air is in a bubble and then you let it out and the pressure is released. We need to let out our pressure. We need to let off steam literally, right? So venting is getting that, like when to validate how you feel, how do you get it out there? For some people, my dad's a pastor, they pray. In the church, a lot of people pray and they'll talk to God and they express to God how they're feeling, but they don't feel comfortable telling their partner, they don't feel comfortable

telling anyone else. For others, it's talking to a therapist. For others, it could be to a faith leader. And I mentioned I treat artists, so sometimes some of my artists will come in and they'll sing a song to me or they'll show me something that they drew. I personally vent by using social media because if I'm feeling a certain way, I'll create a reel or a post to express it. And a lot of my younger clients who are in Gen Z, I think now 50% of Gen Z wants to have like a side hustle as being an influencer.

So they're expressing their feelings that way, venting in that creative outlet. So let me just make sure I get venting because when you said the second V from the research that you've been doing on what you need to be doing in order to become happier based on the research, when you said venting, I'm like, great. So my rage texts to my husband are going to make me happier. My, but that's not what you mean. Okay. Well, there are dos and don'ts of venting.

Okay, so give us the dos because if you validate how you feel, which opens the door to having you be able to feel something different, then you have to vent. But what am I venting exactly? Am I venting bad things? Am I venting good things? You can vent bad or good. Venting is getting the emotion out once you acknowledge it. Oh! Validating can be acknowledging both perceived good and bad emotions, right? Negative or positive. I don't like the word good, bad, but, you know, any emotion that you acknowledge, you can then vent it. Now, what you described when you are, you know, full of rage or you're emotional, that could be perceived as trauma dumping, right?

So, like, you mean Thursday night? And with my clients, I do go through the do's and the don'ts, like, don't vent when you're in the heat of the moment, right? Maybe take a beat, slow down a bit and think about it. And then, you know, don't trauma dump, you know, especially if you're venting to someone who's maybe on a, someone who's an employee, right? That power dynamic is not fair because they're going to listen. They're not going to be like, shut up. Like, you complain all the time. They're going to be like, uh-huh, yeah, boss. And then they're going to go home and then they're going to vent to someone else, right? So you want to be mindful of making sure that you're not trauma dumping and making sure that you are reflecting and not, you know, then creating stress for someone

else. But really, I ask people to do a lot of self-venting first. So say it out loud if you have to, you know, express it in a song if you have to. But it is helpful to talk to people. And you want to think about, okay, the person that I'm going to repeatedly, is it fair? Is that person okay with it? So you can even ask them like, hey, is it okay if I check in with you? I have this problem. I know that I come to you often. If it ever feels like I'm doing this too much, or you feel overwhelmed and it's not reciprocal, let me know. So there are ways to go about it, which I provide. So as part of the five Vs, and I'm sorry, I've got my little brain spinning here. Are

part of these five Vs helping you also release the things that are keeping you unhappy? Yes. Got it. Okay. So now I'm getting this. So a lot of people that do happiness research, they start with, do these things, and then that creates more happiness. As a clinical researcher, you're saying there are actually things that are in your way from even accessing the advice that a lot of people are giving. That if you're, let's just take the first one,

not even present to your feelings and you haven't validated them, you're not gonna take the walk. If you're not venting, which now it sounds like venting is literally releasing the emotion that has you trapped, whether it's positive or negative and saying, oh, I'm sad, or talking to somebody or doing art, you're gonna stay stuck in that emotion

because it's trapped in you. And so it's almost like these are hidden obstacles that are keeping you from accessing the happiness that's available to you. Absolutely. Oh, I just got this. Okay. I love the way that you really break things down because you're absolutely right. People automatically think I got to do these things, but they're not doing the first parts,

which is again, this is the democratizing of the mental health that I'm talking about. The first parts, that's usually what happens in a therapeutic setting, right? We get to the, we started the basics and then we work our way up to the action. Gotcha. But when you're skipping that part, right, and you're doing the action, you don't even know why you're doing it. You don't understand it, correct. Dr. Joseph, I think I finally understand

what you're trying to teach us, which is there are all these pieces of advice that do work that allow you to be happier. But what you're actually doing is going a layer deeper based on the research and revealing the things that keep you stuck from even accessing the happiness. If you do, like you take a walk or you reach out to other people, if you're still blocked emotionally, if you haven't released the emotion, then happiness is

going to be fleeting. It's like a bandaid on a giant wound. And so are these five Vs the things that are almost like the hidden obstacles to you being able to access happiness? They are. You know, if you think about it as you're going from deeper level to surface level, it's a journey. And I think that what you're describing so beautifully is that people, they want to get the skills in the toolbox, but they don't understand the why. They don't understand what they're searching for.

So they're just like, you know, using these tools, but they don't have a target. They don't understand what was behind it. And the beginning parts are so important. And that's what I'm talking about with democratizing mental health is that when you sit with someone who's a therapist and you do the work and you're learning, A, how you feel and how to express it so that you can continue growing in that work, then you can start using the tools. But a lot of us who've never really worked with anyone or didn't have success in therapy,

we're just using the tools, but it's like no one taught us how to use the tools, so we're lost. Well, what's also really important about this is that if you have somebody in your life who's not happy, and I can think of just, gosh, it's probably, say, seven years ago, my husband was really struggling. It was after his business had failed and he absolutely had depression. He was doing all the things. He was meditating, he was exercising,

he was engaging in meaningful work and volunteering as a hospice volunteer. He could not access happiness. And it's exactly what you're talking about. All of his feelings were bottled up inside and in his case, it was the shame that he felt about having lost all this money in the business and feeling like he had failed to provide as a parent

and as a husband and as a father. And it wasn't until he did what you're talking about, which is validate how he was feeling and then vent it by starting to actually talk about it and write about it in his journal and then talk about it with me and talk about it with somebody else. And when I think about our son Oakley, when Oakley was really struggling in school and felt incredibly lonely, he just shut down. And it didn't matter how many Lego sets he built or how much time we spent skiing, which he loved to do, he still would go back to that baseline of unhappiness.

And so I think this is also important because when you have somebody that's struggling in your life, you tend to kind of throw the things they should be doing at them. and this is the deeper stuff that has them blocked. So what is the third V that somebody needs to do? The third is values. And for myself, I talked about how I used to value education and accolades and all these things. But at the end of the day, I had to do a deep dive and think about, well, when I felt full, fed, and really purposeful, these were the times when I was helping others, right?

And even if I was in this prestigious program, in this prestigious field at the time, I didn't feel fulfilled, I didn't feel fed. But what I valued was connecting with people and helping them. So I had to go back to the basics as to what I truly value, not what people tell me that I should value, not what my family told me I should value, but what I truly valued. And for some, it could be your faith. For some, it could be your family. For others, it's a cause that you feel passionate about. There are deeper level values and more shallow ones. Like, you know, many of us, we chase money, we chase materialistic things. I think that those are

more shallow because they don't last. When you're in your deathbed, you're not going to think, oh, I wish I had that pink Porsche. Right. The only people that remember how much you worked are your kids. You're going to think about the people in your life. You're going to think about whether or not you created change. You're going to think about the legacy that you left. So I think that really being, having that self-reflection and thinking about what you truly value, what brings you purpose and meaning, what makes your life rich, what makes you feel full and fed, not the things that are just around you, the objects, but things

that really give you that sense of purpose. As a psychiatrist in clinical practice, is there a question? Is there like some little trick that we can use? Because I do think that word value, it feels awfully big. It does. And when you're not happy, you're not sure what you value. And especially if you're listening, not even for yourself, but you're thinking about somebody that you care about, who isn't happy right now. Is there a question? Is there an exercise? Do you look in the past and see when you were happy? How can you figure this out for yourself?

When I have a client in my practice, sometimes, and I recently had someone come to me and say, I just don't remember what I valued anymore. So we had to look at the past. And I asked her, when was the last time that you can really remember that you felt full and fed? You know, I use these very basic- You mean at a table? Dining room table? Other than that, just like you're spiritually full, you're satisfied. And we went back to her childhood.

And around that time, you know, her parents are going through a divorce. But right before that, she remembered that they would spend a lot of time in nature, that they would, you know, do camping trips and things like that. And so we had to look back in her past. It took us time, but we found that point in time. We found the trauma and we uncovered what was blocking her. And she hadn't been spending a lot of time in nature. She was living in a big city.

She was busy herself with her important job. So I asked her, okay, let's, you value nature, let's start to spend some time there. I didn't ask her to go on a hiking trip. Right. I asked her to slowly take steps. So the first step was, you know, reading about a hike online. The next step was maybe looking at pictures of it, maybe going out and picking out some boots. So we did baby steps to get there. And eventually she started spending more time in nature and feeling a bit happier.

Not to say that her depression was completely cured, but her points of joy were increasing. That gave her hope because she felt so lost, but knowing that these little things, simple things could bring her back to feeling purposeful, even for just moments, that gave her hope. I have a friend that I saw recently who just was glowing. And I said to her, what is going on? Like, you look amazing. And she said, well, you know what? I started taking ballet classes as an adult.

And it was something I did as a kid. And I've been feeling this sense that something's missing because my kids are now busy as they're getting older and I'm not quite sure what fills me up. So I just started taking ballet because I used to love it and I'm just, and she just looked alive. And I offer that up because I think it's a easy way to think about what is something that you haven't done in a long time that you used to enjoy doing, hiking, taking a class, artistic expression, that just that little thing you're saying based on the research can open up doors to greater happiness

for you. It can. And sometimes I have clients who can't remember their childhood because maybe there was so much disruption, maybe there was so much trauma and they have a foggy memory. So I have other creative ways to help them with their values. Like, think of someone that maybe if you could pick one person that you could sit down and have a coffee with or a drink with, who would it be? And sometimes they'll be like, oh, I wish, you know, if Prince were alive, I could sit down with Prince. It's like, okay, so what is it about

Prince? You know, and then we go back to they value music and they used to listen to music, they used to go to live shows. So there are different creative ways that you can get to finding out what you value. And for some of my clients, I have to be very concrete and list the values out and then go through them. But you can find things that you truly bring your life meaning that truly give you a sense of purpose, even if you feel like, okay, I don't have time for that or I forgot it. I can see now why this is individual. These five Vs that you're talking about remove the blocks to happiness,

but they also help you locate the little drivers inside you that you either got too busy or too depressed or too overwhelmed to be conscientious about inserting into your life. That's really cool. I love knowing that these simple things also are tied to all of this research that is coming from your renowned institute. And that's why I'm so appreciative that you're here, because sometimes when you hear things that seem like,

okay, I think I might know that already, you tend to blow them off. But what I love about your work, Dr. Judith, is that it's the research that makes me feel motivated and compelled to really get serious about trying it. And I'm sure as you're listening to Dr. Judith, you're feeling more motivated to try it too. And one of the things that you can do based on the research to boost your happiness is to be connected with people that bring you joy. And so you can spread a little joy

by sharing this life-changing information with somebody that you care about. I love learning from you, Dr. Judith, and I'm so grateful that you're here to share all of the extraordinary insights that you've had now that you've started the Happiness Lab. What is the fourth V? The fourth is vitals. Okay, what does that mean?

I call it the annoying V. Because whenever you go to your doctor, they're going to be like, make sure you're eating well, you're sleeping well, and all these great things. Oh, I thought you were about to say, get on the scale. I'm like, let me take my shoes off first, please. But with my daughter, every night, I'll tell her, I say, get on the scale. I'm like, let me take my shoes off first, please. But, you know, with my daughter every night, I'll tell her, I say, how many bodies did God give you? And she says, one. And then what do you got to do with it? Take care of it. And I think it's a very basic, you know, story. It makes my heart really tender, but we only have one body. That was so beautiful.

Thank you. Would you say that again, what you say to your daughter? I ask her, you know, how many bodies did God give you? And she says one. And what do we have to do with it? Take care of it. It's so true. And regardless of what you believe when it comes to spirituality, you just have one body. And it's your job to take care of it.

It's actually your responsibility. And I love that word responsibility because if you break it apart, it's your ability to respond. And no matter what's going on, if you really take the fourth V to heart in the way that you're about to explain it to us, like you do have the ability to respond to the circumstances of your life

and make better decisions and choices about how you take care of this one body that you have. Because a lot of us just, it's like an afterthought and then we wonder why we're not happy. What are the most important things when it comes to this fourth V and vital and taking care of this one body you have? Well, I love vitals because vitals kind of looks at the biopsychosocial and if you look at the diagram online, they overlap the Venn diagram. So it has a lot of the biological components, like the things that we eat. Many times, you know, we eat things that are so processed that are not full of nutrients. And that causes inflammation to rise in our body.

Inflammation makes our brains unhappy, makes us more anxious and depressed, makes our sleep worse, makes our body feel icky. And then, you know, so there are certain foods that you can eat that are rich in vitamins and omega-3 fatty acids like fish, leafy greens, berries that are good for your brain. Like, in our happiness lab, we do a demonstration where we have everyone eat a blueberry and we're like, you know what? Within an hour, you're going to have blood rushing to your brain because that's how powerful a single blueberry is.

For real? Very powerful. Antioxidant, anti-cancer, just so full of nutrients. And so learning that food has so much power in terms of your happiness, it's a reframe for me. So when I start eating my salmon and my spinach, I'm like, I am doing such good things for my body right now. I'm loving myself.

I'm taking care of my body. And that is, I'm self-validating. I'm venting. Oh, wait. You're tying all the Vs together. You are. Yes. You're right.

Because you're talking about how you feel and you're talking out loud to yourself. You value taking care of yourself. And now you're taking care of your body. As our doctor, even though you can't truly be like, you're not really our doctor, but if you could give us one directive in terms of this fourth fee, what is the single most important thing to do, in your opinion, if you could just remember one, to take better care of your vitals, to open the door to happiness?

Well, in the vitals, there's one that doctors neglect. Doctors don't ask you about the quality of your relationships. Oh. And longevity science shows that the number one factor for longevity for good outcomes are your relationships. But you know, doctors are constricted with insurance and they only have 15 minutes to get everything in. So they're not asking you about that, right? Your relationships are so important. And there was this, I can't remember, I think she was a TikToker and she went on and she was like saying that she was so lonely. She hadn't had a human touch in like months during the pandemic. And she was just like that she was so lonely, she hadn't had a human touch in like months during the pandemic.

And she was just like, it's called like, I think skin starvation, where you don't have that touch. Relationships are so important. They determine your long term happiness, your health. So pay attention to them. Don't ignore your relationships. And I think that's an important part in the vital. So I talk about how every day I talk to my daughter and I tell her, you know, how important

she is and how there's only one her. And there will only ever be one her. Like when I'm talking to your followers, there will only ever be one you take care of yourself. Make sure you're getting that connection. So yes, the vitals include things like sleep, movement, eating well, limiting your screen time because that's another vital we neglect. We don't talk about how technology impedes our health and how I think one day in the DSM-5, there's gonna be a whole section related to how technology

is impacting our mental health. But these are all important vitals. But I think that the quality of your relationships, they're so important. And what's the fifth V? The fifth is vision. Many times we're so busy that we are not planning our happiness. We're not looking forward.

We're not celebrating our wins. And I'm not talking about the big ones. I'm talking about even the small ones. Like if you got your kid to school on time, you know, sit down, have a sip of coffee and say, wow, like I'm really, I'm a good parent. Like I did that. And also just like planning joy. We don't take the time to do that.

We check the boxes, but we don't really look forward to the future. And if we don't have things to look forward to in the future, we're going to feel stuck in the past. I think that's, I think you see it for sure when you have somebody in your life that is unhappy. I think you see it for sure when you have somebody in your life that is unhappy, that when they wake up, they're not happy with the life that they're in and with where they are in life. Is there a simple thing that you tell your patients to do that helps them have a vision

that makes them happy with where they're going in life and with where they are? Yes. vision that makes them happy with where they're going in life and with where they are? Yes. I mean, I have so many different tools that I give them, but one of my favorite is the time capsule tool. So I'll say- Okay, what's that? Will you walk us through that? It's a very traditional thing, but it's like, what are the things in your life that you are looking forward to in the future? Let's put it in this time capsule and let's set a date as a family for us to dig it up, right?

So the, and I asked them to put- But you can do this as an individual, right? You can do this as an individual. All right. So let's just say you're an individual and you're unhappy and you're about to do the time capsule exercise. Can you walk us through it? Yeah.

So if you value, right, your family, you may want to put a picture of them in there and then a little note saying, I want to have more interactions with this person. If you value music and you want to have more live music experiences, I'm going to try and put something in there that I'm going to work towards. Maybe it's seeing my favorite artists playing, maybe it's finally going to a concert. If it's about your health, you're going to put something in there like, okay, I want to get more movement in. So in the future, I'm going to write a note to myself that I'm going to get more steps. Some of us don't

get enough steps because we're so sedentary in our ways. But then if we have this physical thing, and the reason that I came up with this is because I've traveled the world learning about how we view happiness differently. I noticed that a lot of cultures have little shrines and it made me curious about that. What is it about that symbolism that's so powerful? Sometimes we have to create our own shrines to remind us, right? Because again, many of us are neurodivergent, we learn differently. So having that visual, that tactile, that sensory reminder helps us to have something

to look forward to. And my clients love it. They love to be their own happiness archaeologist and put together this time capsule and then have something they could dig up in the future. It doesn't have to be a year. It could be like two months, but we dig it up together and we explore how did we do. And I think it's a creative, fun way for people to stay on track and to have something that keeps them moving forward. How do you, like how does, because I know you researched the heck out of absolutely everything you recommend.

So how does the physical act of creating a vision help you feel happier? You're using all of your senses to stay present. It is something that you need the sense of touch for. You need the sense of sight. Some of the things in there could be emotive smell or sound, but it keeps you grounded and present in this act of love to yourself. And like I mentioned,

a lot of my clients are neurodivergent. They need those different stimuli to be able to stay focused. And they need something to physically look forward to. Many of us can't be as abstract. Many of us need those concrete reminders. So it's something we can do together. It creates that sense of connection, that community. And there are many other ways, tools that I have

for keeping yourself on vision. This is just one of them. Others, that would never work. Other people. Give me another one. For my busy moms, I tell them to open up their calendar and we literally sit and we plan joy. And it sounds cheesy, but I literally.

So you're a busy mom, you're like, are you kidding me? I've got a little laundry to do. Well, what I find in my office is that people will open up their calendars and there's like zero joy. They planned everything else. They have the kids soccer, they have their work schedule, they have chores, but there's no joy.

So we color coat the joy differently and it keeps them accountable. Again, some people are very visual. If they see that there's planned joy and it's blocked out for everyone, you're doing multiple things. You're setting boundaries, you're setting a reminder, and you're prioritizing joy. And a lot of people, if it's not in their calendar, it's not going to happen. So given that you have been researching all of these factors that it seems like, especially since you do all this clinical research around mental health and prescription drugs, it seems to me that these are not only factors that help you access happiness and create a customized blueprint

or formula for bringing more happiness, they also seem like the things that are missing when you're dealing with somebody that has, say, treatment-resistant depression or that's really struggling with a diagnosable issue, that these are also the factors that you see that are present when you have someone that's struggling, that they don't have a vision, that they don't have a vision, that they're not taking care of themselves in terms of the vital things from sleep and

eating and connection that we all know we need to do, to the not talking about how they feel, to not even understanding how they feel, to not even having something that they value that could be as small as gardening or being part of a book club, that those things are missing from someone's life. Is that a fair guess on my part? It is. You just described the biopsychosocial in such a simple way. But yes, these are all the components that make up an individual. We forget that real happiness is the sensation, it's the plethora of sensation.

When you're feeling lonely being connected, when you're hungry feeling fed, when you're tired feeling rested, all of these things make up what happiness is. But we forget about it because we get so focused on just the biology, just the medicine, that we forget that there are other parts of our lives that if we can just shape them a bit differently, if we have some control over the direction of those factors that we could actually have more sustainable happiness and joy. Wow. I mean, that makes a lot of sense to me, especially when I think about the fact that one of the

biggest signs of depression or somebody struggling is that they ruminate and they stay in their head, which they're not truly able to validate how they feel and start venting it because they're in an echo chamber. That's really cool that this is what you're doing. Is there anything else that's come out of all this research that you want to make sure that we know? Well, I mean, I think for women in particular, you know, we have twice the rate of depression and anxiety that men have. You know, women are twice as likely to have depression and anxiety.

That always hits me. I'm like, oh my gosh. Why? Well, when we think about biopsychosocial, from a biological standpoint, you know, we have different hormones and our hormones at times makes us vulnerable. I do a lot of work with postpartum depression and with perimenopause and how moods impact our emotions and our behaviors. Society-wise, so you know, the social part, we're expected to show up for others. You know, life is unfair,

we get paid less. We work very hard and we have so many roles. Many of us are taking care of our kids and our parents, and we have jobs. And then from the psycho part, women have high rates of trauma. We have high rates, again, of depression and anxiety. We have past things that happen to us. When we attach to others, we're more prone to be in relationships that could be toxic, right? So there's a lot that's happening for women. And I think we have to acknowledge that.

And women in particular need to take care of themselves. It doesn't mean that hormones makes you crazy and wild and emotional. It just means that acknowledging that, okay, when I have my period, I'm going to be more vulnerable. When I'm going through the postpartum period, I'm going to be more vulnerable. When I'm going through the postpartum period, I'm going to be more vulnerable. When I'm going through paramedic, this is happening to me, acknowledging that these things happen. And I think that for my patients is very validating.

They're like, oh, I understand this. So sometimes we'll plan the periods. If we know your period is coming in two weeks, you're going to get more support. You're not going to work as hard. If you're someone thinking about having a child, a lot of my patients do, and we do a lot of planning around that. And if you're hitting your 30s, late 30s, early 40s, I'm like, hey, think about perimenopause. So I think the knowledge, the knowing that this is happening helps you to plan your happiness,

not just be a passive participant in this role. You can actually do things to support yourself better. I think that's so important. I remember when I started going through menopause, I thought I was going crazy. The brain fog, forget about the sweating, I mean, that was awful too, but just what was happening to me psychologically. And I suffered for too many years because I didn't do what you're teaching us, which is validate that this was happening and then vent to somebody. And all of these steps kind of get you to stop and drop in and realize that you have

the ability to make a decision that you're not just going to let all of this stuff happen and be at the effect or the victim of it, that there are little levers that you can pull that it sounds like based on the research make a huge difference. Absolutely. Yeah. And understanding that, you know, women are more empathic when someone is hurt, women are more likely to feel that pain with them. And it doesn't mean that we're weaker, we're just different. So understanding the different components of your happiness, understanding the science

of your happiness and tailoring it to you, I think people will have more success. They'll feel less lost. And to your point with the mission, this is a way to work on how you're feeling without the prescription drugs. Or with it. Or with it. You may need it, and that's totally fine. That's a part of the puzzle.

It's the reason why, like I said, we're not all on antidepressants. There are so many pieces of the puzzle, and for some people, they're going to need medication, but others, they won't. But we can work on your happiness from all different angles. So Dr. Judith, could you speak directly to the person that's here with us? And if there's one thing that they take away from this conversation, they actually do, right? What is the one thing that is the most important thing in your opinion for them to do?

I often say mental health is yours. You know, we all have physical health, we all have bodies, but we all have brains. We all have mental health. You may not have a diagnosed mental health condition, but you have mental health. Take care of it. Learn about it. Be curious. Nurture it. And make it fun. Make it creative. Bring it back to your roots. I'm a Caribbean American woman. When I think about movement, I'm not just going to go on a StairMaster. I'm going to do my, you know, my whining, my dancing,

because that bilateral stimulation makes my left brain talk to my right brain and makes me happier. So be creative with it. Think about your past. Bring it into your tailored treatment for yourself. Mental health is yours. You just forgot with it. Think about your past. Bring it into your tailored treatment for yourself. Mental health is yours. You just forgot about it. And what are your parting words? I think we can all live a happier life. I truly believe that if we practice the five Vs and we do a lot of self-reflection,

not only will we be happier, but happiness will be contagious. We're going to think about other people differently. When you see someone, you're going to think about their biopsychosocial and why they're so grumpy, why they're so upset all the time. We'll have more compassion. We'll make society better. The world will be a better place.

So if somebody's unhappy, one of these are missing or more? I think so. And for some, they're going to have to work more on one V versus the other initially. The biggest mistake is when people try to do all the five Vs at once, and then they're like, oh, this is too much. Pick one. Will it work if I just pick one? Will I feel happier? In research, we use points. We use rating scales, talking to patients, and adding up points. But this is important because when we're adding up points, we're adding up sensations, we're adding up things like sleep, we're adding up things like feeling connected to people,

we're adding up things like energy, well-being. These are all things that make up in research what we call happiness. And so I think if people knew that, and they understood happiness from that framework, they wouldn't feel like they're on this mission to this elusive thing that will never happen. Because if you think about happiness as all these sensations in life, and you're just trying to get more points of it, then it is attainable. So it's not a singular thing. No.

It's like an accumulation. I'm a big flower person. So it's like all these things coming together in a giant bouquet. And I take the five V's are all little points or flower buds or whatever that you could add in to build happiness in your life. Little points, you will get there. It is a process, right? And I think a lot of us want the quick fix, but you'll get there slowly with time.

Well, that's why I'm taking the pill. I want the quick fix, which is why I'm like, I will try that, not to diminish how life-changing they can be. But you have been researching this, and it can be really discouraging when you're not happy. Yes. And so what are you seeing based on the research that if you truly embrace these five Vs, these things that are within your control regardless of how you feel or where you live in the world,

what are you seeing is possible in terms of the good news if you focus on these five things? Just think about this. In most research, we don't use the word happy. We try to eradicate points of depression. So reframe it. Instead of thinking, I don't feel happy yet. Think about the points of joy. Think about, okay, did acknowledging how I felt, did that decrease stress?

Because again, happiness is not this one picture. It's this plethora of feelings. So that decreased anxiety, that's a part of happiness. That's slowing down and feeling rested. That is a part of happiness. So try your best to reframe it and think about how many different points can I get in a day versus I just want to be fixed. I just want this to happen.

That reframe is so powerful because my clients will come in and say, you know what? I started thinking about it in terms of points of joy and I felt good because today I was able to get three points of joy. That's three more points than yesterday and build on that and you will find that slowly over time, you will be happier. Well, Dr. Judith Joseph, thank you for the research that you do. Thank you for coming all the way here to the Boston studios to share the latest research that you're working on. There is no doubt in my mind that if the person listening actually takes a start and they're

patient and they apply the five Vs to find their blueprint for happiness, that they are going to feel happier. Thank you so much for having me. This is so much fun. You're welcome. And thank you for choosing to listen to something that could help you be happier and help you improve your life. I just think that is amazing that you're investing the time in yourself. And in case no one else tells you, I wanted to be sure to tell you that I love you and I believe in you and I believe in your power to create a better life.

And part of that is you doing the work to take better care of yourself and to become a little happier. And you deserve that. And now you have some research and some tools that I truly hope you will be using. And I can't wait to hear how they impact your life and the people that you care about. All right. I'll be waiting for you in the very next episode. I'll see you there. I'll see you there.

I'll see you there. I'll see you there. I'll see you there. I'll see you there. I'll see you there. Hold on, here goes the burp. Can't get rolling without a burp. Oh my God.

Okay. I bet our trees are the exact opposite. Okay. Like I bet if I lined up your tree next to mine, cause I'm one of these Charlie Brown kind of trees people like the ugliest looking tree that I think is going to get left behind. I'm like, we'll take that one. And then it's got kind of the ornaments hanging off.

I bet you have a beautiful tree. I have a beautiful fake tree. Yes. I bet it. Well, there's nothing fake about you. So your tree can be fake. Sip of water. Oh my god.

Oh, God. Okay. I hate that sound. Yes. Okay, I finally got the breakthrough. It takes me halfway through a podcast to understand what we're even talking about. You know, there are some days that we have and like every tenor is like This was another mistake. Creating a podcast studio in a loft with no padding in the ceiling So one thing that I think would be very clarifying For somebody listening and do I have to wait for that garbage truck outside? Okay

He was like right behind you. Oh. That's absolutely amazing. It's distracting, right? You guys make me look so good. Look at that. Okay, here we go. That hits the bloopers. Oh, and one more thing.

And no, this is not a blooper. This is the legal language. You know what the lawyers write and what I need to read to you. This podcast is presented solely for educational and entertainment purposes. I'm just your friend. I am not a licensed therapist.

And this podcast is not intended as a substitute for the advice of a physician, professional coach, psychotherapist, or other qualified professional. Got it? Good. I'll see you in the next episode. STITCHER