The Menstruality Podcast - 70. How to ‘Do Less’ Through Cycle Awareness (Kate Northrup)

Episode Date: January 19, 2023

Our guest today is someone we’ve been wanting to interview for a while. She has inspired 1000s of people to find their way of doing less inside a culture that so often pushes us to do more. Kate Northrup is an entrepreneur, mother and bestselling author of Do Less: A Revolutionary Approach to Time Management for Ambitious Women. Her book centers menstrual cycle awareness as a secret productivity superpower that’s always been there, but you just didn’t know you had...After giving birth to her first child, Kate felt profoundly out of control for the first time in her life. Her period came back when she was 13 months old and she felt safe for the first time since her birth. It held her through post-partum anxiety and insomnia and her menstrual cycle served her as a life-raft that healed her in a profound way. In our conversation we explore:Kate’s Summer sabbatical, how she worked with the voices of doubt and the amazing fruits that it yielded (including her best year ever in business). The real necessity of lowering our standards (here’s to piles of laundry and dry shampoo) and asking for help (usually people feel honoured when we do) so that we can get the rest we need. How to get rest as a working mama, and source our enoughness from a deep well within us. Kate asks: “what if you didn’t need to do or earn another damn thing, in order to be the shit?!”Registration is now open 2023 Menstruality Leadership Programme - you can apply here: www.menstrualityleadership.com---The Menstruality Podcast is hosted by Red School. We love hearing from you. To contact us, email [e-mail]---Social media:Red School: @redschool - https://www.instagram.com/red.schoolKate Northrup: @katenorthrup - https://www.instagram.com/katenorthrup/?hl=en

Welcome to the Menstruality Podcast, where we share inspiring conversations about the power of menstrual cycle awareness and conscious menopause. This podcast is brought to you by Red School, where we're training the menstruality leaders of the future. I'm your host, Sophie Jane Hardy, and I'll be joined often by Red School's founders, Alexandra and Sharni, as well as an inspiring group of pioneers, activists, changemakers and creatives to explore how you can unashamedly claim the power of the menstrual cycle to activate your unique form of leadership for yourself, your community and the world. Hey thank you so much for joining us today for coming back or for showing up here if you're new it's so good to be with you. This guest is someone that I've been wanting to interview for a long time she's inspired thousands of people to find their way of doing less inside a culture that so often

pushes us to do more. Kate Northrup is an entrepreneur, a mother and the best-selling author of Do Less, a revolutionary approach to time management for ambitious women. This book centres menstrual cycle awareness as a secret productivity superpower that's always been there but you just didn't know you had it in the conversation Kate shares how after giving birth to her first child she felt profoundly out of control for the first time in her life so when her period came back when she was 13 months old she actually felt safe for the first time since her daughter's birth. Her cycle held her through postpartum anxiety and insomnia and served her as a kind of life raft that helped her to heal. I just want to give you a heads up here, we talk about motherhood a lot

in this conversation so if that's a topic that you know you don't want to hear about right now then please do take care of yourself so in the conversation we explore Kate's summer sabbatical and how she worked with the voices of doubt to get that set up and the amazing fruits it yielded in her business we talk about the deep necessity of just lowering our standards and asking for help so that we can all get the rest that we need and she speaks a lot about how to get rest as a working mama. So I hope you enjoy this conversation. I want to give you a heads up that our menstruality leadership program is open again for registration. I'll tell you more about that in the middle of the podcast, but you can find out more if you're intrigued at menstrualityleadership.com. Okay, let's get started with this conversation with Kate Northrup, how to do less through cycle awareness. Kate, thank you so much for joining us on the menstruality podcast today. I really appreciate the permission that you've given me to rest and do less in my life.

And it's just wonderful to have you here. Thank you. Oh, I'm so happy to be here. Thank you for having me. Could we start with a cycle check-in? Like I'd love to hear where you're at in your menstrual cycle and how it's impacting your mood and your emotions and your state today? Yeah. It's like a weird check-in. I am in a weird place with my cycle. I did not get a cycle from

September to December and I wasn't pregnant. And then I got one in December and then I got another one 19 days later and I'm on day seven and I'm still bleeding. So I'm in a funky, I'm in a funky sort of reset weirdness right now. And, uh, so yeah, so I'm in my menstrual phase, but, uh, it's been like a long one. I don't know what's happening. Yeah. How was it to go without the cycle for the couple of months? How did that feel? I did not love that. I did not love that because for me, my menstrual cycle is such an important marker of time and space for me. And so just sort of like floating in that, not knowing what was going on. I didn't, I didn't love that. I mean, I know of course, like someday I will go through menopause and then I'll sort of switch to paying a little more attention to the moon.

Um, but I'm not there yet. And so it was quite, oops, sorry. It was quite disorienting. Yeah. I found that when I didn't have my cycle after giving birth and when I was breastfeeding and I was like, who am I? What's going on? I just felt very linear. Well, I felt the chaos of early motherhood, but I felt very linear and it was disorientating. Yeah. Totally. I'm on day 18. So I'm just coming to the end of my inner summer. And it's been such a nice inner summer because I really got to rest over the winter break. I really got to let go. I mean, I've got a two year old, so as much as you could let go of the two year old, but while he napped, I just lay on the sofa and it was amazing. How was your winter break? Did you get to have some, some rest? Yeah, I'm still sort of into it. Today, obviously I'm, you know, here doing a few other things and then, uh, and then

next week I'm off half the week again. So I, I always, you know, always for the last several years, I take things very slow in January. Um, I have, because what I find is if I'm ramping up to do quite a bit in January, that basically means I'm not resting over the holidays. So yeah, so I took it, I took it pretty easy with the kids. We did a lot of hanging out at home. It's been great. It's been great. Oh, gorgeous. That sounds beautiful. So we're in winter, but I'd love us to pedal back to summer actually, because you did something bold this summer, which inspired lots of people, including me. And it modeled how to run a business cyclically, how to live cyclically. You took a summer sabbatical and after the sabbatical you said I think you did an Instagram reel I've got a note from it here you took the summer off you didn't know why you said I wasn't burnt out but part of me knew I was going to need the space

and when I heard you say that I got really curious about the part of you that knew that you were going to need the space and how you were able to hear that. Can you remember what it felt like to know that you needed space? But yeah. Well, I've always been somebody who's listened to my intuition, you know, and, and my intuition comes to me, you know, different people are right. Claire, audience, Claire, sentient, clairvoyant. Um, I am a, I'm more of a Claire sentient. Like I just feel things. I just sort of, I have just like a knowing. And so I think that over the years, it's become stronger, um, because of paying attention to my cycle and really going inward on the first day or two of my cycle and really, really doing some journaling and listening. And so as a result of that, I do just kind of have a sense, like a deeper sense of what I need. And, um,

yeah, when those things come, I mean, I recently had another insight about a program that I'm probably not going to run anymore, even though it's been incredibly successful for us. And it just sort of shows up all of a sudden, I just kind of know things and then that's that. So it was like that with the, with the knowing I would need space this summer. And, uh, in the end we had a lot of internal shifts in my company and I did need that space. And, but also, you know, it wasn't like an emergency or anything. I just wanted to spend time with my kids. They're really little. And, you know, I just kind of realized like, oh, my kids aren't going to be little forever. Like, why would I not take the time now? I'm not going to get the time back like this is it this is the time that sort of answers my next question in a really beautiful way actually because historically I haven't taken deep rest until I've been burnt out like I was an independent

filmmaker then I was an environmental activist there was always a reason to keep going and I did burn out twice in both of those professions. So I wanted to ask you, since you didn't need it, you know, you weren't burnt out, what gave you the courage to take it? I think the answer about your kids. Yeah, I think the big picture. Yeah, I also the reason I even started a business was because I was raised in a household with two real workhorse parents. And I had made a commitment to myself very early. Like in my late teens, I had said to myself, I am going to create a business that allows

me to take time to be with my family and be really present with them. And so it was a vision that I always had. And it was like, well, you know, and I, and I am home. I'm home when they get home from school, I take them to school, I go volunteer at stuff. I, you know, I'm the reader in their school class. You know, I do all those things during the year. So it's not like, oh, I got to make up for time that I didn't spend or whatever. Um, but I just, I don't know. It didn't feel like, I guess it felt, you know what, here's what happened. I remember I soon after I had this knowing, I ended up going to lunch with my friend, Laura, who lives actually in Brighton beach. She's married to a British guy. And she, I was like, I'm going to, based on how my next launch goes, I'm going to decide if I'm going to take the summer off. And she was like, you are not going to

decide based on how your next launch goes. You're just going to take the summer off. And I was like, right. Yes. And so I, so I just did. And I didn't have, so here's, I think one, a really important thing to say, I was giving myself this, this carrot at the end of a stick of like, Oh, once I achieve this thing, then I can have this. And my friend reflected back to me like, no, just take it. And so we did take a loss over the summer. We didn't make as much money. It's fine. It all kind of came out in the wash. And I, I trusted that. I just said, you know what, if I prioritize according to my values, I'm going to trust that if I live in alignment with what matters to me, it's all going to work out. And if our business has less revenue this year, it's fine. And, uh, in the end, we actually had our biggest year ever, but even if we hadn't, I would have considered it a huge success.

Yeah, that's beautiful. It's especially beautiful to hear a mother of young children say this, because there are all the guys, business guys out there. Like, is it Tim Ferriss that wrote the four hour work week that, or, you know, guys that can run businesses by working from 5am until, you know, 10pm. We don't have that option. No, no parent has that option. So it's inspiring for me to hear a mama say, you know, I took the summer off and the business has been the most successful that it's been. And I'm doing it again. Like I'm so excited. I'm also, I'm going to take this. This is now my new thing. Yes. One time. It's not a one-time event. This is, I now take the summer off. I have now a teacher schedule. Yeah. That's beautiful. Alexander and Shani take August off actually. They just go. I love it. Well, also PS, like I was talking to my, the, my hairstylist is from Paris and he was, we were

just talking about the American concept of a vacation being like six days and how ridiculous that is. And he was like, he was like minimum it's a month to take a holiday. And it's, and I was like, I know we're so insane and backwards here in the United States. And so, yes, it's very European that you would take, you know, four weeks off. And so that's a totally normal summer holiday for, for people from your country. Right. And I think in the United States, we're like, you know, throwing a parade if we take a week off. So anyway, there's that. What would you say were the fruits? What are you seeing as the fruits of that rest that you took

over the summer? Well, as you know, when you are with children, it's not exactly restful. Someone said to me, when you go on holiday with kids, it's not about rest. It's about making memories. Like, yeah, that's true. And so that, but you know, there was one particular day. I remember that, um, I am a, I am a very high maintenance sleeper. So in order to fall asleep, I have to have like blackout curtains and earplugs and blah, blah, blah, blah. It's like a whole thing. This one particular afternoon, it was the last weekend of July. I think it was the last weekend of July. I laid down on the couch and I fell asleep, which is unheard of for me. And I woke up and I thought, okay, that I have really done some serious healing.

If I could have just passed out in the middle of the afternoon with, you know, kids around and whatever. So, um, that was, I think I just, you know, I got myself into a state of real relaxation, like all the hyper vigilance of the, I have to do this and I have to do that. I so massively pulled back that there was nothing less left on the list of, I have to did it. We weren't promoting anything. I wasn't, it was just like, um, because you know, when you go on holiday, there's like a certain amount of backlog of all of those things. And then there's a certain amount of ramp up to go back, which is why a week doesn't really cut it. It's like at least a week to, or, or two to come off all the, the, the, you know, the, the whirling and the spiraling, and then at least a week or two to ramp back up. And so that central bit was key for me.

So the other fruits were, um, you know, just hanging out with my kids and making memories. Like you said, I took them, we took, we went kayaking and now my kids are four and a half and seven. And so they're at an age where we can actually do more things together. We went kayaking. I took my little one on a carousel. Um, we visited friends and family in Maine where I'm from. We just did a lot of, just a lot of hanging out. Um, and I didn't have childcare this summer. So that was also an important factor. We were in between, um, caregiver providers, which is part of what, why I took the summer

off. Cause I was like, this doesn't make sense to like find a new caregiver for the summer so that I can like, come on, let's just, just take the time. And so, so it was great. We kind of fell into a sweet rhythm together and it was beautiful. It sounds beautiful. I'm excited for your next summer and inspired to do the same. I'm planning to take a two week holiday, but maybe I should stretch it to three. Yeah. Well, I think two is amazing. I mean, if it's a full on unplugged, really present, I mean, honestly, I can, I can feel quite recharged in three days. I find that especially as a mom, I'm like three days feels like I've

just been to Barbados for two weeks sometimes. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. So any amount is great. I mean, honestly, it can be an hour lying on your floor, right? Like I think that it's because what, what can happen is you can be like, oh, well I can't take seven weeks off. Therefore I can't do anything. And it's like, actually you could unplug everything and lay on your floor for an hour and read a novel you could totally do that anyone can organize themselves to do that yes I was going to ask this I think it's an important question to ask anytime we're talking about rest that yes there are the internal barriers to rest right there are all the things that get in the way but there are also the external barriers so there are the systems of oppression that keep some marginalized folks not you you know, they don't have the access or feel safe to rest.

Or like my friend who's a single mom or my other friend who's got two parents with dementia and doing a lot of caring. Yeah. What what kind of advice or guidance do you give to people whose lives are really crunched or, you know, who can't access rest in the same way? Absolutely. So I would say small pockets. One thing that my mom shared with me when she was starting to learn about cyclical awareness, she was up every third night delivering babies. My dad was also a physician, So he was on call. So the two of them, you know, and we, I was, um, I think I was a year old or something. My sister was three and, uh, and they didn't have consistent childcare. They were like dropping us off at a babysitter down. This is like a kind of a mess. And so my mom's, my mom said, you know, it just wasn't like a reasonable lifestyle. Um, and so she said, you know, on days when she had her period, obviously like canceling

her schedule was not possible, but she would just walk from her car to the door of the hospital slightly slower that day. Um, so then we just ask ourselves, okay, like, because there have been, uh, times I have a husband who has been chronically ill off and on for the last four years. And I've been the primary breadwinner and had two, two young kids and I live away from family. And so, um, it, you know, obviously I'm not, it is not the same as being a single mom. It is, you know, I'm not saying it's the same thing as being a, you know, a variety of marginalized identities. And there were, you know, there were moments where it was literally like, okay, I can't

actually like put things down. Cause if I do my kids, you know, it's just like very real. Right. But I just lowered my standards. Yes. I just lowered my standards. So there was like a heap of laundry that wasn't getting done and my house was a mess. And like, I just went longer without showering and used more dry shampoo. And, um, and I asked for help from my neighbors a lot. And I just, you know, showed that I just was okay to, for them to know that I wasn't okay. Um, you know, and my friend TT Lios posted something today that

was so beautiful. She said, let's normalize asking our community for help and let's call it sharing strength. And I just love that so much. And so how, you know, I would really ask anyone in any, in any circumstance to really ask who's in my village and have I been courageous about asking for help? And have I been courageous about offering support? You know, cause it's so often that we show up in our communities and I'm in a new community that I just moved to about two years ago. Um, and when we're just meeting people, it can be hard to be like, ah, I, you know, am I going to ask for that? Whatever. And, and there's a chat in my building, a mom's chat, and I've asked for help for several things. And I'll be perfectly honest. Other moms are not asking for help in that chat. And I'm just like, well,

I'm going to create this culture. And hopefully if I keep showing up there, not in a needy way, but just like, oh, we've lost our wine opener. Oh, I don't even drink, but it was like a recipe that I need. Anyway, who knows? Does somebody have a lemon? Oh, whatever. And I'm just like, maybe if I show up in this way enough, other moms will feel safe to do the same. So had a kid who was throwing up all over me. I just had to like rock up at my friend's house with like a bag of laundry covered in sick and say, love, I'm going to use your washing machine and can I cook dinner here? And I love you, bye.

You know, and they just said yes. Of course they said yes. Who's going to say no to that? And then I actually had loads of lovely moments with my friends that I wouldn't have had if I hadn't moved through that moment of oh shit I just don't want to rely on anybody had to move through that and actually rely on people and then lots of beauty came from it yes yeah because how honored are we when someone

makes a genuine ask from a place of vulnerability I'm always honored when someone I love and respect asks me, you know, and also I don't say yes when I can't. Yes. You know? And so if we can create communities where the agreement is we ask, and if someone can't, they're honest about it, then we can stop the whole mind games we play with ourselves about, oh, am I putting them out? Am I, you know, it's like, we get to not take someone's opportunity to say no away from them. Everyone else is an adult too. Yeah. Beautiful, beautiful boundaries. Great permission there there you are a permission giver aren't you it's part of your dharma part of your calling yeah yeah so I'd love to speak about your book do less so I'll drop a link to it in the show notes for anyone listening um yeah it explores

what we're talking about here but the necessity of doing less and living more rested so that we can be more filled more fulfilled and more happy more healthy and the menstrual cycle is at the center which thrilled me as a menstrual cycle nerd and i'd love to hear why what inspired you to put the menstrual cycle at the center? Cause that's still quite a radical act in our cultures. Just my own experience. I mean, I tracking my menstrual cycle really saved me after my daughter's birth, my first baby, I just felt so profoundly out of control for the first time in my life. And I just felt like I had nothing to

grab onto. And then my period came back when she was 13 months old and I started tracking it and I felt safe for the first time. I mean, I re I struggled so intensely with postpartum anxiety and postpartum insomnia. And it sucked. I mean, it was awful. And so my menstrual cycle was this life raft and getting to know it really healed me in a profound way. Therapy didn't do that. I mean, I think therapy is wonderful, but it just didn't help. I would go into my therapist and because I was so high functioning, she would just be like, well, I think you're doing great. And I was like, I am losing it just because it looks like I'm doing great. Like I am, I am drowning here. And she, there was, she was not helping. Um, and then, you know, it's like, you've got a healthy baby and a nice looking home and a husband and everyone thinks you're all set. Um, but I was not all set. And so

yeah, my menstrual cycle and just like having that, uh, consistency that I could depend on made the biggest difference for me. And then when I started tracking it and looking at my business through that lens, it opened up so much for me in terms of productivity and creativity and access to a source of inspiration and power that I had not had access to before. And so I just wanted to let other people know, cause it had just made such a big difference for me. Um, and it was so cool because it was like, Oh, this has been here the whole time. Right. You know, it's not like a program that someone else invented. Um, so that's what I love about it is that it's like, it's, it's, it's yours. It's mine. It's everybody's and no one, it's like, no one wrote the, you know, if we, of course

we can all write books about it, which I think all of us should, but like no one invented it. Like we all get it because it's all of our bodies. And so that feels just so beautiful. If you sense that there's magic in your cycle and you want to cultivate your intimacy with it so that you can create a life rhythm that works for you so that you can know your power, so that you can work with this power

to live your calling, your purpose in your life, we would love to invite you to explore our 2023 Menstruality Leadership Program. The MLP is the world's first leadership training designed for trailblazers, nurturers, changemakers, troublemakers, and creatives to realize your full authority and leadership through the power of the menstrual cycle and conscious menopause we're starting together at the beginning of april and we're offering a special early bird discount when you apply before january 31st you can find out all about the program, check out the full curriculum and hear from some of our 360 graduates about how the program has transformed the way they relate to themselves,

to their cycles, to their menopause process, to their loved ones, to their work and to their leadership and their power at menstrualityleadership.com. That's menstrualityleadership.com that's menstrualityleadership.com okay let's get back to the conversation with Kate thank you for sharing your experience with postpartum anxiety I really really relate we actually had a health visitor that came over I think when Artie was maybe six weeks old, I was finding breastfeeding so hard. Breastfeeding was so hard for me. I think it is for a lot of people. And she took me through this interview to see if I had postpartum depression. And at the end, she said, well, you do have all the markers for postpartum depression but you seem

fine so I think we'll we're good I think we'll leave it there I just thought holy shit I am not fine I'm not fine but I I knew how to show up yes we're so good at pulling it together make a cup of tea and so she just assumed but yeah geez it's it was rough for me too very rough also I mean I will just say like I don't know how it is in the UK but in the United States the treatment is the choices are things I probably wouldn't do anyway. Yeah. For me, it might be right for somebody else. So it was sort of like, I don't really want to raise my hand within the system because then I'm in a loop that I'm not interested in being in. Yeah. Cause there's the prescription I needed was a village around me to help me do this fricking parenting thing, which is basically

impossible when you're living in a little unit by yourself. Like that's what I need. Yeah. Totally. Yeah. So yeah, there's that. Were you running your business at the same time? Like how long did you take off? Yeah. I took, I took three months off, um, like completely. And then I took, um, yeah, then I went back to work and my daughter, we had a nanny 10 hours a week. So I was like working the 10 hours plus when she was napping. And then, um, she started daycare, I think three days a week, um, when she was nine months old. And then I, I didn't go back to work full, full time. I don't actually work full time, but you know, full capacity until, um, I mean really until, uh, summer of 2020. So my second was two and a half, like two and change. So it's like a real, real slow ramp up. I took five months off with my second. And I know, you know,

again, so American, like, right. I know people in the UK, you have a year and people in Canada. It's normal. I mean, I'm self-employed. So it was a bit different for me. I had to save a big chunk of cash and then once it ran out, I had to come back to work. But yeah, for most people it's a year. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I don't literally, and women, I know who take a year off, they have such an identity crisis about it anyway. So it's like a very different, I don't know that a year would have been right for me, but, uh, I knew for my second daughter, I needed more than three months. I thought three months will be more than enough time. And the first one I was like, ah, and then the second one after five months, I was like losing it. I mean, the five months didn't

feel like nearly long enough. So yeah, we just don't know. Yeah. Yeah. We just got to make it up day by day. Yeah. Yeah. There's a quote from the book that I really wanted to read about enoughness because you make this great connection between our capacity to rest and do less and our sense of worth and our sense of enoughness. So can I read your words back to you okay if we're not sourcing our sense of well-being and enoughness from a deeper inside place we're going to be in a lifelong cycle of it just being out of reach so whatever it is um what if you don't need to do or earn another damn thing in order to be the shit how would you live which? Which is such a great question. And I wanted to turn it to you. Like what, what does that look like for you when it comes to worth and enoughness

and what are your current edges with this? Well, you know, I mentioned earlier on in our conversation that I'm toying with the idea of pausing a program of ours that has, again, it's been very successful and I've loved offering it, you know. But when I looked at the calendar for this year, my husband and I were doing our planning and he's recently come back into the business. And I looked at him and I said, you know, if you told me right now, we didn't need the money, I would not run this program. And he looked at me and he was like, we don't need the money, which the truth is one of my standards that my company stands for is we don't do anything just for the money. And so for me, and again, I've been at this since 2009. So if you're brand new,

yeah, there might, you know, so it's all perspective, right? Um, I'm not new. So I am in a position where I can really trust and look back on my track record and say, I'm not going to do one thing for the money because I know it always works out. And so, but it was an interesting moment of looking and being like, no, I have to do it. I have to do it because of the amount of our revenue that it creates. And it's just like a lifelong process of questioning. Really? Is that true? Like, is that true? Is that the only way this revenue could come in to being? No. Is that in alignment? Is that an integrity to run a program just for the money that you don't want to run? And the answer is no. planning practices. And, um, you know, I, yes, like I have an annual planning practice. I have quarterly review and, or seasonal review and planning. Um, and I, I do a weekly planning practice. So, and, and there's a daily process. So I build in these kind of, I call it micro planning. Um, I wrote a article for Harvard business Review about the power of micro planning.

Oh, I'd love to read that. I'm sure we can, you know, we can find it. Yeah. I'll drop it into the show notes. Yeah. So I think we can get so stuck on like the big vision and like what's the five year plan. And I don't have that. I really never have.

But I'm like good for a season. So I just look at, okay, like what's happening. I mean, I have the broad strokes of the next six months. And then I really look at seasonally because we are such seasonal creatures and there's a flavor that we will experience. Now I live in the tropics, so I'm not having as deep of a seasonal experience. However, I will say it's subtle, but it's there. We have these energetic imprints. And yes, we go through our inner seasons each month, but then there are these real outer seasons. And it helps me to plan my business in accordance with that because different things are happening

with my body and energy. And when I have these practices, then I get to come back and ask like, okay, what's in alignment? What do I really want here? Am I doing something to prove? Like, is there anything on my list that I'm doing right now to prove something? Because that would be a big, like, no. Yeah. Yeah. What does your annual planning process look like? It's kind of in depth. Um, and we do, we, my husband and I go away for an overnight every year. If we can do two nights, we try to, but this year we were just able to do one night. Um, he is, he recently broke his leg. So it's, we're in a whole thing. thing. Anyway, he'll be fine. So, so we do the year in review. So we spend a lot of a bulk of time actually more than the planning doing the review to really digest and

look at the lessons and the key moments and the highlights. And because to me, we are so focused as a culture on moving forward that we really forget to harvest what we have already planted. And that leads to this feeling of emptiness of like, it's never enough because we haven't turned around to be like, oh, actually that was a big year. Let me even, even if, and even if, and pretty much like, then we write all these intentions out. We never do all of them. It's irrelevant.

Like, it's not, we go through each year and that's like, okay, well, we wanted to do this, this, this, which ones of these did we do? Sometimes it's only like 20% of them. Who cares? We did all these other things. So I check off the ones we did. We reevaluate. Are these something we're still interested in?

Maybe, maybe not. Um, so we go through month by month and really look at like, um, the highlights of each month. And then we look at each, a bunch of categories. So, um, family, marriage, business, finances, community health, um, what went well and what didn't go well. And then the key lessons from the year and the key highlights overall, um, best decisions of the year. And then, yeah, I like that one. So then we kind of like do all that and we have a book that we do this in every year. So the same book has all the years in it. And then we do for the planning. Is this book, your do less planner? Um, actually my do less planner does not have the spot for the year end review and the annual planning. It probably should now

that we're saying that, but it doesn't. So I listen to this podcast to do the review and then go and get the do less planner and use it for the year. Exactly. Exactly. And the, uh, but the process is in our, my program heal the way you work. And then for the planning process, what we do is we look at, um, from a business perspective, like what are going to be our money makers, what are going to be our audience growers and then blocking them in. But, but first what we do before that is we put in the things like the, the boulders, the things we, you know, you, you, you've you've heard the analogy, right? If you have a mason jar and you fill it with sand, then there's no room for, and you want to put sand in rocks. If you fill the sand in first, then there's no room for the rocks. But if you put the rocks in and then you pour in

the sand, there's room for both. So we want to make sure that our life doesn't get filled with the sand. In this analogy, obviously for those who are listening, the rocks are the important things like, you know, your health and your family and your spirituality and, you know, whatever is important to you. And so we put in the rocks first. So that would be like the kids' school vacations, other key things that we know, birthdays, trips that we're planning, whatever. And then, so we put in all that stuff first, and then we organize the business stuff around that. Yeah. It's really amazing to me how frequent it is that people say like, I don't have time for X, Y, Z. And I'm like, well,

that's just because you didn't put it on your calendar. I mean, you do have the time. You just scheduled something else, which is fine, but we need to be really honest about that. Yeah. And I'm not prioritizing that. I'm not prioritizing it. And if you really want to see what matters to you, look at your calendar because you are voting for it with your time. And just, we just want to be honest about that. Yes. Yes. Beautiful. So as you look to this year ahead, what do you think are going to be the key things that are going to help you to do less? Oh, it's been, I've been really like in it the past couple of weeks around this. Um, I'm letting some, some big things go because I have another book that I want to write and I wanted to write

the proposal and, um, and get a contract in 2022. And I just didn't do it. Like I just didn't do it because I was doing other things. And so coming into, it was just fine. I'm not having a hole beating myself. I just didn't happen. And I can see why. So at 20, beginning of 2023, I was like looking at what we had on the calendar. And I realized if I do all these things, I will get to the end of 2023 again and say like, huh, what happened to the book? And I know for me, uh, there's a great question from, um, Gary Keller's book, the one thing, which is what is the one thing that will make everything else easier or unnecessary. And, um, for me in my business and with my purpose, it's writing always, always, always writing for me. Writing books grows our audience, indirectly brings in the most revenue.

It's just, and I love it. So it's for sure the thing I need to be doing, but it is the easiest thing to not do. So yeah, so for 2023, I'm getting really radical about what am I canceling so that this can happen in the past? I've written my books very much in the nooks and crannies of my life. I've, um, just while running the business and, and this time I just want more space for it. And so I, the only way to make that space is to claim that space and to say no to things. And so I'm just being, saying no a lot to myself

and then other people also. Yeah. Oh, I would love to hear you about your creative process and your cycle, particularly when it comes to writing. Like, as you think about writing, are you thinking cyclically? Are there times of your cycle where you are more creative and where people can understand easier? Well, it's interesting because, uh, my first book I wrote before I really was practicing cyclical alignment. And my second book I wrote while I was pregnant. So I've never written a book while paying attention to my cycle. However, uh, what I have noticed, cause I do, you know, I write a blog, I write different articles for different outlets. And so what I've noticed is just my sales copy and stuff. Um, I am, uh, I'm my best writing I do and my

luteal face, um, because I have that. I don't really care so much what people think during that phase. And so my inner filter is, um, off. And so it's easier for me to actually say what I think during that time. And so luteal is a great time for me, uh, to actually do the writing. Um, certainly follicular is a great time to just do like outlining and pouring all the ideas out on paper. Um, but yeah, but luteal is, is a great time for me to actually do the writing. What does menstrual rest look like for you? What does, do you have a practice around menstrual rest? Um, I do. So on the, so I, I will just say, I am not somebody who gets my cycle on the same day, like clockwork it's give or take, well, right now it's just all over the place, but it's give or take three or four days each direction. And so I wish I was one of those people where it was like, it comes on day 28 and I always know, but, but, but I can't really plan

for it. So what I do is during on that day that it comes, I do my best to take an hour to, um, sit to pull a card. I like to pull a card for what this particular cycle is going to be about for me. Um, and then I do some journaling of just like, what do I need to know right now? And, um, that's very clarifying. I love that practice. And then in terms of the rest part, you know, I, I just asked my husband to handle bedtime and any dinner prep. And, um, and I, you know, I sleep until I'm done sleeping. I don't exercise, um, usually until day four of my cycle. Um, I might take a slow walk or do some stretching, but I don't like sweat particularly. I go to bed earlier. I will, you know, not, not go do anything at night. So it's not, it's not radical. It's pretty subtle. But it makes a big difference for me.

Yeah. It makes a huge difference. It's very similar for me in my past when I worked less and didn't have children it was like I could have two or three days to lay out you know lay in bed with my red blanket and my red candle burning and journal and vision and dream and that was so key for me in that phase of life but that's just not going to happen right now but I find that by stringing little moments of rest together through day one and day two, that I actually end up with a feeling of restoration and with moments of tapping into the intuition that you were speaking about at the beginning. Is, is that, so you spoke about your intuition earlier at the start, is your bleed a time of insight for you, a time of vision?

Yeah. How does that look for you? Well, that's why I love this journaling practice because I just like sort of ask all these questions and then they, I usually get a clear answer at that time. And so if there is a question that I have, I'll just, that I can't kind of figure out, I'll just wait. And then usually I know the answer immediately on day one or two. Um, so I just, I love that practice, you know, and, and like I read in, um, wild power to, to bleed on it. And I love that. Um, so yeah. And it is a time where I do just feel like I know things, uh, more quickly, um, though all through the cycle, I am pretty in touch with my intuition. I'm not, I'm not somebody who like wobbles about things a lot. Um, but, but it is more potent.

This might be difficult for you to answer right now because your cycle's been changing, but is there a hotspot in your cycle, which you know, is your trouble time where you have to really take care of yourself and how do you support yourself through that? Um, yes, a day around like day 20, I, I get really prickly and I just, you know, really feel like I'm so irritated with everyone and everything. And so I just, I let, um, Mike know like, Hey, I'm in my prickly time. So just please give me space. Um, and I try to not lash out. Um, but sometimes I might say something that is a little bit just, you know, it's not nasty, but just like a little ouch. Um, so I just apologize if I do that. And, uh, um, what I find is that I don't have, I don't have like intense symptoms other than feeling a

little prickly at that time. I don't, I don't have menstrual pain. Um, I don't, yeah. So, so my period just kind of comes and it's relatively easy. It is pretty heavy, but it is relatively easy. And, uh, but if I do keep to myself and retreat a little bit, I, I find that during my luteal is a time I need to retreat a little bit more. And the menstrual, I fairly immediately feel like I come out of the cave, uh, within the first two days, certainly by day three. Yeah. How does it work with your kiddos? Like, do they, are they with you in the menstrual charting? Do they, do they get it? Do they know what you're doing? Do you talk to them about it? To some degree? Yes. Like they definitely know about the period and, uh, what that means. And, um, I haven't shared with them too much about the other phases though. It's probably a good time.

My oldest is seven. So, um, but yeah, but they definitely like know that once a month this happens and, um, these are the different, you know, this is what, like why, and I need to rest. And, um, so that's been great. I've got one more big question I want to ask you, which was inspired by the book, but just before I do, could you speak about how our listeners can connect with you? Could you talk about the do less planner and the, the program that you spoke about earlier, the heel heel, the way you work? Yeah, sure. So I have a, this planner, um, the do less planner, which, uh, helps you to align your work and your life with your menstrual cycle and the moon. So, and, or the moon, um, I really, you know, I've, I've a lot

of different kinds of people in my community. So not only people with periods. And so we all get to play with the moon, which feels great. Um, so it just helps you to understand what the four phases, what's the kind of energy and how to track how your energy ebbs and flows with these four phases, whether it's your menstrual cycle or the moon or both, and then helps you lay out your week and your days accordingly. So, um, yeah, that do less planner is just at do less planner.com. And then the program heal the way you work helps to use that information plus a bunch of other productivity data plus other biomimicry for doing exactly what it says, healing the way you work. So healing any toxic work patterns, healing the parts of us that, um, overdo it to prove our worth, um, looking at ways to be more

efficient, work smarter, not harder. So that's over at heal the way you work.com. That's great. Anything else you have coming up soon that you'd like to share? Um, I have, well, I don't know, um, when this will be out, but anything I'm doing that's like current would be, um, you can follow me at Kate Northrup and, um, and my website, uh, katenorthrup.com is a great place to find any, like the current stuff. Brilliant. Thank you. So I don't know what my question is here. I just feel like it's really important to talk about, but in do less less you point to the work around the top five regrets of the dying whenever I'm trying to make myself make a big change in my life I come back

to this idea of so if you're not always going to be here you know and there will be a time just before you die when you look back on and think, you know, what if I'd live differently? So you name the top five regrets of the day. It can seem dark, but it's not dark. It's just real. You know, it's just the way the world works. It's just nature. So the top five regrets of the dying.

People wish they were more true to themselves. People wish they didn't work so damn hard people wish that they'd express their feelings prioritize friendship and let themselves be happier so I guess my question is with that in mind do you have any final words about why it's important for us to prioritize doing less, prioritize rest? Yeah. Even before I read Bronnie Ware's book, The Top Five Regrets of the Dying, I had always had a practice, which is if I was struggling with a decision, I would project out to myself in my eighties and ask, would, what would she wish that I would have done and my 80 year old self or my 85 year old self or whatever. And, uh, that's quite clarifying. Um,

so, because it just really helps me realize what really doesn't matter and what doesn't. So my whole philosophy is, I mean, obviously rest is so incredibly important and I'm a huge stand for rest and it's not always to do less. It's like to do less of what doesn't matter. So you can do more of what does like investing in friends and family, like doing the things that you love, like savoring the moment. So I think some people can see the title do less and think I just mean like lie around all day. And, um, I don't, I don't mean that at all, though. Certainly there are moments

for lying around and I think that's wonderful. Um, but it's about a life well-lived and I think these top five regrets of the dying just help us to remember our time here is short. We're all going to die. That's for sure. We can't take money with us. We can't take our accomplishments with us. None of it's going to matter when we're dying. So are we actually living? And that is really the question to be asking. None of it's going to matter when we're dying. So are we actually living? Such a powerful question. Thank you so much, Kate, for your time, for for your wisdom I really appreciate you thank you appreciate it thank you thank you for joining Kate and I I was really inspired to see how I can do less in my life

have less of this push and hustle and drive and settle back more into the rhythm that the cyclical wisdom in me knows is good for me and I hope it's inspired you as well. We are in an exciting time here at Red School because the doors are open for our menstruality leadership program again and Alexandra and Sharni have been having such a rich creative time landing the new curriculum for this program this year which is going to be refreshed and in a new format which we feel is going to help to create an even more deep immersive and powerful process for everyone that joins and although they've been leading this training for 13 years now, every year as new people step up to embrace their cycle as their gateway to leadership, they're amazed to see how the work is expressing itself in fresh ways through them.

So I wanted to share some of these stories to give you a sense of the kind of people that join the program, whether this could be for you and the kind of fruits that people get so there are creatives who make menstrual cycle awareness central to their work or conscious menopause central to their work like ruby may for example who's the founder of know your flow and she's now the community leader here at red school there are also artists and writers and poets who take this intimacy that they cultivate with their cycle and use it to inspire creative expression like one of last year's graduates Stephanie Farrell-Moore who's just published an inner seasons inspired poetry book called Bleed Between the Lines and Charlotte Ward who's a photographer and has created this beautiful earth embodiment

photography series. Then there are mummers, nurturers, caretakers who find their unique way of leaning into cyclical wisdom as they hold space and work their backsides off for their families, for their communities. there are lots of healers psychotherapists different kinds of therapists body workers who work with the cyclical wisdom that they develop through the program to bring depth to their client work so we have Lisa Dejong who has created amazing trauma-informed programs and also another one of our graduates Helena Tucker who's doing really groundbreaking PMDD work which is transforming people's experiences of their cycles. There are also business leaders who boldly go where others don't dare to go

for example Zoe Chan who is bringing reusable menstrual products to Hong Kong and Natalie K Martin who you might have heard here on the podcast who's also a graduate and her coaching is embracing the powers of inner autumn you can hear more about that in Natalie's podcast episode which you can you can find on our podcast page. So as you take in these stories I want to invite you to imagine how the power and the intelligence of menstruality within you could influence and guide your life path. We've each got a path to play in the world that we want to create and if you sense that your cycle is nudging you and wanting to guide you then we really invite you to come and check out the menstruality leadership program it's a three-month immersive apprenticeship to the cyclical wisdom within you and it's the

only comprehensive training of its kind in the world exploring and developing the exciting new discipline of menstruality which is a discipline that's set to change the way we approach our well-being at all levels of personal and professional development creative and spiritual life so you can find out all about it at menstrualityleadership.com and if you have any questions you can always email lauren and the team at info at redschool.net. Okay thank you so much for joining me today and I look forward to next time and until then keep living life according to your own brilliant rhythm.