The Overshare with Gemma Atkinson - 30, SINGLE & FINE: Strong Singletons Unite!

Episode Date: October 5, 2023

This is the Overshare for those fighting the pressure to settle down and start a family just because they’re 30 Something.  Here’s a collection of head strong focused singletons who are smashing their career and life and bucking the trend. In some episodes of The Overshare we change the names of the over-sharers to protect them or those connected to them.

Hello there! Oh, it's good to be back, isn't it? In our safe place, Oversharing Together. This week on the Overshare, it's 30, single and fine. And I wanted to do this topic because as soon as I turned 30, I don't know about anyone else, but as soon as I turned 30, every question was, are you going to get married? When are you having kids? Are you going to get a house together? Everything. When, when, when? And I felt in no place, mentally, physically, spiritually, emotionally, I felt nowhere near ready.

And had I settled at 30 because everyone said I should, I would now be divorced because it was with the wrong person. So as ever in this, there is adult content coming up, just in case young guys are lurking. Coming up. He was drinking a lot. He did drugs on the side. And I didn't leave. I didn't leave. as ever in this there is adult content coming up just in case young guys are lurking coming up he was drinking a lot he did drugs on the side and i didn't leave i didn't leave i remember once he threw me over a coffee table because he didn't like my outfit i was wearing with the girls i've now invested seven years i you know this needs to lead to marriage and babies because otherwise what

on earth have i been doing if you have a partner who also is making demands on your emotional energy when your little one's gone to bed, you need to rest and recover. You're not ready to start taking on somebody else's needs. Keep everything. The only thing I'm taking is the dogs. So we've had hundreds of people get in touch, which in itself is amazing.

And it's very encouraging to know that there was so many singletons in their 30s smashing life and very, very happy. So if you are someone in their 30s feeling the pressure to settle down, feeling as if you don't blend in because you're not married with kids and in a state car, this podcast will hopefully really help you out. As ever, we're joined by an expert on each episode. And today's expert is someone who can guide us through the stories we're going to be sharing,

Dr. Claire Stockton. She's going to be here to help us make sense of it all. So Claire, welcome to the podcast. Thank you for joining us. And what is it you do on a day-to-day basis, Claire? My main role is as a clinical psychologist. I work with people with mental health struggles, offering psychological therapies, helping them to find their way forward to feeling better and living more in line with a life that suits them. Brilliant. So it's perfect for this episode, which is great.

Thank you so much for doing this, Charlotte. And Charlotte, tell us a bit about your story, because I believe you discovered the hard way that being in your 30s and being single is fine, didn't you? Basically I from the age of 20 to the age of 29 I was in a long-term relationship it wasn't the healthiest wasn't the best and sort of all came to a head when I was 29 and I chose to end the relationship so I headed into my 30s single and not happy about it it was not where I thought I was going to be it wasn't where I wanted to be at the time um and it it wasn't a great wasn't a great start so you kind of essentially and again this is the only with society saying did it backwards whereby

most people are single in the 20s girls girls holidays, you know, meeting all the guys, you know, the occasional, you know, lover on the scene, but nothing serious. And then as soon as you hit 30, people go, boom, you need to settle down. So was it just a case of in your 20s that you wanted to be with that person? Obviously, you mentioned it wasn't the healthiest relationship. Almost the longer I'd been in that relationship and I was heading towards that, you know, that sort of destination of 30, the more reluctant I was to end it, I suppose, because it was like, right, I've now invested seven years. You know, this needs to lead to marriage and babies

because otherwise what on earth have I been doing kind of thing. Yeah. It all came to a head. And I remember saying to my parents, I was like, oh yeah um it all came to a head and I I remember saying to uh to my parents I was like oh god I'm gonna be single and 30 and my dad went well better that than 40 and divorced I was like that's good it's true it is true so almost then thought well this is the situation I'm in I you know I can either sit at home and cry about it or kind of go and do something. So I almost had my 20s in my early 30s, really. Sorry to be like cheesy, but sort of invested in myself, really.

And, you know, being in that relationship that wasn't great throughout my 20s, I almost didn't really know who I was. Because, you know, you're a very different person from 20 than you are to 30 but I didn't really have that time to to sort of explore so I did it in the 30s really. And I guess it's great uh Dr Claire that you know Charlotte took it upon herself to be like you know what this hasn't worked shit's hit the fan a little bit my options are dwell on it look back with bitterness or move forward fresh start all about me me and my little boy that's all you need I guess that's a great place to be in it is a great place to be in and I think that finding your identity in your 20s is a

key task that we're all trying to do which is why we often try on lots of versions of ourselves at that time of our life and it sounds like Charlotte had found one that she liked which is I'm in a long-term relationship I'm headed for my Disney ending which is a story we've all been sold from being really young and when that didn't work you went back and did that work and and discovered yourself and it's great to be an example as well for your son of what not to put up with and how not to treat people. So a little bit of backstory about my son. I spent my early 30s until my mid 30s kind of, yeah, travelling, doing some amazing things. Work wise from 29 to now, I added about 22 grand to my salary.

And I did all of the dating. I did the internet dating, the speed dating, the singles events, everything and just it wasn't clicking with anybody and I knew that I really, really wanted to be a mum and so I did it on my own. So I went with a third donor and had him on my own. I made a drunken vow at my 33rd birthday and said, if nothing's different in my life in two years' time, I will start the kind of saving and investigating and doing all my research and then have a baby at 36, which I did. Same as me.

And I guess it's great that Charlotte gave herself that timeline. It's kind of forward planning this is what I'm putting out there and if it doesn't work out you know how people expect I've still got the option to do it anyway yeah keep your options open and I think knowledge is power isn't it we're so much more aware of where our fertility starts to change and being able to plan for that takes the pressure off ending up in a relationship that doesn't work for you just because that's your access to having a family. Feel free, obviously, not to answer, but having used a sperm donor, how, like, what do you explain to people when they ask about who the dad is or why you and the dad aren't together? Because obviously, I guess in life, it must come up a lot.

So I,'s my my personal choice I've chosen to be really open about it right from the beginning so everybody kind of is fully aware of of his origins because it's not something I ever want to be kind of like a secret I'm I'm proud of it I think he he is when he grows up so I've chosen to be very honest with everybody that's around us really but you've done it and you prove that you can do it and you can make it work you can be a single 30 and fine well thank you so much hello you're very welcome I'm sorry I've been waiting for Charlotte to say bye was it a little dog I could hear in the background then?

Oh, so I've got a pug and he's like eight months and he's fine sleeping. And as soon as he hears my northern tones go, he's like, oh, give me some attention. So no. Bless him. Producer Matt's just nipped out. And then when he comes back, we'll start.

Thank you so much for doing this, by the way. No worries. Not whatsoever. I feel sorry for Matt. I think I emailed Matt like half of this morning and he was straight back to me and I was like like what are you doing up so next we're joined by Sarah and the story you've got it goes right back to your childhood doesn't it my mum and dad had a negative upbringing so they then carried out that on with me so my mum brought me up she was young when she had me she was 18 she you know social

service did come at one point did take us away but then took us back there wasn't that love there wasn't that well done there wasn't like let's do your homework there was no praise god my earliest memory is what four so back then you play out you play out the lights come on you like the street lights come on we'll come back for food go back. It was never a where are you or getting put to bed or this and that. So I was very independent very early on. As you get older, I don't know, you become an indurance. You get left behind at home with some like treats or whatever. But then she'd go out on a bender, come back the next day.

It was just routine. That's how it was. You was just self-sufficient. You just survived. And I think my earliest memory was as a kid I don't think I've ever said it out loud was like if she was on a bender and there was no food in I knew where the dog biscuits were so but even so young now coming to in my 30s I can survive I'm fine with surviving without needing to rely on anybody and I suppose

all every child wants from the parents is obviously to feel loved and to feel safe. But also like you touched on that praise, like my daughter Mia's forever wanting me to praise her. She'll say, mummy, look, I can jump. Mummy, look, I can put my own shoes on. And all you ultimately want is for them to say, well done, that's amazing. And I guess if you've not got that, you kind of build up a resilience and a mental toughness, as opposed, like you say, you're self-sufficient. And was that the reason why you joined the army, I guess, to escape all that that was going on at home? My mum came home one day. This day she decided to talk to us and she was like, oh, have you ever thought of joining the army? So I interacted in this conversation with my mum because I was like having a conversation with her.

So I was like, oh, my God, that's such such a good idea I'll go down to the careers office and before you know it six months later I'm on a train and I go and join the army wow and you know what it's probably one of the best things I've ever done well we were just talking myself and Dr Clare were talking off air about a lot of people in the military often their reason for joining in is because they kind of not want to escape, but just because they're not happy with how they are at home, the living situation, and because sometimes it is only the option,

isn't it, Claire? Or looking for that sense of community or being part of something. So when you join the military, you're put into a troop. You get given a uniform, so now you've got clothes. You get given a uniform, so now you've got clothes. You get given a rank.

You get given a purpose, you know, and you're being paid to better yourself daily. So are you currently single now? Are you kind of happy being single? Oh, I am happy. When you're in the military, there's boys everywhere, right? So when you're young, it's like a cattle market, Gemma. You'll go out a boy you're like hi come on then let's go and you're boy boy boy you're young you're in your teens and in your 20s yeah why not why not the boys could do it they got to a point and I found myself going for the same guys so guys who had

mummy issues guys who needed fixing and in process, I was getting damaged because of their neglect. I came out of the most toxic relationship and I've been single since. And is that, obviously to bring Dr. Clare in, is that kind of something you see a lot of, of someone who's from a home whereby the parents weren't as supportive maybe? I think what we know about growing up is that the relationships that we have growing up almost set us up for what to expect from life. But obviously that also leaves you with a vulnerability

that if people don't give you a lot, you'd be okay with that for quite a while. And as that relationship develops and you start to want more, suddenly there's a new element to it that wasn't there before. And maybe that person's not able to give you that. And it sounds like the men who she was seeing weren't able to give her the level of connection that she wanted and how how long were you with this in the toxic relationship for just under two years and as soon as I got with him

I knew it was toxic he was drinking a lot he did drugs on the side and I didn't leave I didn't leave that was the biggest red flag yeah there were so many times in that relationship that I shouldn't have left I blame myself for not leaving earlier I've been there as well I was once in a relationship with a guy and it was it was awful it was horrendous he was mentally abusive he's psychologically abusive he I remember once he threw me over a coffee table because he didn't like my outfit I was wearing with the girls and it took my uh my brother-in-law to go around and be like mate you need to disappear and he did and I then stupidly got angry with my brother-in-law I'm never gonna see him again and it's that thing though of they're somehow very clever in manipulating you to make you feel you deserve that treatment

and you were the one who wound them up, you were the one who made them do that and then they're very sorry and you start believing it about yourself. He would fuck up and disappear. So now you're bringing up that rejection in me. Ignore the phone calls, ignore the text messages. Then when he'd finally get in touch, it would be a case of I would apologise to him.

Then he would come back and go, it's okay. He found my old phone, went through it, made up in his head that I had, let's say, slept with 10 people behind his back and put it all over social media. Oh, God. Yeah, put a big post on social media and was like, she's cheated. She's lied. She's been with these 10 blokes behind my back. He left the house on the Thursday.

I go back on the Saturday and he trashed my house. And he did really, really freaky things to the house, like emptying the attic out, put it all in the bath, put loads of water in, taking labels off tins of food, putting them back in the cupboard to make your light go a bit. That's bizarre. Why do people do that, Claire? What's that behave?

Maybe he had a horrible upbringing, but that's... I mean, possibly, but it just falls under that coercive control stuff that's more heard about in the media now that actually I think the subtle changes where people are trying to control your behavior decide what you're going to wear who you can be friends with those things we it takes us a lot longer to spot that that's abuse that's happening yeah because they always back it up with they'll spend the day being an absolute twat and then the weekend buying you flowers, taking you for dinner. And you think, oh my God, it was me. I overreacted. And I think as women, we get a lot of emphasis on

hormones as well. Or maybe she was just having a day. Are you at that stage now where you're like, do you know what? I'm fine. I've got my career. I've got my home. I've got my dog. I'm good. I've got, say, three female best mates.'ve got my dog I'm good. I've got say three female best mates two out of the three of them are single and they are happy they're doing well in their jobs so you are who you hang around with and I don't really see much positives in relationships because I'm surrounded by negativity of it. Most of the people I know who settled because they felt they should are now divorced or single parents or going through a divorce

or having kind of midlife crises with not knowing what to do. And it's because I always say I'd rather be on my own than be with the wrong person and be unhappy. Because I think as well, when you're in that place of feeling like you're like on top of the world,

you attract also what you are. So you in turn, when the time interacts, you'll attract someone who's on the same pathway, who feels supportive of you, but not threatened by you, not insecure about you, just proud. And I think when you're in a funny play, you attract what you put out, really. Thank you so, so much.

Gemma, take care. Thank you. Bye-bye. Oh, that was fun. Bye-bye. Oh, that was fun. Bye-bye. Thanks for downloading our Overshare. Now, this one is all about being 30, single and fine. We've had loads of messages via our WhatsApp on this, and you can get us whenever you want on 07761 039898. Laura's an identical twin. She's 34 years old,

and she says she's got a twin who is married with kids, which means she has to endure the same questions about when it's her turn, when I'm settling down, every time the family gets together. So I guess we've all been that person, haven't we, Claire, when you reach 30? But I guess being an identical twin who's the complete complete opposite year for Laura it must be 10 times as

stressful I think it could definitely be if she's comparing herself to a twin I guess there's also some bonuses built in though because it might be that her parents have got a grandchild on the way have got a wedding to plan for so that maybe there's less pressure maybe they've shared some of that pressure and that's freed her up to kind of live her life more independently and I think as well it could be a generation thing whereby like my nana and granddad and my grandma and granddad got together at like 14 married at 17 were together till they passed away so I think a lot of the times the the pressure's passed down from generation to generation in that there's some kind of shame of, you know,

is your daughter not settled now? When's your daughter going to settle? And it's pressure for the parents as well sometimes. Yeah, definitely. And I think as women are getting older, starting their family, our parents are older, starting to become grandparents. And that's, you know, something that they're often looking forward to. So that can increase the pressure of, we want to get on with it.

Ro, thank you for doing this, Jo. Oh, thank you. So, Jo, what's your story? Is it true you could have been married and settled now, but you've actively chose not to? Yeah, that's correct, yeah. I was engaged a couple of years ago and we had a a little girl who's three now it just wasn't for me i just i just prefer it was like having a second child to be honest about without slagging

him off too much um just in case he hears this i think covid helped a lot with it because um we live separately then we kind of come together at my mum's because I live with my mum at the time and we had the little one and with COVID we're seeing each other pretty much 24 7 and then we moved into our like rented house and then within two months being here he wanted to buy his own house and I just weren't ready for that I just thought it's going way too fast. I'm comfy where I am. And then when I told him it all, yeah, all hell broke loose. So we kind of were split up from it all.

Already before they'd moved in together, you know, Jo's thinking if it goes wrong, it's not fair and it's my fault. Anything that's a big commitment causes us to start questioning again, doesn't it, looking a little bit more closely. So something that might not have been working that well for us but there was no necessary timeline on we might go along with that a bit longer but suddenly we're buying a house there's a commitment I've got to think about that a little bit more carefully. I've been in situations where I've you know thought about buying a property with a guy and you know my mum said rent do a year rent

first at minimum a year and I'd be like no no it's fine it's fine and I've always ended up calling the estate agent around six months saying can we can we break the rental and then going back going back to my mum's I moved back in with my mum I must have been late 20s 27 28 and it was a hassle because we had bought a house and we obviously when you buy a house there's a will involved as who bought what furniture and in the end I said keep everything the only thing I'm taking is the dogs you can have whatever you want and it got to the stage where it was so stressful dividing who'd paid for what who'd bought what that it would have been easier to take my mum's advice rent and I would have come back with just, you know,

a deposit lost for a month as opposed to thousands on a house. So you ultimately did the right thing because you knew it was right for you. Yeah, well, I think before I knew it was coming to an end and I just kind of stayed with him because of my little one, thinking if we break up, what's it going to be like for her and stuff? But she was so happy because I was happier because he was just bringing me down so much because I just I was staying with him just for the fact of my daughter really um but we just and it's great now I love it it's just we just do our own thing

and it's yeah it's just fantastic and is he still present in your daughter's life do you co-parent well yeah I mean for the first seven six seven months we didn't talk so I said look at the end of the day we've got a child to go we need to we need to speak but he has her every weekend um so so she she goes to um her dad's every weekend and she's got another she's got a sister there dad's previous relationship so she's happy going and it's just my time again but all I do is washing cleaning shopping and then back to Sunday again and But all I do is washing, cleaning, shopping, and then I get back to Sunday again. And I guess the thing is, a lot of people stay with the wrong person because of the kids.

My mum and dad divorced when I was 10. And it was only when I was old enough to understand it properly. She told me she could have left him when I was about six. And I was like, why didn't you? She said, because you were at six and I wanted you to have. And I'm like, yeah, but you stayed with the wrong person for for so long and she said when you have kids you will you will understand and I think it takes a brave person you know male or female if you're not happy to get out of a relationship because ultimately you're going to hurt somebody if you're breaking off a relationship but long

term the damage you do to yourself, which then projects onto your kids. I'd much rather have two happy parents living separately than two miserable parents living together. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. And has anyone caught your eye, caught your eyes in? So you're just kind of thinking, nope, I want to be single. I'm good. No, unless someone like Frank Lampard comes knocking, I'll be single for the rest of my life. But I highly doubt that, so probably not. And are you dating anyone or anyone casual or are you just absolutely fine being...? No, I'm just absolutely fine on my own.

I mean, it might change. I mean, I'm 36 now, but everyone says, like, oh, are you not fancy settling down again and stuff? I'm like, no, not really. I just find me my daughter daughter and that's it really. Unless I'm just boring, but no, I'm just happy as it is to be at the minute. And do you come across a lot of people like that, Claire? Like whereby they're just, yeah, this is it.

And people expect so much more. Yeah, I think one of the things that it sounds like Jo was describing is that actually having a young child uses so much of our emotional energy as a woman that if you have a partner who also is making demands on your emotional energy, when your little one's gone to bed, you need to rest and recover. You're not ready to start taking on somebody else's needs. And it sounds like Jo worries a lot about keeping everything right for a daughter. She wanted to be doing the right thing for a partner.

And you can't be in five places at once, can you? You need some time for yourself. And you've got to mentally recharge. I mean, my fella works away a lot. And I'll often say to producer Matt, who's sat here, I'll go because back on Thursday, I've not seen him for three weeks. He's going to want the lingerie. He's going to want all this.

And all I want to do is get in bed. And he'll text me, go, saying, can't wait for tonight. And I'm like, oh, God. And it's because for me, I'm like, I can't wait for tonight because it means you can get up and I can sleep. Get some sleep. Whereas for him, he can't wait

because he's been away for three weeks. He wants to come home. He wants a bit of attention. So that's what I say to him. Go in the other room with your laptop. It's fine. Poor Gawker. Poor lad.

Poor Gawker. Well, thank you so much, Joe, for sharing your story. I'm sure you've inspired a lot of people. And hopefully if anyone's listening to this, who's been in a similar or is in a similar situation to you, you're proof that you can do it alone if you want to. You don't have to settle.

Definitely. Thanks so much. You're welcome. Thank you for doing this, Charlotte. That's all right, no problem. Thank you for having me. Charlotte, welcome to the podcast. Tell us a bit about yourself. Yeah, so I'm 36, single with no children. Pretty much been single for about 10 or so years.

Kind of a few short relationships. The dating pool is somewhat of a cesspit, so I don't particularly enjoy dating. So pretty much just kind of do my own thing, go travelling quite a lot by myself. I went to New York last year by myself, went to Norway, been kind of all over the place and doing various courses to kind of build up my career and things like that. So pretty much just kind of navigating my way through life by myself. And that's obviously something you've actively decided to do by yourself. I mean, like you say, the dating pool's not working. What happened with your last relationship in your 20s that made you think, do know what I'd rather be on my own he was significantly older than me which I think was a factor and he had a little girl um which wasn't really much of an issue but I think I was very I suppose emotionally

immature I think to date somebody because I think at the time when we got together I think I was about 20 23 um and he had a two-year-old and there was still a lot of baggage with the last relationship and I think I wasn't very emotionally equipped to deal with it and it was quite toxic to be honest so I think it took me a long time to get over that and pretty much just kind of learn who I was because I'd been in relationships since I was like 17 years old so um didn't have a clue who I was didn't know what the date in life was like didn't know what I liked as an individual only knew what I liked as part of a couple um and kind of fitting into that box I think um trying to fit the stereotype of needing to settle down and having children and all the things that

my friends were doing and pretty much just kind of pushed against that and decided that that wasn't necessarily for me. It's bizarre everyone we spoke to on this app I've had something in common with I was with someone in my early 20s he was seven eight years older wonderful man wonderful human being and we ended up getting engaged it lasted six weeks because I couldn't go through with it and he had a daughter who was two at the time and I selfishly at the time I didn't see it because I was like you said emotionally immature but I look back now and my issue was that I remember thinking I'm too young to be a step-mom and a wife at this age and I couldn't deal with the fact like at weekends if midway plans and god forbid his daughter was poorly or the daughter's mum needed something he rightly so

would put his little girl first which is what you'd want the father of your child to do but I'd be like I'd be like well I've not seen you for weeks I thought we were doing something he'd be like I know but she she really needs me she's two and I hated it and now obviously that's an awful thing but I I left for that reason I was like I can't be a stepmom and a wife in my 20s no way yeah no I think it's really hard because you want the the guy to be a good dad and for me I think that's a really attractive feature if a man's got children even now if I was to date somebody that had children, it really doesn't bother me. And for me, it would be more of a red flag if they weren't involved with their children and didn't see them.

But I think when you're in your early twenties, you don't really understand the full concept that the dad's kind of got to be a dad and you are number two. And as much as that's horrible to hear when you're, I don't know, 21, 22, whatever, it's the truth. And I think you kind of need to be emotionally mature to be able to deal with that. What are your thoughts on that, Claire? I think stepfamilies are really difficult, particularly when you're young. If you don't have a child and your partner does, essentially, you're never going to be their first priority and you might well be making them your first priority and that imbalance can be really difficult for people to manage particularly when

they're younger. But I guess the thing is as well it's a double-edged sword because if you were with someone who had a child who didn't put them first that for me is a well you won't want a child with them down the line because they could forget about them as well. Yeah, exactly. So yeah, it's whether you're looking for a partner or a fellow parent. And I think at that stage in your life, like your early twenties, you're often looking for a partner. And with being on your own, I believe you've, you know, been able to work on your physical health, your mental health, you do training, you go on holiday on your own. Tell us a bit about that journey. So when I was 28, I decided that I was going to become a counsellor. And so working full time, I decided that I was going to study part time to get my diploma as a therapist, which I

qualified in when I was 32. And then about two years ago, I got offered a job as a counsellor working full time for a mental health charity and physical health I've yo-yo dieted since I was 15 years old so last year when I came back from New York I just decided that I was sick of it and one of my friends that I actually went to school with he was a well he is a personal trainer and I signed up for a program with him, which was pretty much a whole lifestyle overhaul. I love feeling like strong and powerful. And I think there's a lot in that, especially when you're kind of navigating your way through life alone. Yeah, it definitely plays a part. I think the minute you start taking care of yourself, they always say it's hard to feel bad about a

body that you're taking care of. And I guess in your in your experience it's you can take on anything because you're in the right mindset for it well yeah exactly I mean last summer I actually went on a date with a guy which I think was my my first date since before Covid I think um we had a really good first date and then we agreed to meet up a few days later and he actually stood me up and then in the morning I was due to go to the gym um I get up at like quarter five in the morning to go to the gym and I really didn't want to go I was like I had absolutely no motivation I felt really awful um it really kind of knocked me um and I went oh god I felt amazing afterwards it's it's so incredible for my mental health I felt unstoppable and yeah I haven't thought about the guy since yeah it's it's so incredible for my mental health I felt unstoppable and yeah I haven't

thought about the guy since yeah it's it's the endorphins and I guess Dr Claire you'll be able to relate that obviously in certain situations as medication is necessary and essential but a lot of the time good nutrition and movement and fresh air can be a really good medicine as well definitely one of the things that we're always working with people around mood is moving more it's definitely something I'd be talking to people about if I'm working with them around anxiety or low mood or problems with their sleep how much activity are you doing it's one of the top things on my list. What would your advice be to anyone who's you know come out of a relationship similar to you and are now kind of

faced oh my gosh I'm on my own I'm working but I've not got a fella what am I supposed to do? I would say don't get back into another relationship just as a distraction because I think a lot of people do that and especially in the job that I do I see people kind of go from different relationships because they they're too afraid to be by themselves. And it is really scary and doing things by yourself. I still find going out and eating by myself really scary. Of all the things that I do, I always feel really awkward, but I do it and it's really uncomfortable. Do not be afraid to be uncomfortable because the most growth does actually come from that. One of my questions when you were talking earlier, Charlotte, was like whether you'd

always had that courage to go travel independently and do things because it's anxiety provoking to do that but it sounds like it's not that you've always have it it's that you've been willing to deal with the anxiety to have what you want. The thought of never going on holiday unless somebody was free scared me more than going by myself so I mean I didn't go on my first trip by myself until I was about I think I booked it when I was 29 and I just randomly booked a flight to Boston for New Year's Eve I remember when I landed in Boston and I went to get my luggage I was terrified I was like what do I do now I was so scared I do think it's harder to meet people when you're single because I think there's kind of quite a lot of things that are geared towards that kind of mum and baby.

And I think the commonality is that people get together and they have children and you have like your mum friends and things like that. But there isn't kind of like a single person club. Unless you've got specific interests where you can meet people. And I've lived where I've lived my entire life, which I think is actually a bad thing because I think I'm just a bit too comfortable. I'm actually moving up to the Midlands by myself and just completely starting a whole new career and new life.

And I think that'll be really good for me because I'll almost be forced to go and meet people and go to classes. What advice would you give Claire for that whole new experience, new chapter almost? Well, it sounds like Charlotte's doing great already. Like often people say, oh, I'm just not the kind of person

who could do that. And she's not saying that. She's saying this is going to be anxiety provoking, but I'm going to do it anyway. And yeah, that's the way to find your people, isn't it? Better a know well than a what if.

Yeah, that's the mentality I go with, to be honest. Oh, well, brilliant. Well, thank you so much for joining us, Charlotte Oh, well, brilliant. Well, thank you so much for joining us, Charlotte. It'll be brilliant. Lovely. Thank you so much.

Well, that is it. Thank you for all your stories on The Overshare. Another great, great episode. I hope you enjoyed it and I hope our stories have helped you out. If you've got a few hang ups,

maybe, you know, some huge hang ups. We've all been there about hang-ups, maybe some huge hang-ups. We've all been there about being in your 30s and not yet settling down. We'd love your comments on this episode. As always, you can get us whenever you want to on the Overshare WhatsApp, which is 07761039898. Thank you so much to Dr. Claire. You've been fantastic, so thank you to you.

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