The People, Process, & Progress Podcast - Tackling Scope Creep: People, Process, & Courage

Episode Date: May 6, 2025

In this episode, Tackling Scope Creep: People, Process, & Courage, we're diving into how to protect our projects, keep our sanity, and build stronger teams in the process.Episode outlineIntroCore conceptsThe People Side: Assertiveness and Stakeholder Boundaries The Process Side: Change Control Systems (Hard Skills/PM Tools)The Progress Side: Leading with Clarity Under Pressure Summary & ClosingGodspeed y'all,Kevin

Alright project leaders, let's get real. Scopecreep, one of the scary boogie men of a project manager, it's not just missing lines in a document, right? It's a people thing. So in this episode, tackling Scopecreep, people, process, and courage, we're going to dive into how to protect your projects, keep the team's collective sanity, and build stronger teams in the process. But first, it's time to lace up, chalk up, get logged in and get locked on as we put

people first, share our processes and help each other make progress on the People, Process, Progress Podcast with Kevin Pennell. All right, y'all. Welcome back to the Peopleupil Process Progress podcast. Again, my name is Kevin Pennell. I'm your host here on the Pupil Process Progress Project Management podcast. And today we're going to tackle the beast every PM knows and dreads, scope creep. This is a sneaky way that our projects grow beyond the original boundaries.

Scope creep means the section of the charter or whatever document you use that's set out of scope somehow starts to grab things and pull them in. So it's not just a few extra features, but it can be the impact on our teams, on our timelines, on our stress levels, on the budget, on all the things that go with projects. So in this episode we're gonna break down what I like to call the three Cs, clarity, control, and courage, because managing scope creep takes all three.

We can write a clear statement, we can control it with all these forms and documents and reports, but we also have the courage to talk to the person, especially if they're an exec, that's trying to creep the scope. So first up, this is where the soft skills hit hard, right?

And the people side of things, the assertiveness and the stakeholder boundaries. So we as project managers need to have a certain amount of assertiveness without being too pushy, but be comfortable speaking objectively and transparently to what we believe is best for the project and the team and help the leaders that may not understand how this can throw the project off track, right? We need to set boundaries, which if you've heard the Seven Pillars podcast or read my book, The Stability Equation,

setting boundaries is pillar number four and it also makes sense in business, right? So, and stakeholder management, which is, you know, understanding how someone responds, how we communicate with them, what their personality is like, all that kind of stuff. But projects are about relationships, right? So the people side has to come first.

So here's some tips that have worked for me, or maybe some of these haven't worked, and I realize, oh, I should change that, is clarity is key from day one, right? So it makes sense to that nice scope that you made, the charter you made that's got what's in scope, what's out of scope on it, set the turn early with a rock solid communication plan,

meaning you on a call, you sitting next to someone, you in whatever medium you use, clearly read it. You go over it, you say, do we all understand this? Do we understand why, what the negative impact is, what the positive impact is for the positive scope, for what's in scope. So go over roles and responsibilities, how changes are handled, right?

We're not just gonna wild west it or as a leader that I admired and helped me said, we're not Burger King, have it your way, which some places are, that's a problem, but spelled out, right? Don't assume that everybody's on the same page because typically they're not. And here is a thing for project managers

that's quite a challenge, which makes sense, and that's saying no, particularly no to someone that's of higher rank or higher position or status or whatever, or maybe they're overbearing, whatever it is, but no, it's no because here's the impact, right? No, not now, something like that, right? But you have to give it the context of it because just no is a negative door-slamming kind of feel,

right, you have to explain the trade-offs. Well, yes, ma'am or sir, we could do it now, but it would take this many more people and cost this much more, right? Or, you know, a more specific example, so if we're adding that feature, it means that we pushed the deadline by two weeks. And here's how that impacts our budget.

So use data to help tell the story. In this case, if you've heard, and I think I've talked about it before here, is sometimes we use data and facts in a negative way to punish people. Well here we're using it to show folks, here's why we don't wanna do this. Now if you say as the leader, we're gonna gonna and we're gonna spend more and take more time then

that's what we have to do but then also then we get into that escalation hey do I need to manage up and really help you. So the point is use the data, be objective, explain the trade-offs and that can help the people side and your assertiveness is gonna have to be there as a project manager. And then also it's going to help you manage those stakeholder boundaries. And if you think about like this, you're not saying no to the request, right? You're saying yes to project success. So that means it's protecting the team's workload, which is going to protect their mood, their wellbeing, right? The project's goals And setting boundaries is a good thing for you,

for the sponsor, for the product owner, whatever kind of project management you're doing, whether it's Agile or Waterfall or whatever else, but it's being responsible. So that's the people side, it's assertiveness and stakeholder boundaries. Let's talk about the process side, of control systems. And this is a mix of hard skills

and project management tools. So this is where we need to get really administrative, and it's not my favorite, but it's very helpful and beneficial. So I actually do it a lot. I use a lot of project management tools. I'm an admin for some things. And this is where we bring in the control element, right?

And this is where the data and the graphics and the summaries that we make come from to be able to use on the people side to show. So even on small projects, on lightweight things, have a change log, right? Here's a simple list in Teams or in SharePoint or whatever tool JIRA that you use. And it's like, we made this change,

here's why we made the change, it was approved by whoever. And that's it, right? It's a simple thing, you can use Excel spreadsheet, whatever, there's so many different tools, but it's something you can look back on, say a month's down the road and you're like, man, we're really grinding through this,

it's a lot harder, why did we do this? You can look back and understand it, and you can kind of prevent, which stinks, but it's helpful, is the I never said that kind of thing, or we never agreed to do that, and again, this is where you could creep into, well, if we look back here, we can see that you did and be like, you know, my understanding is from a previous decision, we agreed to do this.

And if someone really pushes you, you can go, oh yeah, let's, you know, just as a reference, let's just review the change log. And then it's just kind of there, right? So it's how you approach it too. And what is really important here in this more processed kind of hard, right? So it's how you approach it too. And what is really important here in this more process kind of hard skill side is that we need to tie every scope change to a new risk assessment and resource plan, right?

Every single time. So if we make this change, if you want us to do this, what's the impact to the time and the people and the quality and the budget and anything else, right? It's about not just adding the task, but understanding what does that task mean? Do we have the people? Do we have the time?

Are there new risks introduced? And this is where we as the project manager need to have that strategic look of a project, even though projects are kind of tactical level, right? And then we get up to programs and portfolios and on up to strategy. But this is where we as the project manager need to have a good idea of what our project is all about,

where it's at, what those impacts could be. And that doesn't mean we don't need to do a little more background and homework to get that, but we need to have an understanding off the top of my head, oh, I'm pretty sure that's gonna do this or that, right? And so beyond the change log, right, use your software to track changes, update timelines so that it reflects.

You can mock up, and I've done this many times. Well, let me plug these new dates in, show you on a Gantt chart what that means, and then, you know, again, pictures sell themselves. When you're like, oh, look, the Gantt chart, now it's gonna go over into the new FOSCO view. Now we're gonna have issues with this. Visualization, burn down charts, showing the impact.

It takes away the need for you to explain so much visualization, burn down charts, showing the impact. It takes away the need for you to explain so much by just showing here's the original, here's the new one, which one do we wanna go with, and then even if it's the harder choice, then you gotta prepare for that. So, PMs, you gotta, in addition to that being more assertive, having those boundaries,

working that soft side of relationships, on this process side, we need to use these tools to help us tell the story. But the whole point of people working on a process is to make progress, right? It's the whole name of the show. So let's lead with some clarity under this pressure. So it is going to be pressure. Leaders are going to want you to make changes to the project or team members to make changes

to the project. And they'll think, well, because this person has project or team members to make changes to the project and they'll think well Because this person has rank or status. I just have to do it Well, that should be part of the early discussion is we all agree Right that we're gonna go over these changes and agree and review and understand them before it's made Right that doesn't mean the decision still might not be made But we're not gonna just go direct to someone on the team or the team shouldn't just understand. Hey, understand, just because we talk about a change

doesn't mean go off and make it. And that's where a lot of the people feel pressure on teams is when they're not used to being empowered to help us paint the right picture, then it makes a problem, meaning maybe they've, you know, gotten in trouble for speaking up before, which is not fair, or they've been told, just do it, just do it, I said do it,

or well, if it comes from this person, just do it. And it depends on the leadership they had, right, or didn't have, I'll say. And so this is where the rubber meets the road, though, right? It's that clarity, things are gonna get heated, people are gonna be stressed, and if we all understand, hey, let's go back to our, this is why I think

there's so much value in a really simple charter that's here's the leader's intent, here's within scope and out of scope, here's our objectives, let's just go back to that. Does this tie into what we're doing? What we agreed about? Remember the kickoff. So let's summarize, summarize, summarize things, right? Get the requests in writing and again again, we'll follow up. And as a PM, we take notes or send summary emails

or follow up emails and so say, hey, here's what I understand we talked about, here's what I understand we agreed out, is this agreed on rather, is this accurate? And if so, okay, then we'll move forward with this, right? But that also helps provide that clarity. It shows the progress we'll make either way, whichever decision if we're gonna add the scope

or reduce it, because that's the other thing too, right, is we're talking about scope creep, which typically is adding more, but you also wanna use a lot of these processes if you're gonna reduce the scope because you're taking features from something or, you know. And so when these discussions get really intense, stay calm, practice what Jocko Willink calls normal face.

You're not getting upset, you're not turning red. If you need to turn your camera off, take some breaths. Too quick in your nose, one in your mouth, it's a good calming method. And ask good questions. Help me understand why, what's the why behind this request? Start with why, good Simon Sinek book. And then what problem are we trying to solve?

Tie it to a solution, right? What's the outcome? How does this help our definition of done, right? Or what done looks like or what good looks like. And it's not about winning the argument, it's really what's the best for the project, for the customer that's gonna use the thing, the process, whatever we're putting out.

And ask the questions and be comfortable. And as the PM, again, coming back to that assertiveness, you have to be comfortable asking those questions. And probably more importantly, that your team feels empowered to ask those questions too. If they're not comfortable asking the executive, having them ask you, you gotta work that stuff out. So we should be the calm in the storm,

not the ones who are like, well, they said it, so we have to do this. Doesn't that suck? If we are crappy and have a bad attitude, then it's gonna ripple all through the team. We need to be the voice of reason, right? To understand objectively, here's the decision. We did review all these things, and we're still gonna move forward.

So how, team, can I help you do this? Do we need more people? Because it is more work, it's more time. I'll worry about getting the budget, right? And so we are gonna continue to remove roadblocks for our team, and it's protecting the progress that we all need to make together, right? Preserving relationships, and we're not just managing

the tasks here, we have to really manage people when we get into scope discussions that get heated. And really pay attention, and it's hard, on these remote calls to see the body language, to understand who feels like what, you know, what's going well, but you can still see it. And ask that folks be on camera. That's one of my things is we're so disconnected,

the least we can do for each other is see each other live on camera and read body language. And we can hear voice tone and those together are powerful things. So to wrap this up this episode talking scope create people process and courage right we want those clear boundaries and agile change processes so mindset wise we need to be open that we're going to change because you all know the old school we're going to make a plan it's never going to change is just wrong and that's not a good way to manage

projects. So that is a combination that helps us protect progress rather without burning bridges too. It's a balancing act of speaking up to mention why to be objective but also understanding hey we just we got to pivot. And having the courage to say no, if you can, or no, because, or perhaps we shouldn't because, and communicate that clearly and effectively, and do your best to control the change process.

Make sure the team understands, we're not just gonna make changes because so-and-so asked for it, right? We're gonna discuss them. Then once we'll clearly say, okay, John Doe decided we're gonna do this, we talked about it, we understand the risks, we've all agreed, does anybody have anything else to say?

Okay, team, let's move forward. And it's just that, not that simple, but when you explain it, it should be that clear. So thank you all for listening to today's episode. Until next time, keep leading with empathy, right? Plan with intention and always pursue progress. We do those together when we take care of our people, when we have a shared process. Remember, you're not just managing the projects. You're making a difference. Thank you all for making a difference by listening to the People Process Progress Now of Project

Management podcast. Stay tuned because there is a book with a very similar name coming out in the near future. You can visit peopleprocessprogress.com. You can follow me on X and Instagram at PanelKG, P-A-N-E-L-L-K-G. I also have a YouTube channel called the Panel 5 Fitness Club. So I highly recommend if you're a project manager, program manager, portfolio manager,

some kind of manager that relates to projects that you get after it. Your health is important, your mental, physical, and spiritual health. If you're not taking care of that, you're not gonna be as good as you can be leading your team. So check out Panell5Fit on YouTube.

And if you want some more tools to help balance your life outside of, but also impacting your work, check out the Stability Equation on Amazon. It's Kindle paperback hardcover, and it's actually on sale, Kindle now. It's two bucks. It's pretty easy. It's things I learned from a hard time in my life

that helped me get back on track and come back into leading a large program for a children's hospital. And right before that, I was having a really tough time. I had family sickness and found these tools, started working them, and it helped me empower the team that I had with me. So I think it can do the

same thing for you. Stay safe out there everybody, wash those hands, take care of your people, and Godspeed.