The Ramsey Show - App - 95% of My Net Worth Is in Stocks...What Do I Do? (Hour 2)

Episode Date: December 3, 2020

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Music Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. Anthony O'Neill, Ramsey personality in number one, best-selling author of the book Debt-Free Degree, is my co-host today here on the air as we talk to you about your life and your money. It's a free call at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225.

Gavin is with us in Houston, Texas. Hi, Gavin. How are you? Good. How are you all doing? Better than we deserve. How can we help? So I'm 25 and due to a very fortunate situation, I kind of got doubly lucky here and got some money from my parents and my grandfather and also got really lucky investing in some things I didn't completely understand with that money, like you often say. The tricky part about that now is that 95% of my net worth is in stocks, and I only make 50 grand a year. Getting ready to buy a house with my fiance,

I'm just concerned about the capital gains tax hit to create a down payment for the house. So I'm thinking I've made my fair share of dumb decisions with this money being young, obviously. I've got a big Chevy Tahoe that I don't think I necessarily deserve, but I just happen to like. So I'm thinking, do I sell it to number one, be debt free and create positive equity to maybe absorb that tax it? Or do I keep the truck just because I enjoy it? Is the truck paid for? Yeah. It's got 28,000 left on it, but, um, yeah, either way, I'm not taking the car payment anymore. So I'm thinking, uh, both situations both situations, me either writing it off and writing the tax.

So you're 25 years old. You make $50,000. You have a $28,000 truck, and you have how much in this investment account? About $650,000. Wow. Wow. Yeah, you've been blessed beyond measure, sir.

Yes. And how much of that is gain that is over a year old? Probably about 70% of it. Okay. So that'll be taxed at 15%. And it's in single stocks. And from the way you're describing this, it sounds like it's a fairly high risk situation. Am I right?

Some of it is. I decided, you know, I got scared of it pretty early. So I moved 60% of it into management. I would say the other 40% is individual stocks around consumer data collection and medical diagnostic data collection. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Uber high risk, cutting edge, small cap technologies, and, yeah, you're pretty much playing Russian roulette with those things, or the roulette wheel anyway. So the way I answer questions, we answer questions on this show, is what would we do if we woke up in your shoes? Yeah, man.

Here's the thing. First off, thank goodness you're where you are. Congratulations. It's wonderful. The danger is that it worked and that you may try to do it again. That's the dangerous part. It's like the guy that drops one quarter into a slot machine and wins, and he spends the rest of his vacation putting all his money into a slot machine

trying to do it again because you're not going to do it again uh so i do i do not i do not have investments of those types because they scare me and um and my real estate portfolio alone is worth hundreds of millions so i can speak with uh emotional authority in this situation how it feels uh When I was your age, I was a millionaire and I lost everything. And I don't want you to fall into that. So what I would do is I would move anything that is not in a managed account in mutual funds into that. And I would pay off the truck tomorrow if you're going to keep it. Normally, we say do not own things that are more than half your annual income. This is barely.

But you also have $650,000 freaking dollars laying over here. So I think you can afford to drive this truck if you want to. Right. And then, believe it or not, I'm going to suggest you do not buy a home with your fiance right now. Number one, you don't buy homes with people you're not married to. After you're married, I would rent something,

even if it's something nice, for six months, get to know each other. It takes about a year of being married to know how close to your mother-in-law to buy. Yeah. In other words, after a year of marriage, you will make a different housing decision than you would make today together we've been running here uh for about uh two years we've been i mean we'd probably you're not married yeah correct after you've been married a while you will make a

different decision than you would make as shacked up fiancés. It's a different thing. It just is. That's the truth. And so I would take my time. And you've been the, there's a tortoise and the hare. You've been the hare and you're ahead in the race. And I'm going to switch sides and become the tortoise.

And I'm just going to slow your butt down on the investing and on the house. I'm really happy where you are, and you're obviously a very sharp guy. Yeah. I mean, you're obviously very bright, so you may not do anything we say to do. But you called and asked us, which the danger of that is, is we're going to tell you. Tell you the truth. And I think he will, Dave. I think he's a little nervous. He's a little scared.

He wants to make the right decision. She wants to buy a house. Yeah. And here's the thing, Dave. I think he's a little nervous. He's a little scared. He wants to make the right decisions. She wants to buy a house. Yeah. And here's the thing, Dave, I was going to say. Instead of for, you know, save, like you said, spend the first six months to a year once you all get married, and then with him walking away after he pays the capital gains. I pay cash.

I pay cash for the house. That's what I was going to say. And I'm saying cash like a $200,000, $300,000 home. $400,000. I don't care. $500,000. I don't care yeah 500 you know i don't care yes now you're good really good everything's paid for everything the money's gone yeah most of it but you're not really going your taxes well i mean by the time you it's not gone it's not in the sense of it's that investment accounts yes yes but your taxes at 15 on 70 of 650 650, that's not going to cripple the situation. It's not.

And yes, I would pay the capital gains in order to get this in the right setting. And it doesn't sound like that much of it's going to be subject to capital gains. It's going to sound like you've already done that when you moved it from these higher risk things into the managed stuff. You probably took your capital gains yet then because you liquidated the investments to move them. That's my guess anyway. I don't know exactly how you did that, but that's what it sounds like you did to me. So anyway, I'm going to pay what capital gains you got to pay for making the move, and I'd get it all under managed, and I would sit there, rent something for a year after marriage

or six months after you're married. Then I would buy with cash, and I'd pay off the car today. And I want to say this to America listening. I know you all probably say, oh, man, that worked for him. Let me go try that. No. Do not do it. I mean, I think the numbers, Dave, I don't know the updated numbers,

but it's right around 78% of the people who play in this field do not make a dime. They actually lose money. And so, yes, you hear it worked over here uh but it does not mean more than likely it will not work if you had a buddy that hit a lottery ticket doesn't mean that you're smart to buy lottery tickets yes it's just you know that's the bottom line and so and brandon's or gavin's smart enough to wise enough to be a little bit afraid in this situation. But congratulations that you're there. Yeah. I'm so happy that you're 25 years old and you have $650,000.

That's just so cool. Yeah. That's so neat. And thanks for calling in and asking the question. Yeah. So you get to do what you want to do. You're a grown-up. That's what we would tell you to do.

Yes. Thanks for calling. you've worked hard to make your business successful blood sweat tears and prayers because as a business owner you are the secret. And your company is only as strong as you are. So what happens if a key ingredient is missing? And what if that ingredient is your health, resulting in expensive medical bills? Christian Healthcare Ministries, or CHM, presents health cost sharing. It's different from insurance in that Christians help other Christians to meet their medical expenses. Various programs are available depending on your needs and

budget. As a Better Business Bureau accredited charity, CHM has helped its members successfully share over $5 billion in each other's medical bills for nearly 40 years. Various programs are available depending on your needs and budget. Learn how CHM has served small business owners just like you by visiting chministries.org slash budget. chministries.org slash budget. That's chministries.org slash budget. Anthony O'Neill Ramsey personality is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Brandon is with us in Phoenix, Arizona.

Hi, Brandon. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. How are you? Better than I deserve, sir. How can we help? Well, I'm 35 years old. I have about $180,000 saved up. I have about $60,000 in credit card debt, and I owe about $90,000 on my mortgage with 10 years left on the loan. So at the end of the year here, I'm trying to decide if I

should pay off my credit card debt and the mortgage and then start venturing into some investment properties or pay off the credit card debt and use the remaining $120,000 to start investing in some properties. Yeah, really good question. Way to go. You've done real well. Yeah. Congratulations. Thank you. I'm going to start off on this one, Dave, though. I'm not liking the credit card debt.

So that's the very first thing I'm attacking right now. I'm paying that off when I hang up the phone with this. Yeah. You know, and then from there, I'm going to go ahead and set aside some more money, make sure I have enough, at least three to six months in my savings. Then, you know, I will be looking into the mortgage before I look into rental properties. So, Brandon, when I was 28 years old, I lost everything because I was buying investment real estate on nothing down and 90-day notes, and the bank called our notes, and I had about $3 million worth of debt and about $4 million worth of real estate.

So I had $1 million worth of equity that I lost due to being stupid. That process put me, that pain put me on a journey to learn how wealthy people become wealthy and keep wealth. Not what someone's opinion is or theory is and not someone that wrote a book once, but people that really have done it what did they do people with old hair are people old people with gray hair and money i've been young and rich i didn't want his opinion he was stupid okay so i started talking to old rich people and i found this thing called common sense and then for 30 years we've talked to people as a result and sharon my wife and i made the decision that the closest way to financial peace and wealth is no debt

because no debt works beautifully when times are good because you're making money hand over fist on everything that's an investment because you don't have any payments on the rentals and no debt works great if something like a pandemic happens or a 2008 happens and everything turns down and so you know consequently right now we're sitting on a pile of cash and a pile of paid for real estate the pandemic hits we feel like the third pig the one that built the brick house and the wolf huffed and he puffed and it did no good. I mean, the pandemic's out there blowing smoke all around us and we're just watching some of our friends and our people we love suffer, but financially we've not suffered because we were ready for a storm. And when times are good, we make more money

because we don't have payments. and so then that was confirmed in the data points of coaching wealthy people for the next 30 years and in the study we did for uh chris hogan's book where we studied 10 000 millionaires the vast majority of those 10 000 millionaires became wealthy by being allergic to debt. And then they just were very careful and very intentional about investing. So if all of that to say, if I woke up in your shoes, I think you've done a wonderful job, you know, accumulating some money. I'm with Anthony. I would pay off your credit cards today.

I would also look in the mirror and ask how in the crap I got $50,000 in credit card debt and make sure that doesn't happen again because that's got stupid written all over it. And I'd chop up those stupid cards and be done with them forever. Then, as soon as I did that, I'd write a check and pay off your house. If I did my math right, you said you had $90,000 and $50,000. Did I remember that right? $60,000 and about $90,000. Okay, it was $150,000 out of your $180,000.

So you have $30,000 left after you pay off both things. That's your emergency fund. And what's your income? $120,000 a year. Awesome. Now you have not a bill in the world, and so you ought to be able to save enough to pay cash for your first rental in 18 months. Yeah. And then save and pay cash. And by the way, every time you buy a rental with cash, they make money. You know, the first one's

hard, the second one's easier, the third one's even easier, the sixth one will buy the seventh one. Yeah. It starts snowballing, and that's one's even easier. The sixth one will buy the seventh one. Yeah. It starts snowballing, and that's what I've done. That's how I ended up with several hundred million dollars worth of real estate. We pay cash for everything. I'm sitting in a 200,000-square-foot, $70 million building that we paid cash for. And I'm not bragging. I'm just telling you the stuff I'm teaching you, dude, it works.

Because I haven't done anything that was any trickery that I don't teach you guys to do. Now, I made more money than a lot of people. Yeah. But I didn't do all this off of income. I did it off of living these principles. Yes. So that's what I would do if I woke up in your shoes. The shortest distance between you and the 45-year-old with $10 or $20 million worth

of paid for real estate is the path I just gave you. What do you think? Man, I love it, Dave. I love it. I love how you're teaching. I get straight to the answer. You just take us through a whole story, Dave. Well, we forget to do that sometimes because we just go, oh, the answer is this. Yeah. Because we know the answer. Yes. And, you know, the reason you know the answer of, you know, how not to misbehave talking to a young man on another call is you did misbehave. Yes.

You know, the way I learned about not going broke is I went broke. Yeah. You know, so, you know, my pastor used to say a man with an experience is not the mercy of a man with an opinion. So, you know, you can't talk to Anthony O'Neill about how positive the student loans are because they screwed up your life. They screwed up my life tremendously. Not just that, but even credit cards. I'm thinking the same thing. Like, well, how did you even get the $50,000?

How did you get the $5,000? But then when I sit there and ask that question, I'm like, well, I did it. Yeah. So I know how he did it. Yeah. You know, but. Yeah. But you need to address that because it'll grow back.

Yes, sir. If you don't pull that dandelion out by the roots, it'll grow back and it'll bring three friends. Yeah. And you know what's so funny, Dave? When I'm out there on the road, some of my close friends are like, all right, let's be real. Did Dave really, you know, build that big old building cash? There's just no way.

And I'm like, yeah. I said, believe it or not, Dave practiced those principles probably ten times more than the average person. How do you do that? Well, first you get the money. Right. It's the old Steve Martin line. Steve Martin, a comedian, he had this whole routine. How to become a millionaire.

And the first thing was, first, you get a million dollars. It's like, yeah, that's good. I like that. Yeah, that's how you do it. I mean, you've got to scrape the money together. And the truth is that when we bought the $10 million land under it, it took our breath away. Yes. And the stomach was in the throat.

We built the building. The first $25 million out of pocket was unbelievable. The first time I bought a $5 million building, my mind was blown. The first time I bought a $150,000 rental house, my mind was blown. The first time you do it, you're just like, oh, my God, that just happened. Yeah. But then every time you do it, it's got that much more income associated with it to do the next one so we start building the second one next door it's a lot easier a lot easier been there done that and we've got the extra income now to do it with and now we're building a conference

center up on top of the hill easier yet can't wait for that you know it's it's gonna be even easier but it's the same thing you know the first time you do something and you strain and you barely get there. We bought that other building, the financial piece plaza we were in. Yep. And I paid $5 million for it. I had an option on it for five years I was renting it. Saved and scraped, got the nickels out of the couch. By the time I closed on it at $5 million, it was worth $12.

Good Christ. So, I mean, but I paid cash for it. It was an option, and I didn't finance it, and I didn't borrow money. And believe me, I was tempted because it's worth $12. If I don't exercise that option, I'm walking away from a $7 million equity. Yes. So, you don't have to put a lot of zeros on it for it to make sense. My point is, is we really do this stuff, and it really does.

It went from $5 million up to this $70 million building. And what I love about your story, Dave, that has taught me a lot is the key thing for you was discipline and patience it's taken a while i'm old but i mean i just watched you i mean you bought the land you sat on this land for years yeah before you started building we did we didn't have the money didn't and i'm like wow and to see where we are today because you were patient and you stuck to what you teach, that's why we, during COVID, were able to still operate when other businesses closed because we didn't have any debt. Yeah, the weird thing is that you look back and you go, man, that was 20 years ago.

And that went really fast. Yep. Because it does go really fast. Yes, sir. So whether you do it right or whether you do it wrong, it still goes really fast. Yes, sir. This is the Dave Ramsey personality is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225.

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Hey, Sean, welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, Dave, Anthony, how are you guys doing? Great, Sean. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, Dave, Anthony. How are you guys doing? Great, man. How can we help? All right. So the skinny is I've got about $46,000 in debt. I just started a new job.

We're making $45,000 a year. My question is... You're making how much a year? $45,000. Okay. And I've got a car that I'm slightly upside down on, and I got a question about that. Okay. What do you owe on the car? Probably like, it's around $11,000, like 10-6. And I think if i were to sell it privately i could probably get around ten for it so it's not too bad but i'm wondering if you know if i was trying to get because i would need to replace the car and i'm figuring i need a couple thousand for that do i try and sell the car

get a small loan to pay the difference or a little more to get another car you could just pay it off yeah it's eleven thousand dollars just pay it off what kind of car is it sean uh it's volkswagen golf oh yeah yeah what what's the other debt yeah because i don't think we need to lay on i see what you're trying to do You're trying to get aggressive and go after the debt. If your debt was $28,000 on the car, I'd be selling it in 30 seconds. Right. But $11,000, and you end up with $5,000 or $6,000

in covering the amount you're upside down, plus you're covering another car, you don't move the needle much. I think you can pay it off almost as easy. What's the other $30,000 in debt, though? It's $30,000 in debt, though? It's $25,000 in student loans, about $5,300 in credit card debt,

$4,000 in medical, and then like $1,500 in miscellaneous. And your hold? $27,000. And you're working 40 hours for $45,000 now yes sir I think the biggest thing is not your car it's your student loans

I think here Sean we got to step back and just really work the debt snowball I think at the end of the day just work the debt snowball I wouldn't worry about trying to get a loan to go for this car just pay things off get to the student loans and get really aggressive with that so here's what's happened something occurred that woke you up you got the cold water splash in the

face and you went oh my god and then you got a new job and you got some opportunity to clean up the oh my god yes the oh crap moment right and uh and so it's all kind of new to you but anthony and i've been doing this so long it's real easy for us to jump in and go we can start seeing these numbers and go and you just list these debts smallest to largest you pay minimum payments on everything but the little one you attack the little one with a vengeance yes which um i'm sorry sean but you have no life for a while your only life is going to be working your job and your extra job because 40 hours a week isn't enough we need you to go ahead and pick up another 30 hours doing something else so you can clean

this mess up really really fast the more money you make and the less you spend the faster you get out of debt that's the formula yes and you pay off those little credit cards you chop them up you're going yeah i'm getting some progress here. Then you reach over and pay that car off. Yep. And then there's down to, oh, ugly Sally Mae, which is way more than half of your debt. And then you just start punching her in the face repeatedly until she finally gives up the ghost and you knock her out. But, you know, if you make an extra $10,000, $15,000 a year as your side gig, divide that into $40,000.

What if you make $20,000 as your side gig? Divide that into $40,000. That's two years on the side gig divide that into 40 what if you make 20 as your side gig divide that into 40 that's two years on the side gig and you're out of debt not to mention we're cutting your life away and you're gonna live on nothing on your 42 000 now you're out of debt in 18 months with the whole stinking puppy but the next 18 months is going to be known as hell on earth because all you're going to do is work you are not going to see the inside of a restaurant unless you're working there. Oh, Dave, you hit it. Don't eat out. Heck, I even say probably don't even date the next two years.

I wouldn't go that far. You can get a cheap date. Oh, no. Nobody's telling you you're not going to date. But don't tell a woman, you know, she's a cheap date, Dave. I didn't say her. I said the spending. I get it. But this generation. You might be cheap. But the generation will receive that she's a cheap date, Dave. I didn't say her. I said the spending. I get it, but this generation

will receive that she's a cheap date. He's 26. I know, but you're a cheap date. I'm not. You're cheap. I know. You're cheap and you go on dates. I am cheap.

You know, I am cheap. Well, I'm not cheap. I'm frugal. Ain't nobody put that on me. You got these young ladies out here like, is anthony a cheap date for real he's worth every penny i'm just not worth every penny i'm just not gonna spend five hundred dollars on the date no no i'm not doing that no that's not a cheap date that's just a wise date yes five hundred dollars oh my god let's not bring that back up oh okay yeah we don't need to go back there you

get hate mail every time i do this so and then i get hate mail but i don't read mine that's the difference so all right so sean yeah the more you're willing to sacrifice the more intense you're willing to be the faster all this is going to go away and i think you keep the car yeah and you use it to deliver pizzas yeah Yeah. Yeah. And Sean, here's the thing. I want you to stay on the line. I want you to get a free Ramsey Plus for a year for this process, because I think the key ingredient for you is to really get on a good budget. That's going to really help you stay the path and stay the course because this is the thing. Ramsey Plus is the thing that got me out of debt. But it required discipline and it required a plan.

And I think you need a plan. And work. Yeah. So you are a cheap day. You give away my stuff. Hey, man, listen, it's your stuff. You're the millionaire. I'm just getting there, you know.

You give away my stuff. I give away millionaire stuff. Yes, sir. Now, when I become one, I'm going to be like you know. You give away my stuff. I give away millionaire stuff. Yes, sir. Now, when I become one, I'm going to be like, hey, look at here. Love it. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Rocco is on Instagram. What financial book would you recommend for a high school student?

I got it right now. There's two books, actually. I would say the very first one for a high school student will be my book, Debt Free Degree. And then number two, if you're a high school senior, I would say The Graduate Survivor Guide because I walk through the five mistakes that I made in school. And I love it because I partnered with Rachel Cruz, my sister, Dave's daughter, who didn't make those five mistakes.

And we partnered together and show you how to avoid these mistakes and why Rachel avoided them and how it helped her out so we talk about we cover both sides so definitely debt-free degree and the graduate survival guide and here's another one I would honestly recommend for high school students because we're in this generation Dave of young people loving other people's lives and not theirs so I recommend people to get Rachel Cruzze's book, Love Your Life, Not Theirs. Yeah. Yeah. Because, yeah, you used to could just keep up with the Joneses next door.

Now you got to keep up with them on Instagram. Yes. So, yeah. Give me a break. And Rachel talks about that in her book. Yeah. You know how the age of social media is really starting to direct people down a different path that is not healthy and that is not wise.

And I strongly encourage high school students and college students to pick that book up. It's an older book, but it's a phenomenal, great, great read. Rocco, those are all legitimate books and they're thick books. Here's a little quick one that you can read that's real easy. It's called The Richest Man in Babylon. Wow, that's cool. And we've got it on our website as well. We sell them here. The Richest Man in Babylon. Wow, that's cool. And we've got it on our website as well. We sell them here.

The Richest Man in Babylon. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. Anthony O'Neill Ramsey personality is my co-host today open phones at 888-825-5225 as we talk about your life and your money right in front of you. 888-825-5225. Lisa's in Pittsburgh. Hi, Lisa. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Thank you.

Sure. What's up? Well, I own a business with my ex, and he lives in a house with his brother, and I live in the house that we built. There's two mortgages. You said where everybody lives. Who owns what? My ex and I own the house that I live in, and the house that my ex lives my ex lives with his brother,

his brother owned. Okay. And the point he wants to pay off his brother, he wants to buy his brother out and then work on paying the house off that I live in that we own together. I wanted to ask, what do you think we should start working on paying off first? This is weird. It's so weird.

I mean, you're talking like you're married. Yeah, that's what I was about to say. I'm confused. I hear we, but there is no we. He wants to pay off the house you live in. You understand this sounds strange. Well, we run the business together. Yeah.

I do all the bookkeeping. Okay. He's a landscaper. Who owns the business? He's a businessman. Well, the way I set it up, it's still proprietor,or so he does but okay so you work for him kind of no honey you either own it or you work for him well i don't get paid basically i just pay everything and i manage all the money so i've never heard of an owner who doesn't get paid.

Well, because basically I, I ran the business since we opened it up years ago. Um, and you are, you are, the situation is integrated as if you're married. All of these things you're doing are acting as if you're married, and you're not married, which leaves you very vulnerable, and it's making me very nervous the more you talk. Because I'm starting to fear for you. So let me tell you exactly how this could go down. He actually owns the business.

He could walk in one day and fire you and hire a bookkeeper, and you would be on the street, and you would have made no money while you worked there. You've been working for free. Did I understand this right? Basically, but I know he won't do that. Yeah, right. You knew you were going to stay married when you got married, too. Well, it wasn't a healthy situation.

Yeah, which is kind of how you end up getting screwed on this other thing, too. Yeah. Well. All right, Lisa, here's the thing. I'm confident that he won. I don't think I'm going to be able to give you really good advice because it's going to involve you unraveling a whole bunch of stuff that you guys have got wrapped together that you're probably not going to do. So you're in a very toxic, weird situation, and you've left yourself very vulnerable.

And so you guys need to separate your assets and separate your financial lives, and you need to be paid as an employee, and then we need to decide who's going to get the house, or we're going to sell the house, and you go get you your own house, or you buy him out of the other half of the house, and then you pay off your house. But you guys are integrated in your lives. If you were his wife and you worked in the business and didn't receive a paycheck, that would be fairly normal. Yeah. Fairly normal.

But, you know, you're not. You have legally no rights, and your only chance that you get out of this is the goodness of his heart. And then you just told me it was a toxic situation, which is why you got divorced. And this is the toxic heart we're counting on. This is danger, danger, danger, danger, danger. So you're not going to hear any of this because you think this is all perfectly okay, and it just sounds weird as crud over here on this side of the phone. So that's what I would do if I were in your shoes.

I would separate your lives since you're not married anymore. You need to start receiving a paycheck. Even if it's a percentage of profits, that's fine, but somehow you need to be compensated for your work, and you need to start receiving a paycheck even if it's a percentage of profits that's fine but somehow you need to be compensated for your work and you need to split these assets off and no by god you don't need to pay his brother's all house off you're not married to him he can pay his brother's house off he is should have a separate life yeah but that's cray cray girl that's just nutty so you're gonna have to think through this a little different. But I have a feeling you've been running this thing like a commune for 10 years, and you're used to it.

Yeah. But you are so vulnerable. And then I find you in my offices for crisis counseling when this whole thing comes unraveled four years from now, and you're going to be broken and busted and and i'm i don't want that for you so that's why i'm speaking very plainly to you this did sound as weird to use it to me right it still is weird to me okay i'm just being honest okay because i agree i don't know how to give advice i well i can't you can't yeah there's too many things here so you need to you guys need to spend some time in 2021.

You can do it gently. You don't have to do it with anger or something. But you need to separate your lives as if you're divorced. Yeah. Because you are. Andrea is with us in Phoenix, Arizona. Hi, Andrea. How are you?

Hi, guys. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I have a quick question. I have been blessed to have a 22-year-old who just graduated ASU with his master's degree. Cool. He did that all on an academic scholarship. Go, kid, go.

Yeah, right. So my question is, because of the job climate right now, he has decided to study for his LSAT and pursue a law degree. Bad idea. Very bad. Okay. Studying for your LSAT when you're a genius and becoming a lawyer is a great idea. Doing it because of a job climate and that's your only motivation is a dumb idea. Okay. If he wants to really be a lawyer this kid could be a

lawyer but this kid could be anything he wants to be right yeah he can be um he just his his master's was in um sports law and business and there's not really sports happening right now that's okay he's got lots of business and business law under his belt and he's got a master's degree with a business function to it. And just because he doesn't operate in sports doesn't mean he can't operate. Okay. Lots of business. Well, that was going to be my question.

Here's the thing. I think going to law school is a great idea for this guy. Yeah. But only if he wants to be a lawyer, not as an escape mechanism, because I don't want to face a year with pandemic and andrea sports are still happening you do know but it's the jobs aren't the yeah yeah he's right about that that job's gone for a while i don't know how much longer but hopefully a year but a year from now but i mean there's there were some great jobs in his field of study but it's a it

was a nuanced field of study but it wasn't so nuanced that it doesn't have other applications. The base knowledge he got in that is equivalent of an MBA. And so he can go into the business world. Does he want to be a business person or does he want to be a lawyer? If I'm being honest, he wanted to be the general manager of the Denver Bunkers. Yeah. Well, you probably ought to have more than one job as a possibility in your whole life. But conceptually, he would like to be the operational executive of a forward-facing consumer-based performance product of some kind. Now, there's a lot of those.

The Denver Broncos are not the only one, right? But that's not a bad goal. That's a great organization. But you see what I'm saying? So does he want to be in business or does he want to be a lawyer? If he wants to be a lawyer, this kid's brilliant. Let's go to law school. Yeah.

Okay. He is a brilliant kid, but I think it's just kind of a fallback. I don't know that that's really what he wants to do. Yeah. But I think it's just kind of a fallback. I don't know that that's really what he wants to do. Yeah, sometimes I meet people who couldn't find a job, and so they feel called to the mission field. And they're not called to be missionaries. They just couldn't find a job, and they love Jesus. And so they got distracted. And so if you're going on the mission field, you need to be called to the mission field. If you're going into law, you need to be called into law.

That's what I would do. But this kid's a kid worth supporting because he's brilliant and he's a go-getter. He's goal-oriented. He's knocked it out of the park. I'm proud of him, and you ought to be too. I just, please don't do stuff by default, especially something as expensive and hard as law school is. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Have a friend or family member that needs a daily dose of Ramsey advice in their life? Let them know about the Ramsey Call of the Day podcast. It's

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