The Ramsey Show - App - Am I Being Too Gazelle Intense? (Hour 3)

Episode Date: June 21, 2022

Dave Ramsey & George Kamel discuss: Should you sell your house to pay off debt, How to know if you should fire your financial advisor, Is it possible to be too gazelle intense? Should I take out a loan to pay off my other loans? Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show. Where debt is dumped, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. George Campbell, Ramsey personality, is my co-host today as we answer your questions about your life and your money. It's a free call at 888-825-5225. Nick is with us in Louisville, Kentucky. Hi, Nick. Welcome to the Ramsey Show.

Hello. How are y'all doing today? Great, man. What's up? Me and my wife are currently not in love with our current home. The market's pretty hot. We have talked about, you know, we're working on some of our baby steps, as in paying things down.

Our income for the household is $145,000 a year. We have roughly $36,000 in student loan debt, still outstanding in roughly $14,500 in unsecured or credit card type debt. If we were to sell our home, we would net, based off the market in our neighborhood, anywhere between $1,000 and $125,000. Would you recommend that we continue down the baby step process and pay that down and stay where we are in a home we don't love, or potentially get it ready, put it on the market, pocket the money, rent for a while, and be completely debt-free going into a new home? How much do you owe on your cars? Nothing.

We don't owe anything on any of our cars. Okay, good. So you get $120 out, you got to put $50 down in debt, and that frees you up an emergency fund plus a small down payment on the next house correct yeah i'm doing that sure okay because given the market you know we had planned on renting we are okay with that uh so we don't really owe a whole lot on i wouldn't rent long because i don't think this market i i i'm not in agreement that real estate prices are going to go down. We're actually doing a real estate reality check on July 14th that folks – is it 14th or 13th? Yeah, 14th.

That they need to tune into. It's a free stream on – we're going to go over the data with everybody and show them how and where it's going. But I don't think the market's going to shoot up either. I think we're projecting a 5 uh growth in real estate prices this year it was seven percent last year 18 the year before and 32 the year before so um that's the actual data not not people's feelings and uh you watch the news too much you lose your mind so anyway absolutely the uh anyway i think renting for a year you're going to be perfectly safe i don't think you're going to see a huge increase i don't think you're going to see a huge increase,

and I don't think you're going to see a decrease in prices. You may see interest rates tick up some more as the Fed keeps screwing with us under Biden because this Biden administration is just bound and indeterminate to screw up this economy. They are messing with every lever they shouldn't be messing with, from labor to energy, everything. So you could see higher interest rates, but even then, you go buy a house, and if rates come back down, you just refinance. So I would do this and go rent for one year. That would be my plan. All right.

That's the reassurance that I thought I needed. I would not do that if you love the house you're in. Correct. And that is our problem is we do not love it, but we love the area. So we're willing to flex and hang out for a year or so. Exactly. Sharon and I did the exact same thing. We had kids in a private school because we're in a crummy school district.

We sold the house and rented it for two years and put the kids in, you know, moved into a great school district, this area that we live in today. And that saved, you know, back in the day, you know, $20,000 a year. Wow. That's a lot of money back then. Yeah. And we were renting cheaper, and we had all the equity from the house we had sold, and we cleaned up the last little bit of debt from the IRS and other stuff from the bankruptcy we'd gone through a few years

before and uh so we were clean slate firmer foundation foundation yeah and got settled in the neighborhood the area of town that we wanted to be in the county that we wanted to be in and that kind of thing um and then from there we saved and bought the first house during that two years the repurchase it wasn't our first home it was our third home but still and for a lot of people selling their house right now to clean up a mess could be a good thing but if you gotta you make 145 grand and you've got 50 grand in debt you can pay that off there's no reason to sell the house just because of the exactly there's the math is not demanding you sell the house but you're gonna sell it anyway because you'll like it. And this is a good time.

It feels like a get-out-of-jail-free card, so my caution to Nick is that you've got to change your behavior. We've got to actually decide. We're never touching debt again. We've got these future goals. That's a really good point. Because sometimes it feels like, oh, we just got out because of the equity in the house and appreciation. We can just keep living how we've been living. Yeah, you don't want to do this every time to clean up your mess because you keep making messes.

That's a good point. So do it the right way. good point patrice patrice is with us uh in detroit hi patrice how are you hi dave it's an honor to speak with you you too what's up um okay well i have a distrust issue with my so-called financial advisor um when the market was up to 36 000 she and I had our six-month routine call, and she had someone else on the line, but she did let me know. And what she was doing was, without me realizing it at that time, was trying to start, I guess, get him started with a new account and advise me to take some of the money that I had been saving for my down payment toward getting into a

home and put it into investments. Well, I already have a 401k rollover with them. So I feel like I was number one misadvised and I'm not happy about it. And I'm looking to just move on before Q3 rolls around and I don't want to pay fees to this firm and yet another firm. I just don't, I don't trust them now. to this firm and yet another firm i just don't i don't trust them now what do you advise me to do i think i don't think you should ever work with somebody you don't trust especially on money so you need to move it but then let me scold you also you're you're like a grown woman and stuff you made the decision i know i own that so you, you didn't. You blamed them.

And so, you know, the trust factor has to come down to you. So we teach people not to use financial advisors as babysitters, but instead to use them as teachers. And so from now on, the next time this comes up, your financial advisor's job is to teach you and say, you know, if it was me, here's what I would do and why. And then based on that, you make your decision. And then it's your fault. Okay?

So you need to understand why they're telling you to do this and then do it or don't do it based on the why because you have been taught and your knowledge has increased, and then you decide when you're going to do it. So, like, Patrice, when I'm talking to these NFL guys, these little 23-year-olds and 24-year-olds, and they got a $10 million signing bonus, and they say, I got me a guy, that's somebody who's getting ready to lose all their money because some guy is going to tell them what to do and they don't have a they don't know they're like you know they don't know their butt from a hole in the ground they're stuck and so they've got it you have to go learn

you are in charge of your money you have to take care of your money but i would move it because i don't trust him and then i would get an advisor in my, and I'm not going to have an argument with my financial advisor because they're not in charge of my money. I'm in charge of my money. Their job is to teach me, and then based on that knowledge, do I believe the knowledge, and am I going to buy it? And then based on that, am I going to make a move? That's what you've got to get there.

But you can't ever look back on them again and say it was their fault because from now on it's your fault this is the ramsey show in an uncertain world being a good steward of your money is more important than ever while some circumstances can't be controlled there are items within your budget you can take charge of, such as your health care costs. For nearly 40 years, Christian Health Care Ministries, or CHM, has provided a budget-friendly means of sharing for medical bills when our members need it. Learn more by visiting chministries.org slash budget. That's chministries.org slash budget. Christian Healthcare Ministries is a Ramsey personality is my co-host today you know one thing about doing these live

events again there's a lot of energy in the room when you get in a you know a room of 3,000 or 8,000 people full of you know a theater an arena full of people wanting to change their lives it bleeds over on you and And you leave there. You know, you go to like a football game or a basketball game or something. You get excited. It's fun. Your team wins. Your team loses or whatever.

And you leave, and you're kind of excited for those guys that just did their job. But when you leave and you're excited because you're like ready to go do something for you, that's a whole different thing. So that's what the Smart Conference is. It's a day-long event is going to be october the 22nd in dallas it is not yet sold out but you can still get passes they're only 39 for the whole day it's all the ramsey personalities plus craig and amy groschell from life church are coming to speak on marriage so we'll be speaking on mental health and wellness. We'll be speaking on careers, leadership, marriage, money, millionaires, Christina Ellis, Ken Coleman, George Camel, Dr. John Deloney, Rachel Cruz,

Craig and Amy Groeschel, and Dave Ramsey. It's going to be a full day, and you will leave smarter. It's the Smart Conference. We're cooking things up, Dave. We've been having some meetings about this. We've got some surprises for you. Oh. Yeah.

There we go. So worth it. It's very entertaining. It's probably our most entertaining event on top of the content. It is an absolutely phenomenal event. Live music, you name it. It's a great event. It's an immersive thing, yeah.

RamseySolutions.com slash events to get your whole $39 ticket. We ought to charge $3.90, but we don't. We charge $3.39. All right, Avery's with us in Hartford, Connecticut. Hi, Avery. What's up? Hi, Dave. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. How can we help? Yeah, so question. I'm wondering if I'm being too gazellent. Okay. Why? So last August, I had finally gotten to the point where I saved up a large chunk of money.

And I bought my first house. I did a 15-year. And I saved up. I put down about 25% down. And I saw everything would be fine and damning. I'd be able to calm down at work with the overtime. And it was pretty instantaneous that I went from sleeping okay at night to not sleeping great at night. Why?

I don't feel great knowing that I owe somebody $180,000, $190,000. Oh, okay. But the payment, is it a fourth of your take-home pay yep yeah i can afford the payment no problem okay um so what are you why are you why are you freaking out then you're paying rent before and weren't awake at night yeah yep yep that's true um but i guess just just having my name on a loan for $180,000, it troubles me. And I'm a worker, and I'm working right now. I'm working 90, $100 weeks, and I'm doing it just fine.

I'm happy. I'm healthy. I'm just wondering if I'm being too gazelle intent. And these are consistent 90, $100 weeks. Well, what are you doing this for? Are you trying to pay down the house early? What's your goal? Yeah, every, yep, yep. After the budget is made and after all my bills are paid.

Are you single? Every extra cent, yeah, single. Okay. Well, what's your goal to pay this off? How fast do you want to do it? The extreme goal is three years. The more realistic goal is five years. Okay. Well, do you think you'll burn out doing this for three years. The more realistic goal is five years. Okay.

Well, do you think you'll burn out doing this for three years straight, working 100 hours a week? I've been doing it for two and a half years, and I haven't burnt out yet. Dude, you're like an Energizer bunny. I mean, that's impressive. I mean, you're telling us you're happy and healthy. Here's the thing. We say to go from intense to intentional once you're in baby steps, four, five, six, which you are, correct?

Yes, sir. And me and my wife, we decided to be intense to pay off our house early. We did it in 26 months, which it sounds crazy, and we did go really hard. But we also weren't losing sleep at night. There was an excitement. We were intense about it, but it wasn't consuming our life either. And so I want you to have some balance there. I love that you want to pay this off and you don't like debt.

Great goal to have. But when it's consuming, you're living in your head rent-free, it's not worth it. Yeah, if you're not sleeping and you're working this hard out of some kind of fear or desperation, that's not good for you. Because the numbers don't indicate that there's an emergency. No, there is no emergency. I i know but you're acting like i have a very healthy fund yeah you're acting like i have a very yeah you're a driven dude clearly no no no no no you're you're spun up like a saber-toothed tiger's chasing you yeah i feel that way yeah Yeah. That's not okay. All right.

Being intense and working hard is okay. But being freaked out as your reason for being intense and working hard is not going to be good for you. You need to be able to shift gears and go, I'm going to be peaceful and ambitious. I mean, there's times right now, and I'm worth several hundred million dollars that I work 100-hour weeks. It's just because I want to, because I'm enjoying what I'm doing, and I'm not doing it out of fear or desperation or terror, or I'm not spun up when I'm doing it. I'm doing it because it's a goal, and I'm ambitious, and I enjoy hitting the goal. And usually when I'm doing it, I'm helping thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of people during that week when I'm doing that. Like when we do this real estate reality check, that'll be a 16-hour day that day when I work that day on the 14th coming up. And I don't need to work financially, but there's a different thing happening in my heart.

I'm doing that to help other people because there's so many people scared right now about real estate. They're freaked out. And so I want to help. And I want you kind of coming at this. I don't mind the hours. George is exactly right. I think your hours are fine. If you want to work like a crazy man, I do that sometimes.

But I don't want you to do it from desperation because you're not living in an emergency, Avery. If you were, I would tell you. And I would tell you to work like this if you call me up and said I'm working like this to get rid of my student loan debt and I'm freaked out about it I'd say okay stay freaked out get student loan debt knocked out because you got that thing hanging around your neck but this is a mortgage you're gonna have done in three to five years and there's no reason to freak out you're still a young young guy, man. You've got time. You're doing really, really, really well. And so I would just breathe in and kind of enjoy where you are

and then put your shoulder back into it, you know. Smack them again, baby. Get it done. I love that you're getting it done. I just don't want you to be afraid because you don't need to be. And having that kind of anxiety is not a picture of health to me. So I want you to kind of pan back and go, where is this coming from? And let's figure that part out, and I think that will help you navigate what's next.

Well, and the interesting thing is, Avery, it's like a lot of things. What you're doing is so smart, and it's easy for us to encourage you in it, but we want to be careful and say, up under that, what's really going on? And what is it you're really running from or running towards? And so let's get all that stuff straightened out in your head. Make sure you take Sundays off. Let's put a Sabbath in there. Make sure you're at church.

Make sure you're spending some money and enjoying some of it and giving some of it go for a hike in the mountains sit on the edge of a bluff and look out over a valley it's okay you're doing good man and then go back to work monday but you need to get a rhythm in here that's got some peace in the rhythm that's why you got a lake house, Dave. I turn down that street, my blood pressure goes down, man. I'm just saying. As soon as I turn onto that road, it's downhill.

The last half mile, you can put one of those little things on your arm, and it would be just dropping right there. Dave, you go real hard. I mean, you hold us to a high standard because you go hard. But you were also able to unplug. The point is the why and what's driving it. And what's driving it is the need to serve others and the satisfaction you and I get and everybody, all the Ramsey personalities, everybody at Ramsey gets from helping other people. And that's why we jump up and do a free real estate reality check and we're going to unpack that so we want people calm down they're freaking out and there's no reason for them to be

scared and let's walk through this fear because these stinking news channels have gotten where they're just fear porn 24 7 their goal is just to spin you up left spin you upright spin you up left spin you upright gotta get those ratings let's see if we can get people pissed off and mad at each other let's let's find some reason to all be mad at each other and that's it's just it's it's enough enough already this is just crazy y'all so uh it's the same kind of thing you know but but avery you're doing good stuff a bad way so let's do the good stuff with some peace in it, and you and I will be high-fiving when you get your house paid off. This is The Ramsey personality is my co-host today. Mike and Valerie are with us in St. Charles, Missouri.

And it says on my screen, you guys are debt-free. Congratulations. Yes, we are. Thank you very much. Cool, cool, cool. Now, how much did you pay off? $442,793. Wow.

And how long did that take? 27 months. Okay. And your range of income during this time? $250,000 to $310,000. My, my, my, my, my, my, my. What in the world do you do for a living? Well, I do business development slash sales for a construction company.

And Valerie? I work for a health care company in technology. Wow. So what kind of debt was this $443,000? Well, we had a timeshare that I know you love. There's about $9,000 left on that. A student loan of about $9,500. A 401k loan that's about $9,000 left on that. A student loan of about $9,500. A 401k loan that was about $17,000.

Four different credit cards that were about $40,000. And then three different mortgages. Whoa. Paid off the house. Paid off the house. Whoa! Talking to weird people. I love it.

Yes, sir. As weird as it gets. Love it, love it. Not a payment in the dadgum world. Baby step seven. Way to go, baby. Way to go, man. I'm so proud of you.

What's this house worth? Well, our main residence is about $500,000, and our lake house that we still own is about $300,000. Nice. And how much is in retirement savings 401k is such between the two of us uh it's north of one okay so you're approaching a two million dollar net worth yeah probably a little above that i love it how old are you guys i am 51 and i'm 42 you're like classic classic baby steps millionaires you fit the profile exactly and how much of this did you inherit uh very little there was a little

bit towards the end that was a family property that sold that put us over the edge use the last 20 000 of that um so out of two2 million, you inherited $20,000? Yes. Okay. So we don't want anybody to think you became a millionaire with inherited money. Yeah. Actually, when I was younger, I did inherit a little bit more, but it was not enough to – I did a lot of stupid with that.

Ah, I got you. Okay. Way to go, you guys. All right, what do you tell people the secret to all this is? You've really killed it. Well, paying attention to your money, being on the same page, and being intentional. I called your show a couple years ago before we started this, and you kind of inspired me. And after our conversation, you said 24 to 36 months we should

be at baby step seven so i took that as a challenge and uh finished off the first year with 140 and then the second uh a little more than the second year got the rest of it taken care of so i was wrong it only took you 27 months yep you're okay with being wrong on that one i I like it when I'm wrong like this. I'll take wrong when you're the hero. That's very well done, guys. So, Mike, Valerie, 27 months ago, you guys were pretty normal. You were falling for a lot of traps. You were living on the credit cards, 401k loans, the timeshare, all these mortgages. What happened where you guys just went, we're doing this once and for all? Well, it was mostly me. My wife, Valerie,

is a natural saver, and I was kind of the free spirit nerd on certain items, and I was kind of the king of the credit card shuffle, feeling like I was doing something to move the money around. And yeah, and it wasn't working working and i actually had inherited a zero turn mower from our family that i was supposed to sell when the family sold the farm and it sat under a shed for five years and deteriorated and i told a buddy that's a mechanic hey fix this so i can sell it but don't spend too much money and when i got the bill it just kind of made me sick to my stomach and thought how am i going to pay for this? And Valerie and I weren't on the same page with money and, you know, I was trying to figure it out. And I found your program and I just started selling everything I could to pay for the repairs on that

mower. And then when I did the debt snowball on a spreadsheet, it made me sick to my stomach to look at how much money we were blowing and wasting on all the stupid. Wow. Way to go, man. Way to go. How does it feel, Valerie, to be free? It feels pretty good. I'll take that.

I guess so. A $2 million net worth and not a debt in the world. Absolutely amazing. 51 and 40-something years old. Way to go, y'all. Way to go. We are free, and it feels fantastic. What's the next big years old. Way to go, y'all. Way to go. We are free, and it feels fantastic. What's the next big thing you're going to do to celebrate?

Well, upgrading vehicles. We just bought Valerie a new used vehicle, and probably in the next year or two I'm going to do the same, and it might be a vacation or two in the next year. So looking forward to just not being free and not on anybody anything that works for me what'd you buy valerie uh a nissan armada oh nice car very cool that's a great car all right guys very very proud of you are the kiddos involved they know what's going on yeah they don't know all the numbers uh per se but we'd driven to Florida a couple times and listened to some of your books on the way,

and the kids had to listen to it as well. So they are on board, and they like the plan, and they know that we're finally to baby step seven. They asked questions along the way, and we didn't give them specifics, but we kind of told them where we're at and what we're doing and why we're doing it. So it's been a pretty good journey. Way to go, y'all. Way to go.

I'm so proud of you. You set yourself up. So you're 51. When you're 58, if you don't do anything else, you'll have $4 million. And when you're 65, if you don't do anything else, you'll have $8 million. And, of course, you're going to do more. So when you hit 65, you're going to do more so when you hit 65 you're going to have 10 to 20 million dollars somewhere in there so my last prediction i missed

i'll probably miss this one too but that one's going to be pretty close so yeah i hope so and we're you know maxing out everything so we're on our way yeah way to go guys absolutely incredible all right we've got a copy of baby Steps Millionaires for you. You're already there. You are one. And a copy of the Total Money Makeover. You can give that away and help somebody out with it. And a one-year subscription to a membership on Financial Peace University and get you guys signed up for that to go back through it or send somebody through it.

It's all the brand-new videos that just came out, the best version of fpu we've ever done so good stuff all right mike and valerie st charles missouri 443 000 paid off in 27 months making 250 to 310 they knocked it out house and everything baby steps millionaires count it down let's hear a debt-free scream three two one we're that's how it's done boys and girls that's how it's done debt-free with a bunch of zeros on the end love it love it well here's the thing the baby steps millionaires book this is why we did the book because we're talking to people like mike and valerie almost every day and uh after having done this show for now uh 30 years as a matter of fact this weekend will be 30 years oh wow congratulations technically speaking incredible june 25th was the

date we went on the air and it'll be 30 years on the 25th. And so, you know, all these years of doing it, what we're running into is people like him that, you know, I talked to you 10 years ago. I talked to you 15 years ago. My dad and mom talked to you 10 years ago, 15 years ago. I was a little kid. You know, we get those calls. We get those debt-free screams but what ends up happening is is that when you follow these steps it is the shortest right way to become wealthy and that's why you know that's why we plug people into financial peace university because a lot of

these people that have become baby steps millionaires are following the baby steps through financial peace university they're learning about. They're learning about why spending from you in the new lesson with you and Dr. John. And when you follow these proven steps, and we tell people, you know, we always have told people it takes a decade, you know, to work through them most of the time. And, you know, but then your baby steps millionaire. It's pretty cool. That's how you become an overnight success over a really long period of time that is how it's done over a lot of nights but it can be done and it's slow you wake up and you go oh my gosh we're millionaires i love it just look up one day go look at that

two million dollars who would have thunk it this is the ramsey show Z Show. Our scripture today, Hebrews 13, 7, Remember your leaders who spoke the word of God to you. Consider the outcome of their way of life and imitate their faith. Brian Tracy said, Leadership is the ability to get extraordinary achievement from ordinary people. Brian's right. And by the way, most of us are ordinary until we do something extraordinary. Then maybe you're not ordinary anymore after that.

Who knows? All right, Des is with us. Des is in Philadelphia. Hi, Des. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hello. Can you hear me? Sure.

What's up? So thank you for taking my call. I'm debt. I'm 24 years old, and I have about $32,000 in debt from various things, $10,000 in credit cards. I have $6,500 in a personal loan, two car loans that total up to $15,000, $9,000 for one car, $5,000 for another car. Why do you have two car loans? So I really like cars a lot, so I bought a 2004 Subaru WRX. And anyway, it blew up the day I bought it.

It's a long story, but I got the second car because that car blew up twice in a year. And I was like, this isn't, this is too much right now. And it got really expensive for gas and everything. So it actually cost me less money to get another car, um, instead of just driving that car constantly. That's one way to justify it. Okay. Yeah. So the goal is to sell it, but anyway, I don't, as Blona right now, I have another engine for it, so I'm going to put the engine inside it and then sell it, and then once I put the engine inside it. But so anyway, my question is, though, I start school this summer. I'm going to school for nursing and, uh,

I want to consolidate all my, all my debt into a, um, into a $25,000 school loan. And the reason why I want to do that, cause I want to pay it off faster. Uh, if,

from what I understand, if I do that, instead of me having all these different, these different loans all over the place, because like my one loan, it has a high interest rate and the other one has high interest rates and so on and so forth. Well, totality all into a smaller loan. Des, listen to me, buddy. The problem isn't that you have too many debts all over the place. The problem is, Des, you're the common denominator for all of these debts. So moving

them into one thing over here and moving, you're not actually doing anything. I want you to change the way you live your life, not change where your debt is moving to. Are you ready to do that is the question? Because if not, no, you shouldn't consolidate the debt and put it into a school loan. You should pay off the debts from smallest to largest regardless of the interest rate and stop making bad decisions. What was the $ 6,500 personal loan for oh um i had well it started off like small i applied a small loan um to do like various projects i thought i was going to my credit what is credit. What is a various project? Oh, so, like, I buy and sell, like, random things, and I make profit off of it.

But, anyway, I was doing a – I think I bought a car, and I was building a race car. So what do you – do you have a job now? Yeah, I do. What do you make? My yearly income is between $40,000 and $60,000, but it ranges. It could be $31,000 a year. It could be $60,000 the other year, but I don't always know. All right.

Let me tell you what I'm hearing, okay? And then you can do with that what you will. What we know is that debt consolidation loans, which is what you're wanting to use a student loan for, 88% of the time, that's 9 out of 10 times if someone takes out a debt consolidation loan, they end up further in debt. And the reason is what George was saying, that you didn't change the habits that put you in debt in the first place.

Let's go down your list of debts. $10,000 worth of credit card debt. Buying crap you couldn't afford. $6,500 worth of personal loans. I buy and sell some stuff, and I make a profit. Bull crap. If you made a profit, you wouldn't have $6,500 worth of debt. You'd have $65,000 cash in the bank you're a con artist you're conning

yourself okay and i like cars ones that blow up often so everything on the list is des doing something stupid everything on your list and And so George is exactly right. And I'm not saying Des is stupid because I think you're a whole lot like me. I'm that guy, man. I like doing deals. I like trying to figure something out. I like my feet moving and trading something and buying something. We used to call it horse trading when I was a young guy because back then there might have been a horse involved.

But now there's not, right? But nowadays, anyway, the bottom line is you you just like going moving things around and you're very energetic and you're very bright and you see things and the problem with guys like you and me is we think we can out earn our stupidity yeah and you just you know everything you listed there looks like something i would have done when i was your age that's that's why i can pick on you okay i'm not picking on you. I'm picking on what you did. There's a difference.

I think you're very bright, but I think you've messed up on some wisdom issues here. And going and moving the loans so you can act like all this crap didn't happen and keep doing the same behavior, that's a nightmare, man. Don't do that. So it's time for Des to look in the mirror and go wait a minute i need to learn some lessons from every one of these debts so they never grow back and then i want to work my butt off and pay off these debts as fast as i can using the debt snowball cut up all the credit cards get on a budget work like a crazy man and let's clean this debt up get rid of that subaru let's start selling everything in sight. Let's take six jobs, and let's work our way through these debts as fast as you can.

You can do this because you're not a dumb guy. But, boy, have you done some dumb stuff. And I know that because I've done dumber stuff, and that's how I can see it. So I'm not picking on you anymore, and I'd pick on myself, or I'd pick on George because I love you, and I want you to go win, Des. That's what it amounts to but dude you can't just move the debt over there and keep on with the same stupid butt behavior you're gonna make another mess and you're gonna double the size of your mess so no you don't use a student loan for debt consolidation by the way america that ought to be illegal you and i are funding that crap because your congress are idiots

why in the world do we have a student loan program that allows something like that to even be a question because they'll happily take the idea of student loans is to go to college people and yet it's perfectly legal what he is proposing there's nothing illegal or immoral about it but for america to have this as a policy while the goobers and the white house are talking about forgiving student loan debt and this is where the student loan debt comes from you ought to have your butts kicked america because you ain't kicked your congress's butt unbelievable this is exactly what's going on so it's you know but junior deserves a great college experience dave how

they're going to pay for the water slide how we're going to pay for the subaru engine you know which is that that'll change your collegiate activity you know that you know let's what i get a degree in blown subaru that's my degree you know it's just you know so that that's the problem y'all and so des i love you man but you got to change what you've been doing and that'll fix your problem not borrow you can't borrow your way out of debt and you can't out earn your stupidity i've tried both and i did it with a lot more zeros on the end and i could tell you stories that make you cry how stupid Dave Ramsey was. And so that's the old saying, where does wisdom come from?

It comes from experience. Where does experience come from? Yeah, stupid. That's where experience comes from. It's one way to get it. Yeah, and you just don't do it again. I've done so much stupid stuff, George. My only goal is not to quit doing stupid stuff, but it's quit doing the same stupid stuff. I just don't want to do the same one. Are you finding new stupid stuff george my only goal is not to quit doing stupid stuff but it's quit doing

the same stupid stuff i just don't want to do the same are you finding new stupid stuff every year i find something new wow that's growth that is growth it's encouragement it's encouragement but yeah but it's not i'm better because i got a whole bunch of stuff i don't do anymore the stupid so that that does insulate we're all thankful because we can avoid it when you tell us. Well, it's, man, I can feel his pain. I feel it. Because that's so harsh, though, to actually look and go, oh, this is a symptom of an underlying problem. It's not really the problem. It's easier to go, oh, this next project's going to be it.

I can just make this deal happen, man. That's it. Man, that's the disease right there. Oh, man. Thanks to Austin, Ben, Zach, Andrew kelly and james in the booth i am dave ramsey that's george camel we'll be back with you before you know it in the meantime remember there's ultimately only one way to financial peace and that's to walk daily with the prince of peace christ jesus do you love a good day brand want to see the latest Ramsey show videos going viral check out your favorite moments from the Ramsey show on YouTube

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