The Ramsey Show - App - Anyone Can CHOOSE to Become Debt-Free (Hour 3)

Episode Date: March 5, 2019

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🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. You jump in, we'll talk about your life and your money. Taking the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. You jump in, we'll talk about your life and your money. It's a free call at 888-825-5225. Elizabeth starts off this hour in San Diego.

Hi, Elizabeth. How are you? Fine. How are you, Dave? Better than I deserve. What's up? My husband and I own a business that we got from his parents in 2004, and we're having a lot of trouble. My husband is my husband. We both own it, but my husband is the one who manages it. I stay home and homeschool our children. He's recently revealed to me that tells me we're in trouble.

In what way are you in trouble? You mean the business is losing money? Okay. So in 2004, his parents, who own the business, gave ownership to my husband, but they just kind of left. They had been through a lot of lawsuits due to my father-in-law's mismanagement of the company. Previous to the lawsuits, my father-in-law had taken quite a bit of money out of the business, and legally as a draw, it's like $2 million. And then because of the lawsuits, put it back into the company as a loan, which I wasn't aware of.

He also, the commercial building that this business is housed in, my husband is also paying on a loan to his father for this to total something like $30,000 a month. I knew about the loan on the building. I didn't know about this nearly $1.5 million that he's been paying to his father because he hasn't told me because he's been ashamed. And he's recently been diagnosed with PTSD because of the relationship with his parents. We're estranged from them due to verbal abuse. There's a lot more details, but I probably wouldn't do better if you just asked me questions. Do you know much about the income statement of the business?

Is it making money? Yes, it's an s corporation and so while i don't see this money our last we filed last year last time we filed a million dollars i'm sorry you broke up all i heard was last time you filed you you had a profit of a million dollars the it's an s corporation and so it comes through our taxes right and so i'm assuming and it's not that my husband keeps anything from me, I just haven't asked pointed questions because I've had no reason not to trust him, and I still do trust him. He's just been under a lot of pressure.

Well, he's been making shame-based decisions that included deceiving you, so I'm not positive I trust him. I don't think he's an evil man, but I think he's under pressure. He may not be making good decisions and you do need to get involved okay yeah so here's what i would do i think the two of you need to sit down and comb through this and get the big pieces of it on paper okay because i heard that you have a debt on a building and you have a debt from this weird shame-based loan right yeah but supposedly he

put the money back into the business so where did that money where did that money go he put it back into the business as a loan yeah but that means your husband got a check for two million dollars from his father-in-law from his father correct and where'd that money go to pay these lawsuits lawsuits that occurred in um 2003 due to his father's mismanagement so your husband was supposed to pay for the lawsuits is what you're saying this is part of the reason why he's been diagnosed with ptsd because without going into his family history essentially since his childhood he's kind of been cleaning up his parents' messes. He graduated from college and had an engineering degree, which he didn't really want. But now we're estranged, and so the messes have ended.

Agreed? The current mess is there, but there's no more future messes. Agreed? Is he going to take on any more of his parents crap no no and that's where he's he's now that's what i'm not going to that's what i mean where i am okay okay so so we all we need to do then now is analyze what income we have to clean up what mess we have okay and so if he owes them a million and a half and you have any idea what's owed on the building? $500,000 also to his father.

Okay. So $2 million gets him completely clear of this mess, and he's making a million dollars a year? So in 2011, his half-brother, his father's son, committed fraud. I know this sounds like a crazy story. I apologize. And my husband had to pay out $1.5 million. He didn't take out any loans to do it because it was their fault, the fraud that he committed with...

He worked for your husband? Yes. Okay. So your husband has fired him, obviously. No, his father... Okay. He's gone. That person's gone. Okay.'s that's that's again in the

past there's a lot of trash in the past here but going forward last year on your sub s corp you made a million dollars right i agree there's things that don't make add up and no i'm just saying for next year for the year 2019 if you made a million dollars and you have $2 million in debt, you should be able to clear it in two to three years. Agreed? Yeah, and that's what I've been asking him. He says that at any time he's owed $2.1 million in AR from people who don't, that he's constantly owed that. I think that there's probably more that's going to come out of this i agree it doesn't make total sense but what so it's time for you to get on top of it with him because if it doesn't make sense you know why because it doesn't make sense i agree

and we got a saying around here when something feels weird it's because it's weird yeah and so here's what i'm leaning on when i went went broke, my wife was in your seat. She had no idea what was going on. But she had a bad feeling about things. Actually, she's from East Tennessee. She calls it a feeling. It's a seven-syllable word, right? And what I learned was is who can find a virtuous wife for her worth is far above rubies.

The heart of her husband safely trusts her, and he will have no lack of gain. My wife has a home ec degree and has not worked outside the home in 32 years, and yet we do not make seven-figure decisions here in our $200 million company unless Sharon is involved. Now, lots of little decisions happen every day, but big crap like y'all are dealing with, you are your husband's best resource right now for bringing some common sense to all this madness. Okay, could I ask one more quick question?

Sure. I'm about to have a baby in 30 days or so. Wonderful. Thank you. My husband has put me in charge of managing the household funds, except he told me not to put anything in the stock market. I've been protecting myself and my children from this business for the past 15 years, and I'm wondering if, because as you say, bad feeling, I have a bad feeling.

You can't protect yourself from this business. You're personally liable. The only way you can protect yourself from this business is be divorced. And that's not the equation we're after here. Okay. And so the way you protect yourself from this business, and it may not be in the next 30 days, but it can be. It's stressing you out right now. I don't care.

There's nothing that says an eight-month pregnant woman doesn't have a brain. So you can sit down and look at this with your husband and comb through the big numbers and begin to understand what's going on. And he needs to get comfortable with using you as his counselor, not his dominant partner that tells him what to do, but his co-laborer. And that's what you're doing together. That's how Sharon and I do it, and it's been very profitable for us. Are high health care costs getting you down?

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If you've kind of played along and done Dave karaoke here while I'm on the air and you actually answered the question before I did in your car, and you thought, you know, I'd like to be able to help people that way. Maybe you're a CPA, a teacher, a bus driver, a nurse. I don't care what your background is. If you want to learn and have the heart to serve people, our coaching team is hosting a free information webinar this Thursday, March the 7th at noon Central Time.

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Kim is in Chicago. Hi, Kim. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? Well, I've got some questions here.

My husband and I are looking to retire in the end of June, and I'm trying to figure out how to handle some different money resources that we're going to have. How old are you? Well, I'm 62. He'll be 65. Okay, cool. And we've got the insurance worked out, so we're all set that way. How much is your nest egg? Yeah, I wish it was more, but in my 401K, I probably got about $200,000. He's got a pension that will be about 75% of what he was earning. What does he make now? He's at $110,000, and I'm at $100,000. Okay, so you have a $75,000 or $80,000 in your income.

Okay. Correct. All right, and you have $200,000 in a 401k. And what else? And then what we've, my thinking was, you know, you won't have as much debt in retirement because things will be paid off. But what we've got, we have a condo in Florida that's rental investment property. And we have a mortgage on that, but we still net probably about $20,000 a year on that, and so we'll keep that. And then we have a house that we bought in Florida that we're currently renting, but

that's the one we're going to move into. So that one I have a mortgage on. The house in Illinois is paid for. So my question was... How much is the mortgage on the house in Florida? paid for. So my question was... How much is the mortgage on the house in Florida? The balance? Mm-hmm. About $220,000.

What about the condo? The condo's about $190,000. Okay, so... But the condo's probably worth $4,000, and the house is worth about $3.25. And what's the house in Illinois worth? The house in Illinois should sell for about three and a quarter. Okay. And so my question is, what to do with the proceeds out of the house in Illinois?

Pay off the house in Florida that you're going to live in and I'd sell the condo. Okay, because, pardon me? I'd sell the condo you would why would you do that because i don't want any debt going into retirement and you can't afford to pay it off well i mean you could sell it if you had to pay it off but well assuming you can sell it if you try to sell a condo in florida when the turns down. You can't give the damn things away. Yeah, the economy is good right now. I know, right now it is.

But when stupid is stress tested, it'll catch you. So, I mean, you're sitting there with a bunch of debt acting like you don't. That's a $200,000 debt, and you don't have but $200,000 to your name after you pay off your house. So I want your home paid for for sure that you're living in, going into retirement, and all you got is $200,000 to your name. Did I miss something? I mean, you could do that. Well, I mean, I have a pension income. Yeah, it's an income, but when he dies, you don't have that income.

Well, yeah, the way it's set up, I still would. Okay, a reduced portion. Okay. Yeah. And then the condo in Florida, though, makes more money than... Assuming it's rented. Well, it's pretty much rented. It's right on the ocean.

It's vacation rental. Okay, you do whatever you want to do. I don't care. It's your life. You can do what you want to do. I'm not going into retirement with a debt. If you can figure out a way to pay off this condo, I'd keep it. But if you can't figure out a way to pay it off, I wouldn't keep it.

You don't perceive the risk that I perceive here. I think you're heading towards a wall. Annette is with us in Charlotte, Virginia. Hi, Annette. Welcome to Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Thank you for taking my call. Sure.

What's up? I had a question. We're on Baby Step 7. We've done your program, and we were debt-free in June. And my husband's getting a little bit. We've gotten some inheritance from his father, and we're getting the last little bit. And I was just wanting to see what your feeling would be if we took it. It's about $20,000, and use that toward a vacation for he and I.

You're in Baby Step 7. Your house is paid for. It is. How much is in your nest egg? We have about $300,000 in our retirement right now, and we have about $36,000 in our emergency fund. And how much is your home worth? About $450,000. Okay.

So you're almost millionaires. We're working on it. We're in our 50s, so we're late as far as investing. What's your household income? About $200. Okay. $200. I definitely would go on that vacation.

Okay. I'm just a nerd in the group. You have lived like no one else, and now you're going to live like no one else. Okay. Just wanted to make sure and see what you thought on that. Yeah. Thank you. Here's the thing, okay?

It doesn't change your future okay if it changed your future i would say no i would recommend against it but it doesn't change your future um you're making two hundred thousand dollars a year you don't have a payment in the world your house is paid for you've already got you're in your 50s you've already got 300 000 in your 401ks you're going to double that triple that in the next six years okay and that alone okay so by the time you hit 60 you're going to have over a million dollars in your 401ks and in your mutual funds you have a house that's paid for that's worth a half a million dollars and you've been making 200k if you don't do that then you've been pretty lazy and and you're not lazy, or you wouldn't be calling me from the position you're in.

Okay. So there's three things we can do with money. We can give it, we can invest it, and we can enjoy it. And you ought to always be willing to do all three. All right. Enjoy. I feel like we're headed for a vacation. Where are you going?

We're probably going to Europe. We like to do the river cruises. Oh, that'll be fun. $20,000 worth of that's first class. We're looking at two weeks, at least two weeks. You're going to step on it and go get the big suite. Good for you. Enjoy.

That's fun. That's a fun trip. Open phones at 888-825-5225. I like taking those calls occasionally just to put it in some of your faces that think that Dave Ramsey is synonymous with cheap. I'm cheap so that I don't have to be cheap. I want you to live like no one else so later you can go on vacation like no one else. I can guarantee you Sharon freaking Ramsey goes on first-class vacations,

and she's earned every penny of it putting up with me for 37 years. And you know what? And some of you don't think I ought to spend that money. You know what? It's not in your dadgum business. It's my money. God didn't give it to you to manage. He gave it to me to manage.

And part of what my Heavenly Father wants me to do is enjoy. Part of it is He wants me to think about legacy in the future. And part of it is He wants me to be outlandishly generous. Outrageously generous. And I'll guarantee you, I do all three with gusto. Invest in joy and generosity. And they're all in the scriptures. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. We'll be right back. Calling from Syracuse, New York, debt-free. Chris and Courtney are with us.

Hey, guys, how are you? Great. Great, how are you? Well, better than I deserve, and congratulations. How much have you guys paid off? A little over $108,000. Wow. How long did this take? About 26 months.

Good for you. And your range of income during that time? Went from about $125,000 to $140,000 combined. Cool. What do you guys do for a living? I'm an athletic trainer at a small private school up here. And I'm a project manager for the Department of Defense. Awesome very cool. So what kind of debt was the $108,000? Well we had quite a bit of student loan debt close to about $70,000 and we racked up because we both had our undergraduate and our master's degrees. So that took up the majority of it.

And then we had about $12,500 in credit card debt. We also included our vehicles. We had a roof loan in there. We had borrowed against our retirement to pay off debt previously. So just some medical bills, kind of a hodgepodge of everything. You guys were normal. Pretty much, yeah. You had a little bit of everything.

Wow. How long have you guys been married? Ten years. Okay, cool. Very cool. Good for you. So how old are you in your early 30s? I'm 37. I'm 34. Okay, old are you in your early 30s? I'm 37.

I'm 34. Okay. Just perfect guess. All right. Good. So what happened eight years into your marriage, 26 months ago? Yeah. So I was actually home, and every month we paid the bills, and we looked at mainly the

student loans, and we said to ourselves, you know, when these things are paid off, we're going to feel rich. We're going to feel like we had a huge raise. And we kept saying that month after month. And then we checked and see, hey, there's 10 years left and that seems so far away. I'm sitting at home one day and I see this YouTube video pop up of this guy I watch. He's a homesteader out in Oregon and he's doing a response video to a viewer and he's talking about giving some advice to this guy. And he says that, you know, one of the things that holds most people back

from doing the things we want to do in our life is finances. And I told his story about how they got themselves out of debt and, you know, made their life the way they wanted it, and it just really inspired me to Google Dave Ramsey and find out what that was all about, and that kind of sent us our way, and I was all in Courtney's grill about getting on board after that. Whoa, very cool. So he mentioned us, or he just got you excited about getting out of debt,

and then you found us? Yeah, he specifically mentioned you. I guess his wife ended up, as part of their book club, they read one of your books, and that's what got them started on the path. Okay. That's fun. Okay, cool. And so that got you going, and then you came home and told Courtney,

and he said, okay, we're going to speed this up. Yep. Courtney, what did you say? Well, he shows me the video. He's real excited. I'm like, oh, that's great and all, but I don't really care to homestead. But, you know, mostly focusing on our debt. And it was, you know, you're always in the mindset of,

I just make a little bit more money. If I could just get a raise, if I could get a promotion, then I can, you know, we'll pay this debt off. And rather than focusing on the behavior. So I was definitely a little hesitant at first. We had separate bank accounts when we first started it, and we would, you know, transfer money back and forth for daycare or for mortgage. And, you know, so after when we started it, we read your book,

The Total Money Makeover, together, and then we combined, you know, our bank accounts. That's really when I think we made the progress and we were able to you know take a look and say okay where is three thousand dollars going it's unaccounted for um so that kind of wakes you up doesn't it it's like wow absolutely yeah because i mean you guys averaged over fifty thousand dollars a year for two years yes that's pretty incredible. I mean, you've been on beans and rice. You really have not done anything. A lot of peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, yeah.

I bet. I bet. How's it feel? Feels great. It's amazing. You know, you look at when we first started, our toaster actually broke. And so I'm like, I love toast. And there's no money in budget to buy a toaster actually broke. And so I'm like, I love toast. And there's no money in the budget to buy a toaster.

So I got down to our community maker, and I would make, you know, the toast on the community maker. And I felt like that was such a huge accomplishment when we had a little extra money and, you know, we purchased that toaster. But now seeing how we can make strides and, you know, take a vacation as a family, which we would have never been able to do before without using a credit card. Yeah, absolutely incredible.

Well done, well done. Love it. Well, congratulations, you guys. We're proud of you. Very good job. Very good job. Who were your biggest cheerleaders? I think, you know, we were each other's biggest cheerleaders. You know, we shared our

story, our family and everything, and they thought it was kind of interesting what we were doing. You know, some of them showed some interest, some of them were like, that seems crazy. So I think we really just pushed each other and were pretty intrinsically motivated to get this thing done. Yeah, well done. Very well done. What's the secret to getting out of debt? You know, I watch your debt-free streams all the time, and all the interest people give are great. You know, the budget is obviously an essential tool, but for me, it's just the why and the desire to do it. You can have all the tools in the world, but if you don't choose to use them, you're not going to get anywhere. What was your why? I think, for me, just the kids and being able to provide the best life we can for them,

be able to do the things we want to do. You know, if things for us change on the road and we want to change a job or something, we don't want to feel hamstrung by our situation to not be able to make a change for something that's better for the family. Yeah, so change your family trees, your big why. Sure. Good job. Well done. Well, we've got a copy of Chris Hogan's number one bestseller, Everyday Millionaires,

how anyone can become a millionaire. You are on track to do that. You're going to be there before you know it. You guys have learned to control money. You've learned to work together. You've learned to sacrifice for a greater good. When you do those things, you can definitely win at almost anything and certainly wealth building is one of those things so very very well done you guys all right it's chris and

courtney in syracuse new york 108 000 paid off in 26 months making 125 to 140 count it down let's hear a debt-free scream. Please, share my life with me. The kids are involved in the scream. This is how it should be done. Well done, you guys. Very, very well done. We're proud of you.

Open phones here at 888-825-5225. Folks, some people put off filing their taxes because they're scared of what will happen if they owe money. They hadn't planned for it. They don't have the cash. And it's kind of like this monster in the closet. This is a really bad reason to procrastinate. You need to get on it. You need to find out what you owe, if you owe.

And the sooner you do, the more time you're going to have to save up and be ready to pay it by April 15th. And even if you don't have the money to pay it, you need to file your taxes on time. There's a failure to file penalty that is in addition to the failure to pay penalty. So even if you don't pay it, even if you don't have the money, you need to get it done and get it paid or get it done and get it filed. So quit stressing about taxes. The only tax advisors who understand the baby steps and the journey that you're on are at DaveRamsey.com slash tax advisor, our tax ELPs.

So go to DaveRamsey.com. Look at the front page. Over on the right-hand side is a list of our ELPs, and there's one for tax pros. And you need a tax pro in your corner, particularly this time of year, to get your taxes filed. People who use a tax pro pay, on average, $800 less in taxes than people who use software and do it themselves. If you're stressed, if you're confused, or if you're prideful and think you're a tax expert,

in any of those cases, you need a tax pro in your corner. This is the Dave Ramsey show. Thank you. Our scripture of the day, Psalm 139, 23 and 24. Search me, God, and know my heart. Test me and know my anxious thoughts. See if there is any offensive way in me and lead me in the way everlasting. Susan Taylor said, thoughts have power. Thoughts are energy. And you can make your world or break it by your own thinking. Andrea is with us in Denver.

Hey, Andrea, welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's up? I have kind of a long question, but I'll try to keep it brief. My husband and I were just looking for some guidance on how to have him sit down and talk with his mom about two different single-stock accounts.

One was given to him by his uncle when he was about five or six, and then the other one was given to him by his grandpa. And they're managed out of two different states, so two different companies. And his mom is the trustee on one one and the other one is in Atma. We're getting ready to start our baby step four in two weeks, and we're really, we'd like to have all of those accounts together. And then we're also afraid about one of them, the state, because it's managed so poorly. The state took his sister's that was also given to her because they were not receiving statements.

So the state took it, liquidated it, and now she's having to go through lawyers because the company doesn't manage it very well. Now, his mom will not budge, and I don't think she thinks that we are competent to manage it ourselves. And so we were wanting some guidance on how he can sit down and talk with her about that. Okay. What's his mother's problem? Is she a control freak? That's part of it.

So my husband has a baby of four, and they were all given stock, and a couple of the older siblings squandered theirs on, you know, vehicles and substances. So how much money is in this account? So one is at $50,000, and the other one is at $15,000. Okay, and which one is the UTMA? The UTMA is the $50,000, and that's the one that is managed by CompuShare out of Utah. Okay, and UTMA, no one has control of except your husband.

It's a Uniform Transfer to Minors Act, and And when he turned 21 it was his money No one has any say over that whatsoever Does he have the account number? He does, yeah Well contact them and move the money Okay And tell your mother that's what you did Because you're like a grown butt man

Right How old is your husband? He's 30 Well it's time he be a a grown-up man then. Right, so we've tried to have this conversation with her before. I don't need to have a conversation with her. I'm just going to move the money. Okay.

If I can have a conversation with her, I'll try. But she does not have control over an UTMA. That's the danger of an UTMA. It's a Uniform Transfer to Minors Act. When you turn 21, it's your money. The custodian has no place in this anymore. All he needs to do is notify

them that he's above 21 years old, and he is taking his money out of his account and moving it to another of his accounts. That's how that works. Now, the trust is a different issue. It's got $15,000 in it, and I don't know what the terms of the trust are. What's the terms of the trust are. Okay.

What's the terms of the trust? I have no idea, and that's another problem is that we cannot seem to find anybody that has any of the paperwork. Yeah, okay. And that's the $50,000 one. Yeah. Oh, that's the $50,000. I thought you said the UTMA was $50,000. The UTMA is $15,000. Oh, I misunderstood the 50. I thought you said the UTMA was 50. The UTMA is 15.

Oh, I misunderstood. I apologize. Okay. Well, I probably would sit on the UTMA then until I address the trust. Is your husband willing to sever the relationship with his mother in order to get his money? No, I think she means well. I didn't ask that. I asked if your husband is willing to sever the relationship with his mother in order to get his money. She's an incompetent control freak boob. That's who you've just outlined for me. And she's not someone that's going to go down without fighting.

But she's convinced of her own superiority of everyone else. Am I missing something? No. Okay. This is not going to go well. Right. You're not going to walk in there. I don't have a magic pill you can make mom swallow and make her sweet.

She is not sweet. She means well, but she's completely out of bounds. She's psycho. And so you're going to have to, if he sits down with her and challenges her on anything, it's not going to go well, is it? Right. There's no sweet words. There's no amount of appreciation or gratitude or assurance of your competency that you can give this woman,

that she's going to go suddenly, oh, yeah, you're right. I'm just going to give you the money. I should have done that three years ago. I'm sorry, I didn't even think about it. That conversation's not going to occur, is it? Probably not. Yeah. So then you've got to decide what you're going to do.

And it's okay with me if you walk away with the money in the name of the relationship. What do you guys make a year? What's your household income? So with overtime, he makes $83,000, and I stay home with our kids. Okay. Are you willing to go forward and just forget that this money exists? We consider that. At this point, I feel like we're already on that boat.

Okay. The only thing that was really scaring us was the fact that, like I said, one of his sisters still has her shares. It's not anything to do with his sister. It's got to do with him. His sister's not involved in this conversation. His sister's got her own problems. Right. The two of you need to decide, are you going to look $50,000 in the face

and be willing to walk away from it in order to keep this crazy woman happy? Right. And that's an okay thing if you choose to do that. But you really have probably only two options. One is that, or two is take her down. Okay. Because I don't think you're going to talk her into it, do you? No.

Okay. No, it's never worked before, so. Okay. So, I mean, if he wants to, he could go over there one more time and say, Mom, here's the situation. We're working this system. We're working a proven plan. We're almost out of debt.

We're going to use this for debt and for investing. We have a process here. We're competent. And, Mom, I'm 30 years old. It's time you turn loose of this. And, Mom, if you don't, then you need to understand that I'm never going to bring it up again, and you're going to lose it all, and that's going to be on you. And then walk away and take your $15,000 out of the UTMA the next day.

Okay. And, you know, forget the $50,000 because you're not going to get it. Or be ready to take her down. Hire an attorney and sue her butt and take the money away from her because it's not her money get the terms of the trust get control of it you're 30 years old i doubt very seriously there's any trust put together there that it can that gives her complete control until your husband is 80 i just don't believe that most of almost all of these things are done by the time you're 30 so if she wants to show you the terms of the trust or show your attorney the terms of the trust,

but you're going to, you know, you're going to spend 10 or 15,000 bucks getting this 50, and you're going to lose mom in the process. And that's okay if you want to do that. She might not be worth keeping around. I don't know. And I'm not being sarcastic because this woman's nuts. I'm not sure I want her around, but I do not like her after talking to you. So you guys got to have a decision on this.

But I just, there's not every, you want to be nice. You want to convince people with rational thought that I do too, but you can't convince crazy people with rational thought. It doesn't work. You can't have a conversation with someone like this. So he can try and i would take one last stab at it with the idea that at the end of that conversation i'm going to have already made up my mind i'm either going to say hands off it's all on you i'm not going to

talk about it again go the next morning get your 15 000 out let her be pissed about that but she'll get over it and never bring up the 50 or hire an attorney and take it from her and decide which one you want to do after the conversation. But take one last stab at the conversation and pray about it. Maybe God will send a spirit of favor into the conversation. I sure hope so. But the person you're describing is not someone who is reasonable. And so I don't think you're going to get a reasonable reaction.

I think she thinks she's the god of this trust. And I don't think it's going to work. I'm sorry. I wish I could give you more encouragement, but there's not any. That puts this hour of the Dave Ramsey Show on the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there is ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.

Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Dave Ramsey Show. If you would like to do your debt-free scream live on the show, make sure you visit DaveRamsey.com slash show and register. We would love for you to come to Nashville and tell Dave your story.