The Ramsey Show - App - Are Tipping Screens Emotional Blackmail? (Hour 1)

Episode Date: May 11, 2023

George Kamel & Dr. John Delony answer your questions and discuss: "Should I move back in with my parents to go to school?" Tipping screens on self-checkout machines, "How can I earn passive income while pursuing a career in the arts?" Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Join a Personality-led FPU class. Click here! Enter The Ramsey Cash Giveaway for a chance at $3,000! https://bit.ly/TRSgvwy Shop our bestsellers during the $10 Sale! https://bit.ly/TRS10Sale Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3cEP4n6 Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 Interested in advertising on The Ramsey Show? https://ter.li/s64ye3 Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Девочка-пай Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Pod's moving and storage studio, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm Ramsey personality, George Campbell, joined this hour by the Dr. John Deloney. And we're here to help you take that right next step with your life, with your money, with your mental health, with your relationships, with the boundaries,

with your mother-in-law, all of it right here on The Ramsey Show. Let's do this thing. The number to call is 888-825-5225. Michael joins us in Orlando, Florida to kick off this hour. Michael, welcome to the show. Hi, thank you. What's going on? Yeah, so basically the question is, should I move in back with my parents to go to school in a nutshell? Okay, what's the situation here? Are you doing it to save money for location? All of it? Yeah, definitely to save money. Location, not really, because it's basically a boot camp UX UI design, three months if it was full time. The other option would be for me to continue working what I'm doing, which is a gig economy, Uber, living out of Airbnbs with my girlfriend who works remote, doing the bootcamp part-time, which would take twice the time, but obviously I wouldn't have the emotional toll of, uh, you know, parents. Yeah. That was my question. What's living with your parents like?

Um, so actually it's better than actually living with my parents. Uh, I'll be blessed enough. It's not as bad as I think. So I'll be living with my girlfriend in Puerto Rico and their grandparents have a house, which is pretty available to ask us to live there. We did it before. But there's the issue of my mom who's been very, very verbally abusive for most of my life, which is why I've been in Florida and not Puerto Rico. Okay. I missed that a little bit. So you're thinking about either going to Puerto Rico to live with your girlfriend's grandparents' house or going to Puerto Rico to live with your mom? No, to live with my girlfriend's grandparents. Because they passed away and they gave the house to her.

So where do your parents come into play? Well, really having to have their funding as well. I would have to work for my dad after the boot camp every day. And yeah, just having to face them on a daily basis or almost daily basis. Okay, but let's back that thing up. So you started the call by asking, should you live with your parents to go to college? Now you're saying, should I live with my... That's what the lady told me to say to you as a question, because the question was a

bit more loaded. Yeah. Well, yeah, the whole thing sounds like a mess. Is this full-time, this school? Yeah, it's full-time if I let my dad fund it 40 hours a week, yes. And it's in person? No, it's online, completely remote. So you can live anywhere?

Technically, yes. But if my dad is funding it, I haven't asked him, but I would assume he would want me to be here. What would it take for you to cash flow this and do this on your terms? Because it sounds like right now there's a lot of handcuffs and red tape and strings attached. Right. For me to do it on my terms, it would have to do part-time,

so 20 hours a week boot camp. I don't believe you. I don't believe you. Here's why. I did two PhDs and a master's degree working on a full-time job. Probably my full-time job was probably 55 hours a week,

maybe 60. No, yeah, yeah. I didn't get there. I was saying that the boot camp is part-time, but I'll be working on a full-time job. What job are you going to be doing? I'm waiting to get the results for Amazon delivery driver position, but I also just finished an interview for a remote job as a customer success specialist. I'm waiting

for round two. There's two more rounds waiting. So I have those two things lined up kind of. So there's either a full-time option or a part-time program and the part-time is going to take six months and the full-time is going to take six months, and the full-time is going to take three months? Correct. Do the part-time. Do the part-time and grow up. Listen, the chaos and complexity that you're going to run into, whether it's living in your girlfriend's grandparent's house

and he gave it to her, but she, that mess, or going home to verbally abusive parents that you're gonna have to work to and i'm gonna have to depend on them like dude don't i don't know why you enter into any of that chaos when for six months you're gonna have the same thing and you're gonna have six months of full-time work experience as well to go on top of this credential that you're going to get. Correct. Yeah. Three months, man. 90 days.

Look at it as if there's no other option other than Michael's got to figure this out for himself. He's got to figure out how he's going to survive, live, work, go to school. And if you do it that way, you're going to get real creative real fast. Right. And that's what I've been doing for now. But I just, I think I've let the voices of my parents get infiltrated and I feel like I'm starting to doubt, which is why I'm in this call right now.

No, yeah. Dude, they've been... How old are you? I'm 27. They have been running your life for long enough. Yeah. And they've been dragging you around their life long enough. Fair?

Right. 100% fair. Let's cut the cord, man. They're fair. Let's cut the cord. Yeah, let's do it it might mean it takes you twice as long to get through school it might mean you work twice as much as you wanted to

but it also means you get to do this your way right and that gives me great peace for everybody listening if you were telling me hey I'm going to Texas A&M University and my mom and dad have a fourth room in their house at College Station,

and I can help with my younger brother who's got special needs, and I'm also going to work part-time. Should I go home? Absolutely. You've got a great relationship with mom and dad. Take it for sure. This is a situation where I don't believe that you'll finish in three months living in this toxic, nonsensical mess.

I don't think you'll get done. Okay. I think you will be about four inches taller, and you'll be able to bench press, not as much as George, but you'll be able to bench press a little bit more. And you will be able to walk into an interview with a credential, six months of full-time work experience, and a straight back. You see what I'm saying? Right. And no resentment or any sort of... None.

Yeah. That's right. Yeah, that's the move I'd make, man. Thanks for the call. Man, there's so much there, John, underneath the surface of the question, which is, hey, I could save money, I can have school funded, but there's so much happening underneath that surface that worries me. And so many people out there back themselves into a corner where they go, well, it's either this or this, and they're both toxic situations, but this is my life.

Instead of going, there's option C. It's almost never either or. Almost never. Sometimes it actually is. And it's scary. And like when you get medical diagnostics and stuff, there's either ors, right? But man, when it comes to, I'm 27 years old and I want to get a credential, I got to do this or this. No, you don't. No, you don't. You could work full time for one year and pay cash. There's a million different options here, right? And if he gets a job as an Amazon delivery driver and he loves it, maybe he didn't even go to this program, but whatever. All I have to say is, dude, when you feel yourself either this program, but whatever. All I have to say is, dude, when you feel yourself either or'd, backed into a corner, it's always good to call

and get some wisdom. And especially if you're 27 and single, now's the time you're going to look back and go, remember when I was working 50, 60 hours a week while in school? That was crazy. Because there's going to be a time when you got kids and you have other responsibilities and you're landlocked. It's going to be harder to do these things. Yeah. And he mentioned something. I think it's important. Every extra variable creates more chaos. So, hey, I want to move from my home in Florida to Puerto Rico, live in my girlfriend's grandparent's house. That's three extra variables, dude, that you don't need, right? Don't create chaos

in an already complex situation. Go for the easiest path, even if it's not the most comfortable. Michael, hang on the line. I want to send you our pal Ken Coleman's book From Paycheck to Purpose to help walk you

through this entire process and give you some hope. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, you guys. Health insurance costs are only moving one way, and that way isn't down. And if higher costs aren't enough, the wait times to see your doctor are longer, and it's harder than ever to get anything approved through the bureaucracy. So if you feel like the system is working against you, try a biblically-based alternative to health insurance, Christian Healthcare Ministries. CHM is a health cost-sharing ministry that's helped hundreds of thousands of

families like yours take care of over $11 billion in medical bills since 1981. And CHM has also helped them stay true to their values and avoid miles of red tape. And CHM support goes far beyond meeting financial needs. They'll also help meet spiritual needs. Members become part of a family who will pray with them and for them when they experience a medical event. So listen, y'all, there's no better way to take care of health care costs. CHM programs start as low as $98 a month. So learn more today and join at chministries.org slash budget. That's chministries.org slash budget. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ramsey personality George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney this hour. And we're taking your calls about money, mental health, relationships, you name it, at 888-825-5225.

Hey, can I just say that was fantastic. Thank you. I had my volume turned down, so I didn't hear the music coming in. And all of a sudden, I heard you just talking, and I thought, wow, George is losing it. He's losing it. And then I realized I thought, wow, George is losing it. He's losing it, and then I realized, oh, no, he's a professional. No, we're just live on the air,

on radio, podcast, YouTube, you name it, John. Get with the times. Evidently, you have to turn the volume up. All right. So, John, I have a bone to pick with you, and it involves an article that I received, and I want to get your take on it

because Rachel Cruz and I have covered this issue on Smart Money Happy Hour, and it went gangbusters, and it's all about- But a bone to pick with me is like, I did something. Have I done something? I feel like you're going to try to be a hero on this one.

That's my thinking. Let's do it. Let's do it. So we did an episode called Guilt Tipping, how to deal with an absurd tipping culture. And it was the tip of the iceberg. Because now, John, according to Wall Street Journal, tipping has come for self-serve checkout. So you and the machine, and the machine says, money please. This is wild. So prompts to leave 20% of self-checkout machines at airports, stadiums, cookie shops, cafes across the country are rankling consumers already inundated by the proliferation of tip screens.

How many $10 words could this author fit in here? It is the Wall Street Journal. And here's the crazy part. Business owners say the automated queues can significantly increase gratuities and boost staff pay. You know what else could boost staff pay? Paying them more? Not cheap bosses and leaders. Oh man. And here's a quote from a senior at American University in DC. They're cutting labor costs by doing self-checkout. So what's the point of asking for a tip and where is it going? And tipping researchers, I didn't know that was a job, and labor advocates say so-called tip creep is a way for employers to put the onus for the employee to pay on to consumers rather than raising wages themselves.

Companies say tips are an optional thanks for a job well done. This is exhausting. Yeah. So as you were talking, I, man, I went from hemorrhoids to, I think I've got some kind of lung disorder. Oh no. Yeah. My body's falling apart as I listen to this. Dysentery? There's two parts to this george one is i love i love what it says here it says that the businesses are taking advantage of an opportunity they are that's their job that's what businesses do they take advantage of opportunities right they see a glitch in the matrix and they're like let's make some money fine i think it is unethical to put the onus of paying your employees on the,

in addition to the product or service that somebody's just purchased, to put that on the purchaser. That's insane. Be a grown-up and pay your employees what they're worth. If you think they've done a job well done, pay them for it. Don't be like, well, I don't know, man. The second thing is, is I don't lose a second of sleep over this crap

because they can do whatever they want. It's on me. And we have a culture that is so sad when somebody makes them feel a certain way, they're making me feel sad at the kiosk. Well, then that's on you, dude. If the kiosk that you have gone and got your own water and put it on a self-checkout and it asks you for a tip

and that makes you sad, that's not the business's fault. That's your fault. You need to go to counseling and get friends. And also, don't tweet about it. Just don't do it. And if you stop doing it, it will go away. We have a culture that's so insane. But if you don't tweet about it, did it even happen?

I don't see. That's just bad philosophy, right? But I'm just not going to lose a second of sleep. You're going to love this description. A 26-year-old who works in PR in New York City said the prompt in general is a bit of emotional blackmail. Oh, my gosh. Now, I for sure.

That feels over the top. This segment is brought to you by preparation H because I have atomic hemorrhoids. Now it is not emotional blackmail. It's a business trying to get more money from you. All you have to do a 26 year old who works in public relations in New York city is be an adult. Hey,

jumping in John, do you, how do you feel about with people when a person tip returns the screen around and then they ask for a tip? Does that feel more emotional? It does. It's awkward. It's awkward.

It doesn't make me feel like emotional blackmail. It just feels awkward because I'm not giving you 38% tip, right? Now, if it's like my barber or something, that's fine. But yes, if I have to look at some 17-year-old and have this exchange like, I'm sorry that your boss doesn't pay you very well and they're trying to guilt me into giving you more or just to automate me giving you more, fine. But I don't feel guilty about it.

It's not emotional blackmail. Is it awkward? Yeah, it can be awkward. But I'm going to do what I think is right in the situation and move on. By the way, one of the biggest disagreements my wife and I have is I over-tip. So I'm always over-tipping.

What this is doing for me is it's making me reconsider. Going the other way. Correct. Well, I don't think that forced gratuity is any kind of generosity. It's not generosity. It's not gratuity. It's a cost, right? So either raise the cost of your chicken sandwich by 25 uh and pay your employees what they're actually worth

or um move on yeah well i have no shame i go to the custom tip amount and i do 0.00 enter while making direct eye contact it's a flex john it's a flex it is kind of i can't stand they turn around like i was just gonna ask you a few questions like you don't know what the questions are exactly you know good and well james does that make you feel sad and uncomfortable james is always sad i'm glad you brought up the question thing because it is they act like like they don't know what questions it's gonna ask awkward for them we don't know right exactly that's like um calling your wife and saying hey i'm gonna be four hours late getting home for our date and she'll be like i'll have a few questions for you when you get home

and you're driving like i wonder what they are you know what they are you know what they are oh well thank you for that is exactly how i thought it would go john poorly thank you that was fun so why did you think i was trying to be a hero because last time we did this you're like i always over tip which again you use that line i do but i don't do it on demand i do it because i want to be a person of generosity. When it becomes a demand or when it becomes like a... It loses the joy of giving. Yeah, dude. That's good.

It becomes a payment, and I'm not going to buy a $40 chicken sandwich. We're not falling for it. We're hitting zero. All right, let's get to the calls. William is in Orlando. William, welcome to the show. Good afternoon, gentlemen. How are you doing? What's going on?

Doing great. I just had a question. I wanted to know, is it smarter for me to just pay off, well, me and my wife, to pay off our student loan debt on our own? Or I am a school teacher, and I did hear about the public service forgiveness as a teacher, and I just kind of wanted your expertise on that. How much do you owe? I owe $31,000, and my wife only owes $5,000. How much money do you guys have in the bank?

Saved at the moment probably around $10,000, and as a teacher I make around $30,000, $35,000. Okay, so how long would it take for you guys to take $9,000 out of your savings and then use future income to pay this thing off? How many years? Two? Max? I personally believe it can happen in two. Yeah, less than two.

What's this public student loan forgiveness program going to take, 10? Possibly, yeah. I need to be a teacher for 10 years for half of it to get wiped out oh my gosh so you're gonna wait a decade to hope that half gets wiped out or we can guarantee our own destiny and go this thing's gone in less than two years and we never look back and I can choose to work where I want to work I can choose my own destiny without having to worry about this thing dangling these golden handcuffs how How old are you, William? 28, sir.

28. So think about 10 years ago. That was pre-Biden and pre-Trump. You couldn't smoke, drink, or vote. Remember how great the world was back then? In 10 years, you know what the world's going to look like? No idea. Yes, sir.

I'd pay these loans off. And by the way, I've been a teacher. My wife's been a teacher. I know that it's hard when you look at those that when you get done paying into your union dues and you get done paying into your legal stuff and you get done paying into your teacher retirement, what's left is sometimes paltry. It can be scary. I get that. I know that. I've lived that. And you put your name on a contract that you told somebody, hey, if you help me get through school, I'll pay you back. And so for me, this is just me, there's an integrity thing. Did I know what I was signing when I was 18? No. Did I run up six

figures? Yes. And I did sign my name on a piece of paper, said, I'll pay you back. And that's the way my wife and I chose to deal with it. And on top of that, go just look at the data on this thing. People who applied and people who got it. It was a half percent. Now it's at like a whopping 1% because they made it so much better. Those odds are terrible. And so I'm taking control, man. If you want more on this, go watch our documentary, Borrowed Future, where we talk about this issue. We talk about what to do

and how we can overcome this crisis. But you'll be there, man, in no time. I had 36 grand. I paid it off in less than two years. And you can do the same. Rooting for you. This is The Ramsey Show. And if you haven't heard,

we're doing something around here that we have never done before. Right now, all of the Ramsey personalities are leading Financial Peace University, including me, and I want you to join my virtual class. You can do it from anywhere across the country. Join my class. It's not a competition, John. It's 1,000% a competition, America, and Jade and Rachel are killing us. That's true. That's why it's not a competition, John. I'm going to win. It's 1,000% a competition, America. And Jade and Rachel are killing us. That's true.

That's why it's not a competition because they're smoking us. There's nothing we can do about it. I disagree. I'll never say never. We're pre-Fontaine. Pick one of our classes. So John is leading a Financial Peace University class. His starts earlier than mine.

Mine starts June 20th. You know when yours starts? That's kind of a flex. It's the latest one. Mine starts in a few weeks. Is yours in the evening or during the lunch hour? Mine is during lunch hour. Mine is too. Great. So if you want financial freedom and peace

sooner rather than later, join my class. There's the pitch. If you want one month of just reckless spending before you got to shut it down, you should probably join George's. Now that would be fun. Yes. Alright, well here's the deal. You're going to learn everything about how to handle money, how to pay off debt, how to build wealth in Financial Peace University. And we're going to be your personal cheerleaders through the class. And

you're going to have a community of thousands of others taking the class with you and encouraging you too. And we're doing all nine lessons in about four or five weeks. So we're going to meet twice a week for about five weeks. And we're going to knock this thing out just in time for you guys to finish out your summer, have a great fall, and change the way you handle money. The turnaround on this stuff is amazing. People who go through Financial Peace University, they save thousands of dollars, they pay off thousands of dollars, and it's worth every penny you pay for. So the classes are starting to fill up. Grab your spot right now at fpu.com. That's fpu.com, and sign up for either John or I's class. We'll keep it classy. See what I did there? Man, that's a good way to end a conversation.

We're just going to keep it classy. Keep it classy, John. Because I was trying to, you know, to rise above it. Take the high road, if you will. That's not one of my gifts. I like to get right in the middle of it. I'm not much of a fighter these days. I don't have it in me. Let's get to the calls. Andrew joins us up next in Kansas City. Andrew, welcome to the show. What's going on with you? Yes. Hi. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. So I wanted to, in a nutshell, to ask, how does one pursue an artistic career while trying to find ways to make passive income? Oh, so there's two opposing things happening here, two opposing goals. Why passive income? Well, currently, the job that I perform right now is not what I would call high paying, and I wanted to find ways to make passive income.

And my ultimate goal, you could say desire, would be to get into the creative arts. What does that mean when you say creative arts? I'm thinking either acting or writing. Okay. So you want to be an actor slash writer and you need money right now until you have that career dialed in. Is that right? Yes. Because yeah, it's, you know, it's a subjective field and you're only as good as other people

think you are. So that's not true. That's actually not true at all. You're as good as you are talented. Now, whether they hire you or not is a different thing they might hire you me and george can both be exceptional actors but if they're looking for somebody who's dashing and handsome and clearly intelligent looking they're going to go with george if they want somebody that looks a little bit uh rough around the edges they

might go with me and so that heading into a job in the creative arts already saying, well, I can't do anything about it. It's just going to be subjective. That's not true. Everybody can sit there. It's going to be really tough. Yes. Now, is it going to be a hard road to hoe to make a living doing those two things? A hundred percent.

That's not subjectivity. That's just the nature of the market. And you throw chat GPT and all that. It's a wild time to be a writer. It's a wild time to be a writer. It's a wild time to be an actor, right? Even the old days of residuals, those are largely gone. And you're just gig to gig to gig. It's a tough life.

And for those people that George and I know that do this for a living, they love every second of it. Well, most of the seconds of it, right? So don't go into it already sour or you won't. You've got to go into it with optimism and joy. And this has to be something that you have to do. Otherwise, it's going to be a tough, tough slog, man. Right. It just already feels like there's so much stacked against you if you're not already in it. Correct. You don't have your foot in the door. It's going to be really hard regardless. But here's the thing. This idea that I'm going to use passive income as like a launch ramp to this career is the wrong path because you're seeking out a shortcut that doesn't even exist. Passive income is a myth. We've just all been watching too much TikTok and Instagram. If we think we're just going to get all

this mailbox money that's going to float our dream jobs, it doesn't work. And so what I would do if I were you is find something that you can sink your teeth into full-time that pays more while we get acting gigs on the side and start to work on our writing chops and start to submit those and get into acting and writing groups and improv classes and meet people and interact. That's the only path that I've ever seen actually work. So let me walk you through a couple of things just so you get the other side of this, okay? George and I aren't actors. We do act like we're friends, and we're not. But other than that, we're not actors.

But we are on stages. We are in front of video cameras. We're all recording, doing scripts, all that all day long. We both write. So I remember walking out of the building one day before what I would call a casual shoot the following day with Dave and a couple other personalities. Dave Ramsey and a couple of other personalities

who were world-class speakers, been doing this for a decade or so, were on the stage mumbling to themselves, holding a script. They were practicing. They've been on stages of six, seven, 10,000 people, and they were going to do a small event in front of a couple hundred, and they were up

there practicing. Also, George and I both write. We both say, hey, would you read this for me? Hey, we need to check something out. We have editors that we work with. Sometimes we join a writer's group that's just based on studying humor so we can be funnier and be more engaging. It's a constant practice, and we're already employed. This is already our job. Some of the greatest actors I know, they took waiter jobs and they practiced different accents with different tables and they would write a small script and memorize it themselves and go use it with the particular person at the table. They were constantly working on their craft. They were not just sitting around waiting for the craft to come to them because it won't.

Writers write all the stinking time. They write blogs and they write letters and they write journal entries and they write chapters. That's just what they do because that's who they are. If you talk to writers, that's their identity. That's what they do. And so you can't wait for it, man. You got to go get it. And like George said, if you get a job driving, practice your acting, practice monologues, practice ideas, and talk them into a voice recorder while you're driving, and then type them out at 4.30 in the morning the next morning. That's how you make it.

Get a full-time gig, and then in the evening time um go try to get commercials in your local area i mean it's it is hard hard everybody wants to be an actor it's a fun life man everybody wants to be on stage it's a fun life it's a grueling hard one too see what i'm saying like george i love that you said that the whole i just want to get that passive income thing where they just mail you money like that happened during covid and and it's not going to happen again. Right. Yeah. Okay, so we're ruining your dreams here, man.

What are you thinking here? Well, so I'm thinking that I have an agent, and I started writing some short stories that I just don't know if they're any good or if people would even want to read them. Get a writer's group. My wife has a writer want to read them. Get a writer's group. My wife has a writer's group. I've got a writer's group.

I've got people on the side that read my stuff. Yeah, get a writer's group, man. They'll tell you. So I guess my follow-up question would be, for someone who is almost middle-aged and who hasn't had many wins in their professional slash personal life, what do you say to someone like that who wants to achieve something, but they just feel like they may never do it?

How old are you? They may never reach it. I'm 37. Who told you it was too late for you? That's just kind of how I've... But if someone at some point said, oh, dude, it's too late. You're 37.

You'll never make it. No, not that it's too late, but it's just never... But there's a lack of belief in Andrew and a lack of confidence. You said, no, my work's not great. I don't think I can even do it. There's such a lack of hope.

I started this job in my 40s. Ken Coleman started his job in his 40s. Now, we have years of work leading up to these jobs where we both were writers. He was doing radio stuff. He was doing interviewing. I was doing public speaking all over the place. But we didn't start this job until we were in our 40s. It's never too late.

It's never, ever, ever too late. I'm going to hook you up with some resources. Number one is Ken Coleman's book, The Proximity Principle, to get you connected with others in this field and from paycheck to purpose to give you some hope that you will get there. And I hope you call us back and let us know how it went, man. Thanks for the call. Hey, if you're a new listener of The Ramsey Show and you want to dive deeper into the baby steps, some of the lingo we throw out here, baby step 3B, gazelle intensity, go to ramsaysolutions.com and click on the Get Started button. It's totally free. We're going to help you figure out the next

best step for where you're at in your financial journey today. Go to ramsaysolutions.com and click on Get Started. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney this hour. It's a free call at 888-825-5225. And Jay joins us up next in Chicago. Jay, welcome to the show. What's up? Hi, thank you for accepting my call. Sure. What's going on? So my question is, I was wondering if it is too late to negotiate a medical collection that I already started paying for?

Okay, so this is already in collections. So you weren't paying on it for a while, collections bought it. What's left on the debt? So it started at like $3,200 and now it's down to $2,300. Do you have an agreement with them of how much you're paying each month? So the thing is I first got that medical bill when I was like around 19 or 20, and I'm 25 now, so the memory of like how that all got set up is pretty faint now, and I haven't like paid the debt in about two years.

Okay, so you haven't touched the thing in 24 months. But before then, you were kind of chipping away at it. Yeah, I was paying a little bit at a time on it, yes. Have they contacted you in the last two years? Maybe not more than how many times I could count on one hand. So it sounds like they've kind of given up on this debt. I suppose. No!

But here's the thing. The longer it's been, the more chance you have of negotiating, I don't think they're just going to wipe it out. It's not going to disappear if you put your head in the sand. So you have to deal with this. But what you can do is call them and say, Hey, I'm sorry. I know it's been years.

I'm ready to be done with this thing. Here's what I got. I got $500. Would you take that and call the debt good? Oh, so I have a story about this. So I did send an email about it, which they have a response, so I had to call them. And they did acknowledge that they did receive the email, but they said because of who the creditor was, they weren't allowed to negotiate due to the fact of who the creditor is. I've never heard that. Who's the creditor?

I've never heard it either, but when I called the creditor, like, it was true. Okay. Well, either way, you got to pay this thing. If they're not willing to negotiate, I still want it out of my life because it's been looming in yours for a long, long time. Did you get some medical care done? What did you have done? So, I was in college at the time when I had to go to the hospital for this problem.

It was some bowel issues and crazy. It cost $3,200 to get that resolved. Yeah, that's all I had done. I just went to go get that checked out. So can I flip this around and put this in both of your hands at the same time is that cool sure you're not going to like me but that's okay is that cool like we still be friends

go for it just going to a local ER or a dock on the box in the corner it can be outrageously expensive outrageous insanely expensive especially um if you're a college student and you don't have any other alternatives right and if we go back to when you were 18 19 or 20 you were really sick and you walked in a place and you said will you help me and they said yeah we. And was it expensive?

Yes. Was it worth what they gave you? I don't know. Who knows? I don't even know what the procedure was and I don't really want to know, but there's something to be said for, hey, when I needed help, y'all were there. I'll pay my bill. And now I'm 25, I'm 26. This thing's been hanging around forever. It's time for me to just be an adult and say, thank you. Even though I think what you charged me was 10 times what you actually did. Maybe they gave you a high five and a lollipop and said, go get them kid. And then they charged you 3,200 bucks, right? Who knows what they did, but there's something to be said for, I went and utilized a service. It helped. I'm better. I'm going to pay my bill, even though I don't agree with it. I'm going to be wise and informed moving forward,

but let's just pay this thing and get out of our life. You're going to have a soul tax. You're going to make yourself nuts calling these folks, emailing them, waiting for the response, getting them to call you back, because their job is to tell you no forever and ever and ever. Amen. Just pay the bill and move on with your life.

That's my recommendation. That's what I would do. Do you have the money? Much as that would hurt. I can do it, but the thing is, like, I just really don't want to, especially if there's options. Let's pretend there's no option and you pay what you were billed. Do you have the money?

Yes. Okay. And some more. Where are you at financially right now? Do you have any other debt? Just student loans, and that's it. I pay all my bills on time. Good for you.

What's your income? I'm sorry? What's your income now? Right now, it's about, just for now, it's about maybe $3,500, $3,600 a year. Okay. And you've got more than $2,300 in the bank? Yes. You can give it one last college try, but if they say

no, just say, all right, I'm ready to pay this thing in full and get everything in writing. Yeah, that's the two big rules. Do not, under any circumstance, give them your checking account number because they're going to say, just give us your number and we'll direct deposit it or we'll direct draft it. Do not do that. And make sure you get a read receipt in writing. So I would get a money order, go down to a post office, your local bank, get a money order, and I would mail this with a read receipt on it so that you've got proof that they received this thing. And then you're home free. And you might sit at home and be like, man, I can't believe it.

You are free. You're finally done with this stuff. Thank you for the call, Jay. I appreciate it. All right, let's take one more this hour from Nilesh right here locally in Nashville, Tennessee. Nilesh, welcome to the show. Hey, how are you guys? Thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's going on with you?

So I am 26 years old. I currently work in HR for a company here in Nashville, Um, and I make 55,000 a year. Um, currently have 35,000 in student loan debt. Uh, I recently got into a doctorate program for pharmacy school and for four years, tuition will come up to roughly around 175. What school, what school did you get into? Lipscomb. Excellent. And so my question is, do I pursue a doctorate program with the hopeful outcome of a better salary and better future lifestyle, but will make me go into at most $200,000 in student loan debt, or do I stay where I'm at? Like, I guess like for me, I know what my dreams are. I know what my goals are, but then also looking at the real life,

financial, practical side of things I have to make, I have to consider, um, am I just digging myself into a deeper hole or do I pursue these goals that I've had? I'll let George talk through the math part of it. Here's what I want to tell you. You and I are both here in Nashville. Lipscomb's program is excellent. Belmont's program is world-class. Those are great pharmacy programs, and there's probably several other programs around here. The world needs better pharmacists who are informed,

who aren't just pill pushers, who teach people at the counter and care about their patients and clients. We need them, okay? And you cannot afford this. It's $175,000, right? And so I want, I have friends and colleagues at both of those schools, incredible opportunities, and you can't afford it,

man. I think we need to see what the other options are. And that might mean we wait, we pay off our student loan debt, we start to stack up some cash, we get scholarships, maybe you're married by then, we have dual income, and we start to be able to cash flow this thing. But right now, going $200,000 into debt debt and on the other side, hoping we make enough to pay the bills and get by and one day pay the student loans off, you're just trading for another burden. And the tuition is $175,000, but you have living costs for three to four years. You've got eating costs. You've got all sorts of other things that add up and students coming out with pharmacy degrees 250 300 350 in the hole is not an anomaly that's not a weird thing that happens it's rather common i'd love to see you crank this that 30 000 student loan debt out you only make it 55 and so i get

things are tight especially here in nashville i mean it's an expensive place to live it may be that jumping to this next thing four years from now isn't the right move right to the second. And by the way, my mom graduated from her PhD at 57. You have plenty of time, my brother. Plenty of time. Just do it the right way. Do it the right way and don't hinge your entire life on one thing. Yeah.

This doesn't mean your life is over. If you put pause on this thing to do it the right way, move slow, do it when you have the cash, you'll walk into that pharmacy program with a lot more peace. Yes, hey, stay on the line. We're going to send you our friend's, Anthony O'Neill's book, Debt-Free Degree,

and he'll help you get there, my friend. Good call. That puts this hour of The Ramsey Show in the books. Hey, George Camel here. If you love the show and you want a deeper dive on your money journey, we've got a weekly newsletter that gives you helpful articles and tips on following the Ramsey way. Just go to ramsesolutions.com today to sign up for the newsletter. Again, that's ramsesolutions.com to sign up for our weekly newsletter.