The Ramsey Show - App - Avoid Going Overboard With Gazelle Intensity (Hour 2)

Episode Date: March 20, 2024

Девочка-пай Live from the Ramsey headquarters in Franklin, Tennessee, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people with their money questions, with questions about doing work that they love, and their life in relationships. I'm John Deloney, joined by my good friend Rachel Cruz, and we're taking your calls on just about anything. Give us a buzz at 888-825-5225.

It's 888-825-5225. If we don't know an answer, we will make one up. Let's go out to Sacramento, California and talk to Austin. Hey, Austin, what's up? Hey, how's it going, guys? Thanks for taking my call. You bet, man. We're, Austin, what's up? Hey, how's it going guys? Thanks for taking my call. You bet man. We're partying. What's up? So a little bit newer to the Dave

Ramsey show and I've been listening to the podcast the last couple of days. So just a lot has kind of come out. So welcome to the cult, my friend. We're glad you're here. We're glad you're here. Thank you. So what's up? So I have about $90,000 in student loan debt. Um, just a little bit of out-of-state tuition being irresponsible. And I'm currently getting my MBA right now too. And I'm a little more than halfway through. Um, I also have a car loan that has about 12,000 left on it and the value is about 16,000 or so. I don't have any credit cards anymore. Got rid of all the credit card debt and credit cards. Um, I have about $16,000 or so. I don't have any credit cards anymore. I got rid of all the credit card debt and credit cards. I have about $18,000 saved up right now as an emergency fund with about $10,000 of it in a high-yield savings account and the other in my checking and savings.

I also have 10% going to my high-yield savings every month just to save up for tuition so I don't have to add to the student loans of course um and then I also have my 401k it does up to a four percent match I'm contributing 10 right now so my question is this one to start should I keep putting money in my 401k right now either the 10 the four percent just to get the match or none and then the second part of that question is if i get aggressive i can probably pay off my car and i think nine months to a year or so when there's about two and a half years left on it um but if i were to pay on my student loans right now while i'm in school it would go directly towards the principal so which one should i go after what are you doing yeah and then i do have a little yeah what do you do for work uh consulting management consulting okay how much are you making uh base is 84 okay um what are you in school for uh getting my mba

and you have two years left of that correct uh next spring so a little less than a year okay good okay and you're and you're able to cash flow the rest of that like as you look out you won't be taking on more debt for that yeah if i if i save the 10 it'll cover about half of that so i can pull out of my emergency fund and do it um yeah just looking at the the baby steps i you know i have yeah so rachel's gonna walk the step two rachel's gonna walk you through this brother but here's what i want to say yeah you are a driven smart guy and so we are we are totally team austin here's what i'm seeing from a 30 000 foot view you're in it there's bullets flying there's smoke everywhere you're in it every day you are trying to do everything all at the same time and you're slowly leaking money

everywhere and so you're not so like you are paddling so hard the way you are paddling is so admirable but you're not getting anywhere because there's water coming in all over the place does that make sense yeah okay so rachel's going to outline it for you but you're going to have to make some short-term sacrifices to get where you want to get and when you get there it's going to be much better up on arrival okay guys so you have one quick wrinkle to add to it okay uh my fiance inherited some money and she offered to no no no no don do that okay okay don't do that if you take her to the courthouse this weekend and get married then it's y'all's money but until then don't take her money don't take one penny of it okay all right all right yeah got it i don't

want to do that anyway okay so you owe 12 on the car but it's worth 16 sell it tomorrow okay here's what i would do austin if i woke up in your shoes because that's always kind of how we frame this scenario if i woke up in your shoes tomorrow i would take maybe two to three thousand out of the emergency funds and that leaves me with fifteen thousand and i would add that three thousand to the four thousand that you'll get when you sell your car. And I would go get like an $8,000, $9,000 car and I would pay cash for it and be done with that debt completely. Like you're done so. Okay. So then you're done. Then you're down to $15,000 left in your emergency fund. I would pause investing completely. And my next focus would be to do anything I could to save up 100% to pay and finish out your MBA.

That would be my next goal. And then once you are completely out of school, all is good. Then I would start attacking the $90,000 in student loans. Because, yeah, while it would go to the principal, which would be, that's great, obviously. But you don't owe it, obviously, until after graduation. And so I almost just, I would just, my number one sole focus would be to get my MBA without taking on any more debt.

And then once you're out of school, do you think you guys will get married soon after? And I'm not asking because of the inheritance, I'm just asking in general. Like, will you guys? Yeah, we have a date for next year, next year, March. Oh, awesome. Okay.

So right before you graduate, you'll be married? Yes. And how much does she make a year? It's a little variable. She left her corporate job. She is doing life coaching. So the low end this year will be 50. The high end will be like 150.

But she hasn't made 150 though yet, right? She's made 50. No. Okay. Yeah. But the hope is that, yeah, that it's a little bit more than that. Okay. So you guys will be on the conservative end because you said your base was 84.

That's a base. So I'm like, once you graduate everything, I mean, y'all could be, I mean, close to 200 together. Yeah. Right. I'm like 150-ish, but I mean, it'all could be, I mean, close to 200 together. Yeah. Right. I'm like 150 ish, but I mean, it'll climb. Hopefully your opportunities so much. So you guys could knock out.

And then with that, with her inheritance, all of that, knock out that 90. So, I mean, yeah, within that year. You're debt free in 18 months. Yeah. Does she, will she have any debt coming into the marriage? No, she, she's had her car for 17 years and never had a credit card okay wow all right so get out of debt and get her a car in 18 months okay okay but but you see but the order is important right because you're you're

the debt that's just kind of like just biting your toes on the car is then leaning, and you're going to make a choice about, well, then I got to pay this, and so then I'm going to go ahead and take out another student loan just for MBA, but then I'm going to pay the principal over here, and you're just zigzagging back and forth. You're like a punt returner that's running all over the field. You're just not making any forward progress. Yeah, get north and south.

That's right. Go downhill. So let's knock the car out. Done. And honey, guess what? I'm buying a $9,000 car. That's how much I love you. And she's going to say, I have this inheritance check. Can I just buy you a nice car? And you could say, nope. And by the way, she's

going to respect you more in the long run. That you're like, no, no, no. I dug a hole. I'm going to get this thing cleaned up. And then we're going to go to school debt-free. We're going to knock that out. And then we're going to just crush the rest of it. And we're going to be good to go. Yeah. We're going to knock that out. And then we're going to just crush the rest of it. And we're going to be good to go. Yeah. How old are you guys? Okay. I'm 30. She's 33. Okay. Okay. So great. Because I'm like, I mean, seriously, Austin, by the time,

gosh, you guys are, you know, 30, 36. Yeah. I'm like, you're going to have two cars. You'll, by that point, replace cars, be debt-free, killing it when it comes to your jobs and your careers. And by the, I mean, and then you'll be putting money towards retirement after that. I mean, it's just amazing. You guys really will make so much progress, but it's just one thing at a time. And I want you to feel some of that sacrifice now, but make it the goal to finish out the MBA with just cash. And yeah, you guys are killing it. Great job, Austin. Hey, you guys, health insurance costs are only moving one way, and that way isn't down. And if higher costs aren't enough, the wait times to see your doctor are longer,

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makeover weekend, May 10th and 11th. All right, let's go out to Indianapolis, Indiana and talk to Keely. What's up, Keely? Hey, thanks for taking my call i was calling my husband is obsessed going debt free but he won't take one step at a time how do i get him to take one step at a time oh my gosh what do you mean what does that mean yeah what's happening um so he if we have about 65 000 in consumer debt and he just thinks it's possible for us to get it done in just a few months. And it's just not realistic for us. No. Have y'all sat down and made like a plan on paper?

We have, we have. We sat down, we started doing budgets, making some cuts that we needed to do. And it's still, the $65,000 isn't even what we make half a year. So where does he get these numbers from? He just sees all this debt and he just, they start running in his mind. They're just, they're flying at him. Okay, so what is he doing, though, like, in reality? Yeah, is he, like, in reality that yeah is he like selling stuff and you're like whoa that's our couch don't sell our couch like what's he doing yeah so that's kind of

the thing he he's willing to sell it all he's willing for us to sleep on an air mattress at this point yeah um yeah so but we have been selling things he picked up a side job i mean we're we're doing the work towards it but yeah we haven't even done step one he skipped step one so the emergency fund we'll get to it later he's like i gotta get rid of these credit card debts so i gotta get them now oh my gosh i so appreciate his enthusiasm okay so how much do you guys make a year keely um about 115 000 okay and you have 65. Is that what you said? In debt? In consumer debt. Yep. In consumer debt. Okay. $65,000. And so you'll have no money saved right now. Like not even $1,000. We have right at $700. Okay. So yes, he needs to bump that up to $1,000.

Yep. And then what is, and so again, being specific on your end, because you're calling us saying he's obsessed with it. What do I, is it, is it, is it that because you never see him? Is it because it's all he talks about? Is it like, what's, what's, what's annoying you? He, that's all he talks about. He's not sleeping at night. Just the conversations.

We can't have a conversation about our kids even the evenings without him being like well there's money signs already flying out the window okay all right so here's here's what i think is important is he a guy that gets this way about a thing and it goes away in three months or is this is this a new husband for you uh this is a total new husband okay so he didn't like when Little League was going to start the first year, he's like, we're going to crush you. He's not that guy? No, I mean, he's been the type to always check his bank

account to see where he's standing with his money, but never to this extent. We're checking it a thousand times a day. So he's just, his body flipped a switch and it's game on, but it's like atomic game on. It is, yes. I'm afraid he's going to start running

and he's going to be that guy who picks up the fumble and runs the wrong way into the wrong end zone. Yeah, so I think it's a total mindset shift in your household and there is a level of momentum that he's actually probably feeling with his money for the first time ever yeah um and i don't know this is so stereotypical but the way we've usually like talked when it comes to men and women with money for women a lot of people and this has been through research that our number one fear is security and yeah and if the money is not good i don't feel

safe right like there's that deep feeling for a guy it can be a sense of like you know we've heard we've said like a scorecard or like there's a sense of safety but also shame yes i put my family in this hole and i'm getting us out today yeah so there's like a motivator that he has keely that you may not have right there's something in him that suddenly the light has turned on and he sees a way out and it is like he's not stopping so what I would want you guys to do is to be in agreement that you may Keely for a hot second just smile and nod as he talks about the debt all the time and the budget all the time and you just say okay okay but but your life choices and how your family's set up

you guys need to be in agreement on because it is not fair for you to say yes the school you know the kids i have to make lunches for school and here's the budget for the groceries it's like nope gotta spend only 20 this month and you're like no no like literally that's not realistic so like he has to have reality you are gonna you know a part of me is like i don't know good for him you know? And I'll tell you, I am somebody who gets overly zealous about a thing. Okay. And I'm going to tell you, here's how my wife has kept us married. Is when I get overzealous about a thing,

she will sit down and she'll say, Hey, every conversation is becoming about X, Y, or Z. You get one or you get three. And it's kind of, it's a joke and she's one or you get three. And it's kind of, it's a joke and she's never held me to it. And if you know her, she's funny like this,

but she'll say, you get one, John. Right. I'm going to listen to one new thing about some new weird nutrition hack. I'm going to listen to one thing about some new doctor. Yeah. Cold, like one more thing about ice baths. One, you get one a day, right? And so here's what I would love to see. How long have y'all been just, how long has he just been Tasmanian devil about this? Since December. Okay, so here's what I would love you to do. I would love you to take, set up and say, honey, I want to take you on a walking date

because we're not going to spend any money, but we're going to go to a park or something like that. Or we're going to go get coffee and look at like that. Or we're going to go get coffee and look at him and say, we're spending $9 on coffee. And here's what I want you to do. I want you to take a spreadsheet or a plan or your budget

or whatever it is and tell him, I'm so proud of you for being a part of this change. But I also feel like I'm losing my husband. I need my husband back. Okay. And if you can communicate to him in whatever language y'all use,

not an accusatory, but in the same way he feels panicky and shameful about the whole, he quote unquote, Doug for his family that he's so insane to get out of. I want you to communicate that same fear that you're losing your husband. And we're going to make a plan. We're going to make a budget. We're going to communicate that same fear that you're losing your husband. And we're going to make a plan. We're going to make a budget. We're going to stick to it. We're going to use the EveryDollar app. Do y'all have EveryDollar? We do not yet.

Okay. It's going to be my gift to you. I'm going to give you the premium version for a year. Okay? Thank you. All right. So y'all are going to use that together, but that way he doesn't have to check the banking accounts 24-7, 365. Any expenses will just pop up on the app. Okay. And y'all pop up on the app. Okay. And y'all will be in partnership together. And you can tell them with a smile on your face, you get one. We'll talk about the debt snowball or money once a day. Okay. Okay.

But we have to learn to live in a rhythm now. And we have a map here and the map says it's going to take us 23 months to pay this off. Talking about it a whole bunch every day does not accelerate that 23 months. Maybe you're getting a second job or a third job. Maybe that will. Or if there's a raise at work and a bonus, I shake your hand that that's going to the debt. We dump it all on that. We just did that.

Both of us just took that step. Awesome. But the kids still get to play soccer this summer, and the kids still get to go to church camp, et cetera. Just build it into the budget. Perfect. Yes. Yes. All right. Hey, he's lucky to have you. He's lucky to have, we'll be right back. Welcome back to the Ramsey show. 888-825-5225. Taking your calls on money, life, work, all of it. Let's go out to Austin, Texas to the 512 and talk to Jacob.

Hey, Jacob, what's up? Hey, guys. How are y'all today? Fantastic. Brother, what's up? Well, I've got a few questions for you and I hope you could provide some clarity here. I've got a few brokerage accounts, one of which being a crypto account, totaling to about $50,000. The question is, should I allocate that towards a $48,000 vehicle loan as well as chip away at $200,000 in student loans? Woo, $200,000. What was your degree in?

Yes. That was my wife's anesthesia degree is the vast majority of that. Okay, $200,000. What was your degree in? Yes. That was my wife's anesthesia degree is the vast majority of that. Okay, okay. And how... I'm not going to tell you to get student loans, but that's pretty good. What does she make in a year?

She makes $209,000 and I make about $100,000. So we're just shy of $310,000. Perfect. Okay. Well, that's the good news of all of this. What kind of car is this? It is a Chevy Tahoe. Okay. Awesome.

And is that the debt, just that? Student loans. Student loans? In addition would be a mortgage. Okay. We purchased a home in October. Okay. How much do you guys owe on that?

$320,000. Okay. Okay. How much do you guys owe on that? $320,000. Okay. Yes. So I would, when you cash that out, there may be some taxes implications there, but the rest, yeah, I would throw, pay that off. Exactly. And then I would just, yeah, lower lifestyle and yeah, get this $200,000, the student loans knocked out.

I mean, if you guys could live on a hundred thousand, this could be gone in 12 months. Yeah. Sure. And we've been, we have another vehicle as well that we actually just paid off yesterday. Oh, good. Congrats.

Congrats. That's awesome. Can I tell you if it was me, I'd probably sell the Tahoe. What does the Tahoe, it's a, it's an amazing car. I love them. It's been one of my dream cars for a long time. Does it have any sentimental value or could you get rid of it? And I know you're going to roll your eyes, but could you just like Camry this thing for a minute and get all this stuff out, get all this debt cleaned up?

It's certainly a possibility. We purchased it about three months ago. Okay. What's it worth now? Our family has grown. I would have to assume roughly the same. We don't drive terribly much. So I would assume 50 or so.

How big is your family? We just had our second daughter a few months ago. My parents raised all three of us in a Camry, hashtag just saying. But I know the world's different now. But I'm so proud of you guys. Y'all make killer money and y'all didn't go bananas with your house. And that tells me that y'all are really wise.

And so, man, that wisdom, if you take that wisdom and just say, I know that we make $300,000, but if we live like we just make $ so, man, that wisdom, if you take that wisdom and just say, I know that we make $300,000, but if we live like we just make a hundred, we can change the entire trajectory of our family. Think about just having that. You make 300 grand, you have no payments except for your mortgage. You can knock your mortgage out real quick. And you're talking about y'all are going to be stupid wealthy. You see what I'm saying? Sure.

Y'all could get out in front of this thing really quick with just a year of hard sacrifice. And by the way, not hard sacrifice. You know what I mean. But living well below your means, y'all could really turn the tide on this sucker. Okay. Okay. So just so I'm clear, you'd advise to sell everything in crypto uh as well as the brokerage accounts there's also a ten thousand dollar loss ira that uh don't touch that yeah

leave that one yeah leave that one yeah yeah yeah anything that's that doesn't have the penalty that doesn't have like if it's a retirement account leave it alone yeah but i if i'm in my house if i had fifty thousand dollars in a brokerage account with crypto in it i would that would be gone before the day's over. Okay. And John would sell the car. I would sell the car. I honestly am on the fence with it.

I'll just be a little bit on that. It has nothing to do with your salary to car income ratio. It's just getting out of debt as quick as possible. I would be more haunted by the debt than I would be by a smaller car. Yep. Sure. And then would you still advise maintaining, if I'm not mistaken, baby step two of a thousand dollar emergency fund? Right now,

we have $5,000 in that savings account. So would we whittle that down another four to get to the one? Yes. Yep. And just throw that, anything extra you guys have at that 200 and let that dude and i know it will haunt you it'll drive you it'll drive you crazy let that be the gas um that dumps on the fire that y'all just say honey can we do this in one one calendar year okay can we just be bananas for one calendar year oh i'm willing to drive a camry or a corolla not a corolla that's probably too small for everybody but i i'll drive i'll sell the tahoe if we can just knock this thing out. And let's put all the money towards this. Can we take extra shifts?

Whatever it's going to take, let's just do this real quick. Yeah, and realistically, Jacob, if that's the route you guys take, you'll take that $4,000 and put it towards another car, right? Because you'll be selling the Tahoe. If you sell the Tahoe, then, oh yeah, but then you have the $50,000 in the brokerage account that you can take some.

Yeah, take some out of that, too. Okay. And then I also have another paid-for vehicle. So I don't know if that would have any merit in this conversation. So you have a third car or just two? No, sir. The one you just paid off? Yeah, that's fine.

I would just keep it. Yeah, keep that car. Yeah. The one you just paid off. Yeah, that's fine. I would just keep it. Yeah, keep that car. Unless it's a $75,000 car and you think, well, man, we could sell it, buy two Camrys and take that 50 grand. Now we're dealing with 150 grand in student loans instead of 200,000. No, it's just a Silverado. It's a $35,000, $40,000 vehicle. Yeah, you got to keep your truck, dude.

Oh my God. Don't go too far. Geez. Geez. He's a Texas male. It's part of Oh, my God. Don't go too far. Geez. Geez. He's a Texas male. It's part of the... These men. It's in our DNA.

It's in our DNA, you know? Oh, man. Yeah, I don't want to be totally unreasonable, Jacob. Sell her Tahoe. You keep your truck, dude. Oh, my gosh. Of course, yeah. She can be the worst case scenario.

Yeah. I'm out of this call. I'll hang out with your wife. Yeah, Rachel. Rachel, she's not buying any of this. No, quite honestly, I'm going to be I'll hang out with your wife Rachel's not buying any of this no quite honestly I'm going to be a martyr on this one I would keep my wife's Tahoe and I'd sell my truck and

but whatever y'all decide to do you don't have to sell either of the vehicles it's just going to accelerate everything just think of it this way the faster you get out of debt the faster y'all can go about start going to restaurants again you can get that emergency fund built up where you can breathe, where she can breathe, where you don't have to worry about kids falling down and needing stitches, which they're going to need. All that

stuff, you just begin to build peace into your home and you can start building peace after you quit running for your life. And y'all are just running for your life right now because you got 250 grand clawing at you. 200 like a a car company and a student loan company are telling you two what y'all are going to do with your lives tomorrow right yeah i feel like somebody else's asset that's exactly right you're working for them right now making them wealthy and y'all have worked too hard y'all are too smart you're too accomplished to let somebody else get wealthy off of your hard work. Okay. Well, thank you guys so much for your time. And I can't thank you enough.

Yeah, man, I'm proud of you, man. Congratulations. That's awesome. Yeah, it's funny doing the show with different personalities because you get different levels of like what you'll do, like what George will do, what Jade would do. It is so great. So yeah, back to that though, not to not to confuse anyone it is when we talk about

cars if you can pay it off in 18 months and or it's less than in cars in total is less than half of your annual income then you know that's all good but to john's point when you're in this and especially making choices yeah it's 250 000 staring you. And when you can take some of that and say, my gosh, this percentage could leave right now, this percent, this, this, by these radical choices of selling cars, doing stuff,

that's where you see progress. It really is. Yeah, and again, I'm so haunted. You've been around me when I'm not well, when I'm kind of just out of my mind. I hate owing people money. And so if I sit down

and my wife and I like put it all on paper and in 12 months, if we live radical, we could do this. It almost baby step twos it again for me. Like I'm going to burn a hole through my mortgage. I'm going to burn all this stuff out. And so if it, if man, if it is a matter of me driving a Tahoe or a Camry and we're we don't owe anybody 12 months 12 yes shoot that car is going it's gone yeah right it's out of here totally if it's going to be two years three years Tahoe's a sweet ride it's a sweet ride that's fair all right hey this is the Ramsey show 888-825-5225 i'm john deloney joined by rachel cruz taking your calls on life and money everything you got going on hey listen if you're like me you see the congress spending

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We're super grateful for you. Send episodes to your friends. Doesn't cost anything. And you can really change the country from the inside out. Let's go out to Charles right down the street in Franklin, Tennessee. What's up, Chuck? Hi, guys. I have a life insurance question. Bring it, man. All right. I'm 60 and my wife is 50 and we have two adult children.

We have 800,000 on my life and 250,000 on my wife's life. And they're both in term policies that cost us about $530 a month. I'm wondering if we need that much life insurance now that our children are grown up and our net worth is about 2 million, but that includes our primary residence and we have no debt. How much do you guys have in just cash or retirement or retirement accounts, actual money, not assets in a house? In retirement accounts and 401k combined, we have $560,000. Amazing. Well done. Yeah, so there gets to a point, yes, Charles, where you do become self-insured.

And so it really is running out the math for you guys to say if something were to happen to you or to her and that income is not coming in, where does that leave us? So for you, how much do you make a year? I make $125,000 a year. She makes $78,000. And she makes $78,000. Okay. And she's 50. Is that right? Yes, she's 50. Okay. So yes, I mean, I would for you, I mean, you're in a really great spot. I mean, almost to that point. And so I would just run out those numbers for you guys. I would sit down and say, okay, if something happened to her, would you be okay on 120 for however much longer you want to work or you need to work in order to be fine, which you're going to be, you have a paid for house and

$560,000 in retirement, right? So you're going to be fine. That 560 every seven years will double. Right. That's right. And so you're- I'm not planning That 560, every seven years will double. Right. That's right. I'm not planning to retire until I'm 70 as well. Okay, so at 67, that's 1.1. Right. Right.

And what, 74, it's 2.2. And that's just in your, I mean, you'll be withdrawing from that, obviously. But how much longer are you insured under your policy? You've got to be getting close to the end there, right? Yeah, another 11 years on my policy. Okay, that's a little bit longer than I thought. So you bought that sucker early, huh? Yeah, I did.

I've always been kind of afraid of dying, and I did have a heart attack a year and a half ago. But I set these things up when my children were young. So let me ask you another weird question. Sure. I call it peace of mind tax. I pay for certain things in my life simply because it helps me sleep at night.

Right. And I don't mind paying five bucks a month or 10 bucks a month on several different things because it helps me sleep. Right. Can you afford this payment? Yeah, we can. We're maximizing our retirement accounts with money left over,

so we can still afford this if we want to keep doing it. That's my question for you is if you just had a health scare, you have this thing, and you have no payments, y'all are making upwards of $200,000 a year. If it's me, I'm just speaking honest truth here. Forget the math. The fact that I know that my wife would get almost a million dollars

if I were to go and I got real close to the edge just a year and a half ago, I'd pay that money. I'd pay that money every month until they quit letting me do it okay but again that's not a math problem that is a I want to sleep knowing that that woman that I've dedicated my life to

is going to be able to do nothing if she doesn't want to she's going to be able to do whatever she wants and or needs to do in the event that I go right so that's not a math problem but that's just me that's right and and i and i'll say it too because again we can go the math side charles and i think you guys you guys will be fine i think you'll run out the numbers and realize we'll be good but winston and i we could be self-insured and it's exactly what you're saying john and. And we still have life insurance. We have term life. Because I'm like, we're young and we're healthy.

It's inexpensive. And we use Xander insurance. They always, we always get a great rate. And it's like, why not? Why would we not? And so that's, yeah. So if we're speaking truthfully, that's what I'm doing in real life.

But again, mathematically charged, if you both are really secure and you're like, Mal, we don't really have that. We're fine fine if something happened and that income went away we're gonna be okay because the truth is you will be you will be you have a paid for house you got plenty in retirement you will be fine but it's just that peace of mind and maybe it's vice versa maybe you cancel hers and keep yours because maybe she's like nope charles i want so want some money in case something happens to you or maybe you say yeah money in case something happens to you. Or maybe you say, yeah, just in case something happens to her, I don't know. It may be one or the other even.

You drop one, keep one, drop both, you're fine, keep both. So yeah, it's a peace of mind play at that point because you are at this point self-insured. And here, along that same line, Rachel, just to put this out in the world, and Charles, I'm going to use your situation to just have a broader conversation. My household can only run, I can only do what I do, be on the radio all day. I do my show, I do media in between, and I do this show, and then get on the road and travel and speak, and then write books out of hotels in the middle of the night and early morning. I can only do that because my wife is incredible doing all these other tasks. So we are absolutely intertwined as a gang.

We're a team. And so if something was to happen to her, on paper, it looks like, well, all the money's coming from, or most of the money's coming from here. I would have to have some additional, I'd have to hire people to backfill the role she plays. Right. Does that make sense? Forget the connection part like just the day-to-day like she runs everything she's amazing so she's the ceo of the of the whole property of the whole place so all i have to say is um like rachel said y'all fit factor in what

would it cost to replace just the duties right someone to take care of x and y and z i don't know how y'all have it broken up in your home, but that looks different for every family. But just the reality is my salary is only possible because of the work that my wife does, right? It's a great point. Because we work together on this. So it's easy to just look at the dollar amount, but it's often a bigger ecosystem.

That's right. Totally. Yeah. And Charles, I'm so glad you called even for this question because you're a great example, Charles, for people watching or listening. Because sometimes, John, and more than not, when we talk to people about life insurance, it's on the other end of this. It's a young family with little kids and a husband dies in a car wreck

and there's no life insurance. And it's compounding the worst stress that you could ever, ever imagine. And so all of you out there, you need life insurance. If someone is dependent upon your income, you need life insurance. And so term life, exactly what Charles is saying, it's inexpensive, you guys. Obviously, the younger and healthier you are, the less expensive it is. But go to Zander, shop some rates, and it is a gift. It is a gift to give your family. When people don't have life insurance and something happens, it magnifies, I mean, it doubles down everything,

all those adjectives onto a situation where you just can't breathe. I've been to both sides and I think I've told you privately, there's a particular hollow look in the eyes of a wife whose husband has just died and she says,

I got to go to work on Monday. Like I know we don't have anything or the other scary is she looks and goes, I don't know where anything is. And I had a friend whose husband passed away and he left a significant amount of money on a life insurance policy and she got to go to counseling

and got to grieve and got to be with the kids wherever they needed to be. What a different trajectory. Absolutely. Absolutely. Life insurance. Get it, get it, get it. It's another hour in the books here on The Ramsey Show.

We will see you soon. Thank you. We'll see you next time.