The Ramsey Show - App - Becoming Debt-Free Gives You Hope for the Future (Hour 2)

Episode Date: October 10, 2019

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Mike starts us off this hour in Washington. Hi, Mike. How are you?

I'm real good. Thanks for taking my call, Dave. Sure. What's up? Dave, I'm 63 years old, retired, retired for about a year and a half. Having trouble hearing you. Can you speak directly into your phone, please? Yes. Thank you. I'm 63 years old.

I've been retired for about a year and a half. I have about a 2.8 net worth at Baby Step seven and living comfortably. My question has to do with the emergency fund. I do maintain a six-month 30K emergency fund, but I'm wondering if that's even necessary when I have the disposable income to cover any kind of unforeseen things that come up. Could you address that? No, it's not necessary.

I mean, you've got a couple hundred thousand dollars flying in, and you've got no expenses, and you've got $2.8 million. If you needed some money, you can just reach and get it out of something, right? That's exactly right, and that was my thoughts also. But trying to live with principles, and it's nice to have that cash standing by. Yeah. Now, having said that, I don't think an emergency fund is necessary, but truthfully, somebody with a $3 million net worth,

you need to keep some liquidity anyway, just because you may want to do something. I mean, you worked your whole life to get here. Way to go. That's right. Thank you very much. I appreciate that. You may want to leave $100,000 laying around

just because you want to go buy something. And I do have that also. I call it a project fund. Yeah, there you go. There you go. I mean, I do that. I've got, I just keep some liquid cash just because, just because. Because I don't ever be without, I don't ever want to be without cash again, you know.

I grew up doing a redneck emergency fund, which is $100 bill folded over, it's tucked in the back of your wallet. And that's what we called it. And so it's Redneck Emergency Fund. It's not a good one, but you've got a little bear for a rainy day if something bad happens, right? And you've got to fish that thing out back there. And it might have been wet where you dove in the pool,

or it might have been sweat where you mowed the yard with your wallet in your pocket. It might have all kinds of stuff on that $100 bill, but it's back there. And that's all this is. It's just liquidity to get your hands on in ratio to your 2.8 million so how much of your 2.8 million did you inherit uh zero well so you did it all by 63 oh that's correct um did you steal any of it uh no okay well i just heard the news that all the rich people were evil hadn't you heard the news well i've been told i'm evil but i don't think i am you didn't sound evil to me you don't even have a good evil laugh so i'm proud of you man way to go how'd you do this tell

people how to become a millionaire when they're 63. What do they need to do? Disciplined saving, living below your means, you know, just a good long-term plan and sticking with it. There's really nothing more than that. Yeah. You ought to, like, do a radio show or something. Taking advantage of 401Ks, matching, you know, and staying out of debt. How much of your net worth is in your 401K?

Or in retirement plans? Retirement plans, I've got about 1.7 or so. So over half of it. Yeah. Okay. Yes. Yes. The rest is real estate and just out of retirement investments.

And you said earlier you're baby step seven, so you're 100% debt free. That's correct. Well done, sir. Very well done. Hey, guys, you want the formula? He just gave it to you. Same formula I've been giving you every time I turn on the microphone for 30 years. This is what a millionaire sounds like.

Not real flashy. You don't get your face on the cover of Fast Company magazine. It's on the cover of Slow Company magazine. But that's okay. We want to be on the cover of Tortoise, not Hare. This is how it works. Well done, sir. Very proud of you.

Excellent job. He fits the exact case study of Chrisris hogan's book everyday millionaires number one bestseller we studied 10 000 millionaires in america and the typical millionaire in the study that guy lined it up exactly exactly and if you got a net worth of under five million dollars but over one million dollars the case study fits that just exactly now people have 200 million dollars it's a different thing usually going on but the one to five million dollars sounds exactly like that and then some of them parlay it to 200 million from there but uh you can do just fine on five million

you'll be all right you can pay your bills and put some beans on the table and and and some rice and you'll be all right. You'll be okay. If you are an everyday millionaire, we're going to do an everyday millionaire theme hour. Hogan and I are taking calls from guys and gals just like that. If you're an everyday millionaire, you don't have to have started with nothing. If you have a net worth of a million dollars, we want to talk to you. If you inherited all and you won the lottery, I don't care how you got it. We want real millionaires, not people with political agendas or theories.

I don't want to talk to your broke brother-in-law who has an opinion because he feels stuck and he's a victim. I don't need to talk to him. I know who he is already. No, I want to talk to a millionaire who has a million dollars. I want to know how you did it. Email us, and Madison or Kelly will get back to you for this millionaire theme hour that's coming up with Hogan and I. We'll put you on the air, and we want you to tell your story. We'll interview you like we always do in those millionaire theme hours. And just email me at DaveOnAir at DaveRamsey.com.

DaveOnAir at DaveRamsey.com. Dave on air at DaveRamsey.com. No spaces, no dashes. Just do it. Put Millionaire in the Theme Hour in the subject line and just tell a little bit about your story, your net worth, and we'll get back to you and set you up for the Millionaire Theme Hour. Man, this is so doable. All right.

Joanna's with us in Virginiaia hi joanna how are you hi dave thanks for taking my call sure um so i have a question why husband and i are in baby step two and um he has a student loan about seventy five thousand dollars he's in public service so after 10 years of making the minimum payment, the balance is forgiven. And I didn't know because if we stick to the snowball, we should have that paid off within the next four years. Is it better to pay that off within the four-year period or exclude that and include it with, you know, wait for 10 years out. 24,000 people have made application for their student loans to be given under that program.

Thus far, all of them were denied but 93. So it's probably better, it sounds like, to pay that off with our snowball and just not have the debt hanging over our heads. Yeah, statistically, you stand a better chance standing on the ninth green with a golf club up in your hand during a thunderstorm being struck by lightning than you do this student loan being forgiven. That's what that says. 93 out of 24,000 chance.

These are not odds you play. Nope. Nope. You pay it off. Your government has screwed you, America It's called student loans The only way you're getting out Is you're going to pay them

And quit taking them out And Anthony's book, Debt Free Degree Will show you how to not take them out anymore And all of us at Ramsey Will show you how to get them paid off That's the only way to get out There is no program And socialism is not going to work This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Let me tell you a story about two families

that are very much alike in a lot of ways. Both families have two working parents and a couple of young kids. Each has debt and a struggle to make ends meet, but they're starting to make headway with their budgets and smarter decisions with money. They have dreams and plans, and the only real difference is that one family has the right amount of term life insurance and the other doesn't. Big difference. If one of the parents die, and that does happen, their well-being would be destroyed. Paying for the mortgage, utilities, food, and other bills would be impossible, let alone saving for education or retirement. That's why every day I talk relentlessly about getting term life insurance. Just go to ZanderInsurance.com or call 800-356-4282 and see how inexpensive it really is.

Be the family that takes those deliberate steps to be different and responsible. It really does make you the hero of your story, and it puts you on course for better things ahead. Our question of the day comes from Blinds.com. They have a 100% satisfaction guarantee. It means even if you mismeasure or you pick the wrong color, they will give you new blinds to replace the screwed up ones that you screwed up for free. Who does that? Blinds.com does.

You get free samples, free shipping, the new promos they run every month. You save even more. Always use the magic word, the promo code Ramsey. Todd's in Colorado. My plan is to buy a new home with a 401k loan to cover the down payment and then sell my existing home, pay back the 401k loan and recast the new home mortgage. Both homes are worth 400k. The home I'm looking at rejects offers with a contingency,

so I'd have to carry both for at least a few months until my current home is sold. I do not have any other debts. My income is $120,000 a year. Is this something that follows the plan? No, that's stupid. Don't do that. You're going to get yourself in a mess. What happens 12 months from now when you still haven't sold your house?

Oh, well, the market's hot. Yeah, it says everybody, right? Until they call me up when they're in foreclosure because they've been carrying two mortgages and a 401k loan. No. Okay. Several things wrong here. No, you need to sell your house, and then you need to go buy a house. Oh, by the way, the home you're looking at that does not accept contingency offers,

that might be God saying, you don't need this house. By the way, there's more than one house that you could live in or move into. When you narrow everything down to one house on the planet, there's only one girl, and if I don't marry her, then the only one got away. Oh, brother. Fatalism. No.

No, it's just a stupid house, man. It's just a stupid house. There's a house on every corner in Colorado, and you can get you another house. So if you want to put yours up for sale and it sells, then you can buy the other one before it gets away. And that works out, then maybe that was God. But I can tell you what, you've got about four stupid things piled on top of each other in this little crazy plan you put together. And you've got a whole bunch of ways to trip and fall and break your face in this do not do that hope i wasn't unclear molly is with us in kentucky hey molly how are you i'm good how are you better than i deserve what's up in your world well i am

three-fourths of the way through baby step two so we're're going to be finished in June of 2020. Good for you. Thank you. It's changed my life. I am wondering though, I contacted my mortgage company and talked about a 15 year mortgage at a 3% interest rate. It's 5,000 in closing cost. We have 19 years left on our current mortgage with $77,000 remaining. And I think I can pay that off if I've done my math right. I can get that paid off in three years. Do not refinance it. Okay. $5,000 refinance cost on $77,000 asinine.

That's ridiculous. Okay. That translation, they don't want you to refinance it either. That's what they're trying to say. So what's your interest rate? It's 5.8. Woo! Can you believe that we live in a world where we think 5.8 interest on a mortgage is high?

When I got out of college, I was selling houses in fixed rates for 15.2. Yeah. But we think15.2. Yeah. But we think $5.8 is high. Now, you pay it off in three years, you will not have gotten the money back and interest saved to cover the closing costs. What's your home worth? Probably about $98,000. And you owe $77,000.

Yeah. Okay. I would just get about the business of paying it off in your baby step six, and I wouldn't worry about it. Your interest rate is not ridiculous. If you were going to keep it a long time and it was a lot of money and it would justify it, say go ahead and refinance it, but you're going to pay it off so fast that it's going to negate

any advantages of the refinance. Does that make sense? It does. Yeah. So let's just do your plan. You are on fire, kiddo. Keep it up. Rock it, rock it, rock it.

Alex is with us in Florida. Hey, Alex, how are you? Hi, Dave. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's up? I'm calling you because I just hit off my car last week. Yay.

I'm so excited. But should I call my car insurance company and have them lower my policy rate? Because I have full coverage. I've always had full coverage. Why would you not have full coverage? Well, I thought maybe after I paid off, I don't need

it anymore. Well, if you total the car, you don't have the money to replace it. No, that's true. So you need full coverage. I mean, if you've got $2 million in the bank and you don't have the money to replace it. No, that's true. So you need full coverage. I mean, if you've got $2 million in the bank and you can write a check to replace your car, that's cool, but you don't yet. You will have. No.

Because you're doing smart stuff now. Well, yeah, and I just started Baby Step 3, so I'm excited about that, too. I'm excited to see it grow. Good. So, okay, I'll keep it. Yeah, because, you know, if you need to buy a $10,000 car, you don't have an extra $10,000 laying around, right? Nope, sure don't. Yeah, so if you hit a rainstorm and spin out and total your car,

you'd be walking without full coverage. So let's keep the coverage right now. You need it. It's insuring something you're not ready to self-insure through, and so you transfer the risk, and that's what we do use insurance for so good question that's a good clarity i like that very good open phones at 888-825-5225 you jump in we'll talk about your life and your money savannah is on instagram dave i just started the baby steps so forgive me if this is a dumb question if you you're just starting, there are no dumb questions. Just don't tell me you've been doing something for listening to everything you say for 14 years and then try to do something different.

But anyway, you're not. So I just want things the right way. Good. When I have money left over in my envelopes every month, what do I do with them? Do I budget less the next month or put it onto my debt? Well, there's two kinds of envelopes that we might address this issue on. If it's your food envelope and you have money left over in your food envelope every single month, then you would budget less because you're over budgeting for food.

And you pretty well consume the food every month. If you had a restaurant envelope and you had money left over every month, then you're not spending as much on restaurants as you thought. You would bring that one down. If you had an entertainment envelope and you had money left over, you would bring that one down. A different kind of envelope is if you had a car repair envelope. Now, you might not have car repairs every month. Hopefully, you don't have car repairs every month. And so the car repair envelope starts to be kind of a little miniature car repair savings account. And so it would build up month to month to month to month to month.

Now, if you look up after a year and you got $3,000 in your car repair envelope and you're driving a $2,000 car, that's probably you've overfunded it, right? But if you put, you know, if you're putting $200 a month in your car repair envelope and you go along three months with no car repairs and then you have a $400 repair, see, that's what you'd want. You'd want that in there. It becomes a little miniature car repair savings account. You just wouldn't want to overfund it or underfund it in that case. So that type of an account would go over month to month to month. Other types of accounts that you're actually burning through in a given month will do that. So another example might be kids clothes. Some people spend all of their kids clothes money every month, but a lot of people buy clothing, you know, about once a quarter,

once every six months. And the big kids clothing is back to school, right? And so you get hit a little harder there. And so you would kind of let that one build up, build up, build up. But, again, you don't want to look up and see $3,000 in the kids' clothes envelope. That's not going to be smart. So we've got to go that way. And so good question. Now, we don't use the envelopes for everything, folks.

Envelopes are just things you spend when you are away from home. Entertainment. I used to use car gas envelope. I honestly don't now because I'm too lazy to walk in and pay cash. I just hit the debit card into the thing. But when I started this, you didn't have debit cards. And when I started this, you didn't have the ability to pay at the pump. Been doing this a long time.

So we used to walk in and pay with the car gas. I'll tell you an interesting thing about that. When I quit paying and you quit paying with cash for our gas, we quit noticing how much it was a gallon. We used to know every time it went up a quarter gallon, we'd have a little fit right there. Dance right there and, you know, a little hissy fit, right? Now now we don't even notice you can't tell me what you paid for the last gallon of gas you don't even know you don't even know what the whole tank costs because you didn't keep the receipt i saw you you left it hanging there when i came up it was still hanging there right after you so i mean we don't it's become yeah it's become very very less price sensitive

because we're not using cash to buy it. I ought to give you a clue about some of the other stuff you're spending money on. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage, Chris and Amy are with us. Hey, guys. How are you? Hi, Dave. Welcome, welcome. Where do you guys live?

Burlington, Kentucky. Cool. Welcome to Nashville. And how much have you paid off? $44,125.93. Awesomeness. How long did this take? Eight and a half months. Good for you. And your range of income during that time? Just under $100,000 during that eight and a half months. Cool. What do you guys do for a living? Well, I assemble engines, aircraft engines, and Amy is a stay-at-home mom. She works harder than I do with our seven kids. Cool.

Aircraft engine assembly. Where in Kentucky? I actually work up in Cincinnati. Oh, okay. Okay. Yep. All right. All right.

So you're just driving across the line then? Yep. Okay. I got you. All right. Cool. Well, welcome, you guys. Congratulations. So what kind of debt was the $44,000?

It was a car and some credit cards. All right. How long have you two been married? 16 years. Okay. So what happened eight months ago? Well, it actually starts earlier than that. Amy brought home a book and told me she was reading it and started talking to me about it and telling me about it. And I was intrigued, so I asked questions, and she answered them as best she could.

And so I pretty much discounted it. There's no way you can pay cash for a car. I mean, everybody knows that. Right? You can't do that. And so fast forward about nine years, and I was threatened with what felt like another job loss. And we were pregnant with our seventh baby and so I came home one day just feeling the weight and the stress of what felt to me like a job loss and I asked her I said

if we were debt-free could we make ends meet with my prior prior, could we make ends meet if we were debt free? And she said, yeah. And I said, okay. I want to do the Dave Ramsey plan. She said, well, it's about time. Who knew, right? Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

I've been patiently waiting. Right? Yeah. Okay. And so from then on, I went to work and it felt like I worked for eight and a half months straight. It felt like I stayed at work. Yeah. Took all the OT you could get.

Yes, I did. Okay. So you kicked the income way up. Yes. All right. So when I ask what the key to getting out of debt, one thing is kick the income up. Absolutely. Yeah.

Great place to go when you're broke. Tell work. Yeah. He led the truth. He actually had a record week of 96 hours in one week. Whoa! Yeah. There was a 21-day period where he worked 21 days straight for 13 to 15, 16-hour days.

Unbelievable. It was insane. Wow. And the only reason why he stopped was because I called and said we were having the baby and needed to get to the hospital. Isn't that reason right? She was born five weeks early, so he had to get there oh my goodness wow well way to go man you got after it so once you put your mind to something there's no stopping you

yeah so other than uh increasing the income with outrageous amounts of work uh what are the secrets to getting out of debt um for me it was the budget. I think that's everybody's answer. That's because it's a good answer. Right, right. It's the answer. And so with him working so much overtime, we never could tell exactly what each paycheck was going to be. So I could see his paycheck a few days before it was going to be directly deposited into the account. And so I would get on there, take our tithe out, take our budget money out, and then every penny left, I would automatically have it set to, on payday, pay the next debt that we were at.

So it was never even in our hands. Wow. Because if it was in our hands, then it would be a tempting, you know, to use it. So you were a beast on the plan, and he was a beast on the making the money. Oh, yeah. Yes. Okay. That's a good tag team.

Yeah. Very good. Very good. We also had a debt-free chain that hung in our living room. And each chain was, each link was $1,000 of our debt. And whenever we would pay one off, one of the kids got to take the link off. Okay. So the kids were all into this.

Yes. Get all seven of them or seven and a half of them on the plan. Yes. All right. So it was just a visual guide for us every day to see, you know, how far it was hanging between two windows, how far it was going up the window, and then eventually it didn't reach and we had to let it hang. And so it was just a good visual. The kids were involved.

Chris, you know, was really good for us. So do you think, obviously, you're a world-class mom. You've got a whole tribe there. How many of them of you think will actually remember this well we're hoping at least the four oldest yeah but we're hoping that and the others will hear the story yes for the rest of their lives yes just the way we live from here on out we're hoping that you know debt's not even going to be an option well rachel cruz always says more is caught than taught yes so them watching you is going to be more important than what you say.

Yeah. So good job, y'all. Thank you. Who were your biggest cheerleaders while you were doing this? My coworkers were a big part of it. Cool, really? Well, because I was pretty much around them more than I was around at home. But you were kind of living there, right?

Telling them why it was a sleeping bag. Took my sleeping bag. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's good that they were for you, though, rather than giving you a hard time. Like, man, why are you working so hard? I think he had a little bit of that.

A little bit, yeah. Yeah, especially knowing he had as many kids as he did at home. But we were willing to make the sacrifice. Well, you work like no one else later. You can work like no one else and put you in a position to do that. So very, very, very well done. Good job, you guys. Thank you.

We've got a copy of Chris Hogan's book for you, Everyday Millionaires. That is the next chapter in your story. That's where you're going to be. Yeah. And you're on your way, without a doubt. When you make $100,000 and you don't have any payments. How does that feel? Oh, it feels great.

It literally felt like an actual burden being lifted off of our shoulders and just a new hope for the future to know we're not going to be broke for the rest of our lives. With that debt, it felt like I was running a marathon with a weighted vest and a gas mask on where I couldn't breathe. But I got to run this marathon. But now I just feel so much freeing. It's easy. Take the ankle weights off.

So you brought the kiddos to do the debt-free scream with you? Yeah. I actually wanted to say one more thing, too. Okay. I wanted to personally thank you for everything that you do and the guidance that you give people with nothing, you know, not expecting anything in return. You know, we've never been through FPU. We read the Total Money Maker, but we listened to podcasts like it was our job.

And, you know, Chris, after we got out of debt, we had just had our three months saved up. Chris actually had to have an emergency appendectomy. And so he had to be off work for a month at only 60% of his pay. And before this, that would have been like a tragedy for our family to try and figure out how we were going to make ends meet. And it actually turned out to be like a mini vacation. I mean, we couldn't go anywhere because he had just had surgery, but he'd been working his tail off.

And so it was like, we get to have him home for a month. Yeah. And so it was just, you know, we're just so thankful for you. Thank you. Well, we're proud of you. You guys are heroes. Look at you. Well done.

Well done. All right. Quickly, what are their names and ages? Lydia is 14. Josie's 13. Ethan's 12. Harrison is 10. Eli is 8.

Brooklyn is 3. And Emily is 10 months. Way to go, Emily. Bringing it up. Bringing up the back of the train. I like it. Good job. Well done, you guys.

All right. $44,000 paid off in eight and a half months. Chris, Amy, and the tribe, they did it making $100,000 and working their tails off and tight budgeting. Well done. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Glory to God. Three, two, one.

We're debt-free! Woo! glory to god three two one little emily's looking around like what just happened oh that's great you guys and that is a family tree with a couple of branches, and it's completely changed. Well done, you guys. That's fabulous. Good for you. I always love having folks on with a big family like that, because occasionally I get some idiot on Twitter that goes, well, Dave Ramsey's plan doesn't work for large families. Well, what the flip does?

If our plan doesn't work for large families, what does, you idiots? I mean, really, they just did it. They just did it. Of course they can do it for large families. What does, you idiots? I mean, really. They just did it. They just did it. Of course they can do it. It works for large families. It's the only thing that works for large families is getting your finances in control. What are you going to be? Be a perpetual victim because you've got a couple kids? Come on,

people. These guys are heroes. Look at them. Look at what they just did. Absolutely amazing. Very, very, very well done. Ah, love it. Love it, love it, love it. Open phones this hour, 888-825-5225. When are you going to do your debt-free scream?

We're here. We're waiting on you. Yeah. Jump on DaveRamsey.com if you've done the journey and schedule yours. You need to schedule in advance. They're scheduled several weeks out. Make sure you do the application ahead of time. Don't just show up down here,

but we'd love to have you be part of the show. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you for being with us, America. Kelly is in Virginia. Hi, Kelly. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hello. I have a will question my husband and i do not have any kids we're in baby step number two and i'm wondering if we need to have a will yes everyone needs a will okay so what would happen you own a car uh yes but it's paid for.

Yeah, I don't care. He's going to have trouble selling that car if you die without going and getting the court's permission because you don't have a will. Gotcha. So every little detail, your checking account has both names on it. Even though there's not a huge pile of money or a bunch of detailed assets like some kind of a movie or something, it's still very difficult just to transact day-to-day business if one of you dies

and you haven't left a will giving the provision to hand everything over to the other one. Oh, okay. Yeah, and the good news is they're not very expensive. You just go to MamaBearLegalForms.com, and you can get a will there for less than $100. And they're state-specific. You always want to do a state-specific will, meaning the state you are living in when you die is where the will needs to be drawn for. Because estate law is state law. The law concerning probate, concerning when you die, is not federal law. It's individual to your state.

And some states have very, very different laws regarding estates. So you need a will that is specific to your state, and whether or not it has to be notarized, how many signatures, how many witnesses, all that kind of stuff is unique to each state. Luke is with us. Luke is in California. Hi, Luke. How are you? Hello, Dave. I'm doing well. Thanks for taking my question. My honor, sir. How can I help? So my wife and I both completed our undergrad degrees in May. We both worked through school, have no debt, and have started a baby step three in house savings after getting married and relocating to Orange County.

I'm considering going for a part-time master's in electrical engineering, which will cost $60,000 in total to complete over two, three, or four years, depending how long. My employer will subsidize $52,000, $50,000 annually, but the cost is $8,000 to $14,000 per semester. Is it worth putting off a house for the difference of the degree? It's up to you. How much will the degree increase your income? So my boss said he's really been pushing me towards it. I said it's anywhere from $8,000 to $15,000 instant increase, not including normal um whatever the adjustment is annually okay and so i think so it's got a really good roi it's got a really good roi on it at least

at your current place of employment 22 right now so i'm figuring now is the best time yeah i mean i i just i don't want you to go 30 years without buying a house but if you go a few extra years in order to get some education out of the way, the one thing I would do is how long have you been working with this guy? Just a few months? Since May. Okay. And how big a company is this?

80,000 employees. Okay. I would ask him, since he's pushing you to do it, if there's anything more they can do to help you, because they're not covering even half of this. Okay, yeah, I'll talk to him. That was another thing, too, was seeing if I could ask for that, too. Yeah, but yeah, so the bottom line is, is you've done all the work, you're debt-free,

you've got your emergency fund, and the only thing is, do we do this master's and delay saving for a house? That's the simple question, right? We don't have to go into debt for it. No, we're not going into it. You can cash flow it without a doubt, and you should cash flow it. Yeah, I think I would do this. I really do. I'm just going to try to figure out a way to get them to pay for a little more of it,

and can I do it a little faster? But there's nothing on fire here. Nothing's, you know, and it sounds like it's the type of master's degree in a field that will actually ROI for you, actually give you a return on the money you've spent, the time you've spent to get the degree. So it's probably worth doing. Hey, good question. Jeff is with us in Florida.

Hi, Jeff. How are you? Hey, Dave. Great. Thanks for taking my call, and congratulations on your new building. Thank you, sir. How can I help? I just have a quick question.

My wife and I are in, I guess, baby step six. We paid off our house, but before learning about your steps, we had bought a condo, and we got a mortgage on it. Smart enough to get at least a 15-year. We're paying aggressive on it. We have about three years left, but we're not able to use it as we anticipated. We bought it kind of as a ministry tool. We wanted to have visiting pastors for our church stay there and mission families, and the HOA has been giving us a hard time about parking passes. They're restricting the amount of parking passes we can get. So we're just unsure at this point, should we just sell it and be completely debt-free and then save up for

another piece of property, maybe not in an HOA, and pay cash for it? Or should we try and stick it out or try something else? I hate HOAs. Bonnie Fife is always in charge somebody who needs to get a life somebody needs to get a life i mean really like you're bringing down property values by allowing a missionary or a pastor to stay in his condo what a bunch of crap i know i um i i looked carefully at the bylaws and it said two non-family visitors per year are allowed parking passes. And, of course, they don't allow rental. I'm restricted to three times a month and one month minimum. Three times a year, one month minimum.

Okay. So you have long-term leases they do allow, but not allowing somebody to come in there and stay for a couple months as a missionary yeah so i guess i guess we learned our lesson to not read all that crap before we buy and most people don't i might not have read it either oh that's so aggravating oh yeah i mean the bottom line is you you can't use it for what you bought it for yes should i save it as a real estate investment yeah i just sell it okay you didn't buy it for that and it you know unless you want to pay it off and then save and wait to do the ministry thing and save up and pay cash for a property that you can do the ministry thing with in addition do you want to do that um so i would still take about three years to get this paid off

and then another three years to save up to buy something, right? Correct, yes. No more debt. Yeah, as opposed to if we sold it now, maybe we could save up in two or less and then be able to buy a house and be able to do that. Yeah, I'm probably – I mean, it's how fast you want to do it. If you would keep this as an investment, it delays the other thing. If that's okay with you, then it's okay.

But if you want to put this ministry in front of owning other rental property, then you'd probably just go ahead and sell it now. Okay, great. I think it answered my question. That's just so petty. I mean, you would think you could sit down with them, with the management team there, or the president of the HOA. God, man, I own property in a bunch of HOAs, and every single one of them are a pain in the butt.

It's just, I hate those things. Okay. Hey, thanks for the call, man. Open phones at 888-825-5225. It's my fault I bought property in there. It's his fault we bought property for the call, man. Open phones at 888-825-5225. It's my fault I bought property in there. It's his fault we bought property in the middle of that. But, man, this thing, I'll tell you, man, I told Sharon the other day, if we ever sell the house we're in, I will never build another house in an HOA.

I'm going to go out and buy a big piece of dirt and put signs up that say trespassers will be shot. Golly, unbelievable. Wow. Open phones at 888-825-5225. The Borrowed Future podcast is on fire. If you have not downloaded the first two episodes, another one will come and drop onto the podcast platforms on Monday. So if you're on Apple Podcast, if you're on Google Play, if you're on Spotify, wherever you're picking up your podcasts, the third episode will come out

Monday. It is ranging in the top 10 of all podcasts out there right now. It is exploding, and it's all about the student loan debacle the student loan disaster the student loan plague that is on america and congress continues to allow student loans to be made with federal insurance and continues to put their citizenry in harm's way congress you should stop this program it's a plague it's such a plague that some of you are talking about forgiving the loans which while you're still making the loans is intellectual dishonesty you can't continue to make the line you can't talk about forgiving loans while you're still making them idiots so gee it's time to stop this, America. Check out Borrowed Future.

It will curl your hair. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, guys, it's Blake Thompson, senior executive producer for The Dave Ramsey Show. This hour's over, but you can find more great content on our YouTube channel. Catch the most watched Dave Rants, Deathly Screams, and the very popular Everyday Millionaire segment. Go to the Dave Ranty Show YouTube channel and click subscribe.