The Ramsey Show - App - Can We Really Afford This? (Hour 3)

Episode Date: October 25, 2023

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm George Campbell, joined by Rachel Cruz this hour, and this is your show. We're here, but it's really about you. So call us, 888-825-5225. And if you're wondering, is that the same George and Rachel from Smart Money Happy Hour? You would be correct. You would be correct. We have a great time filming and creating that show just downstairs in one of our studios, so check that out as well if you like what you hear today. Jeff is in San Bernardino, California. Jeff, welcome to the show. How are you doing? Good. So I had a quick question

about, I'm finally, you know, taking your advice. I sat down with my wife and we're paying everything off now. Yay, good job, Jeff. Congratulations. Except we're like way too much into that right now. But right now my credit card, I should be having paid off in the next one year, right? So we had bought a truck, but unfortunately that thing's a lemon and we're going through that whole thing and I'm hoping to get rid of that by the end of next year.

And then I had to pull out of my retirement account money to buy my wife a new car because the other one's just not safe to drive. So we're now paying the credit card first because that's the highest payment or the highest interest rate. What's the balance on that? That thing is $30,000. Okay. And what other debt do you have? I have a truck, which is $24,000, and that's the lemon. Okay.

And then we have my wife's car, which is at $43,000. Goodness gracious. Wait, $43,000 for your wife's car, but you took money out of your 401k, you said? Yeah. So we bought it new only because I know I'm going to get rid of the truck, and I should be getting the money back from that truck. Whatever money I get from that truck. You just said it's a lemon. How are you going to get the money back?

So the truck. I bought my wife. The truck is still sitting in my driveway. How much can you sell the truck for? Well, I got a lawyer already, and they're going to try to give me pretty much what I paid for it. There's a lot of try and maybe, and you sound very confident this is all just going to happen. I'm hoping. What if the truck is worth nothing because it's a lemon? Well, it's still brand new, but it only has

like 30,000 miles and it's still under warranty. Okay. It's only a year and a half old. Okay. So it's still

under warranty and I fixed the transmission like four times already. Yikes. There's a whole bunch of other issues. Great lesson for those of you out there who are going,

I'm going to get a new car because it's so reliable. Not always. Yeah. Look at our friend Jeff. Look at our friend Jeff. So you got a credit card and two car loans. What else? That's it.

Okay. And then the house. How much do you guys make a year, Jeff? After taxes, we take home about $150,000. And if I do overtime, we could get up to probably maybe $180,000 to $200,000. Okay. Okay. And why is it going to take you a year to pay off $30,000 in credit card debt when you net $150,000?

Pretty much because the two car payments are killing me. What could you sell your wife's car, Jeff? $43,000. How much could you sell it for? Probably pretty close to the same. It was also brand new. It's a Honda Accord, but we were planning on keeping that thing

until it completely dies. Well, that would be a plan if y'all could afford it. If it's going to take you a year to pay off your credit card debt, we got to get rid of stuff. Okay. You just told me the car payment's killing you. So this plan of using this car forever. Just the two car payments.

Like when I only had the car payment for the truck, I was okay. But now I'm paying for the truck and paying for her car. And then my car is 11 years old and it has 300,000 miles on it. And I'm afraid it may not last another two years. Right. Um, but I'm going to drive it until it's going to be too expensive to fix it. Yeah. Okay. So what's your question today? So pretty much when I get the credit card paid off and I'm then paying down my wife's car, I'm afraid my car's not going to make it right. And I have a decent interest payment, which is 5% for her car. And if I have to end up getting another car for me, should I put some

money aside while I'm paying off my wife's car in case I do have to buy a new car and it's a higher interest because interest rates are going crazy high right now. So should I then save money and buy another car cash and not put as much money towards my wife's car? And it's going to be a used car. Yep. Yes. No more new cars, no more loans, no more even thinking about interest rates not even

no because you know what because you know what you're yeah because that car payment that you're paying you're paying interest on top of that versus if you invested that car payment you would have what was it like 2.2 million dollars or something i mean millions of dollars so it's mathematically it's a depreciating asset it's not worth it no always cash for cars always cars i am rooting for jeff more than anything but what i'm hearing a lot of right now if i was your friend i'd be like jeff you have justified your way into every financial mistake everything is well here's what i was gonna do and what if i what i what if i just uh i think we need to just cut all that let's's start from scratch and go, hey, clean slate.

We need to get rid of these cars. Yeah, and the good thing is, Jeff, you guys, I mean, because you will be working overtime. So I'm going to just have a little dream session. Let's say you're making $200,000. You're bringing home $200,000, I think is what I heard you, right? You said you could bring home $180,000. That's like if I never see the kids go and all that. Hold on.

See, that feels also aggressive, Jeff. Let's just say $180,000 for fun. See, that feels also aggressive, Jeff. Let's just say 180 for fun. Okay, so you already have a car. You have a truck sitting in the driveway that's a lemon. You think you can sell it for 24. You think you'll just, you have a loan for 24. You think you'll be able to just go be even, right? So I guess the manufacturer already said

that they would give us, like, I think it was $40,000. My lawyer is saying, like, $70,000. So it was $55,000. So you're telling me you're going to get cut a check for potentially $70,000? My guess is probably $55,000. I'm guessing it's going to be. But this could be a year from now. We don't know when this is going to actually happen.

Yeah, that's true. So I don't want to bank on that. Let's call that gravy money later on down the line. But right now, don't make all your plans based on waiting on this check. Yeah, and I'm not. That's why I'm still just having it sit in the driveway and just doing the payments. But we can't sell it until it's fixed? Until I figure out if the company is going to buy it back,

which it sounds like they're going to, but it's just how much. But in the meantime, you're making a payment on a car sitting in the driveway. Yeah. That scares me. Yeah. So if this, yeah, Jeff. Like I said, we can kind of afford it, but, you know, it's just. Jeff, you know what that was?

That was another justification. We need a little ding every time you do one of those. No, yeah. And I wouldn't sit around waiting on them to do something. If nothing has happened by January, I'm on my own. I'm selling the truck. I don't care what the... I can't be paying on something that is just sitting there.

So, no, I would be out on that. I would cut lifestyle down, Jeff. I would cut up those credit cards and you guys attack that credit card debt. But you make great income, work extra for a year of your life, go crazy. And you guys can have this cleaned up. Hey, Jeff, hang on the line. We're going to send you Financial Peace University since you're new to this stuff. It's going to lay it all out beautifully so that you can get on a plan, ditch debt, and build wealth. This is The Ramsey Show. I'm George Camel, joined by Rachel Cruz.

Our question of the day is sponsored by Neighborly, your hub for home services. With the Neighborly app, you have fast, easy access to any home service you need from experts you can trust near you. Download the Neighborly app today to find and schedule service with any of Neighborly's locally owned and operated service providers. All right, today's question's a good one from Sam in Utah. My wife wants to buy a $1,500 stroller for our baby to be born next year. I think it's unreasonable and stupid to spend that much money, that spend so much money on it. We are debt-free, including the house,

with a household income of $300,000. She makes about half of our income and she thinks she has a right to spend $1,500 on a baby after four years of infertility treatments. Am I off base? Whoa, that was a loaded question, Rachel. Okay, so does she have the right to spin? The language.

Let's remove that just for the fun of this. Even if she was a stay-at-home spouse and made $0, I don't like this language. Well, she has no right because she doesn't make this or she makes this. Yeah, it's not about. It's just weird. Yeah, she has a right because she's part of the partnership of marriage that you guys are in.

So she has a right to voice her opinion and all of that, right? Just like he would. Yeah, you guys are debt-free, including the house, making $300,000. I'm saying yes. I'm saying yes. And let's be clear why, Rachel, because this is an interesting conversation. It goes beyond strollers. People probably get mad at me for saying that, yeah.

When people say, I think it's stupid and unreasonable to spend that much money on a blank, on a car, on a house. And what we always go back to is, are you doing it with cash and are you doing it for the right reasons or are you doing it with debt to impress people? Right. And this is not one of those situations.

They followed the baby steps. They make $300,000. Now she probably looks at him and goes, you're going to buy a circular saw from Lowe's for $1,200. That's stupid and unreasonable. And he's going, well, honey, I'm going to, instead of paying for this project or renting it, and she's going, I'm going to be walking around town with the baby. I want a nice stroller to do that with. Yes. Yes. I know. And it is out of all the baby equipment, your car seat, stroller. There's a couple of these things that they get the wear and tear. You use them a lot. So if you have the money to get a nice one that you love, get the nice one. And George, right in front of me, I happened to see something. This is a special

treat. We did not plan this. This was not planned. My wife and my newborn baby are in the lobby right now, and we have a very expensive stroller on display that we maybe had a minimal fight over. What do you mean this wasn't planned? I picked this for stay because you were on and just had a baby. It was totally planned. Yeah, but I didn't know that my wife was going to visit.

They're going to be here in person with the stroller. She's never watched me do the show. That was the cherry on top. Are we able to get a shot? Yeah, I think we're going to try to get a shot of the stroller. So never watched me do the show cherry on top um are we able to get a shot i think we're going to try to get a shot of diana's holding mia will she be able to be in the shot on our team that's not my there's my wife whitney in the white and then diana is in the diana's holding the baby holding the baby hold me and then let's look at the stroller get that stroller this feels like price is right we're showing off the stroller in there go can we turn

the can yeah there we go okay so we didn't see it. Do it again. One more time. There we go. One more time. There's the stroller. Yeah, there it is. So this is an Upababy Vista V2 stroller that Rachel and I talked about. And I had qualms with this, Rachel. Yes, you did. And we use gifts from family money and part of our own money to buy this very expensive

stroller. It was not $1,500, but it's an expensive stroller. Yeah. But we've also worked really hard and we've followed the baby steps we don't have any debt and we budgeted for this thing and let me tell you when we're walking that baby around the neighborhood whitney is like i i feel like this is the rolls royce of strollers like she enjoys walking it's so smooth and you know it's worth it and it's worth it as a new mom who's got enough going on get the stroller, guys. Yeah, the guys don't understand. And so I'm trying to grapple with it.

If you have credit card debt and student loans to pay, and I mean, you can fill in the blank, right? Lots of other different situations. It probably wouldn't be wise for you to do that. Your money would be better off put towards other things like debt and all that. But being debt-free, having the cash to do it, having a great income, yes, it's fine. It's fine.

It's not like it's an unreasonable portion of their world. If they were going to buy a $300,000 car and they made $300,000, I'd say, let's pump the brakes, literally. Yeah, we need to think, literally. And EpiBaby has a great braking system, doesn't it? There you go. Hashtag not sponsored,

but it is known as like the bougie stroller. It's a stroller and we had one and y'all we have all three kids now because it has the adjustable you put the toddler seat the rumble seat in the front and then you get the little kickdown thing for the little one all of it that thing went with us for six plus years yeah and it was great there you go so there you go because listen y'all we talk so much on this show about sacrificing your lifestyle to get out of debt because that's normally what people call in for that they're deeply in debt and they're like we want to get out and it requires sacrifice so we're the people that are always like don't go out to eat don't go shopping you've got to pay this debt off that's the show and when we get a question like this we celebrate especially rachel's you

can do it yes this is when you can spend you live like no one else so later you can live and give like no one else and those of you on baby steps four five six seven enjoy that that your money too at that point especially you all on baby step seven still people are like oh i feel like i still feel like i have the rice and beans mentality i can't i can't you know it seems weird to spend and it's hard for me to spend all of that. Enjoy your money. When you've worked that hard to get to that place, you're free from that. You can enjoy it. So you want to be always giving, always saving, and always spending wisely. So Sam, sorry.

You lose this one, buddy. You lose. We're on your wife's team. We're on your wife's team. To be fair, I was Sam at the beginning when we were starting to add things to the registry and it was getting overwhelming. It feels crazy. Yeah. And again, I don't at the beginning when we were starting to like add things to the registry and it was getting overwhelming. Sure, because it feels crazy. Yeah.

And again, I don't know what strollers cost these days. Yeah. And you can get a cheap. I mean, and those of you that are in debt and you're having a baby, you can find strollers that are way less expensive and they're going to be okay. And you know what, Sam? If you want to split the difference, go to Facebook Marketplace and get a used one for $800 instead of $1,500, if that's the compromise that you guys want to make. But whatever it is, you have to agree on it as a couple. That's important. That's right. All right, let's move on to the phones. Corey is in Wichita, Kansas. Corey, welcome to the show. Hey, Rachel. Hey, George. Hey.

I've got a question for you. I've got $30,000 in a CD. I'm saving that for my three-year-old daughter, her future. Would it be smart to take it out right now and pour it towards my house and get it paid off in a year and a half, or should I just save that money? What happens if you don't touch that money and you just pay off the house with future income? How much longer would it take? Another half a year. Okay, so we're arguing about six months here at the end of the day. Yeah. And is this all the money you have saved for college?

Yes. Okay. No 529s, no ESAs, anything like that? Not yet. I just recently started listening to you guys and we've got everything paid off by the house and I'm just not sure I would like to be just completely debt free but yeah I think Corey you can do you can do both I mean like George said yeah I mean even just say you took this money paid off the house then that frees up a ton of income for you to go and you know open up another savings account or a 529 plan and uh and invest and she's going to be fine she's three years old so she's i mean if she was 18 this would be another discussion but there's plenty of time for you to save or on the flip

side too cory if you didn't touch it and you paid off the house in six months longer great you know what i mean like it's kind of a either way you're gonna be fine so um i almost would be tempted just to pay off the house honestly i know i have an idea that could split the difference what if you took you know when does the cd mature we can take it out without any interest penalties uh march 2024 okay okay let's say in march which one reason why i don't love cds but in march of 2024 what if you took five or 10 grand and put that into a 529 plan and then use 20 grand towards the house? Okay. And here's what that does for you.

Not a bad idea. Then you're invested in the stock market. And so that $10,000 that you put in there could grow to 60 or 70 by the time she's 18. But also, you're feeling a little bit of progress on this house, and you'll pay it off in a year and seven months or eight months. And so, I think it's splitting hairs. But when I look at the baby steps, four, five, six, are you already investing 15% of your own for retirement? So, that's where I get a little confused. So So I'm doing 6%. My wife's doing 8%. So we're at 14 right now. I was going to do another percent. No, because when you double

the people, you need double the money. So you both need to do 15% of each of your incomes to get to 15% of household income. I would focus on that first. Get your own mask on now. Then let's put a little bit away for college each year. Might be $1,000, $2,000. Any money beyond that, let's start throwing at the house. And that'll knock you out of this analysis paralysis. Thanks so much for the call, man. You're great, Corey. This is The Ramsey Show.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Rachel Cruz this hour. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Crystal joins us up next in Hartford, Connecticut. Crystal, what's going on? Yes. Hello. Hey. How are you guys? So good. How can we help you today? day? Well, I've had my, I've had it moment. Um, and I am writing everything down, figuring out where to go from here. My biggest concern is with everything that I've figured out,

it's going to take me more than three years to clean up my consumer debt. Okay. And I'm just worried being 46 years old and having no retirement up to this point causing my 401k with my company that I'm at currently. Okay. What's in your 401k now? I only have about $4,000. Okay. And it's just been a series of really bad financial decisions with other 401ks that I had. Like I've changed careers a couple of times and I've just cashed them out.

Oh no. Yeah. And use them to, for like everyday expenses, living expenses as I was transitioning into these new careers. Like I've made two major career changes. And that's why I'm a little nervous on pausing the 401k. Well, here's some good news. If you pause, you can't rob a cookie jar that has no cookies in it. So there's one behavior change, which I think is what the reason you're calling in today is because you're like, listen, I've been living like this for years, maybe decades, and it's time.

And so that means you have to do some radical things that make you uncomfortable just for a season to get this debt cleaned up. So how much debt do you have? I have, well, the big one is student loans that I'm not even using the education that I got, you know, so. That's the American story. Yeah, I have $66,000 in student loans that I've been paying since 2000 on. Oh my gosh, 23 years. Yeah, exactly. And I'm guessing the balance has grown. I'm sure the original balance has grown from when I've gotten out. And I think I applied for the income-based repayment plan in maybe 2003 or 4, I want to say, and it hasn't made a dent. I don't believe their lies anymore that it's going to be forgiven after you make

certain number of qualified payments. You know, it's just a big. Starting today, you're going to believe in crystal instead of some government plan. So what's your other debt? That's right. What's your other debt? That's right. I did a big old debt consolidation personal loan of $36,000, but I didn't change my spending habits after I did that. That's the problem with consolidation.

It makes you feel like you did something, and then you keep living your life. Don't change the behavior. We're up over $100,000 now in debt. What else do you have? I have a car that's worth 17, but I don't make the payments on it. It's just in my name. Who makes the payments? My brother. And he's okay with this is he helping you out no no he's driving it he just has way worse credit than me so you oh yeah so you have a car loan i have a car loan and how much is that yeah so what's how much is that for 16 000 okay and'm about $3,000 in credit cards. Not really much in credit cards currently because I whacked out about, all my debt snowballed about $3,000 already.

Good for you. That's great. And what's your income? So I looked it back last year, and it's like $68,000 as a truck driver. Okay. Take-home. Take-home pay. Okay, so you probably made closer to $90,000?

Gross? Yeah, probably a little bit under. Okay. Because we get a tax credit because we're basically living in a moving house, so we're allowed to take a per diem credit. Got it. So every day we're out on the road. Okay.

Is this all the debt? Is there anything we didn't cover? No, but I mean, and I cash flow, if I can hear my dog, I cash flow vet appointments. Okay. Every time I have a vet appointment, I stop and I cash flow that now. Crystal, we are in a pickle here. Yeah. We make $68,000 and we have, what, $125,000 in consumer debt.

Yep. And that's what my concern was because from what I can see, like where I've gotten my extra payments is, I've got it to where I'm contributing roughly between $700 extra a month to the debt and $1,000 extra a month. And is this while you paused investing, or have you not done that yet? I have not paused my investing. How much would be in your paycheck extra if you did that?

Do you know? Well, anywhere from on a bad week, about $90 to upwards of $150 a week. That's per paycheck? If I didn't contribute anything. Per week. Okay. So we're talking hundreds of extra dollars you could throw at this debt. Yeah. I know.

Yeah. I mean, it's just that paralysis. Five, six. Yeah. So, Crystal, I think here's the thing. If you, number one, you still have time. Okay, you're not 65 years old. There's catch-up contributions you can do later down the road. But what I would say

to you right now is I would rather not have consumer debt, be debt-free, and then catching up with my retirement than having money in a 401k that I can't touch right now, but I'm drowning in $125,000 in debt. And so what you have to realize, Crystal, and you have realized because I've heard this on the call, which I think is so great, is you have to be able to say, okay, what I've been doing isn't working. So now I have to try a completely new plan.

So the plan that we're going to talk about has helped literally millions of people do this. And it's a plan with specific steps in a specific order for a specific reason. Because being able to wipe out this consumer debt, taking everything possible, right? Because I mean, you're scattered all over the place with some stuff. And so bringing everything in, actually getting traction for the first time in your life, Crystal, like you're going to start to feel it. You're going to actually start to feel

you winning, not through debt consolidation, not through a loan that's sitting there. You're wondering about repayment plan. I mean, none of that. Crystal's going to be doing it and you getting motivated to do that. And then I heard you talk about like the different classrooms that you grew up in and stuff like that. And yeah, my family has always been a paycheck to paycheck family. Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah. I just don't think I've ever learned how to break. That's right. The habit of this. I know George has talked about don't tie your money up in CDs. Well, as I'm going along, I'm having CDs that are maturing, and I'm just immediately cashing them out and paying on the net as well. Yeah, how much do you have saved?

How much are in that? How much do you have saved? I just did one for $1,000, so I cashed it out. I put that towards the most recent vet bill, which gets the cash flow thing.

So the next one, there's three of them that are going to be maturing at the end of November. That'll be $3,000. Okay. So here's the deal, Crystal, quit playing with these CDs. It's not helping you get out of debt. So here's what you need to do. Put a thousand bucks aside in a savings account and don't play with these accounts anymore. The rest of the money needs to go towards knocking out this debt. And you said three years, which tells me you can

throw $40,000 a year at your consumer debt. You'll knock out all $125,000 in three years? Right. Yeah. That's how I got it planned out. I should be debt-free in three years. That's a great goal. Anything you can do to get your income up and your expenses down is going to speed up that process. So my goal for you would be, how do we get even more aggressive and do this in two years, two and a half years? And hold on the line, Crystal, because I'm going to set you up with Financial Peace University, which is our nine-week course, nine-lesson course, which will help you get all the basics and every dollar premium. I want you to do that too. And we have a webinar, actually, if you guys go to everydollar.com slash budgeting to check out webinars that we're doing to walk through the budgeting process. So, Crystal, hang on the line. I'll get you those two things to start this because you're on the cusp of change and it's

going to be uncomfortable. But man, Crystal, in four years, it's going to be a completely different person financially. This is The Ramsey Show, our scripture of the day, Jeremiah 17, 7. But blessed is the one who trusts in the Lord, whose confidence is in him. Corrie ten Boom said, hold everything in your hands lightly, otherwise it hurts when God pries your fingers open. That's a good one. Corrie ten Boom, she's incredible. Is it The Hiding Place? Have you read that? Oh, back in the day oh throwback great great book um war to real um true or true story yeah um yeah cory timpin love that quote though so good yeah you should steal that one rachel not steal but give with credit i should whenever you're talking

about generosity yep it's a great way to look at it. All right, let's get to the phones. Julie is in Vancouver, British Columbia, all the way. Let's go, Julie. What's going on? Hi there. I've had a bit of a rough go lately, and I'm trying to look for some advice on the next steps forward. Okay. What's been going on?

I have two small kids, and unexpectedly, my husband decided to exit the situation back in July. Oh, my gosh, Julie. I'm so sorry. No, it's okay. Things happen. Anyways, you know, he left the country, so I won't be getting any child support. Wow, what a gem. Yeah, very unexpected.

Not who I knew before. It was quick. And I was able to get the condo that we have put under me, Monterran. So I have that. But I'm just facing a challenge in terms of what to decide to do because the costs of it are, to me, I'm pretty good budgeting far exceed what I should be paying and what I can pay. But at the same time, rents aren't a lot different in my region. Yeah. And so I just, yeah, I'm trying to get some advice on what I

should do here. Do you, do you have family in the area? No. No. Okay. How much are you working? Yeah. Okay. And how much are you bringing in a month? About $4,600. Okay. How much is the rent right now? The mortgage is $2,550 a month and an HO of $420. Oh my my goodness. Wow, yeah, yeah. So that's two-thirds of your money is just disappearing. And in the area, Julie, have you looked at other options? Have you looked around to see what else is out there? I've certainly looked I've looked at rents and if you're real lucky, you might get a very rough looking basement apartment for about $2,200, $2,400. And that's something I don't really, I love to put my kids in.

Yeah. And there's also, the reason I wanted to buy initially was because there's a lot of rent evictions that happen around here where the landlords, you know, they can find a reason to evict people to up the rent. Okay. So that happens a lot, especially to families. What do you do for a job, Julie? What are you doing? I'm a program coordinator. And I work for a really great spot right now.

And that's part of why I stay here. And they allow me a lot of flexibility when I'm with two small kids. Like, I didn't get my younger one into daycare until she was two. Okay. Because I worked with her the first year. You know, right now I've got to be able to pick up my kids from school. I've got to have them home if they're sick. And so the level of flexibility I have to do that is worth a plate in gold, really. Yeah, yeah. No, absolutely.

Are the prospects of getting this guy legally to pay anything, is that out of the picture now? Yeah, he's in a place that you can't get him. Interesting. Okay. His country doesn't have any treaties or anything like that, really. But I just still wonder if there are laws in Canada that would require him to pay. Yeah, I can take it through to get it put against, like, if he ever came back, but they can't actually obtain it in any way. Oh.

Oh, I'm so sorry, Julie. I know, you know, Canadian housing is crazy, both rent and mortgages and home buying, but I do wonder how long you're going to be able to sustain paying this mortgage payment if you continue making the same amount of income. Yeah, that's what I'm faced with. How much equity do you have? If you sold this place, what would you walk away with? Maybe $600,000, and I owe $430,000.

Okay. Okay, so $130,000. So you're saying you would sell it for $600,000? Yeah. Okay. So you'd have about $200,000 in equity? Yeah, just under. And $150,000 after fees and all that?

Yeah. I mean, I think month to month, Julie, because all of this is so new. There's so much stress that you're feeling. I would need my income freed up to have a level of peace, and that's not going to happen in the current situation. I mean, because it's more than half your paycheck. I mean, almost three-fourths. So, Julie, I would sell it.

I would sell it, and I would, unless you could see your income going up, that's the only other factor that would change. But I would sell it. I would rent somewhere for a year. You have that equity and just to kind of get your bearings again. But there's also that hard reality, Julie, too, of, you know, what the job you have, which has great flexibility, which is such a gift, but what you make, and the city you live in, you know, we talked to people in LA or,

you know, San Francisco area, you area, these places that are so high in cost of living. And what they make, you can't make the math work. And so I don't want you to make that decision right now, because that's a bigger decision of changing jobs or moving. That would have to be a decision that you eventually will have to face. But I don't want you to face that right now in the middle of everything you've just walked through. But I think one decision you could make that's going to just free you up some for me is selling. Yeah. Especially because your life circumstances have drastically changed. And now that you're a single income household, a single mom, your needs have changed and your income's

changed. And we have to face, you know, as John Deloney would say, choose reality. And the reality is life is different. This is really hard. And not having this mortgage over your head will at least free you up and keep you more nimble as you take that next step. Man, I've talked to you only for like three minutes, Julie, and my anger towards him, I can't even imagine. I can't imagine how you're feeling. But do you have good community around you? Do you have a support system, friends or family? Not a big one locally. No, but I'm.

Where's your family? I work in mental health, actually. Oh, OK. Yeah. I'm keeping my head on pretty straight. Yeah. It's more just that reality of my kids, you know, and what they'll have to do. Oh, yeah.

In terms of, you know, the life experience is really unfortunate. Sure. Sure. Yeah. And so, yeah, you're in mental health, so you know. But I'm like, I just, even from that side of it. I wish I could just snap my fingers and make this all fixed. I know. But the healing process, and make this all fixed. I know.

But the healing process, and it's a journey. And, Julie, you're courageous, and you can do this. Your kids are so lucky to have you. You're a really good mom. Thanks. You know, just to keep pulling it out, I think what really holds me is I'm pretty good at logic, and the numbers don't lie. It's just that level of insecurity, you know,

like the reason I want to buy in the first place for that safety that no one can kick me out. Yeah. Absolutely. Right. But that means there's a reality too. Right. Yeah.

And that makes so much sense. I mean, grasping for anything of control or predictability right now feels so safe and so great. I would imagine, right? So, so I understand that even saying to sell it and finding somewhere cheaper, that that kind of uproots even more of that chaotic feeling. And so I do think once you get in a rhythm of somewhere new and actually having some margin financially to go and buy it, I think eventually you will buy another place, Julie, right? Like this isn't just a, you'll never buy something else, but it's going to be within reason and

it's going to be a blessing to you and it's not going to... It's about the cheapest in my city. 1979, you know, a little condo. Do you have any debt, Julie, other than that mortgage? No, no. And you have an emergency fund? A small one. Okay. That's going to also give you some security and peace as you step into that next phase. But, man, we are heartbroken for you, Julie. And like Rachel said, you're a warrior.

And we know you're going to come out of this on the other side. But right now, you're in the real crappy part where you're left to pick up the pieces. That puts this hour of The Ramsey Show in the books. My thanks to my co-host, Rachel Cruz, all the folks in the booth keeping the show afloat, and you, America. Until next time, spend wisely, save intentionally, and give generously.