The Ramsey Show - App - Change the Habits That Created the Financial Mess (Hour 3)

Episode Date: October 15, 2019

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live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios. It's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. We're glad you are with us. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Kanan is with us in Auburn, Alabama. Hi, Kanan. How are you?

No, I'm well, Dad. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So, I was studying at West Point, and when I went abroad my senior year, I acted a fool and got myself kicked out right before I graduated. Oh, Lord. And I owe the government about $300,000. And while I was there, I also took out a personal loan of about $35,000.

I recently got married in May, and my wife, she can't work right now because we're waiting on her green card. I've bounced around a few jobs since then, and the one I'm working on now is on a bad job, but I'm not particularly passionate about it. And I'm actually on my way now to do my orientation for Domino's. I'm going to go deliver pizzas as a side job, but I don't really know what to do. I have my career path to be in the Army, and I thought I was going to figure it out then, but right now I'm just, I don't know,

I feel like I'm working, and to pay off all those debts is going to take me a long time, I feel like. Yeah. How old are you? 24. Okay. So you are how close to graduating from West Point? The day before, they told me I was getting separated. Oh, man, I'm so sorry. What a disaster. Yeah.

Well, I mean, I'm the one that misbehaved, but I take responsibility for that. I understand. Yeah, you did it, but what a mess. So I am not positive. I mean, obviously that is the preeminent military war college. Do those college credits transfer to another college? Yes. Yes, I actually transferred them and was able to get my degree last month.

Okay, that's good news. In what? I got one of those stupid majors you talk about because I probably don't be in the Army, but it's in Russian studies. Okay, but that was the closest thing for you to finish. Yes, sir. I ended up finishing up with the same degree I was studying at West Point. Right, okay. But at least you come out with a degree.

All right. Oh, my goodness. Well, I think, you know, what I'm going to do, what drew you to Russian studies while you were in the military? Obviously you were studying it from a military aspect. Is that right? Right. And I just fell in love with the language.

I was originally a math and econ major, but I wanted to go abroad and learn the language and then hopefully get a job in the government agency after. Yeah. Okay, here's what I want you to do. I want you to pursue international business with a specialization in Russia. And I want you to learn how to do trade and how to do deals because you've got these skills. You've got a natural tendency to business with econ and math.

You've got the skill set to do that. And you've got this very specialized set of skills, understanding the Russian culture, language, and so forth. Agreed? Yes, sir. Yeah, I think that translates to international business. And there is a lot of money flowing in and out of Russia. Legal money, not illegal money, as you probably already know.

And so, yeah, I would lean into that and say that's going to be the salvation of this mess because, you know, you've got got a really really big hole here and delivering Domino's pizza is not going to get you out of 300 grand right well that's that's my side job okay and your day job is what I work in a rubber factory okay now making what? I make about $15 an hour, so it's about $30,000 a year. Okay. Well, I want you to forgive yourself for your stupidity and reset your career and go, okay, I'm 24. I did a really dumb thing.

It's now in the rearview mirror. I'm not a $15 an hour guy. I'm a $ hundred thousand dollar a year guy and i'm going to go about becoming a specialist in russian international business and i'm going to find people that work with people in russia businesses that interact with that and i'm going to go work for them and i'm going to make some serious money to get out of this mess even if you didn't have this mess that would be what you would need to do because you've got that potential,

and I don't want you to take a $15-an-hour job, and that is now your future in a factory because you had right on the cusp of graduating from one of the world's finest institutions, you did something stupid. That does not need to define your life. It just needs to cause your life to be redirected. Is that okay? Yeah, I think my biggest thing is just not really, you know, my purpose was to serve in the Army,

and now since then I've just kind of been wandering about. Yep, and it's time to get a new one, brother. Not having a purpose sucks, doesn't it? Mm-hmm. And I'm sitting here trying to give you a new one. Because, listen, other than the dumb thing you did, you don't get to the final cut, the final day at West Point if you're stupid. You're not an ignorant.

You're not an unintelligent person. Okay? You don't get there. It's not possible. It's too tough. Am I wrong? You're right. Okay.

You did a dumb thing. That doesn't make you unintelligent. It makes you a smart guy who did a dumb thing. You put my name on that list. I'm a smart guy who's done a lot of dumb things in my life. So put it in the rearview mirror, and let's reset our purpose. We're not going that way. Okay, where are we going?

There's got to be a different adventure, and it doesn't mean that you are doomed to a life of slavery. Next time I talk to you, I want a little more hope in your voice, a little more energy in your voice, a little more energy in your voice, and I want you fired up and wired up about where you're going because that's the next step in your life, brother, and you're not getting out of this debt with Domino's Pizza and $15. Besides that, it'd be a waste of your life.

You're too sharp. There's too much good you can still do, and you can have some fun with the skill set you've got. And you may even be able to get involved in policy and some other stuff in the government position. You don't have to graduate from West Point to use your skill set in a think tank in D.C. somewhere. So, you know, don't camp on the backside of the desert here too long, my brother. You've got stuff to do. And you've got a mess to clean up, too.

But you've got stuff to do. You've got potential. Don't sell that out. So your hope for the future matters. Proverbs says, hope deferred makes the heart sick. But when desire comes, it is the tree of life. Oh, there we go. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Business leaders, if you're not using LinkedIn jobs, you are missing out.

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Visit linkedin.com slash Ramsey. Terms and conditions apply. Scott is with us in Denver. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show, Scott. Hey, thanks for taking my call. Sure. How can I help? Well, I work as a truck driver, and I'm never home,

so I'm planning on buying a house later in life, like in retirement. And I'm wondering what would be a good idea on how to invest that extra money I have to put my house payment away now in investments instead? Good. Good question. How old are you? Fifty-four. Fifty-four. And you're single? Yes. Okay. And how many years do you think before you'll buy a house? I'm thinking at least 16.

Okay. All 16. Okay. All right. Cool. Well, as long as you've got more than five years, I would use a simple growth stock mutual fund or a series of them. For something like that, I probably would just use an S&P index fund because it will grow virtually without paying taxes on it until you pull it out. It has what's called a low turnover ratio,

which means the taxes aren't charged much on the growth until you cash it in. And so I'd start to look at just an S&P 500 fund, an index fund, and use that to grow for the next 5, 10 years or so until you buy a house. As long as you plan to leave it alone at least five years, you can survive the gyrations of the stock market, and you should be fine in that. And that's exactly what I would do. I do a similar thing, Scott, in that sometimes I've got some extra money

and I'm just saving up for my next real estate purchase as an investment. And even if I don't have five years in that case, I'll ride the market with it because I can afford for it to go down if I miss up a little bit. But, yeah, that's the direction I would go. Good question. Robbie is with us in Pittsburgh. Hey, Robbie, welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, Dave, how are you?

Better than I deserve. What's up? Thank you so much for speaking, Michael. Yeah, I had a quick question. So I am a nurse by profession, and my wife is a nurse anesthetist. I am wondering if I should go back to school again next year. So my question is, is it worth for me to go to school? Now, I'm 32 years old.

My wife is 29. We make a combined income right now of $220,000 a year. So if I go to school, it's going to cost me three years of not working and a tuition of around $90,000. But our gross income after I go to school and be successful together would be close to $300,000. What do you make a year now? Right now, around $70,000. Okay. So you're saying this is going to cost you $300,000, three years of $70,000 missing plus $90,000 out of pocket. Yeah. Okay, can you cash flow the $90,000 out of pocket and can you live on her income while you're doing this?

I can live on her income for sure. That's how we did it when she was in school. But I don't think I can cash anything right now because I also don't have a house at the moment. So I was planning on buying a house or at least putting a down payment for a house next year before I start school. Then you need to wait until you can pay for school. I would never in 30 years of doing this show recommend that somebody borrow money to go to school. Okay. You got the cash flow to do it.

It's just a matter of when you do it and what you put first, what you put second. You make plenty of money to come up with $90,000. Yeah. Plenty of money. And you don't have to have the whole $90,000 up front. You just got to see in your budget how you can cash flow it. I can see it pretty easily. How long does it take to go through the class again or to get that degree?

It's a three-year program. So $30,000 a year? $30,000 a year, yeah. And she makes what? She makes $150,000. You can't cash flow $30,000 out of $150,000? Well, not when I'm not in school. No, if you're in school, she makes $150,000,

and you need $30,000 of her $150,000 to go to school a year for three years. I'm sorry, it's going to be around $60,000 a year. I thought you said it was $90,000. Sorry, I got that wrong. It's $60,000 a year. Seems high. Yeah, it is., I got that wrong. It's $60,000 a year. Seems high. Yeah, it is. It is an expensive program. Yeah, go to a less expensive program.

Okay. But cash flow it. Whatever you're going to do, pay for it. Figure out a way to pay for it. It pays you go. You don't necessarily have it all stacked up ahead of time, but you've got to see where it's going to come from. I would not recommend you go get student loans. Because's the thing everyone that starts that program doesn't finish

it but everyone that takes out student loans to start that program has those student loans whether they finish or not and then you've got what's known as a freaking mess and so i'm not suggesting you're dumb or you can't pass the test or something like that but life happens dude and the last thing you want the only time debt works is if everything works other than that that doesn't work and so we tell you to stay away from it thanks for the call open phones at 888-825-5225 joshua is in dallas texas hi joshua how are you i'm good how are you? I'm good. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? So basically, I am stuck in between whether I should file for bankruptcy or just go ahead and start paying all my debts off with debt snowball. Basically, all my debts except my car are in collections.

So that's the only reason I'm basically contemplating bankruptcy. Why are they all in collections? They're like old medical bills. One is a car that got repoed because I lost my job. And I think like a phone bill is in there too. Okay. So how much is the repo bill um that one's actually only like a couple grand um the biggest one i have on there is um nine nine thousand four hundred

and forty five dollars from an old apartment how long ago was? Three and a half years ago. Okay. And how much medical debt have you got? I would say about $2,000. And how much other debt have you got? The rest of it is just mixed in there with like my phone, I think a phone bill and oh, and some payday loans as well. Yeah. So your total debt's less than $20,000. Right. And then I have my car, which is $12,000. Okay. And what do you make a year?

A little bit over $45,000. I make $1,000 a week. I'm an independent contractor. Mm-hmm. And you're single? I'm married. You're married? How old are you? I am 28 on Saturday.

Happy birthday. Does she work outside the home? No. She stays at home and takes care of the daughter. Okay. Good. All right. Well, let me tell you what I'm hearing, okay?

And I think I'm hearing. Maybe I'm wrong. Larry Burkett used to say that debt is not the problem, it's the symptom of something else that's going on. Right. And it sounds like you guys have never told your money what to do. You've never had any savings for emergencies. So every time an emergency comes up, you get thrown out of an apartment and sued, your car gets repoed, and you end up with a mess. Yes, sir.

So we've got to get you on a plan where you are telling your money what to do, or you're going to be back here. If I waved a wand and made all this debt go away, which is what bankruptcy might do, maybe, if it did that and you have zero debt, all of a sudden accept your car. If you don't change the habits that caused this mess in the first place, you'll be back right where you are someday. Do you agree? Yes, sir.

So we really need to get under that because bankruptcy doesn't solve that. You've got to solve that in the mirror, you and your wife learning how to handle money. I don't think you're bankrupt. I think you're scared, disorganized, don't know what to do, and have done nothing so far. I think you can probably settle that old apartment debt for three or four grand if you saved it up and offered them a lump sum settlement. I've actually called them multiple times. When I started listening to you, that was one of the first videos that I was looking up

was how to get debt collectors up you know, up from under you. It doesn't change my answer, dude. Whether it's $9,000 or $3,000, you're still not bankrupt. It's still about you getting control of your money. And when you do that, then you're going to see your way through this bankruptcy. It's not a debt problem. It's a behavior problem that's gotten you here. I'll help you out.

I'm going to send you a copy of the Total Money Makeover book. Read that. Take an extra job. Sell everything in sight. I'll see you next time. Folks, let's cut through the bull. Interest rates are exceptionally low, so you're missing out if you have not called Churchill Mortgage to see if you can save money on your home loan. Lots of other companies are out there claiming great deals, but don't get lured by slick advertisements. No-cost refinance offers do not mean they're free. Churchill Mortgage has a no-bull refinance. This means there are no hidden fees. They will shoot straight with you. Yes, Churchill can offer loans with no closing costs, different down so you can make the smartest choice and save the most money.

Go to ChurchillMortgage.com. Do it today while rates are low. This is a paid advertisement. NMLS ID 1591. NMLSconsumeraccess.org. Equal housing lender. 761 Old Hickory Boulevard, Brentwood, Tennessee 37027. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions, Ronnie and Veronica are with us. Hey, guys, how are you?

Hey, Dave, how are you? We're doing good. Welcome. What city do you guys live in? Houston, Texas. Welcome. Very cool. Welcome to Nashville.

And all the way here to do a debt-free scream. Yes, sir. How much have you paid off? $75,000. Woo-hoo! And how long did this take? About 17 months. Good for you.

And you're... Go ahead. We were doing the pay the bear minimum up until we took the Financial Peace University. And then that kicked in into overdrive. Yes, sir. Very cool. And your range of income during the 17 months? $110,000 all the way up to $130,000. Way to go. And what do you guys do for a living?

We're both in sales. He's in the dental industry and I'm in the oil and gas industry. Oh, great. Very cool. Good for you guys. What kind of debt was the 75K? It was a combination, mainly all student debt, student loan debt. And then we also had a car note that we had one year left, and we paid it off in three months. Woo-hoo! All right. Knocked it out. Okay, so you're going along and paying on debts and just kind of living life normal, it sounds like. And then 17 months ago, you got into Financial Peace University,

and that caused you to push the pedal on down to the floor and get going. Yes, sir. So what started that? How did you end up in class? Well, her uncle actually was hosting a Financial Peace University class, and he tried to get us over to his, but they were about 45 minutes from us, and we decided, well, we'll just look for one locally, and we found one at our local parish, which was a mile down the road, so we couldn't say no to that.

Well, I basically had to drag him to class that first session the truth comes out okay who's uncle your uncle it was my uncle your uncle okay he got you started but then you get find one close by so he's got no excuses yep that's right and my brother and sister-in-law also went through the course so that kind of motivate us motivated us as well did they go through at the same parish you did or it was a different one okay all right so everybody's in different places but going through at the same time all right very very cool well ronnie i'd be like you i'd be like you want to do what yeah and uh so how did you talk ronnie into going it was like you know i think i really thought we needed a third party because all he wanted to talk about was paying off our school debt. But he thought he knew how to do it.

But it was hard to hear what he had to say about it. And so I felt like we needed a third party just to get him to class with me. I just needed to hear, let you, you know, speak to him. You need a plan that you both could agree on. Yes. Well, and you're in both in sales and i've been in sales my whole life and one thing about salespeople is we always think we can out earn our stupidity i think if we just make a little more it'll be okay yep because you know

you can make a little more when you're selling you know i just got to make a little more that's all i got to do and for years my income would go up and my debt would go up and it was just like i had to change something so so ronnie uh what did she say that talked you into going the one thing she just said hey we've got to get on the right page where we were both on opposite ends of the spectrum you know she was the spender i was the nerd i knew how to develop spreadsheets but i didn't really know how to go about paying this all off we needed some strategies. And, you know, that's what.

Something you could both buy into and be on the same page. Being on the same page is a big deal. When we first got married, Dave, we were all about buying a house. And we got married in 2016. And we were looking at houses. We were ready to buy. And then we realized we're up to debt in our eyeballs. Like, we can't even afford it. It's a a shock yeah so we got to do something absolutely do something okay so the spreadsheet nerd who needed a strategy goes to the class and what did you come out with

ronnie where you had a what light bulb moment did you have aha moment where you went oh you know dave it's it's amazing when you go to this class you it's a big support group that i think everybody really needs to be a part of and because we lived in a very high-end area and it was just amazing how much debt everybody had and we're like wow like you know there's a big support group and you know this is a great way let's start with the baby steps. And we did that. We had a bunch of savings saved up, and we used a lot of that to kickstart our gazelle intensity, and it really helped.

How much? We had about $10,000. Okay. That was hard for a nerd. It was. It was. Write that check out, clean out that savings account. Oh!

Yes, sir. It takes your breath away. So, Veronica, the spender goes to class. You wanted to go to class, but then you get in there, and there had to be a moment where you go, I'm not sure I like this. Well, it wasn't so much that I didn't like it. I just felt like I needed, like I said, strategies to help me, because I didn't want to be in debt either. And I just felt like there was just a huge cloud over us all the time.

So what was your biggest takeaway then where you went, ah, I see that now? Everything about it was awesome, honestly. I think it was realizing our roles and with him being the nerd that he is and then me just coming to my senses and saying you know is this is this material thing something that i really need to have and using the envelope system really helped me and map out our budget and you know this is the amount of money we need to pay for our groceries this is you know this is how much we can give to the church, and this is how much we can give people for gifts and whatnot. And so I just needed a layout.

And once we implemented those steps, we were just, let's do this. You sound a little bit like Rachel. Rachel Cruz says that a budget is permission to spend. I love your daughter. She's amazing. Permission to spend. Okay. Yeah, and that's exactly what it is it's i've there were some times

when i just felt like we didn't have any money that's the mindset i had to give myself was okay we don't have money for this but you know it's there if we wanted it but you know when it i'm in control of the budget but once i said it i let it control me that's right yeah very very good okay so we know uncle was a cheerleader. We know your brother was a cheerleader. And you had the community that you got plugged into were cheerleaders. Who else was your biggest cheerleader? I think, I mean, we're really close to our families. And my family, all of them are very supportive of us.

We both come from five brothers, or not five brothers, five kids from each family, so two brothers and two sisters. So we come from a big family, but they were all supportive of us, really, and our friends as well. Very cool. So what do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is now that you've done it? I think the key thing, Dave, is being on the same page. Communication is key. And, you know, we went to the Money in Marriage, and we were listening to a lot of the other couples.

And none of them have gone through the financial piece, but they've gone through a lot of seminars. And I think if they had gone through the seminar or the Financial Peace University, they would really get on the same page. And it would just really explode once they get through that and follow the steps. Yeah. And just, you know, writing down our goals was really important for us to do. And once we had that, you know, we're very goal-driven, especially being in sales. Yeah, you've got to be. Once we, you know, we have that target and we wanted to hit it.

And so just staying focused and dedicated and disciplined um really really helped us well done you guys i'm very proud of you very well done you're a sharp couple less and rachel at that marriage and money thing or it's virtually stand-up comedy because they're both about couple cut-ups yeah they really are funny and they're both funny in the green room too by the way but i mean it's the same thing. So, wow. Well, well done, well done. We've got a copy of Chris Hogan's book for you, Retire Inspired. I want that to be the next chapter in your story, that you're now millionaires and you're well on your way.

And then, of course, outrageously generous as you go along. Very, very well done. I'm proud of you. All right, Ronnie and Veronica, Houston, Texas, 75,000 paid off in 17 months, making 110 to 130. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free!

Oh, that is fun, fun stuff. Man, that's about as good as it gets right there. Life is good. All I needed was a strategy. All I needed was a strategy. All I needed was a strategy. We've got to get on the same page. We've got to get on the same page.

Communication and a budget. You hear it over and over and over again, don't you? So tonight, you turn off the television, you put the kids to bed, get out the credit cards and a pair of scissors and have a plasectomy, and you and your spouse sit down, open up the EveryDollar app, and do your first budget. Because you work too hard to be broke. You work too hard to be broke.

You deserve better. Well, it's time you went and got you some, baby. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. our scripture of the day first corinthians 9 24 do you not know that in a race all the runners run but one gets the prize. Run in such a way as to get the prize. H. Jackson Brown said, in the confrontation between the stream and the rock, the stream always wins, not through strength, but by perseverance. Our question of the day comes from Blinds.com. Find out for yourself why Blinds.com is the number one online retailer of custom window coverings. You get free samples, free shipping, and with the new promos that they run every month, you'll save even more.

Use the promo code RAMSY to get the best deal. Rules and restrictions apply. Stevens in Florida. Dave, I'm approaching retirement from the Air Force after 22 years. I've got the opportunity to opt for survivor benefits for my wife on my pension. I realize the ideal option would be just to have a term policy that would replace my pension, but the price of the policy is a bit more than the cost of the survivor benefit program. Should I just consider this as a term life policy that goes away after me and my wife pass, or is it worth the extra to pass it on to the next generation?

I'm not worried about the next generation. I'm worried about her as a survivor benefit or not having a survivor benefit. So if you're not going to take the survivor benefit, you're going to buy the term life insurance to cover the drop in income that your household will have when you die. And I think you need to check Xander Insurance and the value of the survivor benefit annually, whatever she would receive annually times 10 or 12 is all you need in term life insurance and i don't think that's going to be more than the drop

uh typically you'll come out a lot better off doing that because you get so much more money by not taking the survivor benefit but you can look at it and run the numbers out. But I think you've either tried to purchase too much term life insurance or purchase it for too long, or you've got an ailment or you're overweight or something like that, or you shopped for insurance the wrong place. Because those numbers that you're giving me wouldn't normally turn out that way. So check further into it and uh but but certainly you know the big the main goal here is after all these years of serving your country you want to make sure your wife is taken care of when something happens to you whether it's with term or with the survivor benefit i don't care which one but let's just run the math out and figure that out. Check Zander Insurance and talk this through with them.

Zander, Z-A-N-D-E-R, zanderinsurance.com. All right, Carol is with us in San Francisco. Hey, Carol, how are you? I'm fine, Dave. Thank you for taking my call. I've been listening to you for a couple of years. Thank you. Can you speak directly into your phone? You're a little fuzzy.

Carol. Carol. Carol. Can you speak directly into your phone? You're a little fuzzy. Carol. Carol. Carol, can you speak directly into your phone? You're a little fuzzy. Okay, is that better? Yes, ma'am. Thank you. Okay.

We have three grown sons. The oldest is financially set. Our youngest is financially underwater, but he came to us, and rather than bailing him out, we bought him Financial Peace University. Okay. Our main concern is our middle son, who has our three grandchildren. He's 40.

His finances come from donations, you know, support from people, friends and relatives and that type of thing. This last summer we gave them $14,000 and that amount because they could get that without having to pay any taxes on it as they were going to a training session across country. I'm sorry, he lives off of donations? Off of financial support from friends and relatives and that type of thing, yes. For what reason? Why does he not have an income? He does have an income through that. From donations from his relatives?

From friends and relatives around the country, yes. Why? Is he in ministry or something? Yes, yes, he's in ministry or something? Yes. Oh, okay. So he has a support group for supporting the ministry that he is in. Correct. And he has three kids.

He has three children. So last summer we gave them $14,000 to go cross-country and to do some financial things that they needed. Well, then in October they came to us saying that they needed some, they were going to have to rent another house, and they needed money to get out of the contract that they were in and to buy a new refrigerator and stove in this new place.

Your phone is breaking up again. You're going to have to speak directly into it, darling. Okay. What part didn't you hear? I heard it all, but it's just getting hard to hear. So keep speaking straight into it. So come to find out, I found out that they bought season passes to Disneyland and that my daughter-in-law went to Cancun and an all-inclusive

trip. But yet in October, then they came to us and saying they needed these finances and stuff. I'm not up for that. We also did put them through Financial Peace University. They told us that they had finance help available to them through their company. I'm sorry, their company? Well, through their ministry. Oh, okay. Yeah, through their ministry. So, you know, they are going to be getting quite a lump sum when we die but um until then do we keep financing and enabling them to live without their means no no they're using the ministry as an excuse to be irresponsible that's my feeling

no it's what you just described right when i can't pay my rent and i have to go to my mother-in-law for rent after i went to a trip to cancun that's kind of a problem that is a problem yeah so no i think now do you live in the same area that they're in they live in southern california we live in northern california okay will you be with them in person anytime soon no okay all right well i think maybe that you and your husband get on the phone with the two of them and and here's what it sounds like if i'm you guys okay you can do whatever you want but you're asking me so this is what i would do if this was my kid um i would just say look we've given you money for years we love you we love our grandkids. We feel like we are giving a drunk a drink. We feel like we're enablers because you continue to misbehave with money and come to us as your backstop every time.

We don't mind helping you, but we don't feel like we're helping you anymore. We feel like we're harming you because we're financing your irresponsibility, thereby encouraging it. And we don't want to do that anymore because we love you too much. We want what God wants for you, and that is a life of abundance. And you're not living a life of abundance. You're living a life of financial stress because you're disorganized and you have your priorities out of whack. Now, you can be mad at us.

We don't want you to be mad at us. We love you. We love the grandkids, and we want to help you. But we're not going to just willy-nilly give you money anymore. You're going to go through Financial Peace University. We're going to pay for it, or we're not going to give you any more money, and we need to let you know that, and that is an act of love on our part, not an act of vengeance, not an act of anger. We love you, and we don't want to cause you to continue to be irresponsible. And giving you money and financing your irresponsibility is causing that. And we've come to realize we've brought you harm, and we don't want to harm you. We love you too much.

Okay. You know, when they came to us wanting more money for this move and everything, I said, well, what happened to the $14,000 that we gave you this summer? And he says, Mom, we are adults. We don't need to tell you what we're doing with our money. That's right. You don't. And then you don't get my money.

Yeah. People who will not take my advice and will not be accountable for the behaviors will not get money. Okay. So he's being an arrogant, entitled person. Yeah, yeah. Okay, well, that supports my feeling. My husband says, well, what about grace, Carol?

It's not grace. Grace is being kind to someone and lifting them up when they're hurting. It's not giving a drunk a drink. Right. When you encourage someone's crazy or you encourage someone's irresponsibility by financing it, that's not grace. That's called enabling. It's a psychological disorder.

That puts us out of the Dave Ramsey Show and the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus. This is James Childs, producer of The Dave Ramsey Show. Did you know you can now listen to The Dave Ramsey Show on Pandora and Spotify? For all the ways to watch and listen, check out our show page at DaveRamsey.com slash show.