The Ramsey Show - App - DAVE RANT: Don't Make Decisions Based on Public Panic! (Hour 1)

Episode Date: March 9, 2020

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. Open phones this hour at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. For those of you that are as old as me, you remember this. When we were kids, we used to have these things called service stations. They're different than gas stations because someone would actually come out to your car and pump your gas for you.

And I distinctly remember on Nolensville Road, the main drag ride down from our home, that there was a service station on three different corners of a possible four-corner intersection, three of them competing with each other. Occasionally, a sign would go up that would say, gas war. If you're old, you remember gas wars. Your local gas stations would compete with each other, and one of them would drop the price, and everybody would go over there, and the other one would drop the price more, and everybody would go over there,

and the other one would drop the price more, and they would all go over there. And this competition in the marketplace without government intervention drove the prices down until the guys got tired of it, and then they just kind of raised all the prices back up. But we'd go through a period of time that this head-to-head competition caused a gas war. And it was competition, and it turned out to be good for us because we didn't have a lot of money, and we could put gas in our tank because it was cheaper. Well, guess what?

Russia and the Middle East have decided to have an oil war. Not a war where they're shooting at each other, but where they're driving the price of oil down dramatically. It's dropped 33% over the weekend. Now, you know, those gas stations I was talking about, when they dropped their prices, everybody helped me with this. Did they make more money or less money? With lower prices, they made less money, okay? Everybody knows this, right? Their profits went down, didn't it?

But they got customers, and they got to stay in business by competing. So guess what happens when the price of oil goes down to guys like Chevron and Exxon and people like that? Their profits go down because the price of their barrel of oil went down that they're sucking out of the ground. You do know that means you're about to get some cheap gas in the coming weeks for your car, right, people? If oil drops 33%, do you not think it's going to affect your dadgum price at the pump?

Yes, it will. Okay, because the gas war will, or the oil war, which gas is made out of oil, will turn into a gas war at the pump around here. It won't have a little sign up that says gas war. It's probably politically incorrect. You'll probably get put in jail. But end of the day is you guys are going to get some cheap gas because this is driven down. Now, you think it's going to stay down? No, no more than the gas war between the gas stations continued forever. It's not going to stay down. And so Exxon's going to survive and Chevron's going to survive and BP's going to survive and Halliburton's going to survive. Everybody, all these oil stocks that are driven by profit in the oil business. But guess what?

They're part of the Dow Jones Industrial Average. And when their profits go away to the tune of 33% over the weekend, guess what their stock price does? It goes down. Oh, let's mix that with all of you people have completely lost your mind over the coronavirus and everybody's scared out of their brains and can't even think clearly now. Oh, and now we have a wonderful buying opportunity on the stock market today. The stock market is tanked based on this oil war and the coronavirus. Now, let me help you with this. My friend Art Laffer, who is one of the leading economists in the world, without a doubt, has a great saying. He says, people don't make good decisions when they're drunk, and they don't make good decisions when they're panicked.

If you're thinking about pulling your money out of the stock market because you think the coronavirus is going to destroy the U.S. economy, you are a panicked fool. You're a fool. Southwest Air's stock price is down 30%. Do you think Southwest Air has lost 30% of its value because of the coronavirus in reality? I mean, learn to do a little basic math here.

That means that throughout the next five years, their rides on their planes would have to be down 30% for them to have permanently lost 30% of their value. That's asinine. You're panicked or you're drunk. I don't know which it is or both. That's ridiculous. And so the stock market going down is as artificial as it can be. It is based on drunk people, panicked people in an oil war. And that's what it's based on. This is the best buying opportunity in 10 or 15 years on

the stock market today because these numbers are down artificially these companies have not lost all of this money they've not lost all of this value do you think cruise lines dropped 40% in value over the last 16 days? Come on. How dumb are you? Okay, listen, here's the deal. 40,000 people will die of car wrecks this year in the U.S. 14,000 people have died of the flu so far in the U.S., and around 40,000 will die of the flu this year in the U.S.

22 people have died of the coronavirus. And yet you cannot find a bottle of that hand-washing stuff anywhere in any store in America today. You would think the stuff was gold. If you got a case of it, you ought to put it on eBay overnight because some panicked fool will pay you $8,000 an ounce for that stuff. People have lost their minds. They've lost their minds. Now, I don't want the coronavirus, and I don't want you to die of the coronavirus,

and I don't want you to die of the flu, and I don't want you to die in a car wreck. I don't want anybody to die. I want everybody to live and have a good life. I'm here for you. But you're sacrificing your entire freaking retirement because you're panicked because you watch too much news. You need to turn off the news. You need to turn off. Let me tell you, the level of anxiety you have is directly tied to the number of hours a day you spend watching news. If you just turn it off and open up your Bible, my friend Zig Ziglar used to say, I read the

newspaper every morning and I read the Bible every morning so I can tell what both sides are doing. And, you know, I tell you what, you're just going to have to think, people, when you're drunk and when you're panicked, you don't make good decisions. Usually, as soon as I get really, really scared, right after that, I get really, really desperate and I scared right after that i get really really desperate and i get right right after that really really stupid and cashing out your retirement account or stopping your investing or bailing on your 401k because you've watched too much news is absolutely asinine do not do that as a matter of fact if you've got some extra money it's a good

week to put some money in now i, I don't believe in market timing. I don't have a single dollar allocated in my personal budget for timing the market. So all of my purchases of mutual funds are on autopilot. They just go when they go. But I'm kind of regretting that right this second because, man, I could turn a million dollars into two million so fast right now. Thank you to Russia, and thank you to the Middle East for driving the oil prices down, because I'm going to get a cheap tank of gas from my big butt Raptor pretty soon out of you people. And I'm going to grin all the way to the bank

when this stock market comes right straight back up, and the rest of you are standing on the sidelines going, I lost half my retirement because you you panic. Listen, there are some basic things that you should be doing to take care of your family. A roof over their head, food to eat, even if it's rice and beans, a car to get you from A to B, and term life insurance. Term life insurance is an immediate need no matter where you are in the baby steps since your family is at no greater risk than when you're in debt. That's why I tell you to get 10 to 12 times your income in coverage to replace those lost dollars and do it with a 15 or a 20 year guaranteed level term plan so you can

make sure your family is protected long term the only place i send you is to zander insurance they shop all the top insurance companies and they're committed to serving you that's why i use them and why i've recommended them for over 20 years whether you prefer to work online or you need personalized assistance, you pick your path. Go to Zander.com or call 800-356-4282. Please, please get this done. It is an absolute necessity. Thank you for being with us, America. Hannah is with us in Iowa.

Hannah, welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? So I am going to be getting married in May, and my fiancé has a lot of in May and I will be married. My fiance has a lot of debt, so I'll be marrying into that. And I am totally on board with the baby steps and your whole thought process and philosophy when it comes to getting out of debt and so on and so forth. But my fiance is having a little bit of a harder time getting on board because he wants to experience life a little bit but i'm like we won't have the funds to do that so i'm trying to get him to get on board but i don't know how to do that okay how old are you guys i am 23 and he's 28 he's going

to be a doctor oh good for him a medical doctor an md he's going to be a DL. A DL. Okay, and when will he graduate? He will be graduating a week before we get married. Oh, great. And how much debt does he have? $340,000. Okay. A DL, you said.

I don't know what that is. I'm sorry. It's a DL. It's osteopathic medicine. Oh, okay. Okay. All right. And how long have you guys been dating?

We've been together for almost three years. Okay. And how much pre-marriage counseling have you done? We are actually in the midst of it right now. Good. Okay. Bring this up with your marriage counselor okay the reason i tell you that is the number one reason the couples fight in america today

and the number one cause of divorce in america today is money fights and money problems you have both you're marrying a broke doctor yeah you are marrying into a freaking mess okay and in people who study medicine generally like him are are intellectually brilliant people and sometimes what goes with that is they think that that makes them intellectually brilliant about every subject and a lot of doctors that i meet are arrogant and broke for that reason i meet more music people who have money than doctors broke doctors are a stereotype in the business i'm in because of what you're facing right there. We've got a young, very smart man, very deeply in debt,

and he has confused his intellect with his ability to grasp what the debt is, and you're marrying into this. So it's not a death sentence. The patient is not terminally ill. They can be brought back around. But I think your marriage counselor is probably the best place to do that. But if you marry this guy and he is intent on being in not dealing with this huge freaking mess he has made, you are going to have a long life, darling.

It's going to be problems. You are going to have a long life, darling. It's going to be problems. You're going to have problems because you're calling me already asking for help. So we know there's going to be problems, right? So he's not a bad guy. He's a very smart guy. He's a very disciplined person because you don't finish med school without being smart and disciplined. So he's got a lot of wonderful attributes. You've picked a fine young man to marry except for this one problem that's going to have to be dealt with.

And I would make a big deal out of this in the pre-marriage counseling if I were you. This is the same advice I would give my daughter were I counseling her on this issue. Okay? Because it's a problem. I mean, if the number one cause of divorce in North America were green cars, you would never buy a green car. Right? So whatever the main cause of problems are, you stay away from it, is my point. And you guys are walking straight into it.

So you've got to be on the same page on how you're going to fight it. And if you're on the same page, then you can take his wonderful new income he's going to make and clean up this horrible mess he's made pretty quick. He's going to have a big shovel to go with the big hole he's in. So he's going to be okay as long as he graduates and passes his boards and everything. You're going to be fine. But you're not going to be fine with his YOLO mentality. You only thank god it's friday oh god it's monday this is the this is the language of losers okay and you're so i'm trying to scare you without being melodramatic

i'm not telling you to call off the wedding but i am saying warning warning warning warning bridge out slow down make sure the bridge is in place take a detour whatever you got to do here but hopefully he'll come around pretty quickly i'll help you with that um and you can play this back for him because everything i said about him is true and i'm happy to say it to his face um because i really think he's a smart guy i really do he's just not wise there's a difference in intellect and wisdom and so uh but hold on i'll have kelly pick up i'm going to give you a wedding present it's called financial peace university it's a nine-week class you can go ahead and take that before the wedding that'll be a compliment to your pre-marriage counseling

and uh if he goes through that class um i'll get him. Don't worry about it. I'll turn him around. If you can get him to go to the class, I'll get him. And I'm going to give it to you free, by the way. I'm losing money on this transaction just to help you. But then someday when you guys are rich doctors and you're out of debt, you can help some young doc who's getting ready to make the same mistake. Thank you for the call. Hold on, Kelly.

I'll pick up. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Rebecca is on the line in Texas. Hi, Rebecca. How are you? Hi there. Thank you for taking my call. I'm very nervous.

It's okay. We've never lost a patient. How can I help? Okay, good. I'm calling because I'm a professor, and I'm on Baby Step 4. I contribute the minimum amount to get the match through my 403B. Good. My question is with the leftover 15%, so there's 9% left of my income that I still need to be

putting into retirement. My question is I'm offered two things. Through my university, I can contribute to what's called a tax deferred annuity plan. It's pre-tax. Right. I also have a Roth IRA that I've contributed just a tiny bit over the years into. What is your income? My income pre-tax is $70,000 a year. Okay. Then what you'll be able to do is to just get a simple Roth IRA in good growth stock mutual funds from one of our SmartVestor pros, and

that'll finish it out. Here's the math. The math is kind of a rock, paper, scissors thing, sort of, except there's only one direction. Match beats Roth beats traditional. Okay. So you did the right. You took the match. Up to the match is number one, because you can't beat 100% return on your money

before you even get started. Even with taxes, that comes out ahead. Okay? Then you do Roth, which is what I'm telling you to do. Go do an individual Roth, and you can do $6,000 a year into an individual Roth, and that will get you to your 9% that you're looking for because that grows tax-free. The other stuff that you have available is just tax-deferred, and the difference is humongous when you get to retirement to not have taxes on the entire million dollars or to have taxes

on the entire million dollars or whatever it is you've been able to accumulate in your investments. So match beats Roth beats traditional. So we want to do all our match we can do first, then we do all the Roth we can do next. And if that doesn't get us all the way to the 15%, then we would do some traditional pre-tax, and that would work great for you.

Really, really good question. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Remember, with the stock market down, the deal is real simple. No one gets hurt on a roller coaster except those that jump off in the middle of the ride. Ride it out. Ride it out. Ride it out. When the stock market dove in half from a $13,000 to a $6,300 in 2008,

if you didn't bail out, you would have gone from $6,300 all the way to $30,000. You would have made 5x your money from 2008 at the bottom to this year. In 12 years, you would have 5x'd your money from 08 at the bottom to this year. In 12 years, you would have 5X'd your money. Now it's back down a little bit. Ride it down, sweetie. Don't pull your money out. Ride the wave. Be a money surfer.

Oh, my goodness gracious. The coronavirus is not going to bring an end to America as we know it. Come on, people. Seriously. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. I love talking about companies that know how to do business right. You've heard of Grip6 belts, right? Well, if you haven't, it's the only belt you can get online with no holes, no flap, and no bulk. I'm talking weightless, and the buckles come in really

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Hey, Josh, how are you? Hey, Dave, how are you? Good to have you, man. Where do you live? In Boone, North Carolina. Oh, beautiful area. Welcome to Nashville. Thank you, sir.

And all the way over here to do a debt-free scream. Absolutely. Brought my whole family with me. All right. Look at you. How much you paid off? $31,296.37. Love it. How long did this take?

About 11 and a half months. You did it in under a year. Yes, sir. I got after it. And your range of income during that year? While I was working, the debt snowballed. It was about $50,000. Okay. What do you do for a living? I'm an HR manager. Oh, good.

Yes, sir. Okay. What kind of debt was the $31,000? Most of it was student loans. And of course, I bought a car when I got out of college because I thought I deserved more. Of course. Yeah, that's normal. Yeah. All right. Good. Yeah. Very cool. Very cool. So $31,000. How's it feel? It's amazing. I feel like I can do so much more with my life and I can help others and change my change change my family tree yeah it's amazing when'd you graduate from school uh in 2014 okay yeah december 2014 so you go along a few years kind of being normal after graduation yeah uh what happened 11 and a half months ago that put you on this crazy land you know i've always taken a lot longer than other people to do everything uh you know

when i graduated i kind of didn't know exactly what i want to do with my career uh you know just i had some part-time jobs here and there and you know about 11 and a half months ago a year ago i was like man i know i have all this debt it's just every time somebody brings it up i get so stressed out you know i just don't want to talk about it like i gotta get rid of this stuff and you know i was i got XM Radio in my car. I had a free subscription, and I saw your podcast on there. And I turned it on, started listening to you, and I was like, you know, I kind of agree with some of this stuff, but some of it doesn't make sense mathematically.

And I said, but, you know, it sounds like a lot of people listen to it, so, you know, let me give it a chance. So I actually called somebody here at Ramsey Solutions, and I asked them about Baby Step 2 to it. So, you know, let me give it a chance. So I actually called somebody here at Ramsey Solutions and I asked them about Baby Step 2. And I said, you know, I'm not really sure, you know, why you pay off, you know, the smallest at first regardless of the interest rate. And they said, you know, it's not about the mathematical side. You know, it's about the behavioral side. And, you know, so I was like, you know, that kind of makes sense. You know, and it still took me a little while to figure that out. But I said, you know what, I'm going to, you know, immerse myself in it.

You know, I'm going to give it a chance. You know, the worst thing I can do is, you know, give it a shot and it doesn't work. So I tried it, started getting some momentum. And I saw we had an FPU course right next to my house. I said, you know what, I'm going to go to it. I went to that and, you know, I had two of the best coordinators, Sarah and Nathan McLeese. Shout out to them. I think they're listening right now. I love it. And it's been great. I did that a couple months into it. You know, my parents were, you know, they were really interested in hearing how well I was doing. My brother and his wife and

their little boy were listening. And I decided to actually teach it at my parents' house. Oh, my gosh. I still had a little bit of time left with my subscription. So I figured, you know, go through the course with them. And, you know, they were all a little hesitant at first. You know, people think, oh, that's a good idea. I don't know if it's quite for me. But, you know, we'll listen to you.

And, you know, we got into lesson two. And they're like, okay, some of it is starting to make sense. And they're like you know what let's let's hop on this with you oh wow so it really whole whole gang yeah all of them here yeah wow look at you it's amazing yeah and uh you know it's it's so great uh my baby brother he's actually going going to uh the college of the ozarks uh-huh uh he's going to school completely duck free i think you've heard it before i've spoken there yeah i'm actually wearing the shirt there, so hopefully he's seeing me wear it right now. I love it! Yeah, so my

brother and his wife are actually debt-free as of two weeks ago. Wow! They just had a little boy. He's a year old. Wes, right there. I think you met him during the show. I did. That's wonderful. Okay. Way to go. Very well done. So it's just turned everything around. It's helped. One year later, who would have thought?

Oh, I can't believe it. I can't believe I'm sitting here talking to you. One year later. Wow. Yeah. So now that you've taught Financial Peace University, you've taught it to your family, you've been through it, you actually are a success. You have paid off $31,000.

When someone asks what the secret to getting out of debt is, what do you tell them? I tell them, obviously, I don't know if everybody says it on the show, but the budget, you know, you have to do the budget. Everybody says it, but why? Why do they need to do the budget? Because you don't know. I mean, I have friends that tell me, oh, you know, I know how much I spend in each year.

I know how much I spend on gas. I know how much I spend on my rent. And I'm like, okay, well, you know, can you tell me exactly what you have budgeted for your food for this month i think it's about 500 500 ish whatever they asked me i'm like for 11 months my food budget was 280 dollars okay they're like there's no way in heck you do that yeah i'm like yeah i actually do yeah i have it right here on my app i can show you yeah yeah i track it it's so important i mean i didn't realize how much money not in just in food but you know in certain areas how much i was spending how much i could throw at the debt

and yeah i mean you were you were hitting us at 2500 bucks a month oh i was hammering i had i had about 13 000 in savings and i thought i thought to myself i was like this is my money but then once i started on the program like you know what i have all this debt this is not my money i owe you know i've already i've already debt. This is not my money. I owe, you know. I've already gone through it. I'm negative. I have a negative, you know, negative, you know, net worth. This is not my money. So, you know, one of the hardest things for me was to take that money and go down to $1,000.

I mean, it crushed me. But then once I did that, it really lit a fire in me to, you know, get some momentum and, you know, build that back up. That's when you signed up. Yeah, absolutely. That's when it happened. Right. I love it. Well, congratulations, sir.

We're very proud of you. I know your parents, your brothers, sisters are very, very well done, sir. You're a hero. You took control of your life. How old are you? I'm 28. And you're free. I'm free, yes, sir.

You ever borrow to buy another car? Oh, no. No, I'm not borrowing anything. Everything's cash, you anything. Everything's cash. It's amazing. Thank you so much. You've done so much for me and my family. And you've changed.

And they're friends, too. They're telling people about them back home, and people are interested in it. It's just created such a positive ripple effect for me and my family and friends. Thank you so much. You did all that. I'm so proud of you. Well done, sir. Thank you.

Thank you, sir. Thanks for partnering with us absolutely very very cool well we've got a copy of chris hogan's book for you everyday millionaires because you are definitely destined to be one thank you you are you have all the attributes the character qualities and the habits that are going to take you right straight to that thank you so really really well done j Josh from Boone, North Carolina. $31,000 paid off in 11 and a half months making 50K. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. I'm debt-free.

Yeah. Yeah. I love it well that's how it's done that's how it's done and see you can change your family tree you can change everything and he's changing it like every direction right

I mean he went up the family tree and changed it not just out the branch right so you got mom and dad got his brothers sisters going you can do this and the interesting thing is you don't have to be like abrasive about it you don't have to be a jerk about it you just go this is what i'm doing this is what i'm doing and then when they see the change in you and they see the success in you then they go well it'd be kind of nice maybe i ought to try that and it. And it opens up a positive conversation.

And so you can't beat somebody over the top of the head with a book, but you can show them your life transformation, and that's really not deniable. You can't really, there's no argument for that. I mean, my old pastor used to say, a man with an experience is not at the mercy of a man with an opinion. When you've been there, you've experienced something. Someone who has an opinion about it, I mean, I don't have to be mean to them, but they're just wrong.

They're just wrong. And there is things that are right and things that are wrong, by the way. Some of you think you get to make up your own truth and you are seriously confused individuals so the deal is is that there's right and there's wrong there's things that work and things that don't work and um how you feel about it is not relevant so when you walk your life out in front of someone the way josh did and he said look i'm actually paid off thirty one thousand dollars and then pretty soon that infects everyone can't probably shouldn't use the word infected right now in america people freak out but um probably need a vaccine a vaccine for something that gets infected but um yeah i mean it affects everyone around you when they see your transformation. I had a friend of mine that lost 170 pounds.

He lost a Backstreet Boy. I mean, I'm just like, wow. You can't really argue with that when you're looking at big boy made skinny, right? I mean, there's no arguing about it. He did it. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. our question of the day comes from blinds.com find out for yourself why blinds.com is the number one online retailer of custom window coverings you get free samples free shipping and with the new promos they run

every month you'll save even more the promo code is ramsey donna has our question of the day from indiana she says i'm a new listener i'm debt free i have about two years before i'll be ready and i'll be able to make a wise real estate purchase for myself. Good for you. Where would you suggest I place my monies for those two years, a money market, a mutual fund, or just a plain Jane savings account? Well, I would not put it in mutual funds because, as you know, the stock market goes up and the stock market goes down,

and it could go down right about the time you're getting ready to buy a house, and that money you've saved for your down payment would be less than what you've actually put in there, and we don't want to do that. So if you're going to leave money alone five years or longer, I would ride the market with a mutual fund, because you have a high probability of making money then. About 90 some odd percent of the five-year periods in the stock market's history have made money but only 67 percent uh two out of three of the three-year periods have made money two years even worse so when you've got a five-year window or less i don't try to make money i just try to let it sit and the difference in a plain jane savings account in the money market account is a half a percent which is a nice amount but it's not going to make you be able to buy a house or not. Right. And so you don't want to do

that. I mean, you can do a money market account. There's no risk in that. And you're going to make one, one and a half, one and a quarter, depending on what the market's doing. And, you know, your plain Jane savings account is going to pay you half of that. So you make a little bit more on the money market, and you can probably get that at your local credit union or bank. If you can't, jump into one of the mutual fund companies and get you one. They're very easy to set up. It's just an account that's just a savings account that pays more money.

That's all it is. It's all a money market account is. So you do not use a CD, a certificate of depression, because you're locking the money up and you're not making enough more money for what you're locking it up to get. So just use a money market if you want to. That's as fancy as you need to get there. Doesn't need to be fancy.

Taylor is with us in Texas. Hi, Taylor. How are you? I'm doing good, Dave. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? Well, so, you know, you were talking about the coronavirus earlier,

and I am definitely excited about getting a lower rate. I actually have the crazy opportunity to drop my interest rate by 3%. Oh, wow. And so, yeah, I know. I'm going from a 30-year mortgage, and I'm actually saving monthly payment. I'm actually saving on my monthly payment going to either a 15 or a 20. My question is this. I know that you suggest always 15, and I'm pretty sure I know the answer to this,

but I just want to get assurance from you personally. There is an opportunity for a 20-year. So I'm in Baby Step 2, so I don't have a lot of money on hand, so the closing cost is my biggest concern. So do you suggest in the wave of 15-year that I just take on the closing costs on top of my loans? Yes. Because while that's true,

I'd be saving over $300,000 in a 15-, 20-year period. Yeah, I would do a 15-year and I'd roll your closing costs in if you're in Baby Step 2. I wouldn't come out of pocket with them in Baby Step 2. Perfect, yeah. I will gladly come out of pocket with them in baby step two. Perfect. Yeah. I will gladly reach out to the person today and I'm going to go from a 30 to a 15 year and save money monthly. Cool. Be sure you check Churchill Mortgage and shop with them too, because they do a really good job of service, but their rates are also uber competitive. So be sure you check them. Hey man,

you got it all figured out. You're right on the right track. Sarah's with us in New York. Hi, Sarah. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi. Thanks for taking my call, Dave. I'm a little nervous and overwhelmed, so I'll just give you all the facts real quick. I'm a meteorologist. I make 49K. I'm at $90,000 in debt.

And I did my budget on your budget app, and it looks like it's going to take me about 20 years to get out of debt. Let me break down my income real quick. Okay, wait, wait, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop. Okay. You have $90,000 in debt. I do.

On what? It took me a while to figure out what I wanted to do. What's that mean? Student loans? Oh, sorry. Yes, student loans. No credit cards, just adult student loans. No car payment?

No car payment. Nope, I got a 2004 car. Okay. I live 20 minutes outside of town, and my rent's 22% of my income. Gotcha. But what's taking up a lot of my income is my agent's 5% of my income. The union wants 3%. What status?

Say that again. What's taking up a lot of your income? Sorry. So I pay my agent 5% of my income, and then I'm part of a union because I work for, I know I work for the news, but I'm weather, so I'm not the bad guy. But the union wants 3%, and then I have to pay for hair, makeup, and clothing out of my own income, and I don't get reimbursed for that. I have no idea how to up my income because my contract, because I work on TV, they own my image, so I can't do things like Uber and Lyft and any part-time jobs because they don't approve those. How do I up my income when I have my hands tied behind my back?

And my contract is for another two years, and I've been in the business for three years so far. Okay. Well, I mean, there's only two sides to the equation, the income side and the outgo side. And if you violate the contract, that means you get out of the business is what you'd have to do. And the only reason you would do that is if you could make a complete career change

and make a whole lot more money. That would be the only reason you would walk away from this. I have no idea what I could do with this degree. Well, I mean, I don't either. But so I think when your contract comes up, your agent needs to earn their money, and that would free up the idea that maybe you own your image this next go-round. And so maybe we don't take as big a raise, but I own my image, and allowing me to do outside work of some kind.

I've got several friends in the business, as you might guess, and I know two of them that are meteorologists that actually do some speaking engagements, and they get paid for that, and that might be a way to do something that's consistent with your career track. I'm sorry? No, I'm sorry. It's not my agent that owns the image. The station owns my image so the station doesn't allow me to like no i know you didn't understand your agent is supposed

to represent you in the contract negotiation and they should do their job which is free up your image so that you can make some side money on the next contract negotiation as a matter of fact they might bring it up ahead of time before the contract renegotiates okay because this is costing you some money a year like 10 or 20 thousand bucks minimum if you could get out there because you're well known in your community and and uh if you did things that didn't bring shame or damage the brand of the uh station you should be able to do those for extra money considering they don't give you extra money when there's a storm and you have to stay there all night. That's so true. Yeah, you don't even get overtime.

Do you get those for extra money? I'm sorry? I didn't know I could get paid for it, because I do those things for free right now through the station. Well, if the station asks you to do them as a community service thing for the benefit of the lift of the station, you could. But like I say, I've got two friends that are meteorologists, and they both do some speaking on the side as well.

But they've been in the business longer than you have. And again, I don't know how competitive your market is in that particular town for meteorologists. And I don't know, you know, how, how much strength you have with your ratings and popularity to be able to negotiate the contract or for that matter, be able to renegotiate it in the middle of the term of the contract. Uh, but I'd be pushing on the income side of this. Uh, but then the other side is, is you've dig into your budget and go, where else can

I cut? Is the union mandatory in your situation? because they're not doing anything for you that's for sure we can tell that because your deal sucks so um the uh but but you know cut them out if you need to i don't care but look down through there and go, okay, how can I accomplish the look I need on the air and spend less money on the look, the hair, the nails, the clothing, and so forth. And wardrobe is expensive. It really is. So I understand you've got a situation that may be a little while before you can work your way out of some of these things. But there's only two sides of the equation, the income side and the outgo side. And you need to attack both of them if you're going to get out of debt so interesting call thank you

for joining us don't know that i've ever asked answered a question for a meteorologist directly like that before that's new for me that puts us out of the dave ramsey show in the books our thanks to james childs our producer kelly daniel our associate producer and phone screener i am dave ramsey your host and we'll be back. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Dave Ramsey Show. This episode is over, but if you heard about an event, product, or service and didn't have a chance to write it down, don't worry. We list everything you've heard about during this episode in the podcast show notes or head to DaveRamsey.com. Thanks for listening.