The Ramsey Show - App - DAVE RANT: Renting Versus Buying a Home (Hour 2)

Episode Date: May 7, 2019

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🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions Broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I am Dave Ramsey, your host. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225.

Brady is with us in Des Moines, Iowa. Hi, Brady. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Pleasure to speak with you. Certainly. How can I help? So my wife and I are on baby step three.

We completed our debt-free journey and all last year, came down and did that free screen with you last summer. So we're kind of looking, we're starting that process and looking at houses. We've got the 10% minimum you suggest saved up and are continuing to build that as we look. As we start looking for houses right now, we're kind of noticing that that number we set for our 15% or no more than your 25%,

excuse me, take-home pay, it seems like there's always something major that is a year or two away from needing, you know, a roof for $5,000, $6,000 or appliances, all that sort of thing. But it seems like when we go, if we were to go, you know, that 28%, 29% of the take-home pay, we wouldn't have those issues and you're going to get the more move-in ready house. What would you suggest doing in that term? I think you need to keep looking. Okay.

You haven't found the house. You've just found rationalization. Sure. And here's the house. You've just found rationalization. Sure. And here's the thing. The way you ask yourself the question is not what Dave Ramsey would do, because who gives a rip, really, at the end of the day? But the question you ask yourself is, what is going to cause us to win long-term financially?

And what happens inevitably to me and to you, when we start looking at houses and we start looking at cars, we always see the ones that are nicer. We always do. I was in Florida on a trip for fun, and Sharon and I were considering buying a beach condo. We've now decided not to. Thank you, Jesus.

But we were looking at a vacation home, right? So we start looking at one price, but before we know it, we've got the money. But before we know it, we've crept up almost 50%. Because guess what? Those that that were 50 more expensive were a lot freaking nicer you know it's just a normal human thing to go oh i could get that car but i could get that car you know um it's a normal human thing to let you know it's a creep it's a scope creep kind of thing that happens to us and so i would resist that because i think it's a creep. It's a scope creep kind of thing that happens to us. And so I would resist that because I think it's a good emotional, spiritual, relational exercise to resist that. And I'll give you another example, okay, of just a way to think about it.

You do what you want to do at the end of the day, okay? But I think if you'll stick to your guns five years from now 10 years from now you'll be glad you did even if you put a roof on something or even if you bought a dishwasher you're going to be glad you did because you're going to be moving towards your goals much more rapidly but here's another thing once i decided and sharon decided we no longer borrow money for anything ever i I'm not suggesting that with you. I'm okay with your 15-year fixed, okay? You know the program.

You've been working the program. But I'm just saying, once we had this new guideline, in your case, it's 15-year, no more than a fourth-year take-home pay fixed, right? In my case, it was, I can't buy it if I don't have the money, period. Once we had that guideline, it did two very good things for us. Number one, it ruled out a bunch of stuff. We just can't do that. I just don't have the money. I just can't do that.

I don't have the money. The second thing is, if it was something I was trying to do and I thought I could almost do it, I had to just kind of get creative and figure out a way to pull it off without borrowing money to pull it off. I had to negotiate them down. I had to option the thing and then come back later and buy it when I could get the cash together. I've done that on real estate deals.

That doesn't have the money to close on it right now, but I will have in six months, and so I'd give them some money for an option. I just get creative to where I still get the deal done, but I don't have to violate my guideline, my boundary that I put in place. It made me become a little bit more creative, and it made me learn to say no. And those are the two things I would put on you. It's a different guideline. It's not the debt-free guideline, but it is the 15-yearyear fixed rate where the payments no more than a fourth-year take-home

pay we all get scope creep we all creep up the scope of what we're looking at if it's a dress or a purse or a suit of clothes or a pair of shoes it's it's almost immeasurable if it's a house or car you feel it and see it because the purchase is so much larger. Megan is with us in Norman, Oklahoma. Hi, Megan. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. It's a pleasure to speak with you.

I'm sandrolling a little bit. That's awesome. How can I help? So I am 23 years old. I'm finishing my master's this weekend. Yay! And what? Bluff-painted puppetry or music education.

So, the greatest deal. But I'm on baby step number four, so I have done it completely debt-free. Wonderful. What are you going to do for a living? So, I'm going to be starting my doctoral program at the University of Missouri this fall. Again, that is 100% paid for by the university, stipend, complete tuition paid for. And I also will be working as a music teacher during that time and I have a church job playing organ at a tiny church as well. So my question for you is

looking at moving to this area. Again, I'm on Baby Step 4, so I have my emergency fund. I've got a little bit of cash. I have a Roth IRA that I've been contributing 15% of my income to. And looking at that area, the rent on apartments is really, really high compared to the value of homes. And I know that the program that I'm going to be in is about three years, and there's a good chance that I'm going to be in is about three years, and there's a good chance that I'm going to want to leave after then, but I'm getting a little bit tempted with the idea of

buying a house in that area just because I could probably purchase a home and the mortgage payment would be only about 15% of my take-home pay, whereas finding rental prices that would be under 25% of my take-home pay, you're getting into some scary areas there. You've not done enough shopping because the numbers that you're giving me aren't logical. And the reason they're not logical is if house payments are 15% of your take-home pay and rent is 25% of your take-home pay, there's a lot of landlords out there that are cleaning up. Because if I can buy a house, no, that's just not true. Because what happens is the supply, I mean, the demand will drive the price down.

Or the demand will drive the price up, but a lack of demand. So there's not, you know, the rental market and the house payment always get close to each other by a force of economics. They have to. Now, if you want to buy a house there, I'm okay with that in your situation, but you need to run a couple of numbers. You need to find out what the average days on the market are when you get ready to sell it and what the average increase in value is. And if it's not going to increase in value 5% to 10% a year for three years,

you're going to lose money when you sell it, and you're going to wish you had rented. If it takes you 270 days, nine months to sell your house, you're going to wish you'd never bought it. And so unless it's got a really hot market, it goes up fast and sells easy, you don't want to buy there with a three-year window. Rent. This is big news, guys. You need to stop and listen. The Fed decided not to raise interest rates. That means you've got a small window of time before rates

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That's 888-562-6200 or churchillmortgage.com. Okay, I've had a couple of these calls in the last little while, so I've got to stop and address this for a second. Dave, the rents in our area are so high, so much higher that I can buy a house so much cheaper a month not true you're not comparing apples to apples at least over a period of time it cannot be true economically and let me walk you through why because it's a basic concept but you know again this is the thing where we get scope creep a thing where we get justifying rationalizing buying a house when you're not ready to buy a house or buying a house you can't afford or buying a house in a situation where you shouldn't okay i

love home ownership i always believe long-term owning a home is one of the best plans you can have long term but you need to do it in a wise way so the home is a blessing and not a curse and this stupidity that's out there in the culture including in some of the wonky think tanks it's like all home ownership is down americans are you know the the wealth inequality gap is widening it's difficult to buy a home yeah that's all true but broke people when they buy a home aren't blessed it makes them broker that's why they call them mortgage brokers. And if a whole bunch of broke people buy a house at one time, you could bundle it and sell it on a hedge fund and later on as a regular mortgage block

and actually crash the whole economy back to 2008. Does anybody remember? So it's not a good policy decision, not a good macroeconomic decision, to force people into buying homes or to encourage people to buy homes when they are broke. Now, once you're ready to buy a home, though, and you're looking at rents and you say rents are, you know, $1,500 a month, but I can buy this house for $800 a month. That is just not true long term and here's why it could be true for a moment in a boom town where something's going on like they struck oil okay i mean you get in one of these boom towns you could have that happen. But eventually a supply-demand curve in economics will take effect.

And here's why. Landlords want to have renters, and when there is an abundance of renters willing to pay ridiculous prices, what they do is they start building rental property or buying property and turning it into rental property. And so if there's a house on the market on a street and an individual can buy that house and it's $800 a month or an investor can buy that house and it's $800 a month and he can rent it for $15 and there's an abundance of renters out there, is the reason the price

has driven up? There's a shortage versus the demand anytime demand is higher than supply prices go up okay when there's a shortage on something that's when prices go up in other words okay but what happens is the shortage corrects itself very quickly because those of us that are investors we want to tap into this hot rental market. And so we go buy a bunch of property and turn it into rental property or build a bunch of property and turn it into rental property, which raises the supply back up, thus the shortage goes away. So over time, rents are not going to be double prices of a house price of a monthly payment on a house because investors

that are willing to borrow money or willing to pay cash like i am will buy enough rental property to take advantage of the great rates of return that overpriced rent or an overpriced rental market will do and it will cause the rental to come down or the value of the houses to go up. And so rent always approximates slightly above payments. It always does over time. And so when you call me up and say, oh, I can buy 50% of what I can rent. No, you can't. You're not comparing apples to apples in the neighborhoods.

If you can buy because, investors would have already gobbled that house up and doubled their money. That's the point. And that does away with the shortage, which causes the economics to balance out. Now, again, there might be a six-month period of time where that is not true. But long-term in Missouri, long-term in Boise, long-term in Abilene, that's what happens. If there is a bit of a jump for one reason or another, very quickly it will even out, and most of the time it's already pretty even. Rent is going to be slightly more than payments on average

because investors require renters to pay enough rent so they can pay their payment or so they can get a rate of return on the cash they have tied up, like in my case. I'm not going to tie up money at 4% return in a piece of rental property. I've got to get more rent out of it than that, because I can make more than that on my money doing something else. And so that's going to drive rental rates. That's what we're talking about here. And so these are always going to approximate each other.

Now, if you find a house payment slightly less than rental, that would be normal, and it is not cheaper in that case. So let's say you have a $1,500 rental rate and you have a $1,200 payment. Now, that would probably be fairly accurate. Rent is always going to be a little bit more than payment. Now that would probably be fairly accurate. Rent is always going to be a little bit more than payment, but you're not paying when you're renting to put roofs on and fix heating and air and fix broken hot water heaters. You're not paying the increases in insurance and increases in property taxes that come along until I renew your lease, and then I'm going to bump up enough to cover that.

But that's the difference. Home ownership in a given year might be more expensive for you as a consumer than renting, depending on the repair bill that you end up having. And so there is no economic, no mathematical excuse for buying versus renting until you're ready on the short term. On the long term, owning is always better than renting. So you want to get yourself in a position that you own as you build wealth and as you head towards retirement. That's going to assist you with a paid-for home and building wealth. But it does not assist you when you buy a home and you rationalize your little butt off just because you got house fever and your little friends are out there buying houses and your little family members are whining at you over Thanksgiving dinner about they bought a house and you hadn't bought a house yet. Why didn't you bought a house? Because I'm freaking broke and i'm not going to be broke soon because

i'm on a budget i'm going to get my debt paid off i'm going to get my emergency fund in place so when i buy a house with a good down payment on no more than a 15 year fixed rate on no more than a fourth of my take-home pay as a payment then i'm going to buy a, and the house is going to be a blessing, not a curse. I want you to own your house. I don't want it to own you. And too many people rationalize their butts off. They got student loans that burn so long they think they're a pet. They got two car fleeces sitting in the driveway.

They got MasterCard. They've discovered bondage and American distress. All the money comes in and all the money comes out, and they've strapped themselves to a house on a 30-year adjustable rate mortgage, and it's some of the lowest interest rates in my lifetime, and I'm almost 60 years old. If it's the lowest interest rates in 60 years, where the flip do you think it's going to adjust? Up, dummy.

Up. Not down. I mean, where are you going from 2.9? 1.9? I mean, really? Is this your set of assumptions on which you justified buying an adjustable rate mortgage? That's dumber than a grub worm in a box of rocks. That's stupid.

You're going to get killed. Don't do that. But I've got to have that one with a jacuzzi and a skylight, and I don't feel safe three streets over. And we come up with all this crap that we use to justify and all this peer pressure, the most expensive purchase you're ever going to make for most people, which is their house. Don't do that. Do it right so that your home becomes a safe haven and not a point of stress on your finances,

on your marriage, and in your belly. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. Seth and Donna are with us in Sacramento, California. I see on my screen you're debt-free. Congratulations. Thanks, Dave. We're real excited about it. Way to go. How much have you paid off?

We paid off $220,000. Wow. How long did that take? That took us about four and a half years. Good for you. And your range of income during that time? I bounced around a little bit from 90 to 60 and now 150. Wow.

Cool. What do you guys do for a living? I'm a programmer and my wife is a nurse and that explains the bump. Okay, very good. I love it. So what kind of debt was this $220,000? It was $40,000. Let's see, we had a car loan, some credit cards and a laptop and the rest was the house. You paid off your house! Yes, we did. We're weird people. You are officially weird people.

You're in Sacramento, California with a paid-for house. That makes you double weird. Way to go! What's this house worth? It's worth probably about $480. Oh, I love it. Way to go, you two. How old are you guys? I'm 64 and my wife is 54.

So as you're facing towards retirement, a paid for house, that's got to feel awesome. It feels wonderful. You know, that was probably my biggest fear about retirement was the mortgage. Yeah, that's very real biggest fear about retirement was the mortgage. Yeah, that's very real. That's very real. And you've got a half a million dollar house paid for heading into retirement. Ding, ding. Well done.

So what happened to you two four and a half years ago that lit the fuse? Because something caused you to blow up. I was getting ready to go to nursing school and kind of freaking a little bit about, you know, doing the paycheck to paycheck thing and we had saved up money and just not having a lot of direction and we saw one of your columns in a local newspaper

and I bought the book and handed it to Seth. I said, let's read this. Yeah, so she hands me the book and so I've got it on my lap and I'm thinking I'm 59 years old. How many books just like this one have I read? And it ended up not, you know, working out. So I started reading it and I go, well, that's good, but what about, and then I turned the page and I go, oh, okay, well, I read a couple more pages. And I go, well, that's good, but what about this?

And I turn the page, and you covered that. And so I get to the end of the book, but I ran out of what about. I solved all your objections, and I sold you. I love it. So I turn to Don, and I go, oh, I am so ready to start doing you yeah i love it so i turned it on i go oh i am so i am so ready to start doing this i love it very cool so uh a column in the newspaper leads to the book and that convinces you shows you the program makes you believe you can do it and game on yeah absolutely cool so what do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is?

It's the budget. It's always the budget. You've got to have that budget. The first few months are painful. I can remember friends coming by and saying, Hey, we're going to go do this. You want to join us? And going to look in the envelope and going, Nope, sorry.

I need more notice so I can budget for that. But in communication very good that was one thing we didn't expect is how much stronger it made our marriage absolutely yeah it was a real real plus yeah you had a common goal and you were sacrificing deeply what was the biggest sacrifice you gave to be able to get this goal? Because you have a paid-for house. Well, Dave, I've got to say the wine I'm drinking now is better than what I was drinking when we were paying off bills. The downgrade in wine from the good stuff to the science project. Oh, that's good. I like that.

I thought she was going to say the cheap hotels we stayed at. Oh, yeah, that'll do it, too. Yeah, if you live like no one else, later you can live and give like no one else. Well done, you guys. Who were your biggest cheerleaders? You know, we kept it pretty quiet, so, you know, we, you know, I guess the, and I'm not sure who I'd say our biggest cheerleaders were. Our sons knew we were doing it, and, you know, they're out of the house, and, you know, they were always excited when we told them we'd paid something off. But, and we did do a little post on Facebook when it was paid off, and everyone was really excited for us.

That's good. You know, it was kind of a everyone was really excited for us. That's good. You know, it was kind of a private thing. Yeah, yeah. And now we're trying it with everybody. So really all people saw was the sacrifice and you kind of got the eye roll from that, right? Yeah. Yeah. But now you're sitting here with a paid-for house.

How do you like me now? Exactly. I love it. I'm so proud of you guys. Thanks. Very well done. Was it worth it'm so proud of you guys. Thanks. Very well done. Was it worth it? Oh, yes.

Absolutely. You take your shoes off, walk through the backyard, you have the grass feel different? You know, we've been in a drought for a few years, so it's not as good as we were hoping, but... Okay. But it is yours. It's your dirt now. Yes, it's all ours now. For better now. Yes, it's all ours now. For better or for worse, it's all ours.

I hear you. Well done, you guys. We've got a copy of Chris Hogan's Everyday Millionaires for you, because you will be that if you're not already. You've got a half a million dollars towards it right now, plus whatever's in your 401Ks and IRAs. So you're on your way, kiddo. Well done, well done, well done.

Congratulations. Seth and Donna well done, well done. Congratulations. Seth and Donna, Sacramento, California. $220,000 paid off in four and a half years. That includes their house. I love it. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Woo-hoo! free scream three two one well done well done well done hey man they're free you know it feels like

no house payment can you even breathe that in and some of you've got debt coming out of your ears. You just started listening. You have been listening, but you weren't hearing. You haven't done anything yet. Can you think about what it would be like to not have a payment in the world? No house payment. No car payment.

No MasterCard payment. Ugly old woman Sally Mae has been kicked out of the house. No student loan payment no payments you know what you would have money because you'd have no

payments think about it folks Money. Because you'd have no payments. Think about it, folks. If you just breathe that in for a second, you can feel it. That is the shortest distance between where you are and wealthy. Your most powerful wealth building tool is your income. When you don't give it to other people and instead are able to invest it, instead of handing it to Ford Motor, Chrysler Motor, Lexus Motor, whatever motor, General Motor, what is it?

What motor is it you're going to hand it to? Instead of handing it to Countrywide, instead of handing it to, God help you, Bank of America, instead of handing it to Chase, instead of handing it to Citibank, what's in your wallet? Money, because I don't have you in my wallet. Yeah, yeah, baby. This is how it works. money because I don't have you in my wallet. Yeah. Yeah, baby. This is how it works. If you don't have any payments,

you're in a position to be unbelievably, outrageously generous. If you don't have any payments, you're in a position to build wealth and completely change your family tree. That's where Seth and Donna are. Way to go, guys. We're proud of you guys.

You're heroes. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. Our question of the day comes from Blinds.com. They have a 100% satisfaction guarantee. It means even if you mismeasure, you pick the wrong color, they will remake your window blinds for free. You get free samples, free shipping, and with the new promos they run every month, you'll save even more. Use the promo code RAMSEY to get the best possible deal.

Rules and restrictions apply. Today's question comes from Mariana in California. We're wondering if we should diversify our investments by hiring multiple advisors with different companies so we won't have all our eggs in one basket, so to speak. Or should we stick with one company, or would it be smart to diversify? I would get one advisor, but I would not invest all of my mutual funds in one fund.

Virtually all mutual fund advisors can sell any mutual fund. And so you can buy an array of different mutual funds from different companies through one advisor, and that gives you diversification. There is no advantage to having two advisors unless you don't trust one of them's advice. And the reason you wouldn't trust it is you didn't understand it and make the decision yourself, which was a mistake. I only have one advisor personally, but I understand

everything I do with money or I don't do it until I do understand it. Rule number one of investing, do not put money in something you do not understand. Don't do it because your investor, because your investment advisor said to do it. Don't do it because Dave Ramsey said to do it. Don't do it because your investor because your investment advisor said to do it don't do it because dave ramsey said to do it don't do it because your mother said to do it do it because you know what to do and you understood it now my advisor will bring me i'll say hey i want some mutual funds that are for such and such a project i'm investing for this thing this task right here for my kids college for, for retirement, for whatever, and they'll put an array of mutual funds in front of me. And so out of 8,000, they narrow it down to, you know, a handful.

And I say, okay, why did you pick those? What is it about them? Show me the fund. Show me how it compares to the S&P. Show me how it compares to other funds in the same category. And then now I'm caught up to speed, but I didn't have to spend all my life investigating 8,000 funds to narrow it down. They're helping me narrow it down,

and they can teach me some things about those particular funds or about why they wanted me to go that direction, and so forth. And then based on all of that, I select the funds. Do not put money in something you do not understand. If you do that and you have one advisor, you can create your own diversification through one advisor, and that's what I would suggest. And if you need some help investing, we're not in the

investing business at ramsey solutions but we do recommend people that are advisors we call them smart vestor pros you are the smart vestor and they are the pro that will help you in the business do that that's our brand on it and so you you can click SmartVestor at DaveRamsey.com, and it'll drop down a list of the SmartVestor pros in your area. You can talk to all of them, or you can just select one of them, but eventually you'll narrow it down to one of them. You should, and you pick that one, and that's who you do your investing with. They are people that have the heart of a teacher because they understand

our investing teachings which mainly revolve around don't put money in something you don't understand and so they have to have the heart of a teacher because you have to understand it or you're not going to buy and of course we suggest four types of mutual funds evenly spread growth growth and income aggressive growth and international joshua is with us in atlanta georgia hi joshua how are you pretty good dave how you doing better than i deserve what's up um yeah so I just started Baby Step 2, and I have $87,000 in debt, and $27,000 of that is in a car. And I know it's too much car for what I need, but I don't know if a $1,000 car is right for me because I need something that's reliable for traveling for work. And so I wasn't sure what your advice was around that.

How much do you travel um a couple of times a month and it's usually to the airport or somewhere here within georgia that's like two or three hundred miles away okay oh not the airport's not two or three hundred miles but the other trips are right okay right and uh uber and lyft don't come out to where I live, so I can't rely on that. Like, if my car, if my $1,000 car breaks down, you know, but I need to get to the airport to make my flight to, you know, make the project that I'm going on. Sure. You know, so I'm just kind of curious, but I totally agree with $27,000.

So what's your household income? $77,000. You're single? Yes. How old are you? 36. Okay,000. You're single? Yes. How old are you? 36. Okay, cool. All right.

Well, yeah, you need something more than $1,000. I don't have any problem with that. But as you said, you make $77,000. You have a $27,000 car. Actually, a $27,000 car fits in the guidelines that we have as far as your vehicle's not being more than half your annual income. But it doesn't fit in the guidelines that you can be debt-free within two years. You can't with what you've got. So it does need to go.

I agree with you. But, I mean, you could get a $5,000 car, and that would be a fabulous vehicle for $5,000. As far as reliability goes, it's not going to have a lot of sex appeal, but it's going to be very reliable. And that's still a $22,000 reduction in your $80,000 debt mess. That's a fourth. That's a fourth down, right? And so, yeah, it's still a hoopty compared to what you're driving.

You're driving a beast right now. Yeah, it is. What is it You're driving a beast right now. Yeah, yeah, it is. What is it? It's a Ford Mustang GT. Oh, sweet. What a great car. That'd make me cry to get rid of that, but you're going to cry. Yeah, yeah, I'm fully okay with crying.

Like I said, the $1,000 car, I didn't think I could do that. I'm with you, but the point is, let's get this thing where you can get this debt knocked out so you can save up and drive whatever you want to drive. In three years, you could be driving a similar car,

paid for. Okay. I mean, you'll be back there. It's not like this is a sentence for life. It's, we have to clean up

our mess and pay our, you know, we have to pay our penalty tax here, our stupid tax for having done, having gotten ourselves in a mess. And so you're going to live on beans and rice for a little while. And that, in your case, is a $5,000 car.

And that's a pretty substantial move from that sweet vehicle you're driving because that's a nice car. I love those things. I'm kind of a car junkie, I've got to admit it. But cars will kill you. I mean, they'll just kill you they need to be a small percentage of your income a small percentage of your world because they all go down so fast in value so hey good question man thank you for joining us new cars are something millionaires don't buy very often too by the way

yeah the typical millionaire drives an older honda or Camry or a Chevy or a Ford, and they don't really care what you think. 79% of millionaires received zero inheritance, by the way. That means the average millionaire earned their wealth by driving an older car, working hard, saving money. Financial Peace University, for more than 25 years, has taught almost 6 million people how to pay off their debts, save and invest for the future, and you could be next. Get this. Listen to this. Everyone right now who purchases Financial Peace University for the first time

will get a one-year financial peace membership free financial peace members get access to every dollar plus the world's best budgeting app and the plus parts where it connects to your bank for free included you get access to our live streams to a lot of our live events you get access to our trusted financial coaches who answer your money questions. You get access to bonus content like the Legacy Journey, the follow-up class to Financial Peace, and Rachel Cruz's Smart Money, Smart Kids for teaching your kids about money. You get access to all the online audios and videos for Financial Peace while you're going through the class and through that one year. To start your journey right now, learn more about Financial Peace University, go to DaveRamsey.com or call Ramsey Concierge at 888-22-PEACE.

888-227-3223. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. If you would like to do your debt-free scream live on the show, make sure you visit DaveRamsey.com slash show and register. We would love for you to come to Nashville and tell Dave your story.