The Ramsey Show - App - Dealing With a Payday Loan Nightmare!

Episode Date: May 26, 2022

John Delony & George Kamel discuss: Taking a tax hit to convert your IRA, The dangers of payday loans, Deciding to start a business or work for someone else, Should you take a year off to travel. Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6

I'm out. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your money, your debt, your successes, and your life, your relationships, your mental health, your work, all of it, right here at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. I'm John Deloney, joined here by my good friend George Camel, and we are taking your calls on just about everything. So give us a shout.

Let's go out to New York. How about that? Let's go to New York and talk to Vicki. What's up, Vicki? Hi, how are you, John? Outstanding. How are you? I'm awesome. It's an absolute pleasure to talk to you. I listen to Dave and you and George every day on the way to work and on the way home from work. So I'm so grateful. I have two things I need to confirm with you before I ask my question. All right. The first thing is at full retirement age, which for me will be 66 and eight months and my husband, 66 and six months, there is no limit to the amount of income you can make without affecting your social security. Is that correct? I think so. You've studied this more than I have.

Okay. I think that's correct. The other thing I wanted to ask was money that's put into Roth IRAs, the deposits are done with after-tax income, correct? Yes. Okay. And any money that's in those accounts grows tax-free, and then when you start to withdraw it, the principal and the interest is tax-free? Yes, the whole thing. When you withdraw it? Every bit of withdrawal just goes into your pocket. Okay, so here comes my question. So my husband and I have about $450,000 in traditional IRAs that were rolled over from company 401k plans from previous jobs. So that is all sitting in a traditional IRA. And our income currently right now is about $125,000 a year, which is slowly going down because my husband is semi-retired.

By my best calculations, our income in retirement between a teaching pension, Social Security, and small part-time jobs is going to be about the same as it is right now. So I was wondering, hopefully that's where it will be in a few years. But my question was, would it be worth our while now to start slowly taking some of that money out of a 401k, I'm sorry, out of the traditional IRA, take the tax hit and then put it into a Roth IRA, which it could grow exponentially without having to pay taxes on it. Well, I wouldn't say that just as an overall plan, that's the right move. Because as you mentioned, there's big tax implications there.

And it's six dozen, half the other, whatever the saying is, whatever that is. But you're going to pay taxes on the traditional side if you take it out, like you're mentioning, or you're going to pay a big tax bill to turn it into tax-free growth either way. And so I'd rather you start from here. So you're saying, should I take out a little bit of money and convert it to the Roth portion? Yes, over the next four to five years because we hopefully won't have to even dip into this until there's mandatory withdrawals at 70. The RMDs? I think it's 70. Yeah. Okay. So you're thinking about cashing out your traditionals early, paying the penalty plus the tax to roll that money in two.

Well, they shouldn't have penalties at their age. Well, I don't think there are penalties. My husband is 65. So you're good there. Here's the thing. I just met with one of our SmartVestor pros two days ago, and we were talking about this exact situation. And there's actually a strategy they use where it's smart to have some on the traditional side and some on the Roth side. Do you have a Roth portion as well? We do not have a Roth, no.

So how much do you have total in retirement outside of pensions and Social Security? Is it this 450? It's 450,000 in traditional IRA, a house that's worth about 375. We have about 75 left in a mortgage and about $35,000 sitting in standard savings accounts. And that's kind of your emergency fund? Yes. Okay. That is my emergency fund. Do you guys have a financial advisor currently? Yes, we actually do. We have somebody that we've used for years, but we don't see him until November, December. And I'm starting to think about this because it's getting...

Well, we see him once a year. Okay. To update accounts. I would definitely... See him next week. See him next week and go, hey, what's the best move here? Because we can't get into all the nitty gritty details of this, and I don't want to steer you in the wrong direction. But my gut says this is not a wise move to all of a sudden convert this into Roth.

Maybe a portion at a time, but it may be wise to use some of this traditional money, use it as income coming in, and pay the tax bill as that happens, as taxed as ordinary income? Well, we would never take the whole thing and convert it because we don't have that kind of money to pay the taxes. But the thought that it can grow tax-free when we want to take it out, even if we took a small chunk, $20,000 or $30,000 a year, transferred it over to a Roth, would that be worth our while? My gut tells me the math isn't going to work there. Yeah, I think when you're in your 20s, your 30s, it makes sense to convert it and let that money grow for a long period of time. But as you're in the retirement age, this is where I go. They're

going to run some numbers on both sides and show you on paper which one makes more sense. And my gut says, I could be wrong, but my gut says leaving it in traditional side and just pulling that money out and paying the taxes on it as you go is going to be your best bet. And Vicki, I would tell you this. You are looking at the potential for growth. So I'm going to take this hit here and you're leaving one giant variable untouched on the table. And that is a great gift you can give yourself heading in retirement is no debt liabilities whatsoever.

And you still owe $75,000 on your mortgage. But the goal here is that when we do retire, there will be a move to a cheaper part of the United States. New York is not kind to its retirees, which whatever we walk away from

with this house is what we're going to put into a house with no mortgage. So you're going to pay cash for the next one? Yes, correct. Could you use your future cash flow to pay off the mortgage as you guys head into retirement? The goal is that the house will be paid for by the time we retire, that we will not have a mortgage here. Okay, that's good then. Get that knocked out The goal is that the house will be paid for by the time we retire. We will not have a mortgage here. Okay. Awesome. That's good then.

Get that knocked out of the way. George, I hear a lot of people talk about, I'm going to do this. I want this investment strategy. I want this. I want this. And they're heading into retirement. They've got $200,000 or $100,000, $75,000 left on their mortgage. And, man, anything goes sideways there. And they lose this or the market crashes or their returns are lower than they

think they're going to be, that house payment stays the same every month. Oh, yeah. You get that sucker off the table. Get rid of that fixed expense. That's exactly right. Man, talking to our SmartVestor Pro, I was just like, I was first of all nerding out with him, but it was so helpful to go, oh, these guys don't just hit a button and invest and take your money.

That's not what this is about. A good financial advisor is a coach that looks at your entire money picture and helps you be really strategic when it comes to taxes and estate planning and all the pieces of your puzzle to make sure you do the right thing. I love that. Hey, we'll be right back on The Ramsey Show. Hey, if you've experienced Financial Peace University, I want you to listen up. You know firsthand how hard and confusing money can be. You also know how life-changing this course is, and I bet there's someone in your life who needs the hope and community that you found when you went through Financial Peace University. Well, now you can share that life change with a Ramsey Plus gift card.

It bundles everything that they need to win with money in one gift. They'll get access to Financial Peace University and the premium version of every dollar, plus world-class financial coaching from our own team of coaches here at Ramsey. A $500 value for only $99.99. Look, we know summer's coming, which means graduations and weddings. So give a gift that will actually change their lives just like it did yours. To purchase your Ramsey Plus gift card, visit ramseysolutions.com slash gift. That's ramseysolutions.com slash gift. 888-825-5225.

My brain stopped there for a second. 888-825-5225. George, it was like a glitch in the Matrix, John. It was, man. Yeah, I'm running on fumes. I looked over and I thought, oh my gosh, he is a robot. Yeah, my brain stopped. Wow. Just learning how to love.

Well, in my possession, John, I've got your Questions for Humans conversation cards. Friends edition. I didn't go with couples edition. And I thought, you know what? We've got to make Kelly happy here. She's fading in the booth. So let's read some of these off. Can I't go with couples edition. I thought, you know what? We've got to make Kelly happy here. She's fading in the booth. Let's read some of these off. Can I hit you with one?

I'd prefer you not hit me, but yeah, you can. I don't think I could hurt you if I did. Agree. Who's one speaker, author, or thinker who's made a big impact on you? One speaker. Off the top of my head, author. There's some old authors that I love like twain and those guys but um recent terry reels is an important author for me um speaker i'll

tell you what man uh jade simmons this weekend or this week and will gadara the restaurateur and the pianist man jade simmons and Will Godera were just lights out speakers and just humans to be around. So, yeah, they're very inspirational. Good stuff. I'll give you the Sunday School answer, Dave Ramsey. Oh, my gosh. But for real, though, Seth Godin, I love his books.

Yeah. Brilliant thinker, brilliant author, always an inspiring read. Speaker, absolutely Dave, for sure john deloney second second huh yep that's fair i would have gone one two punch have you ever walked out on a movie or concert what was it oh this is gonna be controversial okay i've walked out of two concerts in my life just because they were so bad oh number one bob dylan ouch i was that bad devastated at how bad it was i just couldn't wrap my head in his old age you just couldn't swing it anymore yeah it was rough i don't know if she's having a bad day it was just rough i didn't know what's happening and we're off the air john just like that and to all of you i know

he's the greatest of all time and partridge in a pear tree and he's a great songwriter and yada yada my whole family was singing along to some bob Dylan Today in the car, so it's not that. A concert's rough. And then Maroon 5. I couldn't hang, man. Too many tats? No. The tats are fine.

It was like the skin-tight black tank top and kind of giving it to the mic stand a little bit. I was like, dude, I don't know. Not for you. I think I'm good. That's amazing. What about you? So one comes to memory. It's a sad story.

My ex-girlfriend, we went to see Grizzly Bear and Radiohead, two of my favorite bands. We get stuck in traffic. We miss Grizzly Bear. She's so upset that we leave early when Radiohead starts playing. Y'all didn't stay? We didn't stay. She was so upset. I don't know.

I was like, well. So you missed arguably one of the greatest bands in the history of music. Yep. For a temper tantrum, huh? That was the beginning of the end for me, John. I can see how that worked that way. I was out. What's a song that makes your ears bleed? There's a few.

Anything by Smashing Pumpkins. The whole catalog. Wow. Hey, man, you're an all-star. Get your game on. Go Play. Just when any time that I hear the psalm, I'm like, ah, I got to go. Those are the two.

Wow. What about you? A song that makes my ears bleed. Who Let the Dogs Out gives me hemorrhoids. They don't make my ears bleed as much as it makes it fire out the back end. I'm trying to think. Probably stuff that you listen to would make my ears bleed. I could see that.

Yeah. I could see that. I. I could see that. I don't know. I can't think of anything off the top of my head. Social media, is it good for us or bad for us and why? I think it's 95% not good, 5% good. Oh, that's a good take. I was going to go 95% good, 5% bad.

I know, but you're wrong most of the time. I know. It is a dark place, but I do think it's an amazing technology that allows us to do amazing things. That's right. It's not social media's fault. It's our fault. There you go. Is what I'm trying to say.

I think there was a time when cocaine was used. It was, people understood there was a medicinal benefit to it. It was in Coca-Cola. And then, well, it was also used for nasal surgeries and things. We misused it. And then it got misused. And now they took it away from everybody. Last one. used for nasal surgeries and things. We misused it. And then it got misused and now they took it away from everybody. Last one.

What's your favorite cheap meal that you'll always love no matter how much money you make? Dorito tacos, no question. Wow. That fast. Taco Bell, man. They do things right. John, just because it's cheap, I mean, it costs your health. No, but it gives me my joy.

Temporarily. And then it gives you gas. Incredible amounts, but so good. What about you? Kelly regrets ever handing us these cards. What about you? You know, I'm a Chipotle fan. It costs $72 for a burrito. How is that your cheap meal?

Not the way I do it, John. You're so bougie. I get four meals out of one bowl. You take your Tesla over there and go Chipotle. Why do you have to bring the Tesla up? Just going slumming with the Chipotle. Why do you have to bring the Tesla up? Just going slumming with the Chipotle. Listen, I try to

use your car to make Chipotle is an anniversary meal in my house. That's unbelievable. Well, fast food's tough for me. I mean, Chick-fil-A

kids meal, that's a go-to for me that I get a lot of judgment for. You officially are on friendship probation and you should stop talking. Let's go to Joseph in

Kalamazoo. Hey, Joe, what's up? Hey, guys. Sorry you had to hear that, Joseph. I apologize. Yes. All good. All good. What's up, brother? Hey, so I am 22 years old, and I have 20K in debt, and I am currently paying off three very predatory payday loans that are eating me alive inside. I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired. Awesome.

So how can we help, man? Well, I guess first and foremost, those three payday loans have some of the most egregious APR rates I've seen in my entire life. Two of them have, one of them has 400%, and the worst one out of the three has 690% APR. 40 payments. What? Is there a prepay penalty?

There is no prepay penalty. How much is it? On all three of those loans. How much are they in sum? The worst, in sum, it's about 400, 800. I'd say about 1,100 in total, all three. How much do you make? I make about $45,000 a year after taxes.

What caused you to go to a payday lender out of all people in the first place? I've been struggling living paycheck to paycheck, and I had no emergency fund, and most days my bank account is either negative or has barely a few ones in it. And so I've had to make some pretty hard decisions, poor decisions nonetheless. All right, so here's what we're going to do. I'm going to turn over to George here for a second, but I want you to get a couple of bricks.

I want you to go find them. Even if you have to go to the hardware store and pay 50 cents for one, okay? Get a couple of them. And I want you to get some masking tape and put it on there. Or just get a magic marker and write on there. Stupid thing you did.

A dumb loan and a dumb loan. Or I got desperate and I found myself negative. Whatever. I want you to hold that sucker for a minute until it gets heavy. And I want you to go to the nearest lake or river and throw it in there. And be done with this. Okay?

Because I can hear your voice. The shame of what happened to you is prohibiting you from launching into outer space to get this stuff knocked out. Every step you take is you're carrying the, well, yeah, so stupid. I can't believe this. And now this 600% interest rate is a slap in your face every day, but you're feeling it as a stupid tax, right? Yeah. Stop. Stop. Get done with it.

Joseph, how much money do you have in the bank right now? Negative $445. So sorry, man. What's your day job? I'm an HVAC heating and cooling technician. Okay. Can you work extra hours? Yes, I can.

Okay. I'm going to be working 80 hours a week until this mess is cleaned up, and I'm definitely focusing on these insane payday loans first, and you're going to be on a shoestring budget, eating rice and beans more than ever before. My favorite meal. So that's good news. And what I'm going to do is I'm going to hook you up with a financial coaching session with one of our trained financial coaches and gift you one year of Ramsey Plus to dive into the budget, focus on that because that's what you can control.

And every dollar is going to have a name, and we're not going to spend any money on anything but this debt and keeping the lights on. That's it. Are you in? I am in. Boom. Austin's going to pick up. We're going to make sure he gets you connected to one of our financial coaches and Ramsey Plus. Watch all the Financial Peace videos.

I want you to get so angry at this that you are standing outside of the payday lender with a sign that says, avoid this scam. And I want you driving for Uber or Uber Eats or something by this weekend. You got 48 hours to make that happen. I want you down at local coffee shop working from 4 a.m. to 7 a.m. to get another three hours in. Go pick up a shift in the evenings, wash the dishes. Your life is over for the next 24 months. And then everything looks different. How do payday lenders sleep at night? I have no idea how they do it. On very comfortable mattresses paid on the desperation of hurting people. 690% interest.

Is there a bigger scam in America? Disgusting. Sorry, my brother. Hang on. We'll be right back. find out for yourself why blinds.com is the number one online retailer of custom window covering you get free samples free shipping and with the new promos they run every month, you'll save even more. Use promo code RAMSY to get the best deal.

Rules and restrictions apply. Today's question comes from Brandon in Indiana. Should I move out of my parents' basement or not? I'm 21 and I earn $2,800 a month. The apartment that I'm considering is $900 a month. My parents think it's the dumbest idea ever because I'm getting married soon. They believe I should wait until I'm married and then buy a house with my wife. I would prefer to get my own apartment, which my fiance would move into

when we marry, so we can save together for a house. Is it smarter to stay in my parents' basement and save money until I get married or get my own place now and finally be on my own. I'm ready to grow up and learn how to love life, but I feel like my parents are holding me back and I have no one in my life to give me real advice. That took a turn at the end there. Very confusing. Oh man. On this show, we often get a run of 21 year olds who are incredible and doing great things. And then occasionally we get the email from a 21-year-old and we go, there it is. There it is. So I want you to be grown up and on your own too.

And by the tone of this email, you're not there yet. I think everybody here is – I don't have any problem whatsoever with you living with your parents until you get married. You're a few months out and i don't know what getting married soon means to some people that's two years and to some that's two months but man if you're getting married in a few months hang on part of growing up is delaying gratification doing the hard thing because it's going to be better for you in the long run man there's got to be more here because just living in your parents basement i don't know if they're overbearing or they're mean or they're abusive or who knows, but just based on this

email, dude, stick it out. And then I wouldn't buy a house. I'd get an apartment, right? I mean, I wouldn't run and buy a house that I can't afford. Go rent somewhere for a year once you're married, stack up a whole bunch of cash because by the looks of it, it doesn't sound like he's ready to even buy a house on the financial side, just the logistics of it. So I would rent for a year once you're married, then save up a bunch of cash, and then buy a house at that point if you guys feel like you're ready. It's that simple. I think it's important to note I'm ready to quote-unquote grow up. That phrase gets people into trouble sometimes they go out and

buy cars that they can't afford they buy homes they can't afford they run off and accelerate relationships into long-term like binding long-term agreements like marriage before they're ready and under the guise of i just need to grow up it's time whatever that means well he's getting married at 21 which is fairly young very very young yeah yeah very young and so that's fine i'm gonna hate on that but man you get some wisdom in your life if you cannot trust your parents for wisdom you need to find a couple of men in your community whether that's an old coach or an old band instructor or a pastor in your community that you trust somebody to sit down and not just ask a bunch of questions to, but somebody to say, hey, I'm getting married in a few months.

Would you start having coffee with me once a week just so I can – I need some wisdom, and I'm not getting it from home, so I'm going to go find it somewhere. And premarital counseling would be great if you haven't done that. Really important. Great place to get advice. Yeah, because the other person you're leaving out of this equation is your wife. Does she want to have an apartment? Where do you want to live?

Where are you going to work? There's a lot of pieces of the equation here we've got to figure out. Yeah, but I'll tell you, brother Brandon, slow down. Slow down. Make a game plan. The game plan is not I'm ready to grow up. The game plan is how much money do I need to get into an apartment when I get married? How long am I going to be here?

What's the agreement with my parents? And so on and so forth. So get a plan, man, and just reverse engineer it and work the plan. Let's go to Evelyn in Dayton, Ohio. What's up, Evelyn? Is it Elvin? Elvin, sorry.

Elvin, yep. Dude, I blew that. I'm sorry, Elvin. You're good. How's it going? If I could read, it'd be going better, but I'm doing good, man. How about you?

Doing great. Hey, a little background here. I am going to be quitting my job here in about a week. Why are you quitting? Going to something new. Why are you quitting? Just time to move on, I should say. Long story, but yeah.

Okay. Usually that means there's a big long story but go for it uh so i'm in the residential construction business i'm currently a project manager cabinet designer uh 21 years old been married for about nine months and have about uh eighty About $80,000 in cash, debt-free. Okay. Nice. So I am looking to either go to another contractor doing project managing as well for relatively the same pay or go out on my own as a carpenter. Okay. What would be your recommendation? I was just thinking, you know, the way the economy is,

didn't want to go in head over heels thinking I can make it. Are you going to have a gap in income if you're quitting in a week and the other one's not lined up? Do you have this other job? It would be right into the next job. Okay. I would do both if I were you. That's my take. John may disagree,

but I would take this other job and start to build your carpentry business on the side and see if you like it and see if you can get clients and ongoing clients and create enough income that you can slowly take a step from the dock onto the boat if that's what you want to do. I have done that in the past. So I've been doing side jobs for, I don't know, probably two years. Have you made enough money that you think you could make this your full-time gig? I believe so. I mean, I've got basically five jobs waiting on me right now if I were to take them. What's driving you towards doing your own thing versus working for someone? Just being able to, you know, set my own schedule and, you know, hopefully make some more money.

I've talked to several individuals that do finish carpentry in the area, and they have all told me now go on your end there's plenty of work out there it's not like you're not going to find work um the one thing that's giving me pause elvin is your response to george's question do you make enough money and you said i think so and so for whatever reason i would say for that i would say yes okay well you do for for four jobs right and as a uh what you have to ask yourself is how many of the jobs am i getting are offshoots of the project management job i'm doing do i have money for marketing or do I have some sort of way to go get a new book of business to build something while I'm doing the job and also marketing and also taking the

calls and making sure I'm hitting all of my... So you have to have a fully realized business plan before you decide to take this brand new wife of yours on a ride right you've got four jobs so i want to hear your answer to do you have money lined up yes i've got four jobs in the hopper i've already done x and done y and i've joined this trade association and i'm doing this and then you're going to be all ready um how much do you make at your project management job um gross about 61.5 okay um just off what i've just recently paid a carpenter you should be able to make that in a year do you feel confident about that yes i do okay so i want you to be very specific and if this is something that's outside your wheelhouse which it would be for most people sit down with somebody who can help you do the math on that and say, here's how much insurance is going to cost.

Both insurance for my jobs that I'm going to have to have because you're going to have to be bonded and insured. And your insurance is going to go – get down and map all that out. Do I have the truck? Do I have the nails? Do I have the equipment? Am I going to have to go put $30,000 of new saws and screwdrivers on a credit card? Or do I actually have – I want you to do all of that math and then say, now I'm ready to start a business. I've got four jobs lined up.

I can make five calls. I want you to have ten jobs in the hopper. I want five – I've got five more downstream. You see what I'm doing there? I'm being really certain, as George said, the boat I'm about to jump into is solid. It doesn't sound like it's there yet. It sounds like it's close, but it doesn't sound like it's there yet. Okay. Yep.

That's the confidence I needed, John, right there. Tell me I'm wrong. I want you to go, no, bullcrap, dude, I've got it. I'm ready. I want to hear some fight in your voice, Alvin. I want to hear that you want to be a small business owner, and this is what you were born to do. Right now, it sounds like you're kind of like, eh, I don't know. Here's the deal. Hang on the line. Probably because I'm

a little bit intimidated. Oh, don't be intimidated by me, dude. I'm not very tough at all. But listen, hang on the line here and I'm going to send you a copy of Dave Ramsey's Small Business Playbook, Entree Leadership, and it will walk you through step by step. And before you quit all things, I want you

to walk through this book and say, okay, I am officially ready to do this. And man, we need more good carpenters out there who are ethical and show up on time and tell the truth. Go get them. Today's scripture of the day comes from Psalm 143.10. Teach me to do your will, for you are my God. May your good spirit lead me on level ground. Ralph Waldo Emerson says, Self-trust is the first secret of success. Imagine the energy of a jam-packed arena

with people ready to experience what it means to live life to the fullest. Picture all your favorite speakers together on one stage, empowering you with tools and principles that'll create unstoppable momentum in your life. That is Smart Conference. Smart Conference is back, and it's been three years, and we are so pumped to get this event back on the road. We're going to be in Dallas, Texas on Saturday, October 22nd. This is not just a rally, pep rally, like, whoo, shaking pom-poms.

This is thousands of people just like you coming together under one roof to help you create unstoppable momentum in your life. You'll learn how to build wealth, achieve your goals, strengthen your relationships, and so much more. But you won't just learn. You'll also have a great time. Trust me. We know how to party and have a good time. All of us here at Ramsey will be there, and our special guests, Craig and Amy Groeschel from Life Church, are coming too. Tickets start at $39.

That's a great price for an all-day event like this. You won't find a price like that anywhere. Get your tickets now before they sell out. They've sold thousands and thousands already. Visit ramseysolutions.com slash events to learn more. Let's go to Tara in Corpus Christi. What's up, Tara? Hi, Tara.

Hi, this is Tara. How are you? This is John. Good to talk to you, Tara. How's it going? Good, good. What's up? I have a question that I need help with, a little bit of guidance with. My husband and I have recently come into some money from a sale of his business, and he is in a non-compete for a year and a half for what he did at the previous job. And I am working part-time, so a little bit of income coming in.

But basically our net worth right now is approximately $4 million. We've got a condo that's worth a million dollars that we're going to be renting out in another month that potentially would make about a couple of thousand a month. And we have a home that's paid off that's worth one million. And we have about two million, 1.5 cash, and the rest is like a mutual fund. Cash? Why do you have 1.5 million in cash? Is this from the sale of the business? Yes, we have. Correct.

We haven't invested that part yet. Okay. Wow. Way to go. Thank you. How old are you two? So, 51. Wow.

Awesome. Okay, 51. Yes. And we are, I guess, toying with the idea of taking him, he has to take a year and a half off from his work because of non-compete. And, um, we are thinking about possibly just not working, both of us not working for a year and a half travel a little bit, possibly investing in another home in Colorado to fix up and sell or maybe to even put in a rental market.

And we just don't know if I should stop working. I have a potential to make about $100,000 a year if I went back full-time. Or any time, really. I mean, I can go back in a year and a half as well and make the same amount. But is it a wise decision or is it too risky of a decision to take that year and a half off to go enjoy ourselves and do something we want to do and then get back into the workforce in about a year and a half? So I'll let George answer the math part of this. Here's a couple of big red flags I've got. Number one, you've backed yourself into a corner

of either working or enjoying ourselves i do not think those things are mutually exclusive especially at the level you two are operating the second thing is is i would want to be really intentional about what you think you're going to get out of a year and a half of not working here's why most people have fallen under the illusion that the goal of life is to get to a place where i can do nothing and that's a dangerous dangerous place to be i spent some time with jay leno this week he's 72 i think does 200 dates a year that's a lot of flying around the country but when i asked him he's like why would i i love this and so the idea of not doing this sounds more punitive than actually like i made it i don't have enough money right same with dave dave has no reason to be in work financially but he it it

brings him joy and it's what uh helping and serving and loving people is what what fills his cup so what i would challenge you on is what do you think you and your husband are going to gain by just pausing life for a year? The third thing is absolutely I would not buy a house 14 hours from your home to renovate and then rent out. Being a long-distance landlord is a disaster. It's tough. And if you buy a nice house, you fix it up, and you end up with a management company that's going to be – your margin of return is going to be much lower.

I'd much rather see you get some houses there in Corpus and fix those up or buy beach houses or whatever you want to do with your money. But it sounds like you all just want something different, and you've got money now. Is that fair? Yes, it is. Okay. That's a whole different conversation because that's two people that say, hey, we've worked this hard like we've worked like maniacs and we're 50. We're about halfway home on this whole adventure.

What do we want to do? And that's a totally different conversation than, well, let's try this. Let's just take a year off. Let's do that. You see what I'm saying? Because you're going to wake up in a year, and here's going to be the best part of it. You had a year off.

It's going to be cool. The worst part of it is that you're going to go with you. And this person who wants a different life, who wants to feel different, become different, wants to have a different level of intimacy in their marriage, wants fill in the blank, wants to live in a different part of the country, that person's still going to be there.

You're just going to be a year older. You're going to be a year's worth of not working with less money, right? And then you're going to have made some decisions. I'm going to buy this house. I'm going to do this. That's going to feel like, ah, I'm doing a thing. You're not doing a thing, right? What's it going to cost to travel for a year and a half and do what you guys want to do a lot like give me a hundred thousand okay two hundred thousand well okay well our

expenses where our son is still in college so we're still cash flowing that so that's about four thousand a month and in addition to that it would be maybe another i would i would say would be a minimum of five thousand a month so it looks like over ten thousand for expenses every month at least okay so yes what's your husband what was his what was give me a i know you can't be specific what give me a general what did he do health care Okay. So is he going to continue being a salesman once his non-compete's over? He's thinking about doing something a little bit different, but in healthcare, yeah. Do you want to continue to live the life of a salesman's wife? No.

That's what I thought. Y'all need to have that conversation. So the truth is, financially, on paper, yeah, you can do this. It's not going to break the bank. You can still retire with dignity. But to John's point, I would ask myself, what am I going to get out of this? Why am I doing this? What kind of life do we want long term so we don't come back from this trip and go, what now?

We feel empty again. So you've still got a lot of life ahead of you. The life of a salesman can be... Well, he was not in sales. The product that he developed, they sold. Ah, okay, okay. No. So this, if we had 20 or 30 more minutes,

this feels like a relationship conversation that you have not sat down and said here's what i i've got i've got 50 years left the math works in my favor and here's what i have pictured of that looking like and it's not this can you go travel for a month and then come back and go all right how do we feel yeah we thought about that as well because I do have a job potentially lined up, and I could start in another month or so. So that would be a good compromise. You'll get the travel bug out of you.

And this could be a great opportunity for your husband to retool and get some education and some new skills that he's going to need to learn in the next chapter of his life. But all of this starts with you guys going to breakfast together and spending half a day doing a post-mortem. Here's the first 50 years. We've been married for this long. Here's where we are. What do we want the next half of this thing to look like?

And you are going to have to be honest, Tara, about your needs moving forward. Hey, thanks to Kelly and Will and AJ and Zach and the gang back there in the booth. George, great show. Awesome times. Thank you, John. America, thank you so much for hanging out with us. Be kind to one another. Get outside and go play.

We'll see you soon on The Ramsey Show. Hey, it's John Deloney, co-host of The Ramsey Show. Did you know over 18 million people listen to the Ramsey Show every week? A lot of those people listen on one of our 600 plus radio stations across the country. To find a station near you, go to ramseysolutions.com slash show.