The Ramsey Show - App - Dealing With FOMO During the Debt Snowball (Hour 3)

Episode Date: February 8, 2024

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I am Rachel Cruz, and this is George Campbell, and we are hosting this hour of the show, and we're taking your calls at 888-825-5225. Talking about your money, your life, your relationships, your work, anything and everything. We are here for you. So first up, we have Jennifer in Ventura, California. Hi, Jennifer. Welcome to the show. Hey, guys. Thank you so much for taking my call.

Thank you for all the work you guys do. I'm so blessed to be on the call. Oh, thank you. much for taking my call. Thank you for all the work you guys do. I'm so blessed to be on the call. Oh, thank you. Thanks for calling. How can we help? Uh, I guess I kind of have a key. I brand new to you guys. Uh, shout out to Ventura, uh, Mission Church Ventura. Um, I will be doing TV sets three lesson on Monday. So I'm like brand new. That's what Rachel and I. We did that once. I kind of took a sneak peek. They gave us like a little barcode thing where we get it for free. Thank God. Oh, that's awesome. I took a sneak peek. So I saw my favorite speaker, George.

You're my favorite. So cheers. George, he wins the hearts of many. Truth be told, I told Jennifer to call because she had a great question for Rachel. I was like, call rachel's gonna crush this question with what rachel's gonna crush this okay so check it out rachel so i i kind of have a a case of like family almost so it's not keeping up with the joneses like i i drive an old van i've got old stuff i learned my lesson i'm listening to you guys i didn't know i'm 37 i'm like way behind and i did not know any of this so i'm like live time learning it and i'm i I'm binging it. Right. So, but I've got one of those super close families, kind of intrusively close families. Like we, we do everything together.

We're, we have like a Facebook messenger, kind of like a group thread email chat thing where we're like, it's literally like, Oh, Paisley woke up with a fever today and Ben got in trouble with school. It's like every single thing in each other's grill. But that also includes like,, let's do everything together. Like every single Sunday, let's have family dinner, especially because my dad passed away. It's been like every Sunday, let's go to Nana's house and don't show up uncandid. Like, what are you going to bring? Are you going to

bring ribs? Are you going to bring this? And I'm calculating this in my head. Like, there's like 18 of us. So for me to sign up for drinks and buy everybody their favorite drink, I'm like way over, like I can't. So oftentimes I'm like, oh, gosh, sorry, guys, I'm volunteering at church. And I like the path. And then I get the whole like under the breath, like, oh, well, too bad you can't, you know, your kids are missing out on family dinner and all that stuff. So I'm just at a crossroads and I've got that crafty sister that's always like we're going to the zoo and I'm like I can't afford the zoo oh there's a coupon okay well it's a gas and it's like you're taking time out of my side

hustle like I can't do it all yeah and my kids my kids see it the cousins show them the pictures they all talk about like oh look where we went and my are like, why can't we go? And I'm just, I'm just at that point where there's only so much I could tell, like, let's be content kids. And my kids are like, I don't, I want to be with my family. You know, how old are your kids? So my son just turned nine in January and my daughter will be 11 in May. Okay. Well, I think what's hard, Jennifer, is what's happened in your life is you've shifted a perspective, right? You've shifted how you're viewing money. You are shifting something. You're changing something about who Jennifer was nine months ago, 12 months ago, into a new season, right? And I know we always parallel the financial world with even

the health world right it would be the same thing if it was like oh my gosh we're gonna you know um go i don't know eat a bunch of pizzas you're like well i'm gluten george would have to say no i'm gluten-free unless they have gluten-free crust i can't go you know like so people even with their nutrition right they draw boundaries on what that is and i know money's a little bit different but anytime you change of what you're what you're used to what people expect of you the normalcy of what was is not there anymore and so I think that acknowledgement is really hard and it's hard when it plays into these kind of smaller day-to-day interactions with family and so I mean have you just bluntly said to, guys, I'm living on a strict budget now because I'm trying to get out of debt and I can't be doing all of this, but I want to still come to dinner.

I'm just going to bring stuff, you know, because we're water people now and you can kind of make fun of yourself and be like, sorry, but I don't want y'all to like miss out on all the good stuff. I'm just choosing to miss out for me, but I don't want that to put you guys out. So y'all do you. Y'all plan yourselves and I'll just bring the good stuff. I'm just choosing to miss out for me, but I don't want that to put you guys out. So y'all do you. Y'all plan yourselves, and I'll just bring my own stuff. I'll bring my grilled cheeses and my water, whatever it is that you're choosing to do. Totally. And I have. I've been doing that.

I think the bigger piece is the kids. Probably my kids are what's bothering me most. My family, I'm the only one that goes to church with my family. I'm the only one. So I'm telling them about this Ramsey thing, and they're like, okay. It's another one of those weird Jennifer things that's happening. Well, I think you mentioned to me also that their incomes, they're all making, you know, six figures. They're just at a different place in life.

Yeah, and so, honestly, Jennifer, the gift to your kids, even with family, is to say, hey, how do we learn to be excited for somebody that has something that we don't have? And how can we still have relationship with them, right? And I would hope your family would kind of give a nod to where you guys are and be like, okay, yeah, if we're going to the zoo, it is going to cost $30 for everyone to go. So we're going to choose not to do that. We'll go to the park or we'll come over and do a play date. Like what other things can we do that you can be a part of as well? Right. And maybe you throw out those ideas. But I think for your kids and I get that. I mean, I understand you're like, I want them to be with family and all that. But but for them to start to see that there are boundaries in

life and limits in life when it comes to money and it's not just this endless, you know, way of how to live. You're modeling that, Jennifer. And that's what they're going to grow up with a level of boundaries. That's really great and wonderful. Yeah. But I also don't want you to miss out on family time. So I do wonder if there's ideas that you can even bring to the table to be like, yeah, they don't, you know, I don't want to miss out with you guys. So I still want to hang out, you know, and I had a good friend, Jennifer, who was going, they're going through some tight financial spots and and she was very honest with me and and I knew and there was you know times that it was like oh yeah we you know I could take my kids to the zoo but we're going to choose not to because we want to hang out with them and

I don't want to put her in a bad spot and then also I don't want to feel like she thinks that I have to pay for her all the time you know like there's all you know some of that so I'm like you know what thank you for being considerate thank you Rachel be the considerate friend but for real and so for your family like you know and not that you can make them do that those kind of things but I would

throw out ideas that are kind of free or less expensive or whatever it is that you actually still get time I would be like listen I'll sign up to clean up after you guys. I'll sign up on dish duty. Thanks, George. Love it. I love it. Be fun about it. And it's only for a season

too, Jennifer. This is not going to be your whole life. When are you going to be out of debt? Oh, gosh. Probably two years. They're fine. When I credit my numbers, it's going to take about two years. That's okay. And here's the truth too, Jennifer. I look back, John Deloney probably would like shake his finger and be like, that's not right child psychology, Rachel. But I'm like, I don't remember being, I don't remember being eight and nine.

Oh, for sure not. Do you know what I mean? Like your kids are fine. They are fine. They really, really are. They have a great mom and a great life. Yes. And no trip or zoo is going to change that.

That's right. Thank you so much. You're doing the hard work. You guys are like my church piece. You're kind of like my family right now. So thank you. That means the world. Add us to the group chat.

We can't wait to hear who gets in trouble at school today. That's what we need to do. Add Rachel to the Facebook Messenger group chat. Have her pop in and just smack some people around. Here's five inexpensive things you can do with kids under 10 years old. Just start putting her blog articles on there. That's fun. Jennifer, we're cheering you on.

Remember, it's not forever. It is not forever. This is a season of sacrifice to get yourself in a place where you can go and enjoy and do the things because you actually have the money to do it. Thanks for the call, Jennifer. George, thanks for the DM. Blessed to be a blessing. Yeah, you just spread the Lord's work. This is The Ramsey Show.

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We can handle what you don't like, too. But yeah, just spread and share the show for us. Always helps us out. Thanks so much. All right, up next, we have Becca in Detroit. Hey, Becca. Welcome to the show. Hi there.

My question is about home renovations. Specifically, how do we know when it's the right time? Oh, that's a good question. And do you mean from like a financial standpoint, obviously? Yes. Yes, from the money standpoint. Is this a need or a want? I'd say it's a want.

When we purchased this house, it was with the expectation that we were going to redo this kitchen because it's just really ugly. It doesn't function too well. That's a perfectly good reason. That helps me. It just helps to know, like, is the roof falling off or are the countertops? Yeah. So that's a good, it just helps me kind of use a filter here. Yeah. Are you guys in a financial position, Becca, where you don't have debt? Do you guys have some savings? Yeah. So the only debt we have is our mortgage. We have about $200,000 left on that, but no other debt. And we have $125,000 saved up, which would be by the time the contractors got around to doing the work, the cost of the renovations, plus an emergency fund, plus a little leftover. Oh my gosh, amazing. So you just can cash flow it. Yeah. That's it. That's when

you're ready. Is it a big number? Is it just scary to spend this much money? Does it feel like frivolous? Exactly. It's a huge, huge number. It's a huge number and we're getting it all over town. So we think it's a real number yeah i mean if you have multiple bids i mean labor's up material i mean it is like that that everything is just more expensive in life long gone are the days like 10 grand can we'll get a new kitchen yeah so what is this going to cost you we're hearing a hundred thousand dollars for all of it are you gutting are you moving walls and stuff or is it just appliances and countertops yeah it would be a gut it would be some structural work yeah to support

heavier stuff bigger island yeah yeah um and just the labor is really expensive right now 400 000 okay because one thing to think about is not that everything has to be about ROI, because you put a pool in the backyard, it may not ROI, and it's okay to just do things for enjoyment, knowing you're not going to get that money back out of it. Look at you being all fun, George. I'm such a fuddy-duddy, Rachel. Unbelievable.

But, you know, with a kitchen renovation, it can and will increase the value by a certain amount. I don't know that it's going to make a $400,000 house into a $500,000 house, but over time it may. But kitchens and bathrooms. Those are the big ones. They're the big ones. So if there's a place to do it from an ROI side, I think kitchen is the best. And yeah, if you guys have it, Beck, I mean, literally this is exactly the perfect situation to do it. And just for everyone listening, remember, no debt and emergency funds. They have the cash to cash flow it. And that's it. There's no HELOC. There's no, we still have our student loans. Take a HELOC to do these renovations. No. And that's what a lot of people did during COVID. And so Becca, you're doing it the right way. You just got to do it. And what's funny though,

is like you said, people actually save the money and they're like, oh man, do we really want to spend it on it but what's great about doing it with cash too becca is you guys well you have your budget and you're going to stay within the budget because i'm telling you you go to the appliance store and it's like oh we can get this you're putting it on credit you're like just get the nicer one yeah you yeah you see it and they're like oh but two levels up oh gosh that's a really nice one okay i found out about levels i was like this is a scam yeah well You don't want the level two tile, Rachel. That's basically dangerous for your family.

You need the level four tile. I know. You can start to, if you use debt, you really can start going over budget because you're like, ah, we'll worry about it later. But when it's your own money and you have a strict budget, you know, okay, nope, we're just staying within this. And it helps keep boundaries on this because home renovations, home building, all of that can go off the rails so quickly. So I'm the spender though, Becca.

So I'm your biggest cheerleader on this call. Do it and get a great kitchen. We spend so much time in our kitchen. Send us a picture later so we can see it before and after. So we're giving you the green light, Becca. That's pretty rare on this show that you get a unanimous instant green light, but it's because she's got no debt and has the cash to do it.

So great. Get what you want. Stay within that budget. It's exciting. That's great. All right, up next, we have Anthony in Philadelphia. Hey, Anthony, welcome to the show.

Hey, thanks for having me. Really appreciate it. Absolutely. How can we help? We're doing great. Doing great. How can we help you? All right. So my question is, should I sell some shares of stock that I have from my previous employer and my current employer to put towards existing debt? How much debt do you have?

So we have two pretty big sums, not counting the house. We have $14,000 left on a solar and then $38,000 on a car. Okay. And how much would the stock be worth if you cashed it all out? Yes. So I can pull out somewhere around $25,000. I also have about $20,000 right now sitting in a high-yield savings account. How much? $20,000, did you say? Yes. So $20,000 in savings. I can get about $25,000 from the stock. My wife and I do have a plan to actually have the $14,000 paid off of the solar pretty much in about a month or two.

We are going to pull from our savings account. We're following the kind of debt snowball method. Yeah. Yeah, that's great. And none of this is obviously retirement. It's not tied up in a 401k or Roth or anything. Yeah, it's just company stocks. Do you have capital gains you'll pay when you sell this? Oh, Anthony's off the line somehow.

Oh, we lost him. Pick him up. He's back. Anthony, sorry. We just hung up on you real quick. No, it's okay. All right. So are there capital gains

on these stocks when you sell? You make some money off of it? Yeah. Okay. So I would factor that into your equation. Make sure you're prepared for the tax hit on that.

It's not going to be astronomical, I'm assuming. You haven't had these stocks super long and it's not a huge amount. But I would at least calculate that and make sure that you pay the taxes on that so but that at least knock most of the debt yeah that's amazing yeah because we

do say to cash out everything you have but retirement to get debt paid off and and we don't like having too much in company stock anyways single because it's pretty yeah it's pretty limited and kind of that you're all your eggs are in one basket mentality which is not ideal with investing diversification and all that is what we're what we're really going for so um and i tell you that as a person who actually did this anthony so it's not like advice i tell you to do but i would never do it i had apple stock from when i worked at the retail store back in 0809 when it came time for debt payoff i was looking around for money and i had a bunch of apple stock and so i sold that and it

helped me get out of debt way faster got got me to investing faster, got my emergency fund funded faster. And I don't miss having those stocks and the what ifs of like, well, do you know how much that would be if you hung on to that? That's what your friends are going to say when you go and sell this. You kind of have to turn down the noise from all the opinions and inputs and go, I want to be debt free sooner. That is my priority. I can always buy more and invest more later. I'm not going to miss out. Yeah. So Anthony, with your savings and the stock, it's about $45,000 and you guys have about $52,000 in debt. Is that right? So you'll have $7,000 left to knock out after all this. What's your income? Yes. Household. So my wife is a

stay-at-home mom. She works part-time for our church and does pull in a little bit uh so combined we make about 175 oh that's great so we're talking like two months from now you're debt-free uh theoretically yes but we have two toddlers and we just had our third child two months ago so a little bit of a fear. Yeah. Congratulations. There's a little bit of a fear. Okay, so four months. So maybe four months.

Give it four. We'll give you four months, Anthony. That's nothing. It's a great question, though. Yep, cash it out, put it towards the debt, and starting with a new little baby. You know what? I'm going to send you Rachel's new kids book,

I'm glad for what I have, for those toddlers and the new baby. Isn't that sweet? That was, thanks, George. I just thought of it. It's a great gift for the kiddos out there. So hang on the line, Anthony. We're going to send you Rachel's new kids book.

It's a great read. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with bestselling author George Camel. We're taking your calls. Up next, we have Shonda in Cleveland. Hey, Shonda, welcome to the show. Hi. Hi, guys.

Hello, hello. Hi. Can you hear me? Yes, we can. We can. Oh, okay. Thanks for calling. Yeah.

How can we help? Yes, I have money stress. I have an income of like $22,000, $24,000, but I have two collection agencies. One is $5,000, which I could pay. I only have $2,000 more to pay for that one collection agency, and the other one is $8,000 and I don't know what to do or begin to pay that debt. I don't even know where to begin. I haven't talked to that collection agency at all because I don't know what to do because I don't have no money to pay them.

A driveway that needs to be fixed, that's like $20,000, they say. So that's an upcoming expense.'s like $20,000 they say. So that's an upcoming expense that's not debt right? Yeah that's an upcoming expense. Okay what other debt do you have? I have student loans that's $50,000, a car loan that's $11,000, a home loan that's 75,000 and I was like um one month behind I think I just caught up and um let's see um credit card that's 200. 200 dollars dollars of minimum payment or that's the total yeah no that's the total so I was gonna pay them off when off next time I get paid. Okay. How old are you? 53. Okay.

What are you doing for work right now? Nursing assistant. But I feel like I'm overwhelmed. I don't know what to do. And I know y'all say don't play the lottery, but I've been trying to do that. Oh, no. I don't know what else to do. I don't know what else to do. In the convenience store, a't know what else to do. Shonda, don't step foot in the convenience store, a gas station.

Stay far away. How many hours a week are you working? That's right. Like 40 hours. And then sometimes I pick up on my off days. Okay. So I'm working. I'm working.

And you're doing what again? I'm sorry. Say it one more time. Nursing assistant. Nursing assistant. But you're only making $24,000 working as a nursing assistant and working 40 hours a week. Yeah. Okay. Okay.

Yeah, I mean, I think the first thing to be looking at, because what's your degree in? Because you have some student loans. Yeah. Well, I went to school for different, well, I really went to school and didn't really get much of a degree. I got one degree and... How long have you been paying on these student loans? Years. And I haven't made a dent.

And I mean, you know, during COVID, they wasn't taking any payments during COVID. They were sending your money right back. Are you single? Yes. Okay. Well, there's some simple steps you can take that are tactical to help you, but it's going to take sacrifice. It's going to take making more, spending less, all of that.

So here's the thing. With the collections, you've got to talk to these people we can't bury your head in the sand and even if you call them and say listen i can't pay you i make ten dollars an hour and i got a lot of bills and a lot of people who want to get paid and so i need to keep the lights on so your one priority is food utilities shelter transportation we, transportation. We call that the four walls. Nothing else gets paid before those get paid. I don't care

who the debt is to, what the collectors are saying, you gotta keep the lights on, keep the mortgage paid, so that you don't get foreclosed on. And eat something too. And so beyond that, you gotta make your insurance payments. We need to keep all of that to protect us.

And then we can start tackling the debt. But clearly, there's not much to tackle it with because you have no money left after making minimum payments, right? That's right. So, I mean, what do I tell them or what do I do? Do I write a letter? Do I call them? I call everyone you owe debt to and say, listen, I want to pay you, but I don't have any money.

I make $10 an hour. I'm six figures in debt. I'll pay you when I can and what I can. But right now, I'm flat broke. Okay. Yeah. And then on the income side, Shonda, I mean, honestly, I mean, I was, you know, Walmart, Target,

like these places are paying up to 20 an hour. Like you could double your hourly rates by working somewhere else. I think you're going to need a different job. I just don't, this job is not going to be able to sustain you. And you're working 40 hours. So I'm like, you have a great work ethic, but that energy is going to something that's not giving you your rate of return of what you need right now. And places like Walmart, Target, some other places, I mean, they have great benefits. They really do a great job in helping their employees.

So I honestly would be switching jobs. You have to make more. You can't be living on this. Is there a path for you to make more in the nursing assistant world? Like to CNA where you could be making $40,000 a year? I don't know, like the hospitals or something like that. I don't know how much they... I would do some homework and research and talk to people who are in these fields,

in these positions, and ask them the path and what it's going to cost and what it's going to take and how long. Because long-term, you need a solution. Yeah, agency pays. I mean, I guess agency. But beyond the agency, as a certified nursing assistant, you should be able to make $30 to $40 versus $22. And with your experience, I'd imagine this wouldn't be a huge leap.

And so I would just at least start to do some homework. I know life has got you down, but this is the time. The next 10 years, we need to be really getting focused, get the income up, get rid of this debt and have no mortgage payment. And Sean, to start binge watching some of our debt-free screams here on the YouTube channel or even podcasts, but go through and watch some of these stories, because I know it feels like you're in such a hopeless situation. And numbers wise, it does feel hopeless, right? And so we want some of that to change with your income and starting to get a grapple on this debt. But just

know that there is a way out. It's just going to look different than probably what you've done in the past, and that's okay. But there's people that do it every day so continue to to feed your mind with this stuff if you hold on the line Shonda Austin's going to pick up I want to give you Financial Peace University that's our nine lesson course on money just to get you the basics we'll throw in every dollar premium as well which is our our budgeting app and they have a great tutorial there when you sign up there to really walk through and teach you there here's detailed how you do a budget. And Austin, go ahead and throw in Total Money Makeover too. And that's Dave Ramsey's bestselling book. And it's the seven baby steps. I just want to get some knowledge of this plan in you, Shonda. And I want you to just like soak all this up because

it's going to kind of be a different world that you'll be navigating with money. It's going to look different, but I want you to have motivation and people behind you cheering you on. And even if it's us on YouTube cheering you on and giving you some encouragement through other callers or watching their stories, I want that for you. Cause I want you to know that, that this can change. It's going to be different. It's going to be different from what you've done and it's going to be hard. None of this is change. It's going to be different. It's going to be different from what you've done. And it's going to be hard. None of this is easy. None of this is easy, but it is possible. I'm going to throw even one more thing,

just because I feel for Shonda. I'm going to gift you a free coaching session with a trained Ramsey financial coach who can walk through all of this with you, help you with the collection side, navigate this wild journey, help you make a plan with the debt snowball, just because we can't do that in a radio call. And I really want Shonda to have hope.

Yeah. Because I know a lot of older caller, there's older people out there listening who are in their 50s, Rachel, and they're going, well, I'm in her shoes. There's no hope for me. And it takes, it's harder to do as you get older. It's just harder. Yeah, it's deeper habits that you have to break that you're used to. The mistakes have been compounding for years. The debt's been sitting around for years. It's in collections. So hang on the line.

We'll get you connected and give you a free session with a trained Ramsey financial coach who can help. So that's a big part of the problem is. Yes. And it is hard. And getting a game plan. That's right. And, you know, we talk to people.

Yeah. In their 50s, 60s, sometimes in their 70s. Right. And they don't have anything for retirement. They're trying to figure this out. And even though it's a hard hill to climb to say, okay, I'm going to buckle down. I'm going to learn something new, change what I've been doing, sacrifice, take on that extra job. All of that is hard.

But it's also hard to go into retirement with nothing if you continued on that path, right? So it's one of those things like you choose your heart. Yeah. And one heart's actually going to be able to give you money when you start working a plan and get out of debt and be able to have some level of control over your life versus not at all, right? Don't give up, Shonda.

You got this, Shonda. We believe in you. This is The Ramsey Show. Our scripture of the day comes from Isaiah 46, 4. Even in your old age and gray hairs, I am he. I am he who will sustain you. I have made you and I will carry you. I will sustain you and I will rescue you.

One man cannot hold another man down in the ditch without remaining down in the ditch with him. Booker T. Washington. That's a good quote right there. That is so true. So, so true. Well, George, it's been a great hour.

It has been. We've had some great calls. I've enjoyed it. I'm glad you feel the same way. I do. I have. All right. So to round out the show, let's go to Ethan in Kalamazoo. Hey, Ethan. Welcome to the show. Hi. Hi. How can we help? So I just had some questions. So I just turned 18 and I graduated a couple couple months ago and I just don't really have any idea like what to do with my money. Okay. So you're 18 years old, graduated from high school.

What are you doing now? Are you in school? Are you working? I'm a pipe fitter in a pipe welder. Okay. Good for you. How much are you making? I make $20 an hour, so about $2,400 a month. Okay, good for you. Are you living at home or are you on your own? Yes, ma'am. You're at home? Okay, awesome. How much money do you have? Right now, I have about three grand saved up in a checking account and then I have, I think, $2,500 in a checking account and then I have I think $2,500 in a money market and then I have another $300 something for bills. Okay and do you have any debt? No sir. Great and what's your question? So I was just like wondering because I know I feel like every like my whole life people said like, you know, renting like apartments was like super bad and stuff.

And then I heard a couple of times from you guys that, you know, renting apartments isn't always the worst idea. And I just figured, you know, since I'm young, I don't want to get any in any debt ever. You know, it scares me now after I've watched your guys' shows for 10 hours a day. And so I was just like wondering like wondering what's okay to be in debt for and what's not okay? Yeah, that's a great question. Well, if you've listened to the show for 10 hours a day,

you'll know that we are anti-debt all the way, anytime. We don't think there's any such thing as good debt. And the only debt we don't yell at you for is a 15-year fixed rate mortgage that you're attempting to pay off early. So outside of that, is good debt. And the only debt we don't yell at you for is a 15-year fixed rate mortgage that you're attempting to pay off early. So outside of that, we don't believe there's any good debt that it should be leveraged, that it's some kind of tool. We've only seen it cause pain and harm in the long term. And the ones that brag about it just haven't been burned yet. And so at 18,

man, if you can get a hold of those principles now, you're going to be unbelievably wealthy. Yeah. And you're going to have a great life. Yeah. And the renting thing, Ethan. Yeah, we are not we're not against renting. I mean, renting buys people a lot of patience and gets them in a position financially then to be able to put a good down payment on a house, get out of debt, you know, do some things. And where a lot of people feel like it's just throwing your money away for us, you know, there's there's a level of risk that you don't have when you don't own a home. Because owning a home, I mean, it can be expensive. I mean, you're, you know, from roof issues, we just had our chimney had to be completely basically redone in the inside. And

so they've been working all week at that. You know, we had stuff with our roof last year. You know, appliances go out. I mean, it's just there is so much that you pay for as a homeowner We had stuff with our roof last year. Appliances go out. I mean, it's just there is so much that you pay for as a homeowner. When you rent, you don't have that expense. So there's a beauty to that, right? We eventually, Ethan, want you to have a house because owning a home and real estate being part of your overall financial picture is a great thing. And we are all about it. but we want you to do it the

right way. But you're 18. So my question for you is, are you going to school? Are you going to do trade? Are you going to be doing this job? Do you think for the near future? Are you happy living at home? Do you want to be out on your own? Where are you at with just your life stages right now? It would be nice to be out on my own, but you know, just like the, like the apartments in my area, like just a studio, those costs at about, you know, like $1,100 to $1,300 a month. And that's well over half of my monthly income right now. Yeah. I don't really plan on going to school. The place I work for, they do an apprenticeship. And so hopefully I'll start that up in September. Okay. And will that cause a raise to occur? Yes, ma'am. That's great. What

will you think you'll be making? I'm hoping they'll give me another dollar. So about 21. Okay. But the thing is, is in, you know, four or five years when I'm done with the apprenticeship and I become a journeyman, I'm expected to make, you know, around 50, you know. Yeah. That's amazing. You'll be six figures by then. Yeah. That's so great, Ethan. Yeah. So what I wouldn't be in a rush with the, with the housing situation. I mean, I think eventually you'll get to a point, you know, maybe when you're 19, 20. And go get a roommate. That's what I had roommates up until I was married.

Yeah, yeah. So get a two bedroom and it may be eight or 900 bucks a month if you split it and go do that for a while and that will give you a sense of independence. It'll help you learn how to be an adult. And, you know, Dave always says that an eagle that doesn't leave the nest

is eventually a turkey so it's good I think it's good for your spirit if you can get out but Ethan I feel like such a mom right now but I'm like he's only been out of you haven't I mean I guess it'll be coming up on a year did you graduate last May from high school um no I graduated early so I graduated um right before Thanksgiving. Nice. Okay. So you've only been out of school for three months, right? Out of high school. Yes, ma'am. Okay. So yeah. I just feel like you're just so young. I'm like, you don't have to go live on

your own apartment right now. No, but if he's saying that's something he wants to do, I don't want people to feel like, well, once I get out, I need to go buy a house. That's right. No, no, no, no, no. Yeah, yeah. And if you want to go and rent an apartment and go do it, that's great. That's great. But I do feel like you've had a lot of life shifting and you're learning how to be an adult right now. And if you don't have to pay for rent right this moment and you know, I think that's a great thing, but I would have plans to move out. Right. It gets to your point, George. Yes. And while you're at home, it brings dignity.

I would say every single penny. Yes yes this is such an amazing season where you don't have many bills and what happens and i i lived this out when i was 18 living at home is i started working and i just spent every paycheck because they didn't have bills i was like what else are you gonna do i'm 18 let's go have fun and i just bought gear and stupid crap and i could have been saving and i could have been paying off student loans but i was just just being an idiot just an 18 year old chuckleold trucker head. Just a little lad, George. You won't be me, Ethan. You're going to do great. Here's the thing. Pay cash for your next car.

That's where 18-year-olds go wrong. So what are you driving now? I have a Ford Ranger. Is it doing well for you? Yeah, yeah. It's been pretty reliable. I've had it for almost two years now. Cool. So great. I would do what George said. Just stockpile some money.

Have a date to say, okay, you know, by, I don't care when it is, September or something, six months from now or whatever, I'm going to really seriously look at moving out, be on my own. And honestly, I think there is something about when you work and you're not in school, you do feel more like an adult, right? I mean, like there's a sense you're bringing in a bunch of money and you're and you're gonna that itch to move out will probably happen sooner than later I just don't want you to feel like you have to rush out right now because you've just had a lot of life change but um have a date talk to your parents about it too and just over communicate

with them like because you sound like a very responsible guy you know and so I think having that plan is great. And that money market account is a great place to be doing your emergency fund. So I would build it up to three to six months of expenses, which may it will increase when you move out because you'll have housing and all of that. But just be putting money away in that money market account. And, and I think just be saving and avoid debts and then be looking at investing soon after you get that emergency fund. I mean, there's some things you can be doing. If you hold on the line, Ethan, I'm going to give you George's book, Breaking Free from Broke,

because he does a great job laying out so many of the myths in our world today when it comes to money and our culture and our generation. And I think as you start, you know, diving into adulthood more and more, you're going to hear more and more opinions about money. And George does a great job refuting. Is that the right word? Oh, yeah. Great word. Thanks. Man, really, really pulled that one out. Refuting a lot of the myths and the lies that people have fallen into. It will keep you away from debt for the rest of your life. I promise you. If you read that book, it makes you want to take a shower when I just lay out the facts.

And Ethan's already right there, but it's easy at 18. You start working. You feel like you need to increase your lifestyle and you start comparing. The credit score. You hear all this stuff. You just got a Camaro. You got to just turn down the noise and all of that and focus on your goals. A Camaro? That's what the kids want these days. Really? I don't know why.

Are Camaros the thing? I saw some nods out there. The 18-year-olds love a Camaro. They love a little muscle car. Wow! Who knew? I got my finger on the pulse, Rachel. Man, you know what's going on, George. You're so hip. I'm a car guy. So hip. Well, Ethan, thanks for the call, and thank you, America, for listening.

Thanks to all the guys in the booth, keeping the show afloat. George, thank you. Thank you, Rachel. You've been a great co-host, as always. And we'll be back. We'll see you next time.