The Ramsey Show - App - Do I Even NEED a Job Anymore? (Hour 2)

Episode Date: October 17, 2019

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I am Dave Ramsey, your host. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Laurie starts off this hour in Idaho. Hi, Laurie. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Thanks for taking my call.

Sure. What's up? I just wanted to tell you thank you for Financial Peace University. It started my journey. And I had spoke to you a year and a half ago about selling a rental property to put a down payment on my house. And I did one step further than that. I sold my commercial building as well and paid off my house. Wow. How's that feel?

It feels great. But my question is, I feel like I'm still living paycheck to paycheck. I'm putting $3,500 a month into my retirement. And I was just wondering, do I still need to be on a budget after being debt-free? Yeah. Everybody needs to be on a budget all the budget is just telling your money what to do instead of wondering where it went okay are you just telling what to do what do you want to do with your money

you got a lot more options now to give okay so have a have a giving budget a giving budget yeah the ramsey family foundation our philanthropy that my oldest daughter runs has a budget that we give away out of that budget every year we're intentional about our giving idea we're very intentional about our giving we lay it out every year and we've got categories and particular ministries or particular things that we're going to support that year we write those checks the ones that are just categories we're waiting on something to pop up in that category and then she handles every bit of that uh in that case but yeah just be intentional about your giving um at least by category you don't have to go you don't have to know every single thing in january that you're going to do through the whole 12 months

but have some pocket money that says uh this is for random acts of kindness and i'm just going to pay this stressed out young couple's light bill okay right so am i putting too much money away in my retirement i don't know what's your income 65 000 3500 is a lot i know but i want to be able to be a millionaire. You will be. Even at 58 years old? I don't know when you're going to die, but I suspect you will be. Okay. I mean, if you keep putting something like that, that's $30,000 a year, or almost $40,000 a year. It is $40,000 a year you're putting aside. And so, yeah, I mean, that's going to about 10 years or so.

That alone, if it's invested in mutual funds, would turn into that. So that'd be $400,000 you put in in 10 years. It easily would have grown to a million. And you'd only be 68. So as long as you're healthy, you're probably going to make it a lot later than that. Right. So how much money do you have in your 401k now and in your nest egg today um 350 and what's your real estate worth um 350 okay if something is averaging um% a year. It doubles every seven years. Okay.

So you have 700 now. But then I'll be a millionaire. You have 700 now. In seven years, you'd be a millionaire if you don't add anything to it. Okay. If you're invested well. I don't know if real estate is going to go up 12%. I don't know if the stock market is going to go up 12%.

But that's kind of a rule of thumb. You can say, okay, if it makes seven percent it's going to double in 12 years okay and i'll still be young enough to enjoy it yeah well you're young enough to enjoy it now and you know so yeah if you want to crank that 3500 back a little bit so that you can do more giving or have a more enjoyment there's three things you should always be doing with money. You should be investing it, you should be giving it, and you should be enjoying it. It kind of sounds like you've got the generosity

and the investing turned up so high that you're not enjoying it. Yeah, because I feel like I'm still living paycheck to paycheck. Yeah, like you're broke. Yeah, because you're not broke. That's what I feel like like you're almost a millionaire now okay way to go i am exciting good i'm proud of you all right liz is in pennsylvania hi liz how are you good dave i'm blessed but i'm at a crossroads. I need a second opinion. I've got one. So my company is laying off and this has been a typical every two years. I'm blessed. I

work for a great company. I have a severance package where I would get 48 weeks and benefits up to 78 weeks. Where my crossroads is, is I am 52, almost 53, and my husband's 55. I want to raise my hand and be done and retire and spend my time volunteering and taking care of the house. And he wants to retire at 60. So we have about a five-year gap of, can we do this? Because we do have a fair amount in retirement how much is in retirement so my part's about 630 right now 630 000 his is over 700 000 and i'm due for a pension i can take the lump sum at age 55 but of course i can't touch it until I'm 59 1⁄2. Right. But my pension's about $430.

Okay. Good. So we're seeing... And you're 52. I'm 52. Okay. Yes. All right. And he's 55.

And is your house paid for? Yes. And what does he earn? He earns about $150 with about a... On average, he's been averaging a $50,000 bonus. Okay, so you got a year of severance, so now we're at $53,000, and he makes $150,000, and at $55,000, you can roll your pension to an IRA, which you're going to do, in good mutual funds, because it'll do better there,

and you get to keep the money in your estate when you die. If you die with a pension, they keep keep your money so we always move it um okay so why can you not if from 53 years old and on when you've got a two million dollar plus net worth i understand you can't access that net worth right now because most of it is tied up in retirement till he gets to 59 and a half but why can you not live on his 130 well that's what i'm telling him really it's 200 when you count bonus but he's scared what's he scared of he's he's a saver a huge saver we have 600 000 between mutual funds and cash on top of that on top of what you told me on top of what you told me that's not in a retirement account? No.

No. We have about $330 in mutual funds, $150 in an annuity, and $150 in cash. Okay. Bubba needs to learn to do math. That's what I told him. He's not scared. He's scared he can't pile up more money because he needs to enjoy money more. All he does is save it.

Okay. And I'm proud of him. I mean, my God, you guys are worth several million dollars, obviously. You've done a wonderful job. Did you inherit all that or did you work for all of it? We worked and saved and budgeted. You guys are awesome. You definitely can quit.

You definitely could quit, should quit. But the big thing here is y'all need to sit down with whoever's handling your investments, and they need to show you that you're okay so Bubba can relax. Because he's, man, he is a saver. Wow. Way to go. That's what got you here. But you also need to get to the other side of it.

You live like no one else, not so you can keep saving and be broke, but so you can live like no one else and give like no one else. And that's where you are. Folks, let's cut through the bull. Interest rates are exceptionally low, so you're missing out if you have not called Churchill Mortgage to see if you can save money on your home loan. Lots of other companies are out there claiming great deals, but don't get lured by slick advertisements.

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Do it today while rates are low. This is a paid advertisement. NMLS ID 1591. NMLSconsumeraccess.org. Equal housing lender. 761 Old Hickory Boulevard, Brentwood, Tennessee 37027. Gabrielle is with us in Indiana. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show, Gabrielle. Good afternoon. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? Okay, so we've been following you guys for about five months, and we got your book. Okay, so unfortunately, I fell and I broke my wrist, and I own a yoga kids company.

So I have not been able to work in six weeks. And unfortunately, I had to get a plate. So I cannot work until after Christmas. But we, okay, so I know all about you and you just say work. So I found a job that I can do on Sundays that I'll be making like $150 to $300 in cash. So my big question is, is now we have this unexpected medical debt of about $5,500 and I have everything set up on payment plans. Do I take the cash that I'm going to be making and throw it towards our credit card debt or do I throw it towards our medical debt? Because medical debt has no interest. The interest doesn't matter. List your debts smallest to largest and pay them in that order. To be honest with you, our medical debt and our credit card debt are tied at $5,500.

No, no, not by category, by individual debt. How many credit cards do you have? We have two. Okay. And how many medical debts do you have? We have two. Okay. And how many medical debts do you have? Do you mean from one hospital to the doctor? How many individual debts do you have? I would probably say about seven individual bills.

Perfect. Then take those seven and the two credit cards and look at the balances and list them smallest to largest between the nine. One through nine. Pay minimum payments on everything but the smallest of the nine. Throw all the cash at the smallest of the nine until it's gone. When it's gone, that payment is also gone. Then throw all cash you can find in your budget at the next one down and then the next one down and then the next one down.

And what it will give you is a sense of progress because you will be making progress. And you'll get more and more excited as you plow through these because you can look at it and go, hey, I knocked out half of them. I knocked out a fourth of them. I knocked out three-fourths of them, you know, by number but maybe not by math. And then you'll be able to plow on through. What is the total of all nine? Like medical debt with credit cards?

You had $5,500 in medical and $5,500 in credit cards? $5,500 plus $5,500, yeah. So around $11,000 clears up the whole thing. What's your household income? My husband makes about $100,000. And my second question to you is he has three months of laid off. So we have your $1,000. And my second question to you is, he has three months of laid off. So we have your $1,000 emergency fund, but how, like your book doesn't really talk about like if he's laid off for three months and he's on main income. Right now? No. Usually there's a period that's either

two months in winter or it's usually two months in summer, the way his job works. And how much notice do you have that that's coming? About two weeks. And what does he do during that two months? Well, see, the thing is if he loses, like he tries to do cash jobs because he can't, if he works, he loses his spot on the contractor line. Like he's in the union. So they have like really strict rules about when you're

off. Okay. You mean he can't do anything? Well, he loses his what's it called? That he gets. I'm sorry. It's called when you get something that when you're off work,

when you're laid off. Unemployment? Yeah, unemployment. But it's nothing compared to what his paychecks are like yeah so go make a paycheck right so that's why i agree with you i'm working which helps um i'm talking about him during the two months you asked me a question about how do you cover your two months that he's not working he works so you're saying don't take the unemployment and go get a different job yeah okay you'll make more what does he do is he an electrician you said um no he's a boil maker boiler maker okay he's a welder yeah welder okay so he can do non-union welding, can he not? They frown upon it at his union if they find out that you're doing non-union work.

I frown upon the fact that they don't let him work but 10 months a year. I'm not sure this union is a blessing. So how much they frown doesn't bother me much. Well, frowning upon means that you can be moved on the list to get jobs so that's what we've always kind of had that question is should he go and get another job during those you know months off or you know do we wait okay yeah he needs to make some more money because that that's just absurd it's asinine that they ask the man to sit on his butt two months a year uh otherwise they frown upon him oh my gosh what kind of union is this i mean they're supposed to be taking care of the people in the union hello

that's not that's that's their job uh yeah backwards backwards weird people all right so anyway yeah that's what you do and you list your debts smallest to largest and you may want to if you if your entire business is shut down maybe someone can teach your kid yoga class for you and you pay them a cut and you don't lose all your clients while you are not able to do this class i don't know what you were making on that but that's something to look at anna is with us in florida hi anna how are you hi dave i'm so excited to get to talk to you. You too. What's up? I am basically drowning in debt and in stress. I have been in a lawsuit for two and a half years, and there's no end in sight.

I have about $80,000 of unsecured debt, some of it related to paying for litigation. And I'm basically running out of money to keep paying attorneys to fight my case. It's basically a breach of contract case, but they're also alleging breach of fiduciary and fraud, which is unlikely they will be able to prove because nothing like that actually happened, if I lose this lawsuit, I might owe as much as $200,000 plus attorney fees. And the longer the lawsuit goes on, the higher the attorney fees I might owe, even if I lose by just a dollar. I don't know what to do.

I had a meeting for two hours with a bankruptcy attorney. It seems really expensive to even file for bankruptcy. If you file for bankruptcy, what happens to the lawsuit? It continues or it just shuts off? It shuts off, but they can force it back into state court for me to have to litigate it. Further, they can file an adversary proceeding, which is basically a case within the bankruptcy court. Yeah, they're not going to the bankruptcy court that I would have to

then litigate. Yeah, they're not going to do that. Very expensively because those... Yeah, but I'm just saying, if you bankrupt on this and shut the lawsuit off, isn't it over? Not necessarily. If they file an adversary, they're very litigious for two and a half years, even though they know we don't, my husband and I don't really have any assets or income or extra income. I've attempted

to settle with them for as much as 150,000 to make it go away with monthly payments. It would not take the settlement unless I signed that I committed breach of fiduciary. So I couldn't dismiss it in bankruptcy. I honestly would like to repay. The lawsuit has to do with real estate that I would buy and flip. And one of the properties basically went belly up because my investor didn't fully fund it. Yeah. Okay. As far as my unsecured debt is concerned, I stopped paying because we didn't have enough money to pay the attorneys.

What's your household income? It's mostly my husband's income, although I help with the business. It's between $100,000 and $150,000 per year. Okay. All right. I do not know the answer on your lawsuit of what to do. I'm certainly not a legal expert, and I can't ascertain from what you're telling me whether bankruptcy is going to give you any relief or not. If it's not going to give you any relief from these people, then why would you file bankruptcy? You wouldn't. Okay. The only reason

to file bankruptcy is to get them off of you, but if it doesn't get them off of you, what's the point in filing bankruptcy? It doesn't serve any purpose. And so what you've got to do is analyze what your options are in those situations, and I honestly do not know is the answer to the question for me. I wish I could be more help, but I really don't grasp why you can't dismiss this in bankruptcy. I understand fiduciary responsibility, and I understand what you're facing,

but I don't understand why you can't go away in bankruptcy. You usually can, unless you've committed fraud. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Business leaders, if you're not using LinkedIn Jobs, you are missing out. Our Ramsey Solutions Company page on LinkedIn has over 100,000 followers. That's over 100,000 potential like-minded people our team communicates our current openings to. We also post on LinkedIn Jobs because we know the right person will have an impact on our company for years to come. And LinkedIn Jobs matches the right person with the right job. It's no wonder a hire is made every eight seconds on LinkedIn. And over 600 million members visit LinkedIn to make connections, learn and grow as professionals, and discover new job opportunities.

In fact, LinkedIn members add 15 new skills to their profiles and apply to 35 job posts every two seconds. Get started today with LinkedIn Jobs and get $50 off your first job post. Visit LinkedIn.com slash Ramsey. Terms and conditions apply. In the Ramsey Solutions Lobby on the debt-free stage, Dominic and Emily are with us. Hey, guys, how are you? Hey, Dave.

Welcome. Where do you guys live? St. Paul, Minnesota. Oh, wow. Nice trek down? Hey, Dave. Welcome. Where do you guys live? St. Paul, Minnesota. Oh, wow. Nice trek down to Nashville. Yeah. Welcome. Good to have you. And all the way down here to do a debt-free scream. How much did you pay off? We paid off $127,500.

Love it. And how long did this take? 18 months. Good for you. And your range of income during that time? Well, our tax returns the year before was $90,000, and this year we're projected to be $200,000. Whoa! Double your income plus. How do you do that? Well, Emily graduated and started as a nurse, and then also we had many part-time jobs,

and we own a duplex, so we rented out the top floor. We live on the bottom floor, so that's how we did that. Okay. All right. So just adding income left and right, plus Emily gets her full-time gig. Yep, exactly. There it is. Okay, good for you guys. What kind of debt was the $127,500? Well, $6,000 was an SUV, and the rest was my student loans from two different undergrad degrees, and then that became our student loans when we got married. Okay, very cool.

So how long have you been married? Five years. Okay, so what happened 18 months ago? Well, I mean, obviously, like everybody says, it starts long before 18 months ago. But when we were dating, even, we knew that we wanted to clean up the student loan debt. Even on date three, actually, Emily mentioned, that's when she came out to me with how much student loan debt, and she was actually encouraging me that we probably should break up. And I said, nope, nope, we're going to go forward with that.

So then actually, so then we got married, and she was still in school. And at that time, we knew we wanted to make sure that we tried to stop getting in more student loan debt. So we tried to pay as best we could for her schooling then. And then about two years ago, our pastor, Father William Baer, he had a homily on his at church introducing Financial Peace University to us, to the whole congregation. And we felt that at that point, if Father Baer feels that we should do this, let's do that. So then the next February, we started Financial Peace University. Unfortunately, a week before Financial Peace University started, Father Bear passed away unexpectedly.

Yeah. And so we started our classes a week after. And it was actually a really good healing opportunity for the parish, and it also made it more motivating for us. This is something that Father Bear wanted us to do, so let's do it. And we're going to go all in now. I mean, my gosh, you can't halfway do it now. Yeah, exactly.

Wow, way to go. Very cool. All right, so $127,000 in 18 months, all just beans and rice? Yeah, pretty much. And a lot of working. Yeah, a lot of working. I worked three different nursing jobs. And then I also, besides my full-time job, I did security at a minor league baseball team games in St. Paul.

And I also played drums. So wherever I could play drums, I played drums at. Okay, cool. Good for you guys. Very cool. So what do you tell people now the secret to getting out of debt is? I say to dream. That got us on the same page. It got us to look beyond just today or the next week, but in the future.

Realizing that I like nice things. We wanted to have a life together, and that wasn't possible. And I knew that coming into our marriage and then going back to school that we needed to get rid of the student loans. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, I say don't make excuses. It's so easy, especially in the day's age, to be a victim, to say, you know, I deserve this. I worked so hard that I deserve to take this vacation.

I deserve this. No, you have to own what you've created. And it was our debt. We have to own that, and we have to get out of it. And take responsibility for that, too. I deserve stuff. No, you have to own what you've created. It was our debt. We have to own that and we have to get out of it. And take responsibility for that too. So you kind of just threw your shoulders back and said, we're going to do this. We're going to put the responsibility right here and let's get after it. Yep, exactly. Very cool. Well, way to go, you guys. Who were your biggest cheerleaders?

You know, I think we had a lot of silent cheerleaders. I think every one of our friends we ditched out last minute because, for me, I was able to pick up a shift. So I was calling friends and saying, hey, you know, I can't hang out. Even if it's just going for a walk, that's something free. I wasn't going to take that opportunity to pick up a shift. Or our family. This past year, I worked every single holiday because that meant double time overtime for me, except the 4th of July, I will say, because it's my dad's birthday. But we said no a lot. And, you know, we did hear some comments about like, oh, your debt's fine.

Don't worry. Your interest rate is totally fine. It less than you know five percent don't worry um but we the majority we had a lot of support with our family and friends just to um continue to push on and they weren't you know complaining at all that's great very cool you guys very very well done well we've got a copy of chris hogan's book for you everyday millionaires you'll be one in 20 minutes the way you're going. Thank you. I'm so proud of y'all. Well done.

Very, very well done. Wow. And look at what your pastor started. Wow. Absolutely amazing. Very, very cool. All right. Dominic and Emily St. Paul, Minnesota, $127,500 paid off in 18 months.

Make a 90 to 200. Never turn down an overtime shift during the holidays. That's how it's done right there. Great place to go when you're broke. To work. Well done. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream.

Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Love it! Way to go go you guys absolutely awesomeness man that is amazing that is amazing our question of the day comes from blinds.com the number one online retailer of custom window coverings you get free samples free shipping and with the new promos they run every month, you'll save even more. Use the promo code RAMSY to get the best possible deal. Rules and restrictions apply. Today's question is from Kim in Colorado. I'm 44.

I have two kids, and other than a mortgage, we have no debt. I recently received the ability to get a lump sum payment of one of my pensions. The lump sum is around $28,000. My question is whether it's a good idea or whether we let it sit till we retire. Are there risks to leaving it? If I do the lump sum, I would reinvest. I would do the lump sum and I would reinvest it into mutual funds in a good growth stock mutual fund in a direct transfer ira there's no taxes that way if you roll a lump sum from a pension into the taxes um i mean into a direct transfer rollover ira you have no taxes and you're investing it you're going to make more on it while you're alive and of course when you die a pension dies with you you don't get to

keep your pension after death it just stays with the company and so when you die and you have a hundred thousand dollars in an ira and a mutual fund which is 28 000 would easily grow to in your lifetime um and you die that's a hundred thousand dollars left to your heirs so you make more with a pension roll over into an an IRA while you're alive because you make a better rate of return, and you make more when you die because they don't keep your money. And so it's rolled over into what it needs to at that point, and a good mutual fund IRA direct transfer rollover.

That's how you do it. So good question. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825- 5225. Brooke is on Twitter. My financial advisor suggested refinancing my mortgage on a 30-year loan and putting

what I save into my 401k. What's your opinion? You need a new financial advisor. He sucks. Hope I wasn't unclear. Any financial advisor that suggests you borrow on your home in order to invest is not wise and here's why it's not wise studying i didn't just make this up it's not a dave principle it's a wealth building principle chris hogan and our company studied 10,000 millionaires. 10,000, the largest study of millionaires ever done.

And you know what the two primary things we found, how they became millionaires? They steadily invested in their 401k and they paid off their house in 10.2 years on average. A paid for house and a big, hairy 401k or Roth IRA in mutual funds. And that's what made them millionaires. So your financial advisor is suggesting to go ahead and cut off at the knees one of the two things that are the two primary data points on someone becoming a millionaire, which means his financial advisor is more squat and you need to fire him and get a new one. Ta-da! This is The Dave Ramsey Show. financial advice isn't worth squat and you need to fire him and get a new one this is the dave ramsey show We'll be right back. on the road best-selling author and Ramsey personality,

Anthony O'Neill is with us in Houston, Texas. Hey, Anthony, how are you? Hey, Dave, how's it going? I am. It's great to be in the great city. Go ahead. It's great to be in the city of Houston, Texas, the last leg of the book tour. Well, congratulations, man. You're almost done.

You've done a great job out there hustling and getting things done. A bazillion media and podcast appearances. You've been working your butt off, man. Yeah, I did. Yesterday was a huge day for us in Colorado. We did Fox 21 in the morning, and then we did the Millionaire's Roundtable. Then we did a lot of podcasts. And then last night, Dave, the book signing in Colorado Springs was jam-packed, standing room only.

We even had an amazing story and a couple of drive all the way down. I forgot the name of the city, but it was a four and a half hour drive just to come meet me, talk to us and talk about their vision. So it's been a great, great, great day. And here in Houston today, I'll do some more media and do a book signing tomorrow night around 6 o'clock. Very cool. Very cool.

So your signing is tomorrow in Houston, Books a Million, Katie Mills, Circle. Yes, sir. And 6 o'clock and giving away $500 cash prize there for that. Must be present to win. Be 18 years old or older. So what are you finding as you're talking to people in these book signing lines and as you're going in these media operations when you suggest that people should and could and can go to college completely debt-free?

You know, Dave, what's been funny, being out here on the road and just hearing people's heart, you're seeing parents bring their kids, parents who took out student loans, parents who are still paying back student loans. I've even seen a couple of parents crying when I'm just sharing my story and giving the process of how their child can go to debt-free. And parents are raising their hands saying, hey, I did it wrong. This is why I'm here, because I want to make sure that my son, that my daughter does not do it wrong. A young lady last night, she had just heard about it from her mother.

Her mother was listening to your show yesterday. And then she called her daughter and said, hey, you need to take your kids here. And she had three kids and she was just literally in tears saying they have to go to school debt-free they have to and she bought all three of them books she said i'm gonna read it but they're going to read it before me and so what i'm seeing here is parents are hungry to set their child up to win truly not to fail taking out student loans very cool very cool so in when you're actually talking to the actual human being that might have taken out a student loan, but you convince them that they don't have to in order to send their kids to school, they're not really pushing back. America is saying, hey, if you don't get a scholarship, take out student loans and go to your school. Harvard will open up doors. Yale will open up doors. But I'm simply saying two plus two equals four. When's the last time you asked your

doctor or your lawyer, what school did they go to? And they all just started laughing. They're like, yeah, he's right. I'm like, hey, how do you start? And even where you finish is not a huge deal. The fact is, if you need education to become a school teacher, get the education. It doesn't matter if you start in a community college and transfer to an in-state school and stay at home all four years. It doesn't matter how you do it. The key thing here is we're going to do it debt-free, and we're going to be smart how we do it. And there's an aha moment. Come on.

Like, wow, I could do it. And it's been shocking to hear. I met a young lady yesterday to be a school teacher today. She has her PhD. She's $285,000 in debt. She makes $72,000 a year. And she's a single mother. And she's like, it's hard.

She said, if I would have had this book 20 years ago, I would not be in this situation. But she introduced me to her 12-year-old daughter, who will not be in this situation. Yeah, yeah. See, what you have to do is, you know, well, Dave, you and Anthony are dream killers. No, we're nightmare killers. Because some of you people, the way you go about living your dream turns into a freaking nightmare. The 32-year-old version of you thinks the 21-year-old version of you is an idiot. You know why?

Because the 21-year-old version of you thinks the 21-year-old version of you is an idiot. You know why? Because the 21-year-old version of you was an idiot because you went $280,000 in debt to get a Ph.D. to teach school and make $70,000. That's just asinine. And somebody ought to have their butt kicked for allowing that to occur to that poor woman, and she ought to have her, oh, that's so make me so mad it's unbelievable you know i talked a call like that on the other day and this stupid idiot woman got on twitter and said uh well you just killed his dream you just killed his dream no i didn't i just kept him from going into a nightmare i kept him from being one of those pitiful callers that's

completely overwhelmed and has no life and he's 37 years old still paying on this stupid dream to get a degree that's not usable in the marketplace. It's crazy out there, man. So I'm so happy to hear that when you're actually sitting down individually, one-on-one, instead of with some moron on Twitter, that you're actually talking to humans that have brains, and they're going, yeah, this is dumb. I'm not doing this.

Yeah, Dave, and I think the exciting part for me too is the kids, like the kids and the students who are coming out to these book signings, who are seeing me, even at so many media events, they're excited about this message. I had a young lady yesterday. She's 19 years old, graduated high school. And she's been listening to you, listening to myself for the last four years. And she said, I didn't really know what I wanted to do.

So she said she went into community college, worked a little bit. She said she was starting off going to nursing. But then when she heard us say, hey, you know, try different things. See what you really like. So she didn't take out any student loans. She volunteered at a veterinary hospital. And I mean, Dave, she came back and said, I'm glad I actually listened because I do not want to be a nurse. I do not want to be in debt.

This is what I want to do. So I have the vision. I'm following the plan. Thank you so much. And stuff like that just really gets me excited, gets me pumped, gets me going. Because when the parents are on one page with their child, you get real, real, real excited. Well, I'm excited for you, man.

Congratulations. Very well done. Ramsey Personality, best-selling author Anthony O'Neill. The book is Debt-Free Degree. You can pick it up anywhere. Great books are sold, and that includes Houston, Texas, Books a Million. Tomorrow night he'll be there signing them. October the 18th on the katie mills location

of books a million we're giving away 500 cash to someone you do not have to be purchasing anything to be qualified you do have to be present and you have to be over 18 to qualify for the money and so come on out and bring bring your bring your kids your parents, bring whoever needs to hear this message that they can go to school completely debt-free. It is the step-by-step guide to getting your kid through college without student loans. Anthony, thanks for calling in, man. Congratulations. We're very proud of you.

Dave, thanks so much. I'll see you next week. Well done. All right, open phones at 888-825-5225. Also, the other thing that's happened is we launched simultaneously with the book, actually the week before, an eight-episode series called Borrowed Future on podcast. It is one of – we have some massive podcasts here at Ramsey. This thing has gone up faster than anything.

Episode 1 broke through 100,000 downloads faster than anything we've ever done. It's in the top 10 on Apple Podcasts, and you've got to look at this, and you've got to hear this, and you've got to play this for your kids. We're exposing how out of control the student loan industry is. They're out of control, they're predatory, and it is not necessary to go into debt to go to college and to get a four-year degree. It is not necessary. The average in-state tuition is about $10,000.

That's $833 a month. You can make $1,500 a month delivering pizzas a night. Now you tell me why you've got to go into debt to go to college. The only possible reason would be that you go to a college you can't afford instead of in-state tuition at your local state school. Well, Dave, Vanderbilt makes you more valuable than the University of Tennessee. Well, maybe, but I went to the University of Tennessee, and people who went to Vanderbilt worked for me.

That's the biggest bunch of crap I've ever heard in my life, that where you went to school has some correlation with your actual success in life. There is zero research to prove that theory. Zero research. I'm not mad at you if you went to Vanderbilt. I've got good friends who went to Vanderbilt. That's fine.

University of Tennessee, Vanderbilt, both of them can't play football right now. So it doesn't matter. So what is it? What is it you're going to school for? What's your deal? You're trying to get an education. You're trying to get knowledge. And that's really all you need to succeed.

This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Hey guys, it's Blake Thompson, Senior Executive Producer for The Dave Ramsey Show. This hour's over, but you can find more great content on our YouTube channel. Catch the most watched Dave Rants, Deathly Screams, and the very popular Everyday Millionaire segment. Go to the Dave Rantz Show YouTube channel and

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