The Ramsey Show - App - Do You Have a Plan For Your Money?

Episode Date: September 17, 2024

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Number one best-selling author, Ramsey personality, Jade Warshaw is my co-host today. We welcome you, America. We're glad you're here. Open phones at 888-825-5225. And for that matter, even if you're not in America, wherever you are listening and watching we appreciate you jade as i was traveling we spent a little time in scotland a little time in turkey and it was um a joyous thing for sharon and i that the people that did recognize me were all under 30. oh that's great and like for instance the girl checking us in at our uh really really nice

restaurant the last night we were in Scotland. We walked up and my wife said, you know, we've got a reservation for Ramsey. And the lady said, OK. And I said, we're running a little bit early, ma'am, but we'd love to go ahead and be seated. And her head snaps up and she goes, you're that guy on Instagram. And it's like and she's like 24 years old, probably, something like that. And I can't do the Scottish accent, but it was great. And so, you're that.

I wish I could. I had it down for a minute. But yeah, for a little bit there. But yeah, it was. And she's, I don't know your name, but I like your stuff. Wow. Okay, there it is. I love that she knows you from Instagram.

So maybe it's not just America. There we go. 8 love that she knows you from Instagram. So maybe it's not just America. There we go. 888-825-5225. Isaac is in Bangor, Maine. Isaac, how are you? Hi, Dave. How's it going? Better than I deserve.

What's up? I just have a question. Me and my fiancée are planning to get married at the end of the year, and I just want some advice on how to combine our finances and assets. Okay. When we began our relationship, she already owned a home, and I did not. I was looking to buy a home when we first started dating, but I never did. And I have some savings, and i'm in no debt after following your

plan and listening to your show what's the plan that you guys will move into her house since she already has one well we already live in her house together now got it okay so i guess my question is should we sell her house and buy a property together? Not necessarily. It's just whatever house you want to live in. Most states, and you can check on Maine as far as the real estate goes, most states you have a marital interest regardless of whose name is on the deed in your personal residence. So for instance, in Tennessee, if I put the property in my name, my wife is automatically the half owner even if her name is not on the deed, on our personal residence. Now, not on investment property and other things, but on a personal residence.

I'm not sure if that's true in Maine. You'd have to check on that. But it could be that just by the fact you got married, you've got that asset transferred to both of you. As far as the other stuff, we just recommend changing the name on the accounts to both of you yeah okay and having one having one account together having the accounts together yeah everything's combined you have one checking account that you operate the household out of and that you both have access to and that you both are in agreement with on your budgeting that's the

you know the part but as far as the other things like if you've got a mutual fund account it's got your name on it or her name on it, just email in, change the name on the account, the owner of the account to two people, and you just update your miscellaneous accounts around like that. Right. She used some of her time to purchase her house. She used some sort of assistant plan with her retirement to purchase her house she used some sort of uh assistant plan with her retirement to purchase her house so i guess she would like to pull some of her equity out to help her in her retirement

sort of get back up to where it should be i would not do that you would not do that no i would not do that no okay i would leave that alone let's let's get started and make sure we're out of debt. We're walking up the baby steps. Yeah. Have your emergency fund in place and then start, you know, saving for retirement. You got plenty of time. You're going to be okay. And just like checking through those things that might have a beneficiary listed and making sure that it's the way you want it.

And now that you're married. Yeah. All your life insurance policies or anything like that that has a beneficiary 401ks uh you won't be able to come but you won't be able to put her name on your 401k or vice versa but you can put the beneficiary on there to be her on yours and you on hers and so forth that kind of stuff that's what you want to comb through and just make sure you got all the tangles out amy's in harrisburg pennsylvania hi amy How are you? I'm good. How are you? Better than I deserve.

What's up? I have a question because of an early retirement. My husband and I are both law enforcement, and I did 28 and a half years and then retired. He's 10 years younger than me, so therefore he has seven years left to do. So he's still employed, and I am not. But we get a pension from my portion. me, but therefore he has seven years left to do. So he's still employed and I am not. So, but I, we get a pension from my portion. My question, my question is, um, we have enough money for our household to not touch my TSP or other investments that I've done. Um, but should I be investing some of my, I don't feel like I'm contributing anymore. So should I be investing part of my pension back into a Roth, or should I still be contributing, or since I'm not going to touch it –

Where are you guys on the baby steps? We paid everything off in 2020. House and everything? Everything. Way to go. That's awesome. Zero debt. Good for you.

There was no place to travel to. Now I don't know what to do. Yeah, I've got too much money now, Dave. Okay. Way to go. I'm proud of you. Yeah. Thank you.

So here's the thing. There's three things you can do with money when you're in Baby Step 7, or for that matter, anytime. You can enjoy it, you can give it, and you can invest it. And you ought to always be doing all three. Okay. And so I want to make sure you're enjoying some of your income at this stage. You've worked hard for this and that you're being generous with some of it and that you're investing some of it.

And someone always that, you know, early on in my career, people would ask, how much should I save? And I'm like, how wealthy do you want to be? You know, the more you save, the more you're going? And I'm like, how wealthy do you want to be? Right. You know, the more you save, the more you're going to have. I mean, it's pretty simple. So there's not a penalty. I mean, there's nothing wrong with you reinvesting, taking some of your pension money and just starting to do some investing with it.

There's nothing wrong with that at all. I'm afraid that I don't think that we'll touch it, at least until he's finished working. Good. And then probably not. But since I'm 52, he's 42 right now. We're going to retire well before most people retire, which is awesome.

Not a bad problem. Well, and you'll probably have an encore career. You'll probably have some other stuff you do. Most people don't quit at 50-something years old and never work again for 40 years. It's a lot of years to not be doing anything yeah yeah I mean it's not that you might not have to do a nine to five or a grind but you might start a small business you've always wanted to start or you might start this or whatever you don't have to be a Walmart greeter to retire I mean if I if I were in your shoes I definitely if I didn't need the money coming in from the

pension if I were in your shoes I'd want to if I didn't need the money coming in from the pension, if I were in your shoes, I'd want to invest it, especially if I can get a better rate of return for it. And if I don't need it, that's, I mean, that's what I would do. I think you ought to budget some of it for fun and some of it for generosity and some of it for investing. And I don't care what the percentages are. You decide that. Okay. Well, I wasn't, we weren't eligible to do a Roth, but now that I'm in retirement, I'm guessing our income will go down. We would be. That would be the smart vote.

You are eligible to do a Roth. You can do a backdoor Roth, even if you're over 200. Yeah, I do Roths, and I'm way over 200. So, yeah, you can sit down with your smart investor pro. They can show you how to do that, but that's a small amount of money. You're talking about more money than that that you can have fun with and then you can be generous with and that you can invest. So I don't want you to do it because you feel like you're contributing. I want you to do it because it's my plan.

Yeah, 100%. This is The Ramsey Show. There's a time in your life and at the baby steps for renting, but you don't want to do it forever because when you rent, you're still paying for a mortgage, just somebody else's. Plus, rent means instability in your budget because it always goes up, never down. So when you're ready to buy, make sure you work with a mortgage partner you can rely on. Churchill Mortgage. Churchill is Ramsey trusted to help you make the move from

renting to home ownership wisely. Churchill understands that when you buy a home the Ramsey way, your mortgage payment will be a consistent, manageable part of your monthly budget. Plus, when your home is paid off, that was your largest expense. Now it's extra money in your pocket and an asset towards turning you into a baby steps millionaire. So get started on the American dream of home ownership today at churchhillmortgage.com. That's churchhillmortgage.com. This is a paid advertisement. NMLS ID 1591. NMLS consumeraccess.org. Equal housing lender. 1749 Mallory Lane, Suite 100. RentWin Tennessee 37027.

Well, guys, time is running out to book your cabin on the Live Like No One Else cruise. That's right. We're going in March 22nd through the 29th. All the Ramsey personalities, plus a bunch of other big-time folks like Stephen Curtis Chapman. And, man, I got to tell you, we've got comedians coming. personalities plus a bunch of other big-time folks like Stephen Curtis Chapman and man I gotta tell you we got comedians coming we've got a it's quite a lineup Dina Carter famous country music star remember Strawberry Wine she was now we're going to Turks and Caicos Puerto

Rico St. Thomas the Bahamas and all the Ramsey personalities including me and my wife Sharon will be on there the entire week it is is a high-end, very nice cruise. This is Holland, America. This is not the cheap stuff. And because you really shouldn't do this, we don't want you there unless you're in Baby Step 4 and beyond. Because you should be getting out of debt and building your emergency fund. But if you want to mark your success, milestone your success with the Live Like No One Else cruise, because we teach you to live like no one else so that later you can go on a cruise.

I'll be at the spa. You will? Oh, yeah. All right. That's where we can find you. The sanctuary. You and Sharon getting your nails and hair and face done. Yes.

And all that stuff. And they don't have enough Bondo in that spa for my face. So I'll be cruising the buffet or something i guess but um yeah so anyway hey it's going to be fun we'd love to have you there's just a few cabins left and you can get yours you can mark it with 600 bucks and come back later and that really puts you in line for upgrades if you want a better cabin if one if somebody drops out later yeah and so it's the way you get the thing you got it you know it's better than being on a waiting list you go go ahead and get you a cabin get make plans to be there march 22nd through the 29th ramsey solutions.com slash cruise baby it's the only

place you can go to see the only place you can go see me and george's sunny and share act oh no that's a joke i hope it's a joke, I hope. It's a joke. Have y'all been, y'all, good, okay. Y'all didn't do something that I don't know about. No, no, no, it's a joke. George is still working on his Cher costume. You guys are not right.

All right, Zach is in Indianapolis. Hi, Zach. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Hi, Jake. Thank you for takingsey Show. Hi, Dave. Hi, Jake. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's up?

Me and my wife are buying a business. We bought a franchise business. And my question was, she's going to be running the store, and we're going to be living off of my income like we are now. And my question was, is it a good idea for her not to take a salary the first year, maybe the first two years, or for her to take a salary because I'm concerned that she's going to get burnt out and not feel like she's being rewarded enough if she doesn't take a salary.

You shouldn't buy this. If the person running it is going to get burnt out because they don't get a salary you shouldn't be running a business yeah you're right no i'm uh that's my concern but we're very passionate about this type of business then it doesn't matter if she gets a salary okay you need to talk to her you need to talk to her about this so she got that kind of passion because if she doesn't if she's buying this thing to have a job and it's going to be all twisted up if she doesn't get a salary yeah they just you don't you're in the wrong you're doing the wrong thing then okay i'm serious man business is hard what kind of business is it it's a pet supplies a store and live small live animals okay um so it's it's a fun fun place to be

okay she's excited about it we're excited about it but i'm just well what's the pro forma are you going to be profitable in the first year not in the first year second year yes and why would you take a salary if you're not profitable? How can you? Well, you're going to borrow more money to pay your salary? Be in the red, yeah, the first year. How are you covering the red? We have a loan. We're taking out a SBA loan for all of it.

How much was it? Can I just ask, what did you put into this loan-wise? We are putting, so the loan's for $800. We are putting in $200 of our own money. So you're a million in? To sell goldfish? $800,000 worth of goldfish? Cat food, dog food dog food grooming and live animals wow and you think you think that in year two you'll be profitable yes yeah so according to all

their uh fdd uh for all the stores there's stores across. There's over 600 stores across. Listen, I hope you are. I hope you prove us wrong. Yeah, but here's the answer. Okay, number one, I'm duty-bound to love you enough to tell you the truth and say I think you need to reconsider this.

You're not going to. So the answer to your question is should you borrow more money in order to pay your wife a salary you're borrowing money to pay your wife no it's not a payment it's not you know she's not making a salary you're just taking a withdrawal from the bank to give her money and call it a salary no we're not doing that that's dumb that's ridiculous absolutely not in, when you own a small business, you take money home when you make a profit. And you don't.

Wow. Anyway, yeah. So no, until you're profitable, you don't take money home out of a business. That's part of running a small business. It's part of being an entrepreneur. And you've got the ability to live on your salary. That's good. I wish you would not go $800,000, $600,000 worth of debt in order to open a pet store. I really wish you wouldn't. You can see how ridiculous, like if you just change the format of this ever so slightly, if you went out and got a job and they said the way you get paid is you go down to the bank and you ask for a loan and that's that's how you get your paycheck you you never take the job because you're like that's not a check that's me going into debt yeah period cassidy's in chicago hi cassidy how are you hi there how are you Better than I deserve. What's up? I have a specific question regarding myself and my boyfriend.

So I am a Christian woman who is looking to get married before I live with someone. And we have been dating for the past three years. We found a house in between our two families. It's $850 for rent. He will be living there. And we're trying to figure out our timeline. I want him to prove himself. So the next thing that we know... Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. How's he got to prove himself? That he's able to have a job in this new location between families and that he's able to pay this

rent first so that we're able to move in together. So you have a concern that the guy you're thinking of marrying does not want to work? Correct. Why? Why do you have that concern? Because in the past he hasn't had a job for the past year. He's worked part-time at a location, but he said he's willing to get back together

to prove that to me. Was that because of school? And I said, well, then you need to be on your own. What was that? Was it because of school or anything? How old are you? I'm 23. I just graduated with my master's degree, and he is 25. Okay, so you're saying he's out of school, graduated. Why is he not working working he's working part-time at a radio station why is he not working he's a 25 year old man why is he not working exactly that's that's been my question oh okay okay all right and then your other question for uh your other question for us was what should my name be on the leaf of a guy that doesn't work much no no no you're not married yet not a chance right right does he want that that validates that is that what he wants to be

married yes right but i understand he wants to be married but i'm saying while you're not married does he want you to put your name on the lease is Is that what he's asking for? That is what he's asking for. And I said, you need to be able to have a job and prove that you can do that. And you need to be married. Like that's the biggest thing. You don't put your name on leases with people you're not married to. Yeah, because let's pretend even if he was working, he had a steady job, everything was good. If you weren't married, I'd still say don't put your name on the lease. Exactly. Okay. I've watched your videos in the past so i that's what i was thinking but that helps to solidify that and even being in this relationship let me tell you if if um if your daughter called you and told you she was considering marrying the same guy that you

a guy like the guy you're talking about you would tell her to even be stronger than you have been okay i don't see this it's a red flag i'll be the old dad guy here i don't think this is gonna work out because i think you're too sharp to put up with him that's my guess this is the ramsey show today's question of the day is brought to you by why refi this is an interesting statistic 93 of undergraduate private student loans are co-signed so when you're a delinquent nana uncle joe they're whoever will it, they're going down with you. But there is a way out. Y-Refi refinances defaulted private student loans that other places won't touch.

And they give you a low fixed rate loan that's built for you. This is special, you guys. Go to Y-Refi.com slash Ramsey today. That's the letter Y-R-E-f-y dot com slash ramsey might not be available in all states all right today's question comes from page in delaware my parents live in a different state than my husband and i everything is fine when they visit but when they return home they send us a bill for things that we ask them to purchase during their visit such as food prep ingredients for meals toiletries etc the items are usually incidentals not the full

cost of a meal are we wrong to ask them to help with expenses while they are staying with us okay y'all are weird page y'all are weird that's shocking to me that's just both of you're weird the fact that you ask somebody else to pay for stuff when they're staying in your home regardless of who it is it's weird you have a little hospitality get you know they shouldn't have to buy their own freaking toilet paper and if you're going to have a meal for a friend or relative that's staying with you you pay for the meal and your parents are weird they go home and send you a bill yeah that's weird yeah I I'm shocked I truly am it doesn't make sense the only like the only thing that I could think of where this made sense is if they came and lived with you for three years or something.

But there's no indication. And even still, I... I have never stayed at someone's home and they asked me to pick up something at the store and sent them a bill. I can't imagine. They let me stay at their home. And I've never stayed at someone's home who expected me to pay for something. But I always try to leave with let them with more than when i came it's like how do you keep a tally about both sides of this

grow a little generosity yeah that's what's at stake here it's wow when someone stays in your home page you should furnish everything and take care of it you should not ask someone to pay for it period i don't care who it is oh by the way parents when you stay in someone's home and they ask you to pick something up pick up twice as much and leave it as a gift to say thank you for letting us stay there and don't send a bill y'all are weird yeah because where i listen if my family comes i'm the type i want to give you a little care box like i want the stuff to be in the room and i don't want you to think of anything dinner you bring a bouquet of flowers and a bottle of wine yes hello wow god man wow y'all are weird to itemize you ate you ate an apple yesterday put that on the bill half a

roll of toilet paper has been invoiced here toiletriesiletries. I'm just saying. Wow. Y'all are weird. I'd love to see that receipt. I'd love to see what it looks like. Half a bag of Tostitos. Oh, God, man. Nine grapes. First time I got the bill, the next time they came to visit, I'd be going Motel 6 over, buddy. Yeah, you may as well stay in a hotel.

Might as well go over there, and you settle up with those people there's free breakfast yeah you get those get those powdered eggs man six o'clock in the morning that coffee that's been watered down that orange juice that never saw an orange man you just stay yourself right over there baby wow y'all are weird tracy's in boise idaho. Hey, Tracy, what's up? Hi. Thank you for taking my call. I have a question. My dad passed away in March of 2023.

I'm sorry. My sister and I were originally, thank you, were originally co-executors. A month after my dad passed, things got really volatile, and I removed myself. I had my attorney draw up a letter to remove me from my dad's estate, let my sister be. And I've had no contact with them since just via a few texts, a few emails, very generic. I received an email on September 3rd from my sister's attorney, the probate attorney asking me to sign a document regarding my dad's home had been on the market for over a year and had not sold. My siblings want to close out the estate and put a renter in there,

which is not what my dad's will says. But because I'm an heir, I have to sign this document. My question to you is, if I sign this document, am I removing all legal representation that my remaining three siblings are just going to honor my dad's will and divide things up according to the will. Basically, my dad's will is very generic, was sell all my assets, pay all my debts, divide everything by four.

Nothing has been done correctly in my dad's will. Nothing has. And I've just let it happen. I mean, I stepped away, so I'm fine with that. But my fear, and my husband and I are in Baby Step 7. We're building a home for cash. Okay, what do you want to do with your share of the home? Are you going to just turn it over to them, abandon it, and walk away?

I think that's an option. Okay, if you're going to do that, then you can sign the letter. If you want your share of the home, you can't sign the letter. You don't need the money. Thank you. What is it? We don't really need the money. Nope the home, you can't sign the letter. You don't need the money. Thank you. What is it? We don't really need the money. Nope, nope, we don't.

And that's kind of where we're at right now. If we sign the letter, we're walking away from it. How much is the house worth? Maybe once it sells and the debt, there was still a mortgage on it, we might be talking $200,000 profit. It's divided by four. We're talking $50,000. Oh, $50,000 each.

Or less. Or less each yeah there are some other assets that you know that's not accounted for and i don't even care i just is it worth it is it worth the listen you're at your wit's end we can hear it in your voice you've oh i am you've gone around and around up on this yeah so i yeah you gotta decide you gotta decide if you want to re-enter the battle or you want to walk away. So my position is, and which is what I told the probate attorney, I want the house left on the market and it's sold.

Yeah, that's it. That's it. That's what the will called for. That's what the will called for. The executor of the will is supposed to execute. That's the name executor, the will. They don't get to make this up and your sister your sister's been making it up and so if i'm in your shoes

i'm going to either go screw it it's not worth it y'all just take the money i don't want it and i'm gonna walk completely away and never think about it again or i'm gonna just tell this guy when you guys sell the house i'll take my And no, I'm not signing anything until the house is sold. Well, I feel like in many ways you made that decision when you walked away from being an executive, though. No. No, she didn't. She didn't lose her rights.

She just got out of the fight. I'm not saying that she lost her rights, but you clearly were worn slap out and were like, whatever. No, she didn't want to stay in the day-to-day rough and tumble. I didn't. That's different than. I didn't. Yeah. in the day-to-day rough and tumble that's different than i did it yeah yeah i understand what you're doing so you know the thing is here's what you're here's what you're really struggling with is you know how pissed off everybody's going to be when

you do this well they already are because they've dropped the house below um at some or right now the house is left below appraisal or value because there's no more money to pay the mortgage. So, which is fine, I don't care, but I don't want it taken off the market. My other conflict, Dave, this is, my sister is also the executor and the realtor, and this is one of our first house sales, which is another reason why. She has the house listed? Yes. Oh, how many times can we spell conflict of interest?

Exactly. Okay, I just wanted to make sure, like, that's my thinking. I don't know how this attorney has kept his law license if he's allowing this. Wow. Wow. This probate attorney, he should be going, no, ma'am, you cannot do that. The attorney needs to be going no ma'am you cannot do that the attorney needs to be oh my gosh is the attorney one of your siblings no you guys are confirming everything that my husband and i have discussed we've been following you since 2008 we became 100 debt free in 2020 and here's

the thing i would just say listen i'm not angry i'm not angry about this this is not about revenge i'm just asking simply very kindly and calmly that you guys do what the will says and we really ought to have i need to hire an attorney no you just don't need to sign it okay if you want an attorney you could go get one to get advice i'm not an attorney but if you just refuse to sign it and say i my instructions as one of the heirs is for you to execute the will properly, and that means the house needs to be sold, not rented. I do not want to be partners with these people 10 years from now in this house. I don't want the liability. No, thank you. Period. If they want to buy me out, they can do that too, by the way. That's a great idea. But they

can't even pay the payments, so they're not going to buy anybody out. This is the Ramsey Show. Hey, you guys. Health insurance costs are only moving one way, and that way isn't down. And if higher costs aren't enough, the wait times to see your doctor are longer, and it's harder than ever to get anything approved through the bureaucracy. So if you feel like the system is working against you, try a biblically-based alternative to health insurance, Christian Healthcare Ministries. CHM is a health cost-sharing ministry that's helped

hundreds of thousands of families like yours take care of over $11 billion in medical bills since 1981. And CHM has also helped them stay true to their values and avoid miles of red tape. And CHM support goes far beyond meeting financial needs. They'll also help meet spiritual needs. Members become part of a family who will pray with them and for them when they experience a medical event. So listen, y'all, there's no better way to take care of health care costs. CHM programs start as low as $98 a month. So learn more today and join at chministries.org slash budget.

That's chministries.org slash budget. Jade Walshaw, Ramseysey personality is my co-host today folks you know what causes relatives to get in a fight over a will or over an estate most of the time it's the person's fault that died because you did not tell everybody how to freaking behave before you died. So you do the will, you read the will to the whole family, or you tell them what it all says when you do the will, and then you tell them what it means. So, for instance, those guys that were just there, you go to Mama Bear Legal Forms, you do a base.

She said it had a very basic will, sell everything and divide it four ways. That was his basic will. You could do that easily at MamaBearLegalForms.com. So he's got the will. That was good because most people don't even do that. That's right. That's right. You do that first and then you tell everyone.

Well, go. At Thanksgiving dinner. Oh. I just finished my will. Not at Thanksgiving, Dave. That does not make well the next day with beer and football I don't care but or later on in the afternoon I don't sometime you gather the whole brood up and you say brood this is what you are going to do when I die

with my stuff okay I'm listening I am 40 years old i've got three kids and a husband we just did our will do we do this now or do we wait till we get a little bit older is being instructed in the will the people they're going to take care of your kids yeah so you obviously got to talk to them well of course okay yes and if you're leaving a family trust that's going to be managed by someone both the trustee and the people taking care of your kids need to know what that is. Yes. Now, the four-year-old doesn't need to have input or the weight of the decisions, but I'm talking about the grown-ups that are going to be involved, everybody.

So when our kids were your kids' age, when the Ramsey kids were little, we had a trust set up upon our death. The assets all dump into a trust, a family trust, okay? And the family trust was managed a certain way, and the trustee was different than the person raising the kids. That's right. And the trustee was going to send money out of there to the kiddos, essentially child support, monthly stipend because for because you're raising my kids it

shouldn't cost you anything thank you and so uh and if they needed money for college a car or a medical issue they could get some more money that was the direction of the trustee both the trustee knew that and the custodian of the children knew that that's right and the other relatives uncles and aunts and so forth also knew who the trusted that are uninvolved but they know so that they stay freaking uninvolved yeah so there's essentially two conversations you're having you're having the initial one with the adults who are part of this then as you age and as your kids get older if you're leaving them anything substantial then you then you bring them yeah like now we have a very detailed thing these days. If Dave dies this year, meeting once a year.

What a weird day. Yeah, weird meeting. My Monty Python, I'm feeling much better. It's just a flesh wound meeting. But there's turkey. There's turkey involved. No, we don't do this at Thanksgiving. It's too complicated.

But I'm just saying, you go over it, and then the brothers and sisters are all mad. Well, do you not think that... Or if they are then it's just because they've got a screw i was gonna say there's probably part of this too that if you've got any bit of like entitlement or grief or greed or whatever that is yeah that could still play a part even if you do everything right from the beyond but at least everybody said it out loud that's right okay and here's the thing you put two sisters as executive co-executors

of the will this guy did and you tell me this dad did not know that these two were going to go at each other's throat yeah that wasn't good i mean you could do it with some two sisters actually my two daughters could do that yeah i could because denise and rachel could do that but this dad has to know these two enough to know that this ain't going to work. Yeah. Because one of them is going to flip their lid. And guys, come on. Don't set up things to where your estate causes a wedge to be driven in your family that takes people 25 years to speak again to each other. Set up your estate to be a blessing to the next generation.

A godly man leaves an inheritance to his children's children. Okay, let me ask you about this. You may have heard me say this before. Is there ever a time where the will or the estate is as written and the people who decide this is what was said, but we think we should do something else instead? Case in point point i always say when sam married me the way that his grandfather's estate was was that he had to marry someone jewish

in order to get the money and so and i'm looking at you and i'm thinking you're not and so uh you know it was him and a couple other cousins and he was the first to say hey i think that if he had met her he would have changed his mind and so over time the cut but over time the cousins changed it and they got the the wife to say you know what i think you're right and she was the executor well then that's everybody that's interesting but the only way that happens is the legal document has to be overridden by a unanimous vote and it was it was it was the wife that's what it amounts to no there's unanimous the brothers sisters cousins the wife oh yeah yeah everybody ended up signing off on it

yes they have you're right they have to because otherwise you don't have a change no you don't and so yeah i mean you can do that you can do that but that's that's the only way if one person said no papa said that and that's the way it is that's right or whatever your jewish grandfather's name is right but zadie okay jd said and that's the way it is yeah sorry we love we love jade but but still that's what he said no you're right all the cousins had to sign and yeah yeah okay interesting wow that's interesting huh yeah i don't mind that, but yeah, that's unusual. Isn't it? Yeah. Most of the time somebody ends up fighting, like that last call. So folks,

read your will while you're alive. If people are going to be pissed off, you should have the pleasure of being involved. I'm just saying. That's the way it is. All right. Now, Romeo is in Phoenix. Hi, Romeo. How are you are you better than i deserve as you say how are you doing today just the same sir how can i help i'm calling because i am a fan of your show i found that roughly about two months ago i just downloaded the dollar app and i started my budgeting every dollar at my apologies and so my question is should I stop do I'm paying my loans and should I diverse my money into a business where I think if I make money faster with a business I could clean up my load faster or should I be chubby and debt and or should I come

sorry should I pay off my loan what What do you make a year now? I make $30,000 a year on my main job. And I do live on the side, which I make my $9,600 additional for the year. Hey, this sounds really familiar to me. How much student loan debt, like how much debt do you have total? I have, in total, I have $ total i have 24 000 okay that's not too too bad what are you talking about spending to start a business um just for uh initial costs for the equipment it's a production studio so i just tell you as you know the production equipment is pretty pricey and so i have an investor I have a business plan and investment.

I have a brick and mortar. My investors are paying for the overhead and everything. It's just we only need the equipment and we're ready to jumpstart. And so that's why, I'm sorry. There's not a way to start. That feels like too much to start with. That's a major investment. What can you do with that skill set that you can use what you

have to make more money than thirty thousand dollars a year or thirty nine thousand dollars a year well that's what i'm looking for and i i i was working at a podcast studio which they weren't the best and they were not the best management not to go shade at them or anything but uh they they actually encouraged me to create my own production company, my own production company, because I saw the way they're treating their guests. Right, but you can do that. My point is you can do that without all the bells and whistles. There's so many podcasts out there who need producers and editors and, you know, you can go in so many different routes that doesn't require you to buy all the stuff, to have brick and mortar, to have investors. That's, if you did that, that would be further,

further down the line. I think right now there's ways that you could probably make thousands of dollars a month and get this debt paid off very quickly without you having to invest much of anything. I have been working with a few comedians because I do have a few ties to the comedy show. And I have been working on comedy specials. Yes. There's so much work. I would do all of that without a production studio. Yes.

There's so much work. There's two million podcasts. I would not open a production studio right now. Certainly not brick and mortar. I've got a bunch of them, but they're for our use only. If I thought I had to make a living renting out production studios, I would. No. No, thank you.

Market's too flooded, dude. Not what I'd drop money in. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show. We help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Jade Walsh, our number one best-selling author, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. You jump in, we'll talk about your life and your money. The phone number is 888-825-5225. You jump in.

Matt is with us in Portland, Maine. Hi, Matt, how are you? I'm well, I'm well, and i appreciate you and your entire team taking my call today thank you our pleasure how can we help so i've got more of a i guess a time problem than a money problem um although time is money and they go hand in hand so i have a full-time career that I've been working for about 15 years now. And in about nine more years, I'll be able to retire with a fairly decent pension. I'll be 46 years old and I'll make about 50 grand a year to sit on my couch for the rest of my life, which I don't think is the worst. But while I've had this career, I've also started some other things. I've got a side gig,

a side business that does about one and a half to $2 million a year. And I also have some real estate investment that totals about $3 million that I owe about $250,000 on. I got a lot going on. I like real estate investing. I want to get into more of it. But my work schedule of approximately 80 hours a week is definitely taking the toll on the family. And my wife and I had a serious conversation the other day. We have a 10-month-old baby, and she is really looking for me to spend more time with them at home. And of course, I couldn't agree more. But I got a lot going on. And one of the things I was looking at dropping was that career of mine that only pays me about $65,000 a year or so, takes up 40 hours a week. But again, if I stick with it for just nine more years, I get to collect $50,000 a year in pension.

Or I could give it up and I could focus on all my other stuff that does substantially better but doesn't come with that quite of a guarantee. You have $3 million worth of real estate. Yeah. And you're worried about a $50,000 a year pension? Yes. It sounds like almost you've got those two things on the same plane of value, and one of them is buying a biscuit.

Unfortunately, you're exactly right. They're not on the same plane, dude. One of them is a 1 out of 10, and one of them's a 10 out of 10. One good real estate deal offset your stupid pension, right? Correct. Mathematically you do one good deal. It'll make you $50,000 a year.

The rest of your life. That's $4,000 a month rent. Yep. Yeah. Okay. So, uh, rest of your life that's four thousand dollar a month rent yeah yeah okay so uh what is this career uh i'm a firefighter and a paramedic okay which was i i was a i was a kid a child that wanted to be a fireman and i did yeah yeah and um so i think you're having a very wise discussion with your wife and also between your ears. You're saying, what do I want to spend my time on that 30 years from now? I'm going to feel good of the 30 year from now person-year-old version of Matt, is going to look back and say, well done. Okay? Now, the 14-year-old version of Matt wanted to be a fireman, and he accomplished his goal, and he served his community and fought fires as a fireman and a paramedic,

and he's a good dude. Checked box. But'm more not concerned about the 14 year old making the 14 year old matt happy anymore i want the 70 year old matt to be happy you follow me with his choices yeah yeah and i think that i think the fire thing's done just in what you described to me because i think you love this baby more than you do 40 hours a week but I also don't think that the first plan that you delivered which was let's say when you said hey in nine years I'll make 50,000 a year I can retire and just sit on the couch all day I don't think that that's you weren't going to do that no no so what would you do I mean I would continue I mean, my goal,

by the way, Dave, welcome back. I hope you enjoyed your vacation. That's my goal. My goal is to not just take a stressful weekend or week-long vacation and actually get away with the family to someplace else for somewhat extended periods of time and enjoy the enjoy god's green earth listen i love that and i think you should do that i just wanted to know like what would be the thing that makes you feel like you're doing something that matters with what would be your contribution you know i i think officially we're not res, but officially retiring from a life in public safety to me now that, you know, my, my, my dad and my grandfather, their entire lives were devoted to our local volunteer fire and ambulance

places, um, over 50 years, both of them, each, um, volunteer. They didn't even make a dime. At least I'm getting paid for it. Rest in peace. And so in a way, I see that, and I'm like, geez, and I'm about to walk away. And granted, I've been doing it, Dave, you're right, since I was 14 years old. September 10, 2001 is the first day I stepped foot

into a fire station as a firefighter. And obviously a lot has changed. So here's what I'm pointing out to you, okay, is you stepped in and your identity became who is Matt? Matt is a firefighter. And now you're making a bigger choice than just $9,000. You're saying, because this is family DNA and everything else, you're saying now my identity is I'm Matt,

the dad of a 10 month old and I'm a real estate investor so that I can have more time for my family. That I love. That's your new identity. And that's part of what's bothering you. It's like you feel like you're dishonoring your dad or your grandpa's memory. You're not. You served honorably for a long period of time to the community and that season's over i think i think but here's

the thing i've had this happen in my life several times because people that get things done put too much on their plate and sharon and i have to sit down and go okay something's going to give we should decide it proactively rather than letting it blow up because you're you know you're either going to blow up the kids by having no father in the house or you're going to blow up your ministry over here that you're putting too much time into so you never see your family or you're going to blow up you know and so just decide on purpose what it is you're going to blow up you know i was working with teens at on purpose what it is you're going to blow up. You know, I was working with teens at the church like hours and hours and hours and hours and hours a week when our children were small.

And we're getting ready to, and I started doing financial coaching at the church before we did all this. And that started during the hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours. And I got little kids. And Sharon and I sat down. The exact conversation they had. And said something's leaving me or the teenage ministry or the financial ministry because you can't there's not room for all three of us and uh she was being sarcastic and funny she wasn't packing up but uh but the but she made a good point you know and so i decided all right, Lord, tell us which one you want us to work on. Pretty soon I started hating teenagers.

And I got over that. I like teenagers now. But I quit. The burden I had to save the next generation in ministry was gone. But the burden I had to help people with their money is still here. Here we go.

Okay, there you go. It's a good discussion, Matt. You're very wise, you and your wife, to have that discussion. It sounds like to two guys who don't know you that much, me and Jade, that you're not a fireman anymore. I've been doing this show for over 30 years, and some of the saddest calls I've taken are from situations that are completely preventable. Yeah. And what's so hard is I feel like one of those, especially the ones that I'm

like, oh, it's terrible. People that call in and their spouse has passed away suddenly and they don't have life insurance. When you have to think through how am I going to pay my bills in the middle of next week, in the middle of all that grief, like it's just it is It's terrible. So life insurance is the one thing, especially as a mom with three little kids that I'm so big on for people to get because it's inexpensive. Zander is the place that Winston and I actually get all of our life insurance. And it doesn't cost much because Zander shops among a gazillion different companies. It doesn't cost much. You just have to admit that someday you're not going to be here. You got to say it out loud and you got to say, I'm going to say, I love you to my family by taking care of them and taking the time to put this stuff in place.

The cost of stinking pizza to get a free quote, call 800-356-4282. That's 800-356-4282 or go to zander.com. Jade Walsh, all Ramsey personality. Number one bestselling author, is my co-host today. Open phones here at 888-825-5225. You call in, we'll talk about you right in front of you. So, CNN reporting mortgage rates fell this week to the lowest point since February, Jade. A lot of people are excited about that. 30-year fixed rate mortgage average 6.2 in the week ended september 12 that's down from last week 6.3 uh which is uh well below the uh two decade high of 7.7 yeah and uh see last time it was this low was um in fe in February of 23. Yeah. So it's been 18 months or more since it was this low.

And it was on the way up, of course, in February of 23. It just passed by this and went on up. Yeah. So mortgage interest rates seeming to soften. The U.S. housing market remains unaffordable for millions of home seekers, especially those with low incomes. Well, that's true, but the interest rate was not the sole cause of that. Price was the cause of that, and house prices going up faster than wages has caused that.

And it's actually, I don't know actually i don't know i don't know there's still a group you know this this article continues the stupid mythology thing that you know a lower income person can live in manhattan or los angeles you can't well yeah i think can't afford it there's like the the outside economic causes for this and then there's like the personal level okay where do i live what do i make how do i manage my money that does play a huge part in this exactly exactly the choices that you're engaging in but there's never been um in in modern history a time that you could afford to live in a super expensive city if you had a low income that was that's that's not changed yeah that is that part is not new yeah no i mean it's um i mean

and low income now the definition low income has changed because we make a lot more money now than we used to but the housing prices are more they used to be so uh but i mean i remember in you know the 19 1982 i'm coming out of college if you wanted to live in new york city in manhattan in 1982 you needed to make you know up close to 100k and so an entry-level college student with a bachelor's i made 18 000 a year at my first job and so the chance i was i could not afford to live come you know entry-level job coming out of college business degree the pay that I was being paid I could not afford to live now I wasn't lower income but I was lower middle income I was a brand new college student out of school so I mean of

course I wasn't making the money that your parents made it's not time yet but you can't go to I you know the only way I can go to New York is if I land a job making that or the only way I could live in, you know, most parts of L.A. So they act like this is some kind of a capitalistic, I mean, CNN or some of these articles, MSNBC act like it's a capitalistic crisis or something. It's not. That's always been there. Now, there is, what is frustrating or interesting

that I don't have an answer for is why the market didn't pick back up with this tick down in rates. We've not seen the activity at the real estate market. It didn't light up. When this happened? Yeah, when it dropped a full percentage, a point and a half. Well, you and I talked about this a little bit even before the show there's still that demand you know the demand is high but there's not a lot of homes on the market is what they're saying yeah that's true if there were like if suddenly there were a bunch of homes to flood the market i gotta believe that prices would go down and then the prices being down plus mortgage rates being slightly down would make people go

you know what okay now i can get in but there is a part of that where you know like it says here a key issue driving america's housing affordability crisis is a persistent lack of homes on the market supply simply not keeping up with the demand in many markets across the country for varying reasons we've been saying we've been saying that for for three years we've been talking about oh there's going to be a bubble yeah prices are going to crash and we said no prices are not going to crash because there's a shortage when there's a shortage you don't have a price crash and part of that shortage okay so they're saying yes it's still expensive

to build right uh construction costs zoning laws uh this says even not enough land available for development and i guess that depends on where you live because here they're building i feel like they're building everywhere i look here in middle tennessee but then if you go down to south florida it's built up i mean they got to tear down stuff in order to build things so again where is their land available yeah where there's land available i mean it's like you know again you in downtown dade county miami there's not land available in manhattan you know there's not any land available hasn't been in a hundred and something years that's right it's been that way it's been a hundred percent

built out for a hundred plus years so uh you know that there's a yeah there's a shortage and then there's the part of i mean i think we all know this by now there are a bunch of people sitting out that there that have two percent interest rates and three percent interest rates and unless they have the need to move a lot of people are like hey i i'm fine where i'm at there's no need for me to why would i double my interest why would you do and i yeah why would you i wouldn't and so that's accounts for what do we decide 20 of what's going on and i'll throw i'll throw in one more thing and this is just a wild guess i have no idea if this is right but let me tell you what it's based on okay okay i am firmly

convinced as a student of economics and i have a degree in finance so i've spent a lot of time in the stupid economics textbook over the years that economics is really as much about psychology as it is math we talked about this the vibe session exactly and so you know when you think it's a self-fulfilling prophecy half the time when you think things are good you go out there and move around in the marketplace and things are good and so hope is actually an economic thing i'm with that yeah it causes economics to prosper. Lack of hope causes it to pull back. Law and order. Economics cannot exist where there is not law and order.

Because you can't open an ice cream store if some mob is going to trash it. Okay? Of whatever that's upset about whatever they're upset about this week. Okay? And so when you don't have law and order and you don't have hope, economics freezes like a deer in the headlights. And on a short-term basis, here's my I don't know if this is right thing. That's all right.

I'm not, no question about that. But the thing I'm not positive about is how many people are sitting and waiting to see who gets elected in 45 days 100 100 people are like if it's my guy this is going to break me free like they yeah they think that you know that happened uh i remember people thinking that if obama got elected because he ran on hope that they were going to get like get a free car or something remember that remember those videos yeah i do i do and it's like you know and let me just help y'all neither one of these people are going to fix what's going on at your house yeah neither one of these people are going to fix everything you want them to fix whoever you are at the white house yeah because no one does everything exactly like you want them to do there's

always going to be something you disagree with and never in the history of the united states has a president caused your life personally to get better you did that but here is the hook ronald reagan was a broker of hope now you can disagree with him you could not like him you could argue about the politics of it but he made the American people the hero in his talks rather than I'm the hero, elect me. And so. Interesting. And that is the, it's gotten all twisted up, but it is the genius of the Trump slogan. If you just take the slogan, all the rhetoric and all the acid and everything else, and just listen to the words, make America great again.

Now, it's turned into make Trump great again. We know that, okay? So nobody's confused about that. But I'm saying if you could just say, independent of all the rhetoric and the crap out there, if you made people believe that you were going to make the country great again, then they would step onto that hope and they would go. Reagan did a much better job at that than anybody in a long, long time. a motivator yeah like a motivational speaker in the white house i think you have to

look at it i mean we are we're always teaching a way of life and a set of principles and you've got to look at it as what what you're doing is the main course and what the whoever wins the election that's the garnish because the truth is yes times... But we've gotten so tied up in the worship of these people and even their ideas that they're sitting on the sidelines waiting to see if their guy gets in. That's what I'm saying. You've got to be the main course. I mean, the truth, yeah, you could have said,

oh, I saved more in taxes under this person. But if you continue to do the right things, you were doing okay no matter who was in office is the point. Exactly. So if you continue to do the right things. I have done stupid things and smart things under every one of them. That's right. And you might have a time where you get a cherry on the cake and sometimes you don't get the cherry.

But you still got the dessert. And so you're like, all right, this is great. Nobody took the cake. They don't get that option. This is The Ramsey Show. Jade Walsh, all Ramsey personality. Number best-selling author is my co-host today in the lobby of ramsey solutions we have the debt-free stage if you don't know this you ought to come by and visit us and you could see it we'd love to have you some wonderful coffee

and homemade cookies await you all on us we won't send you an invoice so there you go and good stuff and also on that debt-free stage today, we have Steven with us to do his debt-free scream. Hey, Steven, how are you? I'm great, Dave. How are you doing today? Better than I deserve. Where do you live, sir? From Badeville, Arkansas. All right. Welcome to Nashville. Thank you.

And how much debt have you paid off, sir? I paid off $150,000. Wow. That includes $130,000 in student loans, $10,000 in credit card debt, and a $10,000 car payment. Wow. How long did this take? So my debt-free journey started in 2018, but I went gazelle intense the last 23 months where I paid off $86,000.

Wow. Okay. I'm going to call it 23 months. Well, we could just say four years to 23 months. Yeah. Okay. And two to four years. Yes? That's the plan. But the last two years turned on the heat. And what was your average or what was your range of income during that time?

Yeah, Dave. I mean, at one point it was zero, but it started when I graduated school at $61,000. And now it's up to $149,000. Cool. What do you do for a living? I'm a producer for a retail media company. Very good. Good for you. Well done, man. Thank you very much. And you had a pile of student loan debt. Yes, sir, I did. So I guess we could ask two things. How did you get tied into this Ramsey stuff back in 18? And then the second question that kind of goes with that, what changed 23 months ago? Yeah, Dave. So originally when I took out these student loans, I had made a deal with my parents and they were going to pay the interest on the student loans and I was going to

pay the principal. But whenever I graduated and started to make the payments, they weren't making the payments. I had asked them to pay the interest like we had agreed to. And they told me that wasn't the deal that we had agreed to. They told me that month to month that they weren't going to pay, that I was going to pay $130,000. And then at the end, in a lump sum, they were going to pay the interest. And so, um, yeah, in 2018, uh, I got my car stolen and I had this debt and, uh, yeah, I was in a really rough spot. And so, uh, you know, I ended up getting a new car. It had Sirius XM free trial and, uh, I was just scrolling through all the channels to

see what was on. And I heard a story about someone, you know, paying off their debt, started tuning into your show. And, uh, you know, I put not just myself and my parents onto your plan and we're all debt free. Oh, started tuning into your show. And I put not just myself, but my parents onto your plan, and we're all debt-free. Wow. Yes, sir. All right.

Wow. That changed a whole bunch of things. Yeah, it did. Did they ever chip in? Yeah, they did. So what happened 23 months ago was I set boundaries. I had to set boundaries with my parents because they still weren't paying. And not only that they

have their own issues and so um yeah I just kind of had to go no contact with them for a little bit until I got my debt paid off and uh whenever I did that they came through whoa yeah interesting yeah okay so what I mean that that part was hard I mean anytime you have to deal with family drama it's draining and it's tough but on your side of of it, I mean, you had a lot to pay off. So what did that take? I mean, surely you were working overtime, you were budgeting. Tell us about that. Uh, yeah. So, uh, this goes back to when I was an undergrad, I got my commercial driver's license at LSU and I drove the shuttle bus, the drunk bus, as they would call it. Amen. Yes, sir. And then, uh then whenever I got to grad school at Ole Miss,

a bit of a curveball there, I was working with the athletic department, going to grad school, but then I also picked up a job doing black car service, and so I drove rich people limousines. I got to drive around Robert De Niro one time, so that was really cool. Did you get a good tip? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, of course.

He was very polite. Very good. Thank you, Robert. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Of course. He's very polite. Very good. Thank you, Robert. Good job. And yeah. And so I continued doing that too. Whenever I got to Fayetteville, Arkansas, you know, of course the university of Arkansas is up there. They have college game days, concerts up there. And so, you know, I signed up for Uber and would really only drive the events where there was a lot of traffic and I could make a really good profit. And yeah, besides that, using the EveryDollarBudget app and sticking to the plan. So tell us the why behind it, because plenty of people get student loans, plenty of people hear that other people have

paid off their debt, but they're like, eh, I'll just keep paying. I'll just make the payment. It's not hurting me. What was your why? Like why I took out the student loans? No, why you got rid of it. Why you got rid of it. I mean, what was driving you, man? You were driven. This is awesome. Yeah. Well, I think it's very important to note that these were private student loans.

Yeah. And so originally my parents were co-signers and, you know, I was fed up with them at one point that I refinanced and took them off as co-signers to kind of prove a point that I'm ready to do this on my own. And yeah, so just really got after it. I mean, in the last 23 months, I put every dollar I could towards it. I was paying $1,200 a month plus an extra $2,500 a month. Every bonus that I got the last two years went towards that. And, you know, I sold some restricted stock too to get all that taken care of. So how's it feel now that you did this?

I'm proud of you. Thank you, Dave. That really means a lot hearing from you. I feel unbelievable. Being debt-free really hasn't hit me until I stand on the stage right now being in front of you guys. I have been celebrating for like the last month. You know, I paid it all off on July 31st and had a table for one for myself. And then, you know, this past weekend, I've got a shout out

to my boy, Mike Boyd, for letting me crash at his place. If you saw me on Broadway this weekend, no, you didn't. And yeah, we just had a good time celebrating. Wow. Good for you, man. Thank you. What's next? You know, I think for this next week, I'm actually on a little road trip. My grandma, she's come down with dementia and is not doing too great.

And, unfortunately, part of this whole process with Boundaries and Family is, subconsciously, I think i've just been distant from my whole family and um so i'm gonna go down to louisiana go visit her i'm gonna go visit my brother he's got a heart of gold i can't wait to see him and then um yeah i'm gonna slide back up to pitbull arkansas and take on baby step three here we go game on sir wow i love it i love it good for you well done well done how old are you 32 okay so there's a 26 or 27 year old out there who's up to their neck yeah and doesn't know they can get out that was you that's right talk to you back then um work hard man work hard You know, the job market right

now wouldn't be, you know, is probably not that hot. So focus on yourself, level up, go get therapy. Honestly, seeing a therapist over the last three years has really helped battle my anxiety, set boundaries with my parents, and stick to my core values of honesty and respect. You know, I think those two values weren't really present in my family growing up or throughout this process. And so, you know, I've had to make sure I do an audit with all my friends and make sure that everyone is holding up to those same standards that I hold to myself. And then I've also had to look at myself and take accountability, Dave, because I took out the loans.

Ultimately, it was my decision to do that. And I had to, you know, sleep in the bed I made. So I had to take care of that. Yeah, good for you. Well done. Thank you. The answer is hard work. The answer is hard work.

Once again. Hard work is hard. And the weird thing is your anxiety goes down because you haven't got time to worry because you're too tired. I know that's's right it's all you're doing is working i know that's right i cannot no time for drama i love it well done steven well done man you're a hero you took control of your life in a society where that's not a popular thing to do sit around blame everybody else nope i went and fixed it drove uber for robert de niro there we go that's how i fixed it there we go good tip robert well done all right oh man congratulations all right steven from fayetteville arkansas

150 000 paid off the majority of it in the last 23 months of gazelle intensity, making 61 up to 149. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. I'm debt free. I'm debt free. We've never seen choreography.

I'll take it. I'll take it i'll take it i like it good job steven man hey guys you just listened to this for the first time i think steven just told you you need to go do it yeah i'm talking to you yeah Yeah. You. This is the Ramsey Show. Hey, you guys. I'm not a fan of the big banks, and you probably already know which ones I mean. But I do like credit unions because they're nonprofit organizations that focus on their members.

And I'm proud to endorse Fairwinds Credit Union because they share the Ramsey mission of helping people get out of debt and live generously. In fact, they design products to help keep you from going into debt in the first place. Fairwinds has been in business for over 75 years, and they serve hundreds of thousands of members worldwide. You can feel secure because your deposits are federally insured by the NCUA up to $250,000. It's easy to join, and Fairwinds partners with more than 5,000 credit union locations around the country,

so you can bank in person wherever you live but if you prefer the online experience you can log on to fairwinds and do anything you could do at a physical location so go to fairwinds.org slash ramsey to learn more and while you're there look at the combined checking and savings account bundle they created just for Ramsey fans to help you take control of your finances. That's Fairwinds, F-A-I-R-W-I-N-D-S dot org slash Ramsey. Jade Walsh, all Ramsey personality is my co-host today. Thank you for joining us open phones at 888-825-5225 hey we were talking about the real estate market a while ago and how people are

sidelined because they can't find a property because of supply they can't they don't want to walk away from their two percent loan loan or they're waiting on the presidential election or whatever. Really, if you're ready to move, I wouldn't let any of those things hold me back personally. And if you need some help, get with one of the Ramsey trusted agents. All you got to do is go to ramseysolutions.com slash real estate and our guys can actually help you get a house sold or bought in this weird market and help you uh help you pull this thing off the other thing you need to know as this particular uh segment comes to a close uh the show will continue on the ramsey app the ramsey network app

and uh if you want to get the entire show every day youtube or podcast or whatever you can get video or podcast you can get the whole thing on the, YouTube or podcast or whatever, you can get video or podcast. You can get the whole thing on the Ramsey Network app free. It doesn't cost a thing. Or, you know, if you're on talk radio, you're going to get what you've always gotten, wherever it is. Nothing has changed there. But a couple months ago, we made the shift to the last portion of the show

is now on the Ramsey Network app. There was all kinds of data and stuff that went into that decision. And now that we are 60 days or so into that, it has proven to be true. So our YouTube listenership or viewership is up. Nice. Our podcast completion rate and everything is up and we still got the same amount of content and you go to Ramsey

Network app you need to get the whole thing there or at least the last segment there if you haven't downloaded the Ramsey Network app for free not we're not charging a thing for this okay you can go get it anytime you want to go get it so just go over to the Apple store or the Google Play or whatever you're going to do and download the app and get the Ramsey Network app to get started. And so as this segment wraps up, we'll jump over to there with you. Or, again, if you're talk radio or whatever, you're going to get what you've always gotten exactly. Okay. Amanda's in Washington, D.C.

Hi, Amanda. How are you? I'm great. How are you all doing today? Better than we deserve. What's up? Hey, so I have a question. I just discovered you all a couple months ago, thank God.

My husband and I are in about a total of $90,000 debt, and I'm full on board, like I don't plan on using credit anymore ever. I do own a business, by the way, and so we're going through trying to figure out how to get through the baby steps the best way. But he asked me, he said, hey, if you don't plan on using debt ever again, why don't you just file for bankruptcy?

What's a you part? Where's he? What wouldn't it be, we? Yeah. Is it business debt? Is that why he's looking at it that way correct okay well no we it's the 90,000 is inclusive of everything personal and business okay so why would you file bankruptcy and he wouldn't well i guess he's looking at it as as my debt rather than our debt and that's part of us getting on board with everything ramsay because before then we didn't have our finances combined so we're kind of still trying to change the language and everything like that okay um how long have you been married? Three years this November. Okay. And break the $90,000 in debt down for me a little bit. What are the major categories? Yep. So I have the student loan

about $40,000 in student loan. And then pretty much the rest is just like credit cards and personal debt. There's no car. Well, no, just a little bit of cars, like $1,900, but it's pretty much just credit card debt. And is the credit cards you're using to keep the business going, and what kind of business is it? Yes, so two of them were used specifically for the business, and then the other were just personal between the both of us.

Is the business profitable? It is. It's getting there now. It's been open less than a year. No, I mean getting there is not what I asked. Are you making a profit this month? Yes, yes, yes. How much do you make this month, profit?

Profit-wise? Yeah. A little under $1,000. Okay. So you currently have a $12,000 a year job, which puts you at the poverty level if you don't get this business moving. You don't have a debt problem. You have an income problem. No.

So that's not the only job that I have. Okay. Good, good, good. I was going to ask about that. I was going to say this sounds a little bit more like a hustle until it's off the ground. Are you doing anything in the meantime? Okay, great. So what do you do? What's your main job? Yeah, what's your income? My income is, we bring about $8,500 to $9,000 a month together. I'm a nurse practitioner.

Okay. Okay, and so we have our income together, but we don't have our debt together. So here's the thing. Student loans are not bankruptable. Right. Okay. So you have a $40,000 bankruptcy or $50,000 bankruptcy. You're talking about not a 90.

And you make, you're not going to get relief from everything by filing bankruptcy. You're just going to get relief from everything by filing bankruptcy. You're just going to get relief from about half of it. And do you own a home? Yes. Okay. It's going to be in jeopardy depending on how much equity you have. Do you have any equity in it? Yes.

About $130,000 is the last time I checked. Okay. All right. Do you actually live I checked. Okay. All right. Do you actually live in D.C. or do you live in Virginia? No, outside in Maryland, actually. In Maryland. Okay. Each, okay, just for fun of it, I'll explain this to you,

but it's not going to change our answer. But knowledge will help you, okay? So when you file bankruptcy, you surrender all of your assets to the court and the court starts doling them back out to you so the court would take ownership of your home not formally but technically and then depending on what maryland has um type that into google right quick what's the homestead exemption in maryland, while I'm yakking. And depending on what the homestead exemption is, in Tennessee, it's $7,500. Okay? And so the court would let you keep $7,500 of your house equity after they sold your house to pay your debt.

Oh, no. Yeah. If you were in Tennessee. Now, I don't know what it is in Maryland. Right, right. But in Texas, it's Tennessee. Now, I don't know what it is in Maryland. Right, right, right. But in Texas, it's 100%, and you get to keep all of it. It's exempt, and so is it in Florida. Okay?

So each state's different. But let's say that it's $50,000, just for the fun of it. Jay will have it in a minute, okay? But basically, your home equity is going to go to pay your debt is what I'm telling you. So your husband's suggestion is based in not knowing what's going to happen to you if you file bankruptcy. So you find homestead exemption and bankruptcy for Maryland. It's there, but it's not clear. It doesn't say what it is.

It should be just a little chart pop up. Okay. Anyway, it doesn't matter. You're going to probably unless they have a hundred percent which i don't think they do exemption okay twenty five thousand one hundred and fifty kelly just found it in the booth okay so seventy five thousand of your home equity would go to pay your fifty thousand dollars worth of debt so you can't file bankruptcy you'll lose your house and it'll pay your debt shoot you just be selling your house to pay your debts what you'd be doing you follow me i definitely don't want to do no we don't want to do that no no and still end up with a stinking student loan debt yeah correct yeah no so bankruptcy is off the table okay even

if it if that wasn't the case you still wouldn't file bankruptcy when you have $120,000, $130,000 income on $50,000 worth of debt because the $40,000 student loan is not bankruptable anyway. So even if you didn't lose your house, you wouldn't do that. I mean, what if you guys just lived on $80,000 and paid it off in two years? Yeah. So I've done all the math and everything. He was very hesitant but is going along now with the math and everything. He was very hesitant, but is going along now with the plan because I, we did this back in June.

So I'm, that's what I calculated was 24 to 26 months. That's what I had calculated. And that's, that's how you are now. That's assuming you're not adding any extra income. If your business, your side hustle takes off in doubles, you do it in half, you do it in 18 months. That's right you are now. That's assuming you're not adding any extra income. If your side hustle takes off in doubles, you do it in 18 months.

That's right. Exactly. So you guys need to get beans and rice, rice and beans on a plan. You need to combine your debts, combine your household, combine your incomes, and combine your efforts and focus and kill this. You're not bankrupt. And if you're not using every dollar, you need to get on every dollar because that is going to be the foundation of all of this. If you don't have that, you're not going to move at the speed you think you're going bankrupt and if you're not using every dollar you need to get on every dollar because that is going to be the foundation of all of this if you don't have that you're not going to move at

the speed you think you're going to move yeah hang on we'll let them pick up and give you that for free okay we want you to not file bankruptcy you're not bankrupt you don't need to file bankruptcy live from the headquarters of ramsey solutions it it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual, amazing relationships. Jade Walsh, all Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author, is my co-host today. The phone number is 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Hannah starts this hour in Birmingham, Alabama. Hi, Hannah.

How are you? Hey, I'm doing all right. How are y'all? Better than we deserve. What's up? So we have a little bit of a predicament, my husband and I. We bought a house two and a half years ago before we started the baby steps and we did everything wrong. So we actually ended up

starting your plan last fall and then we paid off $17,000 between student loans and consumer debt. Found out we were pregnant. I'm happy to report that I had our second little boy. We are doing well. So we had switched to stork mode during that time. We saved up enough to pay off the labor and delivery bill. And then we had about $5,000 left over. So we paid off what was left of my student loan, so those are done. Good. Are you debt-free? So we were about to be, but the day after we paid off the student loan, my husband was under our house doing some electrical work, and he noticed a plumbing issue,

and then we were already aware of something going on with our foundation so we had some a plumber and then the foundation specialist come out the next week so last friday and we found out there is a sinkhole under our bathroom so we're down to a thousand dollar emergency fund and it's going to cost more than a thousand to repair the sinkhole um so my question is what is it going to cost it uh we were quoted 11.5 um so it could have been worse um but with the size of it um and the materials they'll need they told told us $11,500. Our problem is normally we would want to just cash flow everything, but a sinkhole, they were like, we kind of can't tell you how long you have. If that makes sense, it could open up tomorrow or your house could sit fine for five

more years. We don't know. So we're wondering if we should look into this company's payment plan they have a famous cash um plan or we could put down a deposit what's your what's your household income uh right now we met 108 okay all right um obviously we're in Nashville and, um, which is not, uh, topography and geology is not unlike where you are in Birmingham. And I own a bunch of real estate. And so I have had sinkholes over 30 years. I don't know. A lot of times this building has several, um, under it that we had to fix and fill before we could put the building up. It's not unusual in a large commercial project to drill and to run into that kind of a thing. Okay.

The Ramsey Conference Center that we built had one open up just outside the wall after we moved into it. And we had to fill and take care of that okay so um i'm not an expert on this but it's not my first sinkhole okay uh so the first the weird thing about it is it it under your home or any property that you own but particularly under your home uh especially the first time you ever run into this like you guys have it's um it's such an unknown and it's it's kind of weird it it's emotional because it's like the this thing's gonna swallow my house like some kind of a movie or something right feels dangerous yeah it feels it feels it feels ominous yeah you know and it and and when you get the other side of it, you're going to feel this and you're going to find out that's kind of humorous, actually.

It's not going to eat your house. It's okay. And so, but the sinkhole companies, there's a lot of different ways to remediate this. Okay. Okay. So the first thing I want you to do is go get three, two or three other people in that industry to look at this, not just this one company. Okay. Um, and, uh, uh, you know, this is the, the, I don't know the size of what you're dealing with or the speed at which it has already moved,

but most of the time you have a little time. Okay? Okay. If I were in your shoes with my having dealt with this stuff before, I would be very calm because I've got $100,000 a year, $110,000 coming in. We're just going to go back into stork mode only. It's sinkhole mode. We're just going to go back into stork mode only it's sinkhole mode just going to push pause on everything and we're going to cash flow this i mean how much were you putting towards the debt when you were going gazelle intense on the debt every month oh gosh

um three grand minimum yeah putting two or three grand a month yeah so three grand a month three grand a month and you got this covered in four months. Actually, you can start work in three months because you will have nine of the 12 that you need if the $12,000 figure is even accurate. Okay. It might be this, because I got to tell you, you're going to get different answers. If you go get three more, people look at it, you might get a $7,000 answer and you might get a $29,000 answer. Wow. Yeah.

It is an imperfect science. Okay. But basically we're going to, you know, ping the bottom of this thing and fill it with concrete. It's what we're going to do. And, um, and, or you're going to dig it all the way out to the bottom of it and then fill the whole thing up with concrete and that's the more expensive version so um uh you know and it's a process and you know how that how it's shaped and the way it looks and you know there's companies that are

it's it's an engineering geological thing you know and so it's it's very it unless you have a very unusual thing that we would have here in the southern section of the United States I don't think it's going to eat your house for you come up with the money if he had I have a question and Dave you might know this if he hadn't been under the house for whatever reasons he was under there how might you have known oh we've got a sinkhole issue cracks I don't think we would have known, honestly. Well, I mean, it's going to get worse at some point, and you're going to start to see a foundation piece fall away.

Okay, okay. Because it sounds like it's running under the footing. It is. It's running under the edge of the house, in other words, the edge of the wall, exterior wall, right? Yeah. Unfortunately, it's on the corner of where two exterior walls meet, which is why the guy was like, I, you know,

would want to address that pretty quickly. But then also, you know, someone comes out through an estimate, we know they're trying to get us to move quickly to make money. And it's not necessarily that there's a bunch of shysters in that world. It just, there's a lot of different ways to fix the problem and the different ways to look at it and different levels of panic about it. And so what I just want you to, anytime I've got a problem I don't know how to solve, I want lots of options. And that's what I want you to do. And I think you're going to end up cash flowing it. I think

you're going to be fine. That's the answer to your question. I believe you're going to be okay. It's going to be, it's inconvenience awful. You know, you're gonna be okay it's gonna be it's inconvenient it's awful you know you're gonna lose 10 or 15 000 bucks here but you're gonna scratch that out of your income and then you're gonna get back on your plan and go finish your emergency fund and go on this is the ramsey show wow it's here The brand new five mistakes you can't afford to make in college by the one and only Jade Warshaw. It is. It is I. Yeah, it was actually easy to put that book together, Dave, because it was based on all of the five mistakes that I made when I was in college. And so it was easy to teach.

Well, we have had similar products to this over the years graduate survival guide and that kind of thing and i remember that we sat down and said okay jade needs to redo that because that thing's out of date and we need to throw it in the trash and and come up with a brand new one and you did it and this thing is beautiful it's beautiful it's a great thing for the college student in your life. The Graduate Survival Guide, Five Mistakes You Can't Afford to Make in College, completely new material by Jade Warshaw. Yeah, it's just the right size.

It's the size of a journal. You can just throw it in your backpack so kids can take it wherever they want. There's no jacket on it, so you don't have to worry about all of that. And I like it because it looks like a magazine. It's got all kinds. I mean, it's got the four color. It's a high gloss, high production piece. It looks like social media.

Yeah, it does. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, it's perfect for the college student. You got a kid or somebody in your life, a nephew, a son. You need to get this for them. It's in the store right now. What are the five mistakes? Student loan debt, credit cards, dumb choices, no plan, no money.

There it is. That's the five mistakes you can make in college and that you can't afford to make. And people do it all the time. Most of us did one or all of them. And hey, the way you don't do it is you know about it and you avoid the trap. I mean, if somebody had told me these five things, life would have been different. That's all I'm saying. It would have been different that's all I'm saying it would have been better graduate survival guide at ramsey solutions.com slash store you know I thought of this it flashed in my head so I'm going to say it many many years ago

there was a whole movement called promise keepers and I went to a stadium event down in Atlanta, Georgia, and the speaker was talking about, let's see, he had a book out on preparing for adolescence, okay, to teach your kids how to navigate through adolescence. And he had these huge traps, like you trap a wolf with or a bear, massive, that'll rip your leg off, okay, set. And he demonstrated and popped one of them and it like destroys a piece of wood. I mean, it's, these things are, they're horrible traps. And he had them labeled, the things that can happen in your teenage years, you know, premarital

sex, okay, unwanted pregnancy, in other words. You can have drug drug use you could have rebellion you could have whatever and he has all these things and he put a brought a dad and a teenager up on stage and he blindfolded the teenager on one side of the stage with all these traps and told the dad okay guide the teenager through the trap talk him through it and don't let him get his leg ripped off and the teenager takes one step the dad goes no you need to go and the speaker says stop what are you doing he goes well you just told me what to do and he goes why would you ever do that walk over there take his blindfold off put your arm around him and walk him through these traps

yeah that's it was it was a greatest speaking that was a fabulous job that's i mean he really and that's what we're doing here it's exactly what we're doing here's the five things five big old traps take the blindfold off jade's gonna put your arm her arm around your college student and walk them through the traps you don't talk them through it you walk them through and that's what this book does so there you go great one of my favorite all-time speaking things that someone else did other than me promise keepers listen my dad may have been at that event i remember promise keepers it was great i'm trying to think of it preparing for adolescence is the name of the book it was a a great book, and it's wracking my brain.

I guess it was Dennis Rainey? I don't know. I think it was Dennis Rainey that did the book, maybe. I don't remember. Somebody like that. All right. Josh is with us. I'll have to look it up now.

Philadelphia. Hi, Josh. How are you? Doing great, Dave. Thank you for having me on the show. Sure. How can we help? So my girlfriend is in kind of a pickle.

She has $2,300 left in the collection in her name and her ex-roommate's name. Two years ago, her and her now ex-roommate were living together. My girlfriend had moved out early uh to move from michigan to philadelphia to start a phd program there and um the roommate didn't provide a 60-day move-out notice on her part that she was going to move out and so the landlords charged a four thousand six hundred dollar uh fee uh equal to three months rent uh for not providing 60 days notice and so at the time they were on the leash uh they both of them were on the lease yes all right so my girlfriend paid 2300 of her own money uh to try and get get it settled on her end but the roommate

never showed up with the money and it's been about two years and at this point i don't think it's gonna happen i don't think this roommate's gonna uh help out uh to pay for any of this and we're stuck with this collections on we are she is she stuck with this collection on her name can she just settle it so she doesn't have the money right now she doesn't have the money saved up for it and uh we were just wondering what are kind of our legal options we don't have legal options she does yes you need to quit using we we're not married yes okay she does all right her legal options let me go back and explain, and let's reset this, okay? When she, the $4,600 judgment lien is against both of them.

It's what an attorney would tell you is called joint and several, which means that your roommate is liable for the whole $4,600, or your girlfriend, and her roommate is liable for the whole 4,600, or your girlfriend, and her roommate is liable for the whole 4,600. So she did not get released by paying only half of it. Okay? So it's not her half and her roommate's half. That would be actually equitable. That would be fair, but that's not the way the law looks at it.

So your roommate, your girlfriend basically paid $2,300 of the $4,600 that the two of them owe. You see what I'm saying? It's not $2,300 and $2,300. It's $4,600 together. And so she just put a down payment on this thing is all she did. Now, if I were coaching her before she did that, I would have said, okay, I'm willing to pay for half of this if you release me.

Yes. If she had done that, she would be free now. Yes. Okay. And so what I'm going to do this time is I'm going to call them and say, hey, I goofed up. I gave you half the money. I'm really morally only on the hook for half.

The other person, you should get it from them. But you're going to keep coming after both of us because you can. So I'll put another $1,000 on this if you release me. And you can still go after her for as much as you want to. Got it. In this case, when you say release her, can she ask for the pay for delete as well to remove this from her collections account? They have to say it's a paid collections.

In terms of what shows up on her credit bureau report is what actually happened what actually happened was a lease that she was on did not get paid they sued and put a lien on her or they took a lien or they took just a collections notice on her and then she settled that and it'll show a settled collection a zero balance due but there was an event so it will damage her credit you're not going to get rid of that but it's not going to ruin her credit for five years from now four years from now three years from now two years from now it's not a problem it'll still be on there it's not going to keep you from like if y'all got married it wouldn't keep you from getting

a house or something but you do need to get it settled because it's not going to do anything but grow and get worse by you i mean she not you now i'm doing it i'm doing what i told you to quit doing okay but yeah she needs to get this settled because it's not going to get better so she needs to save up a thousand or fifteen hundred bucks or something offer that to them and i i want to leave a little bit there because i want them to go after the other girl yeah because she owes it I mean that's that's fair yeah yeah that is fair so always when you're settling something you don't get rid of the whole balance if it's got your name on it you're not out unless you demand a release for that so if she'd have done that with the first 2300 they'd probably let her go and called it a

day hindsight yeah yep this is the Ramsey show. Okay. Now that I started up a hornet's nest, let's just clarify it. Um, it was Dennis Rainey that did that talk and it's, the book was called parenting today's adolescent. And,

um, Dennis and Barbara Rainey did it. Dennis had since become a friend oh um james dobson has a book out called preparing for adolescents that i also read but it was not the book about the traps this is the traps book okay so just for everybody out there um and i i so that would have been 20 something years ago that i read that book, so I have no idea that the information in that book. Like the thing that I was telling Kelly, our producer at the break, I remember when I read it, Rachel and Denise were early teens,

and one of the traps was, of course, social media was not around, but one of the traps was media and gaming. The next week, Columbine shooting happened after we sat down because i talked them through each of the traps as we finished a chapter we would say okay here's a here's a trap and we want to talk sharon your mom and i want to talk to you girls about this trap daniel was too young to get into it at that point but uh we would talk them through those traps so because what that does is then when they come up and they want to have a fit at 14 years old, like only a 14 year old girl can have a fit at that level. It's pretty amazing. And because I won't let them do something we would have already discussed.

We already talked about this. We already talked about this. And so that was the preemptive thing. And then the weird thing was columbine happened that was the first time we had a school shooting at that level and it was blamed on somewhat on uh gaming that the uh the gaming was was uh vilified in the process i don't know if it really had anything to do with it or not but it all came up we talked about it right so um I also heard somebody say one time uh and I I liked this they said that when when your child hears about something for the first time from you you become the expert so it's

if they're going to learn about game that's how my grandpa was so smart right you know I mean so if you're the first person story if you're the first person to talk about student loans then you're the expert but if they see and hear about it the first time on tiktok then tiktok's the expert and so you talking about these traps first now now they see you as well they're the interesting there we go dave and sharon the experts on gaming that is pretty humorous right there. I'm just saying that's about the funniest thing ever. All right. Wouldn't know how to do it if I had to.

Alex is in Flint, Michigan. Hey, Alex, what's up? Hey, guys. Honored to talk to you both today. You too. How can we help? Hey, so I run a small, just part, or not part-time, full-time, by myself construction company.

But every month, budget's kind of different. I don't want to say budget. Income's a little bit different. I'm just wondering how to actually make a set budget when I don't have a guaranteed exact amount every month coming in. Is there a bottom? Is there a minimum that you know, without a doubt, I will have this? Last 12 months, what's your worst month?

Probably about $8,000. Okay. So you easily could do a budget on $7,000, right? out i will have this last 12 months what's your worst month uh probably about eight grand okay so you easily could do a budget on seven grand right yeah i would think so okay and then you just need to figure out a system for everything above seven grand that comes in right right right and what we do what we do there is a thing on every dollar you can use what's called paycheck planning and uh because you'll know before the money gets there you just don't know four months from now exactly yeah but i mean if we're at the the first of march you're going to know kind of what march is going to look like pretty close yep okay so we know we can do seven grand kind of as a template so to speak and then we then we can go from there and say, okay, if I have a $12,000 a month,

what am I going to do with the other five? And in every dollar, it's called paycheck planning. But here's the concept. It's basically forced ranking. You do everything you can do in the $7,000 towards your goal, and you run your household out on the $7,000, right? And then you say, okay, what is not in the seven thousand dollar budget that i want or need to do and you make a list of those things now if you're in baby step two

paying down debt would be the big one right yep i would want to put more or almost all of anything over seven thousand towards the debt are Are you in Baby Step 2? I only owe like $7,000 combined on everything that I have with my business. Just, you know, some startup costs. I've only been in it two years. Okay, so yeah, you're in Baby Step 2. You need to clean that $7,000 up. So you'd knock that out pretty quickly. So that would be one.

If the extra $5,000 in our example, you follow me, Alex? The extra $5,000 over your $7,000 in a $12,000 a month, extra five over your seven and a twelve thousand dollar month would a lot of it would go towards that it'll also give you peace when you do the every dollar budget you'll know your your minimum like you'll know okay for our household to tick it takes forty five hundred like you'll know that number and that gives you a lot of peace too as you work throughout the month to know okay we're we're covered 7,000, you know, 7,000 covers you. So you're not working like, like that the whole time. Yeah. So here's the concept though. If we get past that, you just force ranking all the things that didn't make the cut in the 7,000. So you say, okay, I got the 7,000. I did. It did all of it. It bought my food. It bought my lights

and paid my rent. Okay. But now what else do I want or need to do? And you make a list of those things and then you rank them in order of importance. And the first dollar above 7,000 that comes in goes to number one and the second dollar to number one and the third dollar to number one until number one is accomplished. And then if there's enough to do towards number two, the next dollar goes to number one and the third dollar to number one until number one is accomplished and then if there's enough to do towards number two the next dollar goes to number two and you decide the importance list of those and so when sharon and i first started this 30 something years ago of course there was no apps and there was no budgeting software or there was no such thing as any of that

we're doing on a yellow pad and we had we're in the real estate business alex we would make zero literally some months and then i might make 25 000 bucks the next month and so it was really volatile and so we lived on a forced ranked yellow pad budget where we started the top number one was food yeah same you know number two was lights and water and you know that kind of stuff and so we took care of necessities first and then when we got down in there we would start cleaning up an old irs dad or we'd clean up whatever and we'd clean up and clean up and clean up and clean up and then finally down there we'd get to a little bit of fun if we got far enough down the list and and uh so forth so yeah that that's the way you handle it is it's a forced ranking above in your case your 7 000 baseline yeah and i always liked when when sam and i were i mean we still

are a regular income but when it was more feast and famine like that i always liked uh being ahead of the month so that you could then take the extra money put it on debt and know hey if money doesn't come in by the first of next month we're still good yeah you can put that on the list you could put next month's rent yeah on the list not this month but next month yeah because you want to make sure because a lot of times that's due on the first so you want to make sure there's money there as well you get you get out ahead of the curve on that and so you're kind of rolling like month and a half roll that's right instead of a one month that's right and that there's nothing wrong with that at all. And actually paycheck planning will work perfectly

for that in the every dollar expanded version that you can get now. Yeah. Every dollar is really iterated. For those of you haven't used it in a while, you need to jump back in there. We've done a bunch of work to it. It's been a couple million bucks on it this year. And it's really it is literally the most robust, best budgeting software on the planet right now. And it's really, it is literally the most robust, best budgeting software on the planet right now. And it's getting better every day. That crew is on fire. That software engineer is up there. They are lighting the place up, man.

So you guys check out EveryDollar. It'll do it. And the paycheck planning function, Alex, is what will work for you. Download it if you haven't tried it. But you can do it with Yellowpad, but it's just a pain in the butt. It is. No, I think EveryDollar is great because you get your monthly picture but then for a lot of people some people just like planning by paycheck some people it's a necessity but you can go in there and you

literally put when you get paid the date and then you can say okay so when that with that paycheck i can pay this this this and that and it'll run down the numbers it'll do the math for you okay you're out of money if you got a car payment it might be on the 17th that's right and that's the second paycheck maybe or the third paycheck maybe. Yeah. And so you can allocate it by paycheck, not just by month. That's right. And that, man, that cleans up everything.

It cleans up a lot. It really is like, okay, now you just push the dominoes. Yeah. Right through the month and execute plan. That's right. Here we go. And the sense of control, the sense of power with it is pretty incredible. And you will, folks, Alex included, you'll feel like you got a raise doing that.

Alex, I'll throw in one other thing that you didn't ask. You're in the construction business. Make sure your job costing, running each job as a separate P&L, it'll increase the accuracy of all your estimates going forward. It's a business thing I'm giving you here, not just a personal finance thing. Construction guys are the world's worst about stealing from one job to the next job inside their own books. It's not really stealing, but it doesn't give you a clear picture of what's working in your business and what's not working. So job costs, those things run separate P&Ls on

each job and you can get some software to do that's very inexpensive try it our scripture of the day proverbs 13 11 dishonest money dwindles away but whoever gathers money little by little makes it grow joan river said people say that money is not the key to happiness but i always figured if you had enough money you can have the key made saucy saucy that's Joan right there Naomi is with us Naomi is in Charlotte North Carolina hi Naomi how are you I'm doing well how are you doing better than I deserve. How can we help? Well, I've got a question for you. My husband and I are out of debt. We own a house. We actually bought the house that we own from my father-in-law two years ago, fixed it up. So we own everything outright. Don't have any debt. My father-in-law is a landlord, is a second generation landlord. My husband has a dream of becoming the third-generation landlord in the same neighborhood.

And there is a house that has come available from my father-in-law. So we have the opportunity to buy from him again. A rental property. It is a rental property. The house that we bought was also a rental property but we live in it so we fix it up and live in it okay so it's not a rental property right now um but this one we would either be moving into that one because it's bigger we're about to have our third and we live in a two-bedroom two-bath house that is a four-bedroom two-bath house. We'd either be moving into it or we would be renting it. So our dream

is to keep the house that we currently have that we fixed up and to start having a third and with the dream of having a fourth generation, like continuous legacy of loaning land and properties in this neighborhood the catch is that while we have no debt and all that kind of stuff in order to get this second house you'd have to we would have to go into debt to my father-in-law correct he would be a for sale by owner he would be the one financing it um but we're just kind of like does that is that trading stupidity for yeah for a dream basically yes um but but let's talk about it okay um i love real estate i've got a bunch of it as you may have heard me say many times um and i love the idea of owning rental property i love the idea of generationally being in a thing all of those are really good ideas they're good things nothing wrong with anything the motivation behind all of that is excellent um let's take the father-in-law out

of it and the owner financing out of it i still wouldn't tell you in order to become a real estate investor, which I think you should do, but I would not tell you to do that by going into debt. Mm-hmm. And you're going into debt to be a real estate investor because I know if you sold the two-bedroom that you're in, you could probably pay cash for that other house. Absolutely.

Yeah. Yeah, totally. That's what you should Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. That's what you should do. Yeah. Okay. Now, then how are we going to be a landlord? Well, we're going to save up money aggressively because it's a big motivator of ours. It is of mine, by the way.

And we're going to pay cash for a rental property. And then when you have a cash rental property with zero debt, you know what it does with the rents? You get a lot of profit. It's all of your loss. You don't have a payment coming out of the rent, right? Right. And so it's easy to stack cash for the second one. Oh, when you have two of them that are paid for,

oh, now those rents stack for the third one really fast. When you get 10 of them paid for, you can buy one ever so often with the cash flow coming off the 10 paid for. It's slower to get started, but you don't get in a pinch. And worst of all, the borrower is slave to the lender 100 of the time whether you believe in the bible or not 100 of the time that you owe your father-in-law money thanksgiving dinner tastes different until it's paid yeah so that is something so when we bought this first house from him,

that was one thing that my husband and I, we are both like super not crazy about debt. I had, I've had a car payment in my entire life and that was the only debt I've ever had. Um, and that was paid off like 10 years ago. are you guys so i'm we're both 34 what's your household income so currently it's about 48 000 okay all right well you've done very well congratulations thank you so far and um i would tell you to pay cash for that other house by selling your current house and make the move up for your family. It's a good investment. It's a property you want to own. It's in an area you want to own.

And save up and pay cash for the next one you move into. And then keep that one as a rental. Yeah. If you want to do that, that's okay. And Sharon and I have done all of that but we didn't we don't we haven't borrowed money since we filed bankruptcy in 1988 and so but i've owned 600 million dollars worth of real estate right now yeah and i have a question sorry 100 it's okay it's 100 we just but it started i'm telling it's, the starting of it's what's hard because your dream

is, but if you borrow into your dream, you can turn your dream into a nightmare. Got to do the real estate snowball. Yep. Totally. Now there is one part that is, so my father-in-law, when we paid for this one outright, he was upset with us because he was hoping for a monthly income because it wouldn't match with his. He doesn't get a vote. Okay, cool. So he wanted you to be in debt so that he could have this coming in monthly?

Correct. I sure don't want to be in debt to that guy. He's more concerned about himself than he is you. Yeah. That guy. He's more concerned about himself than he is you. Yes. Plus, that doesn't even make sense. You gave him a lump sum of cash. So, we found out afterwards that every time he sells a property, he feels like he's losing.

So, I think for him, potentially, it could be if he has his son. You may not want to buy that then. Yeah. I think for him, potentially, it could be if he has his son. You may not want to buy that then. Yeah. Because he may harbor resentment against you to buy that property. Yeah. That's a relational question you and your husband have to answer, though. If we buy this from dad in cash, is he going to be upset with us? If the answer is yes, don't buy it.

Buy something else. Okay. Dude, that makes it a super easy litmus test you know why why would you do that i don't want to upset him i'm if i if i buy something from someone i want them to be glad i bought it from them whoever it is that's right i want it to be a win-win transaction i bought i bought people's houses on thursday and it stopped a foreclosure on friday i got a great deal they didn't get foreclosed on they were glad i bought it yeah i was glad i bought it because i got a great deal and so that you know i i don't i'm not going to sell anything to somebody that's mad because i bought it you said, if he set the price and the price is the price. No, I'm interesting. No. So, yeah, I think, I think there's, there's a sense there's,

there's a lot of control issues flowing through this conversation that are uncomfortable vibes. And I don't know exactly what they are. And I don't even know if your father-in-law means to do that. He may just think, okay, I'm trying to be a blessing and these little twerps won't listen. You know, and it's like, it may be that. I don't know what it is, but still it could be that. It could be just that there's some control vibes going on, but it feels a little weird, doesn't it? It does.

I would agree with that. Yeah. And your husband doesn't have the same feeling about it you do, Naomi. So you need to make sure he hears your feelings loud and clear on this because that's wisdom. There's lots of houses out there. Yeah, you can get a house there everywhere. And there's lots of places that you can own generational rental property. That's right.

That's right. Which, by the way, in our properties, I've told our kids, I don't care. I'm dead. You do whatever you want to do with them. They're going to be yours. If you don't like them, sell them. We were having a discussion, one of the meetings about our estate, and the kids were like, we don't like that property.

I'm like, well, when I'm dead, sell it. I like it. I'm keeping it because I'm still here right now, by the way. But when I'm dead, I'm not going to be mad at you if you sell it. You do whatever you want to do. It's your money at that point. That puts us out of the Ramsey Show and the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace,

and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus. We'll see you next time.