The Ramsey Show - App - Don't Buy Crap You Can't Afford! (Hour 2)

Episode Date: January 3, 2024

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show. We help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey personality, is my co-host today. He's the host of the Dr. John Deloney Show on podcast. You ought to check it out. It's unbelievably popular. Talks about mental health issues and relationship issues there and all kinds of other fun things.

It's very entertaining. You ought to be sure you're there. He's here to help you today, and so am I. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Jordan is with us in Springfield, Illinois. Hi, Jordan. How are you? Good.

How are you, Dave? Better than I deserve. What's up? Hey, so I've got a quick question for you. My wife and I, we're 28. I'm an Illinois State Trooper. She's a nurse. We bring home around $8,000 a month.

I discovered you in September last year. I sold my truck that was paid off for $32,000, paid off my student loans and our rings. So that leaves us with about $45,000 left in student loans and the $280,000 in mortgage. Good for you. You're heading on the right way. Yeah, that's awesome, man.

Welcome to the gang. Thank you. I'm excited to be in this journey, but I have a little bit of a problem. In October of last year, my parents announced they were getting a divorce. And my father told me I'm now responsible for the 60,000 parent plus loan. There have been maybe two payments on it in six years. I've tried to have conversations with them about it. It always gets real hostile. He gets gets defensive he defers the blame to my mom stating that he never had anything to do with the loans in the first place and then my mother handled everything with the loan i know

i'm not accountable for the loan um but every time i bring it up he's always like you're the one that went to school so i i do feel a little accountable. Okay. Was there a conversation back then that you made a contract with your dad and mom verbally to promise to pay this? Not to my knowledge. I mean, we've talked about it. I don't believe so. Okay. So your mom and dad were trying to help you out. They took out a parent plus loan did you

had no reason to believe you had to repay that until your dad decided later that you did is that the actual facts correct okay all right then it's on your dad okay should i add it to the snowball no it's not your dad okay okay dude you're trying to preserve a relationship like you're thinking in your head i don't want to i don't want to mess this relationship up your dad has already done that yeah he's the one who's chosen to take out his frustration with your mom on his son right i mean he yeah that's a good good way to it. That's not your game to play. That's not your mess. Yeah, your mom did this, and I'm getting rid of her. Ooh.

Right. That's strong. Because if he had a real problem with it, he should have settled it in court. Well, the other big issue I have is he's got $140,000 in his IRA. Yeah, but you stay out of his head and out of his checking accounts, too. Okay. Right? Like, you're going to make yourself crazy trying to do dad math on his money.

Did he sign the loan or just your mom? It's just in his name. Okay. Then how did she do it without his knowledge if he signed it? He literally said, he said, I've never seen a document about that. I wouldn't even know what it looks like. That's between him and your mom. That's not between him and you.

Right. Right? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. You know, you don't have anything to do with this. You were just at school, and they were paying for part of it. And your mom, I think your mom made a mistake. Absolutely.

But there's a lot of mistakes in this story between your mom and dad and so um but i don't think it's your responsibility to take on their mistake let's pretend it wasn't alone let's just say she took money out of their joint checking account and just paid for part of your school would you have to pay that back if you didn't have any knowledge that you were supposed to pay that back no it's the same thing absolutely and here's my equally i mean there's that issue your dad's changing the rules he's trying to revisit history here but more so rewrite history he won't have a grown-up man-to-man

conversation with his son who's a state trooper he won't sit across the table and say son this divorce is killing me i don't have the money to pay sixty thousand dollars um i know i made an agreement with you i can we read like he won't do that he makes you feel stupid and small because of a decision him and his wife made when you were 18 years old right when I didn't have any idea what I was getting into exactly right exactly and I hate that for you dude because he's going to make you the bad guy in this and you're not you're not I mean it's it's bringing issues in in my marriage and I just your wife thinks you'd be crazy to pay it that's the issue yeah yeah yes yeah sounds like you married well hey and by the way your dad is

the one opting out of future holidays not you thank thank you for reassuring me of that because i mean yeah he's welcome he's welcome if he can behave if you act like you're growing up decision yeah but if you want to if you want to run away on $60,000, then we now know the value of your relationship with your son, sir. Right. You think we now know the price tag. It's 60 grand. Right.

So just stay on my ground and – Yeah. Here's the thing. If you told them you were going to pay it, we'd be sitting here telling you to pay it. Absolutely, yeah. Okay. I want you to pay it. Absolutely, yeah. Okay. I want you to change your language a little bit.

I don't even know if it's a stand my ground. I'm walking away. Gotcha. Yeah, it's too long to tell the story. I'm finding more and more value in the times I plant my feet on a hill and I'm ready to die on that hill as old as i'm getting older or just getting smaller and smaller and if someone wants to lie about me they want to throw a debt on me that i don't owe they want to take out their frustration about their failed

marriage on me i'm dude i can't engage in that i'm walking away yeah have a good day yeah have a good day and i know that sounds bad but i want you to we're we're uh jordan you're a state trooper around here where most of us are gun guys and a bunch of us have done tactical training and the first thing we learn in tactical training is run get out don't engage john wick is a movie it's not reality run yeah bullets hurt run get away that's the first goal. And instead of John Wayne, John Wick, whoever, we don't need to be John. So we got guys like Jordan to take care of this, right?

And that's kind of what John Deloney is saying. The only John, the real John, right? Do you mind if I ask you another quick question real quick? Real fast. Yeah, real fast. So we're both contributing $500 a month to our IRAs right now. I would if I ask you another quick question real quick? Real fast. Real fast. Yeah, real fast. So we're both contributing $500 a month to our IRAs right now. I would stop that until you're out of debt. Perfect. That's what I was going to ask you.

Temporarily. When you're on baby step two, you stop all investing temporarily to totally focus on a singular goal. And, Jordan, this is going to be hard for you with your dad because he's your dad. And you can be sad, and you can can be kind and you can be strong, but you're not going to convince him that you're right. The only thing you can do is just pull back, pull back, give him room while he's in this wounded state. He's a wounded animal right now.

And just give him room. Just give him room. And someday he'll come around or he won't. That'll be on him, though. It won't be on you. I'm sorry you're facing this. It's a hard thing. But you don't owe the money, sir.

And your wife is right. This is The Ramsey Show. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. January the 11th, you and 200,000 of your closest friends can join us. So far, 227,000 people have signed up for the free live stream, Break the Cycle. Dr. John Deloney, Jade Warshaw, Dave Ramsey, Rachel Cruz, George Camel. We're going to help you break the cycle. Did you know that stupid has a gravitational pull?

I was going to make a joke about sitting next to you, but I won't. Too late. You did. Yeah. I don't know which one is the gravitational pull and which one is the stupid, but we'll go with that. So either way, it does. Stupid will pull you back in, and you have to break the cycle. It requires an effort to break an orbit.

When you're in orbiting stupid, you know, it takes energy to bust an orbit, to bust out of an orbit and break free of the gravitational pull of something, and that's what Break the Cycle is all about. We're going to help you do that. It's time. You can't blame the family curse anymore. You can't blame, well, people like me, people in my neighborhood. No, it's you.

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in lexington kentucky hi logan how are you good dave how are you better than i deserve what's up hey so uh real fast i'll give you a back story of where I'm at today. April of 22, my wife and I got married. Before we got married, I had about $30,000 in my bank account. She had a $5,000 student loan and a $17,000 car note. Pretty much as soon as we got married, paid that off, got that out of the way, took care of. We then rented an apartment for a year and decided we were going to stay there until we had enough money to get down payment on a house. Unfortunately, after that year, we had an opportunity to present itself to buy a home from a family friend at a pretty well discounted price,

well below what the home value was. We knew that it was too much house for us. It was a 4,200-square-feet house. $315,000 is what we paid for it. First-time homebuyer, so we didn't have any money to put down. 0% down is what we got. 6.25% interest rate. We knew it was going to be a lot, but we tried anyway. We lived there up until November of this past year,

barely making it, living paycheck to paycheck, struggling. Our marriage was struggling, and we just decided we can't do this anymore if we want this to work, and we do. So we ended up putting the house up for sale, sold the house in seven days for $415,000, so $100,000 more than we gave for it in March. After realtor fees, et cetera, et cetera, we walked away with $77,000.

Within the time that we lived in the home, we accumulated $10,000 worth of credit card debt. Updating the home was built in 2002, so it was very outdated. And to try to get that home value up even more to sell it, we put $10,000 on a credit card. Fire insurance for us, and then fencing, and new flooring, et cetera, et cetera. Today, I have right at $50,000 in the bank, $22,000 of that $77,000. I bought my wife a car. We just found out on Christmas Day that she's pregnant and did her first baby.

I'm 26. She's 25. I have a car note for $37,500, what I owe on it. So now we have three vehicles. Two are paid off. One truck that I have is not paid off, $37,500, what I owe on it. What are you smoking that you go buy a $37,000 car after you just sold a house because you couldn't breathe?

No, it was $22,000 is what I paid for her car. I already had the $37,000 car long before. What do you guys make a year? $130,000 together. Good Lord. Okay. Yeah. Like I said, I've had the truck.

What can I do to help? You got a Willie Walker ticket, dude, and you blew your nose in it. That's what you did, man. What can you do? You got $50,000 in the bank. After you sell both cars and pay your capital gains, you're probably even. Right, yeah, that's the thing. I don't know how much the capital gain percentage is.

It's not a capital gain. It's ordinary income because you didn't even hold the house a year. So it's a 35% tax on the actual gain, and the gain is not 415. The gain is after sales expenses, and you probably did some capital improvements on that credit card debt that you can deduct as well so you probably have a $70,000 gain at 35 probably got a $20,000 tax bill you need to sit down with the tax person and figure out what that is but it's probably right around there and you have cars you can't afford. And you went and bought another one.

Right. Go sell both of them. Okay. You're not going to, are you? No. I'm thinking what I'm thinking is, you know, we live an hour from work, both of us. We live rent-free now on our grandparents' estate. Unfortunately, they passed away. They had a house here they didn't want to sell, so we're living here rent-free now on her grandparents' estate. Unfortunately, they passed away. They had a house here they didn't want to sell,

so we're living here rent-free. So what? Does that mean you have to be stupid with cars? No, it doesn't. Rent-free doesn't describe stupid cars. Right, right. So we're just trying to decide, should I sell my truck?

Yes, yes. Okay, that's... You should sell the car you just bought her okay y'all are broke people man yeah you're broke you make 130 000 a year and you've made a series of bad financial decisions that have caused you to be broke the best way to do it is go back to the last time you were standing on solid ground which is when you had a couple of junkie cars that were paid for and a hundred thousand dollars cash in the bank yeah that was a while back but yeah yeah get let's get rid of both of these get the most get the best car you can get for cash

no and figure out what your capital gains are so the twenty two thousand dollar car you bought her did you use the fifty thousand dollars cash to do that or did you go get a loan on that no no no we we had seventy seven thousand to bank oh so now you got 50 after buying that car so that car is paid for yeah both we have two cars that are paid for and one car that one truck my truck is not okay the both of our cars are paid for oh good then just get rid of the truck get rid of the truck and pay the capital gains. Right. That was my main question. Yeah. Okay. I'm caught up with you now. Yeah. But, dude, you've got to quit buying crap.

You don't go buy a $22,000 car when you walk out of this disaster you just came from. It literally, I mean, it's the exact conversation you just had about breaking the cycle. You, like, we can't breathe we gotta sell this house we sold the house hey we got some money let's go buy a car let's buy a car oh let's get pregnant and then buy another car that's like oh i can't breathe again well what are we gonna do now i gotta sell the car and do this and do this hey we got some more money let's go get a yeah it's like thank god it's friday oh god it's monday yeah we're in this rent-free house well you know it's gotta have new floors and a new roof and a new this let's put on the credit card we'll just pay it off later we don't

even have a house payment i think you could be dead free if you sell the truck and pay your capital gains and pay off the credit card and chop them up and then you're going to have to make a decision to never do the stupid crap you've been doing for the past three years you have to do i mean when i went broke logan i your age. And I had to sit down and do an autopsy, a CSI on Dave. And I looked at all the stupid butt stuff Dave was doing and had to go, if you want to live like this, you can keep doing the stupid butt stuff. Or I can stop doing the stupid butt stuff and have a better life. And that's why I'm yelling at you because I love you.

I want you to win, dude. This is The Ramsey Show. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Hey, guys. Just a couple weeks ago, we hit number one on Apple Podcasts, of all podcasts in the entire world. That's pretty cool. We've been hovering up around 10, 11, 12. We've been up at 7 a couple times, 5, never number one, and we hit number one. I don't know where we are today.

It changes, I think, daily or hourly or whatever, but we did make that milestone, and we want to say thank you to you guys because it's you that did it. We appreciate you, and we'll ask you to continue doing what caused that. What caused that was more and more of you are sharing the show. You're taking a link to the show or clicking the share button. You're subscribing, you're following, whatever the format is, whether it's YouTube or a local talk radio station, you're telling people about whatever it is, you're letting people know you're leaving five-star reviews. You're sharing. Thank you for doing that. And please keep doing it. It is the biggest thing you can do to say thank you to us and help us if you like what you're hearing share it tell somebody

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And thank you for hanging out with us. We appreciate the subscriptions. We appreciate the follows. We appreciate the nice reviews, and we appreciate the sharing. Nick is in Lima, Ohio. Hi, Nick. How are you? Hey, Dave and John.

How are you guys doing? Better than we deserve. What's up, man? Yeah, so I was wondering if you guys could possibly give me some words of wisdom or thoughts on my wife returning to school. Okay. What's she going to study? So she is looking at studying dentistry

so right now she is a dental hygienist is making about forty thousand dollars a year i'm a cpa i make about seventy five thousand a year um right now we have seventy thousand dollars in loan debt, and that's on my degree. Well, she didn't aim small, did she? No. I mean, have you priced a dental degree? Yes. In Ohio, there are only two dental schools in Ohio State, which is the cheaper of the two,

and I say cheaper when quotes is going to cost right around $400,000. That's pretty typical, yeah. Yep. So we're looking to cash flow this somehow, and pretty much the problem we're running into is, you know, we're projecting it's probably going to take about two years, probably still pay off the rest of my debt. And then another half year to save up the, the fund, whatever.

And then it's going to probably be, oh, probably about two and a half years worth of savings projected cost of the dental school in order to actually cash flow the whole thing with just my salary. I'm confused how you're going to pay off $35,000 a year for two years, but in two more years you're going to have $400,000. No, we would cash flow out two of the dental school years. So we would save up. 200. 200, yeah. And you're going to borrow the other 200. No.

You're going to cash flow it as she goes? We're going to try and cash flow it as she goes. So pretty much we wouldn't start until we had the $200,000 saved up. So what's your question? The question is, would it be worth it to do it, even though she's going to be 30 years old when she starts and we're looking at a 35-year-old graduating dental school. Why does that matter?

My mom graduated with her Ph.D. at 57 years old and was tenured by the time she was 63. You pay cash for it. She's going to be making dentist money, depending on what kind of dental practice she gets into. The next thing you'll face is she'll want to buy a practice, and that's another 500 or 400 the big challenge the question is not is it worth going to school and her not getting out

until she's 30 the question is 35 or 35 the question is you're going to be 35 does she want to be a dentist when she's 35 or no but math doesn't care about your timeline what what why does she want to be a dentist um kind of a three-fold um question almost she's worked for a few dentists um she doesn't always agree with how they want so she kind of wants to do her own thing she wanted to be a dentist, so she kind of wants to do her own thing. She wanted to be a dentist originally, but was kind of afraid to do the time commitment then. But as she's worked in the actual field, she feels like being a dentist would be a good thing for her. Is there any chance somebody in the practice would sign her to a five-year deal and pay for dental school for her? It's possible. I'm not sure how many small dental clinics around here would go for that, but there might be one around here that'd

be willing to do it. So here's what you've done real quick. You've put some constraints. She doesn't want to work at a big one. She wants to work at a small one. We want to cash flow, but she doesn't want to be a dentist all the way until she's 35. She wants to get it sooner. I want to do this, but I don't want to do that. You're going to have to make some sacrifices somewhere. They're going to be really hard. You're probably going to have to get another job as a CPA only making 75. You're going to need to double your income somewhere.

That might mean you've got to do corporate tax, or you're going to take on a bunch of Saturday and Sunday private clients over the next six months. Ohio State, you're moving to Columbus? Probably in between. She would commute someone, then I would commute someone to work. We're not too far away from Columbus.

Yeah, okay. Y'all have children? Yeah, we have two of them. One is a year and a half, and the other is five months. Okay, all right there's no harm in getting on this path you don't pass the point of no return until she actually starts dental school until then you're just paying off debt and saving up money so we can get on that path and then the question i guys i want you guys to ask us a couple pretty regularly is,

I don't want her to go through all this and drop 400K into this and then decide she wants to be a full-time mom. Okay. I've talked to lady MDs. I've talked to people in different kinds of situations that, you know, their dream shifted about what they saw their life being after they were already so far down the rabbit hole on the education stuff. And so it's not to say she can't be a dentist. I'm not saying because she's female she can't be a dentist because she's a mom

she can't be a dentist. She can be. I just want to make sure really $400,000 worth of sure that she's female she can't be a dentist because she's a mom she can't be a dentist she can be i just want to make sure really four hundred thousand dollars worth of sure that she's going to play all the way through and work the rest of her life as a dentist because that's that's what this is for you're going to go she's going to work 25 years as a dentist when she comes out until she's 60 and every day going to work as a dentist every day that's our job and then this roi's but otherwise the 400k is absolutely ludicrous to spend that and then not work you know 20 years plus in the field is ludicrous i think there's a valuable exercise in y'all two making a very committed

debt payment plan to pay off your student loans and see if that fire and that excitement and that desire is still there in 18 months or 24 months. If you're willing to cash flow it and she's willing to stick with it, I'm okay with it. It's not a bad life plan. I just run into too many people who get too far into this and then realize, oh, I don't think I want to do that. This is not going to six months of $10,000 worth of certificates on something and then deciding you don't want to do it. This is a big chunk of your life and $400,000 worth of sure. You've got to be sure. And it's a major commitment, in other words.

So in the process of you all getting out of debt and building up the first $200,000, we're going to ask that question over and over again. Are you sure? And build into your calculations childcare for two little kids for the next three, four, five, seven years. Yeah. Because it's going to cost a lot, too. Exactly. This is The Ramsey Show.

Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Spencer is in Eugene, Oregon. If I can figure out how to hit the right button here. There we go. Spencer is in Eugene, Oregon. Hey, Spencer, how are you? Hey, Ben, John, how are you guys? Better than we deserve, man. What's up? Perfect. Well, I wanted to run a question by you guys. So my wife and I have been married for about 11 years. Of those 11 years, I've been working as a firefighter paramedic for about eight of them. My wife recently brought to my attention that she struggles with certain aspects of my career

to the point where she has thought to ask me to change careers. She struggles with the thought of that because she knows how much I absolutely love my job, what I do and where I work, as well as how well it pays for our large family. She's afraid that I would resent her if I were to leave my career and it would be the hardest thing that I've ever done for sure because I absolutely have no idea what else I would do as my entire educational career has led me to the point where I am now. She wants to explore options for counseling and possibly help her through what she's struggling with before we explore the option of a career change, but we don't know where to start. We don't know if we want marriage counseling or individual counseling, so we're just looking for some advice.

Which part of your job does she not like, or what parts does she not like? So she has a really hard time being alone, especially at night, and kind of just being the primary provider on the days that I'm at work. We have four kids and one of them has some health problems and it's just, it's kind of overwhelming for her to be the primary, the loan provider while I'm gone. She also has a hard time just missing family or me missing family activities and holidays every so often, as well as just all the baggage that comes with the types of calls that we run, like PTSD type stuff.

Yeah. So I have a family member that talked to me. I grew up in a law enforcement household and firefighter household, and I had a family member tell me, like, every day your dad goes to work i have to wonder if he's going to come home that that's that fear is very very real that's not what i'm hearing here and so um because here's the deal i'm i'm a youtuber dude and i was a dean of students before that and before that i worked at burger king all three of those jobs i've had to miss some holiday stuff all three of those jobs i've had

to work really late and missed a couple of this isn't that's that's life so my fear is you're going to quit this thing and this imaginary life on the other side of this is not going to be real okay see what i'm saying so i would not even bankers keep bankers hours now that's right yeah and so i i would strongly suggest y'all go together at the beginning okay and let's parse through what this is because it sounds like somebody who is growing increasingly uncomfortable for any number of reasons with the life that she has and is beginning to look out in the crowd to see who can shoulder that with her and you're the nearest guy okay does that make sense it does and when you're sitting at home and you've got one kid that's sick and

you got three other kids that are burning the house down and making as dave's at pterodactyl it's not a real good metaphor for oh my bad he has a fireman um it's real easy another example to create a story where it's the job right if she told me you know what i love about this call though spencer is your wife um being so mature that she's a recognizing recognizing how much you love what you do, and, B, saying, hey, before we make a big change, let's get some counsel. It might be me. Let's look at, I mean, gosh, that's so selfless and mature on her part. That's awesome.

That gives me great hope that you guys can find some ground that maybe you can make a few minor adjustments here or there to meet some of those needs that she's got. And then that'll help her meet you the rest of the way. Because I got to tell you, the way she's approaching this, the way you described her was very mature, very cool. I really like her a lot. Me too.

I definitely married up. She's a huge blessing in my life. But here's the deal. I've spent my life running around with you guys, and the fact that you immediately, when she talked to you, you went to the computer to see what other jobs were available. I know you did. I did.

And that makes you equally mature also. Yeah, you guys are willing to sacrifice for each other. You have the recipe for an incredible relationship going forward, regardless of whether you stay in this or not. I think you'll find a way to stay in it, and she'll find a way to work with part of her stuff, and you'll find a way. Okay, I can do this. I can make sure with my seniority level after eight years on the force that are in the firehouse that I'm home on these dates. I can plan around that. And a minor example, it's not exactly parallel, Spencer, but when we were starting all this stuff that we now call Ramsey, my days were like 16-hour days.

I missed everything. Sharon will tell you there's about two years she was a single mom and uh because i worked all the time getting this thing going i was pulling this thing up by its hair right and um we worked all the time and so when we finally hit that same wall a similar discussion we sat down and we said okay i gotta have some non-negotiables so after that we never booked a live event on a kid's birthday we never took any speaking gigs ever on around a holiday uh so i didn't miss any christmas i didn't miss any proms i didn't miss any kids birthdays after that two year period and that was me coming back towards her adjusting my business you know to to be able

to still be a husband and a dad, right? And then in the midst of that, that gave her the strength to take up whatever slack there still was, which there still was, and she became a really zero-maintenance person from that point forward, and it's one of the reasons we've been able to build this incredible life. So I just really think you're willing to reach towards her with some adjustments. She's willing to reach towards you. Y'all can reset a few things here or there. I really think you can find this, but I, because of the way you're approaching it, I think you're going to be okay. I think the key here with the, with the counselor is going to be really pulling apart the specifics. What are the specifics? Can we hire somebody that comes in from

4 PM to 6 PM that just helps with bedtimes and helps with dinner, helps with cleanup? That's easy. Can we do something on Saturdays? Can we make Christmas two days early every year? And that's just our fun thing we do together as a family. There's ways around it if you got to, right? Yeah. You spend some of the money you're earning to create a life that becomes tolerable and sustainable. That you want, yeah. Yeah. That's what John's saying. And so that's help with the sick child.

That's, you know, a high-quality nanny two days a week. I don't care what it is. But on the days that you're gone, somebody's there helping. They're filling in, you know. And that'd be worth it to stay doing what you're doing that you love gone somebody's there helping they're they're filling in you know and uh that'd be worth it to stay doing what you're doing that you love so much and then she won't be worried about whether you resent her because it's not her she's trying to you know she's a single mom when you're gone that's what she's saying and um and that's the same thing sharon said and she was right you know

that's a very real thing so hey good question man sound like good people i think you're going to find the way through that for sure um and again i think it's largely because the way you're approaching it she didn't stomp in red-faced and scream you have to quit your job i can't stand it and you didn't say no i'm an entrepreneur or i'm a fireman this is who i am so forget you yeah You know what you married, and that's not helpful either. No, no. Instead, you're both saying, I'm willing to give up a piece of who I am to help you be who you are. Right. And that's called marriage, I think. Yeah.

And this is one of those weird things when you see somebody, you talk to somebody like Spencer and his amazing wife, that it feels like the wheels are falling off, and those of us who have been through this and are on the other side of that go, oh, no, your car's driving great, man. It's the terrain that's rough. It's not the car, right? And it feels like, oh, think, we're going to crash. You're not going to crash.

Y'all are doing good. Y'all are going to figure out your way out through this. Yeah, it's very smart to do that because the career, mental health, the money piece, the wealth building piece, they're all woven together in a way you cannot pull them apart. It's almost impossible to build wealth when you have a crummy marriage. It's almost impossible to have a great marriage when you hate your job all the time. All these things work together. And so the Dr. John Deloney, the Ramsey Show, the Ken Coleman Show,

these things all, the stuff we talk about, the portions of your life, they are woven together in a very real way. That puts us out of the Ramsey Show in the books. Thank you. Take care.