The Ramsey Show - App - Don't Isolate When You're Struggling With Something (Hour 2)

Episode Date: September 8, 2020

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio, this is the Dave Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. I'm Chris Hogan, and hosting along with me this hour is best-selling author and Ramsey personality, Anthony O'Neill. We are very excited to be here with you and very excited about talking to you to find out what's on your mind. So the number you need to call to get us is 888-825-5225.

Again, that's 888-825-5225. We'd love to hear from you, to be able to talk to you, to find out the things that are on your mind. Anthony, are you ready to go? Man, I'm ready to go, Hogan. I've been looking forward to this? Man, I'm ready to go, Hogan. I've been looking forward to this day, rocking out with you. Always learn something when I'm on the air with you too, man.

Well, man, you keep me hip. You know that? I mean, you are the millennial expert. You're plugged into the young folks, and you know what's on their mind. How are they handling all of this COVID stuff? You know, actually, believe it or not, Hogan, they are handling it very well. Some are learning through this process. Some are learning through this process. Some are growing through this process. And some are actually achieving and accomplishing some great things through this process.

So I've been walking through this younger generation, especially that 20s and the young 30s through this opportunity. But I've really been praying and really directing these young entrepreneurs that jumped out into entrepreneurship, I think, a little bit too early. You know, so some of them are realizing like, wow, I wasn't prepared for this. And so just really coaching them through this process, but for the most part, you know, over my YouTube channel, my IG, we're just

having a great time, just keeping everyone educated, inspired, and uplifted. Okay, see, I've hung out with you enough to know that IG is Instagram. And see, yeah, and uplifted. Okay, see, I've hung out with you enough to know that IG is Instagram. And see, yeah, a while ago I'd asked you, hey, whoa, whoa, whoa, what is that? But talking about Instagram, I've got one of those things too.

You do. Chris Hogan 360, get over there. But a lot of people right now, this pandemic has caused a lot of people to kind of wake up and shake up from the norm. Yes. And I'm hearing a lot of people talk about, man, I'm ready for 2021. Well, here's the deal. We don't get to just fast forward through 2020.

We actually have to walk this thing out. And I think what we have in the midst of the struggle is an opportunity. And it's just a matter of the mindset. And so I want you to be careful out there that we're not perpetuating the thing that is not possible, which is we don't get to fast forward. We don't get to just lay down and stop. What we're going to do is push forward. And I think it's really important to do that, to be mindful of the information that we're listening to, the things you're bringing in your mind, but also the things that you speak. You know, there's a lot of crazy out there.

And, you know, I don't even want to pretend drama on TV because it costs me pretend emotions. I don't have time for that, but I want to be mindful of it. And there is a lot of tension and a lot of things going on. And I think the main thing is, is to remain crystal clear on, am I making it better? Right? Am I making things better? And I think that's the mindset because, you know, my grandmother told me a long time ago, if you don't have something nice to say, well, don't say anything at all. And I think that's the mindset because, you know, my grandmother told me a long time ago, if you don't have something nice to say, well, don't say anything at all. And I think the mindset is, is we want to be supportive and encourage, encouraging to people in the midst of this time. All right, let's get to the phones. That's what we do. We're going to go to Austin. We're going to New York. Austin's got a student loan question. What's your question for Anthony?

Hey, good afternoon, Anthony, Chris. I really appreciate you guys taking my call today. Yeah, no problem, bro. How can we help? Absolutely. So currently I'm about, I'm 29, make about $100,000 in New York City. Currently have about $65,000 in cash. And my savings rate is about to go into super hyper growth here shortly. So I just wanted to ensure that I was being hyper focused with that. So I like to look at the goal starting first and then work our way back. So my goal is by my 30th birthday, which will be next August,

is to have $100,000 saved and then beginning to create multiple streams of income, very much focused on real estate. So my question for you is, create multiple streams of income very much focused on real estate so my question for you is should I pay off my existing student loans which are at 49,000 direct subsidized government thing at currently about 4% monthly payments of 225 or should I take the same money and invest directly into real estate with the assumption of the returns around 9% to 12%? Okay. So that's a good question, man. So right now,

your subsidized loans are right at about 4.5% interest rate, all right? You're sitting with- 4.5%. Yeah. And how much is in your savings account again? You said 90,000, right? 65,000. 65,000, right? $65,000. All right. And you have about $40,000 in student loans. At 29 years old, okay,

I'm going to be real with you. You're not going to like what I'm going to say, but this is the best route. I want you to pay off your student loans. Now, paying off your student loans

means that you're not going to be able to accomplish. You may not. I'm not going to say you will not. You may not be able to accomplish your goal by having $100,000 by next August in your account, depending on how much income you have coming in. Now, you may can reach it if you're grinding and doing some other things. But I want you to be debt free going into your 30s rather than having $100,000 just sitting there and you have $ fifty thousand dollars in student loan debt so

i would love to see you debt free with about twenty five thirty forty thousand dollars going into your 30s because you can get to that hundred thousand by 31 years old um but i love your mindset i can hear you grind but let me ask you just one one more question sure outside of your student loan debt do you have any other debt? No debt, no cars, no homes, no credit cards, no payday loans, anything. That's what I'm talking about. My brother said, no payday loans. I hate them things. Thank you.

Yeah, yeah. So that's what I'm recommending for him, Chris, is I want him at 29 years old, I wish I was, I had about $30,000, $40,000 in my savings account. But I think him positioning himself to pay off the debt now and then really grind, he sounds like a smart young man.

Austin, did you attend college? Yeah, I'm actually the first person in my family. I can hear the drive. What did you study in college? Believe it or not, I went to school for communication, but I work in tech now. Okay. All right. And here's what I want to tell you, because there's some stuff. I went to undergrad, and then I went and got my master's and all this stuff, but there was some stuff they didn't teach me. It was called common sense. And so I want to give you a dose of

this, because you mentioned real estate, and I have no doubt that you will get into real estate, but I want you to become allergic to leverage. I want you to be allergic to OPM. Those are three little levers you'll hear them talk about in school or in business, other people's money. If you are going to invest in real estate, my friend, I want you to do it 100% and with cash. It's going to be slower, okay? Now, I tell you, the only debt that I'm okay with people taking is a 15-year fixed-rate mortgage. But if you're talking about investing in real estate, that needs to be something you do outright and with cash. And I know in New York City, you know, number one, it's like L.A.

They charge for air, okay? And nothing up there is cheap. And so, you know, be careful because you're going to hear groups of people talking about they're going to put together an investment group or this or that. And someone like you whose mind is clicking and looking and thinking, you can easily take something that appears to be good and it can turn out bad for your financial future. So I'm just telling you this. Just take some advice from Uncle Hogan that you want to be careful. You want to be diligent and remain clear on what it is you're going to do and absolutely certain of what you're not. And that's the wisdom that will protect you from yourself down the road, my friend.

This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. I get asked all the time about what people need to do to improve their family's money situation. Two of the most overlooked things are term life insurance and disability insurance. Both plans make sure that you have income to pay bills and take care of yourself and your family if something were to happen. For term life, you need to carry 10 to 12 times your income, and I recommend 15 or 20 year plans for most families. Stay away from cash value or return of premium plans. They're just a rip-off. Disability insurance is just as critical. How are you going to pay your bills if you're

unable to work? Disability is the leading cause of bankruptcies and foreclosures, and that's why I send you to Zander Insurance. They've been helping my listeners find the right plans at the lowest cost for almost 20 years. Call 800-356-1780 or visit zander.com and compare online. That's 800-356-1780 or zander.com. Hello, everyone. You are listening to The Dave Ramsey Show. And we are excited to be here with you talking about kind of your life, your questions. And just want to give you the number to call in. You know, a lot of people are at a crossroads right now, dealing with stress, frustration, and irritation.

And wanting to know, how do you get better? How do you begin to push through this? How do you start to make some changes? Well, the first and foremost is we've got to get the information, right? And then what you have to do is start to apply that and give the effort. So call us. The number to call is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225.

Kelly is standing by, ready to talk with you and ready to help. So we're going to get to the phone. We've got, looks like Victor is in Houston. Victor, how can we help you? Hey, Chris. Good afternoon. How are you doing? Oh, doing well, my friend.

How are you? I'm a bit confused right now when it comes to my financials. Let's talk about it. Okay. So here's a bit of a background story. 2016, I left the military, and I left with about zero debt. I left on bad terms due to a sexual assault, and I ended up losing my education benefits in the business. That's long story short. Right.

By 2018, I was about $105,000 in debt. This is a combination of personal loans, car loan, credit cards, and a few miscellaneous loans. And today in 2020, I'm about $70,000 in debt, so I've made some progress, but I'm at an impasse right now. As a full-time student, I've recently acquired student loans because I don't get education benefits, and now the income that I receive is a break-even point to all of my minimum payments,

and I can't seem to get past cutting down my debt back to zero now that I've recovered. Okay. Okay. You said the word recovered. What did you recover from? I went through a sexual assault on active duty military. Okay. And they, instead of helping me, they basically threw my situation into the lurching.

Okay. Made me leave under administrative purposes. Okay. So you've been pushing to try to cope and deal with a lot. Yeah. Have you been working with anyone to help you down this path? No, I did it all by myself because I realize help is great.

Sometimes help is more costly than that is beneficial. I understand. I understand. Some paths are easier when you're walking with someone, my friend. Looking at this, you said you are a full-time student. Are you

working full-time and going to school full-time? No. Okay. Because due to my recovery, it became a bit slower. So it takes a little bit more time for me to be able to grasp new concepts. Okay. Let me give you a quick breakdown of my current debt as is. Go ahead. As of today, you're looking at $30,500 in credit card debts across seven credit cards.

You're looking at $25,000 in student loans from 2018 to today. In other loans, you're looking at $6,500. And in auto loans, you're looking at $13,000. Okay in auto loans, you're looking at $13,000. Okay. Now, mind you, I drive a Ford Fiesta. I don't drive something fancy and expensive. Right. What is your source of income right now? That's a part-time job. I do occasional lifts. I do favor here in the state of Texas with a delivery service. It's pretty neat,

but I don't have the certifications or qualifications to have a full, like an appropriate part-time job. I lost about four jobs between 2016 and 2018. Why? And because I was still trying to recover and I, between 2016 and 2018. Why? Because I was still trying to recover, and I had issues with management. Okay.

Or they had issues with me. I tried to bring something up that I found was good for them, and they're like, oh, so you want to come and change the company now? You're fired. Okay. All right. Victor, here's the reality, my friend. The money side of stuff, I think, is something that you can work on. And what I mean by that is by, A, selling the car, getting intentional, getting a full-time job, and really working. I'm going to

tell you, you probably need to put school on hold as you go work full-time and maybe go to school at night. I can hear it in your voice. I can hear the strain. I can hear the irritation, the frustration, as well as the hurt. I'm going to tell you right now, if you're not plugged into a church, you need to go talk to a therapist just to be able to unpack these things that are on your mind. Because the stuff that you've walked through, you're packing it with you and you're bringing it to each new job.

You've had four jobs you said you've lost and you keep calling back to the other issue. And that's that this root problem that's not really getting dug into to get walk with you. You said help is, is, can be expensive. Yeah, there's some out there that is, but there's some that people will be willing to meet you and to talk with you. And so I want to encourage you to get connected. Start at your local church if you have to, but find a therapist you can unpack and talk about this stuff because what you've tried to do is medicate with stuff. You've got a plethora of all the debts that are out there from credit cards to cars, student loans, personal loans.

I mean, you've got the stuff and you're going to find there's no stuff that you're going to bring into your life that's going to heal anything. This is something that's bigger than that. And so I hope you'll reach out and get some guidance. You know, and Victor, I want to say this too. The key thing you said is recovery, recovery, recovery. One of the things that I firmly believe is that the greatest enemy to our success is our excuse. I'm not saying you didn't go through something, but what I am saying, that's four years ago going on five years ago. I agree with Hogan. You're saying that, you know, help is expensive. Well, in your case, not getting help is expensive. Okay. And so right

now you need to honestly heal. And it's not just for Victor. This is for anyone listening right now, no matter what you've been through, we're here for you. We want to walk you through the process. But sooner or later, you got to look yourself in the mirror and say, OK, I have to change and something has to change today. And Victor, that's you. The person, the most common denominator throughout everything that's going on in life right now is you. And so I want to encourage you, like Hogan said, go to a church, go see a therapist and really get yourself fixed because you got to get yourself fixed internally so you can see something externally change. Yeah, no, that's a good word. And Victor, I tell you this, you get

to the point where you can't pay, you can at least pay attention. And what I mean by that is picking up the phone, contacting your creditors and walking through the scenario with them, finding out how they're working with people. But the main thing is don't have the chip on your shoulder as you contact them. You're calling them to relay some information and explain. And I think that's one of those things that's really important. You know, A.O., what I have found is that typically when people are going through something tough, it is so easy to isolate and compartmentalize. And, you know, it has got to become a battle to push through to be able to reach out and go, no, you know what? This is something I'm feeling.

I'm feeling down. Maybe you felt, you know, down like 10, 11 days in a row. You got to say at some point, hey, I got to talk to somebody. And another way we can do this is by reaching out and connecting with our friends, staying in touch just to find out, hey, are you good? You know, and I know us guys, especially we, we tend to speak in brief sentences like I'm good. Fine. Yep. Yep. All right. I want you to look into people's faces. Even in these days of social distancing, you've got an opportunity to see someone's eyes. And I'm going to tell you something. If they seem off, check on them, ask them a follow-up question

and see if there's something you can do to help them. And you know, Hogan, that happened to me, man, about four years ago, I was in a very tough season and emotionally broke down. And for about a good four days, I was like, man, I'm fine. I'm fine. I'm fine. Then that fifth day, I broke down and I realized I'm not fine. And I needed to be around my family. I needed to see a therapist and I just needed to talk through something. And that day, that fifth day changed my life because I

was willing to ask for help so I wouldn't have to require help down the road. Oh, that's good. That's important. I'm going to tell you something. You need people in your life that you trust. You need people in your life that you trust. You need people in their life that you can lean on because I'm going to tell you, this life is not meant to be done alone. It's about community and staying connected.

This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. Hello, everyone. You are listening to The Dave Ramsey Show. And I know right now you have parents that are being teachers while working a full-time job and having to do more than you anticipated as we stand in the middle of this year. But no parent ever wants their kids to experience the panic of being unprepared for a crisis. But teaching them how to be smart with money can feel like a massive job, this big undertaking. Well, here's the deal. We've got your back. With our fully digital self-study courses, you can rest assured that your teen will know

the right way to handle money and never make the same money mistakes that millions of people have made. And the best part, there is no instructor needed. All the courses are self-paced. So if your teen has a tablet or a computer, guess what? They're all set. Parents, all you have to do is go to DaveRamsey.com slash self-study. Okay, that's DaveRamsey.com slash self-study to learn more about all the different courses that we have available for your middle and high school students.

Never worry about your kids being unprepared with handling money ever again. And this is an opportunity to be able to help young people navigate and take the right steps so we can get smarter, so we can understand what to do, but more importantly, what not to do. Because there's so many pitfalls out there. And, A.O., as you've seen, young people signing on to student loan debts or credit cards or car loans, it can take years to correct that stuff if you're not careful. Absolutely. You know, Hogan, a lot of young people think when they graduate college they'll pay off their student loan debt within about two and a half years.

But studies are showing it's going to take them in between anywhere from 12 to 20 years on average. Whoa! Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now, 20 years on average. So absolutely. Whoa. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Now, that's just, that's on average. What we're seeing right now is taking them about 22 years. Unbelievable. And that's just making minimum payments and just letting it hang around.

Minimum payments, people pushing them back to deferment. I mean, it's just, it's just, it's a mess. I'm going to tell you, I had talked to a couple on the Chris Hogan show earlier, and they paid off $407,000 in student loan debt in five years. Are you serious? Okay. Income never got any bigger than $130,000 between the two of them. Wow. They paid off $407,000 in five years.

It was impressive. Wow. Right? And so, you know, just looking at this, I want people to know if you're out there, you think it's not possible. They paid off $407,000 in five years. It was impressive, right? And so, you know, just looking at this, I want people to know if you're out there, you think it's not possible. It is possible. It is possible, but it is going to require focus as well as sacrifice. Yes, sir. All right, let's see.

We got Amethyst on the line. Hello, this is Chris and Ayo. How can we help you? Hey, how y'all doing? Hey, we're doing good. How can we help you? Hey, how y'all doing? Hey, we're doing good. How can we help? Good. Okay, so I've got credit card debt, basically about $13,000, you can say.

Okay. And I'm just trying to see what's the best way for me to pay it off. I'm a senior in college, mechanical engineering, and a lot of my debt just came from foolishness and bad decisions and just a lot of it was actually emergency so okay all right yeah i feel you i mean i did the same thing in college so you're not the only one who did some uh interesting things in college now amethyst am i saying your name correctly i want to make sure i'm saying it correctly yes it's amethyst okay cool so amethyst talk to me saying your name correctly? I want to make sure I'm saying it correctly. Yes, it's Amethyst.

Okay, cool. So, Amethyst, talk to me. Right now, you're about $13,000 in credit card debt. You're a senior in college right now. What's your income right now? So, like, well, my story was I went into, like, the tuition last semester, fourth semester. So, I took off this past spring semester.

I took off. I worked at Amazon maybe about $2,000 a month. Then in May, I quit to go back to school. I made up for the semester I missed. So now I'm back on trade. But I don't work. I'm not in the e-quadrant. I'm really self-employed.

So my mainstream income comes from, I do e-commerce. I'm part of an agency. I'm actually going toemployed, so my mainstream income comes from I do e-commerce. I'm part of an agency. I'm actually going to be a COO. And by next month, I should be making around $4,000 a month. Okay. But that's all going to depend on me. And I also do delivery driving from time to time, courses by contract.

And I also make another $400 from another place. And I also have like $5,000 in acorns. And that's about it. So Amethyst, let me ask you this question. Do you have any student loans right now? Are you about to graduate with student loans as well? I have government assistance, but it's not more than $20,000. I have government loans.

Okay, government loans. All right, cool. Sounds good. So here's the thing. What I want you to do is I want you to cut up those credit cards. I want you to stop using them. I want you to go ahead and get rid of them. I don't want you to really pay them off right now.

What I want you to do is focus on getting out of college 100%, not 100% because you're not going to get out debt-free, but I want you to stop borrowing money and then what after that once you graduate college you're gonna get into your job and let's just say you know you land to where you are making about four thousand to forty five hundred dollars a month i want you to get on the financial peace university plan now what i'm gonna do is after chris holden i talked to you i want you to stay on the line. Kelly is going to give you a free year subscription to Ramsey Plus. This is going to walk you through our

entire process because we're even going to talk about Acorn. We're going to talk about some of these other things you were talking about that, honestly, I'm not a huge fan of them, but that's not where you called in, so I'm not going to go there with you. I want to go ahead and make sure we get you a solid plan laid down so that we can get you a solid foundation but cut up the credit cards

don't charge them again okay and what i want you to do is go ahead and start making a minimum payment so no keep making the minimum payments once you graduate college then we're going to go ahead and get aggressive going after all of your debt. So not just your credit cards, but everything here. Okay. Yeah, I think the big thing is for you, you mentioned the options you have in your income. Yeah. And, you know, that it's coming in a lot. And so I want to encourage you to get plugged in and use it.

Obviously, every dollar. You're familiar with doing some online stuff. This will help you be able to track it. But at the same time, really starting to understand of how much you can be bringing in, right? Your field of study, mechanical engineering, is obviously going to lead you to an opportunity to be able to have a really good career. But it is going to be a matter of you handling money, right? Because if you don't handle it, it'll handle you. And so, really want to encourage you to get plugged in and really use that information.

I think it will help you have more control than you've ever had before in dealing with money. And here's the thing. I want to encourage people that start right where you are. Like a lot of people will tell me, Hogan, when I start making X, Y, and Z, I'm going to get more serious. And I want to tell you, no, you won't. Okay, maybe you do.

I don't know. But I think the big thing is starting right where you are, which means that's starting to get intentional. And that's if you're making $50,000, $75,000, whatever it is. Your income is going to grow. But I want to hear you. I want you to hear me.

Your income will also grow as you begin to work a plan and get out of debt. Ayo, I tell people, once you get out of debt, you give yourself a raise. You didn't have to go ask anybody. You didn't have to go chit-chat. You're actually able to give yourself a raise. Not just a raise, Hogan, but you're giving yourself peace and freedom. You know, the first of the month when everyone else is stressing i got rent due i have this due i have that due i have this due the only thing you learned about is your rent payment or your mortgage

payment um and that there's so much freedom in that you know my brother's getting married this weekend and i'm going down there with a check yeah i'm giving him a check, like not just a check, but a check because I have no debt. And I'm a huge fan of sowing seeds and just really giving because I have zero debt. I have the freedom to do what I choose to do. But if I was bound in debt, I mean, I'm locked up. I got to pay Sally Mae. I got to pay another another family's last name, like McDonald's or something like that. When I can go give my brother something and sow into his future.

No, that's absolutely right. We put ourselves in a position to be able to bless, to be able to give. And for those of you that are out there and you go, Hogan, I want to be in that position, I hear you. And what I want you to do is not just to decide today, but I want you to decide every day that you wake up. Every day that you don't click on that banner ad that pops up to go over to that one store that has stuff that'll make boxes just appear on your porch. Yeah, you know what I'm talking about. I don't click that. You don't have time for that.

Why? Because you got something bigger that you're chasing. And when we stay motivated, we stay clear, we can stay on the path. And I'm going to tell you, if you fell off, it's easy to get right back on. The key is, let's stay on at this time. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. Hello, everyone. You are listening to The Dave Ramsey Show. I'm Chris Hogan, and joining me this hour, hosting along with me is Anthony O'Neill, national bestselling author and millennial expert, and we have loved taking your calls.

If you're out there and you want to reach out to us, this is the time. 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225. We'd love to hear from you. All right, we're going to the phones. We've got Nick on the line calling here from Nashville. Nick, how are you? Good.

How are you doing? Oh, focus and not finish, my friend. What's on your mind? I had a couple questions for you guys. A little back story about myself. I'm 21. I'm an airplane pilot. I've got $45,000 in my savings.

And looking at hopefully getting an early retirement, make $80,000 gross, $60,000, or $80,000 and gross $60,000. And I'm putting about $4,000 in my savings a month. I still live at home and looking at getting a house within the next year or so. And was wondering where I needed to go with that. And I was told maybe mutual funds or something like that. Okay, so Nick, first of all, 21 years old you you were on the ball uh do you have any debt no debt no sir no debt living at home making about 80k putting 4 000 away a month you were on the ball. Who taught you about money? Yeah. Dave Ramsey, actually.

I was homeschooled, took all of his courses going through high school and whatnot, and my parents just wanted me to be financially educated. And you are. They have to be proud of you. Yes, sir. Yes, sir, they are. Now, Nick, before we answer your question, because we're going to definitely help you out with this because you're a smart young man and we want to make sure that

you do and continue to be smart but to all of the other millennials and young people out there listening right now uh i want you to to tell them why you went down this road why why are you avoiding debt why do you have this much money in your savings account how can we go buy you a nice car maybe you do have a nice car but why are you living this much money in your savings account? How come you ain't go buy you a nice car? Maybe you do have a nice car, but why are you living this lifestyle? I want you to spend about 30 seconds and just encourage these young people listening right now. Yes, sir. Yeah, I never wanted to be financially strapped. I grew up in a one-income family and was just trying, look for a way out and be financially sound.

I didn't have to worry about anything financially and, you know, try and do the best way I can. So encouragement out there to everybody that's a millennial and, you know, there's a way out there to do it. And Dave Ramsey is the way to go because I grew up on it, and it's working for me now. That's fantastic, my friend. How much do you have in savings, Nick? You said $45,000, or do you have more? $45,000, and it's growing. Okay, so you got $45,000.

Talk to me. How much of that is your emergency fund? You know about emergency fund. We tell you to have three to six months of expenses set aside. So how much of this $45,000 is your emergency fund? tell you to have three to six months of expenses set aside so how much of this 45 is your emergency fund yes sir so really the only debt i have is you know my insurance and my phone right and food basically so i'm assuming maybe six grand of that would be emergency fund material you know and i've been looking at houses and i don't want to overspend i'm just looking for the perfect one because i'm not in a hurry of getting out of my parents' house.

I'm just saving money and want to put as big a down payment as possible on one. Here's what I tell you to do. Right now, the way you're living, because you're living with family, so your budget is really skewed. You've got primarily surplus. So what I would do is as you start to brainstorm, you know, the amount of house you're looking to buy, which by the way, you know, be, be clear in that, take your time. You want to make sure you're going to be in the house for two years or more before you look to buy. Um, and so you'd look at that, run the numbers on that. I would tell you, look to have

20 in your emergency fund, anything over and above that, you can start to think about that as the home down payment. The key is don't overbuy. Now, I'm telling you this, Nick, because I've seen it. And I've actually got an article at my website, ChrisOken360.com, giving some tips on what to look for as you get ready to buy a home. Don't overbuy. Because you not only want a home, but you're going to want to put some furniture in it. And you're going to want to go do some stuff. And so you want to be really smart.

And remember, you make your money on the buy, meaning what you spend on it now is the potential growth down the path. So I would say earmark at least 20 of that to be your emergency fund. The rest of that you can start to look at and you say, okay, home down payment. Minimum of 10% down, prefer you go into it with 20 so you avoid PMI, which is private mortgage insurance that just protects the lender, not you. Yeah. But then also to depart that, we want you to part that into like a money market account, your savings account.

And then for your investments outside of your down payment of your home, go ahead and look into like a Roth IRA. All right. That's the key thing here. Yeah. I would also tell you, you know, I don't know if you're eligible right now with where you're working, you know, through the 401k. But if they have that, I want you to definitely go get connected with the SmartVestor Pro

and start to dig into that so you can look and see. At 21 years old, this young man is just on the ball listen hogan man 21 at 21 i was not this young man i'm not gonna say what i was but i wasn't this young man i got we got some other young people out there they're looking at me too like yeah we weren't like him but you what? This is why we do what we do. Yeah. To help other 18-year-olds, 19-year-olds walk into this position. America, I want you to think about this.

Where could you be today if you were 21 years old and you have $45,000 in your savings and you had a bright future with no debt? Yeah. I mean, it just begins to open up the path and you know, you, you begin to have options in front of you. All right, let's take Katie here real quick. Katie, uh, how can you help? Hi, how are you guys? We're great.

How can we help you? Hi, I was actually, um, I'm a long time listener and now my husband and I are really on board with getting on the baby step wagon and staying on there for the rest of our lives, hopefully. Good. And we're kind of looking at our debts and income and everything. And we're in a house. And I was actually wondering if it is okay or if we should sell the house because it is in a seller's market right now and use the profit to pay off our debt. All right.

Really quick because we're coming up against a break. How much debt do you all have? We have about $189,000. How much of that is student loan debt? A big chunk. It's about $85,000. Okay, what's the other $104,000? Well, that's including our two new cars that we, of course, had to get.

And we're trying to get rid of it, but right now we're just too far upside down. So we are working on that and some credit cards. Okay. And so how much is the home worth? If we sold it, we would get about $230,000, and we still owe $199,000. Okay. Okay. So you want to know, should you sell the house to pay off debt?

Yes. That's the question. Okay, Katie, ask me that question. Go ahead. Hold on, let me get my looking face on. All right, I'm ready to go. Go, say it. Should I sell the house to pay off debt?

Nope. You know why? Okay. You know what it is? You don't have a house problem. You got a spending problem. Yes, sir. Yes, we do. And that's the key.

You could buy another house and you're going to. And I'm telling you that straightforward so you can look at it. You and your husband, you go, we're going to fix this. Like, we're not. We don't. This doesn't feel good. Right now, you're willing to sacrifice your home for this stuff. And it's the symptom.

And so I want you all to get serious. These cars, no. Yeah. Yeah, no. No, no, no. Here's the deal. Ramsey Plus free trial. I wasn't going to give it to you for a year.

I ain't sure you're going to focus on it. So I want you to get over on the free trial. And let's get serious about this. You all walking through this thing together. And be intentional. And I understand you didn't get here overnight and you're not going to get out of it overnight. But there is a path and a direction you can

take. Man, listen, Hogan, I about passed out, man. Two brand new cars? Two? I mean, that's but again, she made a mistake. You walked her through the process and I agree with you. I love what you said because you said, hey, go get the free trial because she needs to make some investment, some intention, some direct path.

Hey, we are going to get better, and we're going to invest into our future. Hey, Hogan, you hit that one on the head, man. Again, here's the thing. Nothing changes until something changes. Come on, man. And you have to change your outlook. Listen, I want to thank producer Zach Bennett. I want to thank Kelly Daniels, assistant producer.

I want to thank all of you all for taking the time to call in. Ayo, thank you, man. It was good hanging out. Chris Hogan, man. Thank you for having me. You all, stay tuned. We want to come back. We love you.

We appreciate you. This has been The Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for the Dave Ramsey Show. This episode is over, but if you heard about an event, product, or service and didn't have a chance to write it down, don't worry. We list everything you've heard about during this episode in the podcast show notes or head to DaveRamsey.com. Thanks for listening.