The Ramsey Show - App - Don't Make Payments on Your Mistakes! (Hour 1)

Episode Date: September 6, 2019

Debt, Home Selling   Tools to get you started: Debt Calculator: http://bit.ly/2QIoSPV Insurance Coverage Checkup: http://bit.ly/2BrqEuo Complete Guide to Budgeting: http://bit.ly/2QEyonc Interview Guide: http://bit.ly/2BuGnZE   Check out other podcasts in the Ramsey Network: http://bit.ly/2JgzaQR   

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I am Dave Ramsey, your host. We're so glad you're with us today. We appreciate you hanging out with us. We're having a very special day around Ramsey today as this is our grand opening celebration. Our governor, Governor Bill Lee, was with us this morning for ribbon cutting. And Senator Marsha Blackburn and a bunch of our local dignitaries will be with us this afternoon for another ribbon cutting. Because we couldn't just do one. We needed to do two.

So plus all our spouses and everything, there'll be about 3,000, 3,500, 4,000 folks with us this afternoon. We're going to have just a big family party here and just say thank you, God, for what you've done. This building has blown our minds and the blessing of it and the ability it gives us to help all of you guys is off the chain. So it's celebration day around here. We're all a little amped we're all a little jacked so just bear with us it's probably what you're gonna get on the air today too so just be careful what you ask open phones at 888-825-5225 we'll start this hour off with the first victim i mean caller dan is with us. Hey, Dan,

how are you? Hey, Dave, I'm doing well. Thanks for taking my call and great to be speaking with you. My pleasure, sir. How can I assist? All right. So I have a question in regards to a business that my wife and I have been wanting to open up for a while. I've been a longtime listener, about 10 years. I've actually been debt-free since 2012. I've been working on baby steps 4, 5, and 6 ever since. Good. But we have, yeah, we have a business plan of actually opening, like, a wedding venue. So trying to figure out how to open this business without having to borrow any money. And it's the cost of it.

I mean, like, the infrastructure, we want to build something. I mean, we looked at, we want to build something. I mean, we looked at buying properties as well and renovations, but building is really the best way for us to do it. But it's going to cost between the build it out, the land, the build out, get the building actually there and started and all the details that would go into it. Somewhere in the neighborhood of about $800,000, $900,000 000 maybe even pushing a million dollars we've got a sizable amount of cash to work with but not quite that much i hear you okay all right well one of the things that uh jim collins talks about in his um you know he wrote the book good to great and um we just did an analysis around here on our business about three weeks ago,

and we went back through our whole timeline at Jim's suggestion. He's a friend. And in his new book, he talks about cannonballs and bullets. And he says when you fire a cannonball, $800,000 worth, and you hope it hits something. He calls that an uncalibrated cannonball. You know, based on the fact that I've always wanted to do this, there's a wedding venue shortage in our area, we think this is a good idea, we're going to drop a million bucks in this puppy, okay?

Bullets, on the other hand, the proper way to fire a cannonball is to first calibrate the cannon by using bullets bullets are cheaper uh they don't embarrass you as much if you miss uh and so what you do if you're you know pulling up alongside if you think of an old uh clipper ship back in the uh pirate days um you know and you think pulling up alongside in the fog and you're thinking up alongside in the fog, and you're thinking, before we launch the cannonballs, we're going to use bullets to see how far this thing is away.

We think it's this far away, and we're going to hit something with a bullet first, and then we're going to fire a cannonball based on the information from the bullets, and that's called a calibrated cannonball. The most embarrassing things I have ever done in business were uncalibrated cannonballs. It was like, wahoo! Here we go. And you're getting ready to do that right now. You're going to make a mess.

You need to test market this, and you need to walk into it slower, and you don't need to build an $800,000 wedding venue that probably has a 48-year break-even period. How many weddings do you have to do to recoup a million bucks? Well, over about a five-year period. I mean, the projected income, we've done the market analysis on the other wedding venues in the area. The ones that are doing well, which there's not that many, and you just said there's a shortage of them around here,

there's a high demand for it, those are making gross income or gross revenue per year. The ones probably doing, just based on their bookings and their cost per wedding, probably around $800,000 a year. The other one's probably doing over a million a year. So they charge between $15,000 and $20,000 per wedding. They do two weddings a weekend for 30, 40 weddings a year. So if you do the math, it adds up very quickly.

And we're not just jumping in without anything. My wife's actually been in the wedding industry for 10 years. She's done wedding planning. She makes wedding dresses. We've been thinking about this for years. So it's not just a quick jump in. And we've got $450,000 to work with. And I would build something.

I would buy the piece of ground, and I would build the first building with that, and I would make that building make the money to build the other buildings. Well, the problem is we've tried to price that out. I mean, and I'm sure they can continue to wait longer. We've been working on this plan for a while. Yeah. But I don't have i don't have any choices if i'm doing this i have to do it in stages and i have to do it at the speed of cash because i don't borrow money and i you know me i mean you said you've been listening for years

you knew when you called i wasn't going to suggest you borrow the money for the wedding venue to go into business not a chance you called dave ramsey dude i mean really to go into business. Not a chance. You called Dave Ramsey, dude. I mean, really. So it's not a chance of that happening. So you have two choices. Wait longer and pile up more cash or do it on some kind of phase-in thing. I recommend the phase-in because I think, no, I know you will learn things about the business that you don't know today by doing an initial launch. And that next building, the learnings you get from the first building will give you insight on what you have to have in the second building and the third building on the complex.

And also, let's just be real uh six seven eight hundred thousand dollars gross is not net i don't know what their net is on that but it's probably ten percent uh because there's this little thing called labor and if you look at a pnl of 98 of the small businesses by far the largest item in the P&L is called payroll. And so when you put on a wedding, you know, I went to one of those venues two weeks ago. A friend of mine's daughter got married, and there's about 400 people there, and there was 80 staff there for the weekend. So they might have paid $20,000 or $30,000 for the venue.

They might have paid more than that for the venue including food and everything else but they got food costs they got staff costs they got overhead all through the week they've got taxes they've got insurance and you you know as you said you've run a business plan and i suspect you know what you're doing on that but dude please pay cash it just slows down the pain later. Because when you do something really stupid and you do it with cash, you don't have to pay payments on your mistakes. And I've paid payments on mistakes in the past, and I hate that. It's bad enough to lose money.

It's really bad to lose money and pay payments on it. Please pay cash. Thanks for calling. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Are high health care costs getting you down? Are you confused trying to navigate your options? Do you wish you could find an affordable, biblical solution to your health care costs? Based on New Testament principles, Christian Health Care Ministries, or CHM, helps Christian families, churches, and ministries join together as the body of Christ to share their major health care costs. Christian Health Care Ministries is the original health cost-sharing ministry.

A Better Business Bureau-accredited organization, CHM members share to pay each other's medical bills. It's not insurance. It's Christians financially and spiritually supporting each other. It's what Christian Healthcare Ministries has done for over 35 years, and our members have shared over $2.5 billion in medical bills. To learn more, visit chministries.org. That's chministries.org. Christian Healthcare Ministries is a proud sponsor of Dave Ramsey Live Events. chministries.org. Alyssa's with us in Kentucky. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show, Alyssa. Hi, thank you so much.

Thank you. How can I help? All right, so my husband and I, we have two young children. We're on baby step two. We have a gross income of about $44,000 a year. He's a teacher. And at the rate that our young family is growing, we were kind of wondering whether we should pause our debt snowball to save up for a minivan

or just keep paying on debt until the third baby comes. So what have you got now? What kind of car have you got now? We have like a Toyota Camry. It seats about five, but we can't put a car seat in the middle because it's not set up to do that. It doesn't have a seat belt in the middle? No, it doesn't.

Hmm. Okay. What's the Camry worth? Maybe $2,500. Okay. Well, if you want to trade it for a $2,500 van, I don't care. Yeah, I guess we're just worried because, you know, we do have two young kids, and my husband mostly is just worried about the safety of a van that cheap.

He's driving a car that cheap with two kids. I think that's true. Okay. I mean, I don't want you to drive junk the rest of your life, but you cannot use the fact that you have three kids as an excuse for being broke. Lots of people with three kids aren't broke. Right. And you can't use it as rationalization and justification for buying stuff that you can't

afford. So I'd love for you to get a better van, but it's going to involve him working more other than just his day job. He's probably going to pick up a side job. And, you know, here's an example. Here's an unpleasant example, okay? He delivers pizza four nights a week, which makes you a very fatigued mother of small children, okay? Because he's not home enough.

He does that for a year. It makes $1,500 a month. 1,500 times 12 is $18,000. That'll buy a nice van. So how bad do you want a van that's the thing okay maybe you want a nine thousand dollar van because maybe you only want him to do that for six months maybe he's a teacher so he starts doing tutoring on the side and making 25 bucks an hour more than he would make delivering pizza but still he, he's going to have to be working more to create more income if you want to move up in car and do some of the stuff,

because what you're telling me is your budget's tight, and I think it's realistic that your budget's tight. But here's what you have to be very, very careful of. I am the father of two daughters, both of which have small children. I see the fatigue in their eyes. A group of small wild animals will drain the blood out of your body. Okay? I mean, that's what happens.

It's fatigue. It goes with the territory of having, you know, three kids, four and under. You know, it's just like, and they sound like little pterodactyls. You know, they can break your eardrums. It's just, it's part of the deal. You don't even realize you're getting tired because you're just being a mommy, and you're being a good mommy. But in the middle of that tired, you cannot let yourself drive off the road of wisdom

into the road of foolishness and go buy a van you can't afford or set yourself up to where, well, because we have small children, we can't do anything. No, that's not true. You can do these things, but you just have to start carving out time and the ability to pay for it. So I suggest we work on getting your income up, and I suggest we get you on a budget, the every dollar budget for free, make the money that you have work even harder,

and then let's talk about saving up a couple thousand dollars, adding it to that camera, buying a $5,500 van in cash, and then let's get this debt paid off so we can get back to the savings mode. And then if you want to move up in van a little bit more later on, that would be a reasonable way to do it. When our children were little, they were driving, they were riding around in cars the same price as your car. And they all made it.

They're in their 30s. All right, Andrew's with us. Andrew's going to be in Florida. Hi, Andrew. How are you? Hey, you doing okay? How are you? Hey, doing okay. How are you, Dave? Better than I deserve.

How can I help? So I have a question for you. I've got about $190K in debt and $75K of that is for a business I started a few years ago. So working on baby stuff too right now. And I just want to ask you, when do you declare a bankruptcy for your business, even if it's still kind of running but not at what it used to be? Well, you don't have business debt. You have personal debt.

In your mind, it's allocated. But you sign personally on all of it. Okay. And so you personally have $190,000 worth of debt. Okay. Yeah, that's kind of what I was concerned about was that, you know, my name is Olive, and I can't really get out of it. I just have to pay it down over a few years.

So your business isn't bankrupt. You might be, but your business isn't bankrupt because your business doesn't really owe anything technically. So what's the debt on? So I've got three credit cards that are about $60,000 for the business and $15,000 lines of credit for the business. So on top of that, you know, I did a bunch of other stupid stuff, and I put more personal credit, my own personal credit cards for the business. So I've got a lot of credit card debts between me and the business right now.

Okay, one more time. You signed personally on all of it. In your mind, this is the only place this is allocated to the business right now. Okay, one more time. You signed personally on all of it. In your mind, this is the only place this is allocated to the business. They did not loan a credit card debt to a business like yours. It has your name on it.

You had to sign the personally guarantee it. So it's only in your mind that it's allocated to the business. So total credit card debt, how much is there? Total credit card debt is $110,000. Good lord. Okay. And how much do you owe on your car?

Car stayed off for but most of that stuff is just $110,000 for the credit card and then another $65,000 for lines of credit and then a personal loan for $25,000. So it's all unsecured. Yeah. Do you have any assets?

Just my wife and I. We have a house together that I'm paying a mortgage on. What's the house worth? The house is worth about $250,000. And what do you owe on it? We owe $220,000. No equity. All right.

And what's your car's worth? I just have one car that's worth about $8,000. Uh-huh. How old are you? 38. Okay. What's your household income? Between the two of us, it's $225.

Okay. Well, finally, in all these questions, I get some good news. Yes. You have a wonderful income. Okay. What would be wrong? Did you know the average household income in America is $59,000? No, I did not. What if you were to live on that?

And put the rest of it towards $190,000? How quick would we be out of debt? Pretty quickly here, probably in a few years or less. Yeah, you're not close to bankrupt. Yeah. You have a deep hole, but you have a really nice big shovel. Okay, well. You can do this.

You can do this. Here's what's happened, okay? How long have you run in this business? About four years now. Okay. How involved was your wife in the decisions? She was not. Actually, I found you through her.

So through her, I found you. And she's actually been a great help for me to get out of the hole here. Good, good. Okay. So she's been part of the solution, but she wasn't involved in the problem. That's what happened when I went broke, by the way. Yeah, absolutely not. She's been a blessing.

And we're actually starting to teach FPU next week at our church too now good cool well that's neat well here's what normally happens and it happened to me i was 10 years younger than you when it happened to me and i went completely broke okay i had three million dollars worth of debt um and on real estate sharon didn't know nothing i mean i wasn't hiding it from her but she just wasn't involved i never a master i just went and did stuff and she was kind of playing the scarlet o'hara thing you know like whatever you want to do honey you know kind of crap and that doesn't work and uh but what happens when you run into something like this and you have a business failure uh which is what you've had this business was unsuccessful to say the least.

For most guys, I don't know if it happened to you, but it happened to me, for most guys, it causes us to lose a lot of our confidence. And you lose some of your swagger, some of your moxie. And for her, she's looking at all this, and she gets real scared, which makes you even lose more of your swagger when your woman's losing, is scared. So don't let that chemistry mess your marriage up. You guys jump into Financial Peace University. I'm telling you, as a guy looking on the outside, you can work your way through this and you're better than you feel right now. And Enterprise Alabama, RJ and Holly are with us.

It says on my screen you guys are debt-free. Congratulations. Thanks, Dave. Thank you, sir. How much have you paid off? So we paid off $60,000 in about 11 months. Way to go. And your range of income during that time? It was about $120,000 to $140,000.

Cool. What do you all do for a living? So I'm in the military. And I'm in sales. Thank you for your service. Very cool. It's an honor to serve. So what kind of debt was the 60,000 bucks? So it was

a lot of things. We had two cars, my student loans, a medical bill, and three credit cards. Ah, okay. Very cool. And so what happened 11 months ago? Well, we got married. Oh, there's that.

And RJ decided to take the total money makeover on our honeymoon. How romantic, RJ. Yeah, so he read it there and probably read half of it out loud to me oh um was that like preaching or helping sat down was he really looked at our finances so wait a minute wait a minute wait a minute holly when he's reading the total money makeover out loud to you on your honeymoon is that like preaching at you or or just helping you it was just helping me he kept reading statistics okay okay i have a degree in psychology and he knows i like statistics and that's what he was telling me okay he knew he knew you needed proof yeah you're you're a researcher

he knew you needed proof okay exactly got it okay good. I'm feeling better about you, RJ. Yeah. Once we got home, we kind of looked over our finances and realized we were in a little more debt than we thought we were. And we figured out some numbers and that we could get debt-free within two years, and then we did it in 11 months. Yeah. So what happened that caused it to almost be cut in half of what you thought it was going to take? Well, we really just got fired up about it we looked at stuff that we could sell so uh we sold my motorcycle and um yes sir and then we ended up selling holly's car and were able to use that to cut out a lot of the debt very quickly um and her parents were kind

enough to let us drive one of their extra paid-off vehicles for a couple months while we saved up and bought a car for her in cash. Wow. Wow. So what did her car sell for? So it was about, I want to say, $15,000, $14,000, maybe a little bit less than that. What did your motorcycle sell for? It was $5,500, sir.

So like $20,000 of the $60,000 was like, boom. Yes, sir. So like $20,000 of the $60,000 was like boom. Yes, sir. Yeah. Wow. So what happened was you guys decided you wanted to be out of debt more than you wanted this stuff. That's exactly right. Exactly. Yeah.

It's a simple trade-off decision. It's like first semester psych class, right? Yeah, just like that. Yes, sir. Way to go, you guys. Thank you so much. I'm so proud of y'all how old are you two um we're both 30 oh wow how does it feel to have no payments weird it's very strange so rj was it worth the sacrifice the motorcycle to be here uh absolutely. Yes, sir. Okay. Because it's probably a little bit of your old life before Holly anyway, right? It was. You know, when we start building some more wealth, it's something maybe in the future I'll look into, but right now it is definitely worth the weight lifted off our

shoulders. Yeah. Amen. Very cool. Well, congratulations. What do you guys tell people the key to getting out of debt is? You're professionals. You did it. Yeah. For me, so I'm the spender in the family. So to me, budgeting is kind of like a diet. You need to be realistic about your goals and your restrictions. So for me, I really enjoy eating out. I am not much of a cook.

So I knew we wanted to have money in the budget for that. Otherwise, I would just get kind of frustrated and down and probably not stick to the budget as much. So I would say just be realistic and actually give yourself some leeway for things that you do love. Yeah. So you had that in there, but you cut the crud out of other stuff. We did. And there we did and there we did have plenty of um we didn't do beans and rice but lots of hamburger helper okay all right so when we're home we're on the cheap but occasionally we do the restaurant and we're selling the car driving mom's loaner selling the motorcycle that's 20,000 of the 60,000 we punch the other 40,000 in the face you're doing it as a couple and um. And did you grasp while you were doing this that, like, as your first order of business in your new marriage,

you worked together very closely to accomplish a big goal? That's a huge thing. Yes, sir, absolutely. Yeah, it was really good for us, and, and you know i think that sets a great foundation for the rest of our marriage it does it sets it sets a pattern in your relationship that you'll duplicate when you face other big projects or other big challenges and uh and you will face those in your life so way to go you guys touchdown baby i love it whoa thanks so much so good well we got a copy of chris hogan's book for you

everyday millionaires because you are on the path that's your next story next chapter in your story and i want to hear from you when you hit that too okay yes sir sir all right rj and holly and enterprise alabama sixty thousand dollars paid off in 11 months making making $120 to $140. They got with it. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Woo-hoo-hoo-hoo-hoo-hoo!

Love it! Boom! That's how it's done right there, man. That's exactly how it's done. It is so interesting to me what a large percentage of the equation of you getting out of debt is you simply deciding to do it. That sounds just so basic. That sounds almost weird. But it's really the math.

You can fix the math. You work extra. You sell your car. Drive your mama's car. You sell the motorcycle. You know, you hit the hamburger helper. Beans and rice. Rice and beans.

Ramen noodles. Tuna fish. Tuna fish is broke people food. We ate that when I was broke. My wife used to make tuna fish sandwiches and i would take them to work and by lunch when you got them out of the refrigerator they were soggy i hate tuna fish when i smell tuna fish my net worth goes down it reminds me of being broke you gotta have that stuff man you gotta have those things happen but those things start to happen when you decide

you decide you say that's it i've had it and you know it can be something like getting married it can be something like having a child these are are like God tapping you on the shoulder going, ah, time to be a grown-up. Yeah, when you get married, that's God tapping you on the shoulder going, ah, yeah, this just got real. You're not a child anymore, my son. You know? Or you have a baby, you go, whoa, I suddenly had an epiphany. We got stuff to take care of here. We got to be like grown-ups.

Adults devise a plan and follow it. Children do what feels good. I make 58-year-old children, and I make 21-year-old adults. It's an emotional decision, the ability to delay pleasure for a greater good. I'm going to live like no one else so that later I can live and give like no one else. The Bible says no discipline seems pleasant at the time, but it yields a harvest of righteousness. There's a price to be paid to win. And the interesting thing about you getting out of debt and you building wealth is at least 90% of the equation is you freaking deciding to do whatever it takes to get there.

When you decide, that's it. I've had it. I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired. We make too much freaking money to be this broke. When you have that moment, that's when it turns. No one intellectually conquers this. It's a visceral. Emotional. Experience.

That's why we play that Braveheart clip. Freedom. That's how it feels. You're free. Think about what it'd be like to have no payments. To give Sally Mae. Her eviction notice. You old woman with a wart on your nose,

get out of my house. You are ugly. Ugly to the bone. Get out of my house. When you decide that, it changes everything. I can't do it for you. I can only give you the equation.

This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you for joining us, America. Robert is with us in California. Hey, Robert, welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you very much, Mr. Ramsey, for taking my call. Sure. How can I help? Well, I'm trying to figure out what the best way is to borrow money. I'm wondering if an equity line is the best way to borrow in our situation. Okay.

So you've not been listening to this show for very long. Well, no, I actually do listen to it quite a bit. We're faced with a lawsuit, and we are trying to raise some money to fight that. We've just about burned through our savings, and we were getting ready to do some home improvements with the idea of selling the house. And so that's kind of where we're at now. And what is the nature of the lawsuit?

We live on property with three other neighbors and our water comes from a parent property that subdivided us off 40 years ago. And they are suing us to take our water comes from a parent property that subdivided us off 40 years ago. And they are suing us to take our water rights away. So we're trying to hold on to our water. Meanwhile, you're trying to sell the house. Well, we can't sell it now. With this going on, this has got to be settled first. But we were planning on selling shortly after this is finished.

Okay. first but we were planning on selling shortly after this this is finished okay so why would you do repairs when you need to fund a that for a house you're not going to sell right now when instead you need to fund a lawsuit well we weren't we aren't going to do any repairs now until we figure out how this lawsuit's going to end up. But we had planned on borrowing some money against the equity in our house. We have quite a bit of equity to, you know, do some things to get the house ready to sell before this whole lawsuit came up. Okay. All right.

Well, I teach people not to borrow money because that's the shortest path to wealth. And so it's a fairly unusual question for someone to call me and ask how to borrow money because that's the shortest path to wealth and so it's a fairly unusual question for someone to call me and ask how to borrow money so that's why i was asking about you know how long you've been tied to us uh because i didn't want to like run over you with a bus or something yeah no no no no i listened to the program quite a bit i've read some of your books i've followed your principles so uh i figured so what i start with if i'm in your situation is i don't borrow money and for all the reasons i've described already um uh and so what i start with in the the premise i start with is borrowing money is not an

option so now what am i gonna do yeah and once i do that once i just take that off the table then i start to see ways to get some of the other things done and so in your case i would fight and scratch and claw and get the nickels out of the couch and get the lawsuit finished and then i would do the repairs gradually and incrementally out of my income um i don't see your big equity in your house as a prime opportunity to borrow. That's not how I view it. That's how you're viewing it, and that's how a lot of broke people view it, but I don't see that. I see it as an asset instead. You know, you may be forced to sell the house while it's in the middle of this mess at a deep discount, which means you don't have all that equity.

You may be forced to do some other stuff that is unpleasant. I don't know. But if I'm in those situations, I simply don't have the option because I took the option off the table. And so I don't have the answer to the question, what's the best way to borrow money? You'd have to talk to someone else because I don't believe that to be the best thing for you. And I'd be advising you against my conscience if I did otherwise. Sandra's with us in California. Hi, Sandra. How are you?

I'm doing well. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? My fiancé and I are in quite a bit of debt i'm a little over 60 000 and uh we start premarital counseling next week so we're going to be getting married right after that's finished and basically my question to you is should we uh wait to move to another state that has a lower cost of living before or after that. If moving out of state means it'll cost money to get there and we will have no help or family or friends or anything. Okay.

Well, I mean, you'd want to have a job if you're going to move out of state, right? Yes. We would be transferring to our own company. So we'd have about the same pay and we want to move to Texas and Texas versus California it's pretty lower so we would have the same pay if we transfer in our positions just with Texas cost. So what do you make what does he make? He makes about $55,000, and I make about $33,000 right now, and when I go back to work in a couple months, I'll also be making $55,000. I've had five surgeries in one year, so I've been on

leave for quite a while, and we took a pay cut. Gotcha. Okay. All right. And so you would be getting married in about a few weeks? I think that our pastor said that the counseling is like a six to eight-week program, so probably around December or November. Okay. And during that time, you both are going to be making $55,000 as two separate individuals, and during that time, you could start saving up money for a move, right? I won't be back to work until about January or so, yeah. Because of the surgeries? Yes, sir.

That's a long recovery. You must have had it bad. I've been out of work. It'll be two years in January. It's been pretty tough. Man, I'm sorry. Wow. Thank you.

Well, here's what i'd do okay i would get married as whenever you're getting married um and then if you you know before you start your debt snowball if you want to pile up three or four thousand dollars to make your move and buy you know rent the u-haul right and put deposits down at the new apartment in the other city and those kinds of things, then I would consider doing that and then make your move. You don't have to get out of debt in the expensive state before you move to the cheaper state. That's not necessary. But if you're making $110,000, you ought to be able to pile up enough money to load a U-Haul up pretty quick. Right. Yeah.

And then let's just get over there and make sure these jobs all transfer because what part of Texas would you be moving to? Dallas, like outer city. Okay. Well, Dallas is not that much cheaper than California. It doesn't have taxes. Yeah. It doesn't have income tax, and it doesn't have some of the other stuff.

But the cost of living in Dallas is not substantially cheaper than California. Real estate is, but everything else is not. So you're not going to be having this like all of a sudden everything costs half what it used to cost in California. That's not going to occur when you move to Dallas. So Dallas is a major metroplex like San Diego is. I mean, you're not moving out in the country somewhere here. So anyway, I still think I make the move. It's what you want to do.

It's where you want to live. You've made that decision. I'd get married, save up the money, move to Dallas, then start your debt snowball. And that would be my order of attack if I were in your shoes. Hey, thanks for the call. This is the Dave Ram ramsey show we're glad you're here america owning and leading a business is not for sissies it's not a joke you're responsible for people's lives you're responsible for payroll you're responsible for customers

helping them serving them dealing with difficult team members who misbehave, hiring people, firing people, keeping the doors open. It can be hard, like all the time. It can be lonely. And it's easy to get caught working in the business rather than on the business. And it doesn't have to be that way. But it will be if you don't take time to invest in yourself and get a plan to tackle the problems that are holding you

back. You're going to keep having the same problems until you change. And when you change and you learn more and you know something that you didn't know yesterday, then you'll attack those problems in a different way and they'll start to go away. But if you keep doing the same thing over and over and over again, expect a different result. and they'll start to go away. But if you keep doing the same thing over and over and over again, expect a different result, that's called the definition of insanity. So what we do when we're teaching Entree Leadership is we teach you how to attack the problems by helping you get better. Entree Leadership Master Series is happening November 3rd through the 7th

here in Nashville. I can show you how to do this. This is my playbook. I started on a card table in my living room. We're a $250 million business with 857 employees right now. I can show you how to do this. If you want to come to Entree Master Series, there's a few seats left. Text the word NASHVILLE to 44222.

NASHVILLE to 44222. Or call us at 888-22-PIECE, 888-227-3223. This is James Childs, producer of The Dave Ramsey Show. Did you know you can now listen to The Dave Ramsey Show on Pandora and Spotify? For all the ways to watch and listen, check out our show page at DaveRamsey.com slash show.